Twinrova: Ganon’s Mother - Lore and Origins (Legend of Zelda)

A look at the history of Kotake and Koume, Ganondorf's surrogate mothers.
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[@Zeltik]

please just pretend that I didn't get their names the wrong way around for the whole video

[@Schwarzorn]

You still get like a million points for pronouncing their names correctly. They're twins, so their names are supposed to be similar, but most people don't even consider Ko-také and Ko-umé a possibility since they don't know the Japanese behind their strangely adorable names.

[@simonrockstream]

@@Schwarzorn I thought their names were pretty obvious, how can you pronounce it wrong lol

[@HeartAino193]

Well, did you know that the names Kotake and Koume roughly translate to "little mushroom" and "little plum" respectively?

[@hanburgundy4317]

I don't think that the witches you meet in Termina are different; I think they're the very same Kotake and Koume from Hyrule. We see multiple people from various races traveling between and referencing places and people from both Hyrule and Termina: the Deku butler and his son, Link and the Skull Kid, the Happy Mask Salesman, Gorons, etc. We even hear the name Sheikah mentioned and see their relics, like the Eye of Truth, All Night Mask, and the Gossip Stones. Clearly, Termina is an actual place, and those within know of Hyrule. Even the Garo and the people of the Stone Tower knew of the realm of the gods, building the Stone Tower to reach a portal in the sky that leads to the Haunted Wasteland of Hyrule's Gerudo Desert in the Lanayru Province. I think that both the Gerudo and the Sheikah are descendants of those Terminians who built the Stone Tower, as both races share the same magic and iconography. Specifically, I think Kotake and Koume left Hyrule via the same portal they arrived through and returned to Termina after their assault on Hyrule was thwarted by link and Zelda; Ganondorf was captured, and the rest of the Gerudo were either put to death or sent to the Twilight Realm, but Twinrova escaped. Now, why they seem "nice" is merely an observation, but without the lure of the Triforce and the Sacred Realm they gave up conquest. Their people - those of them who also escaped Hyrule - remain thieves as is their way, but the two witches apparently retired lol

[@darkvizardking69]

It's like people going Fred and George from harry Potter, so you're good. A great video as always.

[@Hellraiser2107]

Fun fact: The boss title of Koume and Kotake is not Twinrova in the German version. For some reason they changed it to Killah Ohmaz which would kind of translate to Killah Granniez. And also their fused form is called Sexy Thermo Hexy (Sexy Thermo Witchey) and that's... a thing that the translators decided to do for some reason

[@wiilov]

I swear, Nintendo localization teams were told to abridge translations...Ghost Stories style

[@GamingKingdom91]

I..wha-...why are you so freaking weird German language? 😂

[@hexenshadow5642]

That’s factually inaccurate, since the German word for Grandma is Oma, not Ohmaz. You’re stretching and having to play with the truth to fit the narrative you want to push as facts

[@JoelLeonhart]

At least thats kinda funny/cool... BUT also the root's bs that's happening now with " localization" In anime & so on... Meaning the "translators" NEVER truly gave a damn to be ACCURATE as possible to Asian(Japan) work's! I'll be truly happy that such bad actors get to NEVER work again when & if Japan & other cultures can do the actual translations themselves through tools like A.I (not to confused yet to SciFi depictions of A.I be it dystopian or hopeful works..)

[@riotx0034]

Seems german enough

[@sansnom5269]

I love the parallel between Link and Ganondorf. Two children of war, born under mysterious circumstances, created by surrogate parental figures inside a secret land. While Link is not accepted into Kokiri Forest for being different, Ganondorf is adored exactly by being the different one. Their protectors see them as messianic figures, one guided to save the land,and the other to conquer it. Their destiny and stories are more similar than they like to admit. Zelda acts like the bridge between them two, once again, in mirrored ways. One seeks Zelda for guidance and Wisdom, and the other seeks Zelda as a tool for more power. One cycle that keeps repeating itself, incarnating on tragic figures from age to age.

[@Vetr_Wærloga]

Very Batman & Joker esch

[@leonelcarita]

Caca

[@loki4807]

To free the land I'd wish upon the Triforce that Demise had never cured Link and Zelda in the first place. It might actually stop Gannon from ever going bad and keep the kingdom from going under finally letting Ruto marry Link as she intended.

[@Hallow6262]

@@loki4807 they don't know about Demise or the curse though

[@loki4807]

@@Hallow6262 But I do knowing that I could potentially save Hyrule in theory.

[@alexnewby2004]

Fun fact, twinrova does actually make a small appearance in totk! In one of the memories, there are two gerudo knealt behind ganondorf. While they dont stand out much, they look identical, and their clothing has their names on them

[@KingsBard]

This explains why they raised Ootdorf the they did, they were the last remaining followers of the Demon King, and tried to recreate him.

[@duffthimblespork]

​@@KingsBard"Ootdorf." Thanks, stealing this.

[@DarkstarMystic]

@rd Honestly, this is my headcanon so I appreciate reading this. Further evidenced by the fact that they appear to be a normal age with Demon TotkDorf, while they are 400+ yr looking old crones in OOT. TOTK Imprisoning war isl at least 400 yrs before OOT, and still lies very early in the timeline, (perhaps after skyward sword, perhaps before)... *not* after some reset. Meaning mummified ganondorf is under hyrule WHILST recreated ganondorf in OOT roams hyrule. (headcanon) Although I get the creators are trying to soft reboot the series. Yes, TOTK created a bit of a lore mess but it's not un-sortable.

[@SimplyAJ]

Something else to think about: Who were the king's BEFORE Ganondorf? If a male is born once every century, wouldn't that mean that these two 400 year old witches have seen at least 4 kings? Did they fall in battle with Hyrule? Were they too raised by Twinrova? Would love to see more about who came before Ganondorf.

[@kylehill3643]

How well would Kotate handle the 'Great June Heatwave' of 2021 where it hit 120F here in Oregon?

[@tatlxtael2303]

I can only imagine the sheikah probbaly had something to do with them

[@yourmum69_420]

maybe they were all ganondorf

[@5-Volt]

Funny thing about that "1 male Gerudo every century" is that since OoT.. he's been the only male Gerudo period! 🤦‍♀️ Maybe it's because he never truly dies though.

[@hashbrown746]

They probably were all incarnations of demise who perished before they could gain the triforce and thus he reincarnated again and again until he participated as Ganondorf in oot

[@cecillewolters1995]

Watching this video finally explained the fire and ice powers of the twins. The fire represents the harsh desert sun, scorching all life. Ice are the cold nights, freezing all that lives. The two faces of the desert, night and day, fire and ice.

[@silverreaps6803]

I wasn't that hard to figure out

[@cecillewolters1995]

@@silverreaps6803 True xD I'm just someone that spots details faster than on the nose things and this just went overlooked

[@cecillewolters1995]

@Shoka Lgbt Maybe one day, but thanks xD

[@CharlesFerraro]

Well I didn’t think of that so I think that was a great observation.

[@gribberoni]

I wouldn't have caught that! Thanks for sharing!

[@MardukGodSlayer]

I'd always assumed that the fused Twinrova was Ganondorf's actual mother, imbuing him with all her magical power, and Kotake and Koume raised him as surrogates as it would have been far too draining to maintain their fused form all the time.

[@TheKyrsisForever]

I actually 100% believe this theory.

[@GuyIllusionMusic]

sooo basically, he has two mothers literally biologically. i've heard of two fathers but this is insanity, lol.

[@ferrishthefish]

I think their death cutscene disputes this. Koume and Kotake's spirits appear separately, despite being killed while fused. This suggests Koume and Kotake are the original beings, rather than Twinrova being the original being who split into two fragments to conserve energy.

[@Graphomite]

@@ferrishthefish Marduke didn't say Twinrova was the original being. He's saying that Korume and Kotake fused themselves into Twinrova in order to conceive Ganondorf with with their combined power.

[@ToxynCorvin8008]

That's what I thought, I recall it said Twinrova is a surrogate mother, which means she gave birth but gave him up. It also explains Ganondorfs immense size.

[@ultraspinalki11]

After learning in Windwaker that Ganondorf once had noble intentions (saving his people from the harsh desert), I like to imagine it was the twin witches who triggered his descent into villainy by making him aware of the existence of the all-powerful Triforce. Thus, becoming obsessed in acquiring it at all costs. After all, the witches are centuries old, they would be the most knowledgeable when it comes to the mythical Triforce after the Deku Tree and the Royal Family itself.

[@enecofan888]

Or WW Ganondorf is just a manipulative guy who wanted to distract the hero

[@matthewmuir8884]

He didn't really have noble intentions. He never once said anything about wanting to save the Gerudo from the harsh desert; he said that he coveted the land outside the desert.

[@mokarokas-2138]

I read it as Ganondorf not being aware of WHY exactly he's driven to evil, world-conquering deeds (meaning he's not aware of Demise's curse). So, from his perspective, he just wants Hyrule because it freaking rules compared to the Gerudo desert and he's jealous. I suppose the flooding of a world and the destruction of entire civilizations can make even a man like Ganondorf reflect on his actions, if only for a bit.

[@ultraspinalki11]

@@mokarokas-2138 Personally not a fan of the added lore from Skyward Sword, but regarding how Ganondorf reflected on the past (plenty of time to do so with his immortality), I particularly like how he views the gods as having betrayed the people of the world. In his point of view, the gods that were worshipped and loved chose to destroy the beautiful world and its people just to stop HIM. It's like dropping nuclear bombs all over the globe to catch one criminal. If I recall correctly, he is also displeased with Hyrule's survivors being "downgraded" to small, scattered populations on islands.

[@IamCanadian3333]

@@ultraspinalki11 I actually really liked that lore. Demise is one of my favourite Zelda villains (him and Vaati). It was cool that even in death, his will endures.

[@corruptedplayer]

did you know that the *official* german name for Twinrova is "Sexy Thermo Hexy" (Sexy thermo Witch) and Koume and Kotakes titles are "Killa Omaz" (Killer Grandmas) the old german translations were full of those things. don't let me get started on LA

[@deecyp64]

Omg I thought I Dreamt this lol

[@DragoonMS]

...wait, what the deuce?? 😆😆😆😆😆

[@gaspardsavoureux8680]

And in the french translation one of the sheikah stones in Ocarina of Time just talks about how cool the translator is, man I love these old european translations

[@owjburnham4317]

@@gaspardsavoureux8680 apparently because he spotted that “Deku” was going to sound rude.

[@gaspardsavoureux8680]

@@owjburnham4317 Yeah, for example if we kept Deku the Deku Tree would've been "L'arbre Deku" which sounds like "L'arbre de cul" (which means Tree of ass, and as funny as that sounds it wouldn't fit the game)

[@davidgorman994]

Definitely one of the more interesting parts of Ocarina. An interesting area and cast of characters

[@sirhenrymorgan1187]

Y'know, I dunno if supplementary material ever answered this, but this gets me thinking: Who was Ganondorf's biological mother? And how did Ganondorf come into Twinrova's care instead of his actual mom? One could assume either Ganondorf was taken from his mother and Twinrova did away with her in some way, or his mother willingly gave him up to Twinrova because they were chief of the Gerudo before Ganondorf was king. Or even that she was reluctant to give him up, only to be brainwashed by Twinrova into handing him over to them. Maybe Ganondorf's mother died after he was born? Death by childbirth? A victim of the civil war, not dissimilar from Link's mother? I suppose it isn't important, and I guess we'll never know. But it's still interesting to ponder: who birthed the Great King of Evil? What was she like? And what if she got to raise Ganondorf herself, instead of the sadistic Twinrova? Well, he likely would've still lusted for power, much like his Four Swords Adventures incarnation...

[@Levacque]

I think you have it in that she willingly gave up her son to the witches - think about it, you are in a culture where you know that birthing a son means that he has a greater destiny than to be your son. You would feel that you owe it to your people to allow him to be raised under (as far as you know) the best possible circumstances. I doubt she even knew about Koume or Kotake, just that her son was being given to a powerful and wise surrogate.

[@labelledamedumanor4876]

As far as Ganondorf's birth mother is concerned, if she survived the birth of her son, it would basically make her the Queen Mother of the Gerudo & it would make sense to have someone play the role of nanny & tutor to a future king. But whether she gave the responsibility to Twinrova of her own accord or was duped into it is another matter entirely.

[@noface5775]

I assume that the one male born every century had to be raised in a certain way, by the chief.

[@Phoenix_1991]

@@noface5775 I agree. The position of Queen Mother may not be as significant in some cultures as they are in others.

[@victoriousf.i.g.3311]

Given that he was born into power by virtue of his sex, wielded power by virtue of the Triforce of Power, and bore the curse of Demise, I doubt he'd ever be anything other than he is: Corrupted and evil. I assume his mother was either lost during the birth or he himself murdered her when he was young.

[@CZsWorld]

I'd love to see them back in Breath of the Wild's sequel.

[@xionmemoria]

I have never needed something so much and yet not noticed.

[@farmerbobbygrows3338]

The fire and ice wizards are descendants of twinrova in botw* honestly their wasn’t real bosses in botw just challenges and trials. Part of the reason why it’s my least favorite Zelda game that and durability. Bring back key items like hookshot and shit like that and maybe I’d enjoy it

[@roseproctor3177]

omg yes

[@alakazamlover4908]

@@farmerbobbygrows3338 ^ i get people liking the open world and all that but...

[@reitairue2073]

@@alakazamlover4908 exactly, they gave up too many "zelda" gameplay staples

[@ArcadeTheatre]

I always theorized that Kotake and Koume appeared in the Downfall Timeline because they faked their death in Ocarina of Time. The whole "angelic ascension to heaven" that they do at the end of the Spirit Temple always seemed really suspicious to me.

[@Katie-The-Bug]

I like this idea. Of course the evil scheming witches aren't going to heaven, they just wanted to pretend for a little bit before they got back to their evil witchy schemes. (Sidenote: does Hyrule even have a permanent afterlife? Do regular people get to chill in the clouds while Link, Zelda, and Ganon fight the same fight over and over again, or do they reincarnate too?)

[@chompythebeast]

@@Katie-The-Bug As far as I know, we know little about any afterlife in the modern canon. Early games seem to depict Hyrule as predominantly Christian, and that notion even continued into Ocarina with Islamic symbols and chants used by non-Hylians, but those have all been replaced in modern releases. In the present canon we know a bit about ghosts, undeath, and necromancy, and we know that those spirits sometimes speak of "rest" or "resting", with little mention of anything else. On the other hand, we have scenes like this one with the halo bit, and we have the Ancient Cistern in Skyward Sword, whose entire construction is meant to convey a Buddhist parable known as The Spider's Thread, which is focused on Buddhist ideas of Heaven and Hell. There is even a large Buddha-like figure at the temple's center. However, that could just represent Hylia's separating Skyloft from the world below rather than being a depiction of any afterlife. I can't think of any other depictions of what might be an afterlife separate from the world we see at the moment. There's the Hero's Shade who somehow continues to persist in Twilight Princess, though he may be merely a part of Link's reincarnated imagination rather than actually existing outside his mind. Again, we see lots of ghosts, so people don't seem to just stop existing upon death one way or the other, especially if they have unfinished business, and perhaps especially if they were powerful in life. But those spirits almost always speak of nothing but "rest" if they do mention the other life at all, unless I'm forgetting something

[@swordofstabbingold]

Considering beedle reappears, maybe all of them reincarnate.

[@indigopines]

I've seen people headcanon that a few people get wrapped up in the cycle between Link, Zelda, and Demise, so they also reincarnate (ie Beedle) but for the most part the population does the ghost/"rest" thing... It gives a lot of food for thought, especially from the point of view that the LoZ story is actually a tragedy

[@CodaBlair]

@@indigopines Honestly when I think of other characters who reappear my first thought is always Impa.

[@CDPW]

I used to think back in my childhood years before I knew what a surrogate was, that the twinrova sisters were the ones who gave birth to Ganondorf. But like... in their combined form.

[@ShinChara]

That is what a surrogate mother is. The one who gives birth to a child intended to be raised by someone else. Nintendo just used the word incorrectly. If Koume and Kotake were Ganondorf's surrogate mothers, that would mean they weren't the ones who raised him.

[@dafilmqueen556]

​@luxarmok9830, so more so his adoptive mothers.

[@dodiswatchbobobo]

I’d love to get a flashback in BOTW2 to ancient Gerudo where teenage Ganondorf is chief, but Twinrova are his overbearing regents.

[@spiralgodking9877]

That would be cool, instead of Link's flashbacks; we get to see Ganondorf's this time.

[@rowandoyle7]

Headcanon - ganondorf is greenish because some designer misunderstood "olive complexion" and just looked at an olive

[@incorporealnuance]

I like to think that the "real" Kotake & Koume are the ones we see in Majora's Mask, a parallel reality untouched by the corruptive influences present in the standard timeline. Explains why they would do such selfless acts (even for evil agendas) such as sacrificing themselves, and why they seemed to have such a "good guy" death in Ocarina of Time.

[@VeArk]

In my opinion, not to attack your theory or anything, I like to think that the real Kotake & Koume are the friends we made along the way.

[@yourmum69_420]

yeah it's weird that the most evil seeming beings ever get those halos and seem to fly to heaven... but I think it's just because it's the only time we see humans die in the whole game, and nintendo wanna be family friendly or whatever. The only other human to die iirc in the whole game is Dampe and we don't see that happen, but when we see his ghost he also has a halo.

[@sintanan469]

My guess is the two were sages of ice and fire before the civil war. The Gerudo were mistreated by Hyrule and they turned from the path of light to use sorcerous magic and create Twinrova. When Link defeats them with the Master Sword in OOT the sword seals the darkness and frees the witch sages from their sorcerous magic and the darkness of Twinrova. They get to pass on, their long duty to the Gerudo finally at end. In the Oracle games, Twinrova is defeated with a magic seed, sacrificing itself to summon Ganon. The witches never get to pass on freed from their sorcerous magic in this timeline. Two more lost to the corruption of Demise. The way I see it is the two are martyrs for the Gerudo, two beings that make a single wrong choice and doom their people, their ward, and themselves. They're a study in how a single wrong choice can lead to disaster.

[@LordMalice6d9]

Its an interesting theory except that Termina being an alternate world to Hyrule suffered from its own civil conflict in the Ikana and Garo civil war.

[@bluelocimon]

@@yourmum69_420 I think it's because Japan has a different culture. In Dragon Ball the villains also have a halo over the heads, not because they ended up in heaven or something like that, just to show they aren't alive

[@nebulathenebulous]

it does make me wonder how much of kotake and koume's cruelty was shaped by their circumstances, fighting against hyrule's invasion of the desert for potentially hundreds of years; majora's mask may suggest it really is almost entirely shaped by that, with how kind their counterparts are in comparison. a shame; i would like to see a ganondorf raised by those women instead.

[@verdantmistral442]

It is possible that Koume and Kotake weren't as evil as as we see in OoT. Ganondorf might have contributed to their evil as he grew up. Ganondorf was essentially cursed from birth and he was likely a charismatic leader. But I doubt that is the case. I think the issue is the filter by which we look at halos. Look at Dragon Ball Z. In that the halos represent someone who is dead, not someone who is good. In Japan, the halo may not actually have a good/evil connection. I think that the reason for the halos is to differentiate Koume and Kotake as normal people rather than monsters. They are the only non-monsters that Link kills in-game. So instead of poofing away in a cloud of darkness, they had a different kind of death.

[@GabePuratekuta]

Well, I remember reading something about how they originally wanted Termina's version of Ganondorf to run the fishing hole but couldn't implement the character in time. But I can't find the info again...

[@saphiriathebluedragonknight375]

@@verdantmistral442 The Historia said they worshiped Ganondorf as the Demon King.

[@The_Moe_Szyslak_Exp_feat_Homer]

@@GabePuratekuta Holy shit. Imagine that interaction. "Hey kid? How 'bout a round of fishing? 50 rupees." "AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH" *Pulls out sword and shield and starts slashing.*

[@InvaderGIR98]

​@@The_Moe_Szyslak_Exp_feat_HomerTerminalMontage could have a field day with that concept

[@DEUCALION109]

It would be intesting to see that OoT Ganondorf’s mother died as a result of the civil war, like Link’s. While having a similar historical context you could argue that ganondorf faced a much harder side of life - born into royalty, but instead of luxuries, he only inherited the weigh of responsibility of his tribe, in a harsh environment, raised and manipulated by Koume and Kotake, having a different development due to being the only male in the the tribe. These reasons make me believe that OoT Ganondorf was something of Fate’s puppet. Him as a human is a victim to circumstances and Demise; due mostly external input on his development. In a parallel universe maybe OoT’s story had Ganondorf as the hero by redirecting his purpose onto something different; feat achieved by use of unprecedented will power. This would surely would have granted him the shard of courage or wisdom, or in a more dramatic turn of events - maybe even allowed him to possess all of it for his balanced heart.

[@milesa2011]

Ganondorf: "Pathetic little fool! Do you realize who you're dealing with? I am Ganondorf! And soon, I will rule the world!" Link: "I slayed ur moms bro!"

[@noahdean9685]

Ganondorf "did they turn into there true form?"

[@pokemonfanatic45]

If link says bro that would be gross and so hippish.

[@milesa2011]

@@pokemonfanatic45 k

[@saphiriathebluedragonknight375]

@@noahdean9685 Link: Yes. Why?

[@Icetongue]

I adore how you mentioned twinrova's double dynamite attack as if it wasn't one of the most ridiculous names in the game.

[@Andoser]

I can think of two possibilities for the halos after their defeat in OoT. One, is that they are the only boss (besides Ganondorf) that is not a monster or a demon, so having the halos and cartoonish sendoff are a way to lighten the fact that Link just killed other humans. The other possibility is that they faked their death to escape. As you rightfully point out, it would be very strange for evil witches to ascend to heaven (which we don't even know exists in the world of Zelda) after their death. I tend to lean towards the first of these possibilities, since Nabooru only awakens as a sage after their defeat, rather than when she regained consciousness the first time.

[@Aceshot-uu7yx]

I'm pretty sure an afterlife exists in Zelda because of all the magic, spirits, and gods.

[@yourmum69_420]

definitely your first comment. Nintendo is tryna be family friendly. Those 2 are they only humans you kill in the whole game. And they're the only humans who die at all besides dampe (who also has a halo)

[@kevinlee7678]

@@Aceshot-uu7yx And because of the Shadow Temple.

[@saphiriathebluedragonknight375]

My guess is it was just a comic relief moment before the final battle.

[@ShaoShaoMienshao]

We cannot forget that this is a Japanese product and halos are less of an indication of purity and righteousness, and more of a signifier of a spirit in the afterlife, which is found in or through the sky in most cultures. See also: Frieza as seen in Dragon Ball Super, etc etc. Therefore I'm inclined to go with the first option -- a cartoonish sendoff to help lighten the fact that Link was forced to kill two women in self-defense.

[@slopehoke1277]

14:06 I wouldn't be so sure Ganondorf turning evil was destined. Yes, Demise's curse is the cause of the resurrection cycle, but we know that not every descendant of Hylia is affected. Between the Zelda from Adventure of Link falling into her long slumber and the events of the original Legend of Zelda game, there were many Princess Zeldas, but it wasn't until the very last one that the cycle repeated, with Ganon invading Hyrule, Zelda being captured by Ganon, and Link having to rescue her. It's entirely possible this is true for Link and Ganon as well. Without Kotake and Koume, maybe Ganondorf just lives life the same as any other Gerudo king, and it's not until an incarnation or two down the line that all the pieces fall into place for Link to have to rescue Zelda again.

[@Spiggle25]

I think kotake and koume helped fulfill the prophecy by raising ganondorf the way they did, fulfilling the prophecy rather than being the sole cause

[@pikathechao3701]

What if, and hear me out, EVERY Gerudo king is the reincarnation of Demise, and it was just Koume and Kotake's influence and everything falling into place in JUST the right way that Ganondorf became the king of evil, otherwise he just lives life as the normal Gerudo King, ressurecting as the new king every time the old one dies.

[@sarenarterius6217]

Not every Gerudo king born from Demise. 90% the time the gerudos are evil - but not full of heatred. The heatred, cause the malice and is born from Demise. What can be more easy to produce hatred as be defeated in a war? We all see in real world what hatred made in Germany after WWI.

[@jillianhubert6931]

I've always wondered why Ganondorf skin is the color of kotake and koume. It's always made me wonder if he's been alive longer than he should be and it's a toll of the dark magic keeping him alive. None of the gerudos have that skin color and maybe they were keeping him alive longer to help him take over hyrule instead of eventually the next generation gerudo male taking over as before the gerudos werent necessarily evil, just more thieves like nabooru mentions Ganon is much more evil. Maybe he was the one who started the gerudos in the war. I would love your opinion on this!

[@geoffreyrichards6079]

Headcanon: The resurrected Ganon fought in the Oracle games onward is the Ganon seen in the cartoon series. It would explain a lot.

[@ripaklaus764]

I like to think they resurrected him stupid so he'd be easier to control or at least cause havoc so they could swoop in once the king is dead and

[@JamesDavy2009]

@@ripaklaus764 One of the rules of having one or more minions under your employ: never have any minions that match or surpass your intelligence. I can name three villains in media off the top of my head that broke that rule.

[@GoldenSon18]

Such underrated and funny characters. Thanks for making this

[@takemetoyonk]

I love how you continuously point out the difference of expression in Ganons between your videos

[@seadragon8417]

I may be late to your channel, but I have fallen in love with your theories because you go over so much information to support your theories. Thank you for bringing so many nostalgic memories of these games and wrapping them up together with things that make sense!

[@sintanan469]

I've always wondered if Kotake and Koume were previous sages, the sages of Fire and Ice, before Hyrule split in civil war. The magic of a sage marks them as one blessed by the divine, and that could explain the cartoony halos they get at their death. Two sages who broke the chain of fate by turning their divine sage magic to sorcerous ends, throwing Hyrule in chaos, and causing the civil war. There is no Sage of Ice anymore, instead we have a Sage of Spirit, combining the powers or two sages fighting against Time.

[@mikefine619]

I know the story of OoT so well but the way you present it is so engaging. Love your videos like this. Zelda is my favorite series of games and you do great work with them.

[@18Krieger]

Gerudo`s are my favourite people in Zelda. Hope we will see more of Koume and Kotake. In German Twinrova has a pun title in the original N64 game. In their normal form they called something like Killer Grannys and in the Twinrova form something like super sexy witch. Changed that for the 3DS Remake sadly.

[@floralfemme4700]

I'm realizing ganondorf has resurrected far fewer times than link and Zelda. I'd love to see a reincarnated ganondorf that's aware of demises curse on him and attempts to break it.

[@TheKyrsisForever]

Ganondorf only has ever appeared 3 times out of the entire series. Pain.

[@BigKaTrob]

I just beat OOT today for the first time in 15 years. Great timing for this video! Love the Oracle games tie in.

[@dannicartee]

Koume and Kotake are perfect representations of the desert. Koume represents the heat of the desert during the day while Kotake represents the cold of the desert at night. 🧐

[@solidskullz5736]

I had a lot of fun with the twintova fight in ocarina of time 3d and just the spirit temple in general

[@welltaco1833]

Screw that one pot in the beginning though

[@marthmallow7420]

i always laugh when the sisters become Twinrova and Link gasps

[@DragoonMS]

@@marthmallow7420 It's pretty funny, though: one minute, you're duking it out against a couple of old, decrepit hags with sick magical abilities...the next, they suddenly Jogress Evolve/DNA Digivolve into a young, sexy enchantress ready to beat 99 forms of snot outta you.

[@GODOFAWSOMENESS1]

@@DragoonMS their combined form is easier though.

[@solidskullz5736]

@@DragoonMS I like to imagine that’s how they looked when they were younger

[@danielholmqvist2713]

Your videos really help us appreaciate this incredible series even more. It's just amazing the amount of thought that the developers must've put in to make these timelines make sense, thought and work that probably would've gone unappreciated if people like you didn't work it all out for us. Thank you!

[@TheRealDreyne]

I want to see a LoZ game where Link and Ganon have to team up to fight an even bigger threat and you get to play as Ganon. Then of course in the end he’ll betray you and you have to fight him.

[@JustQuibbs]

The best part of these videos is how you always include the full story, and it is told in such a way that it is both entertaining (with tension, build up, plot development) and informative (Theory crafting, leaving complex information out but still enough in to be cohesive).

[@thethursdayparty3408]

Aaaand they are back!

[@sammoore2082]

My head Canon is that in the Wind Waker timeline, twinrova have become Frazz in spirit tracks.

[@neniv]

There are times in the Zelda series when Ganon is given a more human background, like in Wind Waker where he wanted the wind of the prosperous Hyrule because his people were downtrodden and cursed with the barren desert. There have also been times where Wisdom is also corrupted as in A Link Between Worlds with Hilda. Do you think there has been any time in the history of Hyrule when a corruption of Courage gained the Triforce?

[@Michael_Raymond]

I would love to see a game where the Triforce of Courage gets corrupted and given to the villain, and the main character is instead Zelda using the Triforce of Wisdom The macguffins being collected can be pieces of the Triforce of Power, Mother 3 style

[@GODOFAWSOMENESS1]

@@Michael_Raymond sounds like the first Legend of Zelda game with a few changes.

[@michealforguson5317]

That's a great idea. Especially now that we've seen how Wisdom can be corrupted in ALBW. And in the same game, how Power and Wisdom's forms are used in a corruptive manner. What would Courage look like?

[@ladyabaxa]

@@michealforguson5317 A constant search for a "worthy opponent" or continuously building deathtraps to "test" people? Constant warfare would also qualify as would summoning powerful beings into the world to spread terror.

[@spiralgodking9877]

@@ladyabaxa Yeah, Link would essentially be turned into a blood knight.

[@Ore0219]

You've quickly become one of my favorite KZbinrs. Keep up the Zelda theories and Commentaries. It really makes me appreciate the depth and beauty within the series

[@TheSlowchamp]

The spirit temple theme is so melancholic. I love it!

[@MercysNo.1]

Fun Fact: In the Oot Light Novel... It's revealed that Volvagia is Links Pet. As a child, Link buys a baby dragon at the market and raises it. Upon becoming an adult, Link tears up when he has to kill the pet he so loved. Volvagia also sheds a tear after Link defeats her before she fades away.

[@Cri_Jackal]

7:16 Correction: Kotake is ice, Koume is fire.

[@lokivaleska3988]

I was gonna comment the same thing. Glad someone else caught that too

[@Abs0lut3_ZER0]

i feels good to hear that intro again welcome back Zeltik

[@GamingwithJere]

Love your work Zeltik! Looking forward to when BOTW2 releases!!

[@HellfireComms]

It's always a good day when a new video of yours appears in my sub feed.

[@TJDious]

I never wondered about this before but now I'm suspicious as to whether these two crazed old women somehow deliberately coaxed the spirit of Malice into Ganondorf the way they would later attempt to ressurrect him in the Oracle games.

[@kenpanderz672]

"we can revive him, we have the magic" *destroys his mind*

[@Varindran]

The Gerudo are so cool and i hope we got tons more lore for them in BOTW 2

[@nathanio103]

Face Shrine music at 10:16 just gives me chills..... absolute masterpiece!

[@ominousvirus5278]

I’d say if there’s a definite timeline branch Breath of the Wild mostly comes from, it’s be the child timeline due to Ganondorf still having an intelligent, although decayed body.

[@MB-gl2bl]

Beautifully made and appreciate the lore a bit more. Great video!

[@dorothygale9648]

"The Master Sword shatters the armor" he says, while showing footage with the Biggoron Sword.

[@rank2859]

I noticed that too lol.

[@ThouzandWattz]

This was one of your best videos! 👌🏾💪🏾🤯

[@Crusteaze]

Anyone else love hearing Zeltik say "Kotake and Koume" for 15 minutes? :)

[@JamesDavy2009]

Not only that, the pronunciations of those names are almost spot on.

[@Erikuzuma]

Zeltik: "Twinrova, a powerful being with mas-" Me: "MASSIVE BOOBS YEAH!" Zeltik: "-tery over both elements" ME: "Oh, yeah I suppose she has those two too."

[@KingWafl]

I'd love to see another video like this for Phantom Ganon. He is such an interesting recurring character.

[@nicklewis470]

It's just Ganondorf pretty much.

[@kamionero]

My favorite boss! And favorite boss music of course. Thanks Zeltik!

[@Cwronaga216]

I would love to see the twin witches return in a breath of the wild style using magic to regain their youth and fighting together against the hero

[@spiralgodking9877]

Interesting material for fanfictions...~

[@Ore0219]

I love these videos. Every single one of them. The part in Ocarina of Time with Nabooru is the scene that really hit me the hardest. It's not my favorite Zelda game but it does have some of the best lore and story in the series. Didn't realize I'm watching this a second time lol

[@Link-Link]

I would love to see an appeareance of the witches in botw 2. Imagine them trying to help Ganon by giving him some sort of malice "regeneration", wouldn't that be cool?

[@cvanims]

Crazy how I play all these games, but miss so much of the story until you drop a video and explain it.

[@chompythebeast]

There seem to be a lot of theories about what the halos in Kotake and Koume's death scene might indicate, but I think Westerners are inclined to read more into the halos than the Japanese devs probably intended. The scene is constructed like a classic Japanese duo comedy bit called Manzai, and the halos appear to be a riff on old cartoons, where characters are depicted with halos to indicate that they're merely dead, not necessarily that they're Heaven-bound as opposed to Hell-bound or anything like that. They're a visual gag, not confirmation of a dualist, Christian-style afterlife existing in the Zelda universe. The back and forth silly bickering in the scene is straight out of Japanese Manzai, and it probably would have been immediately recognizable as such to the original audience. We might also remember that 20th century Looney Tunes were still very popular back in the 90s, they were even experiencing a worldwide resurgence in popularity around that time. The halo bit would have evoked the way many of those shorts ended, with even the "bad guys" like Yosemite Sam getting blown up and then being seen wearing angelic robes, playing a harp, and crowned with a halo to indicate he had died in a way that wasn't gruesome but was actually a silly note to end on. And that wasn't a gag exclusive to Looney Tunes, either. So probably especially to a non-Christian Japanese audience, it would make perfect sense to use halos as a cartoonish gag to indicate in a lighthearted way that a character had died, with no eternal judgement being associated with the symbolism at all. The halos in Kotake and Koume's death scene are just a part of that style of over-the-top or larger than life Manzai comedy, and they shouldn't be understood to be the tip of an iceberg of *deepest lore* regarding the Gerudo afterlife or anything like that

[@zachweller8115]

Besides the fact you killed this. And besides the fact that your videos are amazing. This would be a great movie series. I think an long epic netflix series would go array. But if this was a trilogy/quad movie series. The visuals. This would be epic. And id watch it because of what you have created. This videos are not only fun and seemingly educational, but intriguing enough to watch as a movie. Love it Zeltik

[@davidtosh7200]

Ganondorf’s nasty witches, Koume and Kotake. However Nabooru will have to guard the Spirit Temple after defeating Twinrova and freeing Nabooru as of Sage of Spirit.

[@Flarezetta]

I'm liking these lore videos you're getting out. I wish Twinrova's background could be explored a bit more in OOT.

[@nukal4338]

I'd love to actually one day see his biological parents and how they end up not Raising him

[@MrEmiosk]

Dad probably a guy raped or at best willingly forced into the act. The mother a simple gerudo woman that bore a male child and was forced to give the babe up to the ancient witches. Either by religious reasons or them not giving them a choice. The witches have lived through at least three other periods of a gerudo male, and probably founded the religous desert order using their twinrova form as the deity.

[@alchemysaga3745]

@@MrEmiosk It's not unlikely/impossible that Hylian men saw Gerudo that were on the 'hunt' as a good way to have no-strings attached intercourse. It doesn't matter if the woman get pregnant, because it's what she was trying to get. At least in the cases of Gerudo women who decided there was no point in trying to have a romantic relationship with a man she'd only see on very seldom occasions, if ever again. For example, Malon is implied to be a child born from the union of a Hylian man and Gerudo woman. If you wear the Gerudo Mask, Talon notes that you look a lot like Malon's mother. There's no anger in the phrasing, so we can assume that it was something explained to Hylian men- the child would be raised by the parent they took after. The reason for this is somewhat obvious, as it isn't likely that a pale Hylian would do well in the Desert, let alone in the traditional clothing of the Gerudo. The social isolation problem would be another reason. On the flip side, a pale Hylian with a Gerudo mother could be easily be raised by their Hylian father with no-one the wiser. So it's likely that the idea of kidnapping and assaulting men was, even at the time of Ocarina of Time, the least favored option. Particularly as the carpenter's main complaint is that they weren't getting the kind of attention they had hoped for when they tried to break in to the Gerudo Fortress.

[@MrEmiosk]

@@alchemysaga3745 there are always exceptions to the rules, also it is implied that the civil war/heavy instability of Hyrule ended shortly after links birth. Ganondorf was born in a very different time, and I still do not think gerudo cared very much about the man/men they choose. Considering how openly hostile they as a whole are to men that has not gotten approval from the chieftess/leader. Heck link was only allowed around their stronghold because of how useless it was to try and stop him. And throughout the game the only gerudo that were nice and nonhostile are those on the fringes of gerudo land and society. The fact that more then a few guys would not mind to mingle doesn't mean that their participation was fully their choice all of the time. Certainly I imagine it be safer and more fun for gerudo to pick those who wants to tango rather than not.

[@Blablarrr]

OOT's sexy hexy definitely hit different, when i played it as a kid. Those Polygons awakened something in me.

[@PrimmsHoodCinema]

They both kinda resemble Demise when their hair changes

[@Link-Link]

Hmmmm good observation

[@misswaffles2011]

Awww smacks another one!!!! I loved the twinrova fight in oot! Thanks for another great video♥️

[@ricardobeltranmonribot3182]

After finish Skyward Sword, I began to believe that koume and kotake found remands of Demise and used a baby Gannondorf has the new vesel of the deceased demon king, this was reinforced with the Wind Waker's Ganondorf, since he wasn't as evil like the Twilight Princess's Gannondorf or the Ocarina of Time's Gannondorf, as if like his imprisoment in the sacred realm purge Demise of him, but the resentment and hatred was still in him

[@DJMilez]

Fantastic video love the passion and detailed information on these two sorceress

[@HopelessHermit]

Preferred them in the oracle games. They actually pop up in cutscenes, are referenced by other NPCs, and have an awesome back to back secret final boss fight (not that anything can stop lvl 3 sword + red ring)

[@BobbyHairStudio]

IVE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS

[@Aegisatreyu]

Imagine if Koume and Kotake were to make an appearance in Breath of the Wild 2. It might confirm where the timeline falls. In the child timeline maybe.

[@B3rT286]

Great video as always

[@skuffy4930]

The cherry on top of the twins versions from Termina is something you may not realize. The elements they control are actually flipped.

[@gshaz7]

yaaaaas the spirit temple music background! love your channel!

[@darkcloak100]

They are fun in Ages and Seasons

[@tacohylia]

Is it just me or does at 0:55 or anytime the show the twinrova boss scene the glyphs on the wall resemble the glyphs from the Zelda:Tears of the Kingdom trailers?

[@TheBlackSquirrel]

On the question of who Ganondorf's parents were, I'm still not entirely convinced that he HAD parents... I just find it a little too strange that we know exactly nothing about his mother or father, as well as there being absolutely no information or evidence of any previous male Gerudo leaders. What COULD explain this though (except for the boring "Nintendo hasn't figured this out yet"-answer) is that Ganondorf was not born, but rather "created" by the Twinrova. I also think that the whole "one male Gerudo is born every 100 years and is destined to be the leader" was fabricated by these sisters specifically to give Ganondorf the power over the tribe. No one else of the Gerudos looks to be over 100 years old, so there is no way for them to know whether this is true or not. Assuming that they don't keep historical records (and even if they do, Kotake and Koume could easily manipulate them or just simply destroy them) the women of the Gerudo would have to trust this story. Admittedly there are hundreds of possible theories to who Ganondorf's parents and the previous male gerudo leaders were, but this is one of my favorites because I'm always a fan of forgotten/corrupted history.

[@Kazooples]

I played most of oracle of ages as a kid and had no idea Kotake and Koume were even slightly related to it, I didn’t finish it because the dungeons were too hard for my little brain back then.

[@kidvandal4955]

A theory I have as to why the Kotake and Koume ascend to the heavens after being defeated in OoT is because they’re beings who revel in chaos and misery. So what would serve better as (semi)eternal damnation for these beings than a realm of peace and happiness?

[@lewstherintelamon244]

The old Frieza punishment, eh?

[@saphiriathebluedragonknight375]

Reminds me of Rainbow Dashes nightmare. Sorry.

[@younghacker09]

massive respect to you for the great work that you do, Zeltik!

[@queazy03]

They were pretty easy on the eyes when combined. Also I hear that Oba or Obaba means old hag in Japanese. Twinrova = Twin Oba. Something like that is their etymology

[@Kip667]

Bro your a legend no pun intended. Keep up the awsome videos. You explain alot of my childhood questions.

[@kej_snake]

I have always felt that in the downfall time line that Ganon, finding out that Link had slain his mothers, used the power of the full triforce to resurrect them.

[@yourmum69_420]

nah

[@darkusomegus3540]

Wow! I just beat Twinrova in Ocarina of Time 3D earlier today, then this video shows up. Nice! 👍

[@WarmLillie]

Hmm, maybe they have Halo because they took care of Ganon? A bit divine prank. They follow Ganondorf act for the good people. This show using Dark magic doesn’t make evil automatically.

[@DarknessGuard]

Still love the idea that Calamity Ganon is actually Phantom Ganon gone wild and feral.

[@MrMcGee-yc1oq]

I feel like if Link was older, he'd be able to wield the full Triforce on his own. We know he has courage, if Link can continuously win against a Power infused Ganon in some way or another he has more than enough power. And if he were older and more experienced in life, he could have the wisdom. I'm not completely sure on wisdom, I don't know what exactly gives Zelda her opportunity to use the Triforce other than being part of the destined Demise Trio.

[@MJTRadio]

Wait wait wait, the Civil War before Ocarina of Time lasted an age? Really?! I assumed it had gone on for a few years, a few decades maybe, but a length of time long enough to get the Zelda age mark?! Zeltik, if there’s enough material, a Hylian Civil War video would be very helpful.

[@Juan_blooms]

There’s only one big question with this theory why do they have halos when they’re dead?

[@enegmatixerebro]

Frieza

[@no1guy825]

this isn't a theory - it's just the basic details of the characters. The halos just naturally contrast with who they are, partially as a gag. I will say this happens in old cartoons a lot too...where a character is blown up or killed, and even though they were this despicable character, like Tom the cat or Wile E. Coyote...or just some villain, they have a final joke of them ascending with wings, a halo, a gown and a harp, like some angel. It's just an iconic, easy representation of the afterlife. Although, an equally famous trope is to have them descend to hell with fire, horns, a tail, and a pitchfork......you don't see it nearly as much. I'm guessing they wanted to keep things light....as brutal and horrifying as this game can get in rare moments. Like with Dragonball Z, Japan seems to do this a lot.

[@Juan_blooms]

I understand now Nintendo didn’t really want it up their age rating now I understand why twilight princess got a tea reading that game is terrifying

[@chimuoma390]

Great Video,Zeltik!The Oracle Games Were My Childhood!I Never Knew This Lore!

[@lb7849]

Guys whats the song playing at 10:30, it's driving me crazy cant remember!

[@kibapon3449]

I wanna know too, i have herad it so many times :"v

[@valofthenorth475]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZoPVin1rr5KVm5o here you go

[@lb7849]

@@valofthenorth475 You star! I knew It was from Links Awakening but couldnt remember. Have a nice day :)

[@josephpitcher5990]

You could say that while they worked with and worshipped him. The fact that they were the first to revive Ganon shows a weird level of love to their son.

[@WarmLillie]

Twonrova is pretty interesting, as she’s also hot and cool too.

[@johnmorey720]

I would LOVE to see a spinoff about how they began worshiping Demise, and so much of their origins - and, yeah, how they found the baby Ganondorf and began molding him into their image. I do find it interesting how he loved them enough to put their names on his swords in Wind Waker, to resurrect them in the Hero Defeated timeline (in time for the Oracle games), and apparently again at whatever the flashback timeline was in Tears of the Kingdom (they're younger and they have no lines, but they make a cameo appearance).