When Boutique Builders Call It Quits

Baxter and Jonathan get into when guitar and amp builders are ready to retire, should they sell the company or just ride off into the sunset with their legacy.

[@chiba131]

Wow. Y’all pumped John Cruz SO HARD when he was forced to go solo … and NOTHING about his flameout here. Huge oversight. Really undermines your credibility.

[@spacelab2756]

Amplified Nation is keeping the Dumble dream alive! Handbuilt in Hudson MA.

[@Santaheckler]

I’m so close to playing just one or two guitars (not at the same time 😆) straight into a great amp and calling it “my tone”…🤓👍

[@jhood33]

This exactly. I've been toying with splurging for a great amp, downsizing the guitar collection to just 2-3 and calling it a day.

[@G_Demolished]

Get a telecaster and a Katana. You can play almost anything with that rig.

[@honkytonkinson9787]

I can’t afford boutique, except maybe a pedal. I kinda dream about having a nice strat or tele, but certainly won’t happen any time soon. I’m beginning to appreciate not wanting more stuff and have almost achieved that state of mind.

[@enriquemendez1507]

Same. I'm happy with ol bessy (my tele) and ol midge (my classical guitar)

[@calebjensen3465]

Build one! I have a replacement neck put on an old squier body (first guitar) and that thing feels amazing

[@voyxu143]

Paying mostly for the cost of being a small "boutique" business. Many of the large corps build guitars that are equal in quality and sometimes better than any "boutique" builder can do. This is the case especially so with effects.

[@sisdl15]

I just bought a clone of the Duellist pedal (DualGun) for 50 bucks and am pretty much content. Think I'll sell off my JHS and Keeley overdrives. For someone that mostly plays at home alone I really don't need the best gear!

[@joeydurant6267]

Hell after thirty years of playing I find myself in a halfway house with zero gear... I have all but given away amazing equipment over the years so it's my own fault but at this stage of the game I am looking forward to grabbing a Harley Benton or something similar, modding the shit out of it and basically doing the whole afford a board setup cuz for the foreseeable future volume isn't really gonna be an issue anyway.... But that being said it's a good time to be in this position cuz in my twenties getting even a bit of a setup together would cost at least three times as much from pawn shops and the gear wouldn't be as good more likely than not... With the exception of Peavey amps.... And that's only because I happen to know a few pawn shops down south that are still inundated with Peavey amps for cheap but even at that... For what I need I'd take a black star idcore ten or whatever over the rage 158 that would be the comparable sized and price range... So yeah it is at least a golden age in that respect. No these guitars aren't perfect... No a brand new player probably shouldn't start with an instrument that is gonna need a whole setup (although there is the argument that it's not bad to learn that side of things as well) but for me it's perfect.

[@mikemorgan4774]

I for one would love to see a resurgence of Montgomery Wards amplifiers!

[@DE-GEN-ART]

well you should have kept those maintenance agreements on your stoves and refrigerators

[@nickmartinez8217]

Do you think the name is available?

[@davegallagher7428]

For obvious reasons I would someday love to own a Gallagher.

[@THEItchybruddah]

“…like not thinkin the sky was blue…” Baxter, twang poet laureate of the Carolinas!

[@nwsrcphotog]

I have a Delaney 512.. great guitar!!

[@ronniewilliford3449]

Haven't watched in a while, but Baxter looks nice. Shorter hair, dressed like a business owner. Looks good. Good for you man.

[@jhood33]

To the question that really mattered: Hans Gruber was stealing $640 million in bearer bonds

[@carlmcgregor2707]

$1.66 Billion in todays money.. not a bad score for a school teacher.

[@bigstick5278]

What happens when you waited to long to buy one when they were building, then they stopped? I kept my gold Klon # 11 and a couple first issue Zen Drives.

[@joshgray3581]

I enjoy listening to these knowledgeable cats

[@shaunw9270]

I always wanted an original Dennis Fano guitar. Today my dream instrument is TK Smith .

[@skyemoz6559]

I agree about my fav band Zeppelin. Glad they called it quits when they did. Regarding guitars there are so many boutique guitar builders out there and up and coming. Gerber acoustics sound great but crazy $$. Bouchere Guitars also sound great. My boutique builder Kent Everett retired and I have yet to play a better guitar for my style

[@dallassevison3542]

You Cruz on to the next one?

[@thedirtyknobs]

LoL thata a deep pull

[@davidpekarsky2977]

Well played.

[@MinivanMegafun100]

Funny how they skirted around that very recent case.

[@dainpaxton]

where's the link to the dolphin trainer?

[@scottbookman]

Gurian guitars were amazing,Jackson Browne and Paul Simon played them.

[@ShawnShipstad]

Where are DR Z amps now? there are many others that are a bid ? mark. Can anyone explain.

[@ScottSiegling]

Baxter’s sons work with the dolphins in the summer

[@ThomasJackMoore]

Interesting that you done mention Iconic Guitars even once.

[@TK-fk4po]

I want a Deluis or DGN - already have plenty of big name guitars.

[@mrcurtis73]

This title reminded me of Moniker guitars from Austin. I think they only lasted like 5 years or so.

[@James-vr5wh]

I know you guys probably have a partnership / friendship with Cruz Guitars and might not be able to speak about it but I would have addressed them. It’s like one day there were here and the next day not. Very short lived.

[@drippinglass]

I haven’t used my amps in a long time. 😀

[@kenb9762]

I'm glad I picked up a Hovercraft Dwarvenaut when I did. Not sure what Nial is up to these days

[@Chris_Lohmann]

I hadn’t heard about Froggy Bottom thinking about closing their doors for good. That sucks. I had the dream of eventually owning a Froggy Bottom Will Ackerman signature Model K but they’re already so expensive (something like $15,000). If they shut down, it’ll most likely drive the prices of used ones even higher than they already are. I guess I’ll never own one now.

[@penultimatename6677]

Heritage is somewhere between boutique and consumer. Made great guitars a venture capitalist firm bought. Was that a good or bad move? Benedetto is still boutique having handed over the reigns to handpicked CEO and luthier.

[@MinivanMegafun100]

Noticed you guys didn’t mention John Cruz when mentioning the bad cases. Also note to Derek: ya gotta sort out the auto focus on the tight shot of Baxter. Focus on that camera has been drifting in and out for a few videos now.

[@russellzauner]

Jol Dantzig and Paul Rivera still make gear. Thomas Blug (of H&K fame) just brought his AMPX working prototype, and said: "You'll get it when it's ready but it plays right now". Dean Zelinsky is showing a heartbeat again and Fulltone just relaunched. Bernie Rico Jr literally died or he'd probably be rebooting too. Others like Charlie Hunter are still continuously being discovered and rediscovered, depending on if you saw the guitars or the player first. That's just off the top of my head; it seems to me that the big names are backing off the trade shows and the smaller people or people who haven't even shown before are kind of trying to expand to fill the gaps. I would bet a warm pitcher of Oly that there were more boutique/small business/mom and pop represented at NAMM 2024 percentage-wise than the "critical-mass", "almost too big to fail" music conglomerates.

[@petelewis6920]

Anyone got any updates on the John Cruz situation? Seems the elephant in the room.

[@CheshireTomcat68]

Are you thinking of buying them???

[@johncrace911]

NO Speak of John Cruz or Ron Kirn. Cmon guys

[@andrewhess2978]

I've seen interviews where Kenny Wayne Shepherd says his Dumbles aren't modded Fenders, its all Dumble inside; only the cabinet and exterior are Fender.

[@cortmiller]

Nooooooooo I wish zep would still do a reunion tour with page plant JPJ (if they could convince him) and bonhams son. Jason bonhams tribute band is really great but it would be so awesome to be able to see them live. The celebration day show that ended up as a blue ray had me hoping so bad

[@timedwards5600]

These companies are the same as mom and pa stores. Competing with the big boys.

[@davidlewis2055]

Got a couple of MJ Franks ,a Welsh Meyrick and sold my original Deni Fano tele alt de facto was so much better than my 52 tele with boutique pups a Larraviee & Martin D28 .Did want a Froggy though .cheers all

[@hod8931]

Dumble... yep! Led...yep! Madnatone...yep!

[@bobmanners8624]

Is Jim Olson still building? Amazing guitars.

[@HawkTwoNine]

No. He retired. Existing now going for 25k plus.

[@beatmasterbossy]

Zeppelin... Beatles too. In and out within one decade. Hit the States in 64, stop touring in 66, broke up by 1970 and that's it.

[@justinfrakes4186]

Applying the boutique title to some instruments is suspect at best. I’ll agree with hand crafted acoustic instruments, there is no way a mass produced guitar, lute, violin, mandolin etc will ever approach a “boutique” build. However, when we get into solid body electric guitars and amplifiers that boutique bullshit goes out the window. The most difficult thing to do is the finishing which can be learned by anyone willing to try. The bits and pieces are rarely made by the manufacturer other than the pickups, which again,can be made by anyone willing to learn with off the shelf components. The tuners, bridges, tail pieces, potentiometer’s, capacitors, fret wire, knobs etc are available. An individual can also source select woods, admittedly on a small scale. Amplifiers are also tough to call boutique. Everything really boils down to different variations of fender circuits which at their heart Leo himself said he ripped from GE commercial amplifier designs. The schematics are readily available as well as all the individual components (other than obsolete stuff like germanium.) if you can solder and order parts from the internet then Bob’s your uncle. The cabinetry is the hardest part which is accessible through many vendors. Not to diminish someone like Dumble who actually is an electrical genius that created something all his own. Most boutique amps are just rips of classic designs carefully assembled with “good” parts. Anyone who buys a $12,000 Telecaster copy and $10,000 plus boutique Champ, Princeton etc is just proving they have money.

[@jangafett]

"Bearer Bonds"

[@sergiolicea9056]

Anyone know if Terry McInturff still makes guitars? Always seemed like an under the radar builder that should’ve received more attention.

[@trev3971]

Terry is still rocking a few miles down the road from Casino

[@cortmiller]

In addition to Collings, after Mike lull passed, I think his boy Spencer Lull has done well with the Mike Lull guitar brand where they easily could have disappeared

[@Doczee1000]

The old Fender American Deluxe Strats (2010-2016) were great guitars that came with a hard shell case and great workmanship; sound, durability and a reasonable price. It’s been my go to Strat for over a decade. I’m interested in Collings, but I sure am glad I got this Strat in my arsenal back then. Find one used. You won’t need boutique!

[@djizzah]

What about john Cruz ? He got flogged mercilessly early on, is he a loose cannon?

[@factualverbage]

John Palir quit and then it looks like started again ........ out of Sulfur, Louisianna.... let's hope Chris Forshage doesn't quit...... He's awesome..... check him out and his guitars...... out of Pflugerville, Texas.... not sure about Bilt but there are some out there.

[@marksaulnier2222]

I miss 65 Amps

[@chawkinz]

Been a Bourgeois fan for a while now. I cringe that he felt like he needed to crawl into bed with Eastman, and now selling hybrid US/China series. Still excellent Made in Maine guitars.

[@ThatGuysGuitars]

It never fails to scare the shit out of me every time the camera focuses on Jonathan, and that giant Johnny cash is glaring at me 😂

[@bryantwalley]

Now we just need a 2/13 with 2 10s combo studio amp. (2 watt or 13 watt switchable) Could be a head/cab also but for that I would prefer a combo

[@mitchpalmer5116]

As a professional Woodworker, no one seems to want to pay for high quality custom work anymore. People need to realize that big companies like Gibson and Fender don't care about making quality instruments that are worth the money they are asking for them.

[@chrisdigital]

That's because nobody can afford it. Our money is worthless thanks to all the elitists selling our country off and printing money like there's no tomorrow. Until that shit stops and we bring industry back to the States and empower our dollar again nobody's going to be able to afford artisan stuff.

[@chrisdigital]

Also people that do spend the money look at fender and Gibson as a large company that can back the product in case they have an issue. It's all about the money again, people don't want to gamble with it because it's so hard to come by.

[@mitchpalmer5116]

@@chrisdigital that's if you look at Fender or especially Gibson as a reputable company. I for one do not.

[@mattc6147]

@mitchpalmer5116 - Not sure I'd qualify this as "no one seems to want to pay". I think a lot of people would gladly pay for high quality work, and would much prefer your instruments. The fact of the matter is that free cash flow has dwindled for people with the meteoric rise in housing costs.

[@crosswalklarry]

@2:12

[@robraaiii]

Loudoun County (and Virginia as a whole) SUCK @$$!!! When it comes to VDOT, towns & counties. Verizon contracts my company for the installation of 5G across the country. NO 2 Places in VA have the same Permit Requirements. Can’t just go by national standards… no, every single town has their own unique demands. Just some old politicians and state officials ensuring job security…. Oh wait, LOWDEN!… sorry, this rant is off topic and out of place. But I wrote it all. I’m not deleting it

[@user-cw6xy3ny4d]

Damn, sound really bad. Hope things get better for you.

[@robraaiii]

@@user-cw6xy3ny4d 😁 appreciate that. Ty

[@Joeschmoe8930]

What fender did to guild was criminal.

[@sagittated]

The company was foundering and changing ownership. Fender bought it, tried to save it, and failed. It wasn't a situation where they bought a competitor that was a threat to them just to kill them. Not predatory at all.

[@ampdrum1]

Garnet amps.

[@MinivanMegafun100]

Garnet was never boutique. He was independent, but not boutique. Gar was notorious for building amps out of whatever spare parts he had laying around. Also Marsland speakers were cheap and lousy even for their time.

[@ampdrum1]

What builder just has 'spare parts' just laying around? Also if you know your history, American speakers were not available in Canada at the time and importing British speakers would raise prices significantly. Yes, I put Eminence in my Garnets but I would never take advice from anyone named minivan-megafun. What a maroon. @@MinivanMegafun100

[@davidsummerville351]

If I had a boutique guitar builder and he went out of business I would probably end my life. Luckily I buy my guitars off the rack.

[@user-cw6xy3ny4d]

I bought one from QVC and it is my favorite. It is called an Esteban. It is like no other guitar that I have ever owned.

[@SirSneakerPimp]

@@user-cw6xy3ny4d LOL

[@contrabandjoe7974]

One of many reasons I don't buy boutique. Here today, gone tomorrow

[@BlueberryStinkFinger62]

No on zeppelin please spare us zeppelin

[@agatone20]

What's the status on the strange and bizarre case of John Cruz?

[@allensaunders449]

Alot of builder's can't all be profitable to survive. So many now. I like that but. Relish from Switzerland is out of business now

[@Dragon_rls]

The Groob

[@kevinbolick2349]

I think there are just too many people making stuff. There are only so many takes on a strat that the market will support. And so much of it is hype. There are some builders whose instruments are no where near as good as what they cost to purchase, and I’ll keep those opinions to Myself. I can scratch build guitars that are better guitars than some of these guitars selling 4-6K. Some of these builders are just assembling and finishing partscasters, where I build mine from lumber, but I can’t sell them for enough to make it profitable. So, I do it just for fun. There are lots of good builders out there that are probably a lot like me. There is a good side for the consumer though, if you find the right builder and can look past the hype, you can get a custom shop quality guitar at a fraction of the price.

[@kevinbolick2349]

As for Amps, we’ve just seen Gibson roll out those amps that look cool, but are cheaply made. Anytime the tubes mount to a circuit board, you are buying crap. You’d be better off finding someone like Derryck Wilson at Franklyn Amps and ordering one of his point to point tweed amps. You’ll pay less and have an amp that will outlive you. This is an honest take from a Gibson fan and player.

[@DonnyRocker2012]

$650 million IIRC

[@user-no1cares]

Michael Lewis Guitars. Maybe you can find a pred-owned.

[@johnbriggs3916]

OK, I feel I'm going to be inconsistent here: they say that you should leave your audience wanting more, and Casino Guitars videos usually leave me wanting less! But this video really did just stop as it was starting to get somewhere! (Yes, I know it's lack of preparation -- or any sense of professionalism.) I really wanted to know about the conditions whereby a business can continue as a boutique, or where it can expand. To take concrete examples: why did PRS and Taylor expand to become mainstream brands? Could it be that they were just not good enough to remain as boutique brands?

[@bob733333]

PRS a pretty axe that sounds average.

[@johnbriggs3916]

@bob733333 Think carefully: did your contribution advance the debate?

[@johnbriggs3916]

@@drsrsv8884 They started small.

[@bob733333]

@@johnbriggs3916 Do I care what you think?

[@bob733333]

@@johnbriggs3916 Let me guess, you paid thousands of dollars for a tiger stripe topped axe that has really lame pick ups? Just put some better pick ups in it.

[@rafaelmartinez1917]

Do you remember what happened to VOX amps? I do, they killed that brand moving production to China when they sold the company, which was in my opinion a stupid move and a way of burning out at least 70% of their perceived value as a company when they moved production out of England, those amps were just never the same, in a bad way....

[@DonnyRocker2012]

I had a Chinese hand wired head: incredible amplifier

[@gringogreen4719]

Buy up used Froggy Bottom guitars and sell.them.down the road for a profit. 🤔

[@danielconrad764]

Kingsley amps are super rare and limited in supply... Simon Jarret is a living legend.

[@user-mr1ku5iz8l]

The only Dumble amp I'm interested in is Robben Ford's Dumble. He has the one.

[@gregorglasbruch6917]

Try a Bombshell Overdrive from Amplified Nation. You, won‘t regret it.

[@jvin248]

The problem of boutique guitars is only around 3% of the buyers are chasing guitars higher than $2,500 prices. That sales cycle is super challenging to maintain. Especially when the reality is a kid can take a Fender MIM or Epiphone to a PLEK machine and have the same Custom Shop playability as the boutique instruments. Then all that separates the markets is the exclusive premium price ... and that's just a ghost in uncertain recessionary times.

[@DE-GEN-ART]

well maybee if people actually bought boutique they wouldnt go out of business.

[@jamesonpace726]

Lead whut....

[@IndigoJo]

The bit about Zeppelin splitting up reminds me of something Neil Finn said years ago about his and his brother's first band, Split Enz: that they had been together ten years and that's really enough. (By the end, none of the original songwriters remained.) There are so many bands that have been plodding along for years after they should have called it a day; the Oysterband last made a decent album in 1989 (they were making a sound that was a cross between 80s British pop and folk, whereas since then it's been mostly cliched festival anthems) but they're still churning them out. The Indigo Girls should have called it quits after Come On Now Social or Become You at the latest. It's not to say they've not made a decent album since, or decent songs here and there, but nothing approaching Rites of Passage or Swamp Ophelia. Fairport Convention, they should have knocked it on the head after Richard Thompson left (that was only three years). I didn't know that about the investors driving down the quality at Lowden. I had heard that George Lowden brought the manufacturing back to Ireland after the quality went down in Japan, but I keep hearing that the best Lowdens came from the time when George Lowden wasn't involved and it was run by the team that is now Avalon (also in Northern Ireland). I thought the reason for the split was that the Avalon people started designing their own guitars, but the terms of their contract with the Lowdens meant they had to stick to George's designs.

[@30smsuperstrat]

The Dolphins did get trained by the NFL again😂

[@jamesburge1983]

Just as a nit picky thing, please stop misusing the word 'clone'. If a product is a clone of another product, that means that the parts are interchangeable. If the parts are not interchangeable, then it is not a clone.

[@H43N]

i love the chinese guy who made my ibanez. mr wu tang

[@PeterMoore350]

I gave up on boutiques just before that interwb thang happened. My boutiques are worth thousands now and thx to you?? You’ve reminded me of that. None of that is true. My Elon Musk brain implanted cognisance said i should type it. No i didn’t. Yes idid It’s an ex-parrot No it’s not Cheers from NZ 😎🎸🤘

[@michaeldesrosier1068]

you ok?

[@PeterMoore350]

@@michaeldesrosier1068 no. applying for tens of jobs knowing that i'm a strong, no great candidate in the IT industry where they say they are struggling to get people ? No. I don't have a fake Indian resume/CV nor do i have an Indian accent. Apart from that ?

[@BlueberryStinkFinger62]

My favorite is Fulltone 30 years of brilliance and now gone.. wish Michael Fuller would come out of retirement....

[@Atttuner]

Yawn…. sales people judging craftsman…..entitled day traders

[@johnbriggs3916]

That's a bit harsh on Baxter and Jonathan.

[@jed1166]

These guys are professional musicians who continue to gig,(do you?)…. They have earned the right to speak by being professional stage performers, being successful retailers, and for carrying boutique builders,(Lowden and John Cruz), as well as the biggest ,(Taylor, Fender, etc.). Nothing entitled in those resumes.

[@G_Demolished]

I’m a much better player than my local luthier. He always asks my opinion on his guitars when I stop by.

[@G_Demolished]

@@drsrsv8884 The point being that the salesman’s opinion of the craftsman’s work isn’t something to be rejected out of hand, as the salesman may in fact have a better assessment.

[@michaelblaney4461]

Well most boutique builders are very overpriced😮

[@johnbriggs3916]

That's called a niche market.

[@tommacdonald6295]

You just don't know what you're talking about.

[@johnbriggs3916]

@@tommacdonald6295 Are you quibbling about the word "very"?

[@rv6205]

there is alot i could say ...but just stop

[@johnbriggs3916]

@@rv6205 You don't give us much to work on.