Well There's Your Problem | Episode 122: United Airlines Flight 232

oh you wanna be specific and make it a runway huh
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CHAPTERS:
00:00:00 Intro
00:02:43 The God Damn News
00:14:09 Episode topic
01:40:54 Safety Third
01:50:31 Commercials

[@JJJRRRJJJ]

“…and my pronouns are-“ **click**

[@twofivefive]

Clearly your pronouns are dip and shit, so ¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯

[@TheAtombomb1995]

Triggered rightoid detected

[@mjorn19]

My sweet summer child...

[@LukeHardiman65]

We got a snowflake over here!

[@vla120699]

wow, too sensitive for pronouns?

[@Myrea_Rend]

Probably the most "no one survived that"-looking crash that had multiple survivors

[@Stealth86651]

Reminds me of that woman who fell thousands of feet with no parachute (if I'm remembering correctly) and still lived somehow. She wasn't in great shape, but she did survive somehow. Human body is both incredibly fragile, and somehow amazingly robust in the right situations.

[@deeznoots6241]

@@Stealth86651ep, she got trapped in the fuselage by a food cart while everybody else got sucked out of the plane after a bomb exploded and then the fuselage landed in an extremely lucky way on a snow drift such that it cushioned the impact enough to keep her alive though she still went into a temporary coma Oh and she had a history of low blood pressure which was believed to have stopped her heart exploding from the impact(funnily enough her low blood pressure should have made it impossible for her to pass the medical to become a flight attendant but she drank a ton of coffee before her medical exam to artificially inflate her blood pressure)

[@tangentfox4677]

@@deeznoots6241Ah, the opposite of what I do for medical exams and blood donation. I have to calm my heart the fuck down.

[@rytedas]

Japan Airlines 123 and American 965 would be good picks here too - both planes get practically completely obliterated after hitting a mountain and yet there were surviviors. The worst part about JAL123 was that actually more people had survived the crash at first but then died waiting for rescue parties to arrive.

[@s4nari]

whoa spoilers!! In all seriousness that is kinda incredible though - that first opening slide made me think it was a complete loss for sure.

[@xmlthegreat]

Saddened to hear that Liam has tummy hurt. Praying that he recovers from "I'm gonna fucking die" disease soon. A solemn Yay Liam.

[@Cory_Springer]

yay liam

[@SportyMabamba]

Liam is symbolically America, as James Earl Jones was in that other film on that other podcast.

[@carinafreeman6432]

Another somber Yay Liam. Hope he feels better.❤

[@seanomatopoeia]

So yay we all

[@leasinclaire]

we salute a brave tummy hurt survivor o7

[@themroc8231]

25:09 "Fly me to Cuba. No, it's not a 'muslim thing', why would you ask me that?" was a great joke that got a bit under the radar.

[@YouShallNotPassGo]

Someone explain this to me, it went over my head

[@Moxiethe4th]

@@YouShallNotPassGo In the late 60s and early 70s there were a pretty staggering number of plane hijackings that would divert flights departing from the US to Cuba

[@themroc8231]

@@YouShallNotPassGoExactly. Between the 60's and the 80's if you were h*jacking a plane "for leftist reasons" (typically the wars of independence of the Third World countries) you had them land in a country that was sympathetic to your cause. From the US it was Cuba, from Europe it used to be Algeria or Libya. Uganda once, but that one went bad pretty quickly. Now, Alice is a communist, but she is also visibly Muslim as she wears a veil. The joke was that if she ever was to hijack a plane, it would more likely be for an anti-imperialistic political struggle like in the 70', but because she wears a hijab people would assume it to be *slamic terror*sm. And she presents it as if it was a case of casual prejudice when in the premise of story she is, you know, h*jacking a f*cking plane.

[@MrHat.]

​@@Moxiethe4th to add onto that, Alice is a Muslim, so if she would hijack a plane, it wouldn't be for religious extremist reasons, but for political extremist reasons.

[@TrashGordon36]

@@Moxiethe4th Behind the Bastards did a great series on the Golden Age of Hijacking

[@citadelpariah]

"I don't drink but I'm gonna start" has exactly the same energy as "I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue."

[@jamespocelinko104]

"I thought you didn't smoke." "I don't." "Uh-huh."

[@OwlRTA]

The captain in Qantas 72 said the sniffing glue line during their emergency diversion to Learmonth lol

[@phaserrifle3]

Why am I not surprised Alice likes the coffee maker you have to disassemble and clean like it's a rifle. 😂

[@Abeardeen]

FF

[@Boneworm852]

Do you not disassemble clean and oil your coffee maker?

[@phaserrifle3]

@@Boneworm852 routinely. While repeating "this is my aeropress. There are many others like it, but this one is mine...."

[@anarcho-pingu]

gun people who hate gun people

[@Boneworm852]

@@phaserrifle3 honor guard at the tomb of the unknown barista

[@bobsmith2637]

I want a bonus episode where it's just Devon and Liam yelling at a pinned commenter

[@Trendyflute]

How about a compilation where they roast every single pinned commenter???? 🤩

[@Troggie42]

we have to have one first, haven't had one in a while

[@TheImpossiBelle]

@@Troggie42 Have I got some good news for you...

[@brandonm949]

My favorite part of this story is that Denny Fitch had actually practiced flying with only the engines on a flight simulator, after Japan Airlines Flight 123 had a similar incident 4 years earlier. This flight just happened to have a passenger who might have been the most qualified person in the world to fly this specific plane in this specific scenario.

[@AbsolXGuardian]

Either this or the one with the captain's glider pilot friend hanging out in the cockpit, who after loosing fuel did a maneuver that managed to slow the plane enough to turn a crash into a landing by coming in perpendicular to the runway

[@tomhsia4354]

@@AbsolXGuardian The sideslip, a maneuver used in gliders, but not in commercial liners, IIRC.

[@thehaprust6312]

A similar thing happened on Scandinavian Airlines Flight 751 (The Gottröra Miracle). Mentour Pilot's review of that accident is worth checking out.

[@SlackActionBumble]

@Tom Hsia In Cessnas we do sideslip all the time when we come in too high and need to lose altitude. It's just turning the rudder and the ailerons in opposite directions of each other. It's basically 'fly the plane really wrong so it gets confused and falls down faster"

[@tomhsia4354]

@@SlackActionBumble "Fly the plane really wrong it gets confused and falls down faster." I'm stealing that. Such hilarious succinctness. I'm guessing the biggest pro of this is that it allows you to shed altitude rapidly without gaining airspeed.

[@isengrom6883]

Two episodes, within 6 days of each other? Truly a miracle indeed

[@PandorasFolly]

Truly a festivus miracle

[@elorani1714]

They're going to vanish for two months now.

[@bossbeartherock6034]

@@elorani1714 well they said bonus episode going to be recorded by the time this goes up so we rollin'

[@xmlthegreat]

@@bossbeartherock6034 heck yeah baybee

[@inund8]

As someone who is pretty much only here for the safety third, I'm disappointed. None last episode, and this one was pretty tame.

[@bobsmith2637]

RE: the B-36 'Peacemaker' (an odd name for something that carried nuclear bombs), the 'Six Turning, Four Burning' tagline was quickly modified by crews to 'two turning, two burning, two smoking, two choking and two more unaccounted for'.

[@davidwright7193]

The B-36 was a classic engineering disaster. If they had ever been used in anger 1/3 would have crashed due to engine failure before they came in range of the migs. They were supposed to operate above the service ceiling of the Mig-15 and Mig-17. Whatever the source of that intelligence was fur cupped.

[@redbullwife1]

​@David Wright I have never read a comment that I'm absolutely certain is fascinating while also having absolutely no fucking idea what was said. 😂 Bravo.

[@knightofficer]

I mean in fairness, didn't have a WWIII with nukes, so like made peace by nuclear deterrence I guess

[@HamburgerTime209]

Hell yes, the disaster with the most unrecognized, most incredible feat of piloting. No one even thought you could fly a plane with absolutely no flight control surfaces working before this. Honestly trumps even Sully’s trick shot.

[@RunawayTrain2502]

This and TACA 110

[@windwalker5765]

I'll say Sully's landing was a perfect 50/50 combination of luck and skill. This incident was far more skill, with the only luck being the extra crew member aboard.

[@TiagoJoaoSilva]

how about with flight controls reversed? Air Astana KC1388

[@readmorebooksidiots]

Gimli Glider is pretty up there too

[@RobJaskula]

@@RunawayTrain2502 zero engines, one eye; what a piece of flying

[@toprope_]

“My pronouns are Natural and Gas” Someone’s been drinking the Flint water

[@steemlenn8797]

My pronouns are rust and belt.

[@johnforestersworstnightmar3756]

“His shit wasn’t even made by the lowest bidder!” As a transit planner in the US, that hit real hard…

[@LeafseasonMagbag]

“Uncontained engine failure” already just sounds like the worst thing possible, even if you don’t know anything about plane engines.

[@grmpEqweer]

Meaning...parts of the engine aren't contained within the plane anymore, but have gotten ejected at high speed, in random directions?

[@russellhall1195]

Some podcasts will start by saying ,"We have a little house keeping to take care of at the top of the episode", but only WTYPpod will actually talk about housekeeping. Justice for Liam's crockpot! Little coffees for all!!!

[@happy_hooray]

flying is so goated in situations where having a panic attack and paying $40 for water is the vibe

[@William-Morey-Baker]

what flights are you taking where they charge for water?

[@John-nt3dk]

@@William-Morey-Baker airport

[@m.f.3347]

@@William-Morey-Baker Ryanair type beat

[@appalling22]

I fart in the airport

[@shadoeboi212]

still less dangerous then driving; or walking drunk

[@Mercgribern]

Dev; the best regular reoccurring host since 'Activate Windows. '

[@littlesparkle]

I think this is the accident where flight attendants knew lap children wouldn't survive in laps, so put some in the overhead luggage bins to try to give them a chance at survival. An accident that highlights why babies and toddlers should be in car seats strapped to their own plane seat for safety reasons. Oh also Fitch had read a lot about Japan Air Lines 123 and had tried out controlling a plane with throttles only in a flight simulator in his own time.

[@psychic_beth]

the reason why lap children are allowed is if they were required to have car seats, then more families would choose to drive instead which is much more dangerous than flying.

[@JeepnHeel]

Those overhead bins fill so fast on crowded flights -- sometimes it's better just to gate-check the children and avoid the stress

[@markwilliams2620]

@@JeepnHeel I prefer UPS Ground. Edit: I'm not paying for next day or second.

[@JeepnHeel]

@@markwilliams2620 Good thinking. Slightly unethical tip -- you can send them Media Mail if you write "BOOKS" on the outside. If you go that route, it's best to throw some extra water in to cover the second week.

[@falsum2701]

@@psychic_beth If the FAA applied that kind of logic in practice then they'd probably also shut down all security checkpoints at airports.

[@revmuddswife]

Excellent work, folks. I've known several people who worked or volunteered in the 232 crash. One in particular, a protestant minister, still has PTSD from it. Another factoid: serious thought was given to routing 232 to Des Moines, which was well-provisioned for a crash of this magnitude, had 4 hospitals within 10 minutes of the airport, and was a right-hand turn, but no one had any idea how long they could keep the damn airplane flying. The approach to DSM from their position also put the airliner over a large portion of the city at low-altitude, increasing risk. Oh, and the airport code? SUX.

[@garrettlogue4249]

First a radiology disaster, now an air disaster. My favorites.

[@ENCHANTMEN_]

Next episode is on plane cancer

[@Myrea_Rend]

Next episode is the Goldsboro B-52 crash for a radiation AND plane disaster (/jk)

[@EarsoftheWolf]

@@ENCHANTMEN_ good, I don't like cancer too heavily flavoured.

[@William-Morey-Baker]

@@EarsoftheWolf i prefer the original flavor

[@waharadome]

I don't think they have done an episode on the Palomares H-bomb incident, that one's a doozy

[@xmlthegreat]

Devon made the best joke of this podcast. Their baffles joke won me over.

[@teenageoperator7246]

oh I missed this! do you remember whereabouts in the video it is?

[@TwoWholeWorms]

@@teenageoperator7246 19:29 to 20:05

[@rancidmarshmallow4468]

Fun tip for circumventing Amtrak's 50lb limit: at most of the small stations you can just tell the baggage person you'll throw it in the car yourself and then they don't care

[@MrMeme-ng4ni]

My father used to work for McDonnell Douglass and he was one of the people who created a workaround for flying by throttle. He also met the pilot which was cool

[@yrobtsvt]

Neat to have a life-saving contribution to the modern world. Shout out to engineer dads!!

[@Jabber441]

I think this was the one where a guy's polyester shirt melted onto his skin, while his cotton trousers just smouldered.. Which is why I always try to remember to fly in natural fibres.

[@lukeman9851]

The way i would characterize this, taking a cue from NASA, involves terms like "rapid unplanned disassembly" and "engine-rich exhaust"

[@joshuagreen3185]

btw, re: FAA news, NOTAM now officially stands for Notice to Air Missions rather than Notice to Airmen (given that the airwomen and nonbinairies also need to pay attention to them)

[@grmpEqweer]

Nonbinairies. Well done.

[@silaskuemmerle2505]

Nobody reads the NOTAMS anyway… for legal reasons that is a joke

[@platinum6363]

@@emilyadams3228terf

[@romosome]

@@emilyadams3228 why do you even listen to this podcast are you addicted to rage

[@WaterMan416]

@@emilyadams3228 cope

[@Vazgriz]

The downside of Crew Resource Management is that the captain now has to confer with the other crew members in order to flog a passenger.

[@maybemablemaples2144]

But who would say no? That person is a narc and should automatically be thrown out the airlock. I'm a passenger and I hate other passengers.

[@trashrabbit69]

As a humble request, since you did the whole nation of Rhodesia, I think another great example of pure Commonwealth post colonial clusterfuckery would be the Sierra Leone Civil War. They even got to use the L85A1 in there.

[@niallfoody97]

Honestly you could do an entire DC-10 episode.

[@RobJaskula]

Truly.

[@Dong_Harvey]

Segues into Scientology, which is clearly an engineering disaster

[@nekolalia3389]

They used all the good DC-10 mojo solely on building that FedEx plane that Auburn Calloway failed to take over. It took fighter jet manoeuvres like a champ and is still flying to this day.

[@mysteryshrimp]

@@Dong_Harvey I believe you'll find that that's a DC-8, not 10

[@JD-xt8cj]

I live a few miles away from the Chicago DC10 crash site

[@oinksnork]

Clicked within 6 seconds and already 5 minutes past bedtime, so I am welcoming my own engineering disaster, my sleep schedule.

[@-r-495]

Uhm, don’t you fall asleep during these? I guess it‘s the ad that sends me to dreamland.

[@oinksnork]

@@-r-495 absolutely (I put on older episodes to fall asleep to, now Listening to the last part because I would be lying if I said that I stayed awake till the end)

[@flyingskier1913]

the Boeing-McDonnel Douglas merger was the worst thing to happen to Boeing (also the reason American switched to gray is because some of the Airbus aircraft they picked up in the US Airways merger literally can't do bare metal)

[@thomasgiles2876]

First slide, and I'm appalled by United Airlines littering so much. Edit: 😍 you have to love an episode that ends mid sentence complaining about the recording software

[@himoffthequakeroatbox4320]

At least Roz remembered to turn the mic on.

[@thomasgiles2876]

@@himoffthequakeroatbox4320 unlike the guest

[@michaelkitchin9665]

I'm with Alice on air travel. You're just removed enough from the process that it feels weird. You are Schrödinger's Passenger and you'll only be sure you've went anywhere when you land.

[@BlisaBLisa]

this is what makes it less scary for me. if i climb up on a high tower my brain registers that ive just put myself in danger and that im high up, but in an airplane it kinda just doesnt feel real. like being so high up and the method of getting there is so unnatural that it doesnt trigger that fear of heights in me. the fact that someone else is doing this and im not in control is something that causes fear in a lot of people but for me its comforting, like i can relax and not worry about fucking up, theres a guy thats super expirienced in control and its his problem now. i can cause my own death from a high tower if i trip and fall, i cant really cause my own death by making a mistake in an airplane. or i guess i could but it would be very hard lol

[@jamespocelinko104]

"Ladies and gentlemen, this is your captain speaking. Welcome to the Danger Zone."

[@jizburg]

Wait?! Did i just see moving pictures in a Wtiyp podcast?! What is this magic?!

[@IrishMorgenstern]

They are called Devon and their wizardry is strong

[@jizburg]

@@IrishMorgenstern all hail Devon.

[@cortanathelawless1848]

I really wouldn't mind a bit more of Devon. Like a lil extra for attentive fans

[@mikeschumacher]

26:22 ETOPS stands for "Engines Turn Or People Swim"

[@SparklRebel]

That’s what I tell my dad who was ETOPS qualified all the time! But he swears up and down that it stands for Extended Operations

[@mikeschumacher]

@@SparklRebel Of course. Though I think I heard my definition from a pilot!

[@SparklRebel]

@@mikeschumacher I saw it on a keychain on ebay

[@GorgeDawes]

That or Eventually There’s Only a Plopping Sound.

[@ultrablue8847]

I am a huge fan of Devon's additions, but since I don't look at the slides 100% of the time I'm always afraid of missing them. I therefore humbly request either a sound cue or list of time stamps in the description or a comment. (I truly didn't think this podcast could be improved but their commentary is the perfect extra layer of chaos)

[@Thunder-Chief]

@Ultra Blue Replying for signal boost. I have been thinking the exact same thing since they started, but didn't know how to frame it. But when they used the piano to cue the cameo here, I realized that was what I wanted. Or a bell or chime. Like Tinkerbell reminding us to turn the page. 😉 I didn't see your comment until after I left my own, but I'm going to leave mine just to help make sure it gets noticed, although yours is already off to a good start!

[@syystomu]

I suggest a sort of soft flipping sound, like when you swing a stick really fast, and adding a matching flipping animation to the additions coming in. I've seen other editors on yt do that and it works really nicely

[@icarus313]

Great idea. Just a subtle noise cue would be perfect.

[@Crowborn]

This is a great idea!

[@Vallam23]

I don't think a fwhip or woosh is the right vibe for this podcast but that piano playing lightly whenever text is on screen would actually be excellent

[@fauxpinkytoo]

Denny Fitch died of brain cancer a few years ago. I've often wondered if that was related to the head injuries he suffered in the crash. Incredible job of flying by the crew, though...watched this one come in live on CNN.

[@SivakAurak]

I'm sure the smoke of burning jet fuel and various plastics didn't help.

[@effluviah7544]

@@SivakAurak Yeah, it's more about the fumes than the impact, when cancers are involved. See also: US military burn pits and the water pollution caused by Navy bases in Hawaii.

[@himoffthequakeroatbox4320]

Cancer is usually caused by genetics, radiation or chemicals. Or some combination of them.

[@redbasher636]

"Guess what else is hydraulically powered? The BRAKES." THERE ARE NO BRAKES ON THE RUNAWAY PLANE.

[@rossamundbrennan7248]

Loving the Tom Walker guest appearance. Hopefully we can get him again for an Australian engineering disaster.

[@cutelasscutlass876]

21:47 as a airport ground crew member who never gives a shit, i feel seen, thank you Alice “Donna Respirator” Avizandium

[@RocketSurgn_]

Crew Resource Management also made its way into healthcare- anesthesia used to be very dangerous for a lot of crazy reasons, and as a part of trying to address that they looked at the huge improvements in safety the airline industry managed with new concepts like CRM. It's a really useful system and this incident is such a good example it gets talked about a lot. There's also another great discussion about the United 232 flight on the LeadDev channel by Nickolas Means that focuses more on the details of how the flight crew worked through how to deal with the issue and follows the minute by minute transcript including some of the cockpit recordings. VERY interesting talk. It also includes some footage of some of the crash itself that makes it even more clear how incredible anyone surviving was.

[@fjr4205]

Watched the LeadDev vid based on this rec and it is SO good tysm

[@RocketSurgn_]

@@fjr4205 All of Means’s talks are great, even ones I didn’t expect to get much out of like the history of the Eiffel Tower.

[@redbullwife1]

Healthcare has been trying to copy aviation safety standards so hard for a long time, and sweet baby Jesus are we bad at it. I can never get enough of the eye rolls and passive aggressive comments when I call for the mandatory pre-procedure Time Out that the physician clearly planned to skip. My hospital also paid to make me a Six Sigma Master Black Belt (yes, it's embarrassing to use that title) so they can get mad at me every time I point out how fucking stupid all of our workflows are. But at least our healthcare is the world's most expensive and has the outcomes of a developing country! 🫣 I badly need a WTYP style podcast on the subject, lol.

[@jamesphillips2285]

@@redbullwife1 My understanding is 90% of the price is billing shenanigans that would be resolved with single-payer health care. Hospitals over-bill to cover uninsured patients. Then insurance companies try to negotiate the price down.

[@Fir3Chi3f]

Searched the comments first and there he is! Love all of Nickolas Means talks and this one especially is extremely good!

[@scarylion1roar]

today I: worked, did ADHD cooking, and had a Drink. I'm ready for a Problem.

[@Tom-lm2tc]

Never felt more parasocial in my life than when Alice was describing the pains of making moka on induction

[@Dong_Harvey]

I prefer to keep my Moka pot permanently welded to my induction stove. It's just a Moka-stove hybrid now!

[@TayBridgeDisaster]

Love the Jstor tangent, really speaks to me. MAKE KNOWLEDGE FREE

[@wormxdream]

As an Iowan, the funicular is actually Dubuque, not Des Moines. It's called the Fenlon Place Elevator and it slaps. They sell t-shirts. Edit: further correction as I've continued the episode, do not pronounce it I-uh-way. Just don't do it.

[@russellhall1195]

Please tell me that the t-shirts say ," Fenlon Place puts the FUN in funicular!" I will fly there just to ride it, those cretins in Pittsburgh just laughed at me when I asked.

[@JD-xt8cj]

I’ve been to Dubuque many times (but not recently), it continues to be full of surprises

[@mathewperring]

As a former Iowan (I miss it except winter) Des Moines is a bit flat for a funicular, and Toppling Goliath is based in Decorah Iowa, not Dubuque. Both lovely cities to visit by the way. George RR Martin taught at a college in Dubuque, makes me wonder if an Iowan winter was what was coming in the books.

[@mkjirak]

@@mathewperring I wish I had seen this before I commented the same about Toppling Goliath. 0 for 2 on Iowa geography by our hosts.

[@himoffthequakeroatbox4320]

Day Moyniz Day Moyniz Day Moyniz Day Moyniz Day Moyniz Day Moyniz Day Moyniz Day Moyniz Day Moyniz.

[@Trendyflute]

On the gas stove front, I do like using them to cook with, but a few years ago I really noticed just how much the fumes from the stove was impacting my thinking, making me feel light-headed, etc. and it's a pretty modern, higher-end gas appliance, no pilot lights and presumably pretty good combustion, and it's still not very good to breathe in! I always use the hood vent now and that fixes the indoor air quality issue, but so many people don't have proper vent hoods because they just vent back into the same room. On the larger climate front, it's a decent chunk of emissions to reduce. It's all an overblown issue; being gay is awesome.

[@sakurakiyori]

Did you not grow up with them, then? Because it was*emphatically* impressed onto me, from childhood, that you always have the fan on, if you're using the stove or oven. We've always had gas, because that's what Mom prefers to cook on, and yeah, if you're using the stove for anything, you have the fan on. Or, in cases of outage, either of fan, or power, you crack a window, so you don't Plath yourself.

[@Trendyflute]

@@sakurakiyori My parents are the ones who normalized the use of no fan, because it was noisy, and being aware of your own cognition might lead to uncomfortable discoveries so why notice your brain isn't working correctly while huffing combustion byproducts? Starting to use it coincided with one of the many *"...I think I've overestimated how much my parents know"* moments that happen as one adults.

[@th3oryO]

@@Trendyflute Fair. Poisoning your kids because you don't like slightly loud/annoying voices is a vibe, albeit one most parents only contemplate.

[@slome815]

@@Trendyflute We're not on coal gas anymore, methane and propane only have H2O and CO2 as combustion products. In any properly ventilated house this shouldn't be any problem. What is way worse are the burning oils and greases of actual cooking, which is why you always need a fume extractor. I don't have a gas stove, since my house has no gas connection and already had a ceramic stove installed. But I wish I had one, it's so much better then electric for a wok and it makes flambéing easier.

[@BoraHorzaGobuchul]

​@@slome815i don't like old-style electric cooktops myself but an induction one is crazy close to a gas cooktop in ux.

[@Jablicek]

Devon's edited comments speak to me so much more than the entire pod dedicated to aircraft (which I'm fascinated with, btw, so hyperfixation-mode activated) Also, Alice, John Lewis make an own-branded espresso pot for £30 that works on an induction stove. It's quite good - and cleaning the thing every time you use it is part of the ritual.

[@himoffthequakeroatbox4320]

You can get electric ones. Even 12V ones to use in a car.

[@banjojohn1489]

Since I started reading about aviation incidents and tragedies, there aren't many words or phrases that cause me the same feeling of chills and terror as the words "Phugoid Cycle". Just two absolutely horrible, horrible words that should NEVER appear together in the same sentence

[@GaldirEonai]

So I've looked at some of the materials for this one. There is one interesting detail that deserves mention here: One passenger moved seats, presumably to one of the empty first-class seats. He died. The passenger who ended up sitting in his original spot? Was apparently one of the _completely unharmed_ ones.

[@grmpEqweer]

😳

[@effluviah7544]

Final Destination shit. This is why I don't travel. I know some bullshit like this would happen.

[@kevinmbell91]

I can't wait to hear Alice freak out about how weird jet engines are! Do you know when you're on an airplane, the cabin is pressurized with air taken from the compressor? It's like if the heater in your car was using air heated and compressed by the cylinders to blow hot air on your shoes.

[@joshuagreen3185]

The difference being that in a piston engine, the compression and the fuel combustion happen in the same place but at different times, while in a turbine, they occur at the same time but in different places (thus making it possible to tap off compressed but not hydrocarbon-filled air).

[@kevinmbell91]

@@joshuagreen3185 true but in can tell you from experience that the bleed air based environmental control systems made by the lowest bidder DEFINITELY pull in some lubricants and weird smells from the compressor.

[@ChristopherHallett]

Technically your car DOES use air heated by the cylinders to blow hot air on your shoes. Indirectly, though. The cylinders heat the coolant, which is pumped to the heater core in your HVAC box behind your dash, and incoming (or recirculated cabin air if you're a sicko) air is heated by passing through that heater core. Hence, the heat goes from the combustion chamber through the cylinder wall into the coolant and from the coolant into the air in the car cabin.

[@NZSam85]

@@ChristopherHallett Whereas air-cooled Volkswagens simply passed cabin air through a box around the exhaust manifold to heat it. Much more direct, just pray you don't have any exhaust leaks.

[@BoraHorzaGobuchul]

​@@NZSam85oh yes, ye olde Gaswagen

[@SkyeFergus]

I hope there's a safety 3rd this time, it's my favorite part

[@thomasgiles2876]

🎶shake hands with danger Take a chance that they won't read it🎶

[@shadeitplease7383]

Same lol I was sad they skipped it. Though idk how they will ever top the guy that fell in acid

[@deeznoots6241]

@@thomasgiles2876ignoring the need for a safety third segment is a metajoke about how safety gets ignored

[@Alykat0]

@@shadeitplease7383 wait which episode was the acid guy. I completely forgot about that one

[@shadeitplease7383]

@@Alykat0 it was a recent one but I don’t remember what the topic was sorry!

[@MrxstGrssmnstMttckstPhlNelThot]

My COVID finally cleared up and I tested negative. The stakes for this being good are much less high than last time

[@fritzophrenia3146]

10:21 Bold of you to assume that every rental I've ever lived in hasn't ALREADY had the shitty coil stove

[@placeholdername000]

Every place I’ve ever lived in had the 70s stove with leaky pilot lights and no ventilation, at least shit coils won’t make me lightheaded while I’m burning my food!

[@grmpEqweer]

...my one apartment had a water heater that was ancient. The gas went down for the neighborhood for some reason, and inspectors had to restart the gas. I had to tell the inspector I was going to relight the pilot light on the P.O.S. up by myself if he didn't light it. He put a condemned tag on the tank, and lit it for me, very kind of him. 😊 Very drafty apartment. Not worried.

[@CarrieCole09]

The map of the plane's trajectory looks like "Billy on his way home" from comic strip The Family Circus

[@jonathanreiter2852]

30:05: Modern planes barely make their costs back in selling the plane itself, but instead get their margins from selling replacement parts. Boeing Commercial Airplanes when I worked there made upwards of 80% of its margin in part sales. Particularly on parts that had no competition like landing gear, certain avionics, control surfaces, and so forth. So in sum it's basically the same deal as home appliances!

[@cmarano]

Devon turned a vid-cast about a tragedy into the funniest WTYP podcast this year (okay, low bar, but still).

[@Cory_Springer]

I went to trivia night at my local brewery tonight and I got a point for knowing what a funicular was, it was suprising how very few people knew! Finally it pays off to listen to an engineering disaster podcast.

[@interstellarphred]

Ever hear about the sausage factory worker who became a vegetarian? I was in a jet engine factory; I take the train

[@b_g_kells]

The one time I break tradition and don't make myself a little coffee while listening to the new episode, there's little coffee discourse.

[@maxdelayer]

The only requirement to be able to wear aviators is a bare minimum of self confidence. If you aren't sure about the answer to the question "can I wear aviators", the answer is probably no. No one should let self doubt crush their will to wear aviators - with sunglasses, you will want to maximize surface area that's shaded, it's literally optimal! Reasonable people can disagree about glasses style and size but sunglasses are different, more area is more brightness blocked and less eye strain. The only aviator sin is transition lenses due to a suboptimal experience at both extremes for the sake of simplicity. However, if a pilot has aviators they do outrank you and are cooler than you in such a matchup, that is still an axiom regardless. But if you have perfect vision, fuck you, I have to pay a prescription premium to wear a single pair of sunglasses while you can pick up anything off the rack at dollar general. aviators is the one perk of that arrangement. This has been my aviator rant. Wear what you want to wear, dont psych yourself out of wearing a more comfortable thing because Tom Cruise did it in a movie or two

[@ernekid7241]

I spent this weekend wandering around Philadelphia taking SEPTA public transport. It was my WTYP Hajj

[@Teslin1212]

A Gimli glider episode would be amazing, more Chad piloting, and math. Seems like it be up this podcasts alley!

[@himoffthequakeroatbox4320]

It'd be quite a short one. _Murcans don't understand units. Now, safety third..._

[@Teslin1212]

​@@himoffthequakeroatbox4320 I mean it was a Frenchman who fucked up the Units but true to some extent haha

[@philipcollier7805]

This will be interesting to hear. Back in the day, when I was a commuter pilot. Al Haynes gave a talk at my local airport about UA232. Japan Air 123 was informative as an example of controlling a heavy jet with differential thrust.

[@miche1df]

Yeah, if anybody hasn't seen it, I'd highly recommend searching KZbin to find the lectures he gave after the flight. Really interesting insight into the CRM aspects of it.

[@Hevlikn]

YES MOKA POTS!! Is your pour over not strong enough? Do you not want to sell a kidney to get a real espresso machine? Do you drink a mug of espresso every morning? You need a Moka Pot!

[@francistheodorecatte]

I love explaining to my coworkers, as their faces continue to get more incredulous, that my almost empty 10oz coffee thermos was filled with strait espresso out of a moka pot, as I continue to yawn.

[@uhhhhism]

Every morning I grind my beans, and load up my moka, and make me a nice cup of coffee (on my gas stove, to own the libs of course)

[@CortezEspartaco2]

The only at-home method approved by everyone's nonna/abuela.

[@BoraHorzaGobuchul]

Once I learned about the Japanese cold brewing my life got way easier. Note that I otherwise use a fully automatic coffee machine that does it all for you, still, simply putting ground coffee into a jar with cold water and setting it in a fridge for 24 hours is somehow easier. Makes making cold coffee in summer a breeze.

[@AsbestosMuffins]

fun thing about high bypass fans is the fanblades are made to be loose and wiggly when the engine is cold and at rest, once the engine heats up and spins up everything fits together snugly, the issue is there's a bunch of things that can go wrong between those two operating states

[@GorgeDawes]

Hence the delightful tinkling noise one sometimes hears when a jet engine is spinning freely in the breeze while the aircraft is parked.

[@princeoftonga]

You just know Roz will be extolling the virtues of the L-1011 at some point!

[@mcamp9445]

No hull loses

[@rytedas]

@@mcamp9445 Saudia 163, Eastern 401 and Delta 191 would like a word.

[@princeoftonga]

@@mcamp9445 i think there have been hull losses but they were still much safer accident wise compared with the contemporary aircraft. Hell the RAF used them as tankers for a long time.

[@blackopscw7913]

@@princeoftonga 191 was a similar situation to this

[@mario387mario6]

The weird look comes from the 3rd engine, putting the center of gravity more to the rear, so the wings move a bit to the rear too.

[@misterakachan]

Just like when I'm playing Ultimate Admiral: Dreadnoughts

[@blackvulture6818]

Practicing some sincronized podcast listening together with my mom right now.

[@Hotrob_J]

I'd love to see a podcast collab between WTYP and Scott Manley. There's quite a few space disasters to pick from I'm sure

[@violetausterlitz1379]

tangential to the episode but: my grandpa worked for McDonnell, and then for McDonnell-Douglas, and there's a picture (from around 1960) of my grandma, my mom, and my aunt standing in front of a hangar on like a company open day or something, and just visible inside the open hangar door is one of the Mercury capsules. It's really cool.

[@NorfKhazad]

The flight manual: "Think how lucky you are that life has been good to you so far. Alternatively, if life hasn't been good to you so far, think how lucky you are that it won't be troubling you much longer."

[@Geosquare8128]

You guys should really make an episode on the 2003 northeast blackout its good content

[@maybemablemaples2144]

God I remember that. It was the hottest day on record and the first time I saw stars that wasn't outside of the city.....and how I learned about toilets not working on the 7th floor in an outage.

[@douglasboyle6544]

One of the people who survived this flight was a young-ish Denver area radio broadcaster named Jerry Schemmel who actually just recently retired from the business after a career of broadcasting Rockies and Broncos games. He was one of the few who was able to walk away from the crash and went back into the wreckage to see if he could help other people and ultimately was able to rescue an 11month old baby.

[@g.schiele6254]

Y’all should do BOAC Flight 911 next, one of the only times (possibly *the* only time) clear air turbulence has destroyed a plane in mid-flight. You should do that one especially because it nearly massacred the executive production team of You Only Live Twice. Albert Broccoli only dodged his meeting with the Maker because he (and the rest of the team) cancelled his ticket 30 minutes before departure to see a ninja show

[@MrJimheeren]

Tell me more about this ‘ninja’ show

[@computer_toucher]

Flight attendants are amazing and deal with so much shit there's not much that faze them. But it's fun to try (in a harmless manner). If you book a seat by an emergency exit, an atttendant usually give you the lowdown of your responsibilities should something happen. But they usually ask if you know about it first. That's when you give your best blank, dead stare and say "yeah I've done it before"

[@theodorekell]

Ernest Hemingway had 2 plane crashes but also survived a litany of other close calls. He was seriously wounded by a bomb while serving in Italy in World War I; was mauled by a lion; was in multiple car crashes; and experienced serious illnesses, including hepatitis and pneumonia. There was even the time he narrowly escaped with his life after flushing a toilet went wrong. In the end, he shot himself to death in 1961, suffering from the effects of age and physical ailments.

[@BoraHorzaGobuchul]

I'll have to research the toilet thing, sounds very intriguing from the engineering standpoint

[@Stealth86651]

Oh man, a metal-bird episode. Thanks so much for the effort/content, the work's greatly appreciated. Hope you guys are doing well.

[@IntervencionesGringas]

A second tummyache has hit the podcast

[@AsbestosMuffins]

you think vacuum forging is weird, they take those titanium parts now and put them in an Isostatic press which is basically a cylinder containing your parts, surrounded by a vat of molten tin, then loaded into a big press and squished down for 48 hours. its crazy how dense they can get materials with it

[@Lunahoyer7040]

My parent's house has a propane fireplace that as far as i can tell vents mostly to the ceiling. The house is mostly open plan so the fireplace is in a "great room" which goes all the way up to the second floor. Acending the stairs and reaching the landing, I am always buffeted by the smell of gas. glad im only visiting, although I couldn't impress upon my parents the problems with this (they never go to the second floor)

[@nekolalia3389]

what’s your least favourite pet bird species, because I have exactly one gift idea

[@kibels894]

Have you seen the electric stoves they put in apartments? They heat themselves up more than the pan cause the element is buried under half an inch of glass, and the contactors in the controls are so cheap they explode every once in awhile. The older style ones with the open coils are a luxury these days.

[@lars7935]

Just use induction. It's just as good as gas for cooking and barely any kore expensive as any other modern electric stove.

[@Dong_Harvey]

Oh yeah, open coil for life.. Also recycling aluminum foil to replace the burnt out drip pans

[@BoraHorzaGobuchul]

Induction for the win. Or you could go halogen for style points if you can find one

[@Madhouse_Media]

I remember Captain Hayes saying something about waking up in the hospital and one of his first memories was seeing footage of 232 on the news and asking his wife "jeez, who was that". He didn't believe her when she said it was his flight because it looked completely unsurvivable.

[@pamdemonia]

Just FYI, voltage is potential, thus 600v is the difference in potential between the third rail (considered "hot") and the regular track (considered "neutral") This means that assigning a voltage to the third rail is actually only a conceptual measurement. This is why my electrician brothers and sisters who do line work on high volt age transmission lines can do that work on live wires as long as they bring themselves up to the potential of the lines they are working on (usually via a pole and a helicopter) and don't touch anything not at that potential while working. It's pretty cool to see. Anyway, that's it for basic electricity for today. Love you guys so very much!

[@alexroselle]

Last time I was this early, McDonald’s Douglas was a separate company before it merged its inferior corporate culture with the more popular Boeing to produce the 737 MAX debacle

[@jtsholtod.79]

Who test flew their planes, Grimace or the Hamburglar?

[@alexroselle]

@@jtsholtod.79google “DC-10 copypasta”, or wait and someone else will inevitably post it in the comments

[@DisasterBreakdown]

Alright, I best grab some food for this one.

[@grmpEqweer]

Hi, good to see you! ...I need to spend more time in meatspace. 🤔

[@hikarikaguraenjoyer9918]

didnt expect to see you here

[@kazmark_gl8652]

Can I give special props to Devin for their joke about First Class in the edit. I just wanna do that.

[@fairestcat]

every time I watch one of your airplane-related eps I'm reminded of the time the plane I was on was hit by lightning and the pilot somehow thought "don't worry folks, we've just been hit by lightning," would somehow come across as reassuring rather than fucking terrifying.

[@stiltpuppy]

Saw the map at 1:07:17 and instantly started hearing the benny hill theme out of nowhere

[@AbsolXGuardian]

Guess the way to summon a wtyp episode is to have a bad day. Thank you for being a light in the darkness

[@davidwright7193]

The take home is if flying on a DC10 count the engines. There should be 3. If there are hope that it stays that way until you land.

[@grmpEqweer]

Maybe, make sure all the speed tape has been freshly applied?

[@davidwright7193]

@@grmpEqweer probably best to check that the cargo bay doors haven’t been secured with gaffer tape. That doesn’t end well either. Worst passenger aircraft designed until the MacDonald Douglas updated the 737 to the Max series.

[@aronsztojka6034]

Another one so soon? We're getting spoiled

[@parkerm1635]

I work for United in Sioux Falls which is just an hour away from Sioux City and I've been to the airport aswell and not to be disrespectful to victims/surivors or morbid but it's interesting to here an episode about a disaster that's local to me

[@Tzilandi]

Subliminal Devon isn't real. Subliminal Devon can't hurt you. Subliminal Devon: 0:26

[@123i123i1]

The goddam news: Scholz grounds every Leopard ever - until Abrams are delivered

[@abigailskoda8958]

Most crappy electric ranges don't bother me anymore after living in a house with a 60s push button electric range for a couple years 😭

[@dubuyajay9964]

Yikes. This is the plane that did the cartwheel isn't it? I remember seeing the footage as a kid. Poor passengers and crew.

[@georgeg2041]

Just finished listening to the previous episodes and was sad that I was out of wtypp, and then got this notification :). Impeccable timing

[@lexp6099]

I will continue to defend transition lenses. Some of us live in bright places but rarely leave our respective caves. However I also have a mullet and that may not help sway some people.

[@Eloraurora]

Seconding the transition lens support, with the added argument that the alternatives (fit-over sunglasses, weird little clip-on sunglass lenses) tend to be significantly more awkward/bad at UV protection.

[@MalenkyGoblin]

Errol Morris interviewed Denny Fitch about his experience in a short documentary series, "Leaving the Earth". Denny is an incredible storyteller and has such a gentle and thoughtful demeanor when he speaks. It should still be on KZbin and I highly recommend people go watch it. Sadly, Denny died of brain cancer in 2012.