What's gone wrong with political journalism in the UK? | Armando Iannucci | The New Statesman

[@Dr_Rich740]

Ash sarkar’s point is key. The starting point should be a recognition that ALL journalism is partisan (even the centrist ones which are most committed to pretending that their approach is impartial) but not all journalistic outlets are committed to objectivity and factual accuracy. Holding onto an up front recognition of one’s political values and perspective and yet still maintaining a commitment to journalistic integrity and objectivity in reporting is crucial to navigating the news media landscape.

[@FTZPLTC]

Absolutely right - there is in fact no "neutral" way to describe anything. We always choose what to describe, what to emphasise, what to present first, etc. This isn't to say that specific political biases shouldn't be reined in, and I think Sarkar is right that making sure all your facts are accurate is still worth doing. Still, I think the most important thing a news consumer can understand is that no news source is better than two (or more) news sources.

[@Globularmotif]

That was a great conversation. I have a lot of time for Ash, she seems to have a great understanding of the 'game' but is also very honest with herself. A good combo for her readers and listeners...

[@markwelch3564]

I think the point around 15:00 is the heart of it. When there's a revoloving door between the party machines and the press, and they all turn up to each other's weddings, it really undermines the press as an institution holding government to account!

[@samgould288]

Novara News, the home of real journalism!!

[@howtoappearincompletely9739]

Sarcasm?

[@shaneheff5244]

Definitely not. Completely biased channel.

[@michaelrch]

@@shaneheff5244all media has a bias. Being centrist isn't the same as unbiased. It just means you agree with the elite consensus.

[@Grandude77]

​@shaneheff5244 sure, they are open and honest about it. I find that refreshing. The bias of all media is clear but they pretend it doesn't exist.

[@ftumschk]

@@shaneheff5244 Most of their correspondents/presenters are hopelessly idealistic and naïve. TBF, Ash Sarkar is one of the better ones.

[@mongoliandude]

Found Ash’s perspective to be really interesting. Would be great to see more of her in future content.

[@EamonCoyle]

So glad to hear Ash backing up my view that Michael Walker proves that true class is classless !!

[@doctorfunkshock]

I find Michael to be a reliable interlocutor - his class shines out.

[@aianmacpherson6190]

As a politically engaged voter with no one party loyalty, I now watch, LBC, Novara, Politics Joe, The new Statesman, and times Radio, the mix is important.

[@seanoconnor8843]

I agree but if I'm interested in something I feel it's much better to look myself rather being told what's happening. Some people are quite happy to hear "The BBC. Making sense of the news so you don't have to"

[@helixzin]

Ash is the Ronaldinho of journalism... her flair is through the roof!

[@ConnbineHarvester]

She had an unpaid tax bill in the millions and went to jail for travelling under a fake passport? :O

[@akoustixx]

Stick to the Cider mate!@@ConnbineHarvester

[@ConnbineHarvester]

I don't drink cider and I'm not your mate! ;) I have zero clue and give zero f's who you are! @@akoustixx

[@akoustixx]

🤣🤣🤣@@ConnbineHarvester

[@jakethesnake630]

@@ConnbineHarvesterhow does this effect her work or understanding of journalism?

[@AlunParsons]

Excellent analysis. Great pannel, Dunt and Sarkar are always knowledgeable and eloquent.

[@cleonawallace376]

Good discussion. I'm a monthly supporter of Novara, so already a big fan of Ash Sarkar and Novara's style. I have a friend who told me a few weeks ago that she'd never listen to them because they're biased, but I personally prefer to listen to intelligent people who openly acknowledge their own biases, but then strive to report factually correctly on a wide range of subjects, rather than sources where their biases (not necessarily the journalists, but the organizations') are obvious but never stated (SKY, BBC) and you spend the whole time analysing their biases, and noticing what they're avoiding talking about.

[@joannec3579]

I can already tell from your post that you're a good person! I support them too. Great journalists!

[@Gordon.Pinkerton]

Tell your friend that she'll be hard pressed to find any current affairs related media that is not in some way biased.

[@rogerhigman7568]

An excellent discussion. There was much that chimed with my own experience as a media spokesperson for Friends of the Earth in the 1990s and 2000s. At the end of the day, all media outlets have agendas and values that colour their output. It pays to read multiple sources - and some of the best , like Novara, are in the "new media".

[@David-j9h9g]

Amazing Ash!!!!!

[@edwardbrowne258]

I think when Ash says partisans are often written off for not having objectivity she makes a great point. The wobbly wobbly comfortable middle is all very well if you have the privilege to pretend that benefits society, but truth has sharp edges. Translating that into policy, I prefer kind words, but the anaemic centrism of I don’t have an informed opinion so I’ll just take the middle ground and pretend that makes me wise (nope, makes you an I’ll informed coward or a grifter) is, in the final analysis, negligent reality denial. I have a position here’s why is legitimate. I don’t know is legitimate. I’ll just go along with the herd and not really think about it is useless and lazy. And yes, that is a criticism of bland liberalism in the uk.

[@richmaniow]

The core problem is not "the messengers" it's the political system. We basically have a dual dictatorship in the UK through the first past the post system. The Tories and Labour are both complicit in ensuring that either one will be running the country and making it as hard as possible for smaller parties to gain a foothold.

[@RobertJonesWightpaint]

I think - not that my opinion is any more valid than yours - that this is overly simplistic and fails to touch the real root of the actual problem. Whatever shape an answer might take, I don't believe it lies in the proliferation of political parties; I'm quite glad that some of those smaller parties can't gain a foothold, because they don't deserve one. FPTP is seriously flawed as a voting system, not least because the boundaries of constituencies make absolutely no sense - unless those responsible for drawing them up seek to manipulate the results of elections: I'm not at all sure that they do, but the rationale of their method doesn't work even to make FPTP representative. BUT - PR; I could make the now largely irrelevant point that Hitler was elected under PR - and actually I shall; because he was. There is no panacea - and if there were, PR wouldn't be it. Changing voting systems in itself will not change politics or those who engage in politics.

[@Indiekid-1976]

I honestly believe that Ash Sarkar is everything a Journalist should be, I have so much admiration for her and trust in what she does.

[@BigAL0074]

This is irony right, she is an activist and not inpartial as a journalist should be.

[@Agnelum1]

You have very low standards.

[@Indiekid-1976]

@@Agnelum1 go on then, educate me why I’m wrong? I’ve seen ash sarkar cut through to a right wing audience purely on what a great convincing communicator she can be and her use of facts and and being properly prepared is utterly professional. What standards do you feel that she fails to make?

[@Indiekid-1976]

@@BigAL0074 all journalists have their own views and reasons for wanting to come at a story from a particular angle, there is no such thing as neutrality. When even the BBC is cowed by what might happen if they upset the ruling party, it is necessary to have counterbalance to that and the corrupt right wing media, what’s important is facts, integrity and genuine talent

[@Indiekid-1976]

She wants her work to improve the country for all but the ultra rich especially those most marginalised and the poorest, and she is pretty transparent about all that. I think it’s a pretty noble type of journalism, she has the talents to earn more doing less good so what’s the problem?

[@philipachand]

Armando Ianucci and Ash Sarkar are two of my very favourite Brits at the moment. This is a great discussion, but still hamstrung by the problem of professional courtesy. Most journalists don't produce good work because they're stupid and lazy. When three people who are demonstrably not stupid and lazy get together to discuss the problems of journalism, out of professional courtesy they avoid making that point. Instead they talk about problems of funding, and problems of incentives... all of which are real! But quite often when you look at a particular piece of bad journalism and ask, why is this bad? The answer isn't so complex. It's just laziness. And laziness is even harder to fix than the structural problems of funding and incentives.

[@chrisbfreelance]

Ash is reactionary, her journalism is entirely emotive and lacking nuance.

[@ianlighting100]

Really not convinced by Marxism, but I am always really impressed by Ash when I see her speak.

[@ph8077]

Yes, seeing her speak is indeed impressive. I wouldn't recommend listening though.

[@michaelrch]

I run a business and I can recognise that Marx's analysis and critique of capitalism is extremely important. What we do in response is up to you, but on capitalism, Marx was right.

[@peteradaniel]

There’s a reason why Das Capital is compulsory reading on almost every major economics course from Oxbridge to the Ivy League.

[@abody499]

invariably, people are "not convinced" by those accounts that come from other people's definitions, rather from an actual reading of his/their works. when the opinion comes from an actual reading, it's either agreement or denial based on justification of personal privilege

[@michaelrch]

@@peteradaniel hmm, I don't think PPE-ists at Oxford are reading Das Kapital. I know a few and they don't have the first clue about Marx AFAIK. Mores the pity of course. They tend to spend much more time with Adam Smith, Keynes, Hayek and Friedman from what I can tell. There's a good channel called Unlearning Economics that talks about how bad the standard syllabus for economics is at most universities. Extremely narrow and obsessed with neoclassical economics that has been long debunked and superseded.

[@tcb3901]

I clicked on this for Ash

[@scottbarrett4746]

The news literacy discussed at about 41 minutes is key. I find that so many people apply absolutely no critical thinking to what they're reading or seeing. Maybe it was always the case and I'm just getting frustrated with it as I hit old age! However, just look at the state we're in due to media and politicians who just claim to be providing the public with what they want. Listening to you three gives me hope that there are really good thoughtful political journalists out there. Look how much better Andrew Marr and Emily Maitlis are after escaping their shackles. The Internet and social media have their problems but do give an opportunity to these thoughtful voices. Let's not get too down in the dumps about the way people's minds are being warped by the wall of propaganda. The disconnect between that wall and public attitudes on the Middle East and nationalisation were highlighted but let's also consider how the Labour opinion poll lead is holding up so far despite the onslaught as the press bombards its readers and the Tories panic.

[@dub604]

👍

[@shaun906]

the sun has a reading age of 6

[@dub604]

@@shaun906 True... In the early 1980's the Sun ran a campaign trying to convince its readers that AIDS was a hoax. Nobody ever lost money underestimating the intelligence of the general public.

[@michaelrch]

Is the press "bombarding" Labour? They look to be giving Starmer an extremely easy ride.

[@dub604]

@@michaelrch Try asking someone who reads The Telegraph, Mail or Express.

[@timwilliams113]

Ash Sarkar stole the show.....again

[@timwilliams113]

That was a supremely civilised discussion It was like all 3 of them wanted to hear the others' point of view Refreshing

[@timdownunder]

An exceptional and very informative 48 minutes of debate on the media landscape. Thank you to Ian Dunt, Ash Sarkar and Armando Iannucci.

[@shortdrink873]

The discussion about the laser focus on the NOW from political reporters is so important. And so frustrating - I’ve seen major political reporters write beautifully about how disastrous that focus is, and how everyone including themselves need to change….and then they just go right back to it again.

[@TheFunkadelicFan]

Ash is so effin brilliant, I wanna vote for her. What? She's not a politician? Dammit!

[@chrisbfreelance]

She isn't a good person.

[@davidgaskin5417]

Yeah, she really isn't a good person. Very biased.

[@Porkthepie]

@@davidgaskin5417 Who isnt

[@dotty1774]

​@@davidgaskin5417anyone who tells you they have no biases is lying.

[@keithpanton]

@@davidgaskin5417 I can't imagine being biased against evil and corruption really makes you a bad person.

[@someblokeoffthestreet5214]

A wonderfully grown-up conversation. Feeling vaguely optimistic now!

[@neilbertuk1]

That’s what gets you - it’s not the disappointment, it’s the hope.

[@Mo0n1111]

Novara media, objective, compassionate, reasonable, intelligent and innovative journalism. Go Ash ❤

[@shaneheff5244]

Pro Corbyn anti Starmer all the time. Nothing objective about them.

[@NoJusticeMTG]

​@@shaneheff5244 starmer is objectively awful so no problem there

[@shaneheff5244]

@@NoJusticeMTGNonsense. Media is either unbiased or it isn't.

[@michaelrch]

@@shaneheff5244it might seem that way to you, but if you think the media you consume is unbiased, you're just kidding yourself. Centrist media isn't unbiased. "The centre" is itself a construction that shifts and changes with discourse among elites and the media itself. Centrism doesn't represent a lack of bias. It merely falls in line with elite consensus.

[@Grandude77]

​@@shaneheff5244where have you encountered unbiased media?

[@ToCoSo]

Great debate, I think we judge people nowadays as not having critical thinking, but in the 70's people blindly believed their paper and disbelieved the other papers. We like to blame the readers whereas the editorial process needs to be so strong nowadays. I think I grew up trusting the news and now I have to really check every opinion or story as having no facts in it!!

[@abody499]

this isnt a debate. it's a discussion. the mainstream education system has never trained people to think critically. it's not a new phenomenon.

[@AtheistEve]

News has morphed into opinion. There’s so much speculation and reaction to help pad out a news show. Just the Reuters-style facts with no spin, framing, opinion etc would be refreshing.

[@ToCoSo]

@@AtheistEve yes, click bait and free 'news' has really effected the world.

[@dreamcrusher112]

@@abody499 How is it meant to teach critical thinking when history lessons are twice a fortnight for younger students and no longer a mandatory subject at GCSE? They simply aren't exposed to the expertise of critical thinkers.

[@abody499]

​ @dreamcrusher112 by not treating knowledge as something beheld by experts to be transferred into empty waiting receptacles at the whim of the expert, but rather something generated by capable beings in the action of reflecting on reality.

[@RH1812]

Being old, my biggest concern with bbc/itv/channel 4 news is an apparent reduction in scrutiny. I hope the impending extension of the 6 o’clock slot on the BBC, will mean more time is given to interrogating stories with more depth.

[@polarbear2335]

I feel the He-Man and Man at Arms joke was wasted but I got you Ian.

[@graemekeable8461]

My only experience of GB News or talk TV is clips on novara or Owen Jones Et Al. But I have only ever seen a group of people screaming at one another even though they agree with each other. Compare and contrast with these three having a sensible and civilised discussion. This gives me a chance to breath and be informed and learn from what I'm watching. No wonder the right are so completely misinformed.

[@kville5796]

Ash rocks!

[@GodsCosmicBollock]

No.

[@intothemultiverse1033]

@@GodsCosmicBollock”I am literally a communist” but I love all the trappings of a free market society. She would definitely be on the top table if she was in animal farm.

[@RLeaguer_Saint]

Ash is always a breath of fresh air. Imagine journalism with Ash in charge. Combine her with Mehdi, and we would have journalism that holds the executive to account properly. We’re a long way from that.

[@ruinerblodsinn6648]

The less I hear from Navara the better for my sanity. These people scream: „I have never had a proper job or serious responsibilities to juggle, but I read a book about this topic so you should listen to me.“ Ghastly product of bad parenting, self obsessed social media consumption and a society that is consuming itself by their fear of a quiet moment.

[@belindathorne9784]

@@ruinerblodsinn6648 Good job not engaging with any of her arguments and going straight to the insults. Was making yourself look threatened part of your plan?

[@Indiekid-1976]

@@ruinerblodsinn6648just wondering who you are listening to that manages to keep you sane?

[@ruinerblodsinn6648]

@@Indiekid-1976 friends and family. real-world people mostly

[@ruinerblodsinn6648]

@@belindathorne9784 can you read? I said my two cents and commented on Navara as an organization - which is valid. I don't have the time or energy to go through her monologues. There is also no point. If you enjoy that drivel, more power to you mate.

[@patrickevans8482]

Absolutely brilliant & eye opening discussion!

[@nothereandthereanywhere]

27:15 This is the main problem - no one is giving the full story. Biggest problem of the news in the whole UK

[@treeaboo]

Biggest problem in news globally, and history really. Anyone that records things will inherently decide what is and isn't important to report and what should be emphasised, whether through intentional bias or subconscious bias, it's really impossible to expect any one source to give a totally impartial and complete picture, however ideally they'd give more of one than they generally do currently.

[@scottbarrett4746]

Love Armando's bit at the end - clue that you're being fed rubbish is prominent use of the words 'fact' and 'truth'!

[@DaddyMorphosis]

Well informed, cogent, interesting and respectful conversation. This aftually feels so alien in 2024.

[@c.s.venkatesh9234]

Thank you! Really enlightened me. Think that these are insights for other parts of the world as well! First time on your channel and I don’t know how I got here- but feel rewarded!

[@dharmainthenorth]

Absolutely excellent episode. Very insightful - I've long been looking for an unbiased, factual news source. Maybe it just doesn't exist and maybe oure accepting that is helpful.

[@mynameisjoejeans]

Yeah I think Ash’s point about neutrality being impossible is bang on. How could an outlet be unbiased? Selecting what to report on, or giving airtime to particular actors is inevitable yet must be informed by the outlet’s stance. So often ‘unbiased’ is just coded language for arrogantly centrist.

[@hilaryporter7841]

I don't think that Novara is the specific ideological group you described. Novara relies on truth, not sure how ideological that is.

[@chrisbfreelance]

Novara is massively ideologically driven, what?

[@paulgibbons2320]

Censorship is ridiculous. Shutting down points of view rather than taking them on board. Allot of people run scared of people who disagree with them.

[@elkpaz560]

You should want to get rid of OFCOM then and be horrified by the recent legislation hiding as concern for children - the online social harms bill.

[@paulgibbons2320]

@@elkpaz560 that is absolutely true. OFCOM do literally nothing.

[@MrPsaunders]

The New Statesman talking about group think in U.K. churnalism. I remember a whole issue dedicated to being anti Corbyn and following the line of all mainstream journalists too scared of global politics and context, who now appear to not notice the Genocide in Gaza. 'Difficult, difficult, lemon difficult', indeed Armando.

[@badgertheskinnycow]

One negative issue on Racist Grandad and cfour years later you're still crying about it - bless.

[@MrPsaunders]

Thanks for patronising, maybe read some Chomsky if you're interested in media theory@@badgertheskinnycow

[@MrIvarlira]

Very enjoyable indeed. It is wonderful to listen to some calm and sound people

[@lukeclarke7167]

Enlightening discussion. Cheers guys

[@tkjp999]

Great and necessary discussion, thanks for putting this together

[@warrennelson5190]

A note to the cameraman: when deciding on exposure settings for a group of people with different pigment shades, don’t go for the automatic setting. The woman in the middle is hardly visible because the camera chooses to take its white reading from the cups on the table and less pigmented skin tones. I don’t mind if the cups are overexposed, I would take my exposure from her skin tone. I’m being a bit picky but as a photographer I know how difficult this situation is as ISO is a European standard and not universally applicable, especially in Africa where I live

[@adrianwhyatt1425]

No, ISO is the International Standards Organisation, which is global.

[@warrennelson5190]

@@adrianwhyatt1425 the rating is based on northern conditions, it’s been so ever since ASA standards for film. Exposure in the southern hemisphere is always challenging and needs manual adjustments or reflective bounce for better exposure because the light is a tad harder

[@B0bChorba]

Always have plenty of time for Iannucci.

[@kabl00muk94]

Its rotten from the top down, real journalism should be uncorruptable and those days are LOOOOONG gone 😅

[@dub604]

Nobody is incorruptible, that's why regulations need to be in place to protect the public.

[@oneeleven9832]

@@dub604government f..k everything up..their solutions create tomorrow’s problems..we need small government with no power..regulations are never the answer.

[@curmudgeon1933]

I imagine that in the past there was very little in the way of 'alternative news'. There MAY have been more accountability for publishing misleading or false stories...but they still happened. The opportunities for fact-checking and legislation like the Freedom of Information Act have helped, but corporate media monopoly has also increased, as well as the insatiable greed of those at the top. Rose-tinted glasses don't change the fact that shady political and economic crimes have always happened, and have often been covered up, and journalists bribed or silenced.

[@kabl00muk94]

@curmudgeon1933 spot on 👌🏻👍🏻. The ONLY way to solve it is to have complete transparency in parliament and in those investigating/reporting on it. Wage caps, full disclosure of earnings and finances, a ban on 2nd jobs/moving in to work for corperate entities post government employment... You'd soon sort those that actually want to make a difference from those just interested in a power grab and have accurate reporting on it for once.

[@milesnixon9554]

The critical thinking thing is key. I know lots of intelligent people who are unbelievably gullible, and fill their heads with rubbish, from sources they trust, whilst also pointing at how rubbish the untrusted sources are (and calling everyone else "sheeple" of course). The quality of the discourse in the UK is appalling. Example, I point out the term "Woke" seems arrogant, just the word, it seems counter-productive, I take no issue with what it describes, only the one four letter word describing it all that could easily be changed, the response "Why do you think racism is good"? This kind of thing happens often, people scan, latch on to what they are offended by, and respond to that. Very poor indeed.

[@benfisher1376]

Agreed, but there's a lack of critical, and independent thought on both sides of the political fence. People just get into their tribes and follow them, no matter what. As soon as something happens in the news there's a default setting many people just go to, even if they don't know much about the subject. It's true of the left and right.

[@abody499]

that's by design. the last thing the status quo needs is an electorate of critical thinkers

[@PeterZeeke]

I'm still getting my head around emmy/oscar/bafta nommed Iannucci podcasting. respect.

[@davidmccullough7977]

As someone who has voted for various parties and values fact being separated from dogma (re the question at 26 mins), there never can be a single place to get what I need from news feeds. One has to gather news from various (valued) sources, think about what is said, and reach a decision that can be explained when asked. I am less influenced by what is considered 'left' or 'right' and more by the substance of what is proposed and its potential to bring about that which is promised. Politicians seem unable to understand ' the floating voter' and find it incomprehensible that someone can be attracted to policies from various parties. Discussions such as this are worth far more than the daily blathering.

[@scottbarrett4746]

I think you would find me a bit of a lefty but what you say rings so true. I can't claim to be a big activist but have done some canvassing on behalf of the Labour Party. We seldom got much beyond the 'who are you voting for' thing but I always tried to get at least a bit of a conversation going despite the time pressures. The best conversations were always with floating voters who often came up with fascinating reasoning for their opinions. OK, some were crazy but most were interesting and showed that things can look very different from different view points. We need more of that.

[@TheWeightOutdoors]

I agree, David.

[@scorchgid]

10:40 I desprately tried to make Armando Iannucci to a family member the other day where most mainstream news just falls over in trying to make smart analysis. Which is why I end up in Politics Joe and The News Agents, because I feel at least there's an attempt to work through the new of the day and understand it.

[@MrTereos]

At 26:00 I would recommend looking into ground news. Their approach is interesting.

[@AndrewEdwardBailey]

One of the biggest problems is immaturity. Politicians are younger than ever before and it shows. Their silly attitudes are reflected in the way journalists respond to them.

[@hanumaniam]

More like this please. With these people!

[@suzannelooms7658]

You talk about the ME, Israel/Palestine and group think. No mention of Lord Gibb, who sits on the BBC Board as a NED. He is also the registered owner of the Jewish Chronicle. No investigation into BBC impartiality there, but Gary Lineker co-owner of a small production company and commenting on govt immigration policy was front page news.

[@TheseLocalGods]

"Horrible congealed mass of journalists and politicians" - chefs kiss.

[@spacechannelfiver]

I've been lucky and have spent time in my career working in all sorts of industries, and spent a few years in the broadsheet press, nothing close to the court reporting that goes on but close enough to the huge teams that are selling advertisements to finance getting the paper out each day.

[@IslandlifeIoW]

You’ve made me realise how much I’ve changed regarding the news. I used to listen to Radio 4 every day. Now I listen to Campbell and Stewart at the weekend instead. We crave quality but had few options in the past. Now, build it and they come.

[@michaelrch]

Is that really a change though? The Today Programme shares pretty much all the basic assumptions on economics, foreign policy and fiscal policy with Stewart and Campbell.

[@IslandlifeIoW]

@@michaelrch the loss of audience numbers are saying something different. For me, I like the depth and experience others bring. Maitliss and Sopel quote the same, and quote the freedom from editorial control. I can’t forgive the BBC for its deference to this corrupt and incompetent government. I’ll now seek my news elsewhere.

[@michaelrch]

@@IslandlifeIoW I am not saying they are not different at all, but the differences are minor in the grand scheme. They all pretty much adhere to the same beliefs about the important things about which "serious people" should agree. Even when someone like John Sopel leaves the BBC l, it doesn't mean he suddenly revises his understanding of central planks of political and economic theory. I mentioned Manufacturing Consent. Are you familiar with this book? It was extremely valuable to me in understanding what the media is up to, and why it is so broadly homogeneous on so many issues.

[@mynameisjoejeans]

Armando kinda misrepresents Ash in the sum-up at the end. She didn’t concede that being partisan means you can’t have factual authentication - she said precisely the opposite that Novara are regulated by a regulator with the strongest journalistic standards. Yes, people may lose a sense of objective confidence but that’s purely because of the brazen confidence outlets like GB News have in calling themselves factual. Pretending that those two things are the same and are inevitable issues of partisan outlets entirely misses her point and is downright disrespectful to left wing outlets with incredibly high standards. It also reinforces the use of ‘objective’ as coded language for an arrogantly centrist outlet.

[@OldeJanner]

It's personal political and racial biases being aired these days as opposed to facts and effects.

[@andyash5675]

O.K. So now we accept that the legacy media and government interface is dysfunctional and obsolete. How do we alter the system to expand the civil service and use it to the detriment of ordinary tax payers?

[@spartacusforlife1508]

Political journalism, modern that is, skirts around issues, afraid to offend by stating obvious facts.

[@TP1988]

If the lobby system soaked best for anyone except MPs - it wouldn’t happen

[@englishsteve1465]

At 41: 55 Ash points out the raging thirst of the public to have important news events explained with a breakdown of how various outlets and "news" channels (both right and left biased) are reporting on the event. Opening up the spin they are putting on it and in many cases the distortions, trickery, omissions, missing context and flat out lies that some (looking at you Fox "news") habitually use. People crave this media literacy.

[@michaelhb5258]

This could be the role of a renewed BBC

[@Smarterthanyew]

Working on that

[@tomlangford1999]

Really good discussion

[@colincampbell4261]

Great discussion, thanks.

[@dungeon_architect]

You can keep hearing Armando's mouth open half way through Ash's point, getting ready to talk over her

[@Smarterthanyew]

Ash is the actual most impressive journalist in the country. Novara needs to be watched by millions. Are there no very rich leftists to invest in growing the channel at all? If i won the euromillions I'd donate a couple of million for huge promotion, more broadcast and print staff and even more promotion. Big ad campaigns. Whatever they needed. They're too neessary to discourse to have a relatively small audience. Its,about getting discovered on a,wide scale since in a fair game, theyd have a massive viewership. Millions would chime with their output. It's intelligent, insightful, rigourous work presented in a genuinely witty and irreverent, insoucient manner. It helps the presenters are a bunch of hotties too.

[@keithpanton]

I'd definitely use that line that 'no news outlet can be as good as two news outlets'.

[@pepegalego]

It is a very interesting conversation, but by the end of it, I feel like they are people who like smelling their own farts. Ash Sarkar fights against her own feeling that she is not impartial, defending a particular political stance and yet wants to distance herself from the other media outlets that are biased in their own views. At the end of the day, the "public" or "consumers" want to be entertained by media that will align with their views - nobody will change the way they think about things, whatever they may be. In the internet age Homo Digitalis (my copyright) is unable or unwilling to do the research, so the lobby system is satisfactory for them, although for media outlets who are not invited might not be.

[@ravidre]

very good

[@cbolt4492]

Ash is the best 😎

[@djtomoy]

Problem is it’s all so boring to most people, they’d rather watch videos on their telephones about cage fighting or finger nail painting or some other ghastly thing.

[@timwilliams113]

Cats

[@multislipful]

Your discussion was fine, but, PLEASE - I don’t like being inaccurately pigeonholed. I must point out that I am a male of 75 years who neither watches any BBC News nor reads the Daily Mail. However, I do follow the likes of Novara and The New Statesman among others. Me? - nowhere near your legacy media. I really don’t think I am alone.

[@skymanifest8339]

>Baby Boomer: It's about me!!!! Quelle surprised.

[@GoldnDusty]

Are you basing your feeling on any statistically measurable factor, or do you feel like you're not alone because your strength of feeling hasn't been processed yet? It's not about you, anymore than it's about me, in my mid-twenties, buying newspapers on the regular. We may not slot easily into our demographics, but that makes us the exception, not the rule.

[@michaels8638]

lobbyists are definitely not my idea of a journalist, they’re reporters and 10% of the time reporting on something the government has not wanted to be reported. The journalist in the room is the government spokesperson. Sure the reporter can put their bias on the article they’re writing but when the topic and content in the topic is issued it’s an extremely limited space to put their bias into the report.

[@paulinegibson7010]

The public are also at fault for allowing themselves to be too distracted by entertainment and trivia and not interested enough in what the ruling class are doing to the country. Bread and circuses rule, ok ?

[@jonathanfarnworth9070]

Most of these legacy media journalist's are a part of the political elite, these individuals are also donors to political party's. Of course they have an agenda and this is a part of the problem. So who do these party's serve in the end? There is a lot of distrust right now, because all major parties have a conflict of interest, whilst on the face of it they are supposed to serve the state they are also there to serve the donor's who pay the most money. You can see in the conservative party right now that they have fallen out of favor with their major donor's such as the times and telegraph and so on. Once you lose the support of these journalists you lose the support of the people. Aka there is a rule in political journalism; what you may be telling the people may not be true, but if you tell people the same things over and over again eventually they will believe you... ; If the major political party has control of the media, they have control of the people. And this is why there is a-lot of distrust with the legacy media right now.

[@iforwilliams2509]

Its English journalism, not British or Ewe K.

[@kevoreilly6557]

How about the answer is “Nothing”. People have always sought out confirmation bias … hell we even have an expression for it “birds of a feather” The answer is also not to take the elitism stance of “people reading are too dumb”; that’s arrogant and puerile. The answer is Twitter, Tim Tok, KZbin and create content (journalism) that is engaging and clearly stipulate your truth. Is it hard. Yes! But that’s why you have multiple degrees to hone the message so it has emotional connection. Even frogs jump out of the water when it gets too hot.

[@nealmctaggart7229]

This is all good. However to really get a true picture of the media landscape is to ask informed viewers. Professional journalists tend towards an egotistical and ideological self delusion view of the job.

[@daraorourke5798]

I gave it a like. But your 👍 is the wrong way up !

[@davidgaskin5417]

Really cant take Ash too seriously ever since her sulk when arguing with Piers Morgan. At least she has got the honesty to admit that she is biased.

[@terry9819]

Feels like this summed up the problem perfectly by completely missing the problem and focusing on the media/political bubble. I did have a good laugh when Ash said Novara care about facts, that was a good joke. For me journalism should be about reporting the facts and letting people make up their own mind, not telling people how they should think.

[@jay-ew7gf]

Sorry to say, but I think it is you that has missed the point. They are exploring the ingrained assumptions and circumstances that influence and inhibit the manufacture and representation of facts. This kind of analysis makes your idea of journalism a bit redundant. Ironic really

[@AnthonyNickson-r3t]

what you are saying is there is no journalism (or very little) just reporting

[@AtheistEve]

I thought they were saying that there is no bald fact reporting just spinny opinionating.

[@BSideWasTaken]

Isn't it nice and engaging when 3 people with different political views but that can behave like adults sit down and have a deep discussion? Just a thought.

[@thomasscottwilliams6672]

Interesting but I wish Navarro rep would allow the discussion to have more time in the expanded views within the first 35 mins she keeps going to lobby focus whereas the others are trying to broaden the narrative

[@WilliamMcEvoy-g1u]

Everything that is wrong with journalists in one video - pompous, all about how smug they are. It’s so easy to question the answers, tougher to answer the questions. That is why they choose that profession.

[@polyglotuk]

Politico is hardly straight down the line in Brussels. It is shallow, English-centric and focuses far too much on the personalities.

[@DaboooogA]

This girl is literally the worst person to ask what has gone wrong with political journalism in the UK.

[@Dominatrix97]

‘girl’.

[@colinthompson3111]

This was an excellent program. I hope the New Statesman will continue to have Armando hosting these type of discussions. I have an objection to Ash Sarkar and her explanation of Novara Media. Ms. Sarkar and Novara will criticize the Conservative media for bias. Daily Mail, Sun, Daily Express. Novara will perpetually smear Keir Starmer. If Keir ordered an ice cream, Novara would explain how his choice of flavour was a betrayal of Labour. Please do a review on Novara's videos in 2023 for reference. Looking forward to new videos by this channel in 2024.😊

[@AtheistEve]

Starmer is ripe for criticism. You choose to consider it smearing. But Starmer lied about working with the left wing of the party, he lied about standing by the manifesto. He stands with the tories on so many policies. He wouldn’t even call for a ceasefire as Netanyahu war crimed and genocided his way into Gaza. Novara is left wing but Starmer isn’t; he’s a tory.

[@colinthompson3111]

@AtheistEve Criticize all you want. My point is if Keir Starmer made a charitable donation, Novara Media would simply criticize for some arbitrary basis. No Different than the Daily Mail and associates.

[@AtheistEve]

@@colinthompson3111 I only see them criticize when he does obviously tory things.

[@AtheistEve]

Can you give me a concrete example? Rather than a hypothetical?

[@colinthompson3111]

@@AtheistEve Go work for the Daily Mail. You can make more money for being biased there.

[@kaandervis6276]

Why you cancelled Avenue 5? It was a great show.

[@keithpanton]

Likely just too expensive and niche, I enjoyed it too. Sci Fi and comedy always struggles to get big audiences, Red Dwarf and The Orville did quite well, but it's tough to get a following before those in charge decide it's not a big enough hit.

[@kaandervis6276]

@@keithpanton Man... it was an excellent show... I stumbled upon it and liked every minute. It could be a great hit with a little marketing. It is unbelivable to see this show is cancelled while a tons of expensive but totally unwatchable shows are still on air.

[@willhovell9019]

Kuenssberg

[@elkpaz560]

Simple. Follow the money and see how the journos toe the line. Trusted Media Initiative is also a tell.

[@RobertJones-st3wj]

Ash Sarkar for a start is whats wrong with journalism today

[@grantwallace1882]

Viewers are just as bad. We just look for what we want to hear.

[@wstevenson4913]

Ash Sakar living off the host

[@steigerbower]

Money money money

[@AlexKitson-e9m]

This reeks of legacy media

[@theoriginalrecycler]

Easy answer… no journalists

[@BandOfHarjaps]

Woof woof(!)

[@Jablicek]

I was of the opinion that Novara was as indicative of what's wrong with political journalism in this country as GBNews - extreme and opinion-based, and feeling more like the US-style pieces that masquerade as news. Left or right, you should hold yourselves to a better standard.

[@SigmundJaehn]

Absolutely. They are both symptoms of the same malaise and feed into people becoming more wrapped up in their own bubbles.

[@benfisher1376]

​@@SigmundJaehnAnd both feed the culture wars, presumably to keep their journalists in lucrative jobs😂

[@AtheistEve]

I think it’s fair enough for media channels to have an obvious political agenda - as long as they are fact based. After all, news outlets all have their agendas and biases they just pretend that they don’t. I’d like to see far more linked source material on all news and opinion sites. So often an article will go on about, say, a UN or IPCC report without linking the report or any other source cited. And, by now, channels such as BBC and ITV should be able to fact check a minister live during any interview. I’d love to see such an interview where the “facts” are checked on a big screen behind them as they speak.

[@NotfromDateline]

it was far worse and of course way more centralised without digital media. at least now i can be choiceful around my propaganda intake