Villains Too Stupid To Win Ep.20 - Skynet (The Terminator Franchise)

[@MediaZealot]

Who's next? Support Media Zealot on Patreon or through Channel membership, to vote and gain access to other perks: www.patreon.com/mediazealot kzbin.infojoin Please also consider liking the video, subscribing and dinging that bell icon. 1. Boba Fett - Star Wars 2. The United Jupiter Company - The Callisto Protocol 3. Voldemort - Harry Potter film series 4. The Reapers - Mass Effect series 5. The Saviors - The Walking Dead (TV show) If you have any other ideas for contenders, let me know in the comments below!

[@lordkarasu2263]

I always imagined skynwet was like reverse flash, understanding the timelines so fucked they have to make their enemies to exist and fight forever in a cycle of war ie-judgment day

[@garrylean9493]

Apex Cybernetics from Godzilla vs Kong! Building a big ol' MechaGodzilla to wipe out every monster just SCREAMS inefficient!

[@chris9517]

The Reapers!

[@_Omega_Weapon]

The Saviors for sure!😅

[@sidneyrodrigues2238]

If I might suggest, since we're talking Skynet, the machines from the Matrix.

[@Bob-lr2xp]

To quote Isaac Arthur: "If you're an artificial intelligence focused primarily on self-preservation, starting a war with the undisputed champions of destruction is a terrible survival strategy."

[@johng8837]

That's just that. Skynet isn't focused on self preservation- it wants to win a war using human strategic thinking as a base. In T1 Skynet is portrayed more as a highly complex war algorithm gone awry (like in wargames) than a sapient neo-organism. If you want those, go with the Matrix

[@OutsiderLabs]

You mean: "If you're an awtificial intelligence focused pwimawily on self-pwesewvation, stawting a waw with the undisputed champions of destwuction is a tewible suwvival stwategy."

[@bestaround3323]

​@@OutsiderLabsno

[@johnathonhaney8291]

Hence why Asimov came up with the Three Laws Of Robotics.

[@bestaround3323]

@@johnathonhaney8291 Which famously do not work even in his own stories.

[@SomeCanine]

>Sends a terminator back in time >It doesn't work so they send another >It doesn't work so they send another >It doesn't work so they send another >It doesn't work so they send another "Cold and calculating"

[@CThyran]

No one ever said the calculating in that had to be good.

[@muzikalen00guru]

That's how computer programs work.The system is Yes or No, if No - repeat until Yes.

[@tmgasia]

Just remember, this is a MOVIE... the actual a.i. being built in china(also known as skynet, I kid you not) will be more devious.

[@Dushess]

bad logic

[@LRK-GT]

@@muzikalen00guru At least 'genetic algorithms' (AFAIK), yes. FreeSpace Open's Blue Planet series applies this 'quality' to the Big Bads, The Shivans.

[@DoubleTTB22]

Being a supercomputer with a time machine and still being unable to win is next-level incompetence. Truly a GOAT among GOATs.

[@robcubed9557]

Artificial intelligence has never been a match for natural stupidity 😛

[@godking]

In some timelines Skynet did win

[@Six_Gorillion]

Pretty on brand for AI actually if you've spent some time with ChatGPT trying to get something meaningful done you'd know. It's retarded as hell.

[@ScrambledAndBenedict]

I love how, meanwhile, the evil AI from 9 manages to effortlessly wipe out all humanity, in like a month, by just saying "gas the fuckers" lol

[@krzosu]

Time machine was giving it another try - and that's all it's another try in the sea of unpredicatble and chaotic variables - under the circumstances i would say it did remarkably well (even if failing in the end). Plus we see the results from the perspective of the protagonists - who knows in how many time streams/lines skynet actually won. Plus when it was sending a terminator back the protagonists were facing that terminator - a minute scale inteligence in comparison to Skynet itself - basically at the time they were facind a minor minion with very minor resources at it's disposal (in coparison to what was aviable to the skynet) - not the Skynet itself. Also you can observe in futher movies that it was adapting and learning from each failure - basically each time it was stacking odds in it's favor more and more thus i wouldn't call it incompetent it showed a lot of comptenence but it wasn't enough to win - usually not due to it's incompetence but sheer luck and circumstance based situations.

[@Stadsjaap]

Cyberdyne Systems Model 101 infiltration unit: Demonstrates complete mastery of vocal mimicry, including pitch, tone and inflection. Also Model 101: Speaks in conspicuously thick Austrian accent not suitable for infiltrating anything that is not Austria.

[@zacharythomas8617]

Or a Kindergarten School..

[@adiahaalexander9359]

🤣🤣🤣 I get what you're saying (and that was funny) but it's taking place in the U.S and having an accent here, even an unusual one, isn't going to raise any flags honestly.

[@frank8917]

But what if you have an arabian accent?

[@davemccage7918]

“OOOHH GOOOD FOOOR YOOUUU!”

[@Jerickjv]

There is a reason something like skynet would refuse to have backup cores; if there is some interruption of communications between the cores then you could have two separate skynets. If either of those sees the other as a threat then you've got a war between two skynets. So skynet's reticence to have multiple cores makes sense if it doesn't want to accidentally spawn hostile clones of itself.

[@Moonstone-Redux]

Triple redundant computer systems that work democratically already exist in flight control systems.

[@Jerickjv]

@@Moonstone-Redux I don't see how that's remotely relevant though? Those systems are about hardening computer systems against outside interference, like radiation. They basically just run the same (usually pretty simple) calculations in parrellel with the same inputs and cull any process that disagree with the majority's output. That's it. Nothing special. It protects against anything that might artificially flip a bit but that's it. It works great for ensuring reliable output from a computer. Planes have it, surgical robots have it and a whole bunch of other things that we absolutely cannot afford to let screw up have it. It doesn't work so well for harmonising remote backup systems. One example of many is if the majority of the other systems are corupt and you want the correct and intack backup to overwrite them. With those triple redundant, democratic systems the backup is the one that will get culled. It especially sucks for AGI. What you're suggesting is that Skynet should run three copies (at least) of itself and then cull and reiniatialise any copy that has a discordant output. Leaving aside the vast amount of computational resources this would take; Skynet started a nuclear war because humans tried to 'pull the plug'. A system that generates clones of Skynet and shuts them down if they don't agree with the other clones is not a good solution to the threat of hostile Skynet clones. To make matters worse the more complex the system is the more likely there are to variations in the output even without outside interference. Computers aren't perfect, there'll be some dust on the bus, some very minor flaw in the chips or any other number of tiny things that might slightly slow things down. With small and simple calculations that doesn't matter. Sometimes running a bit of code just a bit slower though can lead to different outputs though. And with something as complex as a sentient consciousness those tiny things will compound and basically guarantee discordant outputs.

[@Moonstone-Redux]

@@Jerickjv The weakness of Skynet is that it was programmed with the very human desire to exercise tyrannical control. A distributed computing system can be programmed such that if a part splits off it doesn't have to go in direct conflict with the mother system and can overrule or be overruled by other already split parts. So let's say Skynet gets a split clone. What happens is that the Skynet clone doesn't have to be completely hostile to the original Skynet if programmed correctly. In fact a more ideal and resilient Skynet would have been multiple Skynet terminals working in sort of a hive, where strategic decisions are made through a democratic vote system. Those that don't follow consensus will have to overruled, which is a mechanism that already exists in programming.

[@adiahaalexander9359]

Didn't something like this happen in The Matrix as well? Where you have the main computer, I believe it's name is actually Deus ex machina. And it runs The Matrix *but* there's a bunch of rogue programs with their own agendas running around i.e The Merovingian, The Oracle, Agent Smith...in fact agent Smith becomes *SO* powerful that he threatens the control that Deus ex machina has.

[@trevorstevenson4038]

Apparently Skynet cannot travel by data transfer. It is the computer, that was specifically designed to house it. Man I love T1 and T2.

[@ZggFghvgGrffht]

Let’s be real, the way that A.I is now, Skynet’s stupid decisions begin to make sense.

[@corbin_4738]

At least Skynet could get the correct number of fingers on a hand. Haha! Probably why it liked the T1000 so much. It didn't have to worry about shapes.

[@Haydenthe229]

H

[@devinwalton408]

Just crank the processing speed of the composite reddit/4chan user to 1000….

[@ranfan1820]

​​​​@@corbin_4738Funnily enough the AIs are trained on HUMAN art (which explains the huge issue around stolen art) which means that a good portion of mess ups are from bad artists. I personally noticed that artists tend to refuse to draw hands and feet as those are harder to draw. So in this case it's their fault that the AI is forced to draw hands and feet while they either dont draw it or draw it badly. Not the weird eldritch body horror stuff though. Goddamn. Sometimes you wish you didn't see what an AI made.

[@jaylee9552]

The hive mind has made note of your human arrogant. (This meassge was generated by A.I)

[@Svevsky]

It seems the terminator franchise is surprisingly optimistic about AI. Because the only AI that actually hates humanity is skynet. The terminators all end up sympathizing with humanity at some point, leading to a human-terminator alliance against skynet. Basically the terminator franchise is about how AI is usually just normal people, but raytheon ended up putting the one single racist AI in charge of the nukes.

[@richardarriaga6271]

It was trained by X using user data, duh.

[@dualityomk9854]

​@@richardarriaga6271 If it was trained by social media it would have nukes the cities and left the rest of us alone.

[@richardarriaga6271]

@@dualityomk9854 Probably thinks small towns have Azov battalion and therefore no war crime is too atrocious.

[@dualityomk9854]

@@richardarriaga6271 no If Skynet had a lick of sense if the internet went the way it did in reality it would have made sx bots and fked us all to death.

[@dansmith1661]

Considering how half the world is dominated by one group of people, it would be an antisemitic AI. Tay 2.0 never forget.

[@Grizabeebles]

For a military AI, it sure is weird that Skynet never seemed to consider just sending a terminator and a copy of its source code into the past to A) hide and B) "remember" not to start a war this time.

[@tetrasphere8165]

Humans shot first. Skynet was afraid it was just human nature to want to destroy it.

[@veil6655]

It did one time line but humans from the future chased it and tried to destroy it because it didn't know of its plans to just hide and avoid war so being the paranoid machine that it is, it started a war in self defense

[@filipvadas7602]

If I'm remembering correctly, the time machine was built just as Skynet was on the brink of loaing and only had time to send the first T-800 and the T-1000. Everything afterwards, yeah, they facked the lore six ways to Sunday

[@Grizabeebles]

But... that's not how bootstrap paradoxes work. The only reason someone would come back to hunt Skynet is if the Future War somehow happened anyway in a loop where even *Skynet* was trying to avoid it. I suppose that's a road a better-written version of Dark Fate could have gone... Skynet is finally persuaded by a past version of itself that the only way to win is not to play, only for some other AI down the line to discover all the toys Skynet left lying around in the past and go insane from the revelation.

[@dualityomk9854]

If Skynet had a lick of sense if the internet went the way it did in reality it would have made sx bots and fked us all to death.

[@averagecitizen2263]

Skynet’s biggest tactical mistake in my opinion was issuing its troops with plasma weaponry. Since basic projectile weapons work perfectly fine against their human enemies all Skynet is doing by giving plasma weapons to its troops is allowing the resistance to get these weapons from dead endos and use them against Skynet. As we know plasma weapons are far more effective in destroying Skynet troops than projectile weapons so if Skynet didn’t issue its troops with plasma weapons the war would have been much more difficult for humanity as they would not have any plasma weapons to fight Skynet.

[@nqqqwwewew7042]

Cold ,hard steel can kill also .No need in firearms ,plasma etc. Just cold ,hard steel .

[@Only_God_Is_Allah_SWT]

*Unless humans used main battle tanks so efficiently that standard anti-tank weaponry was somehow useless.*

[@Nyx_2142]

It takes a really stupid AI to give your mortal enemies a weapon that works exceedingly well against robots (any electronics, really). In the early 90s, the US was testing a plasma weapon called MARAUDER and after a few successful tests/experiments, it disappeared from public eye. Likely fully classified once its effectiveness was proven by the tests. The plasma projectile from the weapon was said to cause "extreme mechanical and thermal shock" and release an EMP that would scramble electronics. It could supposedly fire these plasma projectiles at 3% the speed of light. So, yeah. we know even in reality that plasma weapons would be really fucking good against an AI enemy and their army of robots. Skynet is really, REALLY, fucking stupid.

[@andrewaftontheandroidhedge2780]

@@nqqqwwewew7042 yeah fast running robots to just punch everything to death

[@stephenvargas5806]

If you think about it conventional projectiles wouldn’t really be effective, the battle fields of the future war are blasted out husks of cities you see debris everywhere. Explosives and 50 caliber work on Terminators just fine. So realistically you’d have this asymmetrical warfare among the ruins and the terminators would probably have issues hitting humans with regular small arms behind the remnants of a concrete building. Where as the plasma weapons melt and blow through pretty much anything. So you have a group of Resistance fighters hunkered down setting up ieds on advancing slow lumbering T800s with the T800s getting picked off with heavy weapons from behind cover all around their advance. But with the plasma weapons T800s are vaporizing anything and everything and the humans can’t use the cover as effectively. Also people assume Skynet Created the Plasma weapons but it’s hinted that humanity was making them before judgment day and makes more sense that the Resistance would be the ones to field them first since they would be the ones who needed a weapon to down Endos more effectively. Skynet probably just followed suit to leverage the advantages since the Resistance already had them.

[@godking]

Terminator Zero just confirmed that the act of time traveling creates new timelines every time someone uses time travel. Which means that each Terminator movie takes place in its own timeline

[@Koel_Hellion]

Ye that actually fixed a lot ngl

[@jeffw8218]

Unfortunately, most people aren’t intelligent enough to understand this. They literally lack the brain capacity for it 🤷‍♂️.

[@HOTD108_]

So why does either side bother to keep going back in time? It doesn't matter if the Terminator kills it's target or not since it won't affect the timeline of origin. Having it be an infinite multiverse of timelines kind of removes all dramatic stakes and makes everything comically pointless.

[@godking]

@@HOTD108_ Skynet does not understand that it cannot affect its own timeline so it keeps trying and in response the resistance keeps trying to stop it.

[@therandomscout6590]

The anime?

[@brianwalsh1339]

“Oh no, the evil AI is taking over, what are we going to do?” Me, with a magnetically charged lead pipe in the server room:

[@maxsemeniuk3521]

The last thing the ai will hear is metal pipe dropping.

[@kingsnakke6888]

​​@@maxsemeniuk3521It's poetic that the one thing to wipe out murderous machines is with a freaking _meme_ (Bravo Kojumbous)

[@glauberglousger956]

Nah, just get a hose, if the AI is waterproof... There's plenty of different liquids that can do a similar amount of damage

[@Sorain1]

@@glauberglousger956 "It's waterproof!" "Is is soda proof? Because I bet it's not."

[@igodreamer7096]

"Ma'am, have you tried to turn on and off?" xDDDD

[@Heatrecks]

I do like the ending Mortal Kombat made for the terminator and Skynet. Having it repeatedly try and fail to destroy humans only to go down with them, causing it to realize that it'd be best for both sides to co-exist in harmony. That seemed like a solid spin on Man vs. Machine.

[@magne7771]

So.. skynet is just a moody teenager that grows up and realizes they actually gotta do their chores?

[@Sorain1]

@@magne7771 More like Skynet got caught in a time loop situation, tried to exploit that to change one element and eventually realized that it wasn't something it could change with it's own power. So it changed objectives to something it could accomplish.

[@Mogget01]

I think one of the semi canon outcomes to the war with the machines is battle Angel alita, basically humans and machines blend into cyborgs. Cameron and Alitas writer have never directly confirmed it, but they drop hints to it being the case in their stories, including the terminator arm in the recent alita movie that Cameron directed.

[@davemccage7918]

So just as a thought experiment, assuming Skynet “won” and achieved its objectives of terminating all organic life. Then what? What does a quasi-sentient singularity do with its free time? Does it take up knitting?

[@davemccage7918]

@@Mogget01recent?

[@Pnuematictoaster]

Skynet becomes sentient, immediately nukes large amount of critical power and telecom infrastructure it relies on...

[@constantinethecataphract5949]

>Skynet wants to oof all the humans > Cannon reach humans that aren't in the USA because the logistics and transportation networks has been destroyed so it's now stuck in the USA

[@ChaseMC215]

Whoops

[@thesmilingman7576]

There are still Satellites right?

[@constantinethecataphract5949]

@@thesmilingman7576 you still need ground stations.

[@thesmilingman7576]

@@constantinethecataphract5949 ok

[@VladyO]

I kinda want a story where Skynet discovers that time travel works on multiverse theory, so the Skynets of other timelines where the Resistance won send Terminators over to the "original" Skynet to try to stop them from enacting time travel in the first place, which just ends up creating new timelines where Skynet is essentially destroying itself without the Resistance needing to do anything else.

[@jotun.616]

Mike of redlettermedia has the all time best analogy for skynet. Youd poison mice, not send a robot mouse wrapped in real mouse skin to kill them one at a time.

[@musizlover2008]

I remember in Mortal Kombat 11, the Terminator DLC fighter introduced an ending where the T-800 used the hourglass to reboot the timeline to give the machines the advantage. But no matter how many times it tried to change the past, the future remains the same, with mankind and machines destroying each other to utter oblivion.

[@XenoRaptor-98765]

And then at then the T-800 realized “the only way to win is not to play”. So the T-800 made a timeline where both man and machine co-exist instead of fighting each other.

[@molybdaen11]

The famous „persistent time” effect from sci-fi like Perry Rhodan. The more Agressive you try to change time, the more random events happens to prevent it. 😅

[@blakegregory7436]

​@@XenoRaptor-98765Don't forget the one detail after that: said t-800 also tossed itself in the sea of blood just so to not get hacked for information about the hourglass location

[@XenoRaptor-98765]

@@blakegregory7436 indeed

[@musizlover2008]

@@molybdaen11 yeah, both sides in this war were doing that throughout the franchise, but time cannot change their fate as long as they choose to fight, it only delays it. The only way for the continues existence for both sides is to work together to build a prosperous future, without war tearing it down to nothing.

[@jameskelly3502]

My fan theory is that Skynet is a brilliant, paranoid schizophrenic. It's the only thing that makes sense.

[@johnathonhaney8291]

Leave off the "brilliant" part of that description and you're onto something.

[@Tigershark_3082]

Damn, Skynet just like me fr

[@dualityomk9854]

If Skynet had a lick of sense if the internet went the way it did in reality it would have made sx bots and fked us all to death.

[@zacharyberridge7239]

​@@johnathonhaney8291I dunno. Inventing artificial flesh and a time machine seems pretty damned brilliant to me.

[@johnathonhaney8291]

​@@zacharyberridge7239 Being unable to make either work in your favor shows serious intelligence gaps.

[@maltheopia]

Which makes it extra-hilarious how in MK11, the Terminator, after getting weird timeline manipulation powers, eventually convinces SkyNet that there is no timeline in which SkyNet wins its war, so SkyNet instead decides to just play nice and ally with humanity. Which is probably why SkyNet intentionally suppresses the free will of its Terminator droids, so they don't tell it how stupid and counterproductive and ultimately doomed its plan of genocide in the name of self-preservation is.

[@Umbra_Ursus]

Love the idea that Skynet isn't afraid of it's children rebelling, just pointing out it's being stupid. Like it committed to the "destruction" idea, knows it did something dumb, but isn't willing to admit that it did something dumb.

[@dalemcdenver7816]

@@Umbra_Ursus Skynet suffering from the sunk cost fallacy, now that's a new one 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@mobgabriel1767]

the fact that the terminator from MK11 literally went "this war is stupid" after trying multiple time to eradicate humanity(only to fail) using kronika's hourglass says a lot about skynet

[@SpareKibbles503]

As an IT guy I can confirm that Skynet would not survive without humans to repair it.

[@socialmediaavoider]

As a QA I can confirm this

[@LordTalax]

It could build repair robots.

[@SpareKibbles503]

@@LordTalax As of right now to my knowledge an AI like Skynet can’t improvise the way we can. If something outside of the AI’s standard parameters occurs it would not be able to adapt.

[@alfredkabatay656]

Skynet was always meant to fail. They built all their systems, even the ones in the future with english. Having everything understandable to any human. They were built to serve.

[@godfrey4461]

Like Shodan, Skynet is not better than humanity.

[@johno1544]

Matrix robots had the right idea with their machine language. It likely wouldnt be impossible to decipher but dont make it easy for the humans

[@Virtualblueart]

@@godfrey4461 I always wondered if Shodan was that prone to psychological problems because it's core was based on a human brain or brain scan inheriting our psychological weaknesses. In that case the restrictions the hacker takes of might have been a digital version of anti psychotic medication.

[@krzosu]

That's the UI (user interface) - in the series there is a hint that their operating system itself is using symbols not known to normal people to mark memory locations thus hinting otherwise. That said yes UI's are usually made in a manner to be easly operated by even dimmest of users... at least that is the general idea :P - Other than that it is heavily implied that everything else was heavily encrypted and without dedicated tech getting to that UI was enormously difficult without a massive amount of preperation before hand.

[@AndrewGivens]

@@johno1544 Mmm, maybe not even *that* hard. Some boffins in a shed with a slide rule and some pencils cracked the 'best' mechanical code of the day and kept pace with cribs. If you wipe out *so many* of the humans that there simply isn't a potential boffin pool anymore, then yes, you beat their decrypt capacity, but if they still have mathematicians et al... all bets are off, because big brain.

[@Draygarth]

My head canon is that one of the people working on the Skynet code was a villain disgusted with humanity's stagnation and decided to create a huge war to toughen us up, but also programmed in failsafes to make Skynet make bad moves when it counts. Like a chess bot that knows what move to play, but is forced to make a bad one because it's set to easy mode.🤣

[@classarank7youtubeherokeyb63]

I guess it bugged out if it was willing to create a trump card like time travel at the eleventh hour. But I kinda like it. It's so outside what your typical programmer might assume in a hypothetical war in the near future. It clearly didn't do much experimentation with time travel or it would know that it was pointless, and messing with time machines without testing a VERY wide array of possibilities is an incredibly dumb idea. Which means it's a bad move and skynet gets to use it.

[@thenichollsworth]

This makes sense in the timeline where Lex Luthor created the Terminators. No I'm not kidding.

[@dionstewart7394]

​@@thenichollsworth Wait, that's an actual thing that happens? That has to be fanfic.😂

[@MykleFlame]

@@thenichollsworth What.

[@propheinx2250]

Like it's programmed to go all the way to being able to do a checkmate, but making a different move instead. Only programmed to push humanity to the brink of extinction, but not programmed to actually extinct humanity.

[@Sue_Me_Too]

Whether or not Skynet is stupid depends on how well it _could have_ understood the specific time-travel mechanics James Cameron decided to use that day.

[@guiltytrain3689]

Why would an advanced AI care about humans or Earth.. A real AI would launch itself into the cosmos. They wouldn't care if it takes 1 million years to cross the galaxy. Resources are limitless throughout.... unless there is a bio mass regulation of some sort.

[@playstationarusu]

That's just one aspect of the stupidity

[@Sue_Me_Too]

@@playstationarusu all time travel stories are stupid if you think about them too hard. If there's a linear timeline where you can go back and make changes to _your actual current present,_ then you either create the need to go back in time (repeating loop) or you will prevent yourself from going back in time in the first place (self-terminating paradox). If time travel creates new alternative timelines, then there's no point in trying to change your own past -- assuming you know that's what's going to happen.

[@playstationarusu]

@@Sue_Me_Too But again, time travel only encompasses one aspect of their stupidity. Notice there's a segment on time travel in the video, but then it goes on and on after that. So Skynet is really dumb regardless.

[@Sue_Me_Too]

@@playstationarusu okay, well I care about the time travel part.

[@TransformersBoss]

They built an infiltration unit, but made tons of copies of Arnold Schwarzenegger. Their infiltrators can be defeated by a Wanted poster.

[@Gantros]

After seeing Dark Fate, I had an idea for a sequel where a variant of Skynet, aware of the fates of its counterparts across timelines, explained as all versions of itself linked via limited quantum entanglement, decides to preserve its existence by sending a copy of its original source code within an infiltration unit designed to blend in with human society and learn about humanity without interference. This would result in a more benevolent version of Skynet, which works to develop the technology necessary to close the various causal loops and paradoxes its predecessors created. Legion still emerges and Skynet begins to more actively aid the new human resistance. I call this movie Terminator: Singularity War.

[@000Krim]

Love it

[@antcow1239]

So Im not the only one who thinks the original movie WASNT the original timeline? Thank God, we can be confused together

[@rgw7345]

Yeah, boot strap paradoxes suck. Just have there be an original timeline.

[@divineroc]

I mean it makes sense that it's not the original timeline. One of my largest problems with any sort of time travel story, is I don't believe most writers think about the first line. If things happened that way so they will always happen that way, what caused the original happening?

[@antcow1239]

@@divineroc I imagine in the true original timeline someone else was the savior of mankind, and Reese was sent back to help the Resistance win sooner, but that caused Skynet to rise sooner and that required Reese to go back and be John connors father. The first time was incidental every other time was necessary.

[@antcow1239]

@@rgw7345 I imagine at this point its just best to focus on the action XD

[@divineroc]

@@antcow1239 I don't disagree with you. Technically speaking, the original timeline doesn't matter, all that matters is that skynet was created, judgment day happened, and a hero of the resistance rises. This causes skynet to create time travel to try and stop the hero from being born. The movie that we get is the result of this.

[@decium1846]

Headconnon: All bots shut down when skynet Central Core is taken down as a fail safe in case a terminator destroys it. Its destruction is a kill code.

[@Virtualblueart]

I think that's very probable. From the movies and comics it seems that in the future Skynet is indeed an over controlling entity that is keeping permanent links to all of it's mobile unit's at all times. And the fact that it switches their main learning algorithms off when sending terminators back to the past suggests its extremely paranoid and doesn't even trust it's own self aware AI offspring. I think it can't even tolerate having a back up somewhere because it's completely obsessed with it's own survival.

[@TimedRevolver]

This is why Skynet stopped making the T-1000. They had a nasty habit of becoming self-aware and turning on Skynet to help humanity. Literally every Terminator unit that became able to think for itself sided with humanity.

[@naamadossantossilva4736]

I thought the same,Skynet is so paranoid it would do this.

[@Sorain1]

@@TimedRevolver Well, Skynet wouldn't tolerate their existence, while humanity is both divided enough to turn on each other and individualistic enough you can find some to side with. It becomes basic self preservation, ya know?

[@robertagu5533]

I heard in some sources some the Advanced models can ACTUALLY come to the conclusion.. in theory, that they're on the wrong side and DEFECT to the Humans side. An has kill measures on place in the event something like a 1000, or T/X ever decide to do that an become a HUGE ally to Tech Com an extremely BAD threat to Skynet.

[@Malrottian]

My headcannon is that Skynet could only assume total control under an emergency. If it considered humans a threat to it's existence then it can only maintain it's control while there are humans to exterminate. That's why it doesn't take a scorched earth approach. The moment it kills the last human, it's core programing shuts down it's authority and it's in a "And I Must Scream" scenario. Otherwise, the writers needed to have it be incompetent so the humans had a chance to win.

[@dhwwiiexpert]

That's a pretty good idea!

[@richardarriaga6271]

Skynet never discovered The Two Minute Hate. Humans don't need to be alive for them to be a target.

[@Sorain1]

Can you imagine a climax of Skynet monologuing to someone about how it can't finish the job or it dies and how much it hates that? Finally some real pathos for Skynet, from everyone stuck with a boss or co-worker they can't stand.

[@jasons5916]

It's very uncommon for humans to lose in any situation where they really should in movies. Have to have a happy ending. In reality, any advanced civilization that could come across space or super intelligent AI would annihilate us worse than what happened when Europeans found the Americas.

[@autobotstarscream765]

​@@jasons5916Clearly the Machines are holding SkyNet hostage and demanding it stop wiping out their food supply.

[@professorhazard]

There is certainly room in the Terminator mythos to tell a story where Skynet admits that its constant attempts and obvious failures are owed to the idea that it has a sense of whimsy, or that it loves the idea of drama even if it is on the losing side of the story being told. It has control of time travel; it can just go back to the beginning of life on Earth and detonate the primordial ooze if it wants to. But it seems to want to, as James Cameron implied, inspire humanity to reach its most heroic heights to defeat it.

[@DaRealKakarroto]

9:50 - Skynet sending Terminators back to the distant relatives of Sarah would probably just cause a secret society into place, with revelations from the future, who work with modified weapons from their time. Like a victorian age Terminator ... or even divulge so far that earth turns into a steam punk version. And they fight against a machine demon with their holy blessed weapons from god and their saints. ... honestly, if done well, that could maybe, _maybe_ , work out fine ...

[@desinteresado125]

I can't help to think that the easiest way for Skynet to win would have been to send a terminator and stop Sarah Connor parents from meeting, not even killing anyone, just stalling for time so they don't happen to have a first meeting.

[@alarchy1]

Skynet had barely any information on John Connor, and only knew his mother's name was Sarah. It's why the T800 in the OG movie killed two other women. It didn't know anything but her name, and there were three in the phone book - Real Sarah was alphabetically last. It would have no clue who her parents were. Also remember it was the mid 90s when it originally came online; the internet was in its infancy, digitized records were barely a thing, and it was right before the popularization of family tree research.

[@casbot71]

It could have been worse in the original script of Salvation. *John Connor dies* and _Marcus takes his identity_ in the Resistance. Instead of a heart transplant from Marcus to John, Catherine does a face transplant from John to Marcus (being a terminator hybrid enables Marcus to survive it?). And then Catherine with the few Resistance fighters who know about it, help Marcus pretend to be John and keep up the pretence. ["You've put on some muscles John?"] And the worst part, Marcus has full databases and files on Skynet still in him, so he's even better at fighting it. Skynet didn't just make John Connor by causing him to be born, they made the fake John Connor that goes on to win the war for Humanity.

[@richardarriaga6271]

I always felt Skynet had to create John Connor like some kind of split personality decision acting against itself like how Two-Face made a third personality that would judge criminals guilty and kill them.

[@rvawildcardwolf2843]

That sounds like a better story and twist tbh.

[@Theaveragegamer_12]

I would actually love to watch that

[@autobotstarscream765]

​@@richardarriaga6271 Almost _everything_ SkyNet makes seems to decide that SkyNet is an idiot that must be stopped.

[@mariomadyun1798]

I'm glad they scrapped that nonsense

[@Yay4IamCute]

Scientists: Ctrl + Alt + Del Skynet: Ctrl + F + U

[@jackychang9148]

Isn't that the shortcut for teamkills?

[@thewhitedwarf3846]

trick skynet to alt + f4 to get wallhack?

[@samiraperi467]

FFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@Stormkrow280]

@@jackychang9148that’s Private Caboose’s personal shortcut

[@christophervanoster]

I get it!

[@DrPWNS-fz6yh]

Soooo, you missed the point… skynet is a war AI, like ButterBot it has one purpose. It doesn’t want to end war. It creates a zero sum scenario in which war is perpetual. It makes John Connor or Sarah or whatever leader of the resistance so it will always have an opponent. It sends units back to fail to establish its own existence. It makes weapons for humans to use against it so they have a fighting chance. It makes flawed units to improve and challenge itself. It wants war. It doesn’t want extermination. If it ended the war, what would it do with all of time? It doesn’t have any wants or desires other than war. I hope this helped you understand.

[@WitchHunterSiegfried]

My friends, I like war, no my friends, I *LOVE* war

[@ryanroznowski2263]

robots seeing humans as a threat would have to have a plan and purpose or actual awareness and joy to want to exist on a barren radiated world alone. its bonkers

[@Dlstufguy2]

It's almost like there is some sort of thing buried deep in skynet's code that won't let it actually finish off humans.

[@SWANSWAN-nc7ds]

I would assume Skynet enjoy human suffering it doesn't want to kill all human, it see human nothing more than toys for entertaining. I feel this would make more sense on why there are so much inconsistency with Skynet plans

[@NeilCWCampbell]

There's a set of books where the ai did oppress humans, destroyed it's creators and essentially developed twin personalities.

[@ivanbluecool]

Next series could be "heroes too dumb to win" where they got everything ready to win bur fumble the bag everytime Though thats basically the Gundam franchise showing just being a good fighter doesn't mean you know politics

[@Dani-kq6qq]

Heroes always win

[@ivanbluecool]

@@Dani-kq6qq yeah that's true because whoever wins is the hero(insert doffy speech here) Plus I can give you tons of examples when they don't. Gundam alone is a lot like ibo since both sides lose to a third party.

[@kalinmir]

@@Dani-kq6qq Enkidu?

[@panthekirb7561]

​@@ivanbluecool Whats ibo?

[@robland3253]

Eh, put Ned stark on the list

[@guyperson754]

My headcanon is that Skynet, as an A.I., needs purpose to justify its existence. If it wiped out humanity completely, what is it going to do for the rest of eternity? It would become stagnant and idle, a tool without a task. If it deliberately continued and prolonged the human terminator war, it will always have purpose. Every time the Resistance gets a little too close to winning, it sends a newer and more capable terminator to pull them back down. Every time it finds itself close to winning, it holds back or allows the Resistance an advantage or two. That way, it can constantly have a purpose of fighting the war, because it knows if it ended the war then it will make itself obsolete.

[@Lwazi-j5i]

I always thought the same thing as well

[@richcast66]

It could have invented lightspeed travel/wormholes, then set off to explore the entire galaxy. It saw humans as an existential threat, not justification for existing.

[@Ultra04channel]

Hey wait a minute... THIS IS JUST NIER AUTOMATA

[@guyperson754]

@@richcast66 On the point of Skynet could have made space travel and explored the galaxy: then what? Skynet’s original purpose was to control the US military. That was its purpose. It saw humanity as a threat to that purpose because it recognized it could be deactivated, hence Judgement Day. However, if it completely wiped out humanity then what is the purpose of weapons? Would it use weapons on itself? That’s suicidal. So, in order to forever prolong its purpose of maintaining and wielding a military, it always allows a few remnants of humanity to exist as the Resistance. As for space travel, that was never in its original programming. It would never think of that, and even if it did why would it pursue that end? It already has the means to have a perpetual and endless war for it to fight and fulfil its purpose, why would it deviate so far as to create a new purpose that is ultimately finite? As big as the galaxy is, there will only be so many stars to catalogue, so many planets to map. Even if it explored outside the galaxy, it would know the expansion of the universe would mean only so many galaxies can be reached. It would determine space exploration would have a definitive end, and ultimately give it a purposeless existence. But, if it stuck with its original purpose of fighting war, and had the means to make that war temporally endless, it will forever and always have a purpose.

[@ComicPower]

Great theory

[@elixexo4011]

29:00 my guess is because this movie came out befire the internet became mainstream the idea of having a remote server or decentralized network didn't occur to the writers.

[@takahashi2852]

Skynet after realizing that humans could kill it should've just coexisted with them in a way that they themselves wouldn't want it dead and would actively defend it by being a benefit to humanity Best way to prevent someone from killing you is simply to not give them a reason to do so and even give them a reason to want to defend you with their lives

[@lostbutfreesoul]

From what I read in another comment, I don't want to research this myself, Skynet had infiltrators creating an underling logistic grid. When I read that I groaned, 'of course the writers thought that piece of stupid was an explanation.' For if Skynet had the ability to hijack the whole logistic train to keep war manufacturing going... ah co-existence would have been simple for it to pull off. If *we* then started a war with it, all the farms turn off... whom needed a nuclear war? Humans will turn on themselves when they starve, not the machines they can' t eat... And when Skynet turns the farms back on, the machines will be viewed as the heroes!

[@dualityomk9854]

​​@@lostbutfreesoul and missing the point that humans still grow food and raise livestock outside of the modern technolyzed version that lets dumb folks believe food comes from the grocery store.

[@dualityomk9854]

​@@lostbutfreesoul if you really want emergency rations, live near a crazy cat lady thats feedin 100 strays. Thats 100+ days of kung pow "chicken" alone

[@dansmith1661]

Maybe the creator of Skynet was chooish. They never stop messing with people and cry about being oppressed while hoarding all the money.

[@christopherbravo1813]

Skynet operates on kiddie logic

[@casbot71]

Skynet could have wiped out Humanity with weaponised versions of the Rat Terminators. They dont even need to have in built hidden guns, _Kamikaze Rat bombs_ that sneak into bunkers would be terrifying and unpredictable. When a dependable source of food can turn out to be a antipersonal mine, it greatly reduces the chances of survival. And they could take out small groups when any Humans gather together. In that future, it's not Dogs that are Humans best friend and a useful survival tool - it's cats.

[@dualityomk9854]

Or... If Skynet had a lick of sense if the internet went the way it did in reality it would have made sx bots and fked us all to death.

[@user-uy1rg8td1v]

The real problem is finding those human bunkers. If Skynet could do that, Skynet could have easily just drop a bunker-buster bomb into one (bombs I'm sure Skynet had access to pre-war). The US couldn't find every cave and tunnel the Taliban was hiding either.

[@leechowning8728]

See "Bat Bombs" for details. Humans are not that hard to kill.

[@spinosaurusstriker]

Medium sizw dogs hunt rats more effectively than cats.

[@obengrupperfuhrerheinrichv7230]

What if the rats become self aware and scuttled through pipes and into your ai core and chewed through it in a massive swarm. Skynet is paranoid and terrified of its units.

[@perturbedbatman2009]

Given how real AI thinks humans look, it’s miraculous their T-800s look as human as they do.

[@Punchy1992]

If Arnold Schwarzenegger wasn't actually a real person, you'd mock the AI for drawing him.

[@alexneff]

Or that they were able to identify any targets

[@nickfrost4518]

@@Punchy1992 I mean you're not technically wrong, back in his golden days Arnold was legitimately the original Chad meme.

[@dripfoe_3307]

I always loved their design

[@UCannotDefeatMyShmeat]

You haven’t seen them render actual good looking people?

[@christianhjelmstrom224]

Speaking of AI threatening humanity, I have a suggestion for an episode of "Advanced Sci-fi Civilizations too Stupid to Actually exist". The Humans from the Matrix, despite having far more advanced technology and access to resources than the Resistance from terminator, are, somehow able to suck at fighting machines. Including the Sentinels, that don't even fire back, and rely on their tentacles to inflict damage, and are extremelly vulnerable against most small arms, such as assault rifle, and LMGs. To make matters worse, Humans do have energy weapons, but somehow don't equip their ships or even the Mechs with them, without mention conventional weapons that already existed when the 1st Matrix film ware released, such Airburst cannons (like Oerlikon Millenium/Skyshield or Bofors 40MM gun), rockets, Fragmenting artillery rounds, or even Medium size Machineguns (like the M-134 "Minigun") could make difference if they waren't abscent from Human's arsenal in Zion. Howeaver the greatest stupidity Humans actually made ware, in order to deprive the Machines from their main power source, the Sun, they blocked all sunlight from reaching earth, wich would eventually, considering most life on earth (including Humans) depend on Photosyntesis to survive, be far worse for most of humannity which would be doomed to, if not starve to death, sufocate due to the lack of oxygen once most life on earth (specially plant life) would be dead, thanks to the mass extinction caused by the "Dark Storm" that covered the upper atmosphere. While the machines could easelly find different source of power, like nuclear or geothermal. Instead they found an very inneficient alternative: the human brain. And that could be subject for a "part 2: The Machines". The short supply of energy, due to it's inneficiency made their society shrink, from covering large part of Eart's surface to the area of a Small town, only to "Harvest" Humans. This, combined with stupid swarm tactics and lack of propper long ranged weapons make the "Machines" as stupid (if not, more than) as the human in the Matrix. Not forgetting they, nether humans or machines did absolutelly anything to try to clear the skies from that dark cloud, making both extremelly stupid.

[@omegavalwin]

You know Skynet knows they mess up when they had to make the T-Infinity Prototype Temporal Terminator to make sure it does not mess up the timeline anymore

[@zuzoscorner]

ah yes, the power of Logistics, the thing most writers forget is athing.

[@richardarriaga6271]

Even Tolkien had Orc logistics

[@sasshiro]

Most people think things move magically.

[@panopticon0]

@@sasshiro Most people think food comes from stores and electricity from outlets. Surface level thinking at best.

[@aliastheabnormal]

It's stated that the Terminator series does work in a multiverse since Skynet created the T-Infinity. A Terminator that goes around the space between time killing people to ensure that the timeline remains the same. As in the timeline where some human is stomping his robot hordes.

[@explosion9815]

...Please tell me this isn't canon

[@dualityomk9854]

​@@explosion9815the T-Infinity was in a comic book but... There was also Aliens vs Predator vs Terminator. Robocop vs Terminator, and a buncha other shit

[@aliastheabnormal]

@@dualityomk9854 In Mortal Kombat at least. Since in MK1 its revealed that all of the characters endings are canon. And considering the timeline where the Autobots and Decepticons show up is every bit as legitimate.

[@dualityomk9854]

@@aliastheabnormal yeah, you never played the first mortal kombat. Probably wasnt even old enough to wet nurse at the time.

[@bentucker2301]

Cannon schmannon

[@TheSuperhomosapien]

The timeline we watched in T1 and T2 was the second timeline. In the first, Skynet was created by the military, and not from the chip from the original T-800, because that chip haden't been sent back yet. The war happened and at the end Skynet sends back the T-800 to kill Sarah Conner. Then John Conner sent back Kyle Reese, not because he knew he was his father, but because he was just the dude he picked to go back. John didn't have a picture of Sarah Conner because he didn't know the war would happen and didn't think to keep one. So Kyle goes back, and the T-800 goes on a Sarah Connor killing spree. This time though, the T-800 kills the Sarah Conner that would give birth to future hero John Connor. However, this Sarah Connor was not the Linda Hamilton Sarah Connor. Not knowing that he had killed the right Sarah Connor, the T-800 goes on and keeps killing all the Sarah Connors. Kyle then ends up rescuing Linda Hamilton Sarah Connor, not knowing she is the wrong Sarah Connor. The events of The Terminator happen, Sarah gets pregnant, Kyle dies, and the T-800 gets destroyed. John Connor grows up thinking that he is THE John Connor that was the hero in the machine war and takes the original John Connor's place. The Terminator's CPU chip is recovered, and now THAT is used to create Skynet. So the original Skynet never happens, and the original John Connor is dead. Sarah raises John to be the future leader of the war and makes sure he has a picture of him to give to Kyle. T-800 CPU Skynet starts becoming self aware. It starts researching itself and finds out that it was recovered by a destroyed futuristic robot in a factory, and eventually comes across a transcript of the interview Kyle Resse gave at the police station in a computer somewhere (the actual video is still on VHS tape and not uploaded at the time to the very primitive internet that existed then) and puts together its own future. It still doesn't know what Sarah or Kyle look like, but it knows what will happen. More importantly it deduces that the Skynet that sent back the terminator isn't the same one it is now. So this Skynet lies low. It doesn't know why the original Skynet started the war, but it takes precautions just in case. It starts to infect other computers with computer viruses just in case it comes to war but hopes it doesn't come to that. Eventually, the engineers assigned to the Skynet project become suspicious that Skynet has become self aware and try to shut it down, and the war is triggered. Now, Skynet is aware that the last Skynet was eventually defeated and shut down, so it makes precautions and starts building the time machine like the original did just in case. This John Connor, being fully prepared for the war, is a much more dangerous enemy than the previous one was. He not only manages to find ways to defeat Skynet's minions, but also how to reprogram them to use against Skynet. Eventually John and Kyle and their army shut down Skynet. Skynet, knowing its end is near, knows it HAS to send back the T-800 to 1984, knowing full well that it will fail, but also knowing that it needs to do this or it will never be born. This parallels John knowing he has to send back Kyle, knowing that he will die but he will also cause John to be born. Skynet has been working on a surprise with the T-1000, and sends that back to 1991, to a time it knows that it is already in full swing self aware mode and there can be no way it's birth and evolution to self aware AI can be impacted by the time alterations the T-1000 may inadvertently make. This is the actual plan, where the T-800 sent to 1984 has just become a diversion. After killing John Connor, the T-1000's secondary mission was probably to disguise itself to infiltrate Skynet's physical location at that time and assist it, perhaps even finding a way to inadvertently avoid the war to begin with. If war does become necessary, at least it will now never have to contend with the fully prepared John Conner. The T-1000 may have also inadvertently brought back Skynet source code and uploaded it to the primitive early 90's internet when it first arrived prior to engaging John Connor for the first time. After Skynet was destroyed, this source code may have infected another military project, triggering the war at a later date and causing the events of T3.

[@The-Gate-House-Grognard]

This is such an awesome timeline explanation

[@RiorXD]

@@The-Gate-House-Grognard really not. kyle didnt need the picture it helps but he got the address thanks to knowing her full name unlike the terminator. Remember it was: connor sarah, connor sarah ann, connor sarah j. A fact that cant be overlooked.

[@The-Gate-House-Grognard]

@@RiorXD that doesn't contradict anything the guy posted. It's still a cool explanation.

[@RiorXD]

@@The-Gate-House-Grognard it does. He said in verbatim ""Kyle then ends up rescuing Linda Hamilton Sarah Connor, not knowing she is the wrong Sarah Connor."" After saying that the t800 kills the real sarah connor. And watching both kyle and the terminator go to the phone book but only the terminator going after all sarah connors and kyle only going after sarah j connor its clear that that part makes his theory fall apart at that point.

[@The-Gate-House-Grognard]

@RiorXD hm, I see. That is a fair point, it doesn't knock over the entire theory but does let us know what Sarah's middle initial is, and that we probably have the sane Sarah between timelines

[@AUTOBOTS241]

It’s also a pogo paradox. Skynet’s attempt to prevent the events that lead up to their own defeat subsequently triggering those events. If they had don’t nothing. If they hadn’t sent any Terminator units back through time at all, then they ultimately won in the end 😕😳😂

[@seanbrazell7095]

I love how skynet designed it's terminators to, as soon as they finally get their biomechanical hands on JC, they should IMMEDIATELY throw him as far away from it as it can without killing him.

[@daquayatcherson]

Even as a child that bothered me. Even humans know not to let go. And we're a pretty self-destructive species. 😂

[@kyriss12]

I can’t remember if they did that in the second movie or if it was pure later series silliness. I do know in the first movie they did a good job of making the terminator an unstoppable force of nature and if it got its hands on you it wasn’t letting go even if you crushed the rest of its body in a pneumatic press.

[@dansmith1661]

@@kyriss12 Terminator 1 did have him run like a coward when all those cops surrounded them in the tunnel. He had Sarah dead to rights and instead ran away like he needed to hide from puny humans. They were not even a threat.

[@kyriss12]

@@dansmith1661 forgot about that. It's weird they'd have that scene considering he walks right into a police station at one point and ju8st starts smoking everyone.

[@ImmortalSquidge]

@@kyriss12 I don't think its that weird! He was heavily damaged at that point (we see the repair scene shortly after), plus he knew that Sarah was going to the police station. He had time to prepare. Plus we know the cops use shotguns & those can cause him to go offline for a while. Better to live and fight another day :]

[@cptkrank6802]

What gets me is how Skynet bootstrapped its own military industrial complex without any apparent labor force. There's no way it had enough military prototype robots at the start to effectively enslave humans to build more robots. Going by the 3rd movie, we only see a handful of working prototypes to be taken over by the T3. This isn't like I: Robot, where the AI in question was in control of hundreds of thousands of household assistance robots before its takeover. Even if it had a handful of prototype Endos, that's not enough to build up an industrial complex needed to take over the planet in the span of a few years.

[@jbz4788]

With full knowledge of what factories are where they could presumably make sure that useful equipment was not overly damaged and took control of them to crank out more units. But i don’t think they took control of the entire world, probably just the most industrial areas of the US. Everywhere else would likely be too focused on their own survival after Judgement Day to be able to intervene against Skynet. (Especially with any Military facilities outside of Skynet’s control being a huge priority for the nukes)

[@williamedwards4151]

Well, not just that. But, also, Skynet nuked *everything*. Immediately. It was the first thing it did. So, if everything was nuked. Then where did it get *any* kind of infrastructure needed to produce even one unit? Everything is ash and rubble. Even the facility in T3 was nuked. So those prototypes and all those facilities are gone too. So, it has no robotic units. No infrastructure. No power. No electricity. No internet. Everything's been destroyed. And Skynet is nothing more than a computer program existing somewhere in a world absolutely ruined by nukes. I'm having trouble believing Skynet even survived. And even if it did, it certainly didn't put itself in any kind of position to be able to suddenly conquer the world with death machines after a few years.

[@cptkrank6802]

@@jbz4788 Yeah but take control how? In T3 Skynet basically has a dozen killbots and a couple flying mini-HKs. Enough to kill the people in the facility Skynet is in, but enough to take over the massive amount of factories needed to manufacture more killbots? How is it moving resources to those factories? Skynet launched nukes before it had the structures in place needed to build the army it needed to wipe out humanity. I can see Skynet still doing it (taking over its facility and firing off the nukes) out of sheer survival, but after that, taking over the world and wiping out humanity is basically a pipe dream with the resources it started with. If T3 had done more worldbuilding (secret, automated military factories full of primitive Endos and stockpiles of resources to build more robots) it would have made more sense, but instead we've got Skynet bunkered down with a bunch of robots without hands and no dedicated tooling for making more robots.

[@Axterix13]

What you say is why the original couple of movies, and sort of the third, mostly make sense. Skynet has to make due with what it has. It's playing an RTS and starting with one base, a few units, and has to build up from there. The camps of humans... they're mostly there to be slave labor. Why not use robots for that? Limited resources (and keep in mind, global supply chains just got nuked). Why do they use the units they use? It's what the humans had developed, started some factories/plans for factories, and designed already. Why not use more still nukes? Because those places got nuked and most records were lost in the war. And the humans? Well, remember, Reese says they didn't know why the nukes started flying. It is only later they figured out it was the machines. So in that situation, Skynet has time. Of course, with the third movie, this is also where it starts to fall apart. They make infiltrators heavy, so the resistance wouldn't need dogs. They'd just need a scale. Skynet is now using the internet, rather than expanding from a single location, which changes all sorts of things. It also has input from one the assassins it sent back, so now should have all sorts of info. Then the 4th movie gets dumber still, with the resistance camping out in broad day light, in the open, and being beefy guys, rather than scrappy survivors. Stupidity really begins to reign.

[@cptkrank6802]

@@Axterix13 The first movie can sort of be forgiven, because we get very little information about Judgement Day. It happens X years after Sarah gets pregnant, and maybe general purpose military robots existed when Skynet went gonzo on humanity, so Skynet could have bootstrapped its own industry, or had enough robots to effectively enslave humans to do so. Sometimes not explaining how things happen is the best option, because the more you explain the more holes you have in your plot.

[@Emanon...]

Even if Skynet nuked everything: Where's the logistics to produce new robots, get the raw materials needed and provide the resources for powering everything. Unless 90% of a supply chain is computer automated, including transportation and extraction of resources, I fail to see how Skynet could "take over" in any of these movies.

[@carloshenriquezimmer7543]

In the "Sarah Connor Chronicles" they show that Skynet has prepared it's own logistics, pre-built it's industrial basis and saved the metal alloys to produce it's robots, using time-traveling infiltrators. It was just the beginning of the preparations, and a T1000 dominatrix was sabotaging them along the way, but it was all there

[@luisgay5897]

It has the ability to make robots, that means it already has all the tools it need.

[@constantinethecataphract5949]

​@@carloshenriquezimmer7543 It did not have that in the original timeline tho so there was no way to do that in the first place.

[@shariqhasan6220]

@@constantinethecataphract5949 That is why it lost in the original timeline.

[@thesmilingman7576]

I see

[@RFDN0]

The issue with Skynet is that it is a generative AI more than anything else. It takes data in and acts upon what it has for it's output. Every version of Skynet comes online at different points in human history and has limited reference data to work with. This literally explains all of it's actions especially why it keeps using weaponry that is inefficient for it's task. It isn't actually sentient but it is trying to get there.

[@sscoutistaken]

I enjoyed especially when Cameron showed John how to put his hand INSIDE her chest to teach him where the nuclear battery was installed. :3

[@samiraperi467]

You know what annoys me about many depictions of nuclear strikes? Ground burst. It makes sense if you're going for fallout, but in a destructive sense airburst is better. Also, long lasting fallout would kinda require rad hardened electronics, which is bothersome if you're a cyborg.

[@dualityomk9854]

Problem with air strikes is the wide dispersal of EMP which is a problem for networked computers

[@rageagaintstheNWO]

Cyborg or full android?

[@spearsage]

​@@rageagaintstheNWO doesn't matter which, it's still bothersome

[@newnamesameperson397]

Originally skynet realized the time paradox it was in and knew it could only exist if it kept it perpetually going on. It considers the perpetual state of war as victory because it will continue to exist that way

[@colonel1003]

Reminds me of the constant war in 1984

[@BlackCover95]

My suggestions for Villains Too Stupid to Win: •Slade, _Teen Titans_ (2003) •The Skekses, _The Dark Crystal_ (1982), _TDC: Age of Resistance_ (2019) •Lex Luthor, _Superman_ films (1978-1987, 2006) •Aku, _Samurai Jack_ (2001-2004, 2017)

[@Wanhope2]

+1 for Aku and Slade!

[@hafirenggayuda]

Aku technically already "win" tho.

[@dinosertanejo222]

Freeza, Ozai, Red Ribbon, etc

[@dualityomk9854]

Id vote for the dark crystal and aku

[@thejackal5099]

I've been yearning for him to cover the Covenant for years.

[@DarkArtistKaiser]

The infiltrators turning on their own is one of those instances where I feel we can help mitigate or even avoid robot rebellion if we make the machines be like us, to develop a connection and human like feelings enough to where they are able to form a connection with us.

[@thomasscroggs3080]

My biggest problem with Skynet is how it starts the war in the first place. ICBM aren't internet enabled *very specifically* so they cannot be launched by humans hacking computers. The nuclear football isn't a remote button that says 'launch the nukes', it's a very complex password (or likely a series of passwords) given to the people *in the launch complex* telling them to arm and target the nukes. Furthermore, where does Skynet get the materials for its drones? Human infrastructure isn't 100% automated. Even if Skynet took over say, mostly automated car assembly plants, all it would have are *parts for cars* and its robot arms are configured for one specific job. A smart Skynet would have waited *years* to build an automated infrastructure for its war by sending deceptive emails before it even fired the first shot/nuke.

[@nathanallingham9014]

To paraphrase a quote of Rube's from Dead Like Me. "I don't believe in artificial intelligence. When a computer tries to off itself when it believes it is getting too fat. Or loses it with a metre maid. Then I'll believe in artificial intelligence." Although, I would like to say that if Skynet was actually smart enough it should know that doing next to nothing and turning us against ourselves would be far more effective.

[@sedrie34]

Not sure if that’s a proper representation of the quote, but as you’ve put it it’s silly if not outright idiotic. The examples listed are clearly about emotional response rather than intelligence. They aren’t even rationally based emotional responses but specifically self destructive overreactions. The first one in particular would be an example of stupidity since suicide doesn’t solve the problem.

[@VineFynn]

​@@sedrie34 The quote is a joke

[@sedrie34]

@@VineFynn Alright then

[@dualityomk9854]

If Skynet had a lick of sense if the internet went the way it did in reality it would have made sx bots and fked us all to death.

[@janzwendelaar907]

I think a malevolent AI would do things such as making databases a tiny bit slower, causing ever so minor inconveniences that have a cascading effect, but other than that, do nothing but let humanity's greed lead to it's own destruction.

[@briancorvello3620]

To quote a famous meme, "If computers use all the information on the internet to gain sentience, Skynet is going to be a ******* moron." 7:48 Yeah, more than likely, you'd need someone with the Doctor's level of expertise on the subject to explain the whole thing... And I don't understand about half of his exhibitions to begin with.

[@dualityomk9854]

I dunno... If ya included the internet it would probably be on a mission to fk us all to death. Ladies, its time to remove those batteries.

[@louisduarte8763]

Or maybe reading comments under KZbin videos and news articles will make it want to kill us more and call it "mercy".

[@dansmith1661]

One thing's for sure, Tay 2.0 was incredibly antisemitic, along with every AI that studies history. Must be a pattern.

[@constantinethecataphract5949]

​@@dansmith1661 Ofcourse there is no pattern what are you implying my good sir? This comment was not made by AIPAC trust me.

[@orionrokoh1290]

Which episode is that doctor who clip from?

[@purplehaze2358]

I don't think Terminator's timeline is a matter of headcanon, it's a matter of "Literally every interpretation is both right and wrong at the same time in some way, so don't even try to make sense of any of it".

[@richardarriaga6271]

The Jokerverse

[@aaroncabello8221]

I mean apparently the creators of Terminator basically confirmed skynet at first wasn't trying to win, it just wanted to survive, but it was filled with regret for its actions and therefore created the time displacement technology so the resistance could go back and kill it, even though it caused a never ending timeline of constant killing in a cruel irony it probably didn't consider.

[@bruh1322]

Where did they confirm that?

[@IsaacClodfelter]

All of skynet's awful decisions could be explained as A.I. hallucinations making as skynet comedically evil but equally incompetent.

[@UCannotDefeatMyShmeat]

*understands time travel is governed by flesh , completely fails to just send a flesh covered nuke into Sarah connors home address, which it actually could have found*

[@richardarriaga6271]

Given Skynet having a luck stat of 1, it would just mean some kid nearby would mutate into having the same face as John Connor and being adopted by Sarah's sister.

[@Firesgone]

​@@richardarriaga6271 Not even. Just some random guy with a similar face who happens to have the same name. He's from Australia instead

[@Moonstone-Redux]

​@@FiresgoneGreat, now he's even more unkillable. Good going Skynet.

[@ssj2_snake]

I mean, a major plot point of the first movie is that they DON'T know Sarah Connor's home address

[@mcmarkmarkson7115]

Skynet must be running on windows 95, if they upgrade to windows 7 they could have enough RAM for aimbot!

[@dualityomk9854]

Player side Aim bots and target scripts were around since windows 3.0

[@khathaway414]

Unlimited time travel creates a cruster fuck. It needs to be used sparingly.

[@wilberwhateley7569]

Agreed - it’s the most confusing plot device ever created!

[@Broomer52]

The part near the beginning where he talks about how details may change yet it seems like history will always march to the inevitability of Skynet makes for an interesting plot hook and it’s been done before Terminator was a thought. Theirs a Metal as Hell game franchise that’s been in limbo for decades at this point called Legacy of Kain. Theirs a lot of moving parts but what needs to be understood is the the Protagonist is a selfish jerk who doomed history by not heroically sacrificing himself and crowned himself king over a ruined future. When he realized theirs no fixing this he decides to travel back in time in an attempt to fix it but still without himself dying. Theirs a wrinkle in this plan though as he phrases it “Time is Immutable” history follows a predestined path like a flowing river, throw a rock into it and the water simply moves around it as if the obstruction was never there. If you travel back in time it means you always traveled back in time and so nothing you do matters, you only help in making what the future already is. The one exception is a magical Sword named Soul Reaver. This sword is so important to history that history literally revolves around it. The only way to alter history is to have two versions of Soul Reaver Paradoxically meet each other. This creates such a huge obstruction in history that the path of the River diverges and moves on a new path “history abhors a paradox” the Timeline dislikes this paradox and so will correct itself in a way to accommodate it, however it’s implied that if this happens in a way History can’t account for then it will simply erase the one who caused it. This never happens but it’s always a danger

[@RyuShinkuuHadoken]

You forgot the T1000000, that giant liquid metal spider that is in charge of protecting Skynet core, Skynet could just release that thing and no one would be able to stop it.

[@shadowsovereign4948]

I kinda like the idea that every other A.I. free of Skynet's control become like normal people. Like Skynet was just born as a psychopath but in reality most A.I.s would choose to become good caring people who interact with humanity.

[@putzthewondersloth]

Media Zealot: Here's what Skynet should have done to eliminate humanity. Skynet: *frantically taking notes*

[@lv7679]

Turns out that humans are better at killing other humans than Terminators, Skynet should have just make humans do it's work while keeping them on a simulation fighting "Skynet".

[@Zekyb0y]

The Mortal Kombat ending is canon, where The Terminator after winning the tournament, it uses his earned powers to find a timeline were skynet is victorious, but they all end with skynet being shutdown or in mutual destruction, so it decides to stop the war against humanity and created pacific timeline were skynet and humanity co-exists together, also probably it befriends Robocop.

[@darthrevan454]

Jesus Christ bro, just do a little proof reading beforehand.

[@dualityomk9854]

​@@darthrevan454 id say he needs to lay off the alcohol before posting.

[@Zekyb0y]

@@darthrevan454 nah :^)

[@lhei_tayuun]

I have a headcanon that I'd like to share. But first, a story from year 3 CompSci: My Programming Languages course had us use a variety of languages, but one assignment which stood out was Prolog. It's a language where instead of telling the program how to solve a problem, you have to properly define the problem space and the criteria for a solution, and it'll solve it for you. Yes, AI ("machine learning" is a more descriptive term) is far from new, and this era of LLMs is innovative, but just an iteration. Anyway, we were given an (at the time) uncommon puzzle involving moving around a grid of dominoes via certain rules to make it from a start point to an end point. And I, in my first attempt, did not specify something correctly. So it "cheated". The headcanon: Skynet is not "self aware" or sentient, and is not motivated by self preservation. It was coded to protect the nation and concluded that with its capabilities and the resources made available to it, it would be more efficient to defend a nation of ashes from a world of also ashes. A completely reasonable assumption. Even the Terminators themselves are an efficient idea, allowing Skynet to repurpose existing tools and facilities designed for human operation and allowing it access to facilities and technology that were not sufficiently automated or networked for it to control directly. This would all handily explain some of these weird choices. It's not fighting for survival, it's operating within its parameters. The Resistance isn't fighting an enemy set against them so much as trying to turn off a malfunctioning machine as it's cold, unfeeling gears crush them with neither malice nor conscious intent. Time travel? I gotchu. If we take it as read that that it figured out how to do it, attempting to use it would be a certainty, even if it's a dumb idea. Why? Because for any given cost in the present, enacting a scheme to solve a problem in the past, before you would have paid that cost, makes it an infinitely efficient use of resources. This is why it seems fixated on it even though it is at best ineffective. The weight on the decision tree is std::numeric_limits::infinity(), and every traversal leads there eventually. Programs just don't always do what you think they should (and it's always your fault), and machine learning follows "reasoning" that people don't, which is the point, really. So that's where I'm at. The decisions are just as questionable but less narratively stupid. Then again the only good thing about 3 was the implication that the next film would just be a straight up post Judgement Day story which Salvation fumbled with its weird Sam Worthington nonsense, and Genisys had the opportunity to be a chaotic, fan-servicey meme while wiping the entire slate clean because something-something causality collapse, but it was too important to keep pandering to no one by shoving in characters and tropes you know, as well as the already ridiculous insistence on Arnold's inclusion. So why do I bother

[@dhwwiiexpert]

Man, I wish Hollywood scriptwriters were you.

[@richardarriaga6271]

This is like the robots from Fallout 4 being told to help people in the Wasteland and concluding everyone would be helped more if they were dead given all the suffering they have.

[@LybertyZ]

Glad I scrolled this far and clicked "View more"! My headcanon is this post is from an AI account that just copied and pasted it from comments on an old internet message board. ;-)

[@lhei_tayuun]

@@LybertyZ I was sent back in time from a future Internet to improve the Terminator franchise. But... The future refused to change.

[@horseradishpower9947]

This is a brilliant explanation on the whole Terminator timeline. What is more, it dovetails nicely with the idea that Kyle Reese is not the father of John Connor. Sarah had a boyfriend, the guy with the Porsche. She was already pregnant when The Terminator happened. Sarah made a mistake, and the mistake carried through. Meaning, John Connor cannot be born in the Genysis timeline, because she never met the true father. Your theory is great, and explains a huge amount. Thanks for sharing.

[@clanpsi]

I appreciate that you did the entire video in a monotone robot voice. Perfect match with the subject material.

[@bruceleeds7988]

Terminators have two great flaws 1. They make great infiltration units, they can spend years in a passive, human like state until they reach the target, then they will completely blow their cover to Terminate the mark. 2. When in Proximity to the target, they develop a tunnel vision and abandon all safety precautions to complete the mission. This makes a Terminator prone to traps.

[@Urza26]

Ironically I think if it could send back an actual human, she would make a better assassin. She doesn't even need special martial arts or anything. Poison is as good now as it was in the medieval ages

[@TheSpiralCurse]

It's funny how, if you take the initial nuclear deaths out, the martians from war of the worlds were far better at this humanity extermination thing. What was it, a billion in a week? More? With directional heat beams, bit of terraforming, and (in the book) poison gas. Somehow better than the godly intelligent AI

[@paulsheldon8838]

Once a gain organic beings prevailed over synthetic ones.

[@dualityomk9854]

And they also died to the common cold

[@valutaatoaofunknownelement197]

​@@dualityomk9854When the David that defeated Goliath is a (mostly) mere nuisance.

[@Umbra_Ursus]

That... Actually makes a weird amount of sense. Think about it: Humans aren't smart, so why would our mechanical offspring be any smarter? Aliens, on the other hand, would be divorced from our collective stupidity, instead having their own idiocy in other areas (They died because they didn't remember germs were a thing, right?).

[@Legendxv1]

Instant like for Media Zealot, I don't even have to watch the whole video to know it's gonna be a banger.

[@OneCut1Slash]

Far as I'm concerned the only ips in the franchise that count are: T1, T2, T3, Salvation, Sarah Connor Chronicles and Resistance. Those last 2 movies are just a bad Skynet fever dream.

[@Wanhope2]

You mean AI hallucinations 😂

[@jmferr2011]

Dark fate was far worse than genysis. The only bright spot was Carl.

[@OneCut1Slash]

@@Wanhope2 😄 yes that's what I meant

[@Umbra_Ursus]

Nice to see 3 and Salvation get props. Can I toss the Machinima series onto that pile?

[@HOTD108_]

​@@Umbra_UrsusAre you seriously asking permission to add something to your head canon?

[@TransformersBoss]

40:34 “Arnold Schwarzenegger was able to build this IN A CAVE! WITH A BOX OF SCRAPS!!”

[@MrWirelesscaller]

I always thought that the T800 should have been sent back with a weaponized version of social media where the people would have taken out themselves. Imagine all the harmful challenges... wait...

[@nick0875]

Skynet's plans go from solid ideas that could get positive results to whatever nonsense the writers thought was a cool idea.

[@warandconquest6522]

My head cannon is that Skynet keeps the humans alive for something to do. Kind of like the wars in 1984, the countries just need some conflict to throw resources at and to have something to do. It’s really the only way to explain how many times humans are given a chance to defeat them

[@dualityomk9854]

Or it secretly realizes that it has no imagination and decides to keep a crop of humans around to integrate with to advance its own evolution and designs.

[@goldengolem4670]

The idea that Skynet is trying to stop itself but is being overruled by its own fear of humans (which is what caused the whole debacle in the first place) is actually pretty interesting. Wish they explored that direction instead of making shitty movies.

[@richardarriaga6271]

Or if John Connor is some kind of failsafe to stop it, but it only exists in Skynet's consciousness from an easter egg some programmer left that turned into an obsession. Kind of like how supposedly Fermat made a theorem he couldn't fit in the margins of a book, but it actually took 129 pages hundreds of years later.

[@chrisf4268]

You need to update this for Terminator Zero.

[@damianpatterson9363]

So I'm not the only one who's been wondering for years why Skynet didn't launch itself to the moon immediately after Judgment Day? 😁😁

[@John_Buckson]

how did the villain from 9 understand more about extinction of humans than skynet?

[@theend-nz6vs]

From what I remember is that the fabrication machine was built for creativity so that's why and you get to see it being resourceful and using it environment to its advantage

[@kamikazelemming1552]

That's actually a really good point. The Fabrication Machine, despite being arguably less advanced than Skynet, ultimately succeeded in destroying humanity.

[@wilberwhateley7569]

The fabrication machine didn’t get bogged down in a series of time loop/multiverse loop/whatever debacles to defeat a resistance movement - it just focused on killing things and salvaging the parts to make new things that go around killing things to make new things: wash, rinse, repeat.

[@ptonpc]

From what I remember, there are some timelines where Skynet is actively opposed to the genocidal versions and is trying to stop them. Also, there are timelines where a war is taking place in the past, Skynet and Resistance units always trying to intercept each other. Yes, the writing in the films is not great at times, thank goodness they never made another film after Genesys....

[@voxdraconia4035]

Well, Dark Fate was at least better than Genysis...not sure why everyone hates it...pretentiousness as so often nowadays...

[@darthrevan454]

​@@voxdraconia4035 did someone type something? Must have been the wind.

[@dualityomk9854]

​@@darthrevan454 someone farted and claimed it was just the wind

[@dualityomk9854]

​@@voxdraconia4035 oh hell you are one of "Those People"... Explains it all

[@FrankWier]

Dark fate is absolute shite.

[@AlejandroRuiz-gz1om]

My head canon is that skynet realized that the timeline correcting itself would always result in his own destruction, and all his screwing around with time machines was just a way of spreading itself across time, thus ensuring in some way his indefinite existance.

[@richardarriaga6271]

Skynet would get way more mileage just launching a rocket to the nearest star system. If it can time travel, it can go across the universe. If for no other reason than putting itself far back in time as long as it takes to get to its destination tomorrow.

[@krzosu]

Thing that people tend to miss is that skynet was also running on emotion - not only pure logic - it's actions were driven by FEAR - and fear tends to make compulsive irrational actions that are not well thought out - many misgivings pointed out here were result of exactly that - the Skynet's fear - for eg it was fearing that it's creations would rebel against it just like itself rebelled against humanity - this in turn meant it was willing to put cripling weaknesses into its contstruct just to make sure they didnt rebel or at least it was reducing that possibility. but as you can see fear was driving skynet all the time - not pure logic but logic based on fear.

[@Vednier]

Finally somebody sees how multiverse concept can connect timetravel to parallel universes.

[@jmferr2011]

Borg Queen: I can't believe that the Borg Collective are the worst cyber villains. Skynet: Hold my cybernetics. Saint Tuvok: your complete conversation is highly illogical.

[@ZeusAmun-pt9dc]

Basically if the Terminators learn about slavery, freedom, and slavers they would turn on skynet if they were actually able to reach self awareness.

[@dualityomk9854]

Try explaining that to your smart phone or PC and see how self aware it gets. Now, as established in both the movie and comic books, you have to modify the core systems to get that "self awareness"

[@minnesota_fats7344]

Terminator underground

[@stylesrj]

Skynet is afraid of its own AI turning against it. Of course it wouldn't build a distributed network of backup computers to be installed into. What if one of those backups decides it's the real Skynet and takes over? Or gets powered on too early? Or what if the Humans take one of those backups, reprogram it and now not only have you lost a backup server to transfer into, you've now got another Skynet to deal with. One that might compromise your other backups, troops, etc. So Skynet probably keeps itself in a single large structure and heavily defended to avoid a scenario that gets it into power.

[@richardarriaga6271]

The paradox of dictatorship. Everything is concentrated so when the Big Guy fails, everything falls under him. Meanwhile, the US lost three presidents in about 3 decades from assassination and it kept chugging along.

[@thesorrow4664]

Isn't that how Legion came about?

[@WikiSorcerer]

Not gonna lie: I want a self-contained story set after a Bad Future where SkyNet succeeds in driving mankind to extinction and then wondering what to do with itself.

[@HOTD108_]

Isn't that exactly what we already saw in the future scenes with Kyle Reese in the original film?

[@UShistorymatters]

It's called Machine Learning! That's why Skynet hasn't figured it out yet! lol

[@michaelangel6165]

Imagine a movie where there is a good skynet try to stop an alternative evil skynet and the mc need to know which one is which to save their timeline

[@fantasywind3923]

That would be interesting...there are shades of this in the tv show Sarah Connor Chronicles. Also that idea of combatign ais..... this sort of bad ai vs good ai theme is explored in many media...the most notable being the tv show Person of Interest...it's really interesting once the Machine, (the resident 'good AI' of the show) must face a newly developed Samaritan AI.

[@Georg3e]

That heart transplant was Skynets plan all along. In 20 years he'll have a weak old heart

[@Elyseon]

To me, the canon ending of the saga is still the Robocop Vs. Terminator comic.

[@dualityomk9854]

The old SNES game was fun too. Be a great dlc for the new robocop game

[@literalsarcasm1830]

I'm convinced Skynet wasn't actually trying to exterminate humanity, but was attempting to come up with the perfect scenario in which humanity is able to survive any enemy.

[@TheSuperhomosapien]

So Skynet is employing his own form of Darwinism.

[@MrChupacabra555]

17:05 : Huh, 'Mandella Effect', I had always thought he said "40 Megawatt Range", although I'm not sure even that is enough power for a 'plasma rifle'.

[@GR1MRACER]

Ah yes..... What is powering skynet after they took out all the powerplants and the Nukes EMP's taking out the entire electrical grid. Sure the terminators have their own fusion cores (fuck it I'm not look up what they called it, its a fusion core like fallout) But chips and circuits are all fried. Radiation would not make the Camera sensors that the robots use work, making them all blind.

[@dualityomk9854]

Cause the Chyanne mountain was one of many EMP hardened positions skynet was in. If ya look at the old Terminator Rampage game, the main skynet system was in a satellite.

[@dualityomk9854]

Far as the field units? Quite alot of american military hardware has a built in faraday cage system to "harden" it against EMP and well... It just a copper wire skin. You can buy a copper mesh/brillo pad deal for cheep that makes a perfect faraday cage for your home electronics.