Warhammer 40k Should you chase the Warhammer 40k Meta?

Ian and Steve sit down to chat about meta chasing (some pros, cons, and their opinions on it in the game!) If you like our 40k chats, be sure to like, subscribe, and comment to join the conversation!

[@matts8023]

"You can always win, or you can have friends...but never both" Advice I tell my kids all the time.

[@funkaoshi]

The best thing about meta chasing is when I find minis people have abandoned for cheap in the used bins at my local store and kijiji. I can’t wait till GW nerfs Necrons so I can pick up stuff for cheap. My secret to enjoying this hobby is not being overly invested in winning or losing. It’s fun when people blow your stuff up too. Mind you, I am not playing at tournaments.

[@SpookySpoox]

I'm with you! When people were doomposting before the necron Codex released and reanimations got nerfed, I snagged 25 Lychguard for 50€.

[@funkaoshi]

@@SpookySpoox Living the dream!

[@hyperspacehobbies]

WOW this is actually a hilarious point, all things are cyclical in this game we play, what sucks now eventually will come back. Get those armies cheap!

[@meh1994able]

yeah I both do and don't want the monolith to be nerfed. I want two more for a dumb fun list haha

[@johnbradley8901]

When your fluffy 4th Company Ultramarines lore list suddenly becomes THE marine meta...I just wanted to paint my guys blue with green trim, because I am a Uriel Ventris fanboi. It's not my fault I swear, the meta changed to what I was playing the whole time.

[@ravenRedwake]

Do you have him with his helmet on, or did you go with a head swap?

[@johnbradley8901]

@@ravenRedwake I got the older unfortunately sculpted model that did not come with the helmet. I ended up kitbashing a helm on with laurels and a nice toilet seat XD.

[@ravenRedwake]

@@johnbradley8901 that Simple Jack haircut is not great. I got the old plastic sternguard head that looked like Captain Titus from the first space marine game and put that on mine even though I don’t play Ultramarines, I just wanted a Captain Titus and he pretty much was heavily inspired by Uriel.

[@nicholasd7107]

The Kings have returned

[@trentraber6921]

Great Video!! I am a recently recovering meta-chaser and I have to say that I am having considerably more fun playing the game and I'm getting better because I'm focused on just learning to play what I think is strong and what I want to play.

[@spacemarinesteve6057]

Yes! Exactly! I am very similar! I used to meta chase a fair amount (this was a good long while ago haha) but now I just play what I want to and I definitely think I'm getting way better at the game because of it!

[@danielkearl7392]

I wanted to hear Ian talk about Shrek.

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Subscribe to Ians "Shrek-cast" hehe

[@danielkearl7392]

There is nothing I want more then for that to be an actual thing. Put the link here when it's out. ​@@hyperspacehobbies

[@cameronwoods-reynolds4793]

Great intro! Someone please paint an Ogryn or Bullgryn as Shrek 😂

[@spacemarinesteve6057]

Hahahaha, I totally want to now!

[@stephenevers6097]

In my blood angels list I use two vindicators. I don't care if I win or lose its fun to one shot big models

[@hyperspacehobbies]

LOVE the Vindy!

[@nomassgoer8350]

I feel the same way about my stormsurge. I know it’s not “competitive” but it’s just fun, and isn’t that the point of a game? I’m regretting not getting into CSM because the chance to kill your own models for more power is a fun mechanic!

[@aaronguerrette]

I havent owned Infiltrators, nor Repulsor/Galdiator Tanks. I play Black Templars but 99% of the time I play Index Rightous Crusaders. I really cant be bothered. But I do have Infiltrators in my cart on Amazon.....

[@spacemarinesteve6057]

I vote you go for it! Infiltrators are a great unit and also a fantastic looking model!

[@Kraytdragn]

Thank you. This earned a sub. Nice video.

[@spacemarinesteve6057]

Thank you!

[@user-ng5nc4ph5l]

Meta chasing seems great if you are hyper competitive and in tournaments a lot obviously. Theres different types of players though so some people may enjoy that chase just as much as I enjoy getting one massive single army that im in love with. If youre trying it and getting those bad feels you may want to consider just playing what you actually enjoy. May the algorithm bless you guys!

[@spacemarinesteve6057]

Thank you for your algorithmic blessing! May the KZbin Omnissiah smile on us all!

[@MegaGreenskin]

A long time ago we had the same unit's armament against each other as buddies. It kills a lot of the joy in playing. But now we have stopped it and the joy has returned. I myself cannot really understand that you can be so competitive when it comes to playing with plastic models. But everyone can do what they want of course.

[@hyperspacehobbies]

The arms race between friends can be a real problem. Glad your just playing the rule of cool!

[@jprovorse4159]

I am fully on the side of support your local meta-chaser so the rest of us can get a great second hand deal.

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Ebay is just an open warp rift. Get what you can quick!

[@chrisj9628]

IMO the best thing to do is to have more than one army and keep working on them as your interest in each ebbs and flows. That way when the meta shifts, you get to enjoy when your guys have strong rules, and shelve the other guys for a while and give them a break. While that's obviously not feasible for someone just starting out, I don't think that kind of person should care about the meta anyway. Chasing the meta by starting an entire new army is crazy, because of hobby lag. Let the meta come to YOU!

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Yep this is one way to stay in a positive game state without the meta chase. Also playing more armies usually give you a greater grasp on the game as a whole, which might help in playing any army.

[@ThingoftheDeep1]

I recently tried to talk myself into spending a gazillion dollars to switch my gladius list into an ironstorm list … then realized by the time I spent the money and built and painted the models the new data sheet would be here and it might not work Yo Steve! How do you feel about inquisitorial henchmen? As an extra set of cheap bodies for investigating signals/deep strike blocking/throwing their bodies in the way of a bunch of boys to protect the back line?

[@spacemarinesteve6057]

Marines now, I think, are fairly safe. A few things might change here and there, but ultimately you should be pretty set. They aren't bad at all! Next video I'm doing is about some of the top Imperial Allies, should see that next week maybe! But all in all, I am pro Imperial allies, however!!! I think, unless you absolutely need them to be as cheap as possible, a Squad of scouts can be a little more useful

[@ThingoftheDeep1]

@@spacemarinesteve6057 thank you! If the points cut works out in my favor, I think my two squads of henchmen get to turn into scouts and a tech marine.

[@stuartmortimer3922]

I loved when Custodes were cheap in Autumn/Winter 2023; I bought 2,000pts for £160 from eBay!! So, moral of the story - whoever is weakest in the meta - I buy them from eBay!!

[@QuantemFear]

I dont mind meta chasing on a local or store level. But with the internet the meta is so big being national or even international which makes that everything winning usually seems similar.

[@derekhensche6648]

My list is about as far from competitive as you could get but I’m able to make each game close with back and forth. I totally agree about learning your army even if it’s mediocre and playing it to the best of its ability. I run two units of 5 Reivers with Phobos Lt’s attached and they’ve been some of the most fun and weirdly reliable units to knock out secondaries and threaten enemy objectives held by chaff (cultists, grots, etc.).

[@spacemarinesteve6057]

I have actually been workshopping Rievers in a couple of lists and for being as cheap as they are they can have some serious play. Especially with a LT attached. That's the actual spice. OR giving them the little deep strike wings allowing them to deep strike. It makes them SO GOOD in a Vanguard Detachment because you can pull them up and re-deep strike them from reserves. So much utility

[@nomassgoer8350]

When can we see this on play on? That’s such a great idea! Also even Art of War is now starting to recognize the viability of off meta lists because people don’t have counters to them.

[@izzydarkhart4144]

I love buying models off meta chasers lol. I am not a meta player. I love playing a little more on the fluff side. My blood angel successor chapter is built around melee, flammers, meltas, only using vehicles with meltas and flammers and only really using Son's of Sanguinius and firestorm detachment, idc if they do good or not or if i win. With that being said, Right now they kind slap though so i am taking full advantage of it lol.

[@sgquiblat]

As a Grey Knight player with a very limited number of options in terms of Data Sheets, I find myself chasing the units that are viable/deliver results. With so few options, I'm not sure if it would be considered meta chasing or list optimizing 🤔

[@Doggcow]

Hard Disagree on Netlisting. I've been playing Crons since I started in 9th and never had top table success until I copied a Josh Roberts List. I learned a ton running it also. Strong recommend trying netlists.

[@hyperspacehobbies]

for sure, some of them are perfect for learning how an army can be played as well, unlocking some combo that was hidden.

[@nicholasd7107]

I think meta chasing is totally cool and fits very well with the tournament style/MEGA tournaments like you both talked about. However where the term "meta chasing" becomes a negative is when it divides a friend group or hobby store. For example you beat your buddy and the next thing you know he's running Chaos Knights or Aeldari down your throat, that's where it begins to ruin the game for some. In my (humble) opinion ofc

[@ravenRedwake]

My tau collection can be defined more by what I don’t like and I’m not interested in than anything. I don’t have the storm surge or the fliers or the terrain which is now apparently transports, and the new kroot stuff obviously. I was thrilled beyond reasoning to know I didn’t have to paint all my drones (I’ve changed my paint scheme, stripped and repainted them like six times for my chaos three times)

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Oh ya that's a whole new can of worms once you start repainting, I did it with some marines and I was even less fun painting them a second time. but they do look good i think.

[@huskerdevil24]

Loving your content! Any chance we'll see you two play a game?

[@hyperspacehobbies]

We have been talking about doing something like that. Play On will have us on soon I think.

[@cameronwoods-reynolds4793]

I would love to see that! I saw the angels and demons campaign and it was awesome!

[@arianash7763]

I'd much rather have the fun of playing a list that I've put together based on a mix of unit capabilities and What I Think Is Cool, and get tabled, than copy someone else's list because it's done well. When I play CSM I bring my heldrake because it's a really cool model. When I play my Chaos Knights I bring a Tyrant because it looks awesome and it's hilarious getting to do basically no damage until I can get it within 18" of something. I'd be having less fun if I just had 12 War Dogs on the field

[@spacemarinesteve6057]

I 100% agree. 12 war dogs feels like it would be boring to play and, from experience, it is sort of boring to play too

[@browncaramelboba8408]

One of my friends in my 40k group in the local game store is "That guy". He plays the SM and when the SM is meta he will go around ask to play with everyone but when the SM is weak like nows day he will stop playing and complain that the game isn't balanced. I still debating with my friends that should we tell him about his behaviors or not.

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Oooh thats a difficult conversation.

[@crsmith6226]

What do you guys think about “meta chasing” with models you already have? Like let’s say you already own twenty terminators and the next balance patch makes them insanely good. So you start running the models you already own in greater numbers than you normally would.

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Ya that's sort of different. We are more focusing on the people who run out and buy 20 terminators and sells there old army just to try and win a tournament.

[@piotrjeske4599]

I didn't meta chase. Picked the army with the stuff l like the most (bikes). Didn't care much about winning, just wanted my tatar army (l am Tatar). Took me 4 years to build it , painting the whole thing was tough. Getting the parts for the models was expensive . End of 9th the army was done l had over 2000pts of painted models. Then 10th was anounced and l got hyped . Bikers were that great in 9th, so l expected GW to fix them in a new edition, maybe release a khan ir storm seer on bike. What l got after 4 years of preparing to play was an army that went 100% legend (can't even use my chaplain because he has a thunder hammer and chainfist) . Now after this expiriance l came to the conclusion that while chasing the best, unless you play eldar, is hell of a expensive and it is probably better to start with one good army. The army should be good , to be fun to play, and the player should have the ability to buy+paint+play a new army every 6-9 months. 4 years investing in to something you like just ends bad.

[@ravenRedwake]

I have four armies I collect (oldest to newest) Tau, World Eaters, Grey Knights and Primaris Marines. I started in 5th edition with tau. I’ve mostly been playing Primaris marines in 10th because they are a good baseline and seem to be the recommended faction for new people, but I’ve lost every game I’ve played, at 1000 point games, all the fucking strategems and various things you get points by…I think I’m too old for this shit.

[@theophrastusbomblastus821]

IMO flavor of the monthers are cheesers, "that guy"s and generally "unfun" players. My favorite part of 40k is the inner roleplay, the immersion, of which they care nothing. Also, meta chasing requires either alot of disposable income or the association with a store or team with access to a plethora of painted armies. And finally it is my opinion that meta chasing literally hurts the meta, even though this may sound paradoxical.

[@AsbakNL]

meanwhile i am repainting my space marine army into a deathwatch one because i got tired of always painting the same scheme and now i can spice things up a tiny bit

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Yes a custom paint scheme works really well for taking any detachment you feel like.

[@benbrus42]

Ive got 4500 points of ultramarines painted, and I play with friends only no tournys. But there is a friend who meta chases and changes armies for whats the most busted. Has become quite deflating as i dont meta build and just want to have fun. But currently 5 game losing streak atm haha😅

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Sorry to hear that, maybe try expanding the friend group at the FLG store? I've met entire groups of friends that all meta chase, start an arms race against each other and they end up loving it. not for me though.

[@drtwbuyer]

Big rule changes right before LVO usually don't apply to the tournament.

[@chrisprime7767]

With the way economy is right now, I don't really know who can afford meta chasing. I'm super lucky to be in a group that has 0 meta chasers

[@DrSomhairle]

I don't care about the meta, just want to play the units I think look cool!

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Rule of Cool is always king around here!

[@DrSomhairle]

@@hyperspacehobbies Meta maybe better (on paper) but BA terminators with thunder hammers will always be cool, even if the meta doesn't back em!

[@desertzombie]

I play what i love. If it happens to be meta awesome, if not, no worries

[@hyperspacehobbies]

I bet you have more fun playing the game than most people, Good on ya!

[@desertzombie]

@hyperspacehobbies8400 when playing the Waaaaaaaaagh, how can it be a bad time?

[@johnkon2810]

Question: I've seen the armies structured into winning rate charts based on low, middle and upper tier win rates. Example: necrons are way upper tier vs regular chaos marines at the lowest end of the win rate. That said, wouldn't it be fair that a low end army gets to use 3 units of their best models vs where a top tier army like the necrons are limited to using only 2 units of their best, in a effort to even out the meta?

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Hhhhmmm that's an interesting way to control the meta. Might be hard to control and update from GW's standpoint.

[@johnkon2810]

@@hyperspacehobbies ... agreed as far as GW but, it should be easy among casual playing & even competitive

[@MakoEffect]

[@thebiggestbaz]

One of the boys in my group plays eldar and chaos, and his eldar where stompping all of us haha. I was able to get the first win on them with my grey knight out of any of us and damn it felt good

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Congrats, now share that knowledge with your allies and figure out a way to crack the Eldar again!

[@paulbalfour9339]

I’m a really casual space marine player, but find myself buying models such as, six aggressors as I see the top players using them and see what cool things they do… then I feel guilty taking them to a friendly game! 🤦‍♂️

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Well if you really like them that's fine, its probably not ruining other peoples games. sometime you are the meta without even knowing it. then someone says "hey thats a net list" and you had no idea that you also found the same things in the codex.

[@spacemarinesteve6057]

6 aggressors may be great, and many people may use them, but I definitely wouldnt call it meta breaking or cutting edge space marine meta either. Don't feel too bad about it.

[@paulbalfour9339]

I think as a casual player, I play Ultramarines 4th company, I always have some combo of Uriel with company hero’s, Calgar, Tiggy, and G-Man in my list. But watching the various channels it can be easy for me to be influenced by some units being played across Play-on, vanguard and tabletop tactics. I also want it to last until at least turn 4! 👀 What are your favourite units at the moment?

[@nomassgoer8350]

I’m a T’au meta chaser. I’m trying to have a max of every unit in my collection, or maybe I’m just addicted…

[@hyperspacehobbies]

If you could see the space marine collection in the basement you'd be appalled. Haha

[@nomassgoer8350]

I wish I could upload pictures of my piles of shame haha

[@spacemarinesteve6057]

Appalled is a strong word lol but he's not wrong, I have a serious problem that brings me great joy

[@drunkenpainter]

Very easy answer: NO Metachasing is truly the worst habit of some 40k players. In my mind its good to stick to your army and keep playing no matter how bad/good their rules are. I play Iron Warriors since 8th ED and they were shit in 8th edition, still the best CSM Chapter but compared to other juggernauts they were trash and i kept playing. Now in 10th CSM were very good and i kept playing and after the nerf guess what: i kept playing. Good players can win with mediocre Armies but most important is that you avoid tournament players and keep a friendly group which focuses on fun and cinematic moments instead of cheap victorys.

[@Astartesparty]

I play mostly what I think is cool , fortunately what’s cool is good. Except Dante I hamster myself with mephiston an Dante but they’re way too cool not to run. I want to play against either of you guys one time local from aldergrove 🎉

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Aldergrove nice! are you in the BC 40k league?

[@arestheblue]

Is it still meta chasing if you buy whatever the best units are when you originally start building your army?

[@hyperspacehobbies]

I don't think so, I've been playing Daemons for years, most of the Big models I've either Made by hand, Or gotten through B-Day gifts, If however I was running. It becomes a chase when the thing you play the most takes a nerf and you immediately switch to something different and obviously more powerful, the game is cyclical, everything that stinks, will be good again.

[@ericb9804]

Meta Chasing? Me and my kid go to our local store to mix it up with oomies, Conan, Master Chief, and Batman. WTF you talkin' 'bout?

[@marccote6851]

We are playing crusade and i think it’s the best way to play warhammer40k you got chance to play what you want and worse unit can be good when you upgrade

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Haven't played a lot of crusade but i know people who just love it. Kind of takes the heat off everyone playing and makes it feel more fun.

[@Wi1ykat]

meta chasers paint there models lol naa easer to insist that you ignore VP for painting and play with a sea of gray.

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Oh that's annoying, I don't think i would allow that.

[@thecasualwargamer5195]

Meta chasing is just silly. Play the game and have fun. That's what Warhammer is all about.

[@hyperspacehobbies]

Give this Warrior a Promotion!

[@midtabletactics]

Meta chasing is for the rich

[@hyperspacehobbies]

YES this too.

[@Darker1208]

Meta is always the Warhams trap. If you're chasing the meta, you're already in last place. don't do it. you're just going to still be the sweaty try hard at the bottom tables that no one wants to game with. Also you'll still never win something like LVO. You're just a ringer for the people like Art of War that had the rules you don't understand how to use 6 months ago. Stop it. also play One Page Rules and quit being a Warhamster.