What if Gandalf Took the Ring? | Tolkien Theory

"Gandalf as Ring-lord would have been far worse than Sauron" - JRR Tolkien. Today, using my usual weekly level of research, I've created a plausible scenario that could to Gandalf taking the One Ring and replacing the Dark Lord. There's some safe bets in here, in addition to some longshots, but it's all in good fun! Let me know in the comments what you think would happen if the Grey wizard claimed the ring for himself!
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Gandalf, Aragorn, & Samwise - Donato Giancola
Gandalf in Moria - Donato Giancola
Gandalf Pensive - Donato Giancola
Gandalf and Aragorn - Reacool
Gandalf and Theoden - Tolman Cotton
Gandalf the Grey - Matt DeMino
Gandalf before Denethor - Alan Lee
Theoden - Harlis Suardana
Aragorn - Ian Fee
Gandalf Attacks Dol Guldur - John Howe
King Theoden and Wormtongue - Greg and Tim Hildebrandt
Looking into the Stone - Kuliszu
Rivendell - Zak Seymour
Rohirrim - Gellihana Art
Nazgul - Rui Goncalves
The Hermit - bnolin
The King of the Golden Hall - Ullakko
The Riders of Rohan - Ted Nasmith
Nazgul Rider - William Nunez
Orthanc - Alan Lee
The Ringwraiths - Anato Finnstark
Nazgul on Weathertop - Anato Finnstark
The Nine - Anato Finnstark
Boromir Arrives to Rivendell - Joshua Cairos
The Council of Elrond - Alan Lee
Frodo and Gandalf in Bag End - Raul Vitale
Gandalf and Frodo Examine the Ring - Donato Giancola
Gandalf and Theoden - Kacik Rohanskiej
Gandalf and Saruman - Angelo Montanini
Gandalf in Minas Tirith - Anke Eissman
Nazgul - Allrich Art
Saruman and the Palantir - Greg and Tim Hildebrandt
Saruman - AIMaNeGrA
Saruman's Staff - Alexandr Elichev
Bilbo and Gandalf - Tim Kirk
Wrath of Galadriel - Zyrexthez
Bag End - Wictorian Art
Minas Tirith: Hall of Kings - Hayo Koekkoek
The Shire - Liam Tart
Minas Tirith - Ludovic Bourgeois
Dol Guldur - Michael Merc
Orthanc in the Second Age - Ted Nasmith
Barad-dur - Steve Firchow
The Shire, A View of Hobbiton - Ted Nasmith
An Enemy Revealed - Laurence Andrew Page
Cthumang Darth Vader Gandalf & Sauron - Joujeen
Denethor Son of Ecthelion - Joshua Cairos
Gandalf and Dumbledore - Rodolfo Gurreiro
Check out these resources for this and more info about Smaug, the Dragons of the North, and the War of Dwarves and Dragon:
The Lord of the Rings
Unfinished Tales
The Encyclopedia of Arda
Tolkien Gateway
Theonering.net “Today in Middle-earth History” Calendar
#gandalf #tolkien #lordoftherings

[@NerdoftheRings]

Be sure to hit SUBSCRIBE to get your dose of Middle-earth each week! Check out my latest Tolkien Theory video: What if Smaug Survived?! - kzbin.info/www/bejne/f5eboKOJatWHpas

[@asabovesobelow5368]

@Marvin Bass go away bass. No one is listening. Keep your cult. Your the same as BLM

[@Blackpheonix99]

@@asabovesobelow5368 not defending him cause I find it annoying as well but you do know lord of the rings is heavily based on that cult you speak of right?!

[@Blackpheonix99]

While I agree with 98% of this theory I think the ring may have corrupted gandalf more and possibly made gandalf a new sauron or fuse with sauron somehow possibly rid the taint of man and establish an order with elves or some other creature/race to truly rule over middle earth and more

[@xxRamD3yruxx]

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth. This very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be "cured" against one's will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on a level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals. ― C.S. Lewis

[@Charok1]

well real life humans are mostly greedy hypocrites and the only way to keep them from doing harm to others is a real threat of harm to themselves, so Gandalf made their world better if it is like ours.

[@thehelmsdepot]

He will bring peace, freedom, justice, and security to his new empire.

[@NerdoftheRings]

His new empire?! Our allegiance is to the republic, to democracy!!

[@meghanidels9883]

Only a Sith deals in absolutes

[@benl2140]

Anakin, Chancellor Gandalf is evil!

[@example6978]

@@benl2140 from my point of view the hobbits are evil

[@benl2140]

@@example6978 Well, then you are lost!

[@patrickstar5136]

I love how Boromir just pointlessly travels around the world for the entire story.

[@samwrai]

Right? Lmao

[@aliasmcdecoy8349]

He would also make Gandalfs perfect puppet king so eager to please a father figure

[@HerosTheme]

😂 LOL

[@blazedean725]

Then he gets crowned king out of no where

[@TheHuginandMugin]

At least he is alive, had a nice peaceful journey and became King. So i think he is the true winner here.

[@MrXScarFacexTV]

Boromir really did nothing but ride his horse to and back from rivendale only to become king. What a champ. Total hero.

[@MarvinT0606]

He'd most likely fight Gandalf instead of taking the throne. Remember, Boromir loves the People of Gondor above all others. He'd realize Gandalf is trying to enslave Gondor and flee with his brother to resist him. It'll be like Red Dawn but set in Middle-Earth with Denethor's sons leading the rebellion.

[@Donnybrook10]

Galdalf: I killed your Father... oh, and Aragorn, but don't be mad Bro cuz you're King when I'm not around. High five! Boromir : Cool...so, where's Arwen at? I'm gonna get me some of that.

[@mrknockknock1]

@@Donnybrook10 This man understands the deep lore like none other. Give him many thumbs ups! :P

[@trueredpanda1538]

​@@MarvinT0606That depends, did he know Gandalf has the one ring or not?

[@Zorstor]

😂😂

[@Bakamoichigei]

The idea of Gandalf turning Middle Earth into some kind of dystopian police state under the watchful eyes of his nazgul enforcers is both fascinating and terrifying. And yeah, Gandalf being like "Well, have it your way..." and just straight-up incinerating Denethor _is_ pretty amusing. 🤣 And Boromir spending the whole time just wandering all over the countryside, always missing whatever's going on, only to finally arrive home and be like "What'd I miss?" and have Gandalf make him King of Gondor? I am _dying._ 😂😂😂😂

[@Dogsparkster]

reading your comment, i lost it at the boromir moment, i can just imagine him wandering the trollshaws lost while all the interesting stuff is going on. lmao

[@sentientmustache8360]

“What did i miss?” “Your dad’s dead, here’s the crown” “Cool”

[@donutlovingwerewolf8837]

@@sentientmustache8360 "Also I need an army" "Aight man"

[@KicktheSky34]

Funnily, this kind of reminds me of the plot of this old PS2 game called LotR: The Third Age where you play as an off-brand Fellowship perpetually lagging behind the real one...

[@Backonos]

the order Sauron wanted

[@Menthix]

Imagine if in an alternate universe this is cannon, and someone made a video about a theory with Gandalf not accepting the ring from Frodo, but instead sendt him off to Mordor with his gardner. Just imagine the like-dislike ratio on that video.

[@McBrideRH]

It would seem really messed up bc we'd assume he was condemning the simple gardner to become another Golem. "But Gandalf would never do that!"

[@sirharryharry1665]

That would give "the man in the high castle" a new meaning lol

[@qwertyb18]

It would seem really illogical as the eagles could just fly Frodo to Mt. Doom.

[@PigreKo]

@@McBrideRH thus the greatest writer is revealed, as he made one very hard to believe plot point its best feature. Tolkien was a beast.

[@nicknickson2734]

I felt I had to snap shot this comment lol

[@Cloud.Strife]

Let us be thankful that the one ring of power did not fall into the hands of a Took. For this outcome would lead to the creation of something far more vile and sinister... Third breakfast...

[@praetorian3902]

Great comment.

[@whereismycup]

100 years later: WHAT ABOUT 4TH BREAKFAST

[@burpostockings]

4th breakfast, 8th breakfast, 19th breakfast... The horror would only grow as fat as the hobbits under his rule

[@shastanarnian233]

Just like Fast and Furious series ))

[@L33T_Taco]

This fucking comment is underrated xD lol, or also instead of "elevensies, theres thirtensies"

[@dark7element]

The interesting thing about this theory is that if it had happened, Sauron wouldn't have been surprised at all. Dismayed, yes, but not surprised. Something like this is exactly what Sauron expected to happen if his most powerful enemies like Gandalf got hold of the ring. Sauron couldn't even conceive that someone would willingly try to destroy the ring until the very moment that Frodo put on the ring in the chamber above Mount Doom. He always assumed that anyone who got the ring would use its power for themselves.

[@bzqp2]

Didn't he know about Isildur and Elrond? They set the precedent and were pretty close to destroying the ring. With how circular all the events in Tolkien's World are Sauron would surely at least consider it to be a possibility.

[@Ryplinn]

@@bzqp2 I feel like Sauron may have been a bit distracted at that time, being as close to dead as he can get. Even if he did know about it, I'm guessing that he would count on the allure of the Ring protecting it from destruction. And it did end up being a pretty good deterrent, since exactly two people ever voluntarily gave the Ring up (Bilbo and Sam), and exactly zero people managed to purposefully attempt to destroy it.

[@Hyperversum3]

@@Ryplinn He could be perfectly capable of seeing Elrond call for the destruction of the Ring, but he also saw that Isildur didn't do It. He has no real reason to believe that ring in hand the Elf lord would do what he was saying. Not Elrond could swear about It lol

[@bananamafana3433]

@@bzqp2 well in the books, elrond and isildur never went to mount doom. that whole event of standing above before isildur claims it never happened

[@bzqp2]

@@bananamafana3433 Huh, never realized this difference.

[@swordablaze9259]

This was interesting. Now I want to know how Galdriel, Glorfindel and Elrond would deal with Gandalf as the new Ring Master. They'd realise and be worried and/or kicking themselves. I can also feel all the Valar facepalming at this ending. "You had ONE job, Olórin!!"

[@baabaaer]

Tulkas may arrive cloaked to meet Olorin, then when he is at most vulnerable, Tulkas brought forth the paddle of Manwe, and gives Gandalf a raw bum.

[@thegianttater]

I feel like all the Elves would still leave Middle Earth, just a bit more hastily, seeing no hope in fighting Gandalf with that power and his knowledge. The REAL interesting thing, would be to see if Gandalf tried to, and was successful in, seizing the other two Elven rings of power before they yeeted off to Valinor and left Middle Earth to fend for itself?

[@papuan369]

@@thegianttater I think thats explained by his asking for a modest force and his destination of both Rivendell and Lorien, where the last two rings are, to be taken by force, or as payment for safe passage to the havens

[@dark7element]

@@papuan369 But with his wisdom and power over the other rings, wouldn't Gandalf be able to convince the elves to bow before him? The elves would realize that by that point, if they hesitate even a little in recognizing Gandalf's rule, he'd destroy them all, and even a fraction of the armies of Rohan and Gondor would make the odds of them resisting him utterly hopeless. Leaving for Valinor wouldn't do them any good.

[@jessepinkman5702]

I think Gandalf would still end up killing himself like most who carry the One Ring

[@jpenn9635]

I imagine he would become a ghost-like being and they would call him... Gandalf the Wight

[@NerdoftheRings]

🥁ba-dum-ch!

[@meltingpointcreations1457]

Gandalf the Gray-ish?

[@tylerborah6737]

The Black

[@khatack]

nice one xD

[@MikeG-rp7ep]

You have officially won this thread. Well done!

[@redtsun67]

Gandalf: *takes the ring* Sauron: "why do I hear boss music?"

[@ElementOfTheUniverse]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/pKm7lKh6dttqidU

[@lumsdelj]

cackle. underrated comment

[@jeffjames3111]

@@lumsdelj lol so funny!

[@mattd6931]

Gandalf taking the ring is the equivalent of him going: up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right, B, A, Start.

[@Gudni_TH]

Taking the hobbits to isenguard starts playing

[@jakobbauz]

I like your alternate version a lot. But: I think Aragorn would have been suspicious from the start. I mean he is a hardened, worldly-wise man who barely trusts himself (he is the one instantly realising what's up with Boromir in the original Fellowship after all). As soon as Saruman was dead he would have made plans.

[@MarvinT0606]

There are other things that would drastically change: 1. Minor characters in Minas Tirith like Beregond and his sons will play a bigger role, maybe even the sole witnesses to the murder of Denethor 2. Boromir will also have a bigger role, having *never* been corrupted by the One Ring when he meets Gandalf. When he finds out Gandalf actually murdered Denethor there will be hell to pay 3. It's also possible that instead of killing Aragorn, Gandalf will instead try to break his will or puppet him like what Saruman did. Aragorn as a "new" puppet king while Gandalf rules from behind the throne makes so much more sense than passing the crown to Boromir (who has no right to kingship) 4. Galadriel and Elrond might intervene and "change" the plan somehow, maybe give the Hobbits and Boromir a bigger but different role 5. Ultimately, Boromir the Vengeful Captain of Gondor and Aragorn the Puppet King will have to fight- backed by Gandalf and Galadriel respectively. 6. The story will play out more like a Greek Tragedy than Fantasy.

[@ben10the10]

I would have loved it if Boromir saw through Gandalf's sweet offering and the "King" label. Perhaps he smiles and gets close to Gandlaf, maybe even embraces him. Then he runs Gandalf through with his sword, whispering in his ear: "Gondor has no king, Gondor needs no king."

[@MarvinT0606]

Boromir founds the People's Republic of Gondor 🤣

[@ZealousValkyrie]

Honestly the perfect ending to this. Plausable, too.

[@carolparson787]

Then Boramir would get the ring and end up Sauron’s slave

[@Azuria969]

lol no boromir was a human, galdalf a maiar with the one ring, no sword could pierce him

[@ben10the10]

@@Azuria969 No sword could pierce him? Where is that stated in Tolkien's legendarium?

[@187Cazcrash]

I would absolutely watch this version of the story, specially the part where Sean Bean is not killed and wanders endlessly only to be named king.

[@AbsurdOod]

After all, who has a better story than Bean The Broken?

[@spielunker8438]

One does not simply wander endlessly waiting to be named king.

[@joshuaperry4112]

Boromir would be so stunned at being named King, he would have a heart attack and die.

[@bogdangrigore89]

One of the best comments I have ever seen on a YT video

[@s_shaleh]

@@AbsurdOod hahahaha

[@thomaslampl3001]

Boromir: *arrives in Rivendell after travelling for a good 4 months* Finally, now what is this urgent matter that I was called here for? Elrond: some guys are travelling to minas tirith, you should meet them there Boromir: Are you f*cking kidding me

[@elijahjones2710]

They weren't called to Rivendell. They all just happened to be there on their own business.

[@PunkRockJ]

@@elijahjones2710 boromir sort of got "called " there since his dreams told him to go find elrond's house

[@elijahjones2710]

@@PunkRockJ Your kind of right. I was just pointing out that it wasn't like in the movies and I hoped that my comment would get someone who didn't know to look deeper into it.

[@PunkRockJ]

@@elijahjones2710 Sorry, your point was pretty on point it was just a bit more context for those who didn't read the books

[@elijahjones2710]

@@PunkRockJ You're all good. We were both trying to do the same thing. Have a great day.

[@iainballas]

I like how you kept things in line with Gandalf's main idealism: Gandalf (and Tolkien) acknowledge that strong and powerful people can do great good, but equally may do great evil even if they desire to do good. Meanwhile, the meek and timid may also do great good, but rarely seek to do great evil. Gandalf was always meant to be a supporting character. His power was bringing out strength in others, which is one of (if not the most) powerful gifts of all.

[@songsforthemadre7337]

Nice one. I really like the deeper implications of Tolkien's world about human nature and Life in general. Time and again, souls have fallen into temptation when faced with the possibility (or illusion) of power. At the pinnacle of this, a mature or perhaps more experienced or pure being will know instinctively the simple fact that real power does not seek for more. They would genuinely have no interest in it. In a way it simply makes no sense to them. And even deeper, it's completely outside of their very own nature. It exists in a realm outside of the one a pure being exists in.

[@kjekelle96]

Imagine he took Frodo with him, knowing full well that the ring would corrupt him, and being determined to hand over the ring back to Frodo when Sauron was defeated, as a last resort if he couldn't destroy it himself, and in hope he would have retained his deep compassion for Frodo (and that killing or imprisoning or ignoring Frodo would eat at his conscience if there still was some left).

[@davidanderson_surrey_bc]

Balrog: I like this version much better.

[@arjenvk1]

Gandalf to Balrog: come along friend, We will kick ass!

[@Schrodingers-Fat]

@@arjenvk1 Durin's Bane would definitely be no match, but also wouldn't try anything.

[@1ceH3art]

Man I wish they dove more into the old lore. Balrogs were just foot soliders

[@MrNicoJac]

@@1ceH3art No they weren't 😆 Balrogs were fallen Ainur(?), basically like Gandalf. There are plenty of videos explaining the precise details 👍🏼

[@1ceH3art]

@@MrNicoJac hu I guess things changed since my lore book was published. Wonder how much else was changed. Just went to google to find out why I had a different story. The early conception of Balrogs makes them less terrible, and certainly more destructible, than they afterwards became: they existed in 'hundreds' (p. 170), and were slain by Tuor and the Gondothilim in large numbers: "thus five fell before Tuor's great axe Dramborleg, three before Ecthelion’s sword, and two score were slain by the warriors of the king's house. (From Fall of Gondolin, Christopher Tolkien commentary)

[@jonathancarlson6127]

And then he returned to Mordor and ordered Mt. Doom filled with pipe weed. The smoke was so great, it enveloped Middle Earth, and all were giddy and slightly peckish. And there was peace.

[@skatemetrix]

The one spliff to rule them all!

[@Peaceful_Gojira]

And there was much rejoice! *_depressed yay's heard about_*

[@SoulyG]

Actually there is an italian redub called "Lo Svarione Degli Anelli" where the story is about the one ring who hold the "svarione" (svarione means kinda like being stoned as fuck) and they have to destroy it to free the real highness for everybody, since Sauron (renamed Svarion) stole it and kept it for himsel even if destroyed. All character are renamed: Gandalf became Ganjalf, Legolas became Rizlas, Aragorn became Arabong, Gollum became Condom (cuz he's crusing naked) ecc. they redub mostly of the 3 films, i don't think u can understand it but you cracked me with this comment

[@tcgcollector855]

The wide spread food shortage that followed.....

[@kahnfatman]

Let me guess, you come from Colorado or New Mexico.

[@greggs1067]

What if not quite corrupted Gandalf destroyed the Nazgul, and kept their rings. Later, when frustrated with the lack of order across his kingdom, he begins gifting them to his most loyal allies. Aragorn, Theodin, Borimer, etc. to assist with their work to support him. They enthusiastically start helping Gandalf, before any of them realize that things have gotten out of hand…

[@13g0man]

Nothing would have gotten out of hand. The Nine Ring-Wardens would eternally keep peace throughout Middle-Earth, at the will of the Bright Lord Gandalf.

[@dancooke8811]

Impossible, no living man can kill a Nazgûl remember? Gandalf couldn't kill them in any other Lord of The Rings that's why.

[@CarzorStelatis]

@@dancooke8811 Gandalf isn't a 'living man' though, he's a Maia. Same sort of get-out as Eowyn.

[@SioxerNikita]

​@@dancooke8811That was simply a comment from someone cocky, not really reality. Everything can be slain in a world like Lord of the Rings

[@mon_moi]

​@@dancooke8811can't he just use some Noldorin blades like Merry? I mean Gandalf in this alternate timeline probably wouldn't be welcomed in Lothlorien, but I imagine he could still acquire those blades somehow

[@renardleblanc5556]

It is interesting that at the beginning of Fellowship, Gandalf has been fixated on identifying Bilbo's ring... perhaps, a little *too* fixated.

[@bibsp3556]

It might have whispered somrthing to him, and given itself away.

[@jrpipik]

If anything, he's too casual. He doesn't do anything useful for 50 years! I think it would be easier to argue the Ring psychically lulls Gandalf into not paying enough attention.

[@aaronward3508]

Gandalf would enslave Middle Earth and everyone would work in pipe weed factories. In the Fourth Age, Dark Lord Gandalf creates a pipe weed hybrid called “Fool of a Toke”.

[@gm2407]

The fields shall be fertilized by the dead Hobbitses.

[@nikolanovakovic4150]

Oh boy this made me laugh so hard

[@castletreetv149]

"Fool of a toke" :)

[@redabales8828]

@@nikolanovakovic4150 agreed!!🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@gandalf7262]

Yes

[@MikeC-ce2dz]

True terror would be if the one ring fell into the possession of Lobelia Sackville-Baggins

[@ThoriberoCaroli]

There would be no spoons left in the hands of any free man or woman. :I

[@markbarthel9835]

No spoon would be safe.

[@TonusFabri2024]

@@markbarthel9835 That's OK, *there is no spoon*....

[@helloworld1249]

This. This is the fanfic I desperately need. Million dollar idea.

[@RafaelSCalsaverini]

My god...

[@jvvtheater]

How to become the King of Gondor: 1. Travel aimlessly to avoid war. 2. Return to Gondor when war is over. 3. Wait for your coronation.

[@vagabondx2132]

i really enjoyed the mixture of canon lore and his own conjecture, here. i think he did an excellent job. well done!

[@stefanmekkinosson175]

A Dark Lord is never late, neither is he early. He arrives precisely when he means to.

[@TiaMargarita]

As is a military general!

[@jordanuecker7744]

“Nor is he early” GET IT RIGHT! :)

[@andreashansen5313]

@@jordanuecker7744 One does not simply misspell a LOTR quote.

[@michaelfrankel8082]

Well played sir.

[@mr.honeybee7661]

Oh fuck lol 😂

[@Definitely_Not_Sheev_Palpatine]

So basically, Boromir is just late to everything for months on end, then one day Gandalf is like "Hey, wanna be king?"

[@razorsharpview9090]

What the hell are you here at Middle earth, SENATE?!

[@Hades8103]

He isn’t the senate YET

[@tidemaster]

Here ya go doopemsksoblap eipdeep boing

[@legion9327]

That pretty well describes how Joe Biden became President.

[@Definitely_Not_Sheev_Palpatine]

@@legion9327 Actually, Joe Biden became President because the majority of voters voted for him.

[@justaneedlessboi6710]

I love Tolkien's description of how Gandalf the dark lord would be like, it's spot on, and honestly a really believable corrupted version of the character

[@UXSpecialist]

I think gandalf wouldn't turn evil all at once. He would use the ring with the intent to do good, but would become so powerful, he would become a terrible force in the world, become somewhat of a tyrant and feared among all... It would seriously throw off the balance of middle earth.

[@user-wd2du6ze5p]

Instead of a Dark Lord, you would have a king, not dark but gray, never late and terrible as the dawn of the fifth day! Tempestuous as the fireworks, and stronger than the finest Longbottom leaf! All shall not pass and despair!

[@JFskeezix]

haha nice

[@lordoftherings999]

Great

[@raphaelfelipe1474]

this was the best comment I've ever seen in my life, thanks from Brazil

[@philippecollin559]

Eloquent and funny. I raise my hat to you.

[@fortunatodelacruz2451]

this is perfect! LOL XD! i am reading this like Gandalf is actually saying it in the movie

[@alanfrost75]

So the real winner is Sean Bean. He doesn't get to die for a change...

[@samwrai]

For a time...

[@roxanneranchhand1245]

Not until 'the Frankenstein Chronicles' on netflix

[@vincentsanniti2438]

Que piano falling from sky

[@1freakgamer]

He survived The Martian.

[@darktrooper2099]

@@vincentsanniti2438 *: : : : : : : : : : : :Shortly followed by pirate-ship from "TIME BANDITS"*

[@blueshit199]

I love the idea that Gandalf ends up having the same motivations and means to an end as Cortana in Halo 5, especially with stationing the Nazgul in each major part of Middle Earth for peacekeeping purposes

[@thematrixlunchhacker]

Nice reference

[@sparklingduet]

Denethor being burnt again in this time-line is very accurate, it was his destiny to burn for his mistakes, just like in the vision. The difference here though is that unlike in canon, he will not recognise his son during his final moments, his soul will be corrupt to the bitter end.

[@DamonNomad82]

This theory of how Gandalf would rule Middle Earth wielding the Ring and becoming far worse than Sauron because he would be actively trying to do good and would be righteous in his own mind fits nicely with the position that Tolkien's close friend C.S. Lewis took that those who think they are doing good can do far more damage than the utterly evil, because they have the approval of their own consciences.

[@dominikszakacs7070]

But still, Sauron himself thought that he was doing good. He intended to maintain order in Middle-Earth, though through extreme measures... orc armies, former men who he turned into slaves. It is also like Gandalf without the Ring is a protector of free will, Sauron still wants to maintain order, without respecting the free will of others.

[@thewanabees123]

@@dominikszakacs7070 this is wrong. Sauron thought it was necessary to be the way he was because I valued ORDER above all else. And he felt justified, but I did not think he was “good”

[@Egryn]

Not only that but Gandalf had a second ring if power, Narya. His possession of both rings would not only give him immense power but the ability to inspire hope in any who found him. This would allow him to amass a very large army who despite being corrupted by the one ring would think that Gandalf would be fighting tyranny against any who would suspect him of evil. He would have ended up ruling Middle Earth for ages since Narya also lengthened the life of the user.

[@Travlinmo]

Then engineer in me wonders if Narya would have actually meant anything if both the one ring and Narya were being used by the same person. Also, this Gandalf reminds me of the movie version of the Lady of Lorien.

[@Egryn]

@@Travlinmo it would because the righteous man using both would instill the false desire to fight anyone trying to harm the bearer of the one ring, thinking the other person to be a tyrant and oppressive.

[@videos8159]

The fact I love about this is that even tolkien himself wrote some fan fiction about his own property haha

[@Graphomite]

Doesn't really surprise me. The Hobbit was a pretty restrained novel compared to the LotR trilogy. LotR was def Tolkien indulging himself and/or the geek audience he had awakened and it doesn't surprise me that the dude entertained spinoffs and what-ifs.

[@Kaaxe]

"author fiction" perhaps

[@ggt47]

What?!

[@comradeschnitzelstein7177]

I'm literally trying to write a universe and novel whenever I can and I cannot resist writing fanfiction of what plans I have for it, even when it's not even close to finished. I can see why, lol

[@liquidsnake6879]

entertaining what-ifs is pretty common in writing and a fun exercise

[@henrywebb3009]

I just found your channel. This is such an interesting take, and I really appreciate the time you put into researching this.

[@madzod0076]

Since the ring wouldn't be destroyed, could Sauron still return and maybe take the form of a liberator to deceive men into helping him overthrow gandalf?

[@oberonpanopticon]

Despite watching this channel idk much about lotr, but that seems totally possible!

[@christianholzschuh6853]

"People of Middlearth, I have come to liberate you!" Hurray! It's Sauron here to help us! "FROM YOURSELF!" Oh no! It's Sauron, here to help us!

[@GoldenSW]

It's possible but unlikely. Gandalf would be too strong. Sauron also needed a very long time to regain a semblance of his former strength without the ring.

[@ryhi5]

@@christianholzschuh6853 "GREAT LIBERATOR! YOU HAVE SAVED MIDDLE EARTH!" Sauron: Oh, I wouldn't say "saved", more like..... UNDER NEW MANAGEMENT!

[@thatguywhosenameyoukeepmis9450]

I think over time, Gandalf would have claimed the ring, leading Sauron to be unable to reform physically. Or maybe he claims it once Sauron comes back and tries rallying discontented people to his cause.

[@sithmaster4305]

Won't lie It would be hilarious to see Gandalf ask Boromir to be king just for him to look left to see a Nazgul holding a club just in case he says no.

[@jhamPlays]

Punching his fist like a comic book goon

[@Bakamoichigei]

...and then look right to see his old man's still-smoldering remains? 🤣

[@kennethmoses4900]

This made me laugh out loud

[@eimanb3887]

This is unnecessarily funny.

[@Felix-dh9tl]

Won’t lie this theory would make an interesting movie

[@davidanderson_surrey_bc]

Gollum: How the hell am I going to lure a WIZARD into the lair of Shelob?

[@saltedllama2759]

Underrated post right here.

[@jarskil8862]

Tell Gandalf that there is Old Toby in the cave?

[@Telepian]

gandalf wouldn't need gollum because he already knew the way

[@astwas]

He tells him a naked Dumbledore is in the cave waiting for him

[@spiderprint]

*Cough* Eagles *cough*

[@Delta9Church]

Your voice work is so great! Glad i just stumbled on this channel.

[@witgar1]

This is exceptionally well done. I would ask you continue this story with Gandalfs domination of the elves and dwarfs.

[@misterbadguy7325]

Denethor being actually 100% right in this timeline is so goddamn funny.

[@Facade953]

A " wise " and " misunderstood " man!😅🤣

[@jout738]

Who is Denethor by the way?

[@thebigshep]

@@jout738 Boromir's (Sean Bean's) shitty dad. The one that makes Pippin sing and also later burns himself to death while trying to light his other son on fire

[@milannagy4281]

@@jout738 Father of Boromir and Faramir

[@shaeltr]

@@jout738 the dood who get caught in fire and to extinguish itself he jump on top of Minas Tirith 💀

[@DirtTheGamer]

Imagine if the Game of Throne writers put this much thought into how the characters teleported, I mean traveled.

[@coreymayo8321]

Hexcrawl vs. hand-wavy theater of the mind

[@awesomeluciano78]

When reading the books it's pretty evident that Tolkien had experience with war firsthand and troop movements as well.

[@Khantia]

GRRM actually did put this much thought into it. Just the TV show writers didn't care :P

[@Enonymouse_]

Big difference between writing a book and writing a screen play. Screen plays have considerations forced upon them a novelist doesn't need to concern themselves with. Tolkien was an amazing author.

[@HackerArmy03]

The TV version of Game of Thrones you mean. GRRM hasn't even begun to write the ending for his books. TV/studio foreign writers are honestly such a dumb dumb, remember what happened with the hobbit? Such a shame.

[@southerncampingexperience3841]

I've always wondered what would happen... If Frodo willing gave the Ring to the Witch King out of fear, and avoided being wounded. Would the Witch King usurp Sauron, and become the ruler of Mordor, or would he maintain his service to Sauron?

[@User-hz5vz]

He is neither dead or alive , and he would definitely be loyal to sauron

[@vishnunaidoo3258]

And what if Saruman took the ring?

[@southerncampingexperience3841]

@@vishnunaidoo3258 I would imagine sarumans first task would be to destroy gandalf, and take Narya. Most certainly slained all on the white council. His rule would give him the Nazgul. The Ents and Huorns wouldn't of stood much chance. Saruman would eventually overthrow sauron, and I think what happened to the Shire in The Return of the King would not happen.

[@MarvinT0606]

the Nazgul are too far gone to think for themselves.

[@mspence9596]

I am new to your channel but have been a true LOTR fan for years. I absolutely love watching and listening because of the knowledge it portrays. I love diving deeper and learning more than what I’ve seen on the movies and what I’ve read. Thank you for sharing your research and discoveries

[@jeanbizet931]

Boromir: *holy hell I finally found this place* Elrond: *you have no need here, go back*

[@Langstondennis]

*Photoshopped Sean Bean's face into Mike Wazowski meme*

[@hisnotsolonely2961]

At least he didn't die in this version so far 13:00 Edit: he didn't die which is nice

[@Langstondennis]

@@hisnotsolonely2961 wait until Middle Earth terraforms into Westeros

[@jeanbizet931]

@@Langstondennis 😂😂

[@saraola6477]

Seven hells

[@paulgallagher5889]

Some tales are "There and Back Again." Others are "Boromir: Or How I Walked Around For 5 Months and Became King!"

[@MANB91UK]

Well, at least it only took him five months, he didn't have to spend a few years in a frozen cave learning how to become an emotionless drip that can navigate the Middle-Earthern-Tree-Internet

[@blshouse]

One does not simply walk to Imladris.

[@masterexploder9668]

Boromir had the best story, so he's king now.

[@ricksaburai]

It's still "There and Back Again" if you think about it lol

[@MelindaGreen]

Who made him king? I didn't vote for him!

[@acehardware2823]

God damn, I can't believe I've been sitting on this channel for a year. I never thought it would be in line with the books instead of the movie. Instant sub!

[@elwoodcheek4038]

Now that's some good nerding out there 👍 I appreciate all the effort you put into that, kept me interested anyway

[@zoltanposfai3451]

"All hail the new king, Boromir Blisterfoot!"

[@JakeRivers]

😂

[@shanedude91]

Lmao

[@odger3700]

lol Best comment :D

[@tijltrienen]

Nahh he rides a horse. So its marathon horse of lonely boromir

[@zoltanposfai3451]

@@tijltrienen I don't think he touched a horse in the entire story, except for the ponies carrying their supplies.

[@andreasul2608]

Movie elrond: Strangers from middle earth, friends of old. You've been *summoned* here to answer the threat of morder. Book elrond: Why does random people of different races keep appearing in my super secret hidden place?

[@pickybitch2707]

🤣🤣🤣 true!

[@psychepeteschannel5500]

Yeah :D that is the book version alright. But I think it is quite fitting. The evil is simply rising everywhere, all sides are taking notice around the same time and so Elrond would likely say something like "It has begun"... or perhaps he would say "I was expecting you, Mr. Anderson". Who knows :D

[@andysuryantorovanruzzette8085]

@@psychepeteschannel5500 dang it, you cracked me 😂😂

[@InquisitiveUniverse]

😂😂😂😂

[@LagunaShirogane]

@@psychepeteschannel5500 Elrond takes the ring...hence we have Agent Smith

[@joestar99]

Thanks for the What Ifs, I've always enjoyed stories like these.

[@gabrielegilodi3489]

Love this channel! Congrats!

[@lotsofspots]

So, in this timeline, Denethor doesn't eat a tomato? Where do I sign up?

[@adryanmonk]

This is my favourite comment so far and there are many good ones around. Well done, good dir.

[@kongchangfan2237]

i still feel kinda traumatised by seeing this creature eating his meal :O thanks for warming it up, haha

[@Missingafool]

That was brilliant and so spot on! Well done sir! We'll done!

[@nodaknegan9111]

That tomato seen makes my girlfreind puke every time. Funny shit yo.

[@monex6447]

The only thing worse was the one dude in the Hobbit eating balls

[@immortalntrsovereign4145]

notice how gandalf said "over me the ring would gain a power still greater" hes basically saying when you "Wear" the ring, you're not wearing it, the ring wears you.

[@zakpodo]

Yes. Isnt that what separates the one ring from the others. It is made of the will to power and domination. And Sauron, like Morgoth before had that in spades.

[@KnightOMurk]

In America, you wear ring. In Soviet Russia, ring wears you.

[@johnhansen4794]

What is the Ego of this magic? Oh, infinite... K'Thanx, bye.

[@aminulhussain2277]

@@KnightOMurk The ring wears you in both.

[@rykehuss3435]

@@zakpodo No, the One Ring was created to dominate and subjugate all the other Rings of Power. A Puppetmaster, but first there were the puppets

[@ryzenforce]

Excellent theory! I am a new subscriber of your channel I have discovered only a few days ago, and I must say you researchs, explanation and videos are outstanding. I didn't really read the books of Tolkien beside The Hobbit and LoTR, but I have always wanted to understand more. Your channel brings this to me. Now it's mine!

[@PhodexGames]

Actually the EDAIN modification for the LOTR game "Battle For Middle Earth 2" illustrated this very nicely. You can give the ring to gandalf there and see how it affects him and his surroundings. Very cool, one of the reasons I love this mod and game.

[@RedSpade37]

How have I, major fan of this series and its video game adaptations, missed that? Thank you for mentioning it!

[@keithjzammit]

This is impossible. Sean Bean didn’t die in this movie. So it just cannot be. Sorry.

[@simonhbacon]

Sean Bean plays Aragorn in this version?

[@nodaknegan9111]

Right! He would have turned down the role! "I dont die?!" "Feck that!"

[@keithjzammit]

@@simonhbacon seems possible! I think Bean could make a good Aragorn

[@dandini0698]

We can fix it! On the road back to his home city, Sean Bean öhömmm... I mean Boromir, walking while watching the beautiful glades of Rivendell, trips over a tree root and falls, until his head experiences a sudden stop by a giant rock.

[@Nutsaur]

@@simonhbacon Seen Been.

[@tuseroni6085]

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."- cs lewis.

[@Rayzorbladez]

So, democrats.

[@j.h.oldman7708]

Insightful. A brilliant wordsmith.

[@JoeCold]

Resounds loudly on this September day in 2021.

[@brokenwingbird2552]

Nah.. Cause its what we currently live under. You know nothing else

[@ace2times235]

Great quote

[@samanthadrennan]

This was just super well done and entertaining.

[@trentw.3566]

I love these scenarios of yours. Well thought out and compellingly detailed. You ought to get ROP to give you a job with them.

[@WardenFG]

I believe that Galadriel, sensing Gandalf's actions with the Ring would travel West as she does on the book and eventually warn the Valar of what's going on. Then a crazy war would happen between the Valar and Gandalf controlling the Nazgul. - Cheers from Argentina!

[@spiffygonzales5899]

I dunno about the crazy war part. Gandalf would be powerful but not dumb. I don't think he'd pull a Morgoth and start shattering continents and allying with (potentially) mountain sized spiders.

[@LateNightVibes56]

@@spiffygonzales5899 mountain spiders?

[@spiffygonzales5899]

@@LateNightVibes56 Yea. Ungoliant. It's more or less left up to speculation as to how big EXACTLY she grew, but I've heard some very interesting arguments that she'd be hundreds of feet tall.

[@WardenFG]

@@spiffygonzales5899 I agree with you, I kinda pictured it like Galadriel going to the Valar and the Valar taking action before Gandalf gets to do anything stupid. Yeah, maybe a "crazy war" wouldn't come to pass.

[@joaofarias9986]

The Valar don't give enough fucks to stop him. If they did, Tulkas could have killed him in three days, two of these days woyls be the travel to Mordor and back.

[@melsilva9158]

This made me think of a quote from Yoda, "Paved with good intentions the path to the dark side often is".

[@sacharriolamarino317]

What about Yoda with the ring?

[@thunderstrike842]

@@sacharriolamarino317 the cockring?

[@alexworld1992]

An original quote: The path to hell is paved with good intensions - I think it is old testament Biblical

[@scottfitzpatrick1939]

100% true

[@castletreetv149]

Yoda and Gandalf should team up

[@borntobewilde1971]

This is my first time at your channel but I'll be back. You did some work on this. The timeline deviations and resulting consequences were intriguing.

[@informationageenterprise2184]

Dude, the voices you do are incredible!

[@psychepeteschannel5500]

Complete Travels of Boromir (Gandalf the Ring-Lord Edition): "He runs a lap around Middle-Earth, doing nothing. For this great service to the free peoples, he is crowned king." THE END

[@psychepeteschannel5500]

@Allied Empire United Countries of the World I would like to see the look on Boromirs face as he returns, after walking around for a year getting no results, to suddenly being told that the war is won and he is king :D

[@joyfulyes]

@@psychepeteschannel5500 love the absurdity of it. There's something Python-esque about it, isn't there?

[@alaljarensi6990]

Corrupted Gandalf would give king Boromir a new ring of power and immortality.

[@drewboogie2849]

The road to hell is paved with good intentions

[@Saphire_Throated_Carpenter_Ant]

and the road to good intentions can take you through hell.

[@renato3]

There are people who have to go through hell before understanding the value of good intentions. Others do not. They are already wise

[@pwnmeisterage]

Our mythology offers intrinsically good and holy artifacts, things like the Holy Grail. Middle Earth's mythology offers intrinsically evil and unholy artifacts, things like the One Ring. While the intrinsically good and holy powers are immortal beings like Gandalf and Sarumon - who can be corrupted.

[@CalridRobnor123srs]

@James Gravil The endless Tolkien theme, a thing in itself is not good or evil with the exception of the ring because it was much of Sauron's malice and will, but the peoples of Middle Earth are corrupted by power, even by tools that are meant for good, and even with the best will in the world. eg get that +5 sword, and you become hastened towards fighting things to get the better chance at a critical to use RPG nerd speak. And then you get your skull cleaved by an axe wielding orc horde. Tis ever and so. :)

[@CalridRobnor123srs]

You kinda have to remember too, The Lord of the rings is a Biblical Exegesis too, it's what it is about really, especially when you consider as some people have said CS Lewis (A Christian Apologist) influence on Tolkiens story. The Silmarillion is the war for heaven in The Bible and the LotR is the end times when the beast comes to corrupt men because they are jealous of their free will.

[@Tehownilator]

It’s so crazy to think that Bombadil asks to see the ring, laughs at it, and then puts in on his pinky for a joke and doesn’t disappear. Then he can see Frodo while he’s wearing it.. The humility this imbues in me, I can’t express.

[@somanken]

Wow that was so much cooler than i expected, i love how accurate and fitting this theory was, just makes me think how horrifying the world under gandalf ring bearer could become

[@gamingwithquancena4989]

Totally serious video idea: What if Thorins company turned around to get Bilbos handkerchief

[@NerdoftheRings]

😂😂 Would’ve been catastrophic!

[@fredtrunce5931]

Probably nothing? Thorin’s company sits around waiting for Durin’s day for like a week don’t they? And before that they wait around in lake town for like a month.

[@LookingTheBest]

WAAAAAAAIIIIIITTTT.

[@patrickramseyart]

Stop! Stop! We have to turn around.

[@tygovisser5626]

Bilbo would have something else (handkerchief) to call precious and never gets corrupted by the ring

[@natehall2573]

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience". CS Lewis

[@Crash103179]

A most appropriate quote.

[@filipferencak2717]

Monotheistic Gods be like:

[@whitingpie5146]

Hate to bring Politics into it, but sounds awful lot like Far Leftists of today who have turned into the Fascists they claim to oppose. All for our own good.

[@era5773]

Good .

[@drunkenphilosopher5159]

@@filipferencak2717 never saw someone so stupid lol. "Monotheistic" and "Gods" in one sentence. The logic.

[@danielsalas3394]

You got me hooked, good job

[@tysonstrickland8208]

Just wanted to comment and say that I watch this video on a whim, but it's absolutely rekindled my fascination and interest in the LOTR story and Tolkien's universe. I had read the books a few times many years ago and read parts of his other works. I had forgotten about all the many changes the films made and how incredibly deep the lord and story were. I was way into it. It really is one if the most amazing high fantasy sagas of all time. I'm going to watch the Rings of Power now. Just wanted to drop a thanks🙂 As for what I think would happen, I absolutely agree, and from the very beginning when you quoted his reasoning with desiring strength to do good and prevent weakness, that is absolutely the mindset of dictators and despots throughout all of history. Self righteous is right. He would be the one final authority over all middle earth and as the ring was inhabit his vessel for eons it would slowly wear away at his ability to be objective and remember what truly is right for all and would go for *complete order* at the expensive of freedom for inhabitants to choose their own destiny and change. He would become a shell of himself. Where his mind would have mixed signals from his original identity and the ring, that would in some ways cancel each other out to leave a somewhat confused being of immense power that is subconsciously fighting a war within between the Gandalf he was and the essence of sauron attempting to overtake his mind and become more dominant. The fun and joy at life and fondness he had for those weaker creatures (like hobbits) would dry up, conflicted by the essence of sauron to dominate all. His reason for even defending the realm would fade over time to where the only thing that matters is order, but not necessarily brutal tyranny like from Sauron, if that makes sense . I can see him traveling for a time, then eventually sitting on a throne in a location, alone in silence, but with a smoldering vigilance. He would have a few attendants that would be sycophants that want a piece of his power and he would eventually be misled by these. He might discover this as different factions and individuals seek power and lash out with immense brutality that has been dormant within. This would end his trust with others, then he would rely on the the 9 and other forces he would completely control to watch and see. Eventually the realm would understand him to be a despotic ruler that has to be destroyed, but at that point, I imagine it would just be the realms of man and their greed to have power themselves, perhaps the line of boromir would be vassals that would bristle at his ultimate control or perhaps these vassels would be ruthless enforcers of Gandalf's desire for order and eventually their would be a righteous revolution to wrest control from both the kings and Gandalf. IDK, it's been awhile, so I'm not currently aware of all the forces and characters so I could be missing something big. I look forward to when AI is good enough to design film, media and books based on prompts a la DALLE 2 . "What would happen if Gandalf took the one ring?" will be one of the first ones I do, right after "finish the ASOIAF books" (because I refuse to watch the bastardized version that began to really take hold at season 5, and I still don't know WTF happened, but I'm sure that it sucks based off what I've gathered and how they decided to go with the story. Still kinda salty about this if anyone reading can't tell😅)

[@crazyd3uces]

My wife just asked me what I was watching, and I replied "a hypothetical conjecture about if Gandalf di-..." she's like stop stop stop I don't care lol

[@anakay1184]

I'm sorry that you chose mistakenly

[@bitchursofake]

I too apologize for your mistakes

[@mitzukirigaya3180]

there will be preyers for you our fallen friend

[@BeardAxeMcAxeBeard]

Divorce

[@leothelion19]

Divorce her lol

[@istvanfodor9749]

Best channel to listen to in-between first and second breakfast

[@NerdoftheRings]

Most important meals of the day too!

[@FreeSCV]

@@NerdoftheRings an absolute treat to be sure! =)

[@stonefox9124]

Best at tea...

[@dheijnemans]

No mistake!

[@sampetty5768]

That was so well put together and thought out

[@SketchieDemon]

Amazing theory that gets the mind turning to flesh out more details and what it's. I could see a really cool fanmade storyboard /manga or anime adaption going well with this.

[@fenixmyaroon8633]

Dude every LOTR nerd needs to know you exist, you put so much effort and have great inflections when speaking. This is how I want to ingest my LOTR content from now on. Clean, well written, and produced with real heart.

[@NerdoftheRings]

Thanks so much! I truly appreciate it! :)

[@watkins7086]

100% agree

[@aceofspades4948]

Exactly what I thought when first watched

[@cmdrTremyss]

He is like a fine glass of whisky after a long day.

[@Ubermensch201]

I've been stuck on them for a week now lol I love it

[@Krisu_1000]

Sean Bean approves this no-dying ending

[@deusexaethera]

Wait for the sequel.

[@redwaldcuthberting7195]

Sean Bean has a clause that he's contractually obligated to die in everything he's in. 😏

[@paxnorth7304]

now THAT'S soldiering

[@PierreThierryKPH]

I love how you don't just speculate but base your theories in various writings of Tolkien. It's refreshing!

[@RingtoneBasterds]

This was really good. Thank you!

[@bryndynirving7333]

The only flaw with this theory is that Sean Bean doesn't die.

[@MrSyco07]

One does not simply... save Sean Bean.

[@damianrehbein3992]

@@MrSyco07 Come on, once we can give him. But just once he has a reputation to hold up.

[@damianrehbein3992]

@Grandson Of Cherve Maybe.

[@TurboSilke]

yeah, the movie version of this would need to recast Borimir.

[@roman2374]

They would’ve simply cast Viggo as Boromir and Sean Bean as Aragorn! And there we have a pointless death

[@Autocratical]

I’d like to think that the ring would betray Gandalf just when he needed it most, if not as they enter Mordor with the 9 turning on him or perhaps slipping off his finger during the confrontation with Sauron.

[@namankumar1677]

Yeah, I think this is much more likely. Gandalf is not the true lord of the ring, the ring knows that. It would betray him at a crucial moment.

[@ricksaburai]

@@namankumar1677 could be. But then again, unlike lesser wielders of the ring who were betrayed by it, Gandalf is a Maia, same as Sauron. Just like Gandalf's will was prone to its corruption, so could he too subjugate the One Ring's will. I think it's quite possible considering he had more potential than Sauron after becoming a dark lord.

[@namankumar1677]

@@ricksaburai You might be right, not just because Gandalf is a Maia but because he also carried Narya. I wonder what carrying two rings of power does to you.

[@HeavyMetalGamingHD]

I am pretty sure that gandalf would be able to defeat sauron. sauron is very weakened without the ring. he put his own power into forging it. the ring is basically a part of him. both of them are mayar. they are on the same level and gandalf had narya. But sauron would never fight gandalf without this theory. Sauron did basically never fight unless it was completely unavoidable. The last alliance besieged barad dur for seven years until he finally entered the fight.

[@CaptainKirkZ1LLA]

That's a pretty tough sell. Abandoning someone like Gollum, sure. Leading Isildur to his death, Numenor or not, he's still just a man. But Gandalf is a being of great power. The only real complication as far as taming the Ring is concerned, is that Olorin, when he was sent to Middle-Earth actually feared Sauron, and was uncertain of his ability to keep him in check. That may play into the Ring swaying him or vice-versa.

[@ogion539]

Great video. One thing that I noticed while listening, is how similar Gandalf's endgame is to Magus Bayaz from The First Law trilogy. Honestly, while clearly evil, Bayaz keeps the kingdom in good shape (through subversion and intimidation) and manages to bring about peace.

[@cjhiggins3803]

Really enjoyable hypothesis though. Very interesting and likely outcome showing good understanding of the subject matter. Thnx

[@JMThought]

This was fun as a one off especially as Tolkien talked about it himself.

[@yisroelackerman]

That’s right! In his letters he says Gandalf would have been a “self-righteous” despot. This video acts like Tolkien himself didn’t already have this conversation.

[@vaahtobileet]

@@yisroelackerman he quotes that very letter in the video. Maybe you didn't watch it?

[@justanothaguy3714]

@@yisroelackerman Only now we have a engaging 20m video to enjoy rather then a single sentence. Its backed by a love of the world and the care to consider timelines and personalities. Do not disregard the beauty of a rose because you choose to grasp its stem rather enjoy is visage.

[@yisroelackerman]

@@justanothaguy3714 okay

[@thomashall3314]

@@justanothaguy3714 YEAAAHH.

[@CognizantCheddar]

Gandalf in possession of the One Ring makes a lot of sense as an Anti-Villain. That said... can Sauron truly be destroyed so long as the Ring is intact? Even by a fellow Maia? Aren't we told over and over again that so long as the Ring exists, Sauron _can't_ be permanently vanquished? So, for me, this suggests a wrinkle in this scenario, in which part of the reason why a Ring possessing Gandalf becomes a tyrant is exactly because the threat of Sauron permanently lingers around Middle-earth -- Gandalf uses the constant threat of Sauron's return to justify everything he does as tyrant.

[@guccifer764]

Tolkien himself admitted that theoretically, someone _could_ become the rings new master, severing Sauron’s hold over it. However, in doing so, they would become an even greater Dark Lord than Sauron ever was. So, it’s kind if a pointless endeavour if your goal is to make sure there is no Dark Lord.

[@Ubermensch201]

@@guccifer764 why would the new owner be an even greater Dark Lord than Sauron?? Especially if it's just a Man or "regular" Elf.. Seeing as Sauron was a Maia so anything less wouldn't be as powerful as him, you'd think

[@guccifer764]

@@Ubermensch201 It’s not so much that the Ring could turn Steve from accounting into an even more powerful dark lord. It’s more that the ring could only be mastered by someone who already had the potential of being a worse dark lord, like Gandalf or Galadriel.

[@justink1985]

@@Ubermensch201 For someone to take it from Sauron one would have to be even more powerful and they in time would also be corrupted. Creating an even worse situation. I think this is more whats alluded to in the books or what Tolkien meant by it.

[@ricardokowalski1579]

What if ... Gandalf does not kill Sauron? If Gandalf can command the Nine... could he also use the ring to subdue Sauron himself? Is obedience a worse fate than death to Sauron? Sauron as a Gandalf lackey, would be interesting and terrible. He would do exactly what Gandalf orders...but everything would be done with resentment and hatred.

[@ferreltimothy3004]

BROTHER, YOU ARE THE BEST!!! You oooh really helped me!! THANK YOU VERY MUCH!

[@cgsweat]

26K from 1 million subscribers! I'm really rooting for you!

[@RachelHardy]

You put an incredible amount of time and effort into your videos. This is awesome, I'm hooked on your videos!

[@codyallen2838]

Hey Rachel! I love your music, and I think you're pretty darn cute! (:

[@kirkpatrickg191]

fr

[@sandychen1381]

Fr

[@castletreetv149]

Agreed!

[@eriksalholm]

Fr

[@arminmowenbeinchen5185]

Sauron:"From my point of view, Gandalf is evil!"

[@shlongbongchewy]

Then you are lost!

[@Quantakinetic]

There was a book written with exactly this premise, as an unofficial sequel, called The Last Ring Bearer by Kirill Yeskov if you want to look it up. The idea is that 'history is written by the winners" and thus all the LOTR stuff was propaganda. Quite an interesting read.

[@carnivorecaveman]

@@Quantakinetic Hi, I would like to read that book! Where can I find it in English, either as a paper-book or a digital version? Because I found it on Amazon just in russian edition.

[@TheEllord33]

​@@carnivorecaveman Sauron was not that different of gandalf. He wanted to do good and eventually corrupted himself with lust of power. But taking aside the lack of freedom of beeing under by Sauron, he was actually pretty good at managing an empire.

[@carnivorecaveman]

@@TheEllord33 Sauron was surely good at managing an Empire, this is out of queastion! Without this talent he could not have been a powerful enemy of Gandalf and others. However, freedom is a great value in my eyes... But, even if we take no notice of freedom, the orcs in the empire of Sauron seemd me poor, ragged, they were not wealthy at all, so they were in general unhappy. Additionally they were even ugly, because their body had numerous signs of a vast number of serious sickness'. Therefore it is my opinion that Sauron was not really a good king at all.

[@AnaInTh3Sky]

I'm high as a kite and just came across this channel... this is trippy af, but what I find even more fascinating than the stories is the fact that someone actually makes a very good living out of this channel... you have to love the internet!!!! So awesome 😂

[@MikeHawksSmall]

👏👏👏👏 so good dude!! Damn I'd love to see this play out on screen!! 👏👏👏👏

[@Lesheer]

Very interesting theory! I feel there would be much more nuance and struggle between Gandalf and the Ring. Gandalf was incredibly strong-willed and pure of heart. It would take a long time for the ring to take hold - and even longer to get such a strong hold as to make Gandalf murder friends like Aragorn in cold blood. If it came down to it between Aragorn and Gandalf, I find it more likely that Gandalf would render himself vulnerable in a moment of clarity allowing Aragorn to strike a deadly blow. I just feel Gandalf would be wise enough to realize he was being pulled in by the ring, and also strong enough to exhibit great resistance to its power. He would eventually lose if he kept on with the Ring, but I think he would find a way out - either by himself or by the aid of his friends.

[@SteliosMusic]

This should be top comment. Not just because I fucking love Gandalf, but also because it would fit Tolkiens happy-ending, optimistic style. That being said, I do like a good movie that breaks the mold... I suppose execution would play a big part in this.

[@SteliosMusic]

*mould

[@eowa]

I actually expected it to play out with Aragon severing Gandalfs hand that bares the ring or something, making him see sense.

[@SteliosMusic]

@@eowa Was thinking the exact same thing last night! This comment & the excellently done video, have certainly stirred up the imagination.

[@damianrehbein3992]

I belive Gandalf to be TOO good of heart to not use the Ring. Like if I gave the nicest guy on the planet ultimate power and be like. "You cant use this shit to help anyone." "Kids starving?' Nope. "War?" Nope I think this wold break him sonner then later.

[@stand355]

Gollum is going to get his shit beaten out of him by a dark Gandalf everytime he tries to steal the Ring.

[@gandalf7262]

Yes

[@sledge2742]

This cracked me up 🤣

[@chriscobble48]

"You poor, wretched soul," Gandalf said, standing over the cowering figure of Gollum. "The torture you must feel, the sadness and longing in your soul for that which does not belong to you!" "Smeagle will serve Master, will protect his precious, will do as Master Wizard says!" croaked Gollum, wringing his hands and backing away from the towering figure before him. A light shone now in Gandalf's gray eyes, a spark mirroring the very fires of Mount Doom. " Oh, pitiful creature, I do not need you as a servant, " chuckled Gandalf, raising his staff. "With this Ring, all of Middle Earth shall serve me. I have no need for your sniveling wretchedness!" Gollum's screams echoed through the night as the Gray Wizard drew near, but were cut suddenly short. The night air grew silent as a dark cloud rolled across the moon.

[@user-lz9ys9ex1q]

And I want to thank you for all of the hidden lore you're channel has taught me I'm a freaking nerd myself when it come to tlotr

[@Tabur]

I wonder how happy would JRR be if he had had the chance to watch these videos. Good job

[@EletroBeau]

Whenever there's a struggle for power and land, Sean Bean dies.

[@castletreetv149]

Weak!

[@valritz1489]

And so it was that from the lands of Gondor and Rohan there emerged a great host, and their shields were painted black with mourning, for the death of Elessar still weighed heavily upon them. At their head rode the Wizard, Grey no more, for he had also taken on a mourner's raiment and went now in sable, save where the sun struck him just so and a shimmering multitude of colors could be seen, twisting with a seeming life just beneath the ebony cloak. They departed Rohan and passed beyond the Gap, taking roads unknown and northerly to the eyes of Men. But when they arrived upon the Bruinen they were stopped before the fords, and there stood in shining mail the House of Elrond. Its master was there, bearing mighty Aeglos Snow-Point, and at his right side was Arwen Undomiel, whose fairness seemed not dimmed by warlike visage, but instead conferred upon the latter a terrible and fearsome dread that could not be named. At his left side rode Glorfindel, a burning star of emerald upon his brow. "Lo!" said Gandalf, his eyes terrible and bright beneath his brow. "And thus the line of Beren greets its saviors." "Thus it greets the Shadow," answered Elrond, "for Shadow lies heavy indeed upon your words. I heard them at the Crack of Doom."

[@AH-yg8xb]

Amazing, please continue. (I read wrong "Lo!" as LoL XD)

[@BackcountryForward]

THIS IS GOLD! I feel like I was reading the books themselves! Please continue or link to where you continue!

[@christophstrasen1567]

Well done.

[@Cordis-Ater]

Excelent, very genuine -feeling

[@michelle7410]

I would love to read more of this. :)

[@j_m_b_1914]

This video is definitely worth a coffee. Amazing research!