What is this noise? 300Tdi Day2

[@billb3444]

My mantra for all my career was “ The longer it takes to find a fault the simpler the cause”. Stood me in good stead for decades.

[@roversteve53]

I know you said it has a MLS head gasket but I had a VM 2.5 in my RRC and some how the h/gasket split a tiny bit, it was down on power and made a noise just like yours, no water or oil Leak just air coming out of the gasket.

[@simonstevenson1611]

Hello I was watching the air cleaner box vibrate at the same rate as the cheap. I think a bracket is rubbing.

[@johnmans4530]

Ha, had the same issue. But with a 200tdi. A metal dust shield is pressed onto the back of the front crank pulley. If it comes loose, you will have this sound.

[@BritannicaRestorations]

There is no cover on this engine

[@W555LAN]

interestingly when turning off the engine @7:50 it makes a longer continuous squeak as the engine slows to a stop - which implies that some thing is constantly rubbing but when the engine is running perhaps the vibration makes it intermittent.

[@frankwilliams3081]

Listening to the video, the tone of the squeak changed after you removed the vacuum pump.... I'm no mechanic, but did you have to move or disturb anything to remove the pump ?

[@bradhardwidge1521]

Change the four rubber mounts under the clamps that hold the air filter housing

[@BritannicaRestorations]

They are new - and noise still there when the air filter is removed

[@kevm8965]

Is it just a loose bit of metal like the bracket on the end of the grill or a bracket holding a reservoir, it doesn't have to be a rotating mechanical thing.

[@paulconnelly8369]

i wonder if something got behind the fly wheel i had something simular on a old renault many years ago

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Anything is possible!

[@metaldog7128]

Turbo impeller on its way out? Spinning and just making contact with the housing inside

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Nope...

[@bazvw205]

Notice the noise changed after the air filter housing removed, and the clamps were vibrating faster. Remove the bracket completely for my own piece of mind! 😂

[@berndeikers8924]

indeed it changed

[@johnnywolde306]

Is it also there if you press the clutch?

[@JohnGreen-l9r]

Had a similar sound a couple of times on non Land Rover vehicles. Both time it was combustion gasses escaping causing a chirp/whistle but were difficult to pinpoint. One was a slight leak from the head gasket the other was from a gasket on the EGR system.

[@scorpionrgp]

Just before took the vacuum pump off there was a slight knock in the chirp. But the noise changed as soon removed the vacuum pump. When turned it off after removing the vacuum one can hear it change as engine went backwards abit on the compression. Also sound is consistent with a cylinder. A bad valve lifter? A cam bearing spinning? Slightly bent valve?

[@RobertMoss-z3s]

All I can say is : I’ve had this noise on my 300tdi for several years, I’ve just grown to accept it. I got a spare water pump and clutch, lift pump etc just in case though sitting here in their boxes. You know how the lift pump arm can be tight, would that make noise when it warms up… mine doesn’t from cold BTW. Good luck!

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Thanks!

[@seanmcintyre3986]

I'm so looking forward to you finding the problem...

[@RussellJarrett]

Could it be the turbo impeller hitting the housing?

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Don't think so

[@martianmusic1]

Many moons ago, I was presented with a Morris Minor 1000 with the same squeak. It ended up being a dry rocker. Oil going everywhere except from one blocked hole in the pump fed overhead rocker shaft. The squeak stopped momentarily when I squirted the oil can directly at the rocker bearings. A real bugger to find but so easy to fix. Just a thought.!!!!!!!!

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Changed rocker shaft AND pushrods - same problem

[@martianmusic1]

@BritannicaRestorations Doesn't squeak when it's cold. What about exhaust mountings as it warms up??

[@andrewwoolley8726]

Try injectors and compression test for valves seating properly to rule those out 👍

[@BritannicaRestorations]

I tested the injectors and replaced the seals

[@gregorydobson4307]

Just a thought mike, could it be some resonance from combustion area amplified through water ways being empty. Try filling coolant system. Maybe, Maybe not.

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Could be

[@jamespearce4582]

Mike , from what i can hear it sounds very similar to the noise i had on my 300tdi. Couldnt pin point it at all. I changed lift pump, vacuum pump, had all the belts off and checked for rubbing on pulleys etc and nothing sorted it. A couple of months later i changed my clutch for an lof one before a long trip abroad. Including the nige uprated realease bearing. And what do you know. The noise disappeared. The only other thinh i did at that time was pull of the front crank pulley. The back dust shroud was slightly and bent and looked like it was rubbing in the timing case. But im pretty certain that wasnt the problem anyway. So it had to be something to do with the clutch assembly in my case. Hope this helps on some way.

[@kingy550]

Hi Mike, sorry the injector seals I suggested didn't fix the chirp. At this point, I'd try and determine if the chirp is crank speed or cam/injector pump speed. 800rpm for crank and 400rpm for cam/injector pump. Try playing this video in one tab, and 400 BPM metronome in another youtube tab. By my ear I'd say it matches the 400 BPM metronome, so top end of engine.

[@simondrake8909]

Before going to the lengths of pulling the motor, how about putting a jack under the bell housing and gently loading the engine mounts or exhaust system? Maybe even go mad and slightly slacken the Bell housing in case the clutch was damaged during installation?

[@msmbus]

😢turn the radio up 😅

[@ianhellyer1473]

My 300TDI had a weird noise towards the front of the engine; it turned out to be the injector pump. My mechanic quizzed me about anything that might have changed and that's when I mentioned that I was buying fuel from an independent garage. He suggested I change to a major supplier (BP). I bought fuel from other majors over the years and no noise. It took about 1.5 tanks before the noise stopped and never reoccurred. I was buying fuel for sometime from the independent before the pump started making the noise. The engine now has a replacement pump on it and is running well. One day, I should have the old pump overhauled.

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Interesting!

[@joaogrosso1117]

I have a D1 300tdi that makes a small squeak when running warm/hot. In cold there's no squeak. Mine comes from the front too! I already replaced alternator, belt tensioner, belt, coolant pump and pulleys and timing belt and the squeak remains. I'm going to try your recomendation, because I've always used low cost fuel... 🤞👍

[@Robjud-u2x]

How about remove the oil cap whilst running to see if it gets louder like a cam or something in the too end.

[@BritannicaRestorations]

It's an idea!

[@robwhite3785]

Hi Mike I have a 300tdi on my s2a 88. It had very similar if not identical chirp. I did everything you have done and eventually gave up. One day the starter motor gave up dead as a dodo. Took it off and found a very scuffed look on the flywheel side ends of the bendix teeth. New starter and chirp was gone. I think it was somehow catching the flywheel.... Worth a look?

[@SnaggerNick]

@@robwhite3785 I think you may be right. The same thought occurred to me but I dismissed it because the sound is apparently stronger on the right hand side but the starter is on the left. But sounds travel in peculiar ways on metal objects, and it would explain the sound being absent while cranking and appearing immediately after the starter disengages. @BritannicaRestorations , I think you should consider Rob’s suggestion, Mike.

[@MrRobmellor]

Put a sock in it Mike!!!!! or at least a ball of rags up the exhaust tail pipe, Putting stress on the engine might just show up the fault , or!!!!!! turn the tick over down to a point were it is nearly stalling and again the stress may high-light the fault. You might be able to hear the motor better when you get it outside as there will be less reflected sound like you get off a concrete floors Ect. I'm sorry that I cant suggest anything better, but after sitting on top of Gardener engines for over 20 years the hearing has long since gone. Best wishes from Yorkshire Rob.

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Will try reduce the idle

[@paccoast6249]

Did you check the starter motor to see if it retracting?

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Yes

[@Reaper4367]

Turbo core?

[@thomasillidge3768]

It seems to got louder when you took the vac pump off ?.

[@alisonstubbs2939]

After you took the vacuum pump off and run the engine and the noise was still there, when you turned the engine off and the engine rocked backwards it still squeaked loudly. Wondering if it could be nose cone of the starter motor to the fly wheel, something catching. Easy to check by removing the starter motor

[@adriancarrier7762]

this may sound out there but my mate used to repair london taxi's one had a similar noise turns out it was the flitch panels rubbing, don't why but only did when the friction made them warm, just a thought.

[@allan4854]

It will expand very slightly as it warms

[@PhilUys]

It could be the clearance between the piston and cylinder head. The clearance on the big end crank bearing could be the cause of the piston touching the head. If not the cause, the cylinder head gasket could be too thin.

[@tim8505]

Is the starter motor maybe not disengaging? So it is constantly being turned? Maybe the clutch bearing (does pushing the clutch pedal change something?) Check next to the clutch housing with your stethoscope:)

[@overlandbyrover]

My bet is on the notorious vacuum pump. I had this exact same problem earlier this year and that was it. Local indi shop couldn't figure it out either. I blanked it off and put in an electric pump. No regrets.

[@gazzafloss]

@@overlandbyrover I fitted an electric vac pump with reservoir off a Volvo to my Disco D1 300 TDI, got sick of the oil leaking "Wabco" and it's sub par performance. The rotary vac pump gave superior braking performance, a good move.

[@noelbishop5153]

Does it do it with the bonnet down?

[@julls4x4]

Exhaust manifold gasket ?

[@kevinreeves6875]

Weird one Mike. Suggestion take starter motor off and insulate wires with some tape and get a push start then see if noise goes. It's quick and easier than stripping motor and or removing gearbox.

[@raygale4198]

It sounds like a dry scrape, it sounds to be engine speed related and you thought it was the rear of the engine. I would look at something like a starter motor or starter mount bolt or a flywheel housing inspection cover screw brushing the edge of the flywheel. I had an experience where we changed a 4 cyl. Toyota front wheel drive engine and someone, not pointing any fingers at Stephan, forgot the 1mm thick spacer washer that goes on the rear of the crank before the flywheel gets bolted on. You don't notice it until you start the engine after everything is back together. The dust/smoke and noise as the crank floated was a bit of a give away.

[@kylesfisher]

Sounds like the chirp I had on my downpipe for my 200tdi

[@stephenbricolman1067]

The owner did say it felt down on power so maybe it's the injection pump. To me listening on a phone the squeek sounds like a dogs toy. As though a pulse of air under pressure is escaping. Could you have a bad seal on a glow plug?

[@msmbus]

have bolts came loose on clutch and rubbing within bell housing?

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Duuno

[@paulmyhill4158]

Another couple of thought,s no power how about the boost diaphragm in the injector pump or air leak in the connection . or the crank damper pulley is it rubbing on cover.

[@PipeDream.Adventures]

Could it be the starter that maybe is not completely retracting and has contact with the flywheel? 🤔 But I guess that it wouldn't make a difference if the engine is warm or cold 🤷

[@OTR-UK]

Try in and out of diff lock, I've have a chirpy with that little spring top of the box. Or gear stick moving about

[@allan4854]

Could It be turbo chirp as it hits its housing?

[@richardtedeschi9290]

Could it be the air filter rings or mounts vibrating? My 300 Tdi had the air filter casing rings and mounts which were vibrating and making noises.

[@johncarson6851]

Is there a chirp in the bulkhead when something heats up and expands and rubs the bulkhead or anything else on the chassis

[@owensteele1645]

Have you checked the exhaust mounts?

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Yeap

[@brett2432]

so what u got left that moves on the rear of the engine, starter motor not fully retracting, tappet cam in the block, clutch/fly wheel, tappet shaft in head and thinking of it tappet assembly could be a culprit as the engine speed it would match the speed of the noise as its could be getting tie just in one spot on the stroke. the noise changed when u removed the vac pump it could be something to do with that shaft

[@marksingleton7199]

What happens at higher revs?

[@ianwallett7438]

Starter motor not releasing properly?

[@jameskerr5756]

It's not the starter not retracting the gear far enough away from the ring gear is it? I've no idea

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Could be - who knows!

[@jameskerr5756]

@@BritannicaRestorations Could you take the starter out and somehow start it from the crank pulley end? Anyway, hope you get to the bottom of it.

[@jamesholden5190]

Any chance you've checked the crankcase breather and cyclone?? Maybe worth a shot 👍👍

[@47606odin]

Is it a turbo chirp?? I’ve had those on large turbos, but tends to be at high speed. The turbo spinning feeds more air than the engine swallows so a bit of back pressure stalls the turbo resulting in a little chirp. I know not likely to be in this instance, but thought I’d mention it

[@079si]

Turbo splines catching?

[@HeinerStorchennest1]

What about some pints of 2-stroke oil into the diesel?

[@franzlatchford1219]

A daft one have you checked the turbo impeller? Franz (Derby UK)

[@woodywoodprepper6816]

i have a 200 have you look at the lift pump

[@Ted2019-f4m]

Try the turbo sounds like the turbines catching

[@paulbarnard5267]

I didn’t hear you mention the fuel lift pump. That’s another possibility

[@glennharvey5100]

That was my thought too

[@W555LAN]

second that suggestion

[@BritannicaRestorations]

No lift pump - deleted - now electric

[@andygreen6383]

anything happening in the crank pulley/seal area?

[@OTR-UK]

Dry spigot bush?

[@paulbarnard5267]

How about an air leak at the back of the inlet manifold? There is a blanking bolt there and it might be leaking air around it.

[@zibobpompon5768]

You need an audio spectrum analyser connected to database to identify the source of this noise . Or you can alos use an adjustable notch filter to locate the direction of this noise .

[@sarahdell4042]

Does pushing in the clutch change the noise at all?

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Nope

[@sarahdell4042]

@ Mind boggling. Vacuum pump?

[@stephenvickers2911]

Have you changed the injection pump pulley and can pulley with new timing belt kit? I had a similar noise on a customers defender and changed the whole timing set up I.e new cam belt kit new injection pump and cam pulley noise disappeared. Just a suggestion

[@graham-martin5847]

has anything been done with the turbo as i also had issues with a new core hitting the sides of the housing just a thought,could it be the rad pack touching somwere

[@philipdoris3503]

Broken valve spring?

[@BritannicaRestorations]

If a valve spring breaks on a Tdi, you are looking at a new engine!

[@chriscroucher98]

How about a rocker arm tight on rocker shaft ?? Other than that head gasket

[@willturner5633]

dose the tick change when the clutch is pressed , can you feel the squeak through the clutch peddle ?could it be an end float problem with crank or over long input shaft tight up against the spigot bearing ?

[@garypoulton7311]

Dry spigot bearing? As I wrote last time, I'd drive it until it got worse, or failed, or even dissapeared

[@alanhowatson3462]

Could it be the injector pump?

[@reuben.holmes.9690]

Hi,if you ve, had gear box out, are both bowls,in situ,, clutch plate not true,??

[@mcmeikan1]

It was louder with air filter out of the way?

[@lenhornsey2175]

Air housing filter as loosely?

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Nope!

[@DerekCarnell]

The noise got a touch louder and slightly different when the vacuum pump was removed.

[@paulrust619]

???manifold gaskets???

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Nope

[@ottovink5766]

Crank bolt loose?

[@du7ch384]

Mike just an idea, I know you don't need any from me but it sounds like a bolt that's too long on a pully, flywheel rubbing on a casing somewhere, maybe you fitted a bolt somewhere that was a mil or 2 too long somewhere? As I say just an idea... It so rhythmic and seems to follow the pulse of the engine has to be something silly, just a bugger to find.

[@raygale4198]

Like a starter motor mounting bolt just brushing the edge of the flywheel?

[@davidiley529]

The only thing moving that i can see is the air filter. Is it rubbing on something.

[@patakoripelomundo5362]

engine fan bearing?

[@tonywhite2848]

Could it be the heat shield loose

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Gone a long time ago!

[@richardshaw1919]

Vacuum pump or servo

[@antonionunes998]

There are some expert comments ... to laugh 🤣

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Yeap!

[@marksingleton7199]

​@BritannicaRestorations Sometimes, it's the stupid comment that makes links you to tge answer.

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Or get completely side tracked!

[@oldgrumpy]

Sounds like air blowing past a gasket on compression stroke. My old half deaf ears hear a high pitch blowing sound. Could be lack of Jamesons causing me hearing things.

[@rbrtcrowther]

I’ll suggest head gasket or valve leak…. As it seems consistent with compression on one cylinder

[@GrumpsBarn]

It's Aunty Mary and her bloody canary......other than that I'm stumped!

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Me too! Nothing is logic Captain..

[@alfredsteidle5035]

Elektrik starter not complett in 0 Position ?

[@W555LAN]

it sounds half crank speed?

[@gazzafloss]

Mike, more intriguing than Agatha Christie. To me, the squeaky noise sounded worse after you removed the Vacuum pump. Cam bearing? Just on the JWs, a fellow I used to work with 40 years back always invited the JWs in to sit on his lounge, he'd then disappear out back to make a cuppa, then he'd come back and keep on making excuses to be coming and going out for extended times. The JWs felt so awkward just sitting drinking the tea alone that they eventually got up and left, that particular lot, never to return, until a new lot knocked his door again, then "rinse and repeat".

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Lol!

[@alfredsteidle5035]

Vacuum pump?

[@grahamsmith3536]

Air leaking out from somewhere maybe? doing my head in too and it’s not even mine haha

[@johnmcgonigal8533]

Has someone dropped a small socket in the engine bay and lodged itself where it can’t be seen. I know it sounds like a daft thought !

[@williambaird8807]

Mike I am still thinking turbo impeller it’s rotational

[@keithgraham8906]

You haven’t left the flywheel timing pin still in

[@BritannicaRestorations]

Nope - my timing pin is designed to shear a replaceable pin

[@CHAGrady]

Mike, it’s rare that the Mrs watches along with me. She’s good. She reckons, as you only sprayed water on the belt and never listened with your scope it might be there. You took the vacuum pump off and it got louder. If she’s right. I need to take her to dinner 🙄

[@BritannicaRestorations]

With a wet belt squeaking stops in an instant

[@CHAGrady]

Watching again with her indoors. She says…. “I didn’t say the belt, I said the shiny gold cogs things”……

[@BritannicaRestorations]

lol!

[@bradhardwidge1521]

Air filter housing rubbers have failed

[@BritannicaRestorations]

They are new - and noise still there when the air filter is removed