What The 4 Shades Are Hiding & Zhongli's Secret Origin, Backstory Explained! Genshin 5.0 Theory

[@TheGamerChronicles999]

Are the shades trying to sabotage celestia through the 7 thrones since the very start of the archon war and is Zhongli just another example of that?

[@Vencaline]

Well, I doubt the Sustainer is the Primordial one, she's most likely a shade. So, probably not?

[@TheGamerChronicles999]

@Vencaline Wait who said the sustainer was the PO?

[@radiantradish4943]

@@TheGamerChronicles999 You kinda did. You referenced when Nahida referred to the unknown god as the heavenly principles. The heavenly principles is more likely than not the Primordial One + 4 shades since the 5 of them each represent a different _principle_ of reality. Plus, the sustainer's powers mimic the herrscher of the void very closely. More likely than not, the sustainer is the shade of space.

[@TheGamerChronicles999]

@radiantradish4943 If you assume the PO and the HP are the same then sure but I never did in the video nor do I think that now guess it depends on how someone interprets who the PO is

[@radiantradish4943]

@@TheGamerChronicles999 Before sun and moon confirms that the primordial one is the heavenly principles. If you consider the wiki to be canon, then they are the same by lore.

[@ShootingStarStudio]

I love how Zhongli never shuts up in-game but we still know so little about his past 😂 just a thought

[@TheGamerChronicles999]

right? lol

[@TeddyNONSTOP626]

do you remember the taste of osmanthus wine?

[@bangtanssera]

The fact he was the first one who gave us a hint about our main role - a witness - just out of nowhere, oh he for sure knows everything but doesn’t say anything of that ugh

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

To add salt to injury it cannot be a coincidence, since : 1) Zhongli pretty much foreshadowed most things that happened with the traveler thought their journey, his two ominous story quest gathered key elements to almost everything that happened in every nation (erosion opposing eternity and the dangers that come form killing gods in Inazuma/Fontaine, that memory is fallible and the traveler is immune to the laws that govern this world in Sumeru as few examples ...) he knew we were immune to Irminsul tempering, because we are a descender, before even Nahida did (the neat part is she still doesn't). 2) His contract to keep his silence wouldn't make any sense if he was to be subject to Irminsul tempering 3) He straight out told the traveler that he's going to wait and see whether their heart is made of Gold.... you know, pretty much like him 😅 adding to the long list of similarities between them (being a star or a meteor as one of them)

[@sauce8148]

I'm pretty sure that the "heart made out of gold thing" was just Zhongli being poetic

[@AndrewsMobs]

Nahida knows we are a descender tho

[@PWF-xh4ph]

So Zhongli is a descender himself?

[@AndrewsMobs]

@@PWF-xh4ph No

[@_ayohee]

Nahida is well aware of the travelers immunity to irminsul modifications after the wanderer interlude “Inversion of Genesis”

[@mariapazgonzalezlesme]

Ashikai made a similar a theory about this. In the CN text, the term "descended" is intentionally vague and thus implying that he is royalty or a Prince. Descende could mean tree things; 1) He descended from the sky. 2) He was demoted. 3) That he was tasked with a duty.

[@TheGamerChronicles999]

All could be true honestly I think the last one is true regardless seems he was definitely sent as the shade of space itself demoted or from the shade of space but where he descended from is the question

[@ashy969]

Wherever, he did so after the Irminsul tree was made, because if he can remember the greater lord, he is not connected to it, like us. Also, we have us, the chopped up descender, *GAP* and the heavenly bitch.... Someone is the second D.... And he was not born in Teyvat for sure... How much outside of it is another question... Also... Will we ever get to know if Azhdaha is the geo sovereign? Or what happened with it ....

[@crystaluwu1012]

​@@TheGamerChronicles999 probably Asmoday's right hand man thats my theory if its the case then everyone should get ready to be betrayed.

[@nothmm8582]

I think Zhongli has a strong case to be connected to the Shade of Space(probably the Sustainer). Zhongli has always been depicted as The Sun and the Sun is the primary thing we see in Space also In the Scion of Blazing Sun it was said that Deshret fought against The Sun and fell to the earth. Space may also mean dimensional control and Zhongli is a master in that as well. The Adepti whose Domains are already capable of sealing gods inside them for millenniums and been stated to be crude imitation of what Zhongli's domains are by Ping. The last connection I see is that it was stated somewhere in Liyue that Rex Lapis's constructs are indestructible and the only thing that could affect them was The Abyss which would turn those constructs Black. If Zhongli is connected to the Shade of Space aka the Sustainer then I think the reason why she did what she did was because she was under the control of the Abyss as her powers too turned black

[@HeWhoSwallowedGod]

But doesn't anything affected by the abyss usually become blue instead of red? But really good theory though

[@exdespair6085]

Orobashi dared to challenge Raiden Shogun even though he was ultimately defeated. But the orobashi trembled in fear at the mere sound of Morax's name and fled into the dark sea. this alone shows that Morax really is on a different level.

[@Achronelius]

Space is in direct unity with earth and with it stone. They are both a space where you traverse in and are stable areas where everything resides in. That Zhongli is connected with the Shade of Space therefore makes really sense like Venti is connected to the invisible but yet changing and manipulating winds like time. I believe that they are both at least the apostles of the two corespondent Shades and i really hope that the theory gets canon. Nice video by the way. To this point out of all the others, i really think that your takes on the lore are the closest to the hidden truth. Keep up the good work 🔥 ^^

[@TheGamerChronicles999]

I never made that connection before between space and stone like how time and wind are always changing that actually makes so much sense thanks for sharing! I also picture time and wind going together but that stone and space is spot on

[@mmajerz8913]

You and my name for now should do a collab on a megatheory, cus you 2 are the only theorists thst actually make sense

[@claudiageana2451]

God bless this comment

[@leighslore]

THIS

[@anonded]

I couldn't have said it better myself.

[@aoki395]

Hope they do so in the future, there’s so much mystery surrounding Zhongli

[@ZyaVeriGD]

check out SiliconOneFour - he's pretty good as well!

[@TinkRomero]

I’ve noticed this very interesting detail about Zhongli a long time ago, and I can only hope that it helps you out in some way. The Ley Line Blossoms give us Mora, and EXP Books, they glow Gold, and Blue. But we’ve also seen them glow Red, during Diluc’s 5* Outfit Event, and they were showing memories of Dragonspine. The Ley Lines in Dragonspine were exposed when Durin was killed, and his blood revitalized the Mountain with Warmth. So … this proves that the Ley Lines are to a specific extent, reliant on blood, and they reflect this blood with their color. Now, we have Ley Line Outcrops: Blossom of Wealth, which gives out Mora, and glows Gold. The Topaz Gemstone says “The currencies that flow through this land are my flesh and blood.” So Mora is Morax’s blood. The Ley Lines are reliant on Blood, and reflect it through their color. Mora is the golden blood of Morax. And then we have Ley Line Outcrop: Blossom of Revelations, which gives us EXP Books … three different versions. The Ley Lines are reliant on blood, and they reflect it … so this EXP is the blue blood of some deity. I believe, it’s the blue blood of Three Deities, because each Paper has a different signature, and a different Logo attached to them. I’ve seen this detail before Sumeru was released, and I still don’t have any real idea of who these Three Gods are, the only ones that come to mind are the Three Moon Sisters, but maybe you have other ideas?

[@kotarouinugami1745]

Maybe the blue of the exp lines, is the same blue as blue of Celestial Nails? And blue of many petrified trees too. The color of information.

[@Fuphu]

Yellow is likely the blood of Morax or any other god king, Blue is the information stored in irminsul (a tree of souls and memories both of which are depicted as blue. I dont wanna keep going as I can talk about the proof of this forever but the hall of Duat should be enough proof for now), and the red leylines or purple areas are likely simply abyssal corruption altering how they elemental flow takes form as we know that Abyssal power has the ability to modulate elemental energy into its own special new thing.

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

@@Fuphu Nope, it was clearly mentionned in the lore of the Dialog of the Desert Sages that even in Deshret's time, it was clear that gold was the sole dominion of Rex Lapis, going by Deus Auri at the time. I don't know what you bring up The Hall of Duat and Deshret's treasures, because if you payed attention you'd actually know it's actually the ANTITHESIS to what you just said, because we knew from Liloupar and Taldha that Deshret's gold was ''fool's gold'' mainly just bronze and brass, the same way Remus's golden Ichor was made form an ''immortal' stone he didn't produce and his golden city was also a city made of marble and brass. The ''God king'' is merely a theory popularized by Ashikai, and tough it's fun and has great elements, it's doesn't really hold truth. One thing is for sure, Gold is very valuable to have been a symbol coveted by those powerful dieties, it just adds up a layer of mystery to Zhongli in retrospect. The only golden blooded god in Genshin so far is Zhongli, there should have existed more individuals like him according to ''The Little Witch and the Undying Fire'', but for now, there is no other golden God King....

[@Fuphu]

@@citoyenneteavanttout7273 I'm guessing you just forgot alot of stuff or hear theories secondhand so you missed out on alot of stuff. 1) The title God King is official and is repeated multiple times in the remuria quest and in books. 2) I don't remember exactly but the locations with god kings are said to have gold coins with different inscriptions on it that look different than mora. This is most apparent in an exploration thing or mini quest in the desert I believe where you find a bunch of gold and its mentioned in passing that it looks different than normal mora. (Can't find the source so you're free to just discredit this as you please). 3) The blue energy is seen in the leylines, in the nails, in tsurumi island, in the chasm and so on. All instances of blue energy is related to either celestia or the leylines or souls and memories. The reason I brought up the hall of Duat is because its a place where a large number of sumerian souls are gathered and give the area a blue glow, its also likely the power source of alot of the tech in king deshret's kingdom and its even mentioned by Rene de petrichore that the machines seem to have some sentience likely originating from these souls. I really dont wanna get into blue energy but its pretty much 100% agreed upon by most theorizers that its "information" such as memories or information in the form of souls.

[@The_original_one]

​@@kotarouinugami1745blue layline is memory ( none physical elementel enargy) And yellow layline is well elementel enargy ( physical elementel enargy)

[@waddahrasengan3414]

Many Gods just fleed from Tyvat during Archon war cuz they just know he's totally in different league.

[@BruceWayne-sw5xe]

A few other points I want to add: 1) Zhongli is closely associated with gold, and gold color is very important in genshin and indicates either descenders or some other great power. Think of the Traveler and Albedo, or how the 5 stars are all gold. 2) Teapot is literally a tiny thing that hides an enormous space within it, which is clearly manipulation with space, and it is an adepti technology 3) He said our role is to record the history of this world. Might indicate that he knows Traveler's memory can't be tempered with 4) His ulti is a meteor falling from the sky (which is fake so where is it falling from?..) It's kind of reminiscent of a falling star, no? Both come from space

[@cool_things_collection]

wow

[@gamesanime7838]

Zhongli is *NOT* a descender

[@gamesanime7838]

I can also say stuff like Ei spilt reality with her slash so she is a descendant Etc etc

[@BruceWayne-sw5xe]

@@gamesanime7838 Why are you so heated? It's only a theory, a fun possibility to consider, a thought to ping pong with others. It might not turn out to be true, but who are you to stop us from brainstorming it?

[@gamesanime7838]

@@BruceWayne-sw5xe you know EXACTLY why I am heated

[@kylechupik6446]

My guess is that he's associated with Qliphloth the Preservation and the IPC. Shields, obsession with collecting information, amber. . . Maybe Rhinedotter, too. Because descenders & Gold.

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

hmmm intresting, I will be checking that you really picked my interest because somewhat makes sense.

[@Chloe-v3e9v]

There's also that the demon Morax from the Ars Goetia is linked to alchemy and divinitation.

[@silverX3870]

Not all who comes from beyond teyvat is one who descends that only applies to someone whose will can rival the entire world 1. Protect the world 2. Sustain the world 3. Destroy the world

[@twit3537]

isn't alice a 'descender' as well, or more specifically also an outlander not affected by imisul? I think a better term is 'outlander' as not all outlanders are descenders but all descenders are outlanders (iirc)

[@silverX3870]

​@@twit3537 Outlander:Yes Descender: we still don't know

[@Vencaline]

4. Create the world

[@silverX3870]

​@@Vencaline true

[@The_original_one]

​@@twit3537outlander are effected by irmansole remember what Nahida said about furina Fontaines fate is written in irmansole a long time ago and even about the whale.the whale was an outlander his is recorded but traveler isn't recorded in irmansole

[@miragames9475]

22:11 oh My God , that whistling always drives me mad when I'm exploring Lyiue , it's so haunting 😮😮😮😮😮

[@VJusto]

Amazing lore video. I love Zhongli due to his insane power mysterious background!

[@Frazzled_Chameleon]

The void/space is known for chaos. It could be why Zhongli's one line is "I WILL have order."

[@Dazaiburger]

If we see it from hsr perspective i would've thought order means he's also a follower ena, the order...but i think his cn burst voiceline is different

[@opalakv4ob]

Ayo, no one thinks Zhongli is the shade of Life. Everyone thinks he is the shade of Space because of the cube, representing tridimensionality.

[@HeWhoSwallowedGod]

But the sustainer also uses cubes

[@samsaraslight8377]

​@@HeWhoSwallowedGodyeah, but the sustainer isn't one of the shades. The shades are absolutely acting against the HP.

[@HeWhoSwallowedGod]

@@samsaraslight8377 How do you know she isn't a shade? And how would we know Zhongli is a shade?

[@samsaraslight8377]

@@HeWhoSwallowedGod because so far the shades actions are against the HP. They assisted Makoto in planting the tree in defiance of the HP. They assisted Ageria in transforming the Oceanids in defiance of the HP. They assisted Xbalanque in defiance of the HP. They've helped the archons in ways the HP would not approve of, so it doesn't track that they are aligned. Idk if Zhongli is a shade, so far there's nothing on the forth shade ( shade of space/void ). So he might be it, idk.

[@mith1783]

If we look at the murals in domains, the ones that have a reversed copy below, in the centre, or rather at the beginning of them we see a circle with an ingwaz rune-like symbol inside, which has a meaning of the seed of life. But its shape is really similar to geo symbol, which has the only square vision out of all 🤔🤔🤔 And about Paimon - the old official art with her, had her wielding a scepter. Pretty straightforward 😅 Thank you for another great video.

[@dashhound8974]

The 4 shades probably - "you may have one the battle" (second who came) but you lossing the war your archons actually are ours muahahahah I agree is it possible zhongli is the shade of space since he can summon a meteor from nowhere in the sky and could have ruked like istaroth in mondstat at one time?

[@vxnessaa27]

I heard that the inspiration for artifacts came from “Tarot cards“ and “William Blake‘s Poetry“. There’s a Magician who commands the four (classical) elements. Magician = Phanes (obviously) Chalice of Water = Shade of Space/Void & Hydro Wand of Fire = Shade of Death & Pyro Sword of Wind = Shade of Time & Anemo Coin of Earth = Shade of Life & Geo The last one IMMEDIATELY reminded me of Zhongli since he’s canonically the only one who can create Gold (Mora) and has authority over the geo element. The shade of life = Zhongli theory has probably been out for atleast over a year now and I still can’t let go🙏

[@evilsatorii]

I feel like there is some very important parts of Venti’s story missing in game right now 🤔

[@cherish_xo]

I didn't realize Zhongli was such a mysterious being until recently when I asked myself what do i know about him and my answer was nothing 😂

[@psychod7333]

Sudden thought, and maybe it’s been stated before. But the primordial one broke itself into 4 shades after the second who came won that war. The second who came is the m current ruler of celestia.

[@Anna_96]

This is incorrect. Phanes created the four shades after defeating the Seven Dragon Sovereigns. To my knowledge, there’s also no confirmation that the Second Who Came is the (sole) ruler of Celestia, as Phanes’ rules for Teyvat are still intact and they created the gnoses together from the remains of the Third Descender. This indicates that they were working together rather than against each other. The creation of the gnoses furthermore took place after the destruction of heaven and earth, which happened during the War of Vengeance against Nibelung (Before Sun and Moon states that war was “rekindled, as it was in the world’s creation” [which was against the dragon lords and could thus refer to the battle against Nibelung]), so they possibly even fought together against him.

[@HelloAbby-m3t]

hey! great video lots of good points and i hope this is true! also in enkanomia the people there refer to istaroth as good of time and wind so venti and zhongli defintiely sus

[@aoki395]

I wonder if GI will have a part 2 that tie with the HSR universe. Zhongli have so many similarities with the preservation and there’s a theory that the comet/rock structure during his idle is actually his true body or something. What if he’s a fragment that falls off of Qliphloth a long time ago during the Aeon war. I really want to see some theory’s that connect GI with HSR

[@xskullplayer5566]

If they do have part 2 I hope they don’t delete part 1 considering what happens with honkai impact’s previous games

[@waddahrasengan3414]

Also Paimon sleeves design resembles the statues of the seven and the Celestial Nails. And she has 6 of them! Coincidence?!

[@angrygamer6584]

The vibe I’m getting with that second mural in the quest with our Telaptasaur is that Durin is gonna be revived because he’s the only one that can burn the Irmunsul tree. Since the mural has a black Dragon that is shooting Phlogistan at a gold tree

[@Richinnameonly]

If paimon is the primordial one and traveler is the dragon king, both diminished and memories tampered with. That would mean the whole point of the journey was for these two to become friends. So they have been literally telling us the answer all along. "the real treasure is the friends we make along the way."

[@AndrewsMobs]

Paimon can't be PO because PO is described as androgynous and Paimon isn't even a descender, traveller being the dragon king makes no sense, the dragon king is likely the third descender .

[@NateLindzey]

So we the travelers are like the new zhonggli and we aren’t actually racing to the end we are racing to a new beginning

[@Blue-wk4wx]

lets go had a feel it would be today!

[@inesdng9116]

saw a theory saying that paimon was actually kiana from fly me 2 the moon and genshin is the 61th final level of the game or wtv. that would explain why paimon is the mascot of the game since kiana is hoyoverse’s baby

[@souravkhamari3835]

Zhongli is stiil to this day my best character

[@cringecompilation8105]

Morax apeared long before archon war, bro

[@sgt_malice4521]

Not to mention to, there’s a book you can get in Fontaine that is called perinheri that could be fatui known as the captain, in the book that was talking about a unknown woman came defeated nation that was destroyed by Deus Auri, my question is what crimes that he committed that the hydro dragon knows as neuvillette will bring judgment

[@Vivihorsesegames]

After reading this book I found something even crazier, the fatui capitain apparently wasn’t perinheri but the man in the fight list, and guess what was his surname? ALBERICH, what is actually very very sus, perinheri seems like a reference to arlecchino, even more for being related to Angelica which is seemingly a reference to columbina that goes well with arle as we can see in her voice lines she says columbina is the most sane in the fatui. I could be wrong but they called Alberich the capitain of the knights of Khaenri’ah and this is the title of capitano what makes us wonder what he had been gone thorough

[@sgt_malice4521]

@@Vivihorsesegames wait a minute, didn’t dain mention “alberich” when he was saying that he will have his vengeance?

[@Vivihorsesegames]

@@sgt_malice4521 wow this is going so far, because Alberich is kaeya’s family, and he mentioned his grandpa or smth created the abyss, it was also an Alberich and capitano is also Alberich and now it makes so much sense because capitano use powers of abyss, he probably got them because he’s from the family that founded the abyss. Dain was seeking vengeance of the creator of the abyss and maybe even from capitano, and the leaks say we will have Dain quest in 5.2 what means Dain is coming for capitano?

[@nagorepalaciosdelafuente]

Great video as always

[@catcatcat8]

Some months ago I came to the personal theory that - Teyvat is in Samsara cycles for as long as there are moons left ( or until the world is deemed perfect ) No new souls aside descendars enter, all reincarnate but then become recorded and part of Teyvat - Teyvat is a prison and the Seven are the guards - The abyss is the natural state of the world ( upside down world. Fake stars ) And Zhongli (either and / or) - voluntary left Celestia - is from an earlier samsara cycle with full memories from this - is a descender God - is a shade, himself

[@AndrewsMobs]

We can rule out him being a descender as he is affected by Irminsul and doesn't have a will to rival the world.

[@Redzee0921]

Your theories always just make the most sense!! Great video!

[@TheGamerChronicles999]

@@Redzee0921 Thanks!

[@TheGamerChronicles999]

@@Redzee0921 😊🙃👍

[@NoNameCherry]

Can we just remember that Keith voiced a Zhongli line "Celestia...I have not been back in a long while..." that was supposed to be the line instead of his now infamous "Osmanthus wine..." one? Wouldn't it be wild if the Shades once dwelt in Celestia a long time ago before they got ousted by the heavenly principles, and had a child with them which was Zhongli, either the youngest Shade or an actual son of one? That would explain the fondness in this deleted voice line, and his deeper, hidden motivations. What if the heavenly principles stole his home and his family from him? And he "descended" to not only make sure the archons pre-determined by the Shades took their place, but to ensure they would later on rebel or assist in the rebellion? Teyvat's version of Christ (no blasphemy meant Lord), since now "angels" are known to exist in-game so biblical references are definitely free territory to explore.

[@oo7sk8punk]

The only thing... My understanding is good old zong is simply a primordial dragon and not a descender 🤔 ... And is aloy even being considered in the count

[@WarBoundChoir]

Zhongli is that 🦴 the heavenly principles are having while asleep

[@evillness2360]

Zhongli situation is like kalpASS situation. We don't really know where they come from.

[@Alex-p1h5d]

If the shades were created by the Primordial One and rebelled giving power to archons would that mean that contrary to Gnosticism theory of the Primordial One being the demiurge they would be an aeon (sophia) and the shades are the demiurge? I am not an expert in Gnosticism but that is what I can get from what I know.

[@temporarilyalaine]

LMFAO "woah dude the traveller's got the PRIMORDIAL one.. act normall.."

[@yakzyakiez6375]

Zhongli is the first mc of genshin

[@HeWhoSwallowedGod]

The way she throws childe always gets me 13:51

[@timonzachariah4042]

but if paimon is the praimordial one she is a desender but she was efektet ba Ermensul

[@PolCmara]

Zhongli being second who came makes sense, ie the guy who was fighting Phanes when AbyssNibelung decided to spice things up bringing chaos and heresy into the mix. Also could fit with the narrative where the usurper and second who came made third descender juice into the gnoses to the first contract.

[@AndrewsMobs]

SWC is a descender, Zhongli clearly isn't.

[@LuizFelipe508-ty2id]

@@AndrewsMobs Morax could be a descender, nothing proves otherwise.

[@AndrewsMobs]

@@LuizFelipe508-ty2id The fact that there are only 4 listed descenders.

[@w1nterph0en1x]

If Zhongli is from another world, how likely is it that he's from Star Rail and is a lost High Elder of the Luofu?

[@JustAlex2000]

If anything he'd be an Emenator of Qlipoth imo

[@MB-tj7xh]

There are some differences between the adepti (a group based on reaching buddhist enlightenment and divinity) and yokai. Even if they have long lifespans they're on opposite sides of a spectrum. The cn equivalent would be yaoguai. I wouldn't just lump them in together

[@TheGamerChronicles999]

@MB-tj7xh forsure there are differences I just meant similar as there are different types of yokai just like adepti

[@chesterkuro15bernoulli75]

The harbingers evolve into the aeons we know today, lol 🎉🎉🎉❤❤❤😅😅😅

[@theorize999]

i must have missed a lot when i was taking a break, i’m seeing a lot of footage for stuff i’ve never played, is that zhongli footage in those video from an event or a quest?

[@akumatsubasa6727]

My personal theory is that Paimon is a creation of the shadow of Time whose purpose is to guide and protect the traveler. For Zhongli I have the impression that many people miss it but Xiao tells us that Zhongli knows legends of another world and it is all the more strange, it seems to confirm that Zhongli was not born in Teyvat +6000 years ago but that he has lived there for more than 6000 years

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

True, it was abit too obvious during the 2023 Lnatern rite when she ''unconciously'' completed Venti's rhyme with ''Cultivated by time'' pointing at herself especially since in the newest event she straight out said she was bad at rhyming verses 😂 Also he totally gave Xiao a ''new name'' lmao if we don't get more Xiao's lore crumbs in Natlan I don't know when we will.

[@vladalekseyev5415]

I want to ask a question: What are the secret identities of Aether and Lumine, and who are they truly? In the gameplay, we know that the main traveller is the 4th descender of Teyvat while the the Traveler's twin remains unknown. It would be interesting if you could uncover more hidden details of Genshin Impact about the twins, I would highly appreciate the new information that was discovered by you.

[@afrobanditx2972]

Im hoping we get new 5 stars of the Archon's at their original forms Morax for example and he has the sword instead of the staff. Give us Raiden's sister, Rukadevada, Time Shade Venti, etc

[@Rihorama]

Wait, showing 6k years ago is not showing directly before the Archon war (that was 3k back, roughly?). Also Paimon is subjected to Irminsul - she forgets. That doesn't point towards the Primordial One.

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

It's true, rather it coincides with the war of vengeance/the fall of the seelie race.

[@Rihorama]

@@citoyenneteavanttout7273 But do we know the exact time of that war (in millenia)?. Last time I checked we were all working with very rough estimates. By the time Zhongli descended, Guizhong and her people were already in place and prospering and as far as I know, the only big war that came after that was the Archon war. 🤔

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

@@Rihorama what I meant is you're correct. He should have descended about the time of the fall of the Seelie race and the Hall of stars, which all points out to have accused after or during the war with Nibelung that almost torn the world ablaze, which is a long time since before the Archon war started. And prospering isn't a world we would use to describe Guizhong's people before Zhongli descended, since we know that they merely were thought farming AFTER the Guili assembly was formed under his protection and at that time Shanhui Fort Dynasty (Zhongli's own Civilization) was commercially thriving already.

[@TeddyNONSTOP626]

If erosion is only a part of teyvat, what does that say about zhongli's real reason for stepping down as archon

[@stevom.silverstone9137]

Definitely on to something here

[@XallbX]

do you mean decender as "one of the four decenders", "demoted from celestia" or "an outlander from space"? He cant be one of the four Decenders because we already know who they are: the primordial one, someone evil, someone dead and the traveller. none of them can be zhongli

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

technically you're right, but the second one, how do you know they're evil ? with all what's happening in Natlan it kind of seems like PO in some stories is evil as well.

[@gabrielgrigore3355]

We got shade ruler of death in 5.1

[@PrWoe]

my funny theory is : zhongli is Qlipoth, the Aeon of The Preservation. he s been silent because retired

[@JustAlex2000]

This can't really be right since Qlipoth glanced down at Stelle in the fight with Cocolia. But it's sort of possible Zhongli is an emenator of preservation

[@AruLily]

I like how you think back on him giving the land to the people, by faking his death. What if the sustainer got corrupted by the red space behind the fake sky Paimon being a food lover is sus, is she really eating food or some kind of energy that the food produces. Also why is Paimon so childish, she's almost like ajaw to be honest, why, if she was the primordial one, why would she become so silly? Something doesn't addd up.

[@SuperMCGamer-wg4pc]

I think that Zhongli is indeed connected to the shade of space because of everything that happened in teh Chasm. But I don't think he is a descender. He may be an otherworlder but it's different. Fatui that know most of the secrets of the world, know that there are 4 descenders and Morax can't be anyone of them. The First And Second came before him and the third is already dead. The fourth is the traveler. Besides all descenders are extremely elemental compatible, but Zhongli can only control Geo. There can also be a 5th Descender but then Zhongli would be the 4th and the traveler would have been the 5th because of the order they arrived in teyvat. The reason why he remembers the former Dendro Archon is because of his otherworlder status. I believe Irminsul can't affect, those not belonging to teyvat, both Descenders and Otherworlders. As for why Abyss sibling is recorded by it, They now belong to teyvat because of something we don't know yet. I also think the Primordial One won the war against the Second Descender. Because if the 2th is the Dragon King then the dragons like apep would have taken over teyvat. But this is just my guess.

[@AndrewsMobs]

He is likely a Celestial god

[@AndrewsMobs]

Also second isn't the dragon king, dragon king is likely the 3rd.

[@SuperMCGamer-wg4pc]

@AndrewsMobs Are you sure? Because It would make sense that the second led the war of vengeance if he was the Dragon King. Besides, Apep stated that he came back with the power of Darkness to face the Primordial One once again.

[@AndrewsMobs]

@@SuperMCGamer-wg4pc SWC is a known descender and we know Abyssal creatures while outlanders are not really descenders if they don't possess a will to rival the world. The second is likely the Abyss itself and we know it has a will of its own and that it wants to destroy the world, which would take a will that rivals the world, since the Abyss is also an outlander this would make it by definition a descender and we know only the Abyss so far has the strength to rival PO. Regarding Nibelung, all 7 sovereign correspond with the 7 elements, it makes logical sense that the king of the sovereigns himself may have the ability to control all 7 elements, we know there are 7 elemental gnosis made from the remains of the 3rd descender. Next, we know the Primordial One and "the one who came after" worked together to stabilise the world, no way in hell would Nibelung work together with the PO given how much he hates it. It is safe to assume that if Nibelung is a descender then he is the third descender whom the first two worked together to defeat maybe during the "war of vengeance" and used his remains to create the 7 gnosis. We can exclude Nibelung being the 4th and 2nd descender for these obvious reasons, if he is a descender then he is likely the 3rd one.

[@WayneZvidza-qh2dp]

I think he may be be an outlander but not a descender I don't think his will rivals the world he could be an outlander because there have been many outlanders like Perinheri an outlander who was trained and raised to be a descended but his will was not strong enough to rival the world and disappeared

[@soju-woo]

What if? This divine Throne is = the Divine Power that came from the shades? like how Venti and Makoto affiliated with Time, Egeria with Life, and Natlan with Death? maybe Zhongli is affiliated with Phanes himself and that's where the contract begins? there is this thing in my head like remember they said that this "second who came" was actually the one who started the Archon War? and then there is this theory that the second who came defeated the first descender and overthrew them in Celestia... what if they fleed and went to the seven archons for help? because Egeria is an Archon who used the Divine power but still she was imprisoned by the Celestia? Neuvilette said that the Gnosis is made from the remains of the third descender? and MC is the fourth descender .. isn't that also stating that it was the second who came is the ones that killed/took the third descender and used its power to create the Gnoses? lastly, my theory is what if?? Lumine and Aether have the same ability where they can control elements? but what if Lumine became the third descender because the heavenly principles took her power and dragged her to Khaenriah?

[@thepodmod96]

I'm not saying he is the shade of death because I'm inclined to agree with the wyob theory. But zhongli, the decimator, as the shade of life? You mean, the guy that literally works at a funeral parlour...

[@leongwaikit6658]

Zhongli might as well be The Sage Heaven’s Might. A contrast to the Monkey King the Great sage equal to Heaven.🤔🤔🤔

[@thegamezone6457]

Soooooooo no one is gonna talk about the fact that Zhongli used a sword instead of a spear in the cutscenes?

[@ANexus21]

If paimon is one of the moon sister she'd be the only one remaining according to the lore

[@soni1891]

i have a wild assumption. spoilers ahead. these are all assumptions from the current 5.1 archon quest (which is still mindblowing to say the least). you said that it is clear that paimon may be the primordial one -- however, i stand to question that. sure, she can have a lot of direct references to celestia, but that doesn't guarantee (and i don't see her as being the one who tried to attain forbidden knowledge) that she is THE primordial one. if ever she is the primodial one, for sure, our sibling must've known or recognize that immediately. the cutscene suggests that our sibling was already awake during the cataclysm. she's also trying to undermine celestia, so its rather ironic that lumine hasn't figured out the floating entity next to us. also, the fatui, who seem to have direct knowledge to the scheme to overthrow celestia aren't threatened with paimon. my guess is that she could definitely be the last alive moon sister (we just saw mavuika tear apart a fraction of the fake sky, paving a way to see the corpse of a moon sister). paimon has more resemblance in the logo of welkin moon, and it would plot everything in place. she could also be in deep slumber after being in a close-to-death status. also we have already established the fact that the moon sisters reigned before the era of humans, and back when seelies' race was still dominant in the past. that would perfectly fit the question on why these humans never really recognize paimon at all. also, among all entities in teyvat, don't you think that there's a direct resemblance to a floating seelie to paimon who basically floats and guide us to whatever plan that we go to?moreover, there are current theories that seelies belonged to the celestia, as angels even. that would suggest that the moon sisters are weaved directly to celestia. i think it's also feasible that paimon is the only alive sibling of the moons, given that she is unique to the current style of teyvat but not a descender. take in mind that she's a native of tevyat, given that she's knowledgeable of all the circumstances but she can't force to remember everything. she's not in her prime state --- almost exactly as the traveller's disposition.

[@soni1891]

about venti: i think that he himself is the incarnation of the shade istaroth. he's the only archon that jokingly said (in his voiceline) that the drink in celestia is bland and made comments about the fruits. yes, he was a part of a thousand winds, but don't you ever wonder if these winds are species or a single entity? to say the least, there were no records of them as species. we can therefore say that he's basically the (holy spirit) in abrahamic sense. the thousand winds was the instrumentalization of the shade of time to help the people of monstadt. it was a subtle move to interferre and give these people freedom. that's the only realistic reason why venti can leave monstadt alone to visit other places and go to a deep slumber for hundred of years without consequences or "erosion". he is an original archon, as he is directly a part of the four shades himself. there were no other requirements for archons, be a god and live on during the archon war. is the community sure that the shades themselves didn't try to pursue a region of their choice? that would make barbatos' name unquestioned, cloaked with utmost divinity, and with authority. this theory could also support why his realm is the safest place for all the refugees of other nations (kaeya and vanessa), and even the witches of hexenzirkel's direct projects and dearest entities (klee and albedo). it's all because barbatos, who happened to be the shade isaroth, can stand against celestia or the abyss if ever questioned.

[@AndrewsMobs]

@@soni1891 Paimon is the most obvious choice for Istaroth, she literally has time powers unlike Venti.

[@beyonceverdadeiraoficial3997]

i believe he was the sun chariot, therres that Greek mythology story of a sun chariot that messed up and made the sun fall into Earth, just like how i think paimon was a moon sister, what if she gave her power away to keep the moon lit up in the sky?

[@unknownboy240]

About paimon i thid she could be a part or menefestation of primordial one .. instade of beig "The primordial one"

[@lowkeychains]

What if calestia is a primary world and tayvat is the secondary world where all the entities in calestia are more like angels of that world just like how the dragon sovereigns are the angels of tayvat

[@deannerodriguez2208]

If anything, what I wanna know is if this Tianwang from the Perinheri book is real and Morax actually defeated them… are they from celestia? cuz Tianwang translates to “Heavenly King” of all things like what’s up with that? (I get its a book but Pierro in Arlecchino’s CS said the book has truths, so who knows if this god is true or not…)

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

That book is ominous.... the The Little Witch and the Undying Fire is also an aminous book that sublety references Zhongli, overall, Fontaine did a great job in making him more sus than ever.

[@deannerodriguez2208]

@@citoyenneteavanttout7273 Isn't that the book in the theatre? i haven't read it yet... what does it have on Zhongli tho? That book is like 7 (or was it 8?) vols long...

[@yaameeteeee7778]

If you didnt say it i never notice paimon has a crown XD

[@justarandomguy1541]

How is it implied that he remembers rukadevata again?

[@Kryo_GTS]

I just want that sassy outfit for Venti 🤗

[@0Harebrained0]

How can Paimon be the Primordial One if she is affected by the changes in Irminsul?

[@TheGamerChronicles999]

@@0Harebrained0 same way our abyss sibling can when they should be a descender?

[@Jonatron503]

Who’s the guy on the right when the picture of Cloud retainer, Zhongli, and Madame Ping comes up? Looks like a geo catalyst user. Is it moon carver or mountain shaper? His design is very… Pantalone without glasses and a Liyue outfit. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️

[@amouramarie]

The Unknown God/Asmoday/the Heavenly Principles/the Shade of Space could all still be that same person. It looks _very_ much like she is being heavily corrupted in the opening cutscene. Any motivations or beliefs or loyalties she may have had prior could have been overruled by that corruption and changed her priorities and personality entirely, getting bad enough that she had to go into hibernation/sleep for 500 years after she imprisoned us. I don't a have a dog in that theory race, but it's possible, I guess.

[@jondonom]

Its unfair we were robbed of Egeria (big booba furina/focalors) 😢

[@Rougelesss]

I have a question, where does Zhongli *still* state that him and Venti are the only original Archons? Because none of his voicelines mention that and the only context I remember that being mentioned was either during the Liyue or Mondstadt AQ.

[@AndrewsMobs]

It got changed, it's in his character story, but basically it got changed to only 2 of the og archons being in rulership, Zhongli is no longer in rulership so this can only be referring to Venti and Nahida, meaning Zhongli considers Nahida to be the og Dendro archon, so he is indeed affected by Irminsul.

[@Rougelesss]

@@AndrewsMobs Yeah, I found that, but like... That doesn't make much sense as the Character Stories (as well as Artifact lore) should be entirely unaffected by Irminsul changes, Nahida's character Story still tells the whole thing. Same goes for Raiden's that should've been changed after the 3.3 AQ, because they still imply Scara's existence. I'd argue that it probably was just a change in wording, but the weird part is just that both of the Versions still exist and it only changes after deleting Rukkhadevata.

[@AndrewsMobs]

@@Rougelesss Yeah I agree it is weird, I also was thinking about it more and it makes more sense to consider the character stories to be said from a third perspective, so basically a narration about the characters life story. However if it is indeed a narration then it shouldn't be changed whatsoever, for some reason they changed it in a minor way, it's possible the narrator is actually a character who is affected by Irminsul.

[@TheRealCookiez]

What’s the song at 6:43

[@littlerascal2171]

link of the 2nd channel please? music in genshin is the best part imo

[@TheGamerChronicles999]

kzbin.info?search_query=hoyo+studio also I'm my outdo always a link!

[@littlerascal2171]

@@TheGamerChronicles999 Thank you!

[@Omgcait]

My personal theory about paimon is that she used to be close friendss/ a relative of the heavenly principles as they both have white hair and similar designs, Paimon used to watch over teyvat and report back the sustainer but a betrayal during the archon war caused paimons memory to be wiped (probably not completely) and her power to be lost. She guides the traveler to all these places to see how they are doing and what is going on, currently paimon doesn’t know why but I guess through muscle memory or smth like that. Again this is just my theory so please take it with a grain of salt but this is just based on the similarities and some of lore so in the end it might not even what paimon actually is or her purpose 😭

[@SAHIL-wf5gq]

I think paimon is unknown god. After fight result is draw and both unknown god and traveller fall into teyvat where traveller in land and unknown god in water and then traveller fish unknown god out which is paimon. Both loss there prime power.

[@ねこ男の子]

@@SAHIL-wf5gq Yeah and if you google Phanes, he has the same detail around his leg that both Paimon and Unknown God have. c:

[@ねこ男の子]

kiana paimon sustainer void hur dur

[@AndrewsMobs]

Did no one consider the obvious possibility that Paimon could be Istaroth?

[@Hyomiria]

What are the songs in the background at 6:51

[@temporarilyalaine]

I LOVE ZHONGLI YAY

[@avghuman]

11:15 royal rumble heaaalll yeeeaahhhhh wm 41 mainevent zhongli vs venti 🗣️📣🔥

[@kuroshi7kisu]

paimonial wrath

[@Apologems123]

12:38 lmaooo

[@StarCollecter]

This theory would be cool if there werent 4 confirmed descenders

[@jacoblol901]

i wouldn’t call it confirmed lol. Nahida is still subject to Irminsul, she tried to convince us that our twin was a Teyvat native which isn’t possible. I wouldn’t be surprised if there were more than 4

[@MrEagorath]

@@jacoblol901 it really depends on the circumstances.. throughout the story it is implied that, just because you come from "outside" doesn't mean you have the status of decender. They are unique beings that carry a will strong enough to rival that of fate itself. at multiple points it is hinted at that Khaenri'ah dabbled in the summoning in hopes of finding a decender.

[@jacoblol901]

@@MrEagorath oh i know how they are classified. i was just speaking on the point that there were 4 confirmed, because it was “confirmed” by someone who gathered the information from Irminsul which we know is not a reliable source.

[@StarCollecter]

@@jacoblol901 well it isnt confirmed there r only 4 but it is confirmed tht zhongli isnt one as we are the 4th descenders 3rd are the gnoses 2nd is the dragon king and 1st is the primordial one, then there would make no sense for zhongli to be one

[@jacoblol901]

@@StarCollecter i never said anything about zhongli?

[@driplord6150]

Zhongli is just simply HIM 🐐

[@sidlarson8374]

How did I miss Ei mention istaroth wtf!? must of mashed to buttons and missed that part lmao

[@rew.6z465]

didn't he create the primordial jade winged spear to be able to kill a beast or something because it was overwhelmingly strong ?

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

to kill Baqiu who was an ocean titan. And it wasn't HIM that found it overwhelmingly strong, it's his Geo whales (me in other words lmao). The story goes that Liyue was subject to many attacks from sea monsters and evil gods and Baqiu was one of them (Understandable, most of western Liyue was under the sea until he arrived and raised it from the sea bottom and calmed the tides, technically conquering that area because sea monsters terrorised humans and that's why you find Ameonite fossils all around south west Liyue) so he made a Geo whale to fight him, but the Geo Whale didn't succeed, so he stood his ass up and sent another one of his toys, this time a jade kite that took form the sky and drawned the dude down in the ocean abyss, problem solved, Xiao got a weapon 😂😂

[@rew.6z465]

@citoyenneteavanttout7273 lmao thanks for the explanation

[@Katara-kr9xg]

Lots of info I didnt know or forgot thanks❤ didnt realized he remembered Rukkhadevata one of few people 😔

[@pinkraiden]

QUESTION: is zhongli affected by erosion??

[@JeseCaba-t4p]

Theory paimon is older then everyone

[@pakman9794]

Zhong'li: "only two remain of the first Seven" to "only two of the first Seven remain in positions of rulership." Nahida is now considered the Original by Zhong'li and is simply not a ruler. I wish people would stop stating otherwise. He is absolutely effected by Irmunsul and I THINK that's because he's the Primordial Dragon Sovereign of Geo, a native.

[@AndrewsMobs]

You were correct in the first half but dropped the ball on the last sentence lol, the geo sovereign is obviously Azhdaha.

[@pakman9794]

@@AndrewsMobs I do love Az, but he's just the lord of Vishaps. That theory is as good as any though.

[@AndrewsMobs]

@@pakman9794 It's confirmed in the CN version, same title as the other sovereigns. And Zhongli obviously isn't a sovereign, Celestia isn't dumb enough to give a sovereign one of the seven seats.

[@pakman9794]

@@AndrewsMobs Incorrect as that CN confirmation exists alongside conflicting declarations. Further, it makes sense if Zhong'li became the god of contracts by making a contract with The Heavenly Principles.

[@AndrewsMobs]

@@pakman9794 Everything points to Azdaha being the sovereign, even Zhongli points out that he is basically young compared to Azdaha Also Azdaha was as big as a mountain which is standard size for a prime sovereign We don't know why Zhongli is so obsessed with contracts and how he became the god of contracts in the first place

[@AkatsukiLink]

Don't take this personally. It is just a joke lol Nah! We all know Zhongli came fromt eh Astral Express, or something lol. They called him, Dan Heng, back then 😊🤣

[@40dueceproductions94]

Wait weren't 2 of the 3 moon sisters killed tho i recall that at some point in time during the cataclysm?

[@JaneDoe-dg1gv]

All three died and two fell from the sky. the last one's corpse remains as the moon we see in game.