What was Gandalf's plan?

[@davidponseigo8811]

So many new AI generated LOTR channels have popped up but thankfully we have you and the other few great channels that have been around awhile for great content ! Keep up the great work !

[@ASilverNMeep886]

Agreed, I really appreciate how the artists are credited in the description. It would be nice if there was a small text on screen, but I suppose for anybody looking to buy or commission, they would look through the description.

[@xina968]

Totally agree! Robert is one of the only channels that I keep all notifications on 😊

[@williammcdonald3147]

He and the broken sword are by far the best LOTR creators. It’s a real shame when you click on a cool video with a unique video concept and it’s AI slop. It’s like the scouring of the shire, manufactured and Tolkien would have hated it

[@168toretiro]

@@williammcdonald3147 Jess of the Shire 🤷🏼‍♀️

[@michaelotoole1807]

tolkien untangled does a great job

[@GodofMasks]

It also makes sense if he feared that the ring was somehow worming its way into his decisions. He can never be sure if his own desires are warping his decisions, so he lets Frodo choose the path and helps make it happen.

[@Knight-Bishop]

My thoughts, too. If he would use it out of a desire to do good, what more "good" could he do than outright lead them, rather than merely guide and counsel them. He was led into a trap easily enough simply for seeking the wisdom of Saruman; they know how he thinks. Putting it out of his own hands was probably the best thing he could've done.

[@Firedraconian]

Bit ironic that, considering Frodo was the one carrying the ring. If anyone had worms in their decision making, you'd think it'd be him.

[@MandalorV7]

@@Firedraconianyet hobbits had proven the most resilient to the Ring’s influence.

[@bruhdon4748]

@@Firedraconianthe more power you have the more power you have to be corrupted, hobbits don’t wish for power or long for it, that’s why they’re so resistant to the ring, Frodo does eventually succumb to the power of the ring at the last minute. Gandalf would’ve fell to the rings power much sooner

[@michaelallen1432]

That's what I have always thought. That essentially, Frodo must ultimately decide the fate of the ring.

[@aj_8009]

Is there anything more comforting than a cup of tea and a new IDG LOTR video?

[@colingroot1877]

Nope

[@JesusChrist-vq6lk]

Ketchup or brown sauce?

[@Sven_Hausdorf]

Maybe a new IDG GOT video? But I am not picky.

[@jayjones5756]

I'm drinking a cup of decaf coffee

[@KimDez]

i watched the video while nibbling on a plate of charcuterie, it was quite comforting indeed.

[@steamr0ll]

Robert, for years your videos have been increasing my appreciation of books I have loved (and lovingly re-read) since childhood. I can't imagine the work you put in but it is clearly a labor of love for you. Thank you so much for everything!

[@ElizabethLueders]

Please keep me updated on the BRIGHT SIDE of your comments ❤🎉😮😅

[@gloweye]

I feel like if he tried to command Frodo, rather than let him decide, then that would be to assume authority over the ringbearer, and by extension, the ring. That is step one to getting tempted by the ring. That would definitely be something Gandalf would want to avoid. He was very scared of what he himself could become if corrupted by the ring. Additionally, making a long-term plan also involves a measure of mental dedication to that plan. You might lose the ability to see when your plan is a bad one, and follow it into folly.

[@Jotto999]

That's an interesting angle I never thought of. Indeed the ring is so endlessly insidious, that makes it a reasonable concern. That merely trying to control the ringbearer could give the ring leverage to manipulate them.

[@FrankClark]

HOLY HELL that makes so much sense!!! GREAT interpretation!!!

[@alexeecs]

That's so true, not just for saving the world but life in general. You should never to too attached to your own plan

[@exodiaexodus]

othority over the ring bearer would not mean outhority over the ring.

[@480pthacker]

It's interesting how much fear is a tool for Gandalf considering his mission is to inspire hope and bravery. He feared he wasn't the right entity to be sent to middle earth. He fears the fellowship failing. He fears the temptation of the ring. It grounds him and protects him against foolhardy actions and corruption in the end.

[@DistendedPerinium]

I always got that Gandalf was trusting in Eru. He had his commission from the Valar, but as a maia, knew that Eru had an infinitely larger perspective than even Manwe, and so trusted that whatever happened, it was of Eru's will. The line he says about how Frodo was meant to have the ring being an encouraging thought shows as much. It wasn't so much a mentality of "follow Frodo's lead" but more "Eru slapped this onto his lap for a reason, so I'll trust that it's a good reason".

[@lukesmith8896]

I certainly got this impression as well

[@adorp]

Christianity is basically Taoism with a (unnecessary) patriarch.

[@PoniesNSunshine]

I mean Gandalf runs off, gets captured, escapes, and then finds out that somehow Frodo, who has zero survival skills or combat training, leaves the day that the ringwraiths arrive, ran into none other than tom bombadil, who then saves him from the barrows and hands them four *ringwraith-killing swords* they get into a fight with said ringwraiths, and when frodo gets hurt he happens to have on hand one of the only humans on the planet who knows how to treat the injury. Hell yes I'm trusting in Eru's plot armor at that point

[@Weaseldog2001]

I'll add that he was not sent to actually fight Sauron. He was sent to help the Free People's in their struggle against Sauron. On that note, he was wise in not making decisions for the Fellowship. When he died and came back, his mission had been altered, and he took a more active role. But even here, he doesn't take direct action against the enemy, until Faramir is attacked by the ringwraiths.

[@johnquach8821]

"I have concepts of a plan" -- Gandalf, when asked about Smaug.

[@christophernemeth421]

What percentage of a plan?

[@Nimelennar]

​@@christophernemeth42112%

[@darthherald2564]

That's Maiar for "Plan? Ain't no plan."

[@erikasp205]

😂

[@WillZuidema]

@@darthherald2564 In "Sindarin" I Think they call it "Dunno lol" roughly translated to English.

[@Nastinius]

Gandalf also feared his own power and took seriously the idea that only someone who didn’t want/wield power could confound Sauron by making choice he wouldn’t understand.

[@tire26]

This answered my question. Thank you. I was going to ask why on Earth would Tolkien have extremely experienced travelers and not tell Frodo exactly what to do.

[@ArbitraryConstant]

There's an interesting concept by Charles Stross in The Labyrinth Index that prescience relies on people behaving in certain ways, and if you take someone out of their comfort zone they will be much more difficult to predict. I think that's applicable here. Not sure how much Sauron (or Saruman) rely on mystical prescience or just plain being very old and experienced, but I think similar conclusions apply either way. I've often had similar thoughts about, say, aggressive drivers, in that they don't scare me as much because they're very predictable. But if someone is simply a bad driver I have no idea what they're going to do. It is again the "felix culpa", the fortunate flaw. I think there's also the potential for the ring to start to work its influence on Gandalf (or Elrond or Galadriel) if they allowed themselves to start dictating choices to Frodo. The one member of the party that tries to tell Frodo what to do is Boromir.

[@Nastinius]

@ totally agree and you hear this from professional poker players; a poor player has strategy that is bad but someone who doesn’t know how to play will confuse a pro sometimes because there is no principle and it’s unplayable.

[@TheMinskyTerrorist]

that's in the video

[@Skuggan84]

If you do not have a plan, the enemy can not find out about it and none can betray it. Seems to be the order of the day.

[@danoconnell1833]

Well said!

[@Hazzo88]

Also a similar take by Russian and German battalion commanders when asked about the USA's approached to combat

[@eddieredmann3]

Oh, you mean like Pippin almost did at Isengard? lol

[@dromankass8655]

I did that once in a game of poker. I wasn't confident of hiding my emotions if I had a good hand or a bad, so instead each time I was dealt a hand, I didn't look at my own cards and stuck and folded at random. To the annoyance of the other players, whom I beat.

[@teemusid]

​@@dromankass8655If the non-face cards add up to an odd number, play the hand; even number, fold.

[@elizabethford7263]

This reminded me of parenting older teens..... Be there to support but not to make the decisions. Give them time to make their decisions and do all you can to assist them so that even when you are no longer present in their everyday lives, your guidance is still with them

[@martavdz4972]

Great point. I think Robert put it like that when he described Valar and the elves gradually weakening their influence over Middle-Earth and letting all the beings slowly grow up and deal with their own messes.

[@govsquid]

I like this metaphor. It also touches on an underappreciated aspect of Gandalf's style of planning -- you spend many long years working quietly and diligently to set up the pieces in a way that promotes success.

[@TheKlabim]

Hi Robert, this is us, the listener.

[@MoPaTography]

Hi Robert, this is a KZbin comment reply.

[@karlsweeney2328]

Are we one?

[@stevenwallace773]

"The Listener!" **Cicero voice**

[@evanhayes5891]

I listened to yo momma last night

[@MikaelKKarlsson]

We are Legion.

[@isomeme]

I imagine it didn't include being betrayed by a Maia and killed by another Maia on the way to dealing with his actual target Maia. Not to mention the two Maiar who went AWOL, and another Maia who kind of phoned it in. Perhaps the War of the Ring might be better named the Battle of the Maiar.

[@davidponseigo8811]

Very interesting way to put it, you just might be right.

[@Richard_Nickerson]

I'm assuming you're saying Radagast phoned it in, but he went AWOL too. He accidentally helped Saruman betray the Council & then he was never seen or heard from again.

[@NV..V]

He wound up in the RoP....

[@isomeme]

@Richard_Nickerson , and then he accidentally rescued Gandalf from Orthanc by sending Gwaihir there on a different errand. "Accidentally" seems to be a bit of a theme for Radagast. 🙃

[@justaman9564]

Or those with power tend to seek more power

[@paulschrum4727]

This is one of your best essays ever. Bravo. And the artwork you highlight is sublime.

[@Destroyer94100]

Gandalf was sent by the Valar to assist and guide the people of Middle Earth, it is for this reason he doesn’t just straight up decide what is to be done and instead lets them choose their own path and helps them out on that journey. This is why Gandalf succeeded while the rest of the Istari failed. Gandalf actually carried out the mission he was sent to do.

[@exodiaexodus]

uhm, no... if i'm not mistaken, the other gave up on their goals for assisting the "humans".

[@sambakovsky3637]

I started re-reading these books after having just read them through once and I now read them much slower and your voice is the one who narrates it - it’s much more enjoyable this second go around. Thanks for all your videos!

[@richard1493]

I love the idea that Gandalf, even with his impressive wealth of wisdom, was ultimately unsure on how to proceed and was more or less simply winging it while trying to maintain his composure.

[@andrewschneider2121]

That is how most great leaders operate.

[@exodiaexodus]

@@andrewschneider2121 uhm!?! citation needed

[@undercoverduck]

Gandalf's true wisdom shines through in his ability to admit to himself and others that which he cannot know or predict while people are looking to him for answers.

[@Tommy_UK]

Great work as always Robert. You are absolutely the standard-bearer for Tolkien Lore videocraft

[@dylanmorse8199]

I feel that maybe the reason why Gandalf left it to Frodo for his choices is because of the Rings influence. Had Gandalf forced Frodo to go ti Mordor, maybe the Ring would have tried harder to taint Frodo's thoughts and will. Maybe make Frodo to start becoming distrusting in Gandalf. However Gandalf only being there as a friend and nothing more, it helped Frodo remain strong willed and more resilient. Frodo's condition became considerably worse when Smeagle entered the picture, so maybe simply being near Smeagle helped taint Frodo's heart and soul by the Ring since Smeagl would stop at nothing to take it away. The Ring wanted to go back to its Master, so staying with Frodo and make him more distrusting of his allies when someone was knowingly there to take the Ring, that's what was making him break after all that time. If Gandalf was still around, I am certain Frodo would have held out much longer, maybe even not fall once like he did in the Crack of Doom.

[@jmolofsson]

Through the years, on this channel I think I must have heard nearly a hundred analyses. This one is clearly among them I appreciate the most for clarifying stuff I hadn't thought of. Thanks!

[@George-h3q6h]

Fascinating video - as always. Of all the channels devoted to JRR I enjoy yours the most. The content is always well researched and the delivery in that wonderful voice of yours makes it a treat every time.

[@CovfefeWithASMR]

He alludes to it in the council with Galadriel that it’s the small things, as well as not interfering with the agency of others but completing their mission to motivate and inspire good against evil.

[@michaelogrady232]

The Plan was all laid out in the music of the Ainur at the beginning of time. "There are other forces at work, and not all of them are evil."

[@apm77]

I would be amazed if anyone expected Gandalf to be the sort of person to have a detailed plan for everything. In the movies he is very intuition-driven, it's one of his core character traits, always thinking about what his heart tells him and so on.

[@MrSlm1982]

I love the theological parallels Tolkien makes and how you describe them are well put.

[@jamessheridan9753]

Robert!! Love this channel man, great content! Just wanted to let you know: I think this video is the perfect length! Shorter than a tv show, longer than a reel… nailed it! Also, I love the subject matter! Thank you!

[@jonas.groschwitz]

I love the last sentence. "He did plan, but that wasn't where he pinned his hope". I feel like it describes Gandalf to his core.

[@christophermorton4606]

I always recall the conversation in the Two Towers with Gandalf (the White) when Legolas, Gimli and Aragorn are discussing news and then Aragorn says “we think Sam went with Frodo” and Gandalf exclaims “Did he now!” He was sort of unaware of this bit of knowledge but it immediately boosts him. As much as he relies on Frodo to make his own choices the addition of Sam being there is just as strong and influential for Gandalf. Sam was a huge part of his plan.

[@katherineely3714]

Thank you for your work, Robert! It is always such a joy when one of your brilliantly researched and presented pieces appears.

[@GeirDanckeMolvik]

It just struck me: could it be that, in knowing Sauron and the Istari from ancient times, Gandlaf seeks to use the unexpected? He generally speaks of all the outcomes Sauron is prepared for, and the need to do what Sauron cannot think of, and to that effect, he seeks to use a mind unknown to the Dark Lord? Also, as it is with all motivational speech, if you can make your co-worker do the right thing while they believe it’s their genius idea, they will often be more commited to see it through than just following your masterplan…

[@michaelotoole1807]

well said.

[@Wolfeson28]

I agree that the way Gandalf dealt with Frodo and the Ring quest is very much consistent with how he operated generally, following the mandate of the Istari. He worked to help Frodo just the same as he did with rulers like Theoden or Denethor: by counselling and supporting, not by commanding or leading. There's also another layer specific to advising a Ringbearer. I think Gandalf had learned from his earlier conversation with Bilbo (when he convinced Bilbo to leave the Ring behind) that any attempt to directly command or force a decision from a Ringbearer was likely to result in resentment at the least and outright defiance at worst. He realized that all the decisions to get the Ring to Mordor, just like the one to ultimately destroy it, would have to be Frodo's own, otherwise the quest would be doomed to fail, and the Ring's corruption was more likely to take hold. All the more so since Gandalf would be gradually assuming authority over the Ring if he tried to command Frodo in its movements, and he might end up corrupting himself in that way. We know from that last conversation with Bilbo that Gandalf could get a bit more forceful when needed if a Ringbearer was lurching in an irrational direction, but it's clearly something Gandalf wanted to avoid as much as possible.

[@Limubi1]

We LOVE a close textual analysis! Great work, as ever :D

[@CrustyWhiteBread]

Perfect timing, Hoss Thank you.

[@theharper1]

I think one important thing was Gandalf saying that it's not prudent to look too far ahead. Elsewhere in Tokien's writings, the idea of trying to divine the future was said to be a bad thing, although Galadriel's mirror could do it. Or rather, the mirror could show things which MAY come to pass, depending on the choices people make. But I think the aspect which you've underscored is that the decisions were Frodo's to make, and Gandalf would advise and assist, but not decide for him. I also think that Gandalf didn't lay out the entire approach to Mordor because it would place too much burden on Frodo as well as antagonising Boromir, who clearly wanted the ring to go to Gondor.

[@turquoisesupreme3453]

Amazingly insightful.

[@Lorkdemper]

I'm pretty sure it involved a lot of sitting and smoking

[@nicka731]

😂 Well it always worked for him before. 🤷‍♂️ 🌬

[@justins9886]

That’s exactly what I’m doing.

[@benjaminmorton4958]

"riddles...in the dark......"

[@UkrainianPaulie]

Longbottom leaf or old toby.😂

[@chriswalter7419]

Almost always a great plan...

[@random22026]

Another engaging episode! Helpful details, too. Many thanks, Robert! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

[@busdriversprayer]

Tolkien frequently described similar events twice. Gandalf's not so subtle prod to recruit a burglar was also not a precise plan, but an attempt to set a series of events in motion based an a premonition rather than exact knowledge of future events

[@MegaPhilmurray]

Yes. Like Ulmo guiding Tuor

[@rashkavar]

That's a fascinating discussion, and a very sharp contrast between how Gandalf is early on vs later. I forget if it was this channel or another that I watch that pointed out one of the key differences between Gandalf the Grey and Gandalf the White is the latter having an incredible capacity of foresight and clarity of purpose - part of that is just the urgency of the times - Rohan can't exactly afford Gandalf opting to ride all the way back to Lothlorien to confer with Galadriel about what to do with Saruman's army, it needs him to gather their cavalry and get them to Helms Deep post haste...but there's also some times where Gandalf seems more certain of things than he should be - "Look to my coming at the dawn of the third day" - how does Gandalf know he can get Treebeard to send the Huorns and then find Eomer and whatever other cavalry forces, and get them to Helm's Deep perfectly in time to attack with the rising sun, if not through a mystical form of foresight? Taking Pippin to Minas Tirith, the march on the Black Gate...Gandalf makes a lot of very decisive plays that work out *very* well in the latter two books, whereas in the first, he seems primarily focused on tapping into the knowledge of others: "take the Ring to Elrond, so its ultimate fate can be decided, while I will consult with Saruman." "After Rivendell, we cross the Misty Mountains and strike out for Lothlorien, to confer with Galadriel." And yet he does still wonder about Frodo - wonders about why it was his fate to pass through Cirith Ungol. Perhaps the foresight he gains as Gandalf the White is limited to his own role - he can see what parts he must play and follows them, and yet when it comes to others, those who he will not meet again before the finale, he's left as in the dark as he would have been as Gandalf the Grey. He has the foresight to know that an attack on the Black Gate is the play, but not the direct knowledge of Frodo and Sam's situation to know *why.*

[@martavdz4972]

The difference between Gray and White is on this channel, uploaded recently

[@stevenjlovelace]

Gandalf acts like a good therapist, working to extract what Frodo already knows deep down, without saying it aloud.

[@martavdz4972]

Interesting point. Might have something to do with Tolkien being Catholic (or, might not). I´m a Protestant who´s been meeting Catholics lately, and it struck me how much more therapist-like they are.

[@amadeov11]

A fun thought, with his humility, and even meekness at times as the grey, one thing he consistently avoided was using his power as a direct, egoic force of will. It was not his commission to will victory over Sauron, but to help guide the people through this difficulty. Any assertion of willfulness in the planning of the peoples of Middle earth would be, in essence, the same ruling forcefulness that Sauron, and even Melkor exhibited, and would then taint any actions thereafter. It's a testament to the truth he attempted to embody in his actions throughout the long efforts of his life as a wizard. He seemed to be the only maiar who understood the depths of intention and how it could easily rise the foundations of even the best lays plans. Thank you for another wonderful video.

[@rosswittenham1422]

Great video. Answers a lot of questions with a simple well-constructed logic. It's also worth pointing out that without a plan, it's harder for the enemy to find out where you're going. It's harder for fools and those with prior commitments to betray your approach if you don't even know it yourself.

[@cptswann]

This was legitimately faith strengthening for me; Thank you so much!

[@nathandougherty7058]

Robert, you've been making a ton of amazing videos lately. Wonderful stuff.

[@thenerdfaraway]

Robert, my heart is always happy when I listen to your Tolkien studies! Thank you so much for these... I'm looking forward to hearing the Thranduil character study again ... that is one of my favourites!

[@hansbystrom9983]

This is one the best channels. Please keep it up!

[@FrankClark]

literally one of the most delightfully insightful videos you've made on LOTR (and by the way, i love them all). and it makes me think this: Tolkien was the master of hidden Deus ex Machina. if *one* single variable in the story had changed, Sauron would not have been defeated... but yet, the reader does not see any of this. it is artful, and wonderful that we can look back on all these details and examine what could have happened if one of those variables had changed, as well as why each of those variables was an indelible moment which determined fate. if Frodo had not waited, they would have never met Bombadil, never gotten the daggers from the barrow, and the Witch King would have not been defeated, for example. if Gandalf had led Frodo instead of advising, then the ring may never have had been destroyed. thank you, Robert - your videos have so enriched my own understanding and experience of the Tolkien universe.

[@Explore-With-Care]

Great stuff!! Love the in deep deep dive

[@giggityguy]

The fact that he repeatedly talks about "not seeing far ahead" sounds like he's definitely relying on his foresight, which in truth is less about seeing the future and more about revealing the will of Eru. He definitely put all of his faith in providence throughout the war. I think he also had faith in Frodo, that Frodo was the right person for the job. And on the flip side, he did not want to make any decisions directly about the Ring himself, both because of the terms of his commission, and because he feared that anything he did concerning the Ring could be bent to Sauron's advantage; either by Gandalf becoming invested in his plans for the Ring, or because he feared that Sauron could predict his actions. Also, he probably was afraid of spies.

[@ianallardyce4222]

Gandalf's plan is like leaving all your shopping to Xmas Eve but somehow coming home with perfect presents.

[@TachyonKing]

These videos are always comfortingly insightful, I think its most telling that Gandalf never attempted to find Frodo after he came back - in fact I wonder if him being separated from Frodo was the only way they would have succeeded. For one Gollum would never have guided Frodo and Sam if Gandalf was there (Gollum hated Gandalf and would have avoided them) and Gollum may have been the better guide for that part of the journey, even if he wasn’t the better person. Frodo may have also been more afraid to make the choices and Gandalf may have been more reluctant to put Frodo in danger- which could have ultimately have been the point of failure.

[@mikefraley748]

Thanks, Robert. I appreciate your commentary as always.

[@ToledoPropertyManager]

This channel has always been one of my favorites. I love exploring the lore of middle earth. Thank you 🙏

[@ehd.f4269]

These videos are SO GOOD! Thank you!

[@josie4065]

Powerful stuff, Robert. Thank you.

[@elasiduo108]

Brilliant. You finally answered this question for me. Thank you.

[@chefRyan38]

It is so satisfying the way you read the question in the thumbnail aloud at the onset of each video

[@Way_Out_There_Music]

Very solid OpSec that no member of the team should know the whole plan. That way of anyone is captured by the enemy - or has their mind looked in to - they could never give Frodo away. Who knows what Pippin could have told the Dark, had he known anything at all? Fool of a Took. Best keep it that way.

[@SurferJoe1]

This is a wonderful channel.

[@brileyford5856]

I hope you had some great tea and crumpets this morning

[@PwnySlaystation01]

At the decision point, when Frodo wanders off. The rest of the fellowship is talking about what Frodo might be thinking about, and how he might decide. Whether he'll choose to go to Minas Tirith or not, which path is best or the most desperate... I love Sam's insightful comment. It's one of my favorite little moments of the books. Where he basically says they're all wrong and they don't understand his master at all, Frodo doesn't care about Minas Tirith or what the fellowship wants to do etc. He knows he must reach the Cracks of Doom but now they've reached the decision point he's just plain terrified. He's gone to work himself up to the thing he knows he must do. Go on alone, and not drag anyone else to their deaths. But he's so afraid he's trying to work himself up to do what he knows he has to do. Of course Sam turns out to be right, and manages to track Frodo down during the confusion and go with him. I just always really loved that moment from Sam who understands Frodo as well or better than anyone else, including Frodo himself.

[@curtislesure8906]

I love your videos. This one is my favorite. And so timely.

[@danielbalboa4537]

They are like winter thunder on a wild wind rolling in from a distance , breaking hard in alarm, but sometimes a storm is just a storm - The Battle of the Five Armies

[@custard131]

i wonder how much fear of the ring played into Gandalfs hands off strategy eg we see with Boromir who one could argue tried to push his plan too hard, and his plan wasnt bad intentions or anything just a little misjudged, until Frodo eventually used the ring to escape him and nearly revealed himself to Sauron in the process Gandalf was probably far more aware of the dangers of such a scenario and maybe purposefully avoided it (i do think its also just Gandalfs style to support others rather than lead them but he seems to take it to another level with Frodo) as for the plan, part of the problem with working out his plan is how impossible a mission they were on, its difficult to come up with any successful strategy other than essentially what happens, where he and Aragorn knock on the front gate to cause a diversion while Froda sneaks in the back way, and he doesnt seem to have known about the secret back entrance pretty much every other option requires breaking the gate by force

[@grahambooth8799]

Outstanding, my grateful thanks

[@awesomehpt8938]

The thing is what difference would it have made if Gandalf stayed with Frodo and Sam as they approached Mordor? Unless Gandalf has some kind of magic that can make them invisible they’re not going to get through the black gate. They can’t go around the mountains that encircle Mordor because that will take too long. They can’t fly the eagles over the mountains or go through minas morgul. It seems despite the dangers the only real option was through Shelobs lair and Cirith Ungol.

[@anthonyqcn]

Been waiting for your take on this question for a while now, thanks Robert!

[@ImagineMySurprise510]

That was rather good. Well reasoned. Thank you.

[@Lord_Malkior]

Great video as usual, Robert. 🖤

[@tomdreler6528]

Perfekt Timing, thank you! I habe contemplated this question Just Yesterday.

[@jessetingle9055]

This is such a beautiful idea, thank you.

[@ttapion]

I'm suddenly striking similarities to Qui-Gon. Bless!

[@shaulkramer7425]

It is not often enough remarked that Gandalf displayed such a profound level of faith. A faith that would been increasingly difficult to keep.

[@martincunliffe8555]

Your work continually provides an oasis of thoughtful joy. Thank you.

[@MargoB]

I appreciate your tracing Gandalf's thought by referencing Providence; I love stories of faith and Providence. ☺️ Thanks for telling us about LOTR from yet another point of view.

[@gibranlewis7300]

Great video, as they often are. One amend I'd make is that Aragorn had NOT known Gandalf longest of those in the fellowship, as certainly Legolas and probably Gimli had known him longer. Gandalf's friendship with Thranduil was pretty ancient.

[@ruperterskin2117]

Appreciate ya. Thanks for sharing.

[@meganofsherwood3665]

As a young doctor, still training, Gandalf's approach of Guiding, not Leading, even when you know things the other person doesn't, and can see some of the potential consequences, and yet choosing to let the other person take the lead since it is their life and their journey is just ... this is a really powerful video for me, and I was not expecting it. Thank you, Robert

[@disputeone]

You missed out on the kickbacks from the covid vaccine. I give doctors toilet paper with "first do no harm" written on it. So they can use the Hippocratic oath as toilet paper, you see.

[@JeffRebornNow]

This was a perfect video essay and I agree with everything you said

[@UkrainianPaulie]

Boromir had it right. " One does not simply walk into Mordor". Yet they did.

[@TheDungeonMinister]

One very gingerly, with great difficulty and complexity, walks into Mordor!

[@Itdoesntmatter48]

And let's not forget, it was his job to guide, not to lead, the people of middle earth. Edit.... Well you just said that at 11:18 so much for my being wise lol

[@Puschit1]

Some possible aspects: 1) Gandalf rarely speaks about things directly and has many secrets, just read what he says to the others about his fight against the Balrog. However, we, the readers, don't know much either, many of Gandalf's actions and motivations aren't narrated by Tolkien, all we have is Gandalf's own words. And - I think Gandalf knew way more than he ever told anybody. Especially regarding Gollum/Smeagol when he said early on that it was good to spare him because he might have to play a role. My impression of Gandalf and his actions have always been that of a time traveller that knows some important bits about the future and has to ensure they will happen this way, but he can't directly tell that he knows. You know, like you have to do twists and turns in order to get the events straight because direct interference might lead to people doing the opposite of what they are supposed to do. 2) The ring can corrupt everybody, including Gandalf, and he made it clear early on that he would never even touch the ring. And I think he was afraid to make direct calls regarding the ring because he could never be sure if his judgment is already clouded by the ring's lure. And this leads to => 3) Maybe he knew that even someone as pure as Frodo would eventually succumb to the ring. But if that is inevitable, you'd be better of if it's someone like him rather than, say, Aragorn who could cause way more problems if he claimed the ring. Now, it was also clear early on for Gandalf that the ring was already beginning to claim possession of Frodo as early as Gandalf's first visit when he confirmed it's the One. So ... I think Gandalf's plan was to let it play out with Frodo ultimately making the decisions because he knew the ring would always try to reconnect with Sauron and that means the ring would always try to "go home" one way or another. Since that would be the same path as the oath to Mt Doom, he figured that it's probably best to let Frodo/Ring seek their way on their own terms and just follow them. As this video says correctly it was always about stealth and the enemy never suspecting to destroy the ring. Frodo would never be seen as a potentially dangerous ring bearer and therefore be underestimated. Even if Frodo fails at any point in the journey, Gandalf could still try to track the ring's path. He basically activated the ring's GPS and put faith in it's automatic recovery protocol, ready to intercept it right before it actually reaches Sauron.

[@lili46038]

Awesome work as always

[@toferg.8264]

That was awesome!

[@thebadshave503]

My read of it was basically that Gandalf was pretty outright about how dangerous the ring would be in his hands, how insidiously good it was at working its way into people's thoughts, and how those who reject the ring of their own accord are so rare. Frodo went above even Bilbo's impressive feat of choosing to give up the ring by deciding to take on the responsibility of destroying it, so Gandalf saw Frodo as the only person 'above the influence' enough to make decisions about the ring's path, not even trusting himself to be clear headed about it.

[@emikke]

If anyone but a Hobbit made the plan, then Sauron would have been able to predict it

[@LTV746]

Summed up so well

[@peteranderson3796]

Yet another testament to how well the movies captured the true essence of the story!

[@slowjoe-i5s]

Love your channel

[@94462]

Sauron was right because even Frodo or anyone couldn't destroy it willingly, without Eru Luvatars intervention, the ring would NOT be destroyed

[@JackWitt-g9p]

Well, Sauron was right. No one who held The Ring could willingly destroy it. It took divine intervention which admittedly after Numenor, Sauron should have expected. EDIT: SInce no one seems to have gotten into actual Tolkien lore since I keep getting poorly made comments, Tolkien stated in letters that the Ring could never have been willingly destroyed by anyone and that it was Eru Illuvatar who caused Gollum to fall into the magma.

[@RetroJack]

Actually, it was 'Smeagol' intervention, as even at the end, Frodo was unable to destroy it.

[@JackWitt-g9p]

@@RetroJack J.R.R. Tolkien stated in a letter that Eru Ilúvatar (Tolkien's God) intervened a second time at the end of the Third Age, causing Gollum to trip and fall into the fires of Mount Doom while holding the One Ring, thus destroying it.

[@Vmac1394]

I feel like that is half a plot hole, in that Sauron knew and was there when the Valar crossed the sea and smashed Morgoth as soon as he was poised to win. Sauron should know that the Valar will come back and stomp him if he wins or otherwise intervene in some subtle ways to make him lose. This makes Sauron a Satan type figure where he must know that he cannot ever triumph in the end but is too prideful to submit to God or Iluvatar in this case.

[@JackWitt-g9p]

@@Vmac1394 Well the whole point is that the Legendarium was heavily inspired by Tolkien's religious beliefs. Evil will always inevitably self-destruct in the end.

[@BeauSeymour]

Sauron were themselves divine, so really all strife/evil is under the will of illuvatar. Beauty only exists in the delicate contrast and chaos between the two absolutes of light and dark, illuvatar just nudges the needle every now and again, in either direction. You could argue that's our purpose as a species, to find the balance. Like a parent guiding a child on a push bike, (insert diety(s) of choice) has steadily removed their hand supporting our saddle, but the direction we chose after is ours to find. This is to me how and why Gandalf is the way he is. It's not his bike to ride.

[@sgolosio]

Your voice is amazing . Big fan of your content .

[@hervigdewilde3599]

An interesting take, as usual... 😎

[@cimp8770]

you are a natural audio book talent

[@UPTAUT]

This is one of my moments of pure disconnection from the world. These small moments means so much to my continuing strength during my working week.

[@JackChurchill101]

God I love this art work... Best thing about well researched Tolkien videos.

[@shermanator2112]

Hi Robert. I have been reading the Lord of the Rings annually since 5th grade in 1983. As I grew to know the story very well, I have wondered about Gandalf's fear of Cirith Ungol that you mentioned in this video. It's clear, I think, that he is aware of its proximity to Minas Morgul, as well as Cirith Ungol's own sinister reputation. So, yes, I understand Gandalf's fear. But his musing "Why that way" is where I'm stuck. There are only two ways to get in, and the Black Gate is clearly a suicide mission. My best guess is that Gandalf is not weighing Cirith Ungol vs The Black Gate, so much as, "how does Frodo have knowledge of that passage?" And my ultimate conclusion is that he is beginning to wonder if his foresight about Gollum playing a role is coming true. Because who else would know how to guide Frodo through that nightmarish "secret" way. What are your thoughts?

[@slayskool777]

5:54 Who is that elf on the right? Also, who were the other people at the council meeting and why didn't they volunteer?

[@slayerhuh404]

Anyone happen to know who did the painting at 0:50? I've looked all through the links in the description and I can't find it.

[@DaveConsiglio]

It was in a calendar I had as a kid. Always liked this one. Enjoy.

[@2Tone-x8h]

As best I can tell, It is a painting called “Gandalf-A Light In The Dark” by Mathew Stewart. I hope this helps. 👍

[@davidponseigo8811]

Cracks of Doom, that always makes me laugh, that could be a good description of my sons backend !