Canon R7 performance with Canon RF 800mm 5.6 for Birds in Flight

[@paullanoue5228]

You are the only bird photographer that I’ve watched the has said change settings for different situations. Other than just switching from single point to zone. I like that you always give logical explanations for what you are showing. Don’t quit the videos, your input is greatly appreciated.

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Hey, thanks so much and thanks for watching. Always appreciated.

[@jean-louisrousselle1794]

Ron, there is no doubt that you are in an elite category when it comes to capturing B.I.F. Thanks for sharing the set up which you use to work your magic. Keep up the great work.

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Wow, thanks! Hope you are well and looking forward. Ron

[@zephalu]

My husband and I really enjoy your videos and appreciate your menu tips. We have become a lot more comfortable with the menu since watching you and following your tips. Thanks for your guidance.

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

You are so welcome! Thank you for watching and commenting.

[@nordic5490]

Great advice on the Zone AF. I just tried this on my R5 + 100-500 on some birds. The box zone focussed faster and ignored the back ground. Thanks

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Glad it helped and thanks so much for watching.

[@billmartin1010]

Panning against a water background or distant blurred out foliage masks the rolling shutter extremely well! Bravo! The results would definitely be different against a background of identifiable trees or water grasses. You chose your angles well. And with enough sunlight, the R7 can stand up against just about any camera for bird photography. Part of bird photography is choosing the right angles at the right location with the right light. Great images!

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Thank you very much! You are correct. If the background would have been closer I would have used mechanical shutter. But given the shooting location I was able to take advantage of the better EV performance by using electronic shutter. Thanks so much for watching and commenting. Ron

[@picklebird1261]

Ron, You have a better handle than anyone I know of how to match all the various combinations of different Canon camera shooting options with the various telephotos to get the best out of any shooting combination in a situation. I think you have a special skill in understanding the differences in the various focusing options of the different cameras so you can maximize their ability in a situation and I think that few photographers understand the various focusing systems to the level you do. Kudos to you! I am constantly amazed at the pictures you get! Catherine

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Wow! Thanks so much. Your comments are taken to heart and much appreciated.

[@Chris_Wolfgram]

When I first saw this, I got all excited, because I shoot with an R7 + an 800 too ! But wait, my 800 is a $900 F11 :) lol Fantastic combo for perched birds, which is actually what I prefer, and do the most of... One thing I will say, is that those kites have a white head, and a very contrasty eye, which probably helped a lot. Try this with a bird with a black head, and a dark eye. This makes it tough, even with perched birds. As expected though, your shots looked fantastic ! I'll get one of those lenses, just as soon as I can afford it + a sherpa to carry it for me :) lol

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Ha! Actually, the lens is surprising light for what it is. Nothing like the "old days" of 16 lbs. lenses. Make, no mistake you can use the 800 f/11 for birds in flight, just don't expect to do it in poor light or to get nice creamy smooth backgrounds like the faster lenses can provide. Thanks so much for watching and commenting. ron

[@TheMrNeffels]

The R7s "rolling shutter problems" are really only an issue with small "bush birds" in my experience. Ive photographed larger flying birds, running deer, etc just fine in electronic and use electronic 90% of time

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Hey, thanks so much for adding your experiences to the conversation. Always great. Ron

[@martinpettinger]

Hi Ron 😀 you are always appreciated in this part of the swamp.... !!!😄😄😄 Keep the videos coming ... always informative and entertaining 👍

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Hey, thanks. My only goal for doing videos is to try to provide at least a bit of information that someone finds useful.

[@eskay2250]

Oh lol Ron...I read your desvriptions! Intterested in the settings used and I loved your Swallowtail Kite images (hope this makes your ego feel a tad better) . Thanks 😎

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Ha, thanks so much. I was being facetious with all of that and I see you caught on to that. Thanks for making me smile. Cheers, Ron

[@danwhitton7966]

How were you metering your subject to not blow out the white feathers? Spot with Exposure compensation or Evaluative/ Matrix? And were you updating your metering throughout the different shoots, or leave it alone? Also, where is the setting to turn off IBIS in the camera body on the R7? I know you can turn it off on most RF lenses, but that is for the lens.

[@Marleydia]

Hey Ron, I appreciate this video, even though there is no monster prime in my future. It’s a good reminder to me not to forget the option to change settings for different scenarios. I don’t do much of that today. I’ve probably fallen into the set it and forget it camp. I basically hike and shoot whatever I find. Bird on perch, Slow birds in flight, and mammals. So maybe I’ve got complacent with my settings. I’ve yet to nail a kingfisher in flight if I’m lucky enough to find one! I’d love to see more of your thoughts on scenarios and settings with the R5 and RF 100-500 combo. I know I’m not getting all I can out of my gear! Sometimes I just don’t know why! Thanks!

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Hey, thanks for the comment. We all fall into ruts from time to time. Myself included. I find experimenting with settings and equipment combos keeps me thinking about how to do things and possibly doing them better.

[@fasuego]

Excellent video ! I can use that same configuration in the canon RF800-f/11?

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Yes, absolutely

[@allenfutrelle9090]

One of your best videos. Even though, I shoot the Sony a1 with a 200-600 with your speed harness and love it.

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Thanks so much. Really appreciate you watching and commenting. Glad you like the Speed-shooter.

[@mvp_kryptonite]

Great video. Please I encourage you to continue making these videos. As a few have mentioned already, the information packed in is fantastic! One shouldn’t be afraid of controlling shutter mode, IS+IBIS, eye and tracking along with which AF case. I wish Canon would have parity in their button customisation between their bodies where appropriate. Some key ones missing from the R7 when it doesn’t need to be

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Hey, thanks so much. I was being facetious when I said I may not make any more videos if I did not get more subscribers. It was a way of getting folks attention and asking people to subscribe. If you don't ask you generally don't see much happen in that regards. I agree about button customization and other things when it comes to parity among bodies. Sometime I do not this Canon puts enough emphasis on this. I really do not see why Canon could not have kept the thumb wheel on the R7 where it is on the R5, R3, etc. Also the "AF point selection button" needs to be in line with the other two back buttons so a person can have the 3 back buttons work like on the other bodies. Oh well. I sure do not pull any weight with Canon, so what I say will not sway anybody. Cheers, Ron

[@james647070]

Nice job!

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Hey, thanks so much.

[@boredcat7]

Hi Ron, how do you keep up and locate birds quickly at 1280mm effective focal length? I was having trouble with swallows and doves at that focal length 😅

[@lorraineanderson149]

Great advice for the R7. Have you ever used the Fv mode?

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Yes I have. I use it to allow quick adjustments of a three exposure parameters given the R7 does not have 3 seperate dials like say the R5 and R3. Cheers, Ron

[@ScottRitchie-bw9ls]

Good fun Ron. My favourite Florida bird. I like (masochistic) to shot swiftlets and swallows (I live in Australia). Lots of pics, when close, a get part of the bird, lots of clipping. The IBIS off might be the answer. Also, what mode did you set the lens in? A vid of you with the camera lens would have been fun; it must have been a beast! Could have sold a few harnesses. Finally, next challenge: the Canon 800 F11. Much cheaper, lighter. Can you use it for BIF?

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Hey, thanks. I had the IS on the lens turned off. I have the Canon 800 f/11. You can def use it for BIF. The AF is very good. The main limitation is the static f/11 aperture. If you have the light I can work very well. The overall IQ is great for the price point of the lens.

[@RogerZoul]

I can’t disagree with adjusting ones settings to best match the shooting situation one is dealing with. However, I did see the impacts of the r7 rolling shutter on your shots. You can see the bokah-fied background was slanted in several shots - that’s rolling shutter, though not that bothersome because the subject was far from the background. And you had one of the most expensive lenses in the world stuck on the end of the r7. And of course, you’re you and you do this full time (and I really do appreciate that you share your finding here). The Kites pulling up like that reminds me of how eagles and Osprey pull up after catching a fish off the water, it’s an acceleration and so the IS doesn’t like it so much. But one needs to be shooting that situation a lot to get enough practice in to be able to shoot that without IS on to get used to the shaky VF. I think a relatively few people will be able to do that just due to life situations. Generally speaking, the rolling shutter on the r7 is pretty awful. Try it on some hummingbirds, if you dare! :)

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Yep, as I stated in the video, you can see some rolling shutter in the backgrounds at times. For me, given the shooting scenario, it was not a factor. Overall, you can deal with rolling shutter on the R7 by shooting Mechanical shutter if the scenario you are shooting in will not work with the electronic shutter due to rolling shutter issues. Overall message, adjust your settings and equipment to best suite your shooting scenarios best you can. Thanks so much for watching and commenting.

[@alansach8437]

Ah, yes! The 800 5.6! Right up there with my fantasies of Lamborghinis and certain movie stars!

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Mine too. I had a chance to use a clients, so I thought I might as well test it a bit and do a video. We can all dream.

[@DAVE_WHITE]

? do you have an issue with r7 and 100-500 jumping out to another subject? There are a few videos online already and I have this experience myself.. r7 electronic mode stable subject as a birds eye and maybe 2 out of 8 shots are keeping the bird eye in focus and the other are on the background this also happens to rabbits and anything else I will not post a video link to another channel here out of respect but there are many of us with this issue.. it is like the r7 is jumping focus to something else even if the subject is stable..

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

I have not had this happen to me. At least not in a way that I would describe as you have. The only way I could try and determine what was going on with this issue would be to see your camera setup and shoot it and experience what you are seeing. There may be some setting that is causing this to happen. The obvious one is "Switching Tracked Subjects." That setting should be set all the way to the left to "initial priority." But there are others and combinations of settings that could affect this that I cannot go into here.

[@DAVE_WHITE]

@@whistlingwingsphotography Thanks for the reply Same settings on my r6 and the r6 does not Jump to other areas of the focal plane .

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

@@DAVE_WHITE Thing is, different camera different, different system. As you know, R6 is a full frame and R7 is cropped. That right there may make the AF systems react differently. I would play around with settings to see if you can remedy the issue, or you, yourself, may have to adjust how you shoot with respect to where the subject is in the frame and how steady you pan with the bird to get the AF to hold onto the bird. We as photographers still have to do our part.

[@DAVE_WHITE]

@@whistlingwingsphotography I sent you info from your contact form, I am also going to try the settings you mentioned here in this video...

[@kennethlui2268]

In this situation, rolling shutter is not bad with the R7. But it is bad shooting hummingbirds.

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Oh yes, it is bad when shooting hummingbirds. One of the main messages of this video was to tailor your set up to the shooting scenario. This includes which camera body you use and how you use it. For hummers on the R7 I would work with Mechanical shutter for sure.

[@billmartin1010]

Agreed, but "this situation" includes water and blurred out foliage. There's still rolling shutter, but you can't see it with those backgrounds. That's just good planning on the photographer's part. BIF with the R7 isn't so good against a background of identifiable trees.

[@bruceleonard3096]

I picked up a R7 to go along with my R5 and RF 600 f4 and 100-500 for the reach. I like to shoot manual with auto ISO but I’m really missing the third dial. I want to control my aperture and speed with the usual two dials but where do I control exposure compensation? I tried your suspected FV but that’s slow too when switching between speed and compensation. There’s no ring on the 600 to use either. Suggestions?

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Hey, thanks for watching and commenting. You can set manual focus ring to be the control ring on the 600mm f/4 RF if you have the R3, but no go on the R7. No sure why Canon did not include that option. I can never understand the decisions that are made by these companies. Anyway, I wish I had a great answer for your dilemma, but I do not. Not having the 3 dials can be a real issue depending on how you like to shoot.

[@RVNmedic]

Where did you get your RF 800 5.6 lens. I can't find one listed?

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

This was not my lens. I was using a clients who was wanting me to test it to make sure it was working correctly. If you are looking for one B & H has them in stock. Ron

[@thomasbednarowski1651]

Hi Ron. Is the RF 800mm f5.6 not optimized 400mm f2.8 with the 2x Tc? The outside looks like just 400mm with added tc

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Take a look at the older EF 800mm 5.6. The form factor is basically the same as the RF version. How the RF 800 is specifically made I cannot tell you, but I can tell you that it is very light for what it is and the IQ and performance it provides is extremely good. Even if it is just a 400 2.8 with 2x TC on it. It is a TC that is made specifically for the lens it is applied to. So, right there, you are going to get better IQ than if you used a 400 and added a random 2xTC. Is the quality and performance much better than going the second route? That I do not know, because I have not done that comparison. Overall, any of these RF lenses provide such good IQ and performance that to me it really does not matter. Thanks so much for watching and taking the time to comment.

[@adinew8920]

Thanks.....

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

My pleasure

[@dimitristsagdis7340]

Nice work, I have an R5 and an EF 500 f/4 and I want a second body for my EF 100-400. So I’ve been eyeballing the R7 since it was announced esp as I have been shooting with the 7D2. But I can’t decide to pull the trigger and I need to get a 2nd body by Xmas. I’m thinking a 2nd R5 as all the controls are the same but when I want the extra reach I have to use the 1.4x or 2x. Which slows things down (AF speed in particular) plus the IQ degradation. Also the R5 is about to be replaced and eventually I want to be buying the R5ii so it seems silly buying a second one before the new model is released. Generally I prefer to photograph large mammals than birds but I shoot plenty of birds in the absence of mammals. I’m saying this as mammals tend to be larger in the frame. Finally I use the camera mainly for stills. Any advice welcome. And yes I thought about the R6ii but few megapixels and the price difference with the R5 isn’t that worthy for me to compromise on megapixels and different layout.

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

This is a hard one to provide a suggestion. I agree with your assessment for the most part. I think the R5 is a great way to go for a second body given you have one and are used to the setup, but the R5II is likely to be out Q1 of 2024, so getting an R5 would not appeal to me. An R7 would work as a good second body for mammals, is cheaper, and I don't think you will see a R7II coming out for a long time. So, overall, this may be the better way to go to hold you over until the R5II comes out. I too am really looking forward to seeing what the R5II brings to the table. I would think it will have a stacked sensor and that alone will take the camera to a new level. Thanks so much for watching and commenting. Ron

[@dimitristsagdis7340]

@@whistlingwingsphotography Tnx for your lights

[@dimitristsagdis7340]

@@whistlingwingsphotography tnx for your lights. I tried yesterday an R7 side by side with my R5 mounting the EF500 f/4 with and without the 1.4x from a tripod with a wimberley head and using a small stationary teddybear as the subject, and the R7 results didn't impress me. The R7 eye-AF missed the eye a couple of times, and sensor is not as good. Plus I have to deal with different button layout, 2nd wheel problematic. Of course for the R7 price point, it is fantastic. But I think I will go for a second R5 body.

[@brucegraner5901]

Beautiful job tracking the kites. I rented an R7 and 600mm f11 for a couple of days and was generally impressed with the camera and lens. I felt like some of the reviews of rolling shutter and shutter shock might have been exaggerated a bit and I really liked the 32-meg sensor. I tried the electronic first-curtain setting and shutter priority with floating ISO and it worked pretty well. Was surprised at how camera false-confirmed eye detect a few times on a static subject but was impressed enough overall that I will keep an eye out for an R7 Mk2 while I wait to see if Lumix will offer a G9 Mk2. I subscribe and enjoy your content.

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

Hey, thanks so much for your comments and for subscribing. Always good to hear other photographers experiences.

[@billmartin1010]

Bruce, with electronic first curtain, there is no rolling shutter. What everyone is complaining about is the rolling shutter in electronic shutter mode. In that mode, the distortion is pretty severe when panning or shooting a fast-moving subject.

[@brucegraner5901]

Bill, thanks for the info. Are there any drawbacks to using first curtain electronic flash on the R7? On my G9 I've been using mechanical and electronic. Using the electronic first curtain, I thought, was one of the setup instructions offered by WWP but that might have come from another source. I also seemed to have better results by using eye detect with what I remember as being a + shaped focusing pattern on the R7. However, I only had two days with the camera. @@billmartin1010

[@alansach8437]

I am amazed how a camera will just come out and folks will immediately start talking about waiting for a Mark ii! Anyway, I agree on rolling shutter. Maybe it's my photo style, but I have had the R7 almost a year and taken thousands of images. I have seen noticeable rolling shutter in about a dozen. It will occasionally show up in one frame of a burst, but other nearly identical images in the burst will be fine. I initially shot only mechanical because I was terrified by all the reports of rolling shutter, but quickly switched to almost exclusively electronic due to the earth shattering (and bird scaring) sound (and occasional blur from shutter shock) of the mechanical shutter. Been very happy with images I have gotten with the R7. ISO performance has been better than expected as well. Crop ability is amazing!

[@brucegraner5901]

I agree with you. The R7 is a good camera as is but could have been (or may become) a great camera with just a few improvements. Given the money I've seen invested in bird photography in the field I think Canon could have charged almost a grand more IF they had straightened out the rolling shutter (try electronic first curtain and let me know what you think) and built a quieter and more refined mechanical shutter. @@alansach8437

[@jonzmoviebar7580]

I cannot fathom on how turning IS off (IBIS and IS are dependent, you can't deactivate one or another) could improve shots. In my experience, especially with the R7, turning off IS is just worst since large focal will magnify the frame by a lot and the shaking from your body holding the camera will be transferred to the camera/lens, therefore shaky footage/photos

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

High shutter speeds take a way a lot of shake. When shooting 1/8000s shake is greatly nullified. In the shooting scenario I portrayed in this video the birds movement patterns also dictated to me to turn IS/IBIS off. As I explained, if the bird make a quick upward or downward movement and you make that same movement the first reaction of the IS/IBIS is often to counter that movement. This will keep you from being able to to track the birds. Overall, one of my messages in the video was to be willing to change your settings (including IS/IBIS) to best fit the shooting scenario you are currently in. Do I always turn off IS/IBIS, nope. When shooting slower shutter speeds I certainly leave it on. Cheers, Ron

[@alansach8437]

I shot thousands of images on a falcon next this spring using the R7 and a 500 f4 + 1.4 teleconverter on a tripod with a gimbal head. At first I left IS/IBIS on because I was doing a lot of panning and sudden movements to follow the birds. While my images were good, very usable, they weren't quite as "tack" as I wanted them. I shut off IS/IBIS and saw a tremendous improvement.

[@tatesue]

So why couldn’t the guy get good pics with the same equipment? Camera settings? Experience?

[@maximme]

yeah, he didn't say what happened with the Owner who complained. BUT for me, the R7 has a tendency to SEARCH and hunt , AFTER it had already found focus. Just tap the AF button again and it will go to infinity. Even though image is already nearly focused...

[@DAVE_WHITE]

lots to learn in these little computers they call cameras now ..

[@tatesue]

I have trouble with it searching too

[@brandesd]

Seriously... guy had trouble getting good pics with a $17,000 lens!?!? 😵‍💫😳

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

After looking at a lot of his images, it was mostly due to the atmospherics he was dealing with. A lot of heat shimmer and with that much focal length heat shimmer can be a killer.

[@Michael-ps7ji]

Any thoughts on red dot sights?

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

I personally do not like them. For me looking through the viewfinder is everything as it allows me to see the AF actually bring my subject into focus. I just can't get past not being able to see what the camera system is actually doing. This also includes how IS/IBIS is acting and what the exposure and composition looks like in real time. Once of this is available when looking through a red-dot. For some people, it is a great asset as it allows them to find the subject much easier and not have to deal with such small fields of view. So I do understand why some folks find them useful.

[@Michael-ps7ji]

@@whistlingwingsphotography thanks so much for the reply! I just bought one and I am going to try and use it with live view on the back screen. I guess it just takes a lot of practice to nail small birds with the viewfinder! That's why you're the pro!

[@edkaminski6355]

I don't see where you are getting 1280mm. An 800mm lens with a 1.4x is only 1120mm. If you are using the infamous 'crop factor-pretend the focal length is longer' interpretation, then I can see a "pretend" 1280mm. But then ANY camera with the same size CMOS sensors would also have the same effective "focal length". If a digital Hasseblad had the same sized sensor units, then it too would effectively shoot at 1.6x the nominal focal length of the lens being used. I hate the "crop factor shenanigans" idea. But great content as always... I will try some of your techniques . Birds in flight are always difficult at best. Did you use a tripod for the Kite videos, or are they quasi hand held with your harness? They look VERY smooth in tracking the birds.

[@whistlingwingsphotography]

When you put a lens designed for a full frame sensor on a cropped sensor camera the focal length is changed by the factor of the crop. This is why many bird and wildlife photographers turned to crop sensors; to get that extra reach. It is not "pretend" in my mind. It is what it is with respect to realized focal length as it certainly is not 800mm. Anyway, I was using my Speed-shooter harness system when I shot the video footage. Cheers, Ron

[@kvppvk]

Be warned … typical American ‘life history’ intro: five minutes to get to the set up. 🙄 sorry … he’s still going … it was six and a half minutes!