Which Mercedes F1 is the fastest? W11 vs W12 vs W13 vs W14

[@formulaaddict]

*Correction: 2022 and 2023 times are swapped at the end, apologies for the small error there! 🙏

[@matthewmwepu1134]

I'm new to F1, but if w11 is faster than w14, why not just revert back w11? Or are there some compliance issues? Because 2sec+ would put into context with the leaders

[@formulaaddict]

F1 make regulation changes, to make racing better and closer so that is why sometimes the new regulations can slow the grid down

[@matthewmwepu1134]

So this means they can't revert to w11?

[@formulaaddict]

​@@matthewmwepu1134 No, they are not allowed to. The car would not fit the 2023 rules

[@dirtdiver2389]

I was just going to call that out. Cool illustration.

[@danryyu9638]

The W11 might be one of the greatest F1 Cars ever developed, and Lewis at the helm was a nightmare to deal with.

[@sureyeah3678]

The greatest F1 car ever developed might be the RB19 looking at the projection of this season But w11 is undoubtedly the fastest F1 will ever be

[@rohanhemnani4706]

@@sureyeah3678 f2004

[@HaydenLau.]

​@@sureyeah3678Ever???

[@Stealthassin135]

@@HaydenLau. Yeah. You can't take F1 cars at raw pace. You have to contextualize how the car performed as compared to the rest of the grid. And the RB19 may not look as fast as the W11 on one-lap pace but on race-pace it is likely the fastest ever. It has already broken the record for most consecutive wins in a row and most wins and it is looking likely to smash the record for most wins in a season by winning every race of the season.

[@unknownplayer7190]

⁠@@Stealthassin135yeah but let’s assume that W11 and RB19 made a race. Mercedes would crush the Red Bull’s car

[@mrsheev9131]

Tbf, it's important to keep in mind that the W11 was at the end of its development cycle at the 2020 Bahrain GP, whereas the W12, 13 and 14 were all at the beginning of their development cycles, literally the first race of the season. Just wanted to point that out. Not to mention the W12 had a poor preseason test and kinda sucked around Bahrain at the start of the season, the gap to the W11 would've definitely been smaller than it was, once they solved the car's issues.

[@sangokwho]

Great point, @formulaaadict would you be able to do a comparison at another circuit later in the season like Spain?

[@Bahamuttiamat]

Valid but unimportant point. The w12 is a massively detuned w11. The 13 and 14 shouldn't be in this list. Or ever compared to their other championship winning sisters.

[@sangokwho]

@@Bahamuttiamat massively detuned, but still the point stands that it was the first race of the reg, so the worst it would ever be, versus the almost best version of the W11. So the gap is bigger than it would be if taken in a mid-season race for both year.

[@dragonkrieg4444]

it true, you're basically looking at the full extent of the nerfs with this W12. The W12 that showed up in Brazil would probably hold up a lot better, even if it's slower in the end

[@Diabolical-Tyrant]

also important is the change in track limit rules of course

[@ZeusFTWGaming]

W11 in the hands of Lewis Hamilton was insane. Edit : People can argue just about anything on the internet nowadays.

[@formulaaddict]

It was crazy that he was lapping everyone up to 4th 😂

[@mrklv1593]

He is still insane. Getting podiums with the 5th fastest car on the grid

[@nice900]

@@mrklv1593 2nd in the constructors, but 5th fastest ok

[@IArespondee]

@@mrklv1593 keep coping hard with the 2nd car on the grid ahahah

[@joshflynn2173]

@@mrklv1593 Its the 3rd fastest

[@azure.heartz]

that w11 was something else man

[@formulaaddict]

It was hard to keep it in the frame hahaha

[@woodenhoe]

its literally on rails lol

[@juliusfucik4011]

The W11 has so much traction out of the corners. Insane!

[@bosschu]

adjustable camber was the trick

[@nicholastotoro7721]

Fully expected the W13 to be the slowest. Surprised the W11 was so much quicker and faster than the W12. IIRC the floors were changed (among other things), which must have affected the cars more than I remembered.

[@formulaaddict]

W13 is the slowest in the animation. On the timing screens 2022 and 2023 times are mistakenly swapped

[@ElementsMMA]

Going by the graphic and not the timings, the W13 was the slowest. Which makes sense. Someone cocked up the final timings.

[@kanata4g63]

​​​@@ElementsMMA Read the comment that it's *literally* in top of your comment.

[@tylerplayzz8697]

Also the DAS(Dual Axis Steering) system was banned, it gave the W11 an astronomical advantage in the low speed corners by letting the driver adjust the toe of the front wheels to add more of a contact patch since in the low speed corners most of the grip comes from the tires rather than mechanical grip

[@jsn73]

The 2021 cars (W12) were a lot slower than the 2020 cars

[@TimRobertsen]

Cool video! I always love these:) Tips for improvement: Instead of showing the time for each car (which is the same because they start at the same time), just show a master clock and the delta for each car, and maybe switch the ranking if there are changes in positions.

[@nickysixx2480]

W11 was an absolute apex specimen of engineering. It will be a while before we see future f1 cars be faster than this car.

[@gpaje]

That's on purpose. The slowest cars of that era was faster than the most dominant car of 2023. It's not due to the lack of technology, but a change in regs designed to slow down the cars. The engineering isn't really comparable due to that.

[@nickysixx2480]

Your forgetting about the DAS and the novel rear suspension innovations.

[@dup11-tl6um]

some room temperature iq right there. you realize cars would be much faster if regulations wouldn't limit engineering

[@lukasandresen3383]

@@gpaje Exactly, if you return this year's cars to the weight of the old regulations, (752kg) they would be 46kg less and would probably be as insane as the W11.

[@Firemarioflower]

No way @@lukasandresen3383

[@gvilla98]

These are great visualizations. Keep it up! It'd be very interesting to see a comparison between the likes of the W11, RB19, SF71H, RB6, F2004, MP4-23 and such. Essentially, blisteringly fast cars of varied eras but in different contexts, f.e. high downforce tracks, low downforce tracks, etc.

[@redemolisher]

I'd love to see all of these car's get a 919 Evo Edition and a Modern Makeover Edition (apply some of the new aero principles manufacturing tricks and methods to get a car with classic regulations but kinda Modernised varients of it

[@houseking9211]

@@redemolisher the 919 really was just, remove the things that it needs to race for 24 hours, add drs and better floor aero, and go

[@redemolisher]

@@houseking9211 wasn't the chassis also modified in a few places that made some significant changes?

[@redemolisher]

@@houseking9211 wasn't the chassis also modified in a few places that made some significant changes?

[@houseking9211]

@@redemolisher no just aero changes, obviously they removed things like headlights and balast but that was it

[@izidor]

w11 ...uff it was a joy to watch Ham driving it, specially the Hungary pole lap was something else.

[@yugarten8523]

Austria or Styria in the wet was his best that year !

[@davidcoulter1058]

The W11 was so fast the FIA had to change the regulations and essentially ban the car (rake changes and DAS steering).

[@RehanX44]

its a shame how much F1 is influenced by redbull

[@KistRs]

@@RehanX44 And they won't change a thing about it to stop RBR, because fiabull is stronger than never.

[@dup11-tl6um]

@@KistRs keep inhaling that good copium. monkey will never win championship again

[@ДиёрНасруллаев-л6б]

@@RehanX44the dumbest thing I have heard. But hey Merc fangirls do come up with the dumbest stuff. But hey let’s forget illegal tyre tests and engine getting ready WAY ahead of competitors, right? Y’all have some short memory tbh

[@ДиёрНасруллаев-л6б]

@@KistRsnext level denial

[@PjXu98]

I always wanted to see some comparisons between Lewis and Max from their 2021 cars. Did you consider to do that?

[@formulaaddict]

Yes, we actually have a video up about the infamous Jeddah 2021 Qualifying session hahaha

[@PjXu98]

@@formulaaddict I've seen that one and it was very interesting to see. I believe other comparisons from 2021 between these two will be interesting to see as well.

[@brianm5753]

The RB of 2021 was better than the Merc and driver made the difference.

[@Grafzaaiers]

@@brianm5753 Lmfao what have you been smoking? There are literally multiple articles out there (Racefans and Racingnews365 by example but there are tens) that have analyzed this exact question and literally all of them state Mercedes had the better car overall that season and it wasn’t even close anymore for the last 5 or 6 races.. But whatever makes you cope I guess though.

[@KL50450]

@@brianm5753guess you missed most of the season… I agree driver made the difference in the end, with Max being very aggressive. He had to as his car was inferior to the Merc. This was extremely obvious the last 5 races of 2021.

[@M4NA5]

Would like this comparison for 2014, ‘15, ‘16, and ‘20 Merc cars - they were all 7-8 tenths clear off the field. Data suggests the 2016 Merc was the quickest, in terms of avg. gap to the field.

[@grimm6jack]

The biggest is actually the 2020 if you ignore Abu Dhabi (basically prototype W12 at that point) and the mini circuit of Sahkir where there wasn't much margin for corners to make a difference (basically about 4 real corners) and thus the close lap times of the cars there.

[@aumpauskar4653]

A note here that in 2020 Bahrain was near the end of the year which saves time due to upgrades, nonetheless the W11 is 🔝

[@infinitetk4165]

Yes but merc stopped upgrading the w11 quite early in the season

[@seniordipshitter8954]

To be fair, the W11 was the most developed, cuz it was near the end of the 2020 season, and W12 was underdeveloped compared to it, because it was right at the start of the season, so that's also a big factor for the gap

[@infinitetk4165]

Merc stopped upgrading the w11 early in the season

[@MintedWhim727]

W12 is more of a detuned w11 than a new developed car

[@Clement1912]

The pull the w11 gets out of the corners is insane

[@bassemad7906]

the w12 is good at the entrance of the corner but oh boy the exit on the w11 is insane!

[@leirbag134]

DAS a good comparison, thanks for the video.

[@mmcewen9789]

That was the smoothest the W13 ever ran on a straight. Anyway, good to see them competing again this year. Next year should be something to see.

[@starshipupdates5217]

this is a great video to show the pace difference but mercedes have changed the car a lot over the course of this year. could you potentially do this comparison again with a more recent track such as the hungaroring or silverstone? this would demonstrate the new sidepod, floor, suspension and front aero changes that were made over the last few months by mercedes on the w14

[@johannesbrunjohansson1636]

I find it interesting that both new-gen Mercs (W13 and W14) are at opposite ends of top speed spectrum at first straight.

[@Dragonson575]

My word, how was the performance gap between the W11 and W12 so wide? I know Merc got screwed by the 2021 regulations but I never knew the loss of performance was so pronounced.

[@yugarten8523]

now you need to see the jump in performance in the rb's in 1 year !

[@nexx_740]

There were a couple of changes to the regulations could've caused this, such as an increase in minimum weight limit, aero cuts (less downforce) on the cars, different floors (more drag), and I think Pirelli also changed their compounds a little bit that season to last longer

[@Bahamuttiamat]

Mercedes lost 1.3s with the 2021 regulations.

[@Bahamuttiamat]

@@nexx_740 The main changes; while publicly introduced on 'cost savings' ground were designed to nuked the low raked w11. Namely the floor cuts and specifically the rear cake tin winglets. This changed massively hurt low raked cars' ability to manage the rear tire squirt (wake).

[@yugarten8523]

@@Bahamuttiamat not 1.3s but lost a lot !

[@twosnakse]

W11 is God’s Car

[@xander1052]

The W14's straightline speed was a little surprising but understandable when I think about it.

[@nmnnmtoto]

The video I was waiting for

[@Itz_Yun]

W11 and lewis was something so beautiful

[@whoanelly737-8]

Awesome simulation

[@Alex50969]

If you could show the delta to the leading car instead of 4 equal timers, that would be nice :)

[@Abduldoctor]

The W10 vs W12 would've been a nice comparison

[@charliechisholm5961]

You should do one of these with title winning cars from multiple teams

[@formulaaddict]

Do you mean like: “2023 Championship winner vs the last 10 years”?

[@charliechisholm5961]

@@formulaaddict yes, wasn’t sure if you have done this in the past

[@formulaaddict]

No, but really appreciate the idea! I will make the video and give the credit to you at the beginning ;)

[@charliechisholm5961]

@@formulaaddict thanks man

[@DarrenStevensohnOfficial]

W11 grip and traction is just the best. It can accelerate like nothing else once exiting corners.

[@EvoZAGaming]

Love how they got t4 racing line perfect

[@mrt7uka530]

W11 had the DAS and the party mode

[@NOL1FEK1NG]

THIS is the comparasion we needed to see!!! 🤓

[@AgungWicaksonoOfficial]

More comparison content please

[@CloudyTalksStuff]

W11 was a pure beast

[@pork_friedrice]

What track is this?

[@leonardofrota2173]

Wich track you used to compare?

[@ph4nt0k3n]

Would be much more interesting to see the 2017-2021 era of cars in comparison. Especially how the 21 car stacks up against the 18 and 19 cars

[@samirsuleymanov2099]

What software do you use for racing tracks?

[@DenverLapse]

you've GOT to do a vid of the Lewis-Max qualy laps, 2023 Hungarian GP... pleassse

[@formulaaddict]

We are nearly done! will be out in a few hours :)

[@brian.boamah]

2020 Track Limits very so good

[@BL4K_B4BIES]

i would love to have extra infomation like the difference in track temps and surface changes. even wind speed can make a difference in f1. also tyre compounds can change year to year.

[@FastorOrFurious]

What software do you use to run these simulations? I want to mess around on it and would love to know, thank you!

[@novuki]

Industry secret

[@FastorOrFurious]

@@novuki I think you can code it in Python

[@stevePDx]

I think Bahrain isn't a good representation of each car, considering it's the first race. Maybe do a mid-season track? Like Silverstone or anything that wasn't rain affected with proper car developments. Also, would love to this type of comparisons with other teams too. Especially midfielders

[@formulaaddict]

The problem there is only Austria and Abu Dhabi as alternatives. Every other track either missed a year of racing because of 2020 or it was a rainy qualifying session at one of those years. As Austria is a really short track it’s not fully representative and we have not raced at Abu Dhabi yet hahaha. We will continue to make this format with other teams 100%

[@2sentric72]

@@formulaaddictwatching this after Abu dabi

[@apurvabhatt5600]

cant wait for Hungarian GP quali 2023

[@formulaaddict]

We are on it... it is live in a few hours ;)

[@RoyMatzem]

Those videos are good, but could be better if wasnt in Bahrein

[@prestige2063]

Low rake rule change hurt Mercedes the most

[@joncius1450]

could you do redbull like this? very interested to see their progression

[@adityawardanasujaya]

w11 grip and power was so crazy it can turn left and right easily (some of it flat out) and fuks off into the distance with that engine

[@NFG-Nero]

0:24 that's gonna be 5 second penalty for abusing track limits for W11

[@bachkrain]

Fr like lewis what on earth was that track extension

[@rexkramer64]

Hamilton went completely off track at that exact spot 29 times in 2021. It literally won him the race. Max actually overtook Lewis by going off the track in that exact same spot and had to return the position. I'm glad they're actually enforcing track limits now. I seriously feel like there were times Lewis would lock up on purpose to do big cuts on the track, Bahrain 2021 and Mexico 2016.

[@SaraivaLeo03]

Massive gains for the W11 on turn 4, since it was allowed to go off the track

[@ElementsMMA]

Formula addict really need to check their work more closely prior to uploading. The graphic we just watched showed the 2022 car as the slowest. Yet the timings have the 2023 car as the slowest - which we instinctively know cannot be correct. The last video they did with driver salaries also had a glaring error, with Sainz being shown as paid both 10m, and 12m. Kind of ruins what would otherwise be quite brilliant work.

[@formulaaddict]

Appreciate the feedback really on there, even though the animations are very closely done with very precise details, we keep making small errors on the post process editing which we have to take 100% accountability for. The video is 100% correct apart from the swapped times on the graphics Thank you for the comment and hopefully it will be our last little error hahah

[@dsfdfssqdfsqfdfqsd4235]

How'd you get the stats ?

[@yenkassa]

Three scenarios here: 1. Mercedes team regressed and built an inferior car. 2. Red Bull just got better than Mercedes at building the fastest car. 3. Mercedes intentionally built an inferior car for Hamilton. What's your pick?

[@Minifliek]

2 but its less simple, RB didn't have a bad car from 2014 onwards but they did have a very bad engine. As soon as they got the Honda engine that gap closed fast.

[@Garage_Distinct_Clips]

No, the thing that happened is that regulations affected cars like Aston Martin , Mercedes’. And Mercedes needed to detune the floor of the w11. The regulations nerfed the w12

[@GeorgeVenturi]

Did I miss which racetrack is this simulation taking part?

[@formulaaddict]

It’s in Bahrain

[@ollieo7038]

Hey, what's the track ID?

[@Josh-tz9zo]

Next do the W11 vs the RB19

[@egj1975]

I want to see which could bounce the most... hehe. Some of the 2022 shots of the Merc remind me of a scene from Ace Ventura where he is in the truck and the head is all over the place.

[@yoboybruno]

Rb19 vs w11 would be a juggernaut race

[@sebastiaanburger352]

can you do one with all the cars running a qualification lap. ie Quali 3 for the Hungarian Gran Prix

[@formulaaddict]

It will be out in a few hours :) Stay tuned

[@kwwong2013]

Please make the same comparison for Red Bull cars.

[@joetheftman9619]

Proof that the cost cap worked. No more 100-million-pound updates for half a tenth.

[@arrex7]

you know what I came here for.

[@jonathanhidalgo4591]

3 seconds per lap is insane!

[@allanrvlln]

2020 really was a goated season and the last good one in terms of true F1 (when it still was the pinnacle of motorsports and constructors could try to experiment unique things) and car performance. Cars will simply never be that fast and good looking ever again. What I dream we could see is the F2004 with slicks just to compare with the W11

[@hectornecromancer5308]

W11 is really the peak of an F1 car

[@Lancista]

👉 *_W190 Turbo Diesel_* 👀

[@idontlikeformula1]

Is there a weight difference of the cars also? Almost 3 seconds behind is insane

[@MurkTempers]

How did they regress from 2020 to 2021? I know they implemented the cost cap, but if they already had the car developed, they couldn’t just bring it to the next year?

[@thehugo96]

"0:25" W11 & W12, +5 seconds penalty 😂

[@chrisc475]

The W11 is one of the all time greats. It's interesting that the W12 was over 2s slower. The regulations changed before the 2021 season to favour the low rake cars (such as the RB). Without this change Hamilton would have romped to his 8th WDC.

[@Sandow.]

RB was high rake though, Merc were low rake. It was the reduction in floor area that hurt Merc in 21.

[@no1washerezz]

i believe it was due to those garbage pirelli tyres being unable to guarantee safety with thee extremely fast cornering speeds so inevitably, downforce had to take a step back.

[@chrisc475]

@@Sandow. Thank you, and sorry for getting it the wrong way round!

[@max9877]

We need a comparison between W11 and RB19

[@gouthamkumar6062]

Can you bring the difference between speeds of W11 and the current 2023 Redbull

[@formulaaddict]

Have have that video on the channel 🙂

[@Dioums]

That’s just in 1 lap…let that sink in!

[@kartikkaushik9811]

The laptimes for the W13 and W14 are flipped, just a heads up

[@Rohitmanotra664]

W11 was a beast

[@dybmask9579]

It will be more fair compaire the laptimes after monza 2020, because FIA introduces le ECU and Engine MOD limited from qualy to race! before in qualy all engines went to maximum in qualy, or just in 2 attemps of q3.

[@mattitan9457]

the w11 is just an absolute beast not only because of how fast it is but also because of how great its livery is

[@maxthecooldude4873]

at 0:22 the w12 and the w11 went wide, i know those were the old regulations, you can go wide if you dont gain time on the corner but still

[@dankmonke44]

what was this track?

[@aidankreltszheim3599]

Imagine if the w11 was allowed to have the 2018 year old wing inlets and the 2017 shark fins. That would be so quick

[@aguywholikescomedy7615]

Don't forget purple ultra soft Pirellis

[@yasserdjbara3874]

Which track it is ??

[@josem.turrubiartes3836]

Which track is this? Or is this custom

[@formulaaddict]

It is Bahrain, comparing all the fastest laps done by Mercedes each year at that track

[@cocos6408]

The fact that we went wide in barhein at turn 4 is quite funny. (27)

[@Kevin-gx4ms]

The W11 after first three corners went into space

[@dshepherd35]

Accurate af

[@charlesthomas7372]

Nice to see the Silver tractor again 😂… W13 was really a headache.

[@misterre4232]

The w11 gave newey and the redbulls nightmares

[@Heathen.Deity.]

The second I saw the video title, I knew the W11 was going to be saying, “see ya guys!”

[@twoobliviousidiots782]

Not sure if I am crazy or not. but for the 20 and 21 cars were they not more or less the same due to covid and the regulations being the same?

[@Jcoxy2k10]

RB19 is the best f1 car ever made, it would be interesting to see how close they are (w11 vs rb19)

[@michaelthomas9802]

which track?

[@cheesycarrotsoup]

W10 should of been on this list it's the predecessor to the w11 and was on it's own a hugely dominant car.

[@kenchen704]

I like how this is peak W11 cuz the 2020 season had Bahrain at the end.

[@csabazombori9862]

The 2022 one i belive it can fly

[@razs.4548]

How acurate are these animations in real line choises?

[@pendrive_01]

Nothing can ever be faster than W11.

[@ljkoh20052000able]

This is an example of a de-evolution.

[@jamesyates6957]

2021 Car without a doubt.