Vaush And Xanderhal Takedown Video | LEFTIST CIVIL WAR

Destiny reacts to Noah Samsen's take down video on Vaush and Xanderhal ft. Hasan...
Date: 10 Feb, 2022
Follow Destiny
►STREAM - www.destiny.gg/bigscreen
►DISCORD - discordapp.com/invite/destiny
►REDDIT - / destiny
►INSTAGRAM - / destiny
►MERCH - shop.destiny.gg/
Check Out My Amazon: www.amazon.com/shop/destiny
Buy My Merch: shop.destiny.gg/
We are giants - Epidemic Sound (SONG)
00:00:00 Teasers / Intro
00:00:56 Noah Samsen's video on Vaush and Xanderhal ft Hasan
00:07:26 Framing Xanderhal's comment in a racial way
00:11:56 Ben Shapiro and Jordan Peterson's influence
00:14:04 Hasan was a debate bro
00:24:10 Noah Samsen ratio'd Destiny on Twitter
00:29:55 The right cares about optics, dog whistles, tokens
00:42:07 Outdated talking points from Vaush
00:46:21 Vaush's minority take...
00:54:27 Noncompete looked awful vs Vaush
01:02:58 Interactions w/ debate streamers...
01:05:28 Professor Flowers debate vibe...
01:12:53 Ex-debate bro John Duncan
01:18:25 There are ways to move through these arguments...
01:26:11 NonCompete and Vaush disagree on the facts
#Destiny
#Vaush
#Hasan

[@destiny]

▼Referenced videos▼ Destiny moderates a Hasan, Vaush and Rem debate ►kzbin.info/www/bejne/d5vWq3iAd7CKiNU Destiny and Hasan break down Hasan's Charlie Kirk debate ►kzbin.info/www/bejne/b5u1mXqXpciUgZY

[@dannyboi986]

I hadn't watched any content before this, for a while. xD

[@kennymendoza1581]

If neither these guys are relevant, how is this "a civil war on the left"? These clickbait titles really say everything you need to know about what appeals to the average destiny fanboy.

[@HasanSIM14]

@@kennymendoza1581 wtf who said they're not relevant? They're stupid yes, but not irrelevant. This is the entire problem lol. If they weren't so relevant it would be great

[@majdjinn5042]

On the black separatism, in their own writings they are angry that white nationalism has basically immunize people to their own rhetoric. They are mad that people have faced what they want to say and they are easily seen for the racists they are. They never debate they aren't, they just go "well blacks need to do it because Tulsa" .

[@bennywolfe4357]

Destiny, I was wondering, do you still think hate crimes don’t matter? I recall you saying that black people disproportionately committing hate crimes against Jews doesn’t matter because black people cant genocide the Jews in America.

[@moxpanda]

"Heres a little cartoon character that represents good faith arguments" Tell me your video is going to be pure bad faith bullshit without telling me.

[@Kingninja42]

Up there with PF’s brownie point jar opener

[@andrewteague114]

@@Kingninja42 yeah, ha, what a way to begin a debate! "you're a child, so I'm going to act like one" was basically what that was

[@tomtommerson6320]

Always just screams how little you know of the topic or person you talk about. The only way you can present yourself is like a kids cartoon where you act out a conversations just for scripted lines that wont challenge your point

[@user-wu1us1yh3n]

This is why LGBT background lighting and zoomer humor doesn't make a video essay's points any stronger.

[@benny399]

Zoomer Humor???? Bro this ain't zoomer humor, this is an incredibly insular type of comedic aesthetic... zoomer is over stating it

[@benny399]

@@loganroofpedoexposer4952 OMEGALUUUUULL 💀💀💀💀

[@shhs1227]

this isn't zoomer humor

[@MH-bw9zt]

So you're saying being gay or supporting gays automatically makes them bad?

[@chickenandksivideoreviewer9739]

This is not humor, they try to use comedic timing and editing but it's completely soulless

[@eben7248]

People like Noah Samsen will force Destiny and Vaush back together, and I don't know how to feel about that.

[@mario167100]

Avengers assemble, mf

[@eben7248]

@@mario167100 but the avengers are our parasocial parents

[@garywebb2432]

@@eben7248 who divorced so this is after captain america: civil war

[@chickenandksivideoreviewer9739]

the way other people are acting, I could probably look past some shit vaush has done or said.

[@PacifistBetaFish]

You love to see it

[@SirGrimLockSmithVIII]

I seriously don't understand why anyone would try to use Hasan as a valid source for anything.

Entertainment?

[@galleryofrogues]

@agreed, he occasionally says some funny shit, though usually unintentionally 😂

[@GayTier1Operator]

as a leftist, what’s hilarious about videos like noah’s is that they formally and implicitly demonstrate that they don’t care to make a good argument and rely on aesthetics and gags to supplement the lack of points they make

[@chickenandksivideoreviewer9739]

The funniest part is they're essentially the liberals that leftists used to make fun of

[@ExeErdna]

That's shock and awe tactics for ya.

[@just_a_turtle_chad]

Vaush completely destroyed Noah

[@keggerous]

It's actually a form of meta humor I think. Like, the dude is trying to be funny but he's clearly not but you can find humor in the fact that he talks for 10 minutes without saying anything of substance at all.

[@mclazerz8931]

The left will just continue to eat itself

[@jamiehayes7353]

It takes a special kind of person to literally make a joke out of the concept of engaging in good faith.

[@jmoreland4]

It's the idea that "the opposition" is morally wrong and engaging them in good faith will always have bad outcomes. This is a position I do not hold.

[@Megelos]

this whole video is a parody to that gag

[@juliancohen9561]

Actually the concept of "good faith" is increasingly being considered part of "white supremacist culture". Four months ago the developer community of Ruby, a very popular programming language, removed from its code of conduct the notion of "tolerate opposing views" and "assume good intent" because certain activists believe they enable white supremacy.

[@neffsucksatgaming5418]

I honestly hate streamers like Vaush cause they are part of the reason good faith are being made fun of. He always acts like he acts in good faith when often he doesn’t. Makes it easier for people to make fun of it

[@ExeErdna]

@@juliancohen9561 Some people don't see the irony. They legit saw good faith with bad faith and painted the good as bad because they don't wish to be wrong.

[@RealFreedomMG]

The funny thing is about this whole situation is how quickly Noah proved his main points wrong immediately after posting this video. He talks about "debate bros" but all it took was one debate with Vaush about this video and he walked back everything he said on a video that apparently took him a month to make. If he had just done the thing he was so against in the video and talked to Vaush or Xanderhal when they were live and had a discussion about it he would have saved himself a month of his life but it shows how just doing quick edits with some gags is enough to be considered a "video essay"

[@chanr9531]

Debate changed his mind, shocking almost as if debate is a legitimate way to convey your ideas to other parties.

[@ifillspace6887]

But he would lose the cash from the video.. This way he gets the cash, walks back on his words and gets to be on the good side of bigger creators.. Not saying it was his thought process or anything.. just saying he gained a lot with (what seems to be) a small backlash.

[@RanEncounter]

is that vod out already? Edit: nvm here it is watch?v=79DwS8EzXbM

[@LimewaterMusic]

You can walk back as many comments as you’d like, it never means you have to refund your subs lol

[@venom16839]

What about Naruto Music?

[@Wakefan2557]

He doesn’t like hypotheticals because it makes you defend positions you wouldn’t originally defend if it wasn’t brought up? So you’re scared of the logical conclusions of your thought process. That’s a problem.

[@ethansofinowski7349]

Exactly

[@Megelos]

Its like they haven't fully developed their arguments yet so when you force them do it on the spot they just deny it and quit.

[@UsoMerit]

Also it wasn't even really an exaggeration. All Vaush did was ask what PF means by "having the right to live without their oppressors" and that the deportation of an ethnic group isn't justified. That's literally just asking: what do you mean by your statement and what are the direct implications, not some slippery slope type around 10 corners, like noah implies.

[@deceam208]

I'm pretty sure Noah's just strictly against making inductive jumps to unstated conclusions (whether using Hypos or not). The saddest part about this is he would absolutely be fine with this if it were used against someone he disagrees with. A good example of this is Jordan Peterson. Anyone who has an issue with JP has to read into his rhetoric (the cherry picking of descriptive facts) and find some sort of conclusion to attack since he famously never makes prescriptions (i.e., he technically never says anything offensive just like Professor Flower technically never said she would be in favour of a white genocide). To be clear I don't know enough about PF to make an a half decent guess at her beliefs, just what I gathered from the clip.

[@Ed-en8br]

The problem is you can construct a hypothetical for literally anything. Creating a fringe scenario doesn’t mean your points are invalid. Destiny fans really struggle with this idea

[@soonforget]

It’s always a blast when someone, who isn’t funny in any sense, inserts 1000 drops into their video to slam their jokes over your head.

[@youisstupid2586]

This right here. The only person who I’ve seen do this style correctly is lonerbox

[@AssailantLF]

Also the distracting and repetitive background music with like 3-5 second loops.

[@zacharychristy8928]

Reacting with images and jokes that appropriate internet culture? I believe it's called "virtual soy face".

[@adamp_]

Idk his points are pretty stupid but I did find it mildly funny at points, I don't think it's this sinfully unfunny thing you guys are making it out to be, we can find the video stupid without seething over the humor

[@zacharychristy8928]

@@adamp_ It's not terrible, it's just overpoweringly mediocre with smash cuts and quick audio stabs that are basically part of the free "millennial humor starter kit". It works for TikToks but gets really boring and repetitive in a 1 hour video. He's like the Chinese bootleg version of hbomberguy. It's not really 'seething' I think it's just that when you're going for the aesthetic of 'disaffected, condescending intellectual', editing your video to run the same set of loud, annoying 3/10 jokes into the ground gets incredibly grating.

[@e.d.5766]

If you want a counterbalance character to ensure that you don't come across as bad faith, maybe have someone who disagrees with you at least proof read the script. The problem with having a fictional character you alone wrote calling you out for being bad faith is that you wouldn't say something that you think is bad faith, so this character is useless.

[@jeffwells641]

That's my biggest issue, I want to call it laziness but I almost fell like these guys just don't have the depth of experience to recognize glaring flaws in their arguments. They stay in a bubble that just hides these flaws, so when their videos break through to a wider audience, they get torn apart because they are weak. I like video essays, you can pack way more nuanced information in an essay, but your information and arguments need to be correct. I get not being able to argue nearly any subject at the drop of a hat like a debate bro, and having no desire to do so either, that's a particular skill not everyone has. But if you can't even intelligently discuss a topic you supposedly spent anywhere from several hours to several days researching and formulating arguments for, that's a real problem. All you need to do to make a good argument is make it valid (conclusions follow from premises) and make sure it's sound (the premises are true). You can still be wrong, (you can miss one or more premises that apply and change the conclusion) but this is a solid foundation for a discussion. If that's too much to handle then you really probably shouldn't be making video essays. You don't know the subject well enough, or you're bad at logic. Either one is bad for information heavy essays.

[@sathrielsatanson666]

I was thinking the same. But yeah, that would be a good idea if that was his objective but he just wanted to deflect criticism about being bad faith while still being bad faith.

[@RanEncounter]

Yeah this. He is literally acknowledging he is bad faith and rationalizing it by creating an imaginary "good faith" character to keep him in check. It is like he does not understand how bias works.

[@egusisoup1826]

Lol, he doesn’t keep that character for counterbalance, he does so for humor. It allows him to say edgier things without the perception of fully endorsing them, so he can get squeeze out entertainment value while giving himself the easy out of “it was just a joke”. This is how he gets away with doing everything besides explicitly calling Vaush and others white supremacist, racists. His character isn’t there to steel man him, but to slightly dilute the venom of his words to make it more digestible.

[@RanEncounter]

@@egusisoup1826 Yeah we know that but do you think he views it that way? Of course not. He has done this type of "humor" so long that he does not recognize what is the pitfall of that kind of "humor".

[@xamn4351]

This is so much bad faith, Vaush actually made Slavoj Zizek's argument about the jews. But Noah just clipped that part out.

[@bluemethetys9267]

Yeah, and now we unfortunately find Destiny misundertanding Zižek's point. Zižek is NOT saying ceding any ground on "descriptive reality" means you lost the debate. In fact, he's said in the past that even if all that Nazis said about Jews were true, their ideology would still nonetheless have a pathological structure. His point in the clip is that arguing against the empirical claims of Nazis is not sufficient in combatting them. The necessary fight to have is beyond empirical claims and is more metaphysical (in layman terms, it would be about morals).

[@pellelindtner3488]

@@bluemethetys9267 That's also what he means by "fake leftists". he's talking about people who responded to the Iraq war by arguing Saddam was actually good, when they should argue that the invasion was wrong even though he was evil.

[@s-tierkeyboardwarrior-lvl4686]

@@bluemethetys9267 While I have no doubt this was Slavoj Zizek's argument was what you say, it appeared like he was saying "the real question isn't whether or not what the Nazis say is true, the real question is why they need the fantastical jew to support there politics." The quote is paraphrased, but here is a timestamp: 55:43 In this quote, or what he said in the video, it comes off as though he is saying "yes, that's true, but why does your argument need it to be true." which is a goofy question. I agree with what I assume his actual argument is. I think Destiny interpreted it similarly to me or in some other equally different way and that's why he thought it had nothing to do with the video.

[@NocturnalNick]

@@s-tierkeyboardwarrior-lvl4686 You've probably recently heard Destiny say, "People on the left feel the need to die on every hill". This is all Zizek is saying, that's what he means by 'putting yourself in an idiotic position by accepting the debate on your opponents terms'. i.e., we don't argue if 13/50 is true, we argue why the conclusions they justify with 13/50 are bad

[@s-tierkeyboardwarrior-lvl4686]

@@NocturnalNick yes

[@xenusprophet3001]

This guy's humor is every generic KZbin "uwu I'm depressed" vlogger but with a really low battery.

[@Dizastermaster.]

"Hey guys i'm so quirky and relatable now agree with me"

[@UnionJames]

I personally preferred the Noah/Vaush talk that happened later. It was so weird to go from this video to Vaush softly telling Noah that he isn't mad, just disappointed while Noah tries not to cry.

[@problemsolver3254]

truuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuue

[@cuac232]

It was pretty funny. Video Noah: Vaush is spreading nazi propaganda that's absolutely not true. Stream Vaush: It's not nazi propaganda and it's actually true Noah: Yeah sorry about that

[@tianamaycry]

This is the most accurate assessment of that conversation I've seen. Like a father scolding his son. lmaooooooo I feel like I understand what happened there so much better now.

[@musicplayah]

"good faith Gary" = strawman represented by an absurd avatar... lol. Maybe this is the new meta? Conservatives can invent a character called "good faith Susie". A fat, pimply, pink haired, woman with bottles of anti-depressive medication strapped to her body. Somtimes she randomly starts screeching for comedic effect, it's one of Susie's endearing quirks! 🙂

[@evaahh9584]

Remember freedomtoons? This is freedomtoons tier stuff.

[@BlooCollaGal]

I genuinely can't tell if this is satire or just unironically true...

[@GodsTodd]

SUSie

[@devilsadvocate6098]

@@evaahh9584 nah, freedomtoons is funny most of the time. At least he put some efforts into the vid

[@evaahh9584]

@@devilsadvocate6098 they were funny, when I agreed with them a few years ago. Now, looking back, it’s just like “ok, but the stats here is just wrong” or “wow, it”s just making fun of me for being trans”

[@iceyroo]

Noah went on Vaush’s stream, backtracked, and apologized IMMEDIATELY…

[@kishendooken1856]

Like a castrated white man 😉

[@shacka95]

@@kishendooken1856 circumcised*

[@seanjenkins5505]

It's pretty hilarious how condescending all these KZbinrs are in their hour long diatribes, but if you watch the conversation he had with Vaush he walks back almost everything and basically apologizes for making the video.

[@frealish6622]

These little weaklings can talk their talk on the hour long videos they make but when actually confronted they started grovelling

[@MMAGamblingTips]

“Destiny is a Mr. Girl‘s name.“ -Good Faith Gary

[@jeremias-serus]

Thank God Good Faith Gary was around to keep our content creators out of bad faith acting

[@Joe-fj6dj]

@@jeremias-serus god that bit was so cringe especially ironically enough good faith Gary was being bad faith lol

[@Me-kt3gh]

@@Joe-fj6dj I’m sure the guy’s fans thought it was genius. Have a fun little mascot to bring up good faith iron man versions of arguments in order to defeat the strongest versions of them, but he did it so sarcastically, bad faith, and lazily.

[@toecutter303]

You may not like it but he's not wrong 😏

[@MMAGamblingTips]

@@Joe-fj6dj soooooo cringe 😬 like I wanted to FF it but was afraid I’d miss something. So awful.

[@jloiben12]

When Destiny is pretty solidly siding with Vaush on a subject then you know the other side is in trouble

[@Solo24516]

Vaush is always hit or miss with his takes

[@finnmacmanus5723]

@@loganroofpedoexposer4952 okay Logan

[@Cashout95]

@Oswald Cobblepot nah

[@christopherloud3990]

As more of a Vaush fan I've always found that 'our' mutual antagonism is a product of proxying for Vaush and Destiny's separate Melodrama. I actually love them both but their beef is totally childish. At the end of the day 'our' communities typically share 99.9% of values, on average.

[@xenos_n.]

@@Solo24516 So is Destiny. Literally nobody isn't. Everyone has some cringe takes.

[@jedidiah5515]

destiny: what’s bi lighting? the lights behind destiny: 🏳️‍🌈

[@MustardSkaven]

I have my lighting change colour but it does not mean i support giving into mental delusions that don't decrease suicide rates.

[@RisenSlash]

@@MustardSkaven are you ok?

[@MustardSkaven]

@@RisenSlash I am great, thanks for asking. You?

[@risingdoom]

@@MustardSkaven Hello fellow rightoid

[@MustardSkaven]

@@risingdoom hi

[@goblinreal9164]

The Arguments against the Vaush/Noncompete debate are so genuinely heartbreaking I almost couldn't believe what I was hearing and needed to rewatch it twice to make sure he was really saying what he was saying. Jews have a deep history with banking in europe, it's not controversial, it's true, everyone knows it. Seeing someone get so upset about basic history, denying reality and then getting upset at vaush for even bringing it up is the kind of behavior that has ALWAYS emboldened the right, it makes them look like the good guys because they're willing to acknowledge the truth about basic facts and it makes the left look super sketchy when you could just argue against something instead of burying their heads in the sand. If you're too afraid to argue then it looks like you're hiding something when there's nothing to hide, it's just true and you can just argue the points and if you're well-informed and can argue at all, you'll always be in the right because you're defending the rights of the Jewish people to not be mass murdered which is fundamentally a reasonable position. Saying "It's a sensitive topic" and sidestepping something isn't an argument, because in reality people don't respect sensitivity to something just because you say it's sensitive, if they want to talk about it they're gonna say. "I don't care, I want to talk about this now.". If you just say turn them down without a good reason they'll just continue that conversation without you and because of how the internet works, it'll most likely be with people that already agree with them because they don't need you.

[@BlooCollaGal]

I forget which Pope but one of those dudes decided it was a sin to charge interest on loans or whatever so Christians NEEDED Jews to be in charge of the banks. (Clearly I've been educated lol, please correct any mistakes)

[@sathrielsatanson666]

That this the problem with Zizek's and Noah's argument. You can't deny reality because it is used by bad people to justify their bad perscriptions. You look as if you're trying to conceal the truth and only make your opposition look better.

[@chanr9531]

When you don’t understand history but try to argue. It’s infuriating because like you said, who cares if they held more banking positions, that doesn’t give you the right to mass murder them. But getting caught up on this “were they over represented in banks” question completely misses the underlying issue with the holocaust

[@RanEncounter]

@@BlooCollaGal There are a lot of muslims that actually believe that charging interest is a sin. You can look at Turkey and what is happening there because they are not willing to increase the interest rates to stabilise their economy.

[@BlooCollaGal]

@@RanEncounter I didn't know that, I thought it was just a Christian thing.

[@keepwhiningtankies3594]

It's not that Noah is wrong, it's that he's wrong and incredibly condescending

[@RogueMunkyNinja]

The smugness of this guy is what gets me. Video essays are good and can be useful to get a different perspective. Although If you're essay primarily consists of critiquing people and you refuse to engage or have a conversation with them, it just comes off as cowardly to me.

[@madv6715]

Exactly, his smarmy sort of condescention is just so tiring, combined with the tired tropes of the LED lights and the zoomer style editing. Its so uninspired and unoriginal.

[@aarondavis8943]

And there's your smudgeness.

[@isaiahthomas6744]

I seriously don’t get how PF and her supporters legitimately don’t see they’re giving justification for genocide

[@havefaith4382]

@Alex Haughton radical lefties are beyond cringe

[@Jay-qu2bc]

I feel like they do see that they’re justifying genocide. They just don’t care because the people they’d be cleansing are white.

[@RojirigoD]

You have to see all her videos, read her comments and all the times when she says she does not support genocide and believe her... and when she say susy things about violence on colonizers, or implies to remove the "colonizers" of sudaffrica then you have to only see the metaphoric non genocide approach that is not explained but can be extracted indirectly after you see all her videos, comments and others on "good faith"... easy...

[@phadedlife]

@@havefaith4382 using the word radical as a descriptor for political positioning is equally as cringe. Just believing in a different economic system makes someone "radical." That's a lot different than justifying genocide.

[@sadboipotato3382]

@@phadedlife OK. Insane lefties then.

[@Ryattt81]

I agree with Destiny. My biggest issue with this when I watched it the first time was that it made me root for Xanderhal, a person I find insufferable. Also, I hate the way that you can spot the youtube video cadence from a mile away, its just this vaguely humerous monotone mix of ATHF, Rick and Morty, and Chris Raygun. Where the humor is just saying something stuttery, or something like"you can shit all over the tippy top of my brain defender for saying this buuut..." it reminds me of TED talks, and how they all use the same speaking cadence.

[@mario167100]

That last part is the truest statement ever.

[@garywebb2432]

that 1st sentence is the biggest b*tch boii thing ever lmfaoo

[@Ryattt81]

@@garywebb2432 lol....yea, it was poorly worded. Im cool with you feeling however you feel about it.

[@garywebb2432]

@@Ryattt81 cool its a waste of time to dislike anybody on the internet attack their positions instead

[@Ryattt81]

@@garywebb2432 pointless, but if its how you felt its how you felt. I read your comment and thought "true" and laughed out loud. It got my point across, but it was some bitchboi wording

[@user-fz3sz2dj4r]

Wow, this guy really thinks he's contrapoints. Except he isn't, and it's cringe.

[@Savannah-]

Professor flowers very literally said that while she doesn't like genocide or the violent removal of an ethnic group, it should be up to the colonized people to decide what they'd like to do. She said it because she believes it, vaush didnt trick her. He plays the clip of her using rhetoric to obscure that position with emotion and clever language and then just goes "shes right, i dont have to explain" and moves on. That's the ENTIRE reason debates are important. Far right figures have a habit of using clever rhetoric to hide the true reality behind what they really mean and what real harm their ideas lead to. They disguise it so they can pull more people in before they show you the extreme side of their beliefs. Would he have any criticism when alt right people have their true beliefs exposed in debates? I fucking doubt it. What a clown.

[@lilstevechan8427]

What PF does is exactly what dipshits like Ralph, Metokur, Fuentes, Black Pigeon Speaks, Lauren Southern or E;R do. They hint at something extreme and then obfuscate it, leaving impressionable idiots to defend them because they didn't outright say the extreme thing.

[@Zealot007]

@@lilstevechan8427 so do all of these people like professor flowers identify as egalitarians or are they just representatives of their own ethnic interests? If that’s the case what’s the difference between their positions and the alt right’s? Other than being opposed to one another.

[@lilstevechan8427]

@@Zealot007 PF is a representative of her ethnic interest just because of her hatred of white people. It seems that she has absorbed all the leftist Twitter hot takes against white people and made it her ideology.

[@jloiben12]

PF: There is no amount of violence that colonized people can do to colonizers that can match what happened vice versa. Also PF: Here is a list of things that are physically possible to happen that the colonized would have to exceed in doing to colonizers in order for what the colonized do to colonizers to be worse. Noah: PF is right. Colonized people can’t possibly engage in worse violence to colonizers then what colonizers did to the colonized. 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️ Another example of Noah’s own evidence disproving his own point

[@sathrielsatanson666]

And there would be even SOME merit to argument if it pertain to people who did colonize and did all this horrible shit but as is it is taking sins of the father to thw extteme.

[@brokenman58]

Well yes they could because you are talking about HISTORY. If they started slaughtering people now they would slaughter FAR more than "colonizers" did and in the modern, enlightened age. Making them LITERALLY like the lowest carrion eating scavenger. It's always funny how what the "natives " did to their own with slavery and rape etc and it's all laid out as if they were ANGELS and evil only came with "colonizers"

[@erichooper2794]

@@brokenman58 the “noble savage” trope runs deep

[@coolcat1530]

@@brokenman58 No one is saying they were perfect angels. They are saying that there were already people here, and to genocide them because they had a different way of life is evil. Nice try though. The real savages are the those who murder millions and think it just.

[@brokenman58]

@@coolcat1530 millions? You honestly believe there were millions at the time? You seem to forget they had enemy tribes and slaughtered each other, wiping out some tribes completely. Then they took their land and women because of their fighting superiority. The white men did the same mostly minus making them slaves. Keep revising history pal

[@AkaiKnight]

44:04 that explanation does not work because you’re forgetting other races exist beyond just black and white people. A black separatist movement would necessarily exclude all races not just whites, and prioritize blacks over all other races. We never learn from our mistakes, we just keep justifying them because “it’s different this time”

[@SuperNeospace]

Good point

[@Shimansaji]

The Zizek quote is explicitly an argument against the point Noah is trying to make. Accept the case that “x group has hegemonic power in x institutions” and make the argument why it is not correct to deport them etc. on your own terms. Don’t adopt the opponents language.

[@trashygamer1368]

Bro that's I thought too lol. I was like replaying that part couple of times.

[@OLucasZanella]

Exactly. Not to mention if you constantly say "no it's not true" instead of going "so what?" it just makes it so much more powerful when someone learns that you were lying and it is indeed true. So they were lying about that... what else?

[@infinite1483]

He literally loaded, aimed, and shot himself with that one

[@josevonbuergenwader2]

Vaush was 100% right about Professor Flowers. She said multiple times that black majority countries have the right to do pretty much whatever they please to remove their “colonizers” from their country.

[@red2theelectricboogaloo961]

yeah, there's a reason she wouldn't define what she meant. as much as i hate vaush there we have a rare vaush W.

[@Woodsy2575]

Noah’s rhetorical tactic of trying to tie someone and therefore their opinion to a descriptive word like “debate bro”, “white”, “nazi”, “colonizer” etc is the problem with leftist essay content. As long as you add those descriptors you can just paint someone else as evil without having to engage with what they’re actually saying or face any kind of pushback.

[@ExeErdna]

Truth, the moment you don't agree especially on youtube comment they quick you call you one of the above. It's like they cannot present an argument where nobody is "evil" in someway so they can paint themselves as the "hero". It's why people laugh at their ass.

[@fungdark8270]

Good way to derail your own argument by throwing in a bunch of extraneous, highly charged jargon for opponent to stumble over. You just go back and try to address talking points after you trigger your opponent by basically equating them to brown shirts

[@Terszel]

Constant poisoning of the well

[@throwawayaccount4398]

Doesn't Vaush do it constantly as well?

[@aarondavis8943]

In any case, what are video essays but debates in slow motion? This entire enterprise of the debate about debating is more of a masterbate.

[@ConsciousnessInc]

Destiny just straight up wrong when he said if you use "minority" or "majority" it refers to structures of power and not demographics. Women aren't referred to as a minority. When they are mentioned as a protected group etc. it is always "Women and minorities" because no one thinks women ARE a minority.

[@ConsciousnessInc]

Another case and point would be the Rwandan genocide where minority (demographically! but powerful politically!) Tutsi were massacred by majority Hutu. No one referred to the Tutsi as a majority despite their monopolisation of the power structure.

[@humpyloaddart]

I love that lefties are allowed to assume and imply what conservatives mean and believe ad nauseum and in perpetuity. As soon as lefties apply that to each other, then there's a huge issue. This is the crux of the paradox and double standard that people hope to highlight on the modern left. Rules for thee, but not for me. Point the finger at right wingers and cry if we apply a 1/00th of that criticism to ourselves. It seems like that's why the vast majority of online discourse is just memes and buzzwords. They've managed to foster a community of people that are terrified of criticism.

[@lilstevechan8427]

It's true. The leftist space people like Noah, Professor Flowers, Noncompete etc want is one where hard questions are never answered, people get banned for bringing up facts and hypocrisy is fine as long as it paints the left as good and the right as bad. My best guess is that these people know that debate would tear apart their worldviews and they want to protect the echochamber. It's why they fall apart so thoroughly when arguing against Destiny and Vaush and have to run from the discussion to save face. The online left needs a reformation to be more optics-driven and less acting ironically detached while you call everyone a fascist.

[@chickensalad7199]

@@lilstevechan8427 This!

[@Runescape12345]

You'd wonder if they'd even be willing to admit the first antifa ever were themselves socially conservative and to a far greater level than any soccon today could hope to achieve. Then going by their definition of progressivism and historical moralism, every culture creator and civilization builder was hard conservative because they were massively xenophobic, racist, bigoted, etc. It always seems to burn their bristles to even imply that conservatism has done anything good.

[@matthewpeverill5688]

I think my biggest issue with this entire video is Noah introduced this Good Faith Gary character as a way to guarantee his video will remain within the realm of good faith, even if the reframing is used as in the frame of comedic self awareness and then immediately portrays Good Faith Gary as an untrustworthy actor by trying to have Gary reframe arguments in such a bad faith way that Noah just refutes it or shrugs it off like it was a joke. The entire point of Good Faith Gary is to just reinforce how bad faith Noah thinks his subject is.

[@adamdrake7182]

Found the destiny fan

[@totom.8095]

@@adamdrake7182 whoops did you think you were commenting on noah's channel? holy shit you found a destiny fan in destiny's comment section. nuts.

[@dylansevitt]

@@totom.8095 🤣😂

[@KumaNicol]

I like how this dude makes his own little dumb character for when he is bad faith, but it doesn’t show up during the entire “Racial Arbiter” point? Sure dude, only the goodest of faith arguments there.

[@emeryboehnke4259]

Hahaha you're right, it's a clever cover for him to be like "omg that part was SO bad faith!!" with an obvious one, but hide his more subtle ones under the guise of "this character recognizes ALL bad faith."

[@abednegokurio9244]

It blew my mind when I found out the essayist dude’s only 22. I guess it’s good to have younger people be more politically involved but a lot of the times they are still incredibly impressionable and I wish they would temper themselves a bit before being so self assured. But I guess that’s a bit paradoxical, maybe it’s just something you grow out of.

[@dakneegrow.]

all those young impressionable fox news viewers. oh wait, old people are still just as impressionable lol

[@abednegokurio9244]

@@dakneegrow. yeah but they ain’t making video essays

[@PuddingXXL]

I believe it to be a natural state of mind that you grow out of eventually. Happened to me and virtually everyone I know. That's why I will condone this behaviour while being able to emphasize with it. So yeah like you said it's a self fixing problem.

[@legin777]

I think once you have children your mentality changes a bit. Instead of seeking change, you start seeking stability? Maybe?

[@PuddingXXL]

@@legin777 I think that just comes with age. I don't have kids but still settled down a lot more with my personal ideals.

[@michaelsalmon6217]

PF talking about how nothing the colonized people could do would be worse than what the colonizers did legit sounded like some attack on titan shit. Actually crazy to see fantasy hypotheticals about how cycles of violence proliferate prove themselves true.

[@karsakasdasfa6474]

What could Native Americans do that is worse than what was done to them by the settlers?

[@orgate3953]

@@karsakasdasfa6474 The same thing but more?

[@red2theelectricboogaloo961]

@@karsakasdasfa6474 i mean on it's face you gotta admit, asking that is a little sussy, saying what PF said was a little sussy, even if it's technically true, i mean... it'd be hard for black people to fuck up and do some bullshit to white people that's more than what happened to them, but then why bring that up???? why say that? it sounds like you're trying to cook up a reason why we [or they cuz im a white dude] should do it. whole thing has "i wanna kill somebody or deport somebody" written all over it.

[@jloiben12]

I find it very disappointing that Noah would deny us our history by saying the Jews didn’t have disproportionate control of banks in Germany at the time. Noah created an incredibly fact and accuracy deficient video so I am not surprised by this but it is really embarrassing when you deny easily demonstrable facts that show a minority group succeeding. It makes Noah’s discussion about this video with Vaush make a lot more sense since Noah basically walked back this entire video in that discussion

[@extremedrumming3393]

I don't know about the banks thing (just haven't googled it yet), but this type of problem seems to happen a lot especially with left people. They deny some facts because it COULD lead to a conclusion that is right wing.

[@kingryan69]

@@extremedrumming3393 Jews were a tiny minority so any control of any banks would have been disproportionate, its extremelly misleading and I have doubts that Jared is speaking in good faith here.

[@extremedrumming3393]

@@kingryan69 that's fair.

[@bobjenkins4925]

I'm certain that these people's brains would malfunction if you said this to them irl. It's all memorization and word association with them. Saying something they've probably never heard before, when they have an audience on them, would result in some prime brain breakage.

[@scarletsletter4466]

Yes, he should've acknowledged the disproportionate control of banking and explained that it arose as a result of antisemitism throughout history, because Jews were kept out of many fields but were allowed to handle money and make loans, because the controlling majority deemed those activities undesirable.

[@simonwinn8757]

Listening to Noah word salad rumble is mind numbing and when he gets to a point, I'm like "Really that's it". When he defended Professor Flowers, he fell back on it's not my place to make arguments, so believe me and I don't have to educate you, this is reeking in intellectual dishonesty and cult like belief.

[@ILovinGunz]

Never in my life have I ever heard someone call women a minority.

[@-MacCloud-]

I'm pretty sure that Jewish banking families had a lot of economic control over Europe in general. I asked my grandfather about it before he died and he agreed it was true, he was a Jewish man from Germany btw, his father fled Germany when he was a baby and joined the British military to fight. The way I always saw it is that yes, the justification claimed was factually true, they did have a lot of economic control over Germany, but its never going to be a true justification for what they did. Most German Jews were not bankers or accountants or any of that shit, they were just normal working class citizens trying to get by. So to blame ALL Jewish people for the actions of a tiny portion of the population who are indeed immersed in the banking family businesses is idiotic and unfair based on any ethical standard as well as their own claimed standards. Also, a group having economic power doesn't give you the right to murder them and their entire race. But socialists sometimes don't agree with that latter argument so I see why they are trying so hard to weasel out of the entire discussion, they agree with some of the justifications a don't want to end up looking bad.

[@Sonyboj]

I love how they forget about the Mongol empire...they where totally white, right? "Who colonized the world" god I hope people do not take their points from this guy

[@michaelallen3304]

They don’t. Some Americans think slavery didn’t exist before America was discovered.

[@mertguner8684]

You are already lost because you are trying to formulate the world in their terms.

[@red2theelectricboogaloo961]

hmmm ottomans hmmmmmmm mughals hmmmmmmmmmmmmm hmm THE ABBASIDS..... hmmmm... hmm... yeah didnt happen

[@red2theelectricboogaloo961]

hmm like every dynasty that ever existed in medieval china hmmmm

[@murderparker7968]

“White men will be fine no matter who’s in power.” Come on Destiny, you know that’s not necessarily true. Lumping “white men” together in this way fails to acknowledge that the “white man’s” experience is vastly different depending on a variety of factors; white men in the hills of West Virginia and those in Silicon Valley definitely have different concerns and depending on who’s in power, will be served better or worse. Pretty sure I’ve even heard him make a similar point before.

[@karsakasdasfa6474]

@@tomwensrich9602 so what? Governments of Belarus and Russia aren't almost completely white men only?

[@krotchlickmeugh627]

@@karsakasdasfa6474 so? Why are you saying irrelevant ass shit?

[@lightfeather9953]

The latter point doesn't contradict the former. You're missing the context and taking "be fine" in a really specific definition that was clearly not the way destiny meant it. It's relative.

[@vanakneon621]

this dude's cadence is putting me to sleep almost as much as his arguements

[@vidzorko4492]

I hope youre talking about destiny, because he is a n-word lover XD (Please dont delete this comment, if you delete this comment you are a scaredy-cat)

[@Jacob-nz8ok]

I don't see the comparison. He just didn't have any arguments, just lies.

[@adamdrake7182]

Wow found the destiny fan lmaoooo

[@cosettapessa6417]

@@see_sealy looool

[@chaunceyloveshack9530]

@@see_sealy dude is lost

[@reikowallach2465]

Yeah I don't think I've heard women being called minorities either. I think you and Vaush are both off on that one. I've heard of "women AND minorities" in a sentence and "minority interests" but I think the chatter that said that "marginalized" or "disenfranchized" is right about those being better words.

[@pellelindtner3488]

I have seen it used in some cases, but i think it confuses things more than it needs to.

[@badicusvibesimus182]

Holy shit I popped over to Hasan's youtube channel and the random commenter was right. They literally do 20 jump cuts during a single thought. Not sure if that's to make Hasan look smarter or so his baby brained audience doesn't lose patience and click away.

[@amusicalindividual1772]

This is why despite my MANY disagreements with the Vaush/Xanderhal crowd, I still have a certain level of respect for them and watch their content, because they still have enough integrity to admit when their side is cringe, even if they won't disavow parts of their ideology as much as they probably should. People like Noah Samsen and NonCompete are intellectually equivalent to Jesse Lee Peterson or the Hake report, just completely detached from reality to the point where even their own bases probably quietly mock them.

[@skulley6361]

Why should they disavow their ideology because it seems too radical or contrary relative to the ones you are living by? Or is your ideology having none and be a neutral rational human being who presicly weights in pro and con because this is an ideology especially one that upholds existing power structures that strikes me as highly questionable and worthy of ideology critique.

[@justingutierrez233]

@@skulley6361 pure ideology is typically bad. You need to have self awareness or a level of introspection. Some of these creators absolutely do not. It's just dogma and echo Chambers reinforcing that dogma back

[@skulley6361]

@@justingutierrez233 ideology is everywhere and we are all influenced by that....critical reflection is therefore important

[@red2theelectricboogaloo961]

@@skulley6361 but that's the point he was making at you, echo chambers will make you stupid.

[@degeneresqueen6084]

The idea in the clips shown that professor flowers and non compete were in the right and vaush was wrong, is INSANE. It has to be genuine stupidity (i know he hates that criticism but it can apply regardless), or intentional dishonesty. He's the type of guy to walk away from the serfs & lauren debate with that guy apparently an expert on indigenous issues, thinking that serfs and him got a w and lauren was just being a debate bro. Even if there are things lauren and counterpoints might have been wrong on (i haven't seen it), you have to be lost to think in any of these debates did noncompete, pf, or serfs took the actual W lol.

[@adamdrake7182]

Found the destiny fan

[@saampam894]

@@adamdrake7182 a destiny fan commenting on a destiny video, how shocking

[@youisstupid2586]

Noah samsen is dollar store lonerbox. Lonerbox is the only guy that does this type of content without sounding annoying or jarring.

[@thalesanastacio760]

Also lonerbox monotone is funny, instead of boring, like noah's monotone

[@youisstupid2586]

@@thalesanastacio760 yup, right up there with hbomerguy.

[@clivedoe9674]

Center right here. Literally the only reason I occasionally watch this channel is that he's willing to engage in conversation with people he disagrees with.

[@BlooCollaGal]

I came here for the yelling and bloodsports and over the past couple years it has started to influence my beliefs. I'm a lot more moderate now

[@clivedoe9674]

@@BlooCollaGal I've put my core beliefs through the grinder for 3 decades online so I probably won't be seeing them shift much more but watching leftists eat each other using bad-faith tactics is still hours of entertainment.

[@Yuh_mama]

I’m on the right and watch Destiny. I disagree with him but I respect him for conversing rationally even if I don’t agree. I’ll occasionally watch a Vaush or Hasan video on topics I care about, but can’t watch more than 10/20 mins because it ends up being Hasan yelling “hurrrr durrrr dis dewd is so dumb dewd” or Vaush being dishonest and hyperbolic in every single way possible.

[@michaelchiasson2927]

Im more right leaning. I'm actually glad I started watching Destiny, its help challenge my views. Hasnt changed them at all much but its good to see honest arguments against them. Im more surprised I found somthing I agree with Vaush on for once. Genocide is bad lol

[@s-tierkeyboardwarrior-lvl4686]

I'm still trying to figure out wtf I am or whether or not it's productive to position myself on any axis. I'm 19 for reference

[@thenayancat8802]

BadEmpanada is hilarious; he does insanely good, balanced (surprisingly) and well-researched video essays, but he's also absolutely unhinged and abusive. Inside you there are two wolves; inside him there are two wolves with rabies

[@burmy1774]

Dude thinks Argentina is a good place to live, of course he's unhinged and abusive. lol

[@BlooCollaGal]

Not all socialists are Nazis BUT All Nazis will pretend to be socialists until they can seize power. There is NO DIFFERENCE between a antisemitic socialist and a Nazi

[@badsocks756]

@@GayTier1Operator Lol the Soviet Union literally exported European style antisemitism to the Middle East. Also the Khmer Rouge murdered fucking everyone including a lot of Buddhists for example.

[@Pundargandalf]

@@GayTier1Operator The Soviet Union's persecution of christians comes to mind. Might be a bit of a stretch to call it "targeted mass murder" though.

[@haxorsleuth9450]

@@badsocks756 All of the western world was anti semitic us had one too which only died out due to ww2

[@superexplosive]

There’s no way the Right will be persuaded by edgy humor and debate memery. Surely softboy essayists with their peer-reviewed sources will pull them to our side!

[@menkaragamble8175]

Who said they care about persuading? They are comfortable staying in their echo chambers raking in cash from their sycophants.

[@Condeycon]

There are zero peer reviewed sources here despite maybe the Zizek quote if properly cited. Even then, that quote supports Vaush’s point vis a vis the jews and Noah doesn’t even realize it.

[@superexplosive]

@@Condeycon damn- I couldn’t sit through Noah’s whole video but I figured he might pull out *something* of value to make his point. Guess I set the bar too high..

[@jakemitchell9853]

Bro, I showed a Noah-video to three roughnecks and three linemen and now I have a half-dozen-deep squad of emotional supersoldiers and we WILL install RGB lighting in EVERYBODY'S bedrooms!

[@MustardSkaven]

@@menkaragamble8175 same thing can be said of leftists. The usa is so polarised, both sides are stuck in an echo chamber. Greetings from Europe.

[@Hollow-ty3qm]

52:45 vaush's whole point is that just cause a certain group (in this case the jews) has more power (in this case through the banks) isn't a reason to justify discrimination/oppression of a group of people (in this case the holocaust). I don't know if vaush is even right about jews owning the banks back bevor Hitler (edit:or if this even means they had a lot of power) but his argument makes sense. Even destiny missed vaush's point. Edit:nevermind destiny didn't miss his point 1:00:25 it's cause they can't argue within the hypothetical, and are either too stupid to even realize it or too arrogant to admit it

[@coal_91]

I'm sorry Destiny but "minority" is always related to numbers.

[@havefaith4382]

thats what im saying bruh

[@MustardSkaven]

Whites are the real minority.

[@axson8]

I would like to thank destiny and his little bursts of screams throughout this video, I was nodding off constantly listening to this guy; he is actually verbal melatonin.

[@perpetual_suffering1458]

"Verbal melatonin" LMAO

[@ThePainkiller9995]

18:25 the more you say "framework" and "systemic", the more right you are

[@profoundresolve]

Don't forget "Overton window". I'm throwing up.

[@e.d.5766]

This video does a great job of showing how debates can be bad whilst also being a demonstration of how video essays can be bad. Which is a great example of how nothing he criticised the debate space for is different in the video essay space. Debates necessarily require two conflicting sides, which is a difference, but video essayists can criticise other people's content (like he does in the video), and in that case the only difference is that one side doesn't get to defend themselves. In a debate, instead of a bad faith character mocking people who want good faith conversations, it would be someone who actually disagrees with you and actually holds you accountable for being disingenuous or dishonest, even when you aren't aware of it. And a good video essay should at least try to address conflicting viewpoints, so the only video essays where unfairly framing the opposing argument isn't just as incentivised as it is in debates are bad video essays. A lot of his criticisms of debates are genuinely bad things that actually happen (even if most of his examples were pretty bad) the problem is that they aren't criticising debates, they're criticising all political and in this case metapolitical discussion.

[@ant7891]

And his talk with Vaush is a great example of the value of debates. The dude works on a video for two months yet fails terribly to defend his claims when he faces actual opposition. You can say dumb shit and come off looking pretty good in a video essay but that's far harder in a debate.

[@ZennZennster]

*Leftist Unity - Jreg plays in the background*

[@alfredoarellano6606]

One day these cowards will talk to Destiny

[@gendolookin]

A game where you literally break rocks into smaller rocks....

[@BlooCollaGal]

Lol Prisoner Simulator 1899

[@CakesWarden]

Don’t forget cutting down trees 😆

[@xenos_n.]

I'm here for Edgy Debate Bros vs. Spineless Video Essayists

[@SuperSecretAgentNein]

I don’t think Xan is racist, but I do think it’s rich that Xan was attacking Signifier for being a “dumbfuck”. I don’t always agree with him on everything, but he is a much smarter guy than Xan, in no small part because he realizes that he might be bad at internet bloodsports, and maybe shouldn’t try it. Xanderhal could learn something from this, as he is A VERY BAD DEBATE BRO. Like, not a bad person? But bad at what he does.

[@Seiga005]

I agree. FD Signifiers overall complaints about debate bros were hyperbolic and wrong. But some of what he said does apply to people trying to be debate bros and failing lmao

[@Condeycon]

Ya, I can agree with this. Xan comes off as a kid who got dazzled by Vaush and Destiny and said “I can do that too!” and rushed off doing a bad imitation. Even down to copying their more hyperbolic mannerisms.

[@ExeErdna]

FD is very hit and miss yet he isn't a dumbfuck that's too low tier of thinking to present I called him a dumbass on some topics he did yet I also realized he had his own biases and I have my own. It's legit childish to be tossing around such things without some sort of definitive backing. The only one I can legit call dumb without a doubt is Hasan because he doesn't need to be smart to win

[@chickensofdeath490]

wow a guy with funny wacky editing while talking like hes bored as shit in the most monotone voice ever and everything he says is "just a joke bro"? He must be so funny and fresh and make great informative videos.

[@storminmormn6283]

The bisexual lighting comment was actually hilarious. Noah’s comedy isn’t funny at all to me. Him being a young 20yr old makes a lot of sense when put into context.

[@gnomebody2371]

So basically these people are losing debates, and they don’t want debates happening anymore.

[@TrentonF505]

Yup it’s like when we were kids and instead of losing the game against a friend you would just turn off the game console

[@red2theelectricboogaloo961]

@@TrentonF505 yeah. but thats the issue cuz this shit is in real life now, there is no turning it off you have to keep going and find a new strategy or cope and seethe and fall off, but ppl like noah for some reason dont know that

[@degeneresqueen6084]

This guy said he's doing a video just for destiny. I'm sure it will be even worse then this one, lol

[@matt_9112]

Tempted to subscribe to him, just so I can get it right in my feeeed.

[@ksilva2848]

Absolutely, even more after the recent drama, we will see the "most charitable reading of Destiny" just like we saw in this video with good faith Gary (fml) being silent while this guy paints anyone who disagrees with black people as racist.

[@melvinklark4088]

@@matt_9112 subscribe then unsubscribe if you feel like it

[@garywebb2432]

@@ksilva2848 nice name drop of ne

[@matt_9112]

@@melvinklark4088 nah, not doing a single click to even support this dude only temporarily. Gonna be up here soon after anyways.

[@alexkremer4842]

destiny: want to catch populists viewers: august: just say and write "leftists" everywhere and they will come

[@frorencenightingale1217]

Worked on you, bud... August must be doing something right 😀

[@egusisoup1826]

Slowly unpacking the August lore is truly the most fascinating part of this channel

[@shiitalkiemushrooms4487]

The editor hounding down the clips destiny references is legit god tier

[@casko9626]

Creating a Good faith character that you control yourself is like starting a bad faith sentence with im gonna be incredible good faith. it has zero value

[@haydn1708]

1:29:35 scoffs at the insinuation that lefties engage in preferential treatment to POC / minority online figures 1:36:32 implores audience to engage in preferential treatment to POC / minority online figures *Brain damage intensifies*

[@matt_9112]

Know what? If some debate bro had challenged Hitler with the "extreme hypothetical" of a possible outcome early, at least nobody in or out of Germany could've said "we didn't know" at the very least.

[@aidancollins1591]

Hitler literally wrote a book while in prison for a failed coup where he laid out in explicit detail what he wanted to do to eastern europeans and Jews. Any German who knew about the contents of Mein Kampf could reason through what was going to happen.

[@matt_9112]

@@aidancollins1591 oh I totally agree and don't let that count as "excuse" for people who say it wasn't visible. But it is a fact of history that even in Nuremberg people got away with it/tried it as a defence and international politics like appeasement or Évian show that people either "didn't think about the worst case" or didn't care. Most contemporary criticism of Hitler/Mein Kampf was focussed on economical/ "goubernatorial" issues and the danger of war in general and did not adress the two main points of the holocaust or the particular brutality of the war in the east (which were also visible, but either not adressed or not thought throu emough, which is my point).

[@jloiben12]

Noah. PFs content prior to, and since, the Vaush conversation is consistent with Vaush’s view that she is a racist ethnostater. Rejecting a classification or category is irrelevant when that classification/category naturally follows from the positions PF holds and the arguments PF makes. For example, I can say I am not a self-hating Jew. I can reject that categorization. But if all I do is make arguments and hold positions of a self-hating Jew, that makes me a self-hating Jew

[@Brokenfirealarm]

Time to gain an opinion of someone I've never heard of before based on one video again.

[@BlooCollaGal]

YOU HAVE BEEN JUDGED AND FOUND WANTING! OFF TO THE BLOOD PITS! NEXT!

[@matthewedwards8576]

El Tratado de Versalles fue un tratado de paz que se firmó en dicha ciudad al final de la Primera Guerra Mundial por más de cincuenta países.[1]​ Este tratado puso fin a lo que sería "la última guerra", trató de limitar futuras aventuras militares por parte de Alemania. Terminó oficialmente con el estado de guerra entre la Alemania del segundo Reich y los Aliados de la Primera Guerra Mundial. Fue firmado el 28 de junio de 1919 en la Galería de los Espejos del Palacio de Versalles, exactamente cinco años después del atentado de Sarajevo en el que fue asesinado el archiduque Francisco Fernando, (en alemán: Franz Ferdinand) la principal causa de la Primera Guerra Mundial. A pesar de que el armisticio fue firmado meses antes (11 de noviembre de 1918) para poner fin a las hostilidades en el campo de batalla, se necesitaron seis meses de negociaciones en la Conferencia de Paz de París para concluir el tratado de paz. El Tratado de Versalles entró en vigor el 10 de enero de 1920.

[@donniejefferson9554]

"You shouldn't argue about white supremacy or white genocide ever." "If we talk about this, the black separatists might feel bad. We can't have that." The longer I live on this planet, the more the white genocide people seem like they have a point. Not much of one at the moment but still

[@jafethwattimena9258]

August i feel bad for you, this video must have been hell to edit and you had to watch rust aswell.

[@tylercsm4690]

August has hardened skin after the hours of league he has watched.

[@donanderson3653]

Why would you make a youtube video out of this? Destiny spoke for like 5 minutes in a 90 minute video, and the video he's watching was bad.

[@Flipflopflopper]

He said all colonisers were Europeans but does he not know of Japan, china, etc. they also say america is the only colonial power still around but that’s with their new definition, china are Russia are still the far worse old version. The guy seems to know little

[@nonstickpansexual4540]

Video essays have become so pretentious. You have that weird voice they put on, the poorly written scripts that are almost always packed with inaccuracies and cringe humor, and the creator pretending to be smart and insightful.

[@mertguner8684]

Its just a "intellectual" masturbation session with people who already think the same as you.

[@Agiranto]

Now that some transformative content we love Destiny The Reactman for.

[@folklorefanatic7193]

Thank you for being objective when watching this. The most powerful arguments in reactions are those where you have to agree with people you dislike.

[@pjhaze]

I know people irl not just online who were conservative but watched Destiny in 2016. I don’t really like him anymore but I understand his value. The guy making the video got so much hate for recommending Vaush and Destiny in his first big video he’s had to backtrack ever since. He’s on Twitter too much, just like Destiny.

[@theangrycheeto]

May I ask why you don't love destiny? I have my own issues with his content but I was just curious.

[@PitterPatter20]

When Noah (a supporter of Professor Flowers) directly associated Professor Flowers with the Scottish guy who endorsed the ethnic cleansing of Kenya he inadvertently vindicated everything Vaush said about PF's worldview on this topic.

[@rylee9086]

I can never get over how good the editing has been. I love inserted video for context

[@Neverwas_one]

Is it a problem if I agree with every supposed gotcha statement that he shows from Vaush or Xan? He just highlighted them spitting facts, which I found refreshing as I normally dont like Vaush or Xan. His video actually improved my opinion of them.

[@Tyler.8046]

The argument "No amount of violence today to colonizers can compare to the violence experienced by those colonized in the past" feels extremely non-sequitur. You could literally make the same argument about anything, "I can murder any number of people today that I want because it could never compare to the holocaust" like yes, that statement is probably true but the latter doesn't justify the former. Yes, colonization involved many heinous acts of violence; yes, it was largely perpetrated by white Europeans; no, acts of violence in the past do not and can not justify acts of violence in the present or future. We do not perform "eye for an eye" justice in America, or in most "civilized" countries; largely because its a poor system of justice, especially when perpetrated on individuals disjointed from the original perpetration of the crime. Not to mention, grouping everyone who looks a certain way into a group referred to as "colonizers" feels very... discriminatory, and like we're stepping backwards in progress.

[@Seiga005]

FD Signifier did say he made a bunch of mistakes in his break bread video in a conversation with Sharkzero. I just wish we didn’t have to go to shark’s channel to see it. He should post it on his channel as well.

[@CakesWarden]

I’m totally mind reading here but it seems like they care more about the video monetization instead of being correct. I think it’s why Noah won’t take down this video despite walking back nearly EVERYTHING in his debate with Vaush.

[@red2theelectricboogaloo961]

@@CakesWarden wasnt even really a debate vaush just got him on and showed him the things and then he just went like "oh yeah i shouldn't have said that" for like 1 and a half hours man

[@paulyshore1942]

I deeply disagree that conservatives are using tokenism. I believe conservatives at this point are largely accepting of race and BASIC gay rights. I think they have drawn the line at trying to normalize trans stuff. I think it’s because they know that kids are impressionable (they’ve done it with Christianity for however long).

[@benjoleo]

Is this just me and my biases or did that guy lose multiple arguments against a fictional character of his own creation

[@PicassoSensei]

I’m late to this situation but I can tell you, it’s not just you. I said the same thing

[@kingz7151]

I watched this video when it dropped as I'm subbed to Noah, and I just felt like it's rehashing points that are years old that will never conclude, this debate vs nodebate argument is just something that's going to plague the left and progressive thought forever now, as someone who honestly likes watching debate content, I find this loop frustrating.

[@bulletsandbracelets4140]

I'm not a regular on these vids but I'm really glad I watched your take on this, thanks for posting it. Your explanation of the difference between white nationalism and black separatism, in one sentence, did more for my understanding of it than any other video so far. Appreciate it!

[@skillbopster]

Destiny clearly knows nothing about South African power structures.

[@BarleyBReal]

I'm so tired of this. Humanity, regardless of skintone has been barbaric. History is written by the Victor and all the people complaining about how their people lost are just sore losers. Move on, we're in a new Era, and you're living in the past.

[@hypnotoad311]

If this dude unironically said that I had a great channel, I'd be like, ".......F***!”

[@Alex-qn9og]

27:23 paraphrase "A considerable problem with the debate bro sphere on the left is that they still hold reactionary tendencies" Can someone tell me if he ever gave examples of this? Or is the rest of this video one big vaguepost?

[@chronographer]

'We should use violence to create racially segregated spaces, spaces where one race has more power.' + 'No amount of violence our race does will ever compare to the violence our race has suffered.' = ... not justification ...? Said by people who is totally _not_ a [race] supremacist?

[@savokgrim4131]

52:40 Ok. Based purely on the clip of his video, Noncompete is claiming that historically, if and when enslaved people rose up and liberated themselves then it was "probably" justified. Vaush is using the example of the Nazis, and how they felt they needed to rise up against the perceived Jewish threat. Noncompete even mistakens Vaush's point and asserts that the people who rose against the nazis were justified, and Vaush reiterates the hypothetical. Except it wasn't a hypothetical. Vaush was comparing Nonconpete's justification for violence to how the nazi's rationalized theirs. Then, the argument becomes about whether the nazi's were justified in their rationalization, which used the Jewish people as a rallying point for their movement. The thing is, it is irrelevant as to the reasons the nazis used when galvanizing and as to their merits (which there were none), the point is they believed themselves to be a marginalized group, convinced their society of this point, and proceeded to commit horrific crimes. What Noncompete should have done is argue that: 1) As a political group, the nazis were a minority. 2) By virtue of being a political entity they managed to climb out of being a minority their society. So much so that they managed to edge out other political parties. 3) The Jewish people were not a political entity, they were an ethnicity. And unlike political parties with racist ideologies, an enthnicity can't become a majority overnight if they are a minority in the nation to begin with. The nazi's racist ideolgy was born out of lack of national identity and a general link to German-ness, as they nation was still a baby at this point. Case and point, Hitler was an Austrian that identified with the Germans. This guy is flat out misrepresenting Vaush here. Also, say what you want about the debate community, but at least they are willing to defend their ideas. You know, instead of reframing of their arguments.

[@croppedcrit8812]

Good Faith Gary was lacking the whole time. LOL

[@subroy7123]

Zizek's point actually supports Vaush. Vaush's point was that the moral question has nothing to do with the reality of Jewish representation in Weimar banking. Even if they are overrepresented, that does not impact the fact that the Holocaust was immoral at all. This is why Zizek says the "real question" is not anystatistics about Jewish overrepresentation in banking, but why the Nazis needed it to be true. What dark things did they want to justify with that statistic? That's what Vaush wanted NonCompete to understand. NonCompete actually believes that if the statistic is true (if it's not "false consciousness" as he put it), then the Nazis would be justified to do what they did. Which is why NC has to lie about the statistic and say "Jews were not overrepresented in Weimar banks", thus putting himself in a "totally idiotic position" as Zizek.

[@TrollingComedy]

Debate Bros and Video Essayists are pretty much two sides of the same coin. They lay out an argument, premises, and conclusion just like debate bros (try to) do in their arguments with each other. They have their differences but overall are people who are tackling an argument but just go about it differently.