Who Won The Battle For Azeroth? - Alliance VS Horde

Sylvanas left, the conflict is over but who won the battle for Azeroth?
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So the conflict had ended, Sylvanas left and is now working with the jailer. But what actually happened to the Battle for Azeroth and who won - the Horde or the Alliance?
In this video I briefly cover the history of BFA and then I talk about the events that occurred after the battle at the gates of Orgrimmar, the Saurfang mak'gora and the armistice signed.
Talking about the casualties suffered by both factions, the warfronts - battle for Darkshore and the battle for Stromgarde and their outcomes as well as what ultimately happened to the Horde and the Alliance.
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[@Doronsmovies]

Briefly covering the Battle for Azeroth and talking about the outcome of the conflict. Despite Blizzard confirming some victories who do you guys think got the better end of the war? Also if you haven't checked out the second channel Doron's Academy it will be relaunching very soon. - Second Channel: bit.ly/SecondChannelDoron

[@wexgaming7240]

well it should be horde because if the horde had all of its commanders together instead of baine and saurfang and others being againgst sylvanas they would have won because for example saurfang s horde had an army and when he was talking to anduin and anduin did say that he doesn't have a lot of troops left and that they can easyly get wiped out and also sylvanas also had an army so if the horde was as I said I belive the horde would win and don't forget about sylvanas s powers and imagine what else she can do since she has always been pretty strong even when she was on arthas s side so her power plus the jailer s power she could kill tons of soldiers since she killed a lot of soldiers in the trailer with just one scream and she blew up a siege tower with only one arrow and also alliance did lose a lot of troops while they were in capital city while the horde didn't lose any in darnassus so that's why anduin said they don't have a lot of troops because of these losses

[@sseb7846]

Definitely not the players/subscribers lol.

[@jmcghane]

You ain't lying.

[@KingNoob308]

Haha best comment

[@thebigidea9659]

Sylvanas won the war while the Alliance and Horde destroyed each other.The Alliance lost Darnassus and wont be able to fully reacquire the Lordaeron capital city because of the blight.The Horde gets dragged into another war at the whim of yet another evil warchief and now have to remake their political structure to prevent it from happening again. Both sides suffered countless casualties including the loss of their naval forces.Neither faction won this war because this war was ultimately pointless and never needed to occur.

[@MOo8996cz]

Fits for the whole expansion. It was all forced

[@twilighthammer2785]

Well at beginning it was for azerite

[@pensador6953]

this^ .Also to add, Death won, that's what, on top of weakening the contenders for protectors of azeroth, bolstered it's own strenght with the souls lost in this war, anything either side aquired was nothing more than a participation trophy, and completely worthless compared to the souls themselfs along with the weakening factor, that one would be a victory in and off itself, so yeah....Azeroth is in serious trouble, to put it mildly(extremely).

[@badrinath5306]

Yeah not like they gained complete indomitable authority over an entire continent while still retaining past territories r something.oh with yeah the alliance still has its position in kalimdor while now being the ruler of all of the eastern kingdoms except quel thalas

[@pensador6953]

@@badrinath5306 yeah that would be an advantage, if it wasn't relatively pointless judging by what is coming their way, death itself, they got resources, they got land, they got weapons, they got buildings,...but how about the people? The soldiers, the farmers, the pilots, many dead and in something's clutches, one can only imagine, resorces require workers, souls is all that death needs, and if more people die, more for death to take, not saying they can't turn it around, but boy Azeroth will have some trouble in this.

[@vasilisgorgogiannis5517]

The Alliance won actualy because they defeated Horde in both warfronts, they sunk the Zandalari fleet and they killed many Zandalari boses and king Rastakan, Sylvanas left the Horde and now we have to hunt her in the Shadowlands and Varrok the great Orc general is dead... But the Allies lost a lot of troops in the process and it would be difficult for the N.E to rebuilt their capital.

[@thebunz7]

Everyone lost. I feel like I need a shower after this expansion

[@Irken_Invader_Zim]

Bruh life itself lost

[@ОбальдМногострельный]

I hate Blizzard. Again they set the Horde as the second villains. They repeated Pandaria ... and people did it.

[@kou7191]

There should have been 3 factions from the get go, because unlike the Alliance the Horde has always been split between those following Thrall's Horde, which would be the true morally grey faction, and those that want to play as the villains.

[@radudancoroian5169]

@George Marros you really dont know lore

[@radudancoroian5169]

@George Marros not at any point the horde itself was evil or "bad guys", as in the past Blizzard has portraited all the factions to follow their personal intersests. Some races of the horde were portraited as more barbaric while on the aliance side it was underlined more coruption to various factors. Post 3'rd war where the orcs had escaped the demon influenced, there were not big conflict created outsider of the MoP, which was a good soryline. Bfa was really a victim of bad writing as there were so many characters from the aliance that at multiple ocasions had attacked without real provocation, but they said "screw it, Sylvainis is big bad die". I will not include the smaller war crimes as there are plenty on each side. Saing the horde is evil is terrible false as we have characters like Thrall who saved the world in Cata or Baine.

[@radudancoroian5169]

@George Marros I still dont see where the "bad" is, as besides Garosh there are not many "bad" people in the horde, while the majority of the raid/dungeon plots revolver around aliance memebers smoking weed. Just because one civilization is more barbaric doesn't equal to evil, and saing that the horde didnt stood up when someone messed up its also false.

[@heymynamesaidan7918]

Horde is more of a morally dark grey than a grey

[@linkzellda]

I don't like that the Alliance is portrayed as incompetent during the war. They could use their Airships to invade Lordaeron and Orgrimmar.

[@ivan.a.p]

And vindicar is afk....

[@curts7801]

I’ll say, I don’t trust the efficacy of massive super weapons. Archimonde showcases in WC3 that powerful magic can decimate impenetrable super fortresses easily.

[@hck6684]

Alliance won indeed. I was trying to tell this to my in-game Horde friends but they dont wanna listen

[@cabrondemente1]

Maybe in lore, but from a players perspective the Alliance has been a second thought since Legion.

[@exanimato6586]

@@cabrondemente1 Whel, we are talking about lore, no subjetive perspectives.

[@Mengeneful]

I love alliance bias in wow fcking blizzard always do this to horde

[@requiem1123]

@@user-iy5sg2rn4x you think the horde helped the alliance in a battle between the alliance and the horde?

[@ArnoldTeras]

I think the Alliance "won", but it was a very terrible victory, and the night elves lost most of their race and civilization, and have yet to get any real resolution or justice. Thanks a lot, guys. :(

[@astrealove1]

Lorewise I'd say that the Alliance won... however in the sense of PvE, the Horde won.

[@KoaFidCZ]

Azerite isn't "no apparent reason" I feel it's pretty big to make a war about control of nuke

[@BambiBreaker]

Exactly lol

[@newfacepaula]

is it me or when the moment Blackhand died, every major war the Horde (kinda) always lose.

[@Chris-ve1st]

Blackhand won the first war only because the whole horde went against one human kingdom. After his death Orgrim showed how good leader he really is when he led the horde against lordaeron, ironforge, the high elves, and all the other human kingdoms aswell and still would have won if not for Gul'dans betrayal.

[@newfacepaula]

but still Doomhammer's reign is going swell until he left the Amani trolltribe to fend for themselves against the High Elves and sent nearly half of the Horde troops to hunt down the Shadow Council in Tomb of Sargeras... which is the fatal blow to the Horde. Ner'zhul on the other hand went batshit insane the moment he realized that he is talking to Kil'jaden and Gul'dan's insane knowledge Thrall and Vol'jin sucks at all. Garrosh's reign could have been the second(?) coming of the might of the Horde but blizzard said nope!!!

[@Chris-ve1st]

@@newfacepaula I like thrall. In warcraft 3 they established his character as the last hope of horde. Wise, charismatic, young strong leader, who's willing to end the bloodshed between the horde and the alliance. He was the one who saved the horde from the scourge and the burning legion by leading the horde to kalimdor. But for some reason later they decided to make him a bad leader who let his people starve to death inside their own city. I guess this was the introduction of Garrosh as a new, better warchief. But then why turn him into a villain? Then repeat it in bfa. Horde lore sucks since Mop. Change my mind.

[@twilighthammer2785]

Chris and he is bald too

[@badrinath5306]

Third war ending the horde won against Derek while thrall won the starting one.Howevee this was well balanced still as Alliance gained new territories as well such as theramore.After that biased WoW was written and horde never fought like that ever again. Derek: I am surprised you loathsome beasts haven't turned on each other yet.can your blood atone for genocide orc?

[@lonefish8128]

Alliance also gained a an additional kingdom (Stromgarde) whereas horde didn’t. It took alliance over 15 years to get it back, but now it could mean they can use it to regain Gilneas or even lay siege to Silvermoon should another war begin.

[@shakirashipslied9721]

The titans, because they're sitting up there comfortably and leaving all the work to us as usual.

[@jonathan6578]

it was won by the alliance so did the 2 warfronts. it was stated by blizz in the Q&A at blizzcon 2019

[@ДэнКоч]

So, it was just a warfronts, not war at all...

[@dylanbrewer8605]

Looks like it will be a good one. Edit: it was as always, good work Doron!

[@witnessforchrist7778]

If I'm not mistaken, according to follower missions. The Horde never lost control of their various outposts in EK such as Tarren Mill, Revantusk Village, Sepulcher, Kargath, Grom'gol, Stonard and Hammerfall

[@johannessimola1615]

Sylvanas and her loyalist won the fourth war she fed many souls to the maw... so her ultimate goals were met heck even defeat of n'zoth who was the only real threat for her and jailer.

[@curts7801]

N’zoth was telling us all along too. He told us he was the force that could hold back death. Nobody believed him because ‘evil spaghetti monster must die’. I’d love for N’zoth to come back and take a protagonist role at some point. Blizzard is building up the Light to be our Post Shadowlands villain, so N’zoth might yet be the Shadow that shelters the despondent. Death doesn’t mean the same thing for the Old Gods. That is not dead, which can eternal lie; and with strange eons, even death may die.

[@johannessimola1615]

@@curts7801 void and light are as much evil as the other. They both desire only their chosen future and are prepared to do anything for it. N'zoth is boistering as in shadowlands alpha we have maldraxxus alone have managed to beat assault of Void and Light to shadowlands so I find it hard to believe void could beat maws forces which are easily strongest know force in shadowlands since all anima has flowed there from our universe. Thats h.p lovecraft quote never being used in canon wow material and blizzard have stated yogg, y'sharaaj and c'thun are gone gone so how n'zoth died he likely was sent back to the void like demons are sent back to twisting nether and far more interesting choice would be used pure void creatures like dimensius who seemed to avatar of a true void lord.

[@Skollshorties]

4:42 There's my boy.

[@Doronsmovies]

Haha, was thinking you would notice when I was recording the shot.

[@Skollshorties]

@@Doronsmovies I'm flattered.

[@stealthyspy1012]

This whole war was just a massive plot armor for Sylvanas honestly and we all HATED it. I'm thankful that we'll finally get to kill her in Shadowlands

[@kou7191]

Ib4 she gets a cheap, Illidan knock-off redemption arc

[@stealthyspy1012]

@@kou7191 she won't lol, how can they justify burning down a world tree in cold blood? At least when Illidan sacrificed his mages in the scenario back in legion he was affected and haunted by it because he didn't want to but HAD to do it

[@kou7191]

@@stealthyspy1012 Sylvy's plot armor is stronger than a divine shield, bad writing will find its way.

[@stealthyspy1012]

@@kou7191 with the backlash that came with teldrassil and BFA overall I hope not

[@superspork3975]

@@kou7191 its not really bad writing though, if we want to address bad writing lets start with how the Tyrande and Mulfurion are just always strong enough to defeat everything in front of them as if its nothing, just becasue, with no explaination. Or how Thrall completely ignored the decisions of the celestials. Sylvanas is basically just as strong as shes ever been, and its her wit thats kept her a relevant character. You can disagree that "she shouldnt be that cunning" but thats been her thing since day 1

[@_yiggy]

Why can't Jaina do the circle flashy thingy she did when Sylvanas deployed blight and just make Lordaron at least not usles?

[@jamesjohn-bf5bh]

"Horde plot armor"

[@Manowarrior1992]

@@jamesjohn-bf5bh dont even mention, no dont even think of plot armor when talking about jaina

[@jamesjohn-bf5bh]

@@Manowarrior1992 well sylvanas plot armor are thicker than any lore characters plot armor

[@curts7801]

james john Jaina’s plot armor is hella thick. She was straight up saved from the Garrosh bat. Now THAT’S plot armor.

[@KoaFidCZ]

Goal of Horde was get rid of Sylvanas, she was the threat of the Horde... I would say strategic victory for Alliance, tactical draw... but deffinitely not pyrhic victory, because it's not really a victory... :D

[@Shadowhunterbg]

Let's be honest the Horde should stop existing as a faction. What i liked about it is that i saw it as a place where the different persecuted races can go. Their need for survival changing to camaraderie and brotherhood. Bound by a code each race fighting side by side for victory. Now the Horde fought itself splinting into two factions while the Alliance stood united more than ever in MOP. Sylvanas also splits the Horde more or less into two. Loyalists and "traitors". The Alliance again... stood united. As i know it the Alliance was more numerous than the Horde, with all that infighting that faction should stop being a thing anymore. In MOP the Horde are the bad guys. Kidnapping children, destroying nature etc. while the Alliance are always the good guys. There is no gray here. Alliance - good, Horde - bad. Blizzard writed itself into a corner with Anduin. The goody two shoes who always wants to be an angel. They have the draenei - the chosen of the Light and Night elves who protect nature and balance... This faction can't get wrong at this point so if there has to be a war - the Horde will start it... again. I really was a Horde fan but now i am not. It has been ravaged by Blizzard so much that it's hard to believe in it's ideals anymore seeing all this betrayal and backstabbing. Despite the Horde chasing down the "warmongering" Banshee queen they will fight the Alliance again... for some stupid reason making all that effort to make peace, useless. There is zero continuinity. Honestly i think the Horde and Alliance should stop fighting for good and let Alliance or Horde players group and have the freedom to go into their respected capitals. The Horde don't stand a chance agains the Alliance now. Blizz can always introduce a playable third faction that will fight Horde and Alliance. For the Alliance!

[@cabrondemente1]

You don't know much about lore if you believe the Alliance are the good guys. Have you heard about Garithos? The purge of Dalaran? The night elves alone have done more damage to Azeroth than all of the playable races combined, Teldrassil itself was a travesty against nature.

[@Shadowhunterbg]

@@cabrondemente1 i know very well about Garithos and his hatred for non-humans. About Jaina and her purge and the Night elves and their quest for immortality but the past few expansions have been only about Horde bashing. You can always say that Garithos was never a part of the current Alliance. That Jaina did this solo with Varyan dissaprooving. Played Mist of Pandaria while lvling for Legion and what did i see? Horde spreading the plague, kidnapping children and destroying the land - for conquest. What did the Alliance do? It's there to save it's prince. That's it. While saving pandas and stopping Horde attrocities. Alliance soldiers do something bad but what's this? They were under evil control and that's the reason. In my eyes the Horde has stopped being the good guys after WOTLK. This is not grey anymore but Black and White. Night elves - they preserve nature and want to keep the balance. Humans of Stormwind - doing good deeds, tolerant and use the holy light. Draenei - holy space goats that are favored by the Naaru - the holy light itself. Dwarves and gnomes - practical and industrial people. Rarely being cruel. Now Horde. Taurens - a good race, like the Night elves. Orcs - want battles, can be easily manipulated. Half of their army left the Horde to follow Garrosh for the bloodshed... and didn't want other races in the faction. Mind you, orcs that you fought besides during Vanilla, TBC and WOTLK never approved others races... Undead - enemy of all life, creates plague, does experiments on living humanoids. Blood elves - unstable, addicted to magic, ready to risk a lot for magic knowledge. Enslaved the Light for their own purpose - blood knights. Trolls - are okay minus the cannibalism. Now tell me that this is not biased? How is the Horde grey? What about faction leaders? Alliance - Varian Wrynn is aggressive but always justified it with the Horde attrocities. Never cruel without a reason. He didn't dismantle the Horde when he had the chance. Died for Azeroth. Blizzard made it like the Horde abandoned him. Anduin Wrynn - Jesus Christ at this point. Now Horde - Thrall was a good leader, non-aggressive but he was an obstacle for Blizzard and their excuse to continue the war and so they put Garrosh. Garrosh - a racist, aggressive all the time, wants expansion, destroys the land, honorable at some point, nukes Theramore, sells himself to the Old Gods. Dies as a bad guy. Vol'Jin - useless. Sylvanas - practical, uses the plague and Blizzard made every effort to make her a war criminal although the destruction of Teldrassil is justified for me. Now she is the bad warchief and probably next boss to kill...

[@Mengeneful]

@@Shadowhunterbg in mop if you played intro campaign you can see even alliance has pandarian slaves

[@teostere]

So i was mind controlling the aliance Off cliffs for nothing ?

[@saffronic3026]

Stere Teodor All of my bullets, wasted on Hordies, all for naught, thank god I don’t have to buy ammo anymore

[@Dendarang]

Battle for Azeroth has been an absolute shitshow for the Alliance, both in universe and in meta sense. Starting off with the burning of Teldrassil destroying one of the most beloved Alliance zones and making Night Elves, one of most popular Alliance races, an endangered species. And after that the genocide at Teldrassil was completely ignored and just used as a vehicle for Saurfang's story and Night Elves weren't mentioned for the rest of the expansion. Except for Tyrande who underwent extremely dangerous ritual that nearly killed her to taker her revenge just to in the end lose, actually lose, to Sylvanas' underling and get zero revenge. No victories on screen to the point where devs had to confirm at Blizzcon that, yes, indeed, Alliance had won the Darkshore warfront (and Ashenvale as well but that's even harder to find). And all that so that, in the end, Saurfang could get his Jesus storyline and Anduin could give man co-responsible for burning of Teldrassil his father's sword and stand aside like a good little sidekick. And now Tyrande is getting hit with a villain bat and is called crazy for wanting some justice for her people. Out of universe it was a shitshow as well with devs showing the full extent of their Horde bias with the Allied races. Alliance got fat humans that literally no one will play and will be the new least played race, Draenei with weird tattoos, diaper gnomes, Void Elves that they pulled out of their ass in five minutes just to spite Alliance players hoping for High Elves and Dark Irons. Dark Irons are literally the only requested race Alliance got but even they were never super requested one, just mildly. Meanwhile Horde allied races have been a checklist of everything Horde players wanted, upright Orcs, Zandalari Trolls, Zandalari paladins, Nightborne, FUCKING NIGHTBORNE exclusive to the Horde and Vulpera. Vulpera are literally the first mildly iffy Horde race while on the Alliance side mildly iffy is the best we got. No cool races that would get people to play Alliance, no highly requested Alliance races, no Vrykul that would make Alliance more desirable as a faction and stop the bleeding. That's not mentioning bigger than ever population imbalance in favor of the Horde that rivals the infamous vanilla one that the devs are doing nothing about but adding more cool races to the Horde, exodus of all skilled pvp AND pve players to the Horde to the point where now, I think first time in WoW's history, one faction is absolutely dominant in both pvp and pve and you borderline need to be there for high-ish content for either of the primary activities in WoW, Horde being 99% of the war mode players making world pvp dead for Alliance, Horde getting merc mode to have the cake of being on overpopulated faction and eat it (but pve merc mode, which would benefit Alliance players, is of course nowhere to be seen) etc. Honestly I hope they never do another faction war expansion because if they do I'm not playing it 100%. All the devs, or at least all the lead devs, are hardcore Horde players that openly say they'll never play Alliance and we're supposed to trust them into making fair and balanced expansion centered around war? No thanks, getting invested in BFA was the worst thing I ever did.

[@MilanchoSt]

Such rage i have never seen...

[@Turakius]

A tricky question. Alliance actually didnt do much this war unfortunately. It was mainly Horde. Technically they were the ones who destroyed a whole city and even managed to devastate Alliances Army.

[@Doronsmovies]

I can't really agree too much with that as the Alliance did destroy Undercity as well, the Zandalari fleet and was at the gates of Orgrimmar.

[@Turakius]

@@Doronsmovies perhaps brother. Anyway I enjoyed your video. I always do :) For The Alliance!

[@stepanpytlik4021]

@@Doronsmovies It was the Horde who destroyed the Undercity

[@Turakius]

@@stepanpytlik4021 Indeed they did! They (Horde) Destroyed Teldrassil + Undercity which undercity was a retaliation from Teldrassil! And during the Attack on Undercity the Horde whipped out a huge amount of Alliances Army using Blight!! After the War you see in a Cinematic of Anduin and Genn overlooking the Stormwind Harbour. We Alliance Players lost alot of our Warriors that day especially when we also seen them be resurrected into mindless beings of undead!

[@stepanpytlik4021]

@@Turakius What I also don't like is the fact,that without extremely overpowered Jaina, the Alliance would have lost the war within the matter of weeks

[@Ychazz]

If anyone cares, the answer is Alliance. At blizzcon someone asked this as a question and the they said Alliance won both battles.

[@jako997]

I think the alliance won at the end but probably suffered more casualties than the horde. Main reason obviously is because of the night elf home being burned to a crisp. It's honestly surprising how blizzard hasn't made the night elfs or the all the eleven people in general near extinction at this point. Its like how are they still here. Arthas murdered like 80% of the high elevs ( now known as blood elfs) and the 4th war pretty much destroying the night elf home and most of it's people. All elves should be damn near extinct now

[@cabrondemente1]

Player population doesn't match Blizzard's idea of extinction. Blood Elves make up nearly 30% of the horde players while night elves are ~25% of the Alliance. Let that sink in, there's 11 playable races.

[@elihudson9983]

Lol like manpower ever matters in this game.

[@ronanchristiana.belleza9270]

We They don't need Manpower They are millions of us that are keep respawn

[@Zerathenezot]

What I love is how saurfang started the rebellion even though the war of the thorns was his idea. Everything up until the tree burning was his idea.

[@badrinath5306]

Nope ot was Sylvanus.There's literally a non game dlc just about her convincing him to lead their people into war.

[@Zerathenezot]

@@badrinath5306 read a good war. It's all saurfangs idea. Than he chickened out because muh honor.

[@fizzbrew]

Activision wins as they got to steal our beloved game and keep it on life support because they know there is no other MMO as enjoyable.

[@KoaFidCZ]

2:13 I don't think the opposite site of Kalimdor is Eastern Kingdoms, what we see in game is one hemisphere, or maybe just big chunk of it... so I would rather say on the other side of world than side of planet

[@Doronsmovies]

I agree, it was more of a figure of speech.

[@Ares99999]

I'm not a WOW player, so I don't have a strong sympathy for either side, but if I had to go through with canon information... I'd say the Alliance came out generally in a stronger position than the Horde did. The Alliance won the two massive, main warfronts, securing Darkshore and the Arathis Highlands . And it still had enough strength to send a large army to aid Saurfang and his rebels. This is significant. The Horde also had two civil wars in very close proximity, and the second left the Forsaken fractured and, realistically enough, seen as unreliable in its loyalties by the rest of the Horde. Although both factions are clearly spent, and both took hard hits, the Alliance was better able to tank the hits than the Horde, and the aforementioned Second Horde Civil War left it partially fractured. The Horde has a somewhat stronger grip on Kalimdor and the Alliance a somewhat stronger grip on the Eastern Kingdoms. But while the Alliance retaking Darkshore mitigated the Horde gains, nothing really mitigates Alliance gains. The Alliance also retains the naval advantage, as the Zandalari joining the Horde is negated by Kul Tiras rejoining the Alliance. Not an Alliance win, perhaps, but as a whole, the Alliance end the war in a significantly stronger position than the Horde. Lore-wise, at least.

[@kaelthasstormstrider7462]

Heres what i dont get. While night elves were left off fending for themselves only 50% of their sentinels, the horde is 100% THERE even the horde races from the eastern kingdoms of bloodelves and forsaken!!!! Basing on elegy, it was just 50% night elves vs entire horde! Heck why would the horde races even manage to gather trrroooops... But thats understable since 4 races of horde is in kalimdor. So they would literally have the numbers. But hey again the alliance' assault in Lordaeron all horde is there again!!! How would they amasss the entire horde army of goblins, trolls, orcs, and Tauren in a pace quick enough to match alliance who, in the first place, is IN THAT CONTINENT!!! EVEN FLEEING DARNASSUS ELVES ARE THERE, THEY COULD HAVE JUST ASSAULTED IT RIGHT AWAY, the dwarves, gnomes humans elevs and worgen are already fucking there! And yet they let the horde buy enough time to reinforce lordaeron, its not like theyre brewing a mana bomb or something like garrosh did. The draenei, fuck them, azurrmyst Isle is just a mile a way, why fucking no aid in war of the thorns, and why the fuck is tyrandr MIA the whole time! And fucking mallfurion didn't raise the forest into action like he did when he was awakend in the battle for mt hyjal! They have the terrain anvantage, everyone there in nightelven land is surrounded by trees! Yransforming them into treants would have easily demolished the back lines and just break their lines, imagine all of a sudden all treees are moving attacking... Fucking malfurion who held darkshore single-handedly with a massive tornado, and tyrande who as a priestess can call upon raining starfalls are justsnsjsmzisuskzldxhdjld xhzoznd8sgshsmxis...... Though thats why they won darkshore warfront even with a thinned numbers, add maiev who is also a kick ass

[@jamesjohn-bf5bh]

Simple dude, it's horde thick plot armor as always.

[@corybuczkowski8784]

Portals?

[@kaelthasstormstrider7462]

@@corybuczkowski8784 if it is portals, then why doesn't it work for the alliance??!?! Night elves were alone there.... Where were the other races? As far as we know, both sides have access to portals, perhaps maybe even alliance has much frequent use to it, lorewise

[@Mystra]

Neither. Sylvanas won.

[@dmar3651]

Dragonspheres Sylvannas fled with her tail between her bitchy legs. She fought against an old orc and an old human Lich. Big Deal. Come and face the Champions of the Horde or the Alliance (I.e. US) and she would have died then and there, with no one to save her. She beat the Lich King, big deal, we did that almost a Decade ago. She beat an old retired war vet, PLEASE...we beat Blackhand in his PRIME. All her achievements were from borrowed power, and ours were through determination, endurance and sheer skill. She was ever in our shadow, and so chose the easiest way out. How Pathetic.

[@VentusHarpus12]

​@@dmar3651 Sylvanas won the war, her true plan was to get the Alliance and Horde to Kill each other so all the spirits would be fed to the hungering darkness! which she succeeded she brought war made them kill each other, and even Anduin says he has enough people for one final assault, and pretty much with Varok, he had all he had with him for the rebellion. Varok may be an Old War Vet, but he did knock Anduin onto his ass! Sylvanas still killed him, during the mak'gora and yes Bolvar Lich Kind is old himself, but she still defeated him even when the lich king is supposed to be one of the strongest characters in wow's Lore! Sylvanas never ran with her tail between her legs, she brought the fight to you, she made sure she was known for who she was! She gave the Horde a chance to kill her, she gave the Alliance a chance to kill her! Both armies stood there listening to her preach about how she hates the Horde, "Beasts who how for honor" and pretty much the same for the Alliance! you obviously never paid attention! Also, Sylvanas is pretty much the strongest character right now, either she possesses power from an old god, or powers from the shadowlands! she blasted that old war vet Varok with one blow, and that old war vet also knocked Anduin onto his ass at the beginning of the Xpac!

[@dmar3651]

@@VentusHarpus12 so you're saying that her strength is purely just plot armor? Well thanks for pointing out the blatantly obvious. Again, she is nothing compared to Azeroth's champions. Only a coward borrows power and ODs on it. We never needed someone like her leading the Horde.

[@Mystra]

@@dmar3651 You sound so salty over a fictional character lol

[@VentusHarpus12]

@@dmar3651 Yeah, Azeroth's Champions are strong but even us as champions have failed to kill her! besides, I said my point, anyways if you can't understand ur just a child! I'm not gonna argue it's just a shitty ass game that I ended up quitting cause the game just doesn't have no fun to it, yeah, it's very easy to kill a pixel character when ur actually a real-life human when that pixel isn't even real!

[@kenduxbury7122]

TLDR Answer: ActiBliz shareholders walked away with the win. Everyone else lost. Massively.

[@petersander5802]

The alliance did as saurfang rebellion was on the alliance's side plus it was anduin's sword there won the battle.

[@stepanpytlik4021]

The Horde rebellion wasn't exactly on the Alliance side. It was instead the Alliance supporting the Horde rebellion. And just because Anduin's sword "defeated" Sylvanas, it doesn't mean It's Allaince's achievement

[@robertushaposan2048]

Indeed it's more like alliance is the winner, but they suffer heavy cost.

[@badrinath5306]

Did u see the cinematic??He died after thinking Shalamene was a good weapon really doomhammer would've been appropriate for an orc.

[@Mediados]

The Alliance only entered Durotar because the Horde allowed them to do so. Besides, Shalamayne didnt win anything, the scratch Sylvanas got could have been achieved with any other sword.

[@robertushaposan2048]

@@Mediados obviously horde must allowed alliance to enter ogrimmar, anduin helped lift saurfang corpse. Lot of weapons could hurt sylvanas. BUT shalamayne is special weapon, you can split it into two, and your enemies will not aware what's gonna happen. That sword is the main reason sylvanas lose it.

[@lankyeric]

So if blizz say that Ally won, then ally won. its their game... However! Horde are more than likely in the better position. Here is why. In the cinematics Varok and Anduin discuss Sylvanas army and flat out said she currently has the largest army on Azeroth. Then you have the "rebellion horde" and the alliance army. Anduin and Varok said with their combined forces they were still massively outnumbered and they didnt think it was enough, but were hopeful. So lets say worst case scenario type numbers. Sylvanas has 52% of the soldiers on Azeroth. Varok/Anduin 48%. 24%horde and 24% Ally. with a reunited horde their numbers swell to 76% of the remaining fighting force on Azeroth.

[@badrinath5306]

That is in reference to the loyal forsaken who left with her.so yeah not valid anymore considering you know a whole race not from being overpowered into almost nothing.

[@jamesjohn-bf5bh]

I disagree, she didn't have the numbers. She killed her own people and alliance armies in undercity with blight, zandalari already achieve prryhic victory against zul and alliance killed lot of them even killed their king. Horde lose a lot of their soldiers in warfront and they failed to hold their position. Horde lose lot of their armies again when azhara use tidestone. Infact the horde armies split into two, and the rebels are so few in numbers. So alliance still have better numbers than the horde and the armies enough to final assault. Alliance still have the biggest army But we know sylvanas and blight is like bread and butter, that worries anduin and saurfang.

[@lankyeric]

@@jamesjohn-bf5bh I mean you can disagree all you want... but the cinematic I'm talking about is the one that takes place the night before they approached the gates of ogrimmar. So.... for you to be right, that would mean the cinematics would have to be wrong

[@jamesjohn-bf5bh]

@@lankyeric I also talking about that cinematics. They said about sylvanas threat not horde numbers. Because if we see the lore, lot of race in the horde is low in numbers. That's why horde theme always about survival. The alliance have great numbers because humans are great in numbers. If the cinematic talking about numbers, well that's mean wow fucked the their own lore.

[@curts7801]

james john they do mention in the cinematic where Anduin recruits Saurfang that the Alliance is completely spent. They were really concerned that they would outright lose to Sylvanas. The Alliance TECHNICALLY won all the major battles, but they were so costly that they were counting on the farmers as their backup plan. This fits the text book definition of Pyrrhic Victory. The Horde TECHNICALLY lost all major objectives, but they pulverized the Alliance’s resources into the ground. Both lost pretty hard, and so we can safely say that everyone lost the war.

[@DollanFerinal]

Does the Alliance ever lose? Come on breaking the stasis of wow? That would require thoughtful writing

[@theunknownpersonism]

They lost the first war

[@Reblobler]

Sylvannas won

[@ExelArts]

Isn't it obvious all of us! As this expansion is almost over!

[@kaizoulol]

ExelArts technically half the expansion is left

[@ExelArts]

@@kaizoulol kinda true since it was cut short

[@robertushaposan2048]

I think the alliance is the winner, but they suffer heavy price. Sure the alliance help saurfang's supporter, but saurfang's supporter only few in numbers than the alliance, and the alliance did the greater fight. So the alliance is the winner. Even though i still think sylvanas is the true winner in this blood war.

[@stepanpytlik4021]

Alliance isn't the winner

[@robertushaposan2048]

@@stepanpytlik4021 hmm actually they are the winner

[@stepanpytlik4021]

@@robertushaposan2048 How so?

[@robertushaposan2048]

@@stepanpytlik4021 i already write it in your comment 😊

[@redhairmagneto1642]

@@stepanpytlik4021 you clearly dumb right?

[@Viper69618]

How are night elves even alive at this point first horde destroyed ashenvale then burning legion did the same to felwood, hyjal and nordrassil then naga killed every remaining elves in azshara coast, then cataclysm happened and flooded whole feathermoon and now sylvanas conquered darkshore and burned darnassus/teldrassil. At this point there should only be like 1000 night elves left.

[@vasilisgorgogiannis5517]

The female N.E probably gave birth to new children born so they can restore their loses.

[@CuthiePatootie]

You nailed it.

[@Xenowarrior92]

Ofc you can replenish manpower within a few years...just build more barracks duh!

[@BuriedAlien-TRN242]

Blizzard lost the war.

[@architagorico]

Who won? Easy, Blizzard!!

[@Dimamlavets]

Alliance have always been stronger than the horde in the lore

[@lokischeissmessiah5749]

They have never won a war against a united horde

[@Dimamlavets]

Loki Scheissmessiah LoL dude Draenei alone can beat the whole army of the horde. Just look at Legion for example, how many times Draenei used their spaceships to obliterate demons. They could do the same thing to the whole horde army

[@happybalint]

Thats only because they are greater in numbers

[@lokischeissmessiah5749]

@@Dimamlavets all draenei ships are good for is crashing. Where is your lore that the lightbound ship can destroy the horde? It barely took out any demons, just blasted a few walls here and there for the heroes to get through

[@lokischeissmessiah5749]

@@happybalint the alliance are greater in numbers. Humans and night elves alone are a higher population than the horde combined. What greater numbers could you possibly think the horde have? The entirety of the orcs managed to fit on lordaeron ships to escape to kalimdor, the tauren are a near extinct race, the darkspears are a near extinct race, the blood elves are a near extinct race, one small cartel of the goblins..etc etc.

[@For_The_Horde]

Let's be real for a sec. Every single time the Alliance and Horde go to war the Alliance ends up in its last ropes while the horde is doing fine and it's only when the Alliance gets help from inside the Horde (Vol'jin & Saurfang) i.e. Plot armor help that they finally get to finish the war in a draw. Truth be told if the Horde wanted to wipe out the alliance with no second chances, change of hearts or story bs that makes us the bad guys and has us help the enemy then the Alliance would be gone. In BfA the Alliance was down to sending farmers while the Horde still had a massive army. Besides in history nations go to war all the time that doesn't make the one who starts it a bad guy #Garroshdidnothingwrong needing food and lumber to survive and not wanting a hostile enemy in your back yard is a pretty understandable reason to go to war. After all the alliance did make slaves for the Orcs for decades. That's true bad guys stuff right there. The Horde has the best Spell casters the best warriors and the most experienced generals. So to recap The Horde is the winner because the alliance survives at the Hordes mercy. And the true bad guys are the ones who think they're on a holy mission for the light while making slaves of the guys who have a different skin color. FOR THE HORDE!

[@Q8Bart]

The Jailor won :)

[@yurikawauchi5935]

Silvanas win the alliance scared about her power so they united forces with the other horde side to try beating her and in the end everyone loses

[@kingofthehoopers]

How about jailers power in sylvanas? without it only azeroth would clap the horde with or without alliances.

[@yurikawauchi5935]

did she fight all fights ? The horde army was stronger than alliance army u can see in all cinematics the alliance cant hold for long so they try find a option to end the war

[@kingofthehoopers]

The horde is strong, sylvana is strong. They united forces, yes but doesnt mean they are afraid to fight but because azeroth only had men with armors. So it is an unfair win for azeroth. Because the horde is muscular

[@kingofthehoopers]

They wanted to destroy the horde together because they are trying to rule the world. So they allied each other

[@kingofthehoopers]

There is always an option for anything to win, study more kiddo

[@Kalibby22]

who won? no one. we all lost

[@cleverfoxseer7023]

Friendship?

[@Irken_Invader_Zim]

Its funny how the writers are Alliance bias but the playerbase and the rest of the developers are HORDE, Everyone plays horde nowadays and the only thing the Alliance has is just lore and thats it, 66-33 Horde - Alliance ratio is self explanatory with the current state of that pathetic human faction

[@onesidedunpure109]

BFA was BS , seriously because of the peaceloving "rebels" the horde became weaker I loved how garrosh and sylvanas wanted the horde to endure by leading them to their deaths but at desame time bolstering their armies the horde byfar is the most strongest or would have been the strongest if it wasn't for the interference of those peaceloving mongrels that called themselves "leaders" cough cough ....voljin cough baine....cough cough saurfang WoW is becoming not interesting and unique because if some of the villains would've won we would have gotten more expansions I had High hopes for the BFA but it was a big disappointment they made thrall dumb and a pussy . Thrall wanted war at ogrimmar while saurfang wanted to sacrifice himself so that there would be no massive casualties

[@chrissnyder8415]

What makes you think the Battle is over? Welcome to The World of Warcraft, I see it is your first day here. That's cute......you think it is over.

[@jamesjohn-bf5bh]

I believe the battle is over. Not alliance and horde conflict, or battle against third parties. But blood war is over, that's the point of this video.

[@adamka3219]

The true winner is sylvanas.

[@stepanpytlik4021]

In my opinion, the Horde is the main victor. The Alliance has suffered far higher casaulties and has lost more battles than the Horde. And to make the things even worse for the Alliance, without the Horde rebellion the Alliance probably wouldn't have even been able to defeat Sylvanas

[@uniackesummers5948]

Also the alliance now has strong divisions in their ranks

[@robertushaposan2048]

Remember horde lose lot of their soldiers to in the undercity, sylvanas blight also killed her armies. Also in warfront horde already lose. Horde lose again in zandalar, even lose their king. I think without alliance and anduin supporting them, the horde rebels will never survive, heck even exist. Remember there are only few horde rebels. Infact horde itself split into two forces, their numbers split into two, that's why saying that the horde is winner is wrong for me. But still both suffer heavy loses.

[@stepanpytlik4021]

@@robertushaposan2048 At Undercity Horde didn't lose many troops and they were also evacuated. In Zandalar, it was only pyrrhic victory for the Alliance. And now, it is the Alliance who is being divided

[@robertushaposan2048]

@@stepanpytlik4021 actually they did lose great numbers, and combined with the blight they need new armies, that's why they recruit zandalar. Zandalari lose more than you think. After conflict with zul, they must face invaders and lose their ship easly because alliance bombs. I will not call it pyrrhic. About divided thing I doubt it, their target is sylvanas, not the horde anymore.

[@stepanpytlik4021]

@@robertushaposan2048 The Alliance suffered FAR higher losses. Early on in the war, the Horde definitely had the advantage and went to Zandalar in order to get naval dominance. Alliance went to Kul Tiras in response but we know how that went. The Horde delivered many blows to the Alliance and the only thing that truly changed that was the Siege of Zuldazar which was still a pyrrhic victory as Alliance suffered high casaulties and lost some important characters. The attack of Night elves in Darkshore ended in stelamate and the Horde continued its attack on Kul Tiras. In 8.2 the Alliance lost its naval dominance when Azshara apperead and the inflitration of Orgrimmar really didn't give Alliance much. 8.2.5 the situation in the Alliance was dire and Sylvanas was "defeated,, only because of Saurfang who even wasn't Alliance. So who won in the end? Well, the Horde definitely came uo better from this conflict

[@ElduCraft]

oooga booogaaa

[@dbix11]

Classic

[@youngkingdom8131]

Who cares?

[@oli_thelock]

N'zoth & co. xD

[@jarlbob3191]

Who won the battle for azeroth? Blizzard of course

[@strongzelda]

Who won? ...Azeroth

[@henchlord3174]

So you’re entire video summarised in your final sentence, it was a draw? Thanks

[@Zarturael]

All the Horde fanboys triggered and whining for the most part in the comments lel ( but to be fair not all of them though, some provide some good and solid arguments for their cause). But let's be honest here, lorewise the Alliance was always superior and the Horde kept existing only because there would be no WoW without the other faction. And I don't see why people think that winning a battle/battles is the same thing as winning the war by saying things like the horde destroyed this the horde destroyed that, so what of it? In the end the horde nearly destroyed itself (yet again because they got manipulated), and survived only because the Alliance chose to help the rebelion of the "true" horde and show mercy. The Alliance won the fourth war for sure and beyond doubt and especially if Blizzard allegedly confirmed that, but The Horde survived the war and lives on with new and better leadership so it's not a total lose in the end too!

[@patriousthefallenknight3185]

Jokes on you. We all lost

[@kovacsbenjamin7960]

Blizzard, because there were millions of dumb ppl (including me) who bought this piece of shit.

[@Dovahkinn-Ussopp]

So basically Ally won yay

[@ironghost-ug2si]

Saurfang won the battle for Azeroth.

[@exanimato6586]

All wow lose.