The Sega Saturn & Sega's Fall from Grace | VideoGameDocs

Today on Video Game Docs, we explore the intricacies of the Sega Saturn. How internal struggles killed the console before it released, and how the Saturn ended up being Sega's worst defeat.
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[@BubblegumCrash332]

It still baffles me that Sega never gave us 32bit versions of Streets of Rage, Golden Axe, Sonic etc etc.

[@VideoGameDocs]

To be honest that's probably part of the reason why the Saturn failed. If they had delivered on properties that most people knew about it probably would've done a bit better in America.

[@ericp631]

It's not hard to understand. Sega was a non entity in Japan until virtua fighter and the Saturn, all those "classic" Sega franchises you mentioned, they never heard of or had any caring for(even up to modern day no sonic game has cracked over 100,000, let alone a million, in Japan). There was a story from stollar trying to get sor4 for the Dreamcast and none of the execs in Japan knew what streets of rage even was. But you are right that they should have known what was popular in other regions, and cater to it. Take Nintendo, metroid isn't popular in Japan, only America, and yet most consoles see a game because of it

[@STAXONDECK1]

@@ericp631 sounds about right except recently Sonic Frontiers did really good in Japan, best selling Sonic game

[@InsomniumX]

A huevo a HUEEEEVO a huevo a huevito a huevote huevote dije es un BACILON de cristal también se me hizo tarde y no me han dicho nada de la comida y agua de la comida y agua de la comida y agua de la comida y agua de la comida y agua de la comida y agua de la comida y agua de mamey pinches valedores

[@IFinishedAVideoGame]

This was an extremely good watch so I'm kinda baffled the channel doesn't have more subscribers. Thanks for the information!

[@VideoGameDocs]

I’m glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for watching and appreciate the kind words!

[@joesaiditstrue]

7:49 Sega should've fired whoever it was that told them they should be worried about the damn Jaguar

[@roberto1519]

Truly, this comment made me laugh hard!

[@Teknoman]

@@roberto1519 I still find it hard to believe that they were really worried about the Jag of all things, but I guess maybe they assumed Atari was still a big name in gaming and trying to make a come back full force? In hindsight its really baffling though lol

[@roberto1519]

​@@Teknoman Yes, looking back, it's strange they even considered the Jaguar to be a strong contender, but if we take into account that SEGA themselves emerged from the ground up with their first true 16-bit system in 1988 through 1992-1993, they weren't wrong to think that any competitor could indeed be the next big thing. Specially since the 90's didn't have a standard and the industry changed so quickly, wow, the jump from the 16 to the 32-bit era is the biggest in my opinion. Let's also consider that gamers are impressionable, we were kids who loved technology, even the 3DO in its early months promised something special, I remember the magazines showing it off quite a lot. All in all, SEGA didn't actually grasp what Sony did, which was to secure third parties and sequels to their console and actually delivering more in-depth content to gamers at home. I mean, Gran Turismo, whether people like it or not is the best selling game on the PS1 for a reason, while Manx TT, Sega Rally and Daytona USA has barely any content in comparison. The Saturn is my favorite console, but I think I played the PS1 even more or just as much due to many sequels and exclusives it got from 1998 through 2002.

[@spencerstevens2175]

Jaguar was doing what made Sega successful in the first place. It just didn't work out for them. Of course they were worried

[@Adamtendo_player_1]

That would be Hayu Nakayama who this point was paranoid of everything and anything at this point and he should’ve been fired a long time ago.

[@ogemaweyaus4105]

I was the only kid in my town who had Saturn... (I lived in a small town lol) Tomb Raider was my only game at first. The music or lack there of was incredible. Many great memories with system!

[@RickyIcecubes]

I was a Genesis kid, and was so hyped for Saturn. My parents saw the $399 price tag and said no, but they said yes to PlayStation's $299 price tag.

[@ogemaweyaus4105]

@@RickyIcecubes as long as you have good memories gaming with what you had. That's what counts

[@RickyIcecubes]

@@ogemaweyaus4105 Oh, I was happy with it. PS1 definitely ended up being the one to get, but it still bothered me a little bit back then when Sega would release a new first party game from one of my favorites series for Saturn and I couldn't play it. Some of them I've played throughout the years but most I haven't.

[@chungkingexpress94]

Sega was a weird situation. The difference in how Japan and the US markets responded to each Sega console is what did them in. It was like two completely different companies operating to fulfill the needs of separate audiences

[@VideoGameDocs]

I think that was easily their biggest challenge. Instead of really trusting Sega of America with it's own decisions, Sega of Japan forced what they thought was best and at times really put Sega of America in tough positions (as we saw with the Saturn.) It's honestly amazing that the Genesis was the success that it was lol.

[@Mitsuraga]

I think you're half-right. I get really tired of the narrative that SEGA of America had the right idea about how to approach marketing and such for the Saturn, that their only real obstacle was SEGA of Japan's meddling. While anybody can agree that the surprise early launch was absolutely a bad idea (and although we only have one person's account to go by on this, it seems reasonable to assume SEGA of Japan called the shots of what games got localized and what didn't), I do not think that the American side would have done too much different than what we actually got, nor do I think it would have been significantly more successful. SEGA of America made stupid mistakes, too. They weren't a flawless golden child, just because the Genesis did exceedingly well, here, and their problems did not all (or even mostly, I'd bet) stem from Japanese branch decisions.

[@marcbasil]

SOA was an absolute joke. Saturn was a *titan* in JP; it’s library was enormous

[@23GreyFox]

@@marcbasil And SOJ still managed to fuck up everything.

[@KoolKeithProductions]

​@@Mitsuragaare you kidding? While Sega of America wasn't perfect, understand that Sega was getting STOMPED by Nintendo (they owned 95% of the market) until SoJ finally swallowed their pride and let SoA take the lead with the Genesis. Now Sega owned 50-55% of the market, but what did SoJ do? Clearly they got jealous and took back control, green lighting the 32x, and it was all downhill from then. Then them forcing the American launch early put the nail in not only the Saturn's forehead, but Sega in its entirety. SoA also aced sells and marketing with the Dreamcast, but guess what? SoJ messed up their launch by not having enough consoles. They were a complete mess.

[@KoolKeithProductions]

@7:35 "We needed to respond to Atari's jaguar..." should have been a line no said EVER 😔

[@grinbrothers]

A fantastic summary with some really neat details included such as how the Saturn fared pretty well in Japan against PlayStation (until Final Fantasy 7 released) and the overview manual when you were talking about the tech of the system. I can understand why a lot of the mistakes regarding the Saturn were made but the creation and release of the 32X is still the most baffling of them all. They already had knowledge of how well a console add-on for the Mega Drive would fare with Mega CD and their big concern was the... Atari Jaguar? The latter is quite hilarious in hindsight.

[@VideoGameDocs]

The 32X will never make sense to me. I understand a lot of it had to do with Sega Japan vs Sega America, but it still seemed so boneheaded to make. Imagine being afraid of the Jaguar lol

[@albertabramson3157]

@@VideoGameDocs After seeing some of the best of the Sega CD's M2 games (Batman Returns, Soulstar, Sonic CD's bonus stage, etc), it was already clear that the CD-ROM's ASIC and improved rendering hardware was capable of putting out some great 3D games. It could even texture and Garaud shade 3,000 polygons/sec on top of its Mode 7 like graphics and offered arcade sound. Had SEGA put its resources into porting some of its arcade games to this clearly arcade machine and pushing the limits of this $500 beast, they would've had the 1,000 titles, 100+ active software developers, and their 55% market share and revenue to combat both SONY and NINTENDO's offerings. After seeing amazing limit pushers like Toy Story, Mortal Kombat, and Street Fighter II on the Genesis, it was clear that the Sega CD platform still had enough gas to reach 1996-97, enough time to bridge the gap to the Dreamcast.

[@marcbasil]

Lmao the MegaCD had nearly as many titles as the lowly 64. Think about that

[@marcbasil]

@@albertabramson3157 umm, Saturn had over 1,200 titles & one of the GOAT home console libraries. It received nearly 7 years of development

[@noneofyourbusiness1998]

​@@marcbasil And it still flopped.

[@Aikalukko]

Great video, really surprised how good it was. This deserves more views, hope the algorithm gods favor you well. Subscribed.

[@VideoGameDocs]

I appreciate the kind words! I hope the algorithm gods favor me as well, but honestly I just enjoy putting these out there :)

[@destineeharper2889]

Great work! Can’t wait for more videos :)

[@oldheadinspirit]

Appreciate how you break down the technical aspects of the consoles.

[@ChristopherR1981]

I hardly knew anyone with a Saturn... almost everyone I knew had a Playstation.

[@RewindArcade]

Nice work on this, always nice to see other newer VG doc creators on here. Subbed and will keep an eye out for more videos!

[@VideoGameDocs]

Thank you! Really appreciate the support :)

[@joebaumgart1146]

Very high quality. I can see you becoming much more popular.

[@VideoGameDocs]

I appreciate that! Glad you enjoyed it!

[@joebaumgart1146]

@@VideoGameDocs very much. The kids today will never understand The Bit Wars!

[@GamersGardenRetro]

Just found your channel and really enjoyed this video, really well made. Subbed :)

[@VideoGameDocs]

I'm glad you enjoyed it! Hope you'll enjoy the rest of my content :)

[@glauberbispo8922]

nice video dude i don't see alot of guys talking about saturn with so much details

[@VideoGameDocs]

Thank you! I'm glad you enjoyed it. I discovered the Saturn not long before I started work on the video, I just found it so fascinating!

[@marcbasil]

LMAO this is sarcasm, right….? Are you brand new to KZbin…? It’s literally the most discussed/obsessed over home console, and it’s not even close. No one ever shuts about it, and most of the time, it’s utter nonsense

[@elsiebartlett6808]

Great video, became a subscriber recently and have been going through your stuff. Thank you for being so dedicated to researching these topics and sharing with us. I am curious, not sure if you will remember as this video is from a while ago, but what is the music you used during the credit sequence? Very relaxing

[@nathantaylor8643]

I know the Saturn was a failure but to this day it's still my favorite console. I bought it day one and enjoyed the hell out of it through it's short life. That launch console still works to this day.

[@VideoGameDocs]

That's awesome that you got it day one! Super glad I took the dive into Sega, because the Saturn and the Dreamcast have quickly become some of my favorite consoles!

[@nathantaylor8643]

@@VideoGameDocs I love the Dreamcast but it's lifespan was so short we'll never know how truly great the console could have been. What we did get from it was incredible in such a short period of time.

[@fordxbgtfalcon]

Saturn was really only a failure outside of Japan. I also bought mine day one back in 1995.

[@metronome8471]

The 32X should never happened. All of its games should have been on the Saturn. However the 32X games were better than the Atari Jaguar Versions.

[@VideoGameDocs]

It really is unfortunate that there was such a divide between Sega Japan and Sega America :/ but like you said, at least it was better than the Jaguar

[@metronome8471]

Posted from a VCS lol.

[@awakenedsoul2638]

Yeah right! The SEGA CD was enough.

[@chadridgeway7171]

Jaguar Doom was one of the finest ports at the time

[@leeartlee915]

The 32X is a prime example of suits not thinking shit through. Like they said in Jurassic Park “They asked “can we do it” rather than “should we do it”

[@TheDreadedZero]

Wish Knuckles Chaotix would have been ported to the Saturn or Dreamcast

[@ZenithMusicNet]

Pleasant narration and a well-structured documentary. My compliments 👏

[@GothGfGG]

Pardon my French but how the fuck do you only have 600 subs?? YOUR CONTENT IS SO GOOD

[@VideoGameDocs]

Thank you! I'm glad you're enjoying it. I may only have 600 because I don't particularly upload too often lol

[@TheRealDustinNunn]

I wish I still had a Sega Saturn to this day because I missed out on a lot of good games for it. I mean, sure, the console didn't have that many Sonic the Hedgehog games, but it had tons of fighting games from Capcom, Sega, SNK, the Mortal Kombat series, Dead or Alive 1 and some other Saturn games that I never heard of. And the superior RAM cartridge that the Saturn had was the Action Replay Plus cartridge, which was a 3-things-in-1 device, meaning that it would allow you to perform cheats in your Saturn games, save your Saturn's game data and break the region encoding allowing you play imported games on any Sega Saturn model of your choice, which was awesome and the Saturn was also backwards-compatible with music CDs as well.

[@VideoGameDocs]

I've been loving my Saturn since I got it. Been looking into getting some hidden gems that I'd never heard of. The Action Replay is great since it helps with the cost of a lot of those games.

[@jacob60617]

Omg wow what a great video. Dude you deserve way more subs

[@VideoGameDocs]

Thanks man! I appreciate it a lot

[@MichaPisarskiTech]

Great video, keep it up :)

[@The.love1]

simply amazing plz continue , and thank you

[@fordxbgtfalcon]

Great video. Saturn is still my favorite console of all time. I have several versions, mostly Japanese versions. It’s a beast when it came to 2d games when paired with the ram carts.

[@VideoGameDocs]

I love the Saturn, really glad I was able to get one for fairly cheap a few years ago. I mainly have US versions but I don't have a huge collection.

[@TheCostascrete]

great video really like it

[@TheDJMeyer85]

It’s amazing how Sega managed to screw itself over

[@Seanbyford]

Great doc - thanks for making this - subbed

[@VideoGameDocs]

Much appreciated!

[@Jolly-Green-Steve]

You could get a Sega Saturn with VF2/Daytona/and Virtua Cop for $199 for Holiday 96? I did not know this I was too busy playing Nintendo 64 I guess. Great deal though.

[@MaxAbramson3]

That was Kalinske's idea, and was the only time that the Saturn outsold the PS1 in NA. Ironically, the Genesis would outsell the PS1's 21 million consoles in NA... with 22 million, plus the Nomad.

[@CovenantAgentLazarus]

The main problem with the Sega Saturn for me was the fact that most of the games felt like a demo

[@SirChadofWick]

Another thing to note is that Sega could have perhaps mitigated the Saturn’s difficult design by offering better development libraries.. something Sony did exceptionally well. I’m guessing the lackluster libraries Sega offered was due to the fact that Sega changed the Saturns architecture late in its development. Which brings me to this question, and it’s something that never gets mentioned no matter how many different videos I watch or articles I read.. if Sega had an arcade division that primarily showed off 3D graphics as being the future of video games, and they knew this.. why would they decide to initially begin Saturn with 2D games in mind? Did they not think it would catch on as quickly as it did thanks to Sony? This decision to play it safe and not push technology forward in the home market I think was the beginning of the end for Sega. That and the 32X, which clearly should have never existed.

[@VideoGameDocs]

Yeah I think basing the knowledge I have off of their Saturn guide giving some development libraries would’ve helped a ton. Wouldn’t surprised me if the sudden shift messed a lot of that up or even just made it hard for them to even create libraries. While researching for this video honestly that was a question that regularly stuck in my mind as well. I think that maybe the idea was that 3D was, at that point, fairly easily achievable with Arcade hardware, whereas if they were to push 3D in the home console market it could possibly jeopardize their arcade market. I do definitely think part of it was no one knowing how quickly 3D games would catch on in living rooms specifically. Arcade hardware is fairly expensive, and I think it was part of Nintendos plan to hold onto 2D until 3D was at a cheap and acceptable adoption rate for home consoles since Nintendo didn’t do arcade games. Sega probably though doing hardware extensions to the Genesis was good enough, but still wanted to compete in the 32-bit market. The PS1 however proved you could create 3D graphics fairly cheap, which I think scared Sega into shifting gears and throwing in more hardware to make it more 3D capable, and scared Nintendo into creating a super powerful 3D machine that ultimately hit the market too late. All speculation of course, would absolutely love to know what happened behind all of those closed door meetings lol.

[@SirChadofWick]

@@VideoGameDocs them being afraid that home 3D systems would jeopardize their arcade business is something I haven’t thought of before.. that could be a part of it. Though they completely did a 180 on that stance with the Dreamcast and Naomi hardware

[@marcbasil]

“Lacklustre” libraries, uhh, wut…? Saturn had over 1,200 titles of insane diversity, and arguably the greatest RPG & SHMUP library of any home console, rivaled probably by only the SNES

[@marcbasil]

@@VideoGameDocsSaturn had well over 1,200 titles. In no way was it difficult for them to create libraries

[@SirChadofWick]

@@marcbasil yes, that was in Japan and I’m pretty sure a lot of those games used 2D sprite graphics. In the US, not sure if you were aware, but the Saturn was bodied hard by the PS1’s easy 3D development tools. Also, by “libraries” I mean that in a development sense, not the actual library of games.

[@deepblue8143]

Great video but Tekken did not have twice the frame rate. VF was a smooth 60fps and still looks great today.

[@VideoGameDocs]

Actually that's VF 2! Which is the one I was playing in the video. Virtua Fighter 1 was the launch title for the Saturn and that ran at 30fps.

[@deepblue8143]

@@VideoGameDocs Wow that is very interesting, you learn something new everyday. I always wanted a Saturn as a kid but my parents never broke down and bought me one. Now as an adult I finally own one for my retro corner. We were playing the original Virtua Fighter the other day, I remember it got a lot of criticism when it 1st came out but I still think it plays, runs and looks great. I honestly thought the original was 60fps too. I don't think I'll ever understand Sega's design philosophy when it came to arcade versus home hardware, they obviously were the leaders in 3-D at the time and saw where the future was going yet for some odd reason they thought to make the Saturn a predominantly super 2D machine.

[@AndrewXX92]

I was huge Into video games growing up in the 90s I had everything from SNES and up I had the Genesis and dc and some how I completely missed the Sega Saturn I don't even remember kids talking about it in school I went to a catholic school so most of us were spoiled lol my dad was a huge gamer 2 and the Saturn was never on his radar Sega had to have terrible marketing for this to be possible

[@drunkensailor112]

The Sega megadrive actually sold really well in Europe. 5 to 1 compared to snes and best selling console of all time until the playstation

[@ogemaweyaus4105]

The Saturn never fell from grace. It was just a system that many people would have loved. Just never experienced.

[@cryptocsguy9282]

@drunkensailor112 you mean bestselling console of all time in Europe 🇪🇺?

[@drunkensailor112]

@@cryptocsguy9282 yes until ps1

[@G.L.999]

The SNES was actually quite popular in countries like Germany and Austria outselling the Mega-Drive. Unless you're from the UK or Portugal or Spain of course.

[@drunkensailor112]

@@G.L.999 in Germany it was about 50/50 everywhere else Sega outsold snes and mostly by large numbers. Especially Southern Europe and UK

[@G.L.999]

@6:33: "In America, the Genesis was performing well. Laying claim to 55% of all 16-bit hardware in 1994!" Donkey Kong Country: "I'm gonna crush Sega out of the hardware race! Hold my bananas!!!"

[@dianak5519]

I agree with others. Sega Saturn is one of my favorite video game consoles!!

[@costasvasilogiannakis7816]

great video love it

[@Cloud121D]

Ugh..... To this fucking day the "$299" quote pisses me off so much. The Saturn was $400 with Virtua Fighter and internal storage for saving (though limited). That "$299" did not include a game or memory card, so it was really $380 or so when you bought a game and memory card with the PSX. I love my PSX, and I own over 500 games for it, but as a Sega fanboy all my life, the whole Steve Race thing still pisses me off to no end, as people couldn't/still can't do the damn math.

[@STAXONDECK1]

Thanks for beign logical

[@chadridgeway7171]

11:20 if I remember correctly the Saturn Virtua Fighter port was garbage. They had to release Virtua Fighter Remix to make up for it

[@InsomniumX]

A huevo valedores a huevo. Es un BACILON tranquilo que rico bacilon BACILON tranquilo dije pinches carnales váyanse a la verta y pónganse a limpiar su casa de mamey pinches carnales pinches valedores locos de mamey

[@BUGZYFANG]

Get a popper stopper

[@Psmgamer]

Never owned a Sega Saturn but remember playing Nights into Dreams at Target back when they had kiosk machines.

[@VideoGameDocs]

Nights is one of my all time favorite games, even though I played it like 20+ years later haha.

[@keithkelly5692]

lol @ "to little" @ 15:54

[@LukeDodge916]

Great video. I will always love the Saturn even while i was disappointed in it's performance. It did have some fun games but the PS1 just stole all its thunder. I love both systems but most families were a 1-system household. Anyway, im glad the Saturn is having a second Renaissance today. I just wish prices would cool down... because i just cant afford the library that i want to own lol.

[@thehound1359]

I loved the Saturn. I remember getting sonic 3d blast for Christmas one year. The system had a pretty decent library.

[@jonnyelpoiss7]

What truly killed the Saturn and Sega was its former president, Nakayama, form the Japan Division, because he was way too conservative, he saw America as the enemy even in its own company, instead of teaming up and listening to Kalinske (he basically refused every single thing the guy asked for by being stuborn, without any reason, even if making so was defying maket logic). Ho yesh and above of it all, the worst mistake he made was that he didn’t trust his own brand power at the time and wanted to compete on every single front (including Panasonic, I mean come on!), making stupid move and releasing stupid hardware that no one asked for, instead of focusing on competing Nintendo, their true competitor. If he have had more faith in its company and product, Sega would still making console today!

[@VideoGameDocs]

I think that’s always why I found the Saturn/Dreamcast era of Sega so interesting. If you haven’t read Console Wars, a book that primarily focuses on the Genesis Era and how Kalinske lead Sega at that time, it’s crazy how much he was put through. Nakayama was the one that approached Kalinske though and gave him the go ahead for a lot of the strategies that made the Genesis a success in North America. Truly a shame that there was such a split between Sega of Japan and Sega of America, but at the end of the day company management is not my specialty haha.

[@AlbertoFPomar]

I disagree that Nintendo was their competitor. Sega and Nintendo coexisted with different target audience, I think their true competitor was Sony

[@marcbasil]

And despite all of that, Saturn is STILL the GOAT Sega creation, and Arguably the GOAT home console ever released. Largest & most diverse library of any Sega console @ over 1,200 titles.

[@marcbasil]

@@AlbertoFPomarlolwut

[@jonnyelpoiss7]

@@marcbasil it is indeed an incredible system with outstanding and innovative title like none other. The panzer dragoon series is a must play, there is a ton of wonderful rpg and fighting game, shoot'em up and more. Dont get me wrong I love the system, and love even more the sega CD! But the way they were menaged and marketed cost Sega everything.

[@chadridgeway7171]

Sidenote, I remember the Saturn also launching with an esoteric, pretentious, art house marketing campaign instead of the fun, irreverent, Sega scream that had made it popular in the first place

[@VideoGameDocs]

I always wonder why they ditched the marketing that made the Genesis famous in favor of.. well exactly what you described.

[@Shorty_Lickens]

I dont remember that at all. I remember a smear campaign against Nintendo when they had very little to offer on their end. It was funny but sad.

[@dianak5519]

I agree with others. Sega Saturn is one of my favorite video game consoles!!

[@48hourrecordsteam45]

What sega had to do was 1:not make the 32x to try to expand the genesis - instead made the svp chip a stand alone lock on cart like (sonic & knuckles ) sold for $49.99. & made Virtua racing ,virtua fighter,Star Wars arcade, Daytona usa & see if Namco woulda port ridge racer & tekken to the genesis’s svp chip. Games sold for $49.99 then late later gen titles would be made tot ale advantage of the svp’s beefed up memory . Games like umk3,toy story ,vectorman 2 , Batman beyond , road rash 3 would have really shinned harder , just using the svp’s extra ram. They Then released a controller sold separately.‘basically the 6-button but with 2 shoulder buttons, a little bit longer handles , & a lil analog stick next to the dpad. The size of say the Sony Ps vita’s.. Sega genesis 6button gold or some fancy name . That would have done awhole lot of good sega’s way 2. made sure the Saturns hardware was optimized so developers could have all the tools necessary to develop for the system easily . Removed the pack in title & the internal memory and sold them separately allowing the Saturn to sell for $299.99 and let the cartridge slot play genesis titles or a sold separate lock on cart again 🤦🏾‍♂️ that allowed genesis & master system games to be playable .! Trust People would have baught that Here now the genesis 6button would have been the standard controller now with a right lil analog stick and a more rounded underbody to fit in the hands. Like Nintendo and Sony was doing Right there that would have just made sega more competitive in the marketplace. An easier Optimized genesis for the tail end of the war .! No Extra headaches & the Saturn competitive in price /development & controller adequate for 3d gaming

[@danielrierson6683]

😂

[@marcbasil]

Saturn was the greatest thing Sega ever did

[@SubieandFriends]

Amazing video! Great narration voice too!!

[@Direwoof]

Not a popular console but a incredibly good one for JRPG fans.

[@andrewmedanich2844]

Still have my Saturn and nearly every game launched for it.

[@jacklazzaro9820]

Jenovi brought me here

[@VideoGameDocs]

Glad you're here and I hope you enjoyed the video!

[@Videomaster89]

In the 90s SEGA was able to outsell Nintendo four Christmas seasons in a row and at the end of 1993 Nintendo only had a 37% share of the market, the video says the Megadrive was not so successful in Europe wrong! As in the UK it outsold the Nintendo SNES and had a strong following the Saturn and Dreamcast so well initially until the PS1 and PS2 took the limelight

[@maroon9273]

32x suppose to be cancelled or turned into a alternative hardware for the saturn (based on the genesis, sega cd and saturn) or 5th gen level cart/cd neptune project (based sega cd, genesis and bits of the sega saturn). Saturn hardware needed a diet changes and foreground vdp needed a replacement or makeover. No suprise launch day, proper software lineup, proper documentation and software development kits.

[@tarjetart8090]

yuh this is lit bro

[@msdmlaher3378]

Ikr

[@almighty1984]

0:33 Never heard of negative praise 15:56 Typos Otherwise great job, subbed

[@VideoGameDocs]

You woulda though that after editing this for weeks I would've noticed those typos lol, thanks for the comment!

[@wojiaobill]

"git er done" -- Hayao Nakayama

[@Azgriff]

had some amazing games

[@marcbasil]

None of which were released in murica

[@keithkelly5692]

lol @ "jag-wire" @ 7:38

[@epicon6]

Wow the Saturn did really bad. We are really lucky then to ever get the Dreamcast.

[@mmaneage86]

You kind of wonder if the Saturn had lasted longer. If Sega didn't have to develop and release the Dreamcast early- could DC have utilized DVDs and become more attractive to the casual consumer?

[@DukeDudeston]

Something doesn't make sense. During the 16BIT era we saw pseudo 3D games become all the rage, the Super Nintendo showing off its Super FX chip, Sega went against that with the SVP, then we started seeing the release of the premature 32BIT and questionable 64BIT games consoles. Again both able to perform 3D capabilities. While at the same time Sega were killing it with their 3D arcade machines... So of course makes sense that Sega will create a new "flagship" console without any "real" 3D compatibility until after they heard about Sony and the PlayStation where it then got added?

[@VideoGameDocs]

Trust me, while doing research for this video, and many others, it was never a clear answer on why Sega didn't invest their industry leading 3D technology from Arcades into their consoles. From what I found, they kind of viewed 32bit systems as an opportunity to "perfect" 2D games, whereas Sony decided to push 32bit gaming to 3D. Seems like Sony wanted to innovate, and push the envelope to develop 3D games, whereas Sega wanted to continue perfecting the 2D game landscape, but it still doesn't make much sense considering their Arcade division was pushing 3D.

[@ericp631]

​@@VideoGameDocs there are a few reasons. 1. They were fighting the last war. The 2d tricks(sprite scaling, rotation, mode 7, ect.) That snes and neo geo and cps2/3 arcade boards were capable of(and beating them with) haunted sega and they felt like they needed to catch up as they were losing to it in both in the arcade and at home, especially in Japan. And 2. Despite vf's popularity in Japan, the Japanese on the whole always preferred 2d to 3d. All excitement and drive over 3d was very much coming from the west.

[@StalinBrosef]

I think a crucial part of the Mega Drive's lack of success in Japan is a lot less to do with the SNES than it is with NEC's PC Engine. Just as the Genesis beat the SNES to market in the west, giving Sega a market advantage by making the NES look antiquated to consumers looking for cutting edge games, in Japan the PC-Engine beat the Genesis to market, and despite being a hybrid 8-bit CPU machine with some 16-bit graphical capabilities it offered a lot of arcade focused experiences for gaming enthusiasts. By the time the Super Famicom had released, Sega had already been defeated by NEC. And ironically, NEC dragging its feet when bringing the PC Engine over to North America as the TurboGrafx 16 cost it a lot of market share to the Genesis, in an inverse way to how PCE beat Mega Drive in Japan.

[@Abandoned2377]

The 32x was a bad decision but rushing the saturn out ruined relationships on all sides

[@MaxAbramson3]

SoJ killed the already developed SVP LockOn with 6 arcade hits. It was ready for a March 1994 launch at just $49.95 and just as powerful as the 32X released in November--AFTER the Saturn and PS1 were released in Japan.

[@MrCalverino]

Sega Saturn is my favorite system next to the OG NES

[@VideoGameDocs]

It's pretty high up there for me! Although I'll be honest there really isn't a system I don't like!

[@MrCalverino]

@@VideoGameDocs I'm a big fan of AM2 and Yu Suzuki, plus Nights is one of the Greatest games ever!!!

[@VideoGameDocs]

Nights is one of my favs so I definitely agree with you there!

[@BasedDoomSlayer]

Bad decisions were Sega's downfall.

[@roahnosh]

Sega;s mismanagement is still ongoing today look at how they murdered both PSO2 and PSO2 NGS it just launched on the PS4 with little to no fanfare and where's the content?

[@MaxAbramson3]

Update: 32X also had its own powerful VDP for doing a 256 out of 32,768 color layer over the top of the Genesis/MD VDP. I was a SEGA enthusiast from the days of the Sega Master System and can tell you that everything was getting better and better all the time for Sega systems until SoJ decided to try to bring the Saturn to stores in May 1995. The 32X-CD was rumored to be coming out as one powerful unit for about $200 (the basic Genesis 32X--Neptune--was then slated to come to market for just $149). The Neptune would've kept SEGA in competition in North America, South America, and Europe if the Saturn had been held out as an arcade/enthusiast's console at $500/box. Most consumers would've chosen the Neptune over more expensive offerings PS1 and Saturn, and the backward compatible Neptune would've continued expanding the Genesis market worldwide with its late stage 30-40 megabit games, eventually reaching the 120 megabit (15MB) limit of those carts with perfect arcade ports and great adventure, rpg, and sports games. Even in the 3D market, the 32X was capable of rendering 40,000 Guarard shaded, textured polygons/sec, as many as most early PS1 titles. More games like Crash Bandicoot, GT1/2, Final Fantasy, and Metal Gear would likely have shown up on the Neptune or Neptune CD.

[@Mitsuraga]

It sounds like you're basing a lot of your info off of rumours that abounded at the time, mainly with regards to console functions, names, and prices. Now, to be clear, I was like, seven years old when the Saturn came to the United States, so I only know about how the gaming press reported on the 32X and Saturn before their releases in retrospect.

[@MaxAbramson3]

@@Mitsuraga People called SEGA, and their own people had been given wrong information by Japan.

[@Mitsuraga]

I mean, yeah, that makes sense. Seems like a lot would get lost in translation, that way.

[@MaxAbramson3]

​@@MitsuragaWell, more that SEGA's ever changing roadmap was a disaster. So many people were excited about the Sega CD+SVP ($49.95 Lock On cart that already had four top arcade games developed). SEGA needed to stick to its roadmap, but just confused people with its Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Neptune, Pluto vaporware. Meanwhile, SONY just had PlayStation.

[@MaxAbramson3]

@@Mitsuraga SoA was looking for an alternative to Saturn. They already had the 32X-CD and should've just put a few cool games out for that.

[@danielrierson6683]

I think if they released the sonic 3D before Mario 64 and Crash then I think Saturn doin have stood a chance

[@VideoGameDocs]

I guess it depends on how good it would've been lol. Not sure how many people would've liked the fisheye perspective.

[@Bronxguyanese]

Sega problem started with the Sega cd. Hardly anyone bought the add on and stuck with the regular Genesis. Than comes out the 32x another add to pro long and compete with Nintendo in the USA market. By the mid 90s Genesis was showing it's age neither the Sega cd or 32x which offered better quality at a cost vs fX micro chip or other 8mb snes games which had great graphics and cd quality sound.

[@joesaiditstrue]

5:10 song name?

[@joesaiditstrue]

Nevermind: Panzer Dragoon Saga OST - "Rest"

[@VideoGameDocs]

@@joesaiditstrue Glad you found it! Was just about to comment that haha.

[@joesaiditstrue]

@@VideoGameDocs Reminds me of Xenogears

[@RengaBeats]

Nice doc.. but you know Sega IS still around right??

[@themadmallard]

is it really tru the sh-2 was developed FOR the saturn? it had lots of industrial uses outside of the saturn in japanese electronics...

[@VideoGameDocs]

Good catch! After further research I found out that Sega and Hitachi did indeed partner up, but Hitachi more or less duped them into using the SH-2, since there were concerns of it's initial performance. If I ever remake this video I'll make sure to update it!

[@themadmallard]

@@VideoGameDocs they may have been duped but its just as likely to have been a cultural thing. Many video game architectures used non-Japanese design or sourced chipsets, like the 68k (even though hitachi & toshiba made their own 68k copy), so there may have been a cultural push to home-source the tech. It stands to reason that this is a factor because it carried over into the Dreamcast, where they were reporting initially about going with 3dFX chips instead of NEC.

[@penuts17]

This is great. Btw, is that Donald Trump at @0:38 ??

[@VideoGameDocs]

Very glad you enjoyed it! And I think it is!

[@ciredecgellar8232]

The only reason of the Saturn's lack of success is the competitiveness ..... All the other things are just kids story ...

[@marcbasil]

Uhh what’re you talking about…??

[@ciredecgellar8232]

@@marcbasil I talk about the facts ....

[@marcbasil]

@@ciredecgellar8232 like….?

[@ciredecgellar8232]

@@marcbasil like the cost VS the profit, like the fact that a company who outsources everything cannot compete with a company that manufactures its own components. Sega could have made the Saturn an exact copy of the PS1; it would have been more expensive anyway, less well distributed and less well marketed anyway. Sega's annual reports are public. The numbers are there.

[@gjergjaurelius9798]

The day Sega died....yes....😑😔

[@DaveDoc1984]

FYI it was NOT called the Genesis in Japan and Europe. It was called Mega Drive. Only North American consoles were called Genesis due to a trademark already being in place for Mega Drive.

[@VideoGameDocs]

Correct! There are a few times I mention it as the Mega Drive in the video. Thanks for the comment!

[@gjergjaurelius9798]

God I hated clockwork knights. I tired and tried I just could not get into the game.

[@Jolly-Green-Steve]

The Saturn would have done way better if they never released the 32x and had big title support from the get go. If they would of had Capcom Generations 5(SF2/SF2CE/SFF2 Turbo) and a proper port of Mortal Kombat 2 for North American launch amongst other Capcom/Konami/Midway/Sega arcade hits it would have slowed down Sony big time. They also should have beefed up the ram from the start so they didn't need ram carts later. Instead of 2 meg give it 6 meg like Neo Geo CD had. Start the system out at 399 in 95 then lower it to 299 in 96 with more pack in games. Also give the system mpeg adapter support built in for better FMV and leave the slot open for games that use plug in harddisk like arcade perfect port of Killer Instinct for 99 bucks at launch. You think Saturn would of failed then with arcade perfect SF2... MK2... and Killer Instinct all at launch? ahaahahahaa!

[@TheAxeGrinder]

Segata Sanshiro should’ve been over here in North America. Problem solved.

[@Hugoisbuff]

Fr

[@russmawson6744]

You made me switch off when you referred to the mega drive as genesis at the Japanese launch. If you can't get that basic fact right how can I trust the rest of the video?

[@VideoGameDocs]

I actually refer to it as the Mega Drive twice in that section. “From their perspective the Mega Drive, as it was called there and in the EU…” I also personally don’t fully understand the need for switching between names constantly, especially for clarity sake. These videos are meant to be educational, and if someone is new to the subject and I say “The Genesis sold well in America.” But then said “The Mega Drive didn’t.” That could be confusing.

[@Mitsuraga]

This video starts off with referring to the Japanese Mega Drive as the Genesis. Not an especially promising beginning, but hey, let's go. I'm always all about engaging in Saturn talk, any time. The whole idea that the Saturn was initially supposed to be a 2D powerhouse without concern for developing 3D graphical technology is not entirely true, based more in the system's unique architecture than in its planned software. The Saturn was actually at least partially a response to the Atari Jaguar. With the Saturn being planned to host to so many arcade ports, and with SEGA taking over the world with 3D arcade hits like Virtua Fighter, it was a big focus for the company as a whole. Just because the Saturn could render and scale sprites like a champ doesn't mean that's all it was intended to accomplish. The SEGA Saturn *can* render 3D objects; it just accomplishes this by effectively stitching sprites together to form polygonal surfaces. To say that it couldn't render 3D environments is false. Developers usually used VDP2's infinite scaling trickery to get around the fact that it would be taxing to make games this way, back then. To be fair, I think you made this point well enough, clearly intending to mean that it doesn't render 3D environments in the same way as PSX or N64, but the way you worded it at the start really made it sound like you think it couldn't do it at all.

[@henrypage8951]

Is there anything here that is original and not shamlessly regurgitated from segaretro?

[@VideoGameDocs]

If you’d like more original research I’d recommend checking out some of my newer videos! Admittedly some of these earlier videos are more of a compilation of information I found while researching the topic of the video.

[@Dashi26]

Ughh, I hated Virtua Fighter. The controls were horrible. Panzer Dragoon was pretty good, Daytona 500 was what it was and it was kind repetitive and boring. This was the era created the beginning of the end for arcades

[@DaoistYeashikAli]

Comment for the Algorithm

[@G18999]

❤️

[@fantasticdavidson1179]

Sonic extream look like 3d blast two the return of shit

[@x7heDeviLx]

So they had 50% of the market and out sold Nintendo two to one those numbers aren’t mathing. Did ChatGPT writethis.

[@MaxAbramson3]

There were lots of lesser selling consoles and even a few NES and SMS consoles selling.

[@Volcell-85]

It's weird that a video of a woman putting makeup can get 500,000 likes and a video like this gets few views 😢

[@king2025-i]

We already know the Dreamcast die,the cost of death the PS2

[@elin111]

The Dreamcast was already dead on arrival long before the PS2 was even a relevant factor.

[@bls8959]

What the hell are you trying to say??

[@Adamtendo_player_1]

The PS2 was the kiss of death for the Dreamcast.

[@SouthernOregonReps]

The Saturn by far was Sega’s worst system. The 32X wasn’t much better. I had both played PlayStation and Sega cd genesis games over it. The 32x and the Saturn was the catalyst to put sega out of the hardware business.

[@marcbasil]

LMAO wait, is this sarcasm…? Not only was Saturn by FAR Segas greatest thing they ever created, but it’s also arguably the greatest home console ever released. The largest library of any Sega console (over 1,200 titles) as well as the most diverse. Additionally, it received the longest linear development period 1994-2001. So, again, you’re joking…?

[@Adamtendo_player_1]

@@marcbasil I actually like the Saturn but I have to be honest the former CEO of Sega that basically killed the Saturn was right about it. The hardware was under powered. It was too difficult to develop for and the games as great as they are were an absolute miracle.

[@wordsshackles441]

Mega drive was beating Nintendo in Europe too. Do your research properly.

[@vh4690]

Drew carry had one

[@marcbasil]

Who