What do White Americans Owe Black People? Jason D. Hill on Racial Justice

The Michael Shermer Show # 231
A conversation with Jason D. Hill on what white Americans owe black people.
Shermer probes the philosopher on the arguments for and against reparations. They also discuss multiple dimensions of race in America today, including a black-white divide which has grown exponentially over the past decade.
Jason D. Hill is a professor of philosophy and Honors Distinguished Faculty at DePaul University in Chicago. He is the author of five books, including We Have Overcome: An Immigrant’s Letter to the American People. He specializes in ethics, politics, foreign policy, and moral psychology.
SUPPORT THE PODCAST
If you enjoy the podcast, please show your support by making a $5 or $10 monthly donation.
www.skeptic.co...
SPONSOR
Wondrium
wondrium.com/s...
#michaelshermer
#skeptic
Listen to The Michael Shermer Show via Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, Google Podcasts, Stitcher, iHeartRadio, and TuneIn.
www.skeptic.co...

[@sprinkle2513]

The state should be strictly prohibited from discriminating, but the people should be free to associate and trade with whom they please.

[@captaincheese-beard6316]

About the single mum discussion: Here in Brussels about 30% of kids live under the poverty line and the number one predictor of that child poverty is if you grow up in a single mother household combined with your mother being from African descent.

[@AddMoreQuarters]

I don't owe anyone sh!t

[@henryroberts1233]

If I owe black people reparations, then the italians owe me reparations for the Celtic genocide. 100 pre-augustinian Denari/year will do it.

[@rickyrayrosenberg420]

Well - my neanderthal ancestors were wiped out by Africans when they migrated out of Africa - so they owe me reparations too.

[@thomasgilson6206]

You can collect after the italians collect from Germany for the sack of Rome 404 AD

[@billlyons7024]

Excellent conversation, thank you both.

[@masterofnone8400]

I get why Michael would point out that the guy is black (honestly he doesn't look black he looks like one of his parents were white) given the current milieu but we have to get past this obsessing over skin colour. An argument should be judged on its merits and the ethnicity of the individual making the argument is irrelevant.

[@tayaotto3484]

I think I may disagree with the indigenous parts. There were massacres that were unprovoked n done by the colonial military to indigenous peoples. The movement west, not only forcing AND bounties for "dead indians" was also a thing. And the forced assimilation led to murders too. Those are intentioned. It wasn't as organized a genocide like Hilter, but really do we split hairs on them?

[@paulburgess5111]

Wow! A nuanced point of view. I feel like this point of view is obvious but you rarely here it. Hopefully our national conversation can evolve into something like this.

[@jps0117]

Jason Hill is right. I think that, if we want better lives for the Native Americans, Palestinians, etc., we should imagine the best possible future and work from here (2021) to there (a future point in time), considering vectors of possibility, rather than focus inordinately on the past.

[@zebrawien]

I do not owe anyone anything and I treat people the same, period. Takes a few seconds to diggest but long to manifest.

[@viewingthetube45]

I feel I owe those who have made this nation wealthy and offered me such a high standard of living. This nation was made wealthy by slavery. Do you feel entitled to the wealth millions of people produced while enslaved? That seems extremely egotistical and entitled.

[@dgh5760]

Equal opportunity starts with equal primary education where every child everywhere receives the same high quality teaching and learning in the basics of reading (phonetic), technology literacy, and conservative mathmatics. That will allow each child to achieve their potential and have access to post secondary technical training programs or intellectual programs as they are inclined. Adopting this policy would change the country within 2 generations. This has nothing to do with race and everything to do with class.

[@chb762]

He's also right about the issue of the Native Americans. I'm putting this book on my to-read list.

[@c0bra969]

Keep it up Shermer.

[@AK-yx4wc]

Isn't there anything that comes from the US that is not about race!?

[@lukaradojevic7195]

Gender?LGBTQ? They have a lot of products..C'mon man..

[@AK-yx4wc]

@@lukaradojevic7195 👍🏻you are right, I stand corrected

[@rickyrayrosenberg420]

Well we are in the middle of a race based Communist revolution so it's a it's a cancer that seems to metastasize in every type of media.

[@AK-yx4wc]

@@rickyrayrosenberg420 active measures seem to have worked well...so we'll that even skeptics follows the flow.

[@rickyrayrosenberg420]

@@AK-yx4wc 60 years of obedience training has an impact

[@Seekthetruth3000]

Intelligent guest. Thanks.

[@viewingthetube45]

Prior to the Civil War 60% of US exports consisted of cotton and tobacco. These industries provided tremendous wealth as the economic foundation of the United States. The textile Mills in the North, infrastructure, industry, military and macroeconomic global advantage would not have been as strong if not for Black slave labor. Please stop the myth the sole reason for American wealth was "my immigrant ancestors worked hard". All humans throughout history worked hard but at least admit the nation was made wealthy by exploiting millions of Black people. The free labor of millions of Black slaves afforded you the enjoyment of living in this wealthy nation. This is a fact.

[@fainitesbarley2245]

Well slavery made a small number of big landowners rich. This does put money into the economy but nowhere like as much as the emphasis on family farms and businesses as in the north. Hence the vastly greater overall wealth and development of the north. Hence the backwardness and defeat of the south. Also - numerically the importation numbers into the US as compared to South America is very small. Yet South America states are not hugely wealthy world powers. The British empire reached its great extent and power in areas without slavery and subsequent after abolishing slavery. I’m not saying slavery didn’t create wealth for those involved in the trade and plantation owners. However, the trade was one of many and plantation systems actually created not only the conditions of slavery but also the impoverishment and lack of opportunity for the majority of the ordinary, non-slave and non-slave owning population. Hence the poor white population being variously named ‘waste people’, ‘swamp people’ and ‘trash’. In the north these were the people who built farms, industry and wealth. In the south they were excluded from workable land and society in general. The Caribbean slavery produced huge wealth for plantations over the years. This was a relatively modest number of aristocratic types who lived like filthy rich aristos usually do. The Romans had similar issues. Instead of having large numbers of family farms forming the bedrock of their society, with no or a few slaves, they moved more and more towards huge farming concerns with vast numbers of slaves and the constant movement of wealth upwards to and increasingly distant and small elite. This resulted in the destruction and impoverishment of the middle classes and the dispossession of the Roman poor who became almost entirely dependent on the ‘grain dole’. The Muslim slave trade from Africa was longer lived and substantially larger than the Atlantic trade. In addition they had an equally substantial slave trade up through the Caucasus and from Europe. The caliphate s and then the Ottoman Empire were very large, powerful and expansionist. It hasn’t made them wealthy or well developed in the long run though. Current Middle Eastern wealth comes entirely from oil, not a 1,300 year history of being slave-dependent societies. We should not distort or exaggerate certain aspects of history to pursue a current ideology.

[@viewingthetube45]

@@Amero2323 There were 4,000,000 slaves in 1860 alone.

[@viewingthetube45]

@@fainitesbarley2245 I'm ignoring all of the straw man arguments and your attempts to discuss numerous unrelated topics that are in no way related to the wealth created by slaves in the United States. The rich red clay soils in the south combined with forced slave labor produced a cotton and tobacco yield at high levels unachievable any where else in the world. Your belief that a few people becoming wealthy doesn't benefit the overall economy, infrastructure, and wealth of a nation is so far removed from reality i won't take the time to address. It's similar to saying Elon Musk, Rockefeller, or Jeff Bezos don't benefit the overall US economy and all of their wealth only benefits them. I suggest reading an econ 101 book.

[@fainitesbarley2245]

@@viewingthetube45 You haven’t read what I said with any care.

[@johnnyphilon7506]

And that is history. And that's where it stays. Reparation should not be just handed out for an era that is part of our history. If that's the case, where's our reparation for the thousands upon thousands of men and women who died FORCED to fight in the civil war? Not asked, but forced. Now YOU tell me what's the difference here?

[@sirsidfosse1313]

I'm a debt free wasp.

[@beephex1]

And I have a skeeter on my Peter, dear sir

[@sirsidfosse1313]

@@beephex1 how can I get one?

[@chb762]

Great talk. As he mentions, there has never been an in-depth look into the actual causality of group differences by many in the intelligentsia and media class. Instead, there is simply the forwarding of a scientifically lazy and ideological narrative. Thomas Sowell writes on this in "Intellectuals and Society" as well as "Discriminations and Disparities," both of which I would highly recommend to any viewers of this video.

[@masterofnone8400]

Strange that u did not talk about the biological differences (and psychological) between men and women that explain difference in interest. Instead u left the implication that sexism was the explanatory variable, which in todays world is not true.

[@romanski5811]

Are there systemic racist outcomes?

[@crazierthan-u7571]

I also noticed that the biological influence on what jobs men and women choose wasn't mentioned, but the factor he did talk about was something I hadn't heard before and is definitely worth considering. Yet another thread of nuance to weave into this already incredibly complex study.

[@romanski5811]

@@crazierthan-u7571 Which factor is that?

[@crazierthan-u7571]

@@romanski5811 Go in about 15 minutes, when Michael starts talking about Sally Ride.

[@francescos7361]

Thanks Micheal love you

[@ericm6415]

45:00 - How is society responsible for procreation decisions? Because in the scope of poor people having babies they can't take care of, that isn't a result of people deciding to have a baby... They are deciding to "have sex" because their day-to-day life is such a miserable experience from one moment to the next, with no real expectation of a better life, that momentary pleasures such as sex are very welcomed intermissions from the standard level of misery. "But... people know where babies come from" ... Sure... "most" people do. But the poorer the community, the less likely they are to get proper sex education which can significantly help with factors related to mental preparation. We didn't evolve to have "responsible sex"... we evolved to have a desire to "have sex" because that emotional response was significantly beneficial to reproduction and survival of our species.

[@ransakreject5221]

If anyone should pay it’s the Democratic Party

[@Muonium1]

*BASED* Carribeans

[@nitahill6951]

What about the treaties that the US Gov reneged on with the Native Americans?

[@Rainy_Day12234]

To treat them as equals.

[@nobodyexceptme7794]

That's truly all it should come down to, but that burden is on the white ppl who as a whole have shown they don't want to do that. They don't want a justice system where sentencing is equal across the board, they don't want to hire strictly based on merit, they don't want to make sure minority areas get the same funding and resources. The history of this country shows time and time again...when minorities are succeeding outside of the mainstream.....white ppl resort to violence, unlawful behavior, changing laws, and subjugation. This is a country that committed millions of government funds to try and undermine a preacher speaking of love and equality. A country that tried to convince that preacher to commit suicide (and in all likelihood probably had something to do with his assassination). It's a country where just a few decades ago black business men would outbid white ones then are murdered and the government looks the other way as their property is taken. One where today legitimate black businessmen still deal with an increase of attempts to undermine their ownership and property rights that others do not. It's a country where a black family is given lower appraisals on property unless they send a white face to speak for them. So how long are minorities supposed to wait until white ppl truly make everything equal? How can you make everything equal when so many in power are proudly racist and were born into a society built on racist ideals? If this was 2080 and our oldest senators and congressmen were born in 2000-2010s its another conversation, but we aren't in that time. We are in the present where the majority of those in power in this country were born in the 40s and 50s to think of anything other than white ppl as lesser than human and free and to be used as tools for white prosperity instead of fellow human beings.

[@mitchkahle314]

Religion is not an innate trait. Except for childhood indoctrination by religious parents or peers, religion is a choice and may be rejected. Skin color is entirely innate, as are sex, age, ethnicity, national origin, sexual orientation, and gender identity. Therefore religion does not deserve the same level of protection as innate biological traits.

[@rickyrayrosenberg420]

None of those traits have any meaning outside culture. In your culture - you have no belief in gods - but you have belief in the psychological reliability of a mentally ill person who wants to remove their reproductive organs because they "identify" as something else. Sexual orientation is also not necessarily innate. Behavior that is culturally encouraged or proscribed can have a huge impact on how young imprint and what they think of when they become of sexual age. This can be seen pretty clearly with people that are victims of childhood sexual abuse - and their resultant behavior with regard to sex. In Papua New Guinea there is a tribe whose cultural belief is that young boys receive their skill in hunting by having oral sex with the men out on hunting trips. This would be considered pedophilia and sexual relations with children - or homosexuality if the child imprints on this and has later proclivities - but its entirely a function of culture. I am an atheist. But I certainly understand that religion is something most humans need to function. If they do not have a supernatural religion - they will adopt a secular religion - like yours. They will still have dogma and faith - and will accept the morality structures of this shared belief - with or without a supernatural component to it. You can see this clearly in the modern left.

[@waynemcauliffe2362]

I`m a poor white Aussie.If someone of another color does wrong to me what then?

[@DeconvertedMan]

31:00 but then - the argument could be made if a state has not done anything against (X) race/group etc then a business could do it- but then the question is how long must a state NOT do that?

[@jameslabs1]

Privilege is a terrible and wrong word to use in many ways. If I’m born in a wealthy family, good looking, well schooled I have an advantage over others. A privilege could be something given by a king and haha taken away by him as well.

[@wraithofsolidarity]

"The Supreme Court ruled Thursday that about half of the land in Oklahoma is within a Native American reservation as stated in treaties." 2020. This is regards to a 'land grab' where many tribes were wiped out if they opposed the action. If you're Native, you're going to be a bit salty about stuff like this. It's all understandable and evil doesn't exist.

[@rickyrayrosenberg420]

Every piece of land on which people have ever existed has been fought over and held by blood. Rivers and rivers of blood. This pretend notion that somehow the current people in this country have no right to be here because people a hundred years ago conquered another nation is nonsensical and ahistorical. It is the result of 60 years of obedience training to which we have all been subjected in modern media and public schools. No other people are trained to think that that they have no right to exist but white people of European descent.

[@agaperion]

@@rickyrayrosenberg420 *I agree.* _Howeverrr..._ the US federal government has for many years been in violation of its treaties with various indigenous tribes across the land. That's just a fact. Either honor treaties or throw them in the trash and admit that they're not going to be honored. Instead, the parasites in DC do the same to those documents as they do to the Constitution: Pay lip service and then ignore.

[@wraithofsolidarity]

@@rickyrayrosenberg420 Without presuming who you are, I'd like to hear that from a Native consensus and I fear that view doesn't exist in the wake of inequality. Are you an expert on the morals of BLM, the holocaust or Amazonian rights? Why don't we talk about the holocaust even though it was 80 years ago with most of those that went through it deceased? When are Non-Jewish people going to begin telling Jews how they should feel?

[@rickyrayrosenberg420]

@@wraithofsolidarity inequality?! You are not equal to yourself on 2 different days. People raised in the same household that make different life choices have vastly different outcomes. They are not equal. People that choose to incentivize personal pleasure over financial gain end up not having equal net worth. Intelligence is not equal between individuals. Work ethic is not equal between individuals.. Culture is not equal between individuals. So why on Earth would anyone expect you to be able to cut up large groups of people into arbitrarily defined categories based on something as ridiculous as percentage of skin melanin and expect there to be equality in any of these groups - in any criteria? The entire concept is a Marxist lie. It implies that any difference between individuals is caused by the person who is less successful being exploited by the person that is more successful. It is a talking point used to manipulate low IQ people that don't understand they will never be equality even in their Communist utopia. The best you can hope for with any of this is to treat people without regard to personal criteria under the law. Even then - no matter what - in any political system - you're not going to have equal outcomes for 2 individuals because every individual circumstance is different. You also won't have outcomes that are identical based upon an arbitrarily defined block of people - again, categorized based upon skin melanin or nationality or ethnic break down or family history or anything else. But the tool of claiming that you don't have something because someone else hurt you is a tool used all the time. BLM have no morals. It is specifically a group created on a lie that uses terrorism to demand resources from people who are too frightened and naive to understand what the game is. An examination of crime statistics indicates that there is no appreciable difference in policing between races. But there is a large difference in criminality. Going in to places like Chicago or Memphis or Saint Louis - shows this clearly. It's not even a function of income. But when you break things down to end to individuals making individual choices, if choices, that is from where the differences in these groups arise. People that choose short term gain over long term investment end up involved in criminality at a higher rate than people who make other choices. People who make choices to undertake high risk - low reward - opportunities end up having worse life outcomes. There is nothing race based about this. But people's choices are certainly influenced by their culture. No one alive today experienced the trail of tears or the westward expansion or the fall of Rome. Do we pretend forever that blood libels emerging from these historic events are presently traumatizing people? Or do we accept that there is no clean history? The best we can hope for is to treat each other today the way we would like to be treated as best we can. I don't have to have had a relative experience the holocaust or the Holodomor or the killing fields of Pol Pot or the Great Leap Forward to understand that horrible things happen in this world. In my lifetime I've watched several genocides. I've watched the mass murder of people for political ends. I've watched wars being fomented and mass killing happening based upon lies about weapons of mass destruction or lies about the nature of political difference or lies about skin color and tribe. You can continue to play this game where you have collective guilt and collective responsibility for things from which there was no collective gain or collective ownership or collective choice. I accept the reality that there is no collective. I cannot go to Bill Gates and demand money from him based upon us sharing a similar percentage of skin melanin. But if he and I were in a group the average net worth in that group would be in the millions. That same game of averages and lies is at the heart of all of these historic claims of grievance. It is petty, it is ahistorical, and it just leads to a continuation of the cycle of hate and violence people pretend they want to stop.

[@ceeyaaa]

Interesting guest and viewpoints. Education and guidance during childhood would make all the difference on children giving birth to children and also on a host of other bad decisions. The question is how to achieve the education and guidance for ALL. History shows it is not just blacks who have a disadvantage; there has been poverty and disproportionate wealth for centuries.

[@DeconvertedMan]

Nothing. Oh - good he is against it. Thank goodness.

[@bxdxggxdxb2775]

Gus Fring?

[@Anticleric]

How angry was he when he turned off that light switch behind him?

[@MoonChildMedia]

This question just like most everything about our culture today is preposterous! What do black people who enslaved Italians or Slavs owe their descendants? There is no race of people who has not been enslaved by their own race or other races. What do Black Americans owe Black Americans....blacks have enslaved blacks in the past, have they not? Let's not be asinine. See kzbin.info/www/bejne/pabQdmWtp6tnfKM

[@christianbolt5761]

Good discussion. Using a running race for an analogy is interesting given west Africans have dominated.

[@rickyrayrosenberg420]

its a poor analogy. Its based on assumptions about people in group dynamics that are little more that hate based stereotypes. Using averages without noting the mode of a distribution is often the tool used by leftists to demand concessions based on those averages. But when you do multivariate analysis you can see very clearly that these simple analogies fall flat under scrutiny.

[@pakalak3]

The differing of conquering and stealing is confusing to me here. Like of course it was conquered but that doesn't mean that it also wasn't stolen. I think conquering and stealing go hand in hand.

[@chb762]

It's called history. You might want to read some of it sometime.

[@SlyNine]

Humans have always fought for resources, it's an endless chain that extends back forever.

[@meinking22]

I really enjoyed how nuanced Dr. Hill's thinking was on these matters. I will certainly be buying and reading this book. Especially his reference to the "sloppiness" and lack of rigor by the likes of Kindy and Jones, one might think those individuals were trumpeting their causes in an opportunistic way rather than out of a real concern for justice, in the same manner a grifter would.

[@Slipknlov]

i'm gonna come back after there's more than 50 comments to flip through..

[@BrianBattles]

I wish Michael wouldn't say "troothes" as the plural of "truth".

[@crazierthan-u7571]

Mr. Hill presents some unusual, challenging ideas. I agree with Michael, though -- Hill must have a death by cancelation wish. And omg, I cringed every time he used forms of the word "eugenic"! I was really wishing he'd find a less thought-freezing term to describe whatever the hell it was that didn't have anything to do with eugenics.

[@williamvorkosigan5151]

Who are the greatest modern day beneficiaries of the North Atlantic Slave Trade? Well, the poorest African American is among the richest 10% of black people on earth, so there is that. I am not familiar with a great trend of African Americans emigrating to Sub Saharan African Countries. African American's voting with their feet in staying put I guess. However bad it might be claimed living in the US is for a black person, the answer seems to be, not as bad as living in a Sub Saharan African country. Micheal Eric Dyson doesn't seem to be seeking a teaching post in a Nigerian University.

[@rickyrayrosenberg420]

Well Dyson's job seems to be too convince white leftists elitites in the West to economically torture and destroy less affluent white people in an effort to pay back a blood libel. His grift would have little utility with the Chinese who are the current economic owners of Africa.

[@agaperion]

How many of these grievance types do you think have ever even been outside the United States? What they "know" about places like Africa they were told by NPR, CNN, and NYT. But, as you say, they don't go and would never live there. It's easier to pretend as if blacks didn't have an opportunity to leave the country and have their own (Twice, kinda: Liberia and Linconia). Those who did make that return trip found building a prosperous nation isn't as easy as it may seem.

[@nonserviam751]

Nothing whatever.

[@thomanderson7981]

Dr HILL is a Jamaican, an immigrant & not a descendant of enslaved ppl in America. Therefore, he's ignorant of the history that I as a black man growing up in America has an intimate & implicit knowledge of that he will never know!

[@sircharlesnot]

Absolutely nothing

[@stanislavmauzy8384]

I think reparations followed by segregation is necessary...I know it may hurt in the short run but it will be better in the long run It is the only way forward. Too much conflict has been between the races. Every race should live with its own. Segregation is the key to a peaceful society. No racism possible if you don't live with each other

[@alanadams6723]

People will just start being racist towards the people in the group. People have been being racist towards each other as long as we have been here. Most forms of racism have been against people who now adays are considered the same race. In Japan they still racially discriminate against Chinese Koreans Mongolians ect. I cant tell any of those people apart but they still are racist against them. People will find something to hate about the group they are in.

[@Frodojack]

Stanislav Mauzy That's just dumb. You want reparations and then you want segregation? You want a new Jim Crow? Should all the interracial marriages break up? Should biracial and multiracial people take their own lives? Sorry, but your "solution" not only shows no thought whatsoever, but is in itself racist.

[@rickyrayrosenberg420]

I owe no blood libel to anyone. You people are racist.

[@veridicusmaximus6010]

@@alanadams6723 That's not racism - racism is actually fairly recent in human history. The kind of prejudice you are talking about is national, cultural, religious, class status, etc.

[@carsonb6136]

Races are not actual Distinct groups and people always hate. If black Americans were never here, you wouldn’t see all whites as one group. There would be lot hate between different European heritages. Actually, race relations are good and get along well in urban areas in this country. Look at Uganda as well and there genocide and Jews and Palestinians. 2 examples of peoples closest together genetically.

[@mitchkahle314]

Today's equivalent of 40 acres and a mule would be about $150,000 per family. Pay up!

[@rickyrayrosenberg420]

You first.

[@fainitesbarley2245]

All those poor whites promised land in the South that they never got are owed too then. All hoovered up by slave owning aristo types.

[@doctorisout]

Greatest episode ever. 😉 Joking. (I have faith) Just started watching ... just dropped.

[@beephex1]

Put down the pipe, Kunkel

[@doctorisout]

I did. The episode dropped at the top of the hour; felt great 2b first. Thats all

[@Gi-Home]

To pretend that race and class no longer exists is to perpetuate injustice, incredibly naive.

[@Marriedrebels]

Just to be nice...and to tell them that rap music is awful.

[@mitchkahle314]

Stolen land is a fact. What to do about it is the question. If my white great grand parent's stole your native great grand parent's land, and I inherited the stolen land from my grand parents and parents and continue to occupy and benefit from free use of the land, year after year, don't I have a moral obligation to give it back?

[@rickyrayrosenberg420]

All land is gained and kept by violence and war. Its no more stolen than the land the natives stole from each other for 10k years - or stole from the animals that lived on those ranges when they wiped out the megafauna in North and South America after the last glaciation. By your logic no one should be able to even eat. The meat you have gained from killing an animal is stolen meat. The plants you harvest are stolen plants. Your perspective is naïve and childish - and completely ahistorical. But sadly - its what is drummed into children these days in every leftist public indoctrination center.

[@fainitesbarley2245]

Yeah but they don’t. All those virtue signalling colleges which constantly ‘acknowledge’ they are on ‘stolen land’. Give it back or shut up about it.

[@edinazsiga8608]

@@rickyrayrosenberg420 so many good points. Thanks for all your thoughtful input. You're bringing up even things most people haven't even touched on.

[@SteveN-qo5uv]

This isn’t practical. My grandparents were Polish holocaust survivors who came to Canada after the war. They lost everything and it never occurred to them to try and get it back in the decades after leaving Europe. Their lands/houses were taken by Poles after the Germans left, and that was that. The only way land could be “returned” to Native tribes/groups would be for the government to expropriate lands from the current owners at fair market value and then turn it over to those Native groups. Which of course would end up in the courts since land owners can challenge the validity of an expropriation. Would be interesting.

[@arthur1658]

How far do you want to go back in time? The white settlers in America took the land from the native "americans" who were there first. They then subjugated them along with slaves from Africa. Same thing happened in south America with the Spanish and Portuguese. It's only a thing because it's relatively recent in history. Go back 500 or a few thousand years. The same thing was happening in Asia and Europe. Romans did it across most of Europe. Vikings did it. The french did it when they invaded england. The Greeks did it, the Egyptians did it etc etc. Not to mention the USSR after WW2 Should we ask them all to give back what they stole and pay reparations? Might be a bit tricky. What a mess the world is 😔

[@heteroerectus]

Don't worry guys I'm paid up. I posted a black square on social media last year. So, yeah I'm a pretty good person.