Van's RV-10 wanting to buy? [Performance, costs, build time, and more]

[@rv10ator]

My RV-10 is a quick-build assembled by my wife and I and completed in 2007. At 15 years in service, it has just passed 1250 hrs TTSN, all of which I have flown as pilot in command. It started life with a factory new Lycoming IO-540 and Hartzell blended airfoil prop, and they have been 100% reliable for the roughly quarter of a million miles it has flown to date. Accessories have needed to be replaced beginning in the past few years, such as a new alternator, new EGT and fuel pressure sensors, and both main gear tires and brake pads seem to last about 200-300 landings. The avionics have been a continuous story of upgrades over the years, beginning with dual Grand Rapids EFIS displays, a TruTrak 2 axis autopilot capable of shooting coupled ILS and GPS LPV approaches, a Garmin GNS480 navigator, SL40 second comm, and GTX 330 transponder. The EFIS's were upgraded to Synthetic vision, the GTX 330 became a 330ES for ADSB-out, a Stratux homebuilt ADS-B In receiver was added, an additional EFIS display was added to the copilot side, and one of the mags was replaced with a SureFly electronic ignition which noticeably improved power, operating efficiency, and solved a problem with occasional difficulties doing hot starts. The original cost including professional four color paint scheme was just about exactly $150K, and over the years an additional $15K has gone into avionics upgrades. As a previous owner-pilot of a Cessna 172 and 182, and builder-owner-pilot of an RV-7A and RV-12, and with a total of about 3300 hrs PIC in the logbook, I can say that the RV-10 is clearly the best aircraft I have ever built, owned or flown. It is a cross country magic carpet in which one can easily log 2000nm of cross country flying in a single day and still be feeling like wanting to fly some more at the end of the day. It is particularly at home flying high, in the mid-teens (with portable tank O2 for pilot and pax), and is an honest 170 KTAS aircraft that will hold that cruise speed up through about 16000 ft. burning 13-14 gph. Mine has GAMI injectors and can be run lean of peak at 10.5 gph doing 155 KTAS. It is basically a responsive, lightweight homebuilder's Cirrus SR22 at a quarter of the price. Just a wonderful bird if one's mission is cross country travel with "speed, style, and comfort" as the Van's description says. The major problem in 2022 -- along with inflation--is that if you order one you may have to wait up to a year or more to even get your first subkit (the empennage). The supply chain issues and order backlogs at Vans are an extremely severe issue at present. So the best time to build one seems to be, say, 2007. ;-)

[@hellochriscole]

This is an awesome case study, thank you Dan!

[@muhammadsteinberg]

Excellent information. Sold my 172N back in July 2022. Ordered RV-10 empenage kit (not quick build) about a month later. Just got it last week so mine took approximately 4 months.

[@Nitrag0191]

Appreciate the detailed review!

[@richardfrisbie252]

Built my RV-10 standard build kit over 19 years with 6000 work hours logged including all helpers. This includes major changes to the door hinges and latch mechanism to prevent unexpected door opening and detachment during flight, a unique 12 gallon third fuel tank design located in the baggage compartment, overhauling my IO-540-N1A5 Lycoming, dual electronic ignition, dual alternators, etc. etc. Fling off the forty hours now. A great aircraft. Fast build kits would have saved about 1500 hours of build time.

[@adopstap]

Well presented and informative video. Good sound quality. I like the modest way of presenting; asking comments, tips and experiences from Van RV10 owners. Well done.

[@2Phast4Rocket]

The cost to build a regular 2 person RV is over 100K with basic VFR panel. It will easily cost over 200K for a 4-person RV10 today. This applies all of the airplanes that can carry four people. The Sling is even more expensive but it has less performance than the RV10. Why does it cost so much? It is because owners of the RV10 want to have a great looking IFR panel, premium interior like the Cirrus, and professional paint job. Plus they want the brand new Lycoming engine from the factory. All of these push the price up to 1/4 million dollars. There are a few inexpensive experimental kits but they don't have the performance like the Vans aircraft. They aren't easy to build or have the customer build support like Vans. This is why Vans has high resale values because the owners know the company will be a round for a long time, has inexpensive parts in case of minor paint scuff, and all A&Ps know how to work on a normal Lycoming powered Vans aircraft.

[@edwardchipps8629]

Best plane anywhere! It’s a family member! Lots of happy memories in my 10!

[@AndyMatrix]

So this baby made into my top 14 list: My needs , Range and Price 1 Velocity V-Twin 2 Risen 3 Seabear 4 Riven 500 5 CH77 Ranabot 6 SuperStol 7 Advantic WT10 8 Argon GTL 9 Rutan Long-EZ 10 VL3 Evolution 11 Velocity XL RG 12 Super Petrel Xp 13 TL-Ultralight Stream 14 Van's RV-10

[@pilotavery]

The true cost for someone who's just getting started and doesn't have the tools is going to be around $250,000 realistically. An experienced builder could do it for $200,000 if they already have their collection. However, I think that if you're already spending $250,000, you may as well spend $300,000 because that means you get $50,000 to spend on the interior which means you can get really good avionics with IFR equipment and you can get some really nice custom fabricated handles and you can get leather upholstery and other mods

[@observer1242]

If I’m going to spend 300,000 then I’ll get a bonanza or a 210. Building is nice, but it takes time away from flying. And the tools cost money. If you’re not a gearhead, you run the risk of burning a hole in your stomach or your head exploding.

[@observer1242]

If you would consider a Cessna 182, then you have to consider a piper Dakota 235.

[@davidtsw]

What a beautiful aircraft. 4 pax, baggage and short field performance together with 165-170 kt cruise speeds and reasonably low fuel economy. I'd love to fly it but I'd never dare to even attempt to build one. Way too complicated and I'd much rather have someone who knows what they're doing build it for me

[@ferhanhussain4737]

Great video Captain MIke!

[@StoriesofAviation]

More to come!

[@lcprivatepilot1969]

Hopefully TurbAero gets the turbine figured out!

[@TomasGeorge]

Looks cool!

[@ctn830]

A beautiful plane which I was looking at. But at the end of the day you can’t beat Sling with Rotax 915is engine. Full FADAC sipping 5 gal/hr

[@jayanthkumar7964]

What's the TBO on those? Much lower

[@ctn830]

@@jayanthkumar7964 same if you use regular gas at half the cost 😁

[@Reloadeez]

@@ctn830 I was actually surprised when I looked up the comparison. RV10 vs Sling Tsi, 1450 fpm vs 1000 fpm, cabin width 48in vs 45in, full fuel max load 740 pounds vs 702 pounds, fuel capacity 60 gal vs 52 gal, normal cruise 201 mph vs 170mph, fuel burn normal cruise 11.5 gph vs 8 gph, miles per gallon normal cruise 17.47 vs 21.25, range at normal cruise 825 miles vs 1,010 miles, complete build cost with quick build 215k vs 199k.

[@georgehardie2016]

Who builds it kind of important

[@flodurpups9846]

Thanks for the new kit. The permissions is for experiment? Than i can use diesel engines? And is it allowed to be built in Germany?

[@coasternut3091]

1050 for 4 people who are 6'4??? So they don't need any fuel then?

[@georgehardie2016]

Just the process seems ridiculously complicated

[@mehmetvural8095]

have a nice day. 0 km for 4 people. Can I buy the ultralight plane for $300,000? thanks.

[@Austinmediainc]

Great video but way off on the pricing. You're looking at 200k + depending in how's its configured. The quick build kit, new engine, and prop will cost you 175k. Add interior, paint, and avionics and many people are now close to 300k to build. Most I've seen lately are selling for 300k+ with the odd higher tine with basic avionics and options selling for 240k.

[@BobbyPilot]

Current rv10 builder here. I'd say the numbers were close maybe a year or two ago but... especially with recent inflation hitting the aviation sector pretty hard... the numbers are probably more like 160 - 200k (well equiped) if you were start a kit today. We started our kit in late 2018 and assumed we'd be in the 150 range (no parachute and no AC). Actual numbers are still TBD but probably closer to 175 out the door (after paint... paint job alone is 15-30k). Some guys a creatively frugal and can source used avionics and 540 cores and get the number south 150... so more power to those guys. I'm not one of those guys. If I were starting today, I'd just budget for 200k and roll. And still beats a brand new SR22 by about $700k. :)

[@Austinmediainc]

@@BobbyPilot no doubt still a good deal, probably the best bang for your buck in aviation. That being said, after the last 3 price hikes from Vans and Lycoming you would probably be close to 135k for a new engine and standard kit. Even rebuilds with a core are going to be close to 40k now. So if you go cheap rebuild, standard kit, 6 pack, basic interior, and home paint you'd be about 165k, but like most people if you're building and spending that already are you going basic? Once you add premium interior, glass avionics, and good paint I think you're closer to 250k. I have an excel spreadsheet to budget and thats what I'm at. Lycoming, Vans, interior, and paint have increased at least 50% over the last 3 years.

[@BobbyPilot]

True. Bottom line... Not as cheap as it used to be. :) I guess we can say that about almost everything these days. But yeah still better than a cirrus. :)

[@jonasbaine3538]

Shouldn't the landing gear suspension have much more resistance since that drop test was an empty airframe that still bottomed out from a few foot drop? Imagine full loaded aircraft.

[@beechcraftpvp]

While I agree, most pilots don’t stall their plane at 5 feet and let it plop down.

[@simonhughes-king8493]

They do the drop test at MTOW. No point doing otherwise eh?

[@jonasbaine3538]

@@simonhughes-king8493this video shows a bare airframe drop test

[@simonhughes-king8493]

@@jonasbaine3538 But loaded up to MTOW with sandbags etc surely?

[@katiemyers1192]

A detailed complete build: youtube.com/@buildingthe10

[@USA-GreedyMenOfNoIntegrity]

So it doesn’t require any special skills to build one? Kidding right? 9.3 gph. I don’t think so. Try 10.5-14.0 gph. You need minimum $200K. Enjoy. They are a blast to fly and can get you into trouble much faster than your 172 trainer.

[@simonhughes-king8493]

I think that 9.3 gph must be LOP.

[@paulo7200]

Neighbor built one. I couldn't believe the amount of cutting, boring holes, sizing components etc and other tasks that should have been done in a factory. This problem isn't unique to Vans. Call me when there's a kit plane available that consists of bolting together factory assembled finished components.

[@edroman2042]

Try the BD4-C. Lower price, significantly less build time and great performance. Not the prettiest plane but as they say beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

[@USA-GreedyMenOfNoIntegrity]

You’ve got to meet the 51% rule.

[@jeremy31326]

Being in aviation heavy maintenance for over 30 years, it’s comments like this one that shows exactly how people think they know, but really don’t.

[@tinolino58]

Imagine a replacement for this terrible wing

[@tinolino58]

@@jonasbaine3538 study the profile and keep quiet

[@tinolino58]

@@jonasbaine3538 you are just a fan boy.

[@thumpin250]

What's the issue with the wing?

[@2Phast4Rocket]

@@thumpin250 The wings attract a lot of trolls.