Why Are Explosive Barrels Always Red?

[@ArchitectofGames]

Want to tell me about other videos focusing on video game barrels I didn't realize existed until it was too late? Tell me on twitter!: twitter.com/Thefearalcarrot (Go watch Ahoy's vid! kzbin.info/www/bejne/gn68dnhuodufrA ) You are now thinking about how the series of symbols you are looking at are just random shapes with no inherent meaning at all but your brain has tricked you into thinking that they correspond to sounds and ideas that are telling you to give me money on Patreon: www.patreon.com/ArchitectofGames

[@Jan12700]

Ahoy's vid: kzbin.info/www/bejne/gn68dnhuodufrKM

[@urcitenetom5017]

Have you ever played The Messenger, it's an amazing game which almost no one played (it's obviously my opinion) and sorry for my english

[@Ruboka]

are the info cards not available anymore? it would be great to link the mentioned videos there.

[@demoninblack6011]

Dont copy that floppy is a bop

[@michaelharry9317]

Sorry to be so offtopic but does someone know a way to get back into an Instagram account? I somehow forgot my login password. I appreciate any tricks you can offer me

[@Dartowl1]

Fire red, explosions like fire, so barrels that go boom are red.

[@ashtonland2029]

I was just about to watch the video but i saw your comment thanks for simplifying it

[@luizzeroxis]

Pretty sure fire is yellow

[@MSWS]

@@luizzeroxis fire can be different colors depending on its temperature

[@torthos1]

@@MSWS Also depending on what you are burning.

[@iseetheendisnear2416]

Common fires are orange (red+yellow). Although directly looking into one tells us it’s more complicated than that.

[@notjoss]

12:37 "bridge the gap of communication" meanwhile: footage of a bridge being blown up I don't always spot these visual jokes, but when I do I'm so glad...

[@jammish9802]

Fun fact: Bulletstorm origionally had blue explosive barrels, but because no one was shooting them they updated them to be red

[@blockchainprofessor.x]

Still throws me off in some games when they have blue for electricity barrels

[@MercuryA2000]

This video really reminded me of the 'What games are like for a non gamer' series by Razbuten. He tosses his wife, who doesn't play games, into a bunch of different ones and looks at all the subtle little things that we've learned. Some things are so simple it seems almost like basic knowledge to me, and probably most of us, but for non gamers it may as well be random segments of braille.

[@f2progamer80]

What wife?Are you referring to the lady he lives with?

[@MercuryA2000]

@@f2progamer80 Oh yes, my mistake.

[@Pensive_Scarlet]

Bonus fact: Metal Gear Rising, a game with many built in self-parody elements, includes exploding red barrels. You are playing, however, as a cyborg ninja, so they only serve as obstacles and hazards, damaging you and ruining your flow if you strike one with a basic combo. Instead of using them to score cheap hits on enemies, you have to carefully dispose of them with a precision cut or just stay far, far away from them.

[@treymtz]

That's so fucking cool. I love that kind of thinking and design.

[@Espartanica]

Or you could shoot them and use them the same way as any other game

[@Pensive_Scarlet]

@@Espartanica No. No you can't. Unless maybe you soccer dribble one over to a guard and then stun him next to it with a red phosphorous grenade and then run back a bit and use a rocket launcher (your only ranged ballistic options when barrels are around are a Stinger and an RPG) to shoot it. But, generally, they are placed as hazards for the player. There's a boss fight with quite a few around and I don't think the boss is even phased by them. It's really obviously a subversion of the trope.

[@OmegaRejectz]

Metal Gear Rising omegalul

[@Espartanica]

@@Pensive_Scarlet Or... shoot them and use them the same way as any other game? You do realize bosses are usually made immune to things like that so they can't be cheesed as easily? Not to mention their massive health pool. Don't act like you know everything the developers intended and everyone else is wrong

[@iratami]

For someone who is "attempting" to make a game, thinking about this kind of intuitive symbolism is helpful. Something else it brings to mind is the potential for subverting symbolism while also not making thing unintuitive. It's not as fun to play a game if you cant figure out what anything is suposed to do or if it goes completely against expectations. Finding thematic alternatives is always a good idea too

[@chrisgorgon3629]

I think you hit the nail on the head! Also what type of game are you makeing

[@iratami]

@@chrisgorgon3629 I'm attempting to make a semi open world rpg. But I'm far better at conceptualizing what I want than execution. I have some concepts sketches for the 2 main characters and some more fleshed out material for one of them. There theming is of 2 nature spirits/demigods of plants and animals respectively. Honestly I could go on about the ideas but I havent the foggiest how to do a good chunk of it as my specialty is more in the visuals department

[@chrisgorgon3629]

@@iratami ah i see. I wish you the best of luck i think you might just want to start with a fun proytype and it is okif your lnly vsiual just enjoy your time makeing what ever it is.

[@rory_person_being]

Everyone is mentioning the Ahoy video on explosive barrels, but that is not the video this reminds me the most of. "The Color of Corruption" by Razbuten is a video on this topic, mainly focusing on the purple aspect. Everything Adam Millard says in this video about health bars and purple is pretty much completely identical to what is in that video. This could just be a product of two videos being made on the same subject though.

[@hugofontes5708]

Yup Kinda hard to change what colors mean to humans as a civilization and even as a species for the sake of making a video that does not sound like the other lol But this does have a different take, since it covers barrels as a trope and a tool too, and not just their color as practical use of symbology

[@rory_person_being]

@@hugofontes5708 One of the major takeaways of Razbuten's video was that the relation between purple and corruption is only found in gaming, not in wider civilization, but that doesn't really take away from this point.

[@timogul]

I love the explosive barrels in Genshin Impact. The game includes "slimes" of various elements, Electric, Wind, Ice, etc., but the explosive barrels in the game are just wooden barrels, but through a hole in the side you can see that a Fire Slime has been stuffed inside it and is peeking out at you. Fire go boom.

[@arthurlins9413]

AM “what colors are barrels? Green? Purple?” Me, a borderlands player “yes”

[@Alexgaby15Channel]

He said explosive. So it's yellow. :))

[@indigofenix00]

The green ones are filled with poison gas, naturally.

[@spartanwar1185]

Also the newer doom games, i think atleast 2016 has multiple colors for different types of damaging barrels

[@jyongfishboi]

Green = corrosion, Purple = slag XD

[@wilsonweiseng6485]

what about the nitro crates in Crash bandicoot

[@wulfherecyning1282]

Red and orange are common motifs in real life warnings for "flammable", or sometimes anti-flame (eg fire extinguisher). It's not hard to see how "flammable" becomes "exploding", because in the common imagination a great ball of fire is synonymous (rightly or wrongly) with explosion. More interesting to me is what on earth is meant to be contained in the blue, grey, black and brown barrels in games that don't explode. Do they all contain water? Sand?

[@halfgecko3202]

Could just be empty

[@Bruh-hq1hx]

@@halfgecko3202 but why are there so many Containers there for storing air if air doesnt need such storage and transportation Methods

[@halfgecko3202]

@@Bruh-hq1hx have you never seen stacks of empty barrels?

[@Bruh-hq1hx]

@@halfgecko3202 i have but people have stacks of barrels for storage and easy transportation

[@BisectedBrioche]

"Makes us no better than Cinema Sins" -Sweats in TV Tropes editor-

[@corruleumblue3317]

The difference is that TV Tropes, in my experience, is more interested in cataloguing tropes, and teaching people to identify them for a more complete example list (making it more likely for other people to go "oh *that's* what that is" when they see a thing they recognise). Tropes Are Tools, and all that. People who then use the existence of tropes and their presence in stories as a reason to criticise something, particularly after being introduced to the concept through TV Tropes, are a) missing the point b) drawing more from cultural baggage about "copying bad" and "originality good" and "repetition bad" (the same type of baggage that has, indirectly, driven a deep hatred of the word "bluenette" into a generation of fanfic readers). Tropes are not bad. Tropes are tools, and they have a purpose, and *celebrating* that, to me, is exactly what TV Tropes is all about. That, and going "hey, this is a thing I've seen in at least two unrelated pieces of media, wonder what else it shows up in". Genre conventions are also tools, to get as much of the audience into the *story* as quickly as possible, letting the mechanics of *how* they engage fade into the background. It's a shorthand, establishing expectations. I may be biased, I credit TV Tropes as being an important early stage of my growth as a writer, learning to see the building blocks stories are made of, so I can start to pull them apart, and pick and choose the bits I like, and build something new. It's a good springboard into looking at *why* stories are constructed the way they are, across various mediums. (Then again, I was never really an editor, just a lurker, so I may be missing some nuance on that end.)

[@zynix976]

Ahoy also has a great video about the history of the red barrel in video games. Highly worth a watch :)

[@illuminoeye_gaming]

Yeah I watched that vid a while ago and it's really good

[@slickzMdzn]

was thinking exactly that

[@j-hackhammer6078]

I was expecting this comment like an R34, thank you

[@IgnatRemizov]

Yeah and it's done much better than this video kzbin.info/www/bejne/gn68dnhuodufrKM

[@j-hackhammer6078]

@@IgnatRemizov ikr, the guy could talk about a slice of bread and make it sound like the deadliest weapon out there

[@parchmentengineer8169]

The Messenger has a wonderful subversion of the "health and checkpoints before boss fights" trope. For the first two worlds, you're shown a standard checkpoint room right before the boss, and have a chance to talk with the shopkeeper about the boss. At the start of the third world, you're told that this world is like a vacation, and to take it easy. When you ask about the boss at the obvious checkpoint room, the shopkeeper accuses you of drawing patterns where none exist, and claims that there isn't a boss ahead. Sure enough, when you enter the next room, it's the exact size and shape of a boss arena, but you don't actually fight a boss there. The game then goes on to feature the exact same checkpoint room in front of every boss.

[@ZeroKitsune]

So it establishes a pattern, mocks you for recognizing the pattern, breaks it exactly once, and then continues to follow the pattern for the rest of the game? And that's...clever? I haven't played this game but that sounds really annoying and not a "wonderful subversion" at all, the way you're describing it.

[@parchmentengineer8169]

@@ZeroKitsune The game is a tounge in cheek paraody of older games, and the shopkeeper in particular is fond of mocking the player. This instance isn't mocking you for recognizing the pattern, it's mocking you for thinking a boss fight should interrupt your vaccation.

[@bryanbergmann1133]

@@parchmentengineer8169 Idk how someone could get offended by a game mocking a trope, this is a very cool idea!

[@IsabellaCV]

@@bryanbergmann1133 And it sounds even better, because the Shopkeeper mocks you because of your own error, the game told you "There is No Boss, take a break", and you still waited a Boss, you deserved it xD Pd:I haven't played the game, but because of what i just readed, it sounds like it's marvelous

[@timothymclean]

Red looks like danger. Red looks like fire. And most importantly, red looks like explosives in every other game that the player has played.

[@mjc0961]

Not in Doom! Silver barrels filled with green goo go boom. Who needs red?

[@WASDLeftClick]

Unless you’re from an East Asian culture, especially China, where red symbolizes joy, good fortune, and luck. And green is associated with infidelity and sexual desire. And yellow is associated with royalty, bravery, and holiness(which is particularly opposite to Western symbolism wherein yellow is associated with cowardice and insanity).

[@timothymclean]

@@WASDLeftClick Nah, red is associated with fire and stuff there too. But it's associated with plenty of non-fire, non-danger things in the West, too. Health care, to pick an obvious one. No culture has just one meaning for any primary color.

[@FelixHelixihare]

It doesn't help that Red is one of the most loaded colors out there. Use it as a symbol, and it's probably been used that way long ago. Life, death, decay, hope, doom, magic, rage, bravery, emotion.

[@AlbertAlbertB.]

Thanks for saving my time.

[@eldritch_whispers1654]

Ah, yes, my favorite elements: Fire, Air, Water and Sodium

[@0ctopusComp1etely]

Truly the basis of all life.

[@slavthesage5661]

@@0ctopusComp1etely Na. Y No C?

[@CptMagnus]

There is a great webcomic called Order of the Stick, which followed the rules of chemical elements. So you could indeed summon, among others, Chlorine or Osmium Elementals.

[@T4gProd]

I love the internet. This isn't even the first in depth video that I've seen, that talks in depth about barrels in video games .

[@NewandForgiven]

Xbox ahoy being the other?

[@absolutelyyousless7605]

“Red ‘unz go fasta!.. You gitz don’t know dis?

[@cherubin7th]

Hating tropes for being tropes, is a trope itself.

[@Ozukai]

What a trope that is.

[@3nertia]

No, that's a cliche xD

[@CBRN-115]

@@Ozukai similar thing to cliché

[@Medytacjusz]

hating the trope of hating tropes for being tropes is a trope itself

[@underdoug]

Well, the green ones are toxic (poison) and the purple ones are whatever that game's version of "corruption" is. Yellow ones are toxic too (radioactive) and blue ones are somehow full of electricity. Orange ones have fire in them (perhaps just oil) which spreads fire or lingering fire and are distinct from red ones which just explode (no lingering fire) but will light any nearby oil. Black ones have oil in them which leaks out if shot but doesn't necessarily light unless exposed to fire or explosions. White or Khaki barrels are scene props for hiding behind or throwing into enemies or onto switches but have no contents (other than possibly loot).

[@gunjfur8633]

Yellow and orange could also mean explosive In the Borderlands games yellow is the color of explosives

[@underdoug]

@@gunjfur8633 oh for sure, there are exceptions. I'm thinking of "generic RPG/FPS/3PS game" if every colour had to have a designation of some kind.

[@mangckyatmamon]

That flamethrower-flare-axtinguisher combo earns massive respect.

[@Shoxic666]

It was lucky for him that the heavy was super slow to react otherwise he'd be swiss cheese

[@subprogram32]

This was a neat video! I can only imagine how weird a gaming world with no established mechanic-symbols must be - as someone who never played Doom for example, I never realised those green barrels I saw in footage were meant to explode *until* you spelled that out in this review. They really do blend into the background quite a bit. Certainly, symbols make life easier for developers and players alike! XD

[@mjc0961]

I always see Doom the opposite way. I look at it, and how easily I was able to figure out that silver barrels with green stuff in them explode, and wonder why all these unoriginal developers make their barrels red. Clearly other colors work. Clearly players are not stupid, and can figure it out. Enough red barrels, let's see some other colors.

[@ZZZZordan]

​@@mjc0961 You probably understood that by shooting on it by accident / to see what could happen / an enemy shot it, but I really doubt you "guessed" that. Or maybe you've played other games with barrels, meaning that the only reason you understand it in Doom is because you've played other games Unless the "things" looks like something that can explode (let's say, T&T), you can't guess it without prior experience or assumptions, which is why red barrels full of oil seems like the best choice most of the time (just like cars exploding sound obvious even tho they don't IRL), it refers to something we know from real life Of course you can change things and most "veteran" player will understand without any problem, but newcomers might be pretty unsettled by other choices

[@EGRJ]

I think Halo tried to give the Covenant "plasma batteries" that were purple with glowing blue light, to stay on-theme. AFAIK, most players don't even realize they're explosive barrels. They also had UNSC versions (grey with glowing orange), and Forerunner power cores (basically the same).

[@eurothug4000]

great vid on how games set and subvert our expectations of mechanics in relation to colour and symbology! AND ALSO THANK YOU FOR THE SHOUTOUT AHHHHH ❤️

[@ArchitectofGames]

No problem at all, you deserve it!

[@onatgz]

because otherwise it wouldn't be "realistic." see coconut effect for more info.

[@NanoMan737400]

Cool, I just learned about this!

[@pablomonsalve3911]

I think it's because it would shatter the expectations and preconceptions of the player set by their previous experiences in other videogames

[@hugofontes5708]

@@pablomonsalve3911 congratulations, you just explained the coconut effect

[@duchi882]

*"Why are Explosive Barrels Always Red?"* *Genshin Impact* (Dragonspine): Hmmm yes... Red...

[@Insert.Oregano]

"You'll know to go for their weak point for massive damage" Was that... Was that a reference?

[@duchi882]

*Pewds* (2012): I don't discriminate. I hate all barrels equally.

[@rashkavar]

Regarding the point about health having many colours, one issue that has come up fairly recently is that health is often symbolized by a cross, as per the Red Cross. Thing is, the Red Cross is a symbol that is *heavily* regulated by international law and its use in video games is rather problematic, particularly when it's used as a tool in combat zones to extend your ability to fight. The Red Cross's use in a context of war is specifically to designate a non-combat vehicle or zone dedicated to humanitarian efforts, such as medical facilities and supplies being distributed to the displaced or otherwise disadvantaged civilian population. Slapping that symbol on a powerup that makes you harder to kill in combat is...not great. And technically is a contravention of international law. So now we have developers using the green cross or the blue cross, which is exactly the same symbol but deliberately using the wrong colour to make it legally distinct. Because no video game developer wants to be brought to trial at the Hague.

[@gunjfur8633]

I think *part* of the reason why a cross is used for health is that the it can means adition or plus, as in "aditional heath"

[@rashkavar]

@@gunjfur8633 It dates way back - the white cross on a red field was the flag of the Knights Hospitaller, an organization formed after the First Crusade. They had 3 branches of service - chaplains, military men, and "the brothers infirmarians" - healers who treated sickness and injury among the pilgrims who travelled to Jerusalem. The Knights Hospitaller are still around, in a way - a branch called the Order of St John, also known (at least in Canada) as St. John's Ambulance. They're the guys who make first aid kits and do first aid training. The Red Cross is actually a different symbol, based on the Swiss flag, both using a Hellenic Cross (the square kind) - probably in reference to the founder being from Switzerland. But it's also a humanitarian group that is concerned about giving medical help to people who need it, among other necessities. So the whole red-and-white cross symbology is very much an old symbol of healing in Christendom. That's why the equivalent organization in Muslim countries is the Red Crescent - Islam is just as strict about not using symbols of other people's gods as Christianity is.

[@LeoStaley]

I don't know how you'll take this, but I always confuse you with Game Maker's Toolkit. Captivating content with incredibly interesting, and even helpful, commentary on games, with similar voice, video length, and overall experience. But it's the kind of quality experience that is pretty rare and wonderful.

[@gunnarschlichting9886]

Saaaaame. They have similar content, in both type and quality, that I forget they are different channels. Definitely a compliment though, since I think both channels are really good.

[@ababyalbatross9016]

I only just realised I'm not subscribed to this channel because I thought it was GMTK 😅

[@carlinvoker2532]

I would love to see you do a series on the language of games. Ever since I saw Razbuten's "the color of corruption" (where he just talks about purple) I've wanted to learn more about how game designers can use this kind of short hand to make games more accessible to novices, and as an extension to teach how to play their games more "organically"... whatever that means exactly.

[@himlyk]

Because that flammable / explosive symbol is GHS an international picture system for all chemicals and products to be labeled so it is identifiable. Using that in games lets more people globally identify the markings faster. Good video!

[@commissarcactus1513]

One odd exception to the rule is Halo. The series features exploding fusion coils which are distinguished by glowing blue bits. They don't act exactly like classic explosive barrels though. They take so much gunfire before exploding that it's tough to deliberately detonate them by shooting, but grenades blow them right up. In a way they're more like amplifiers for grenade explosions.

[@underdoug]

I think that the coloured ledges could be hand-waved as viewing the world through the perception of the character who probably has a sort of inherent awareness of these ledges due to their apparent skill at utilizing them which just gets represented visually, as that's most humans' primary sense, especially when playing a video game.

[@FinetalPies]

Was Razbuten's video "The Color of Corruption - How Purple Is Used in Video Games" like, explicitly mentioned? Definitely covered a lot of the talking points but I wasn't paying close enough attention to know if there was an explicit callout. It's a great video if you like this you'll like that too. kzbin.info/www/bejne/gmaUqZZsntaYl7c

[@SupaDanteX]

There it is. No I don't think it was mentioned. But I just left a comment saying "I feel like I've seen this video before" And sure enough, that Razbuten one, is what I'm remembering. Good Work sir :D

[@qwefhj3011]

The answer lies in a caveman's mind barrel red blood red blood bad red bad barrel bad

[@kieraneadon-jones56]

Menstruation

[@doublesystem9790]

blood bad? try living without it lol

[@qwefhj3011]

@@doublesystem9790 yup blood is good but it is good if it is in the body not outside as a red pool lol

[@f2progamer80]

@@qwefhj3011 so if you see blood then it's bad so blood is bad.

[@gunjfur8633]

also: fire red fire bad

[@nah6024]

and why do I keep getting rewarded for destroying someone else's crates?!

[@unlimited8410]

Its Ea's revolutionary 'surprise mechanic'.

[@nah6024]

@@unlimited8410 I'm talking about Zelda-style wooden crates you smash to get at the money and ammo ;P not whatever EA is bullshitting us with

[@IshanDeston]

That was a super random dig at cinemasins.

[@couchpotatoe91]

He's not wrong though...

[@bryanbergmann1133]

@@couchpotatoe91 He is :D

[@RandomPerson-yq1qk]

@@bryanbergmann1133 No, he really is not.

[@sahirva5469]

4:50 "Leaving players to fumble around, just trying to work out how to damage a boss isn't very fun" Shadow of the Colossus: Unless it's done very well.

[@flyingsquid6062]

I distinctly remember watching the “don’t copy that floppy” video in grade school in the early 2000s and I appreciate your inclusion of the clip

[@jonathanfaber3291]

Essentially, tropes closer to the primary loop should be played straight, and tropes further away can be experimented on. Explody red barrels are immediately important to players, which is why they're all reddish and barrel-y. A desert that uses red and/or purplish sand instead of yellow sand, however, is verymuch not attached to the primary loop, so go nuts

[@delirious_z9987]

Be proud gamer we v made a visual vocabulary

[@benedict6962]

Not just vocabulary. Colors and symbols are the "words", but mechanics are the "grammar" in the language of video games.

[@corwin32]

Fun fact: the term for a symbol based on the function of an object no longer in use (a la floppy disk) is skeuomorph

[@Illogical.]

Thank you for explaining it in a way more people will understand. I knew most if not all of it, but I'm glad I was reminded about it, and I know, that not everyone understand these types of things.

[@dside_ru]

3:48 Um-m... Well, it is a floppy, but these icons usually depict the 3.5" kind.

[@cattysplat]

Tell girls you have a big floppy not a small one.

[@Pro_Triforcer]

@@cattysplat who cares how big it is if it's floppy?

[@EKHawkman]

I think HL2 is actually an even better example of using colour to guide the player, Valve has a great talk on how they use light and the colour blue to train players to be able to explore "open" levels, while not getting lost and unable to progress. I forget who else did a video on it, but it was very good.

[@Not_an_alligator]

Ayy it's Metal Slug @ 1:27 !! the infuriating memories of all the lost quarters from this game are flooding back to me

[@Benseer]

I'm kind of suprised that you haven't talked about terraria when you bring up colour coding and similar things. I think that it is a good example for colours in different locatioms. Almost all of the biomes have thier own colours, for example, the evil biomes. The corruption is a diseased purple area, while the crimson is a gory red fleshy area. On the other hand, there's the hallow, a bright pink land filled with fairytale like scenery, but is extremely dangerous, which is why it only appears halfway through the game. In the end, It's fine if you don't use it as an example, I don't mind at all, but i just figured pointing it out wouldn't hurt the chances it gets used as an example.

[@indigofenix00]

Also, collectibles are often yellow. Coins, stars, rings, bananas, music notes, jigsaw pieces, golden idols...it's not quite as universal as explosive barrels, but it's common enough to be considered a symbol. Shiny gold thing = grab it!

[@RayPoreon]

I was thinking of something that might work in an xcom/divinity-esque game, inspired by when one of my d&d players shot a barrel with a firebolt, only to find it was full of wine instead of gunpowder/oil. Rather than marking every barrel or explosive, you give subtle hints to the player or their character. A glossy smear near the barrel's top indicating oil, or a black handprint from handling blackpowder, spotted as either subtle details on the model or by a deliberate check by the character(in a turn-based game it could be an actual ability).

[@grr7293]

0:17 That guy is rather uncaring about about being on fire and actively being shot at.

[@glitterviolence8978]

" Spikes, Thorns, And sawblades. " Really triggered my Hollow Knight Path of Pain PTSD.

[@christosgeorgiafentis4825]

Some of my favorite games are the ones that use icons I do not know or understand, but when I find out what they mean and learn how to use them, it brings me joy.

[@XLuxtra]

Barreleology is a deep subject. From Color and Evasiv tactics tohide from enemies like the Barrel Roll to their language. It makes many years to study these wonderful creatures. However it is truly rewarding.

[@boyceernest8127]

Really well done video. I love listening to your explanations and love the way you structure your videos. I am really glad i found you

[@AntivenomOW]

15 minutes talking about why video game barrels are red... love you man! ^^

[@TheRealLink]

What a great sub-conscious analysis and explanation on some of the things we see in games, as gamers. There is truly an art and craft to good level design that not every game nails, though many are getting better at every year!

[@shr1mpleTV]

The Ori music hit a weak spot in my brain, I didn’t realise I had..

[@oneunknown8226]

I want to add to your comment at 4:52 about how adding an obvious weak spot to Zelda bosses with a big glowing eye leads to a more engaging boss fight. The prime counterexample of this philosophy imo is MM3D where they took the original boss designs and added giant pulsating eyes for weak spots, allowing a clear comparison between the two design philosophies. Instead of dynamic engaging boss fights that supported a wide variety of strategies, they got reduced to 'Do the thing that makes the eye appear, wail on it, repeat', leaving them one of the weakest parts of the remake, imo. It is of course possible to go too far and make a fight so inscrutable and lacking direction that the player has no idea what they're supposed to do (looking at you LA Armos Knight), but I feel that modern Zelda games and their obvious weak spots have overcompensated to the point where they detract from the challenge and satisfaction of the boss fight by over signposting.

[@rmsgrey]

The problem with the Majora's Remake bosses isn't that the weakpoint is shown by a big glowing eyeball, but that they've been reduced to a single specific weakpoint rather than being vulnerable to a number of Link's tools, across large portions of their bodies. It would be even worse if they had the specific weakpoints without the symbol...

[@EggBastion]

Good job giving Eurothug4000 a shoutout all her videos _are_ incredibly lovely

[@Tutorial7a]

Oh, I know, I know! Because fire is red?

[@doctorwhors]

You made an interesting point near the end of the video, about how the red explosive barrel and its ilk have become part of the culture - the shared history of games. What might be an interesting follow up topic is what happens for new and/or newer gamers who don't have that inbuilt cultural knowledge - how do they navigate the minefield, the wall of information that is thrown at them when they boot up a game? Or how does one learn the various "taken-for-granted"s of gaming (eg the trigger button on the console is fire your gun, "press x to jump" etc.)?

[@stevenstevenson3948]

3:56 Don't copy that floppy is indeed a jam and I am willing to die alongside you defending it.

[@StefanLopuszanski]

Iconography and symbology are also huge in board game design. Both to make it easier to get into but also to make it language independent. Lots of interesting things to learn about there.

[@ninja_goose4360]

Im glad you use Noita as an example because it's my favorite game and definitely worth a look at.

[@evanschulz9704]

i believe good colour and symbolism can help extenuate a character. take samus aruns varia suit and zero suit. the varia suit's main colour is orange and the bulkiness of the suit shows how much Armor she would need to go out into adventure. while the zero suit is light blue, slick and skin tight.

[@LeoStaley]

I misread the title as "why are explosive barrels always bad?" I was actually disappointed it was just a high quality commentary on easy to recognize visual cues used in gaming.

[@jinkstkittensen99]

In a game i'm making green liquid is flamable. Is it a stretch to make the explodable barrels green?

[@AlexMint]

I've also noticed that some games are trying to use things other than barrels for explosives, but people are less likely to engage with a generic gas canister like in Control until they've dealt with a lot of them.

[@oicmorez4129]

I like red barrels, because any other barrels are just barrels - parts of geometry. Red barrels however are out of place often a bit out of place and I instantly know I shoot it and it goes boom. Normally, you'd need to add some kind of tutorial for it, but now it's all just simpler cuz everyone knows what it is instantly

[@PhilTruthborne]

Symbolism has always been such a cool aspect to me and honestly it can really make or break some things to use it properly and that really intrigues me as a designer~

[@PedanticPig]

You can get a lot out of subverting the symbols too. One of the things that makes Baba Is You so mind-bending and surprising is that it breaks all the usual symbols from their meanings.

[@gerg905]

The language of games has developed similarly to the language of film. Using tilts, zooms, pans, dutches and various angles can be pretty "samey" to the point of being stereotypical. Using various musical cues and chord progressions can make music seem uninspired and cliche, but they're all well founded stereotypes that have been built up over the course of generations to the point that almost anybody with any level of knowledge cinematic language can pick up on these cues with little to no conscious thought. It is up to the creators to find ways to spice up those cliches in an interesting way as to keep audiences interested.

[@darth0tator]

another point about those tropes and video game language is, that you have to learn it...and a developer has to consider, that any game they make, could be a "first game" for some or even many people. So those tropes should be in there, so that new "gamers" have a chance to learn the language, which many of us use fluently. Like seeing many supplies in prep for a boss-fight might be easy to spot for someone who has experienced that at least once, but for a new player it might not be like that. Sometimes this language can even trick people...lots of supplies lying around -> there is a boss-fight ahead...and then there's no boss-fight

[@ThylineTheGay]

2:18 such a nice surprise to see noita, such a underrated game :-)

[@FieldOfViewGameDesign]

It's good to remember that video games have their own language, and that using it creatively to say new things is part of the fun! - Stephen

[@Tazerboy_10]

Most games are color coded, look below for examples *(Iconography / Color Theory)* : Red - Damage / Fire Orange - Waypoints? Yellow - Waypoints? / Electricity (Pikmin series) Green - Health / Poison / Energy (Stamina) Blue - Mana / Shield / Ice / Water Purple - Magic / Electricity White - Path to waypoints (There's probably a lot of examples that are missing from this list...) 9:11 - 9:17 ---> What's the name of that game? (It looks familiar...) 9:30 - 9:40 ---> Those are some great examples for elemental uses...

[@Shatterverse]

It's the same reason yellow barrels=radioactive or acid, green barrels/bubbles/etc=poisonous (in JRPG poison is sometimes purple). It's the same as Hazmat placards; red is flamable and has a fire on it. There are specific symbols for radiation, toxic, acid, etc. that are universally recognized because all humans are the same, and are vulnerable to the same nasty stuff. Red is usually health though because blood is red, and hearts link the ideas together. Loosing blood is bad for your health, so loosing red stuff is pretty intuitive.

[@KappGaming]

„Is it green?“ Doom 1 players: Well

[@kingoftropes922]

13:03 This is why I love you, Adam. And I'm not just saying that because of my username.

[@hyperteleXii]

Excellent study. Dense in practical information. The epitome of the kind of content I subscribed for.

[@alexgrd75]

Red is the alert color used in HIM, cognitive science and ergonomics. So they use red because it give the player a warning. Red is the most noticible color for the human eye it is means blood and danger. 😊

[@Kittycat-dc7xl]

Lol the saving icon displayed on explanation is a 3.5 inch diskette While you showed a actual floppy disk with the commodore And damn those things both equally awesome

[@elliotgott2993]

Is anyone familiar with the Flash game Depict One? It's a very interesting twist on a lot of these video game symbols. Green gems hurt you while spikes can be collected as ammo, for just one instance. The game purposefully toys with your expectations to keep you feeling off-kilter the whole time.

[@k1ngk4gl3]

I think 80's & 90's action films helped lay some foundations as well

[@knyte_]

The use of Akkala ancient tech lab theme from BOTW really caught me off guard

[@zs9652]

Now I want to see someone make a xenofiction rpg where none of the cultural references we use are in it. As you learn about the very alien world, you start to pick up on whay the new cultural references are telling you. Would make for a really interesting way of doing worldbuilding for the player.

[@rommdan2716]

... I want to pay for playing your game

[@samuelcrispin4228]

Well now I'm gonna have to listen to "Don't copy that floppy" aren't I?

[@Soumein]

In Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance, there's exploding barrels that are light tan and a bit smaller than regular breakable barrels. I remember finally figuring this out after maybe the 3rd or 4th one slugged my health. It's harder to notice the explosion when you're already throwing flames around. Also shoutouts to Diablo 1, with no distinction between barrels at all, and Dark Souls 3 giving you a firebomb throwing enemy to teach you the leather bound barrels go boom.

[@luissantiago5163]

Awesome. Happy holidays everyone

[@ihsaningersoll9232]

Just want to give a shout-out to Ahoy, a great Chanel who does video game amazing history/ retrospectives and has covered this topic from a historic rather than symbology so perspective

[@Daniel-yy3ty]

wait, a reference that's not a joke and actually gives a reason to go watch the other video? that's illegal

[@christopherg2347]

3:37 I heard a story of a young person seeing a actuall 3.5 inch Floppy Disk and saying "Cool, you 3D printed the Save Symbol!" Yeah, it is that much of a Symbol!

[@nyetloki]

ISO, ANSI, OSHA: what are we chopped liver? Flammable liquids in portable quantities are required to be transported in red metal drums with ISO 7010 flammable symbol on them. *Art imitates life*

[@MidnightSt]

2:10 it's an "affordance symbol" / affordance icon. "affordance" (what utility an object can be to you) -> kzbin.info/www/bejne/h3S2iXiBfbFpnMU the "save" icon (floppy disk), even though getting increasingly awkward due to the obsoleteness of what it takes its affordance from, is another example of the same thing. red barrels are meant to be shot and explode. red explosives explode when punched (minecraft) switches are meant to be flipped and buttons pressed (doom, half-life, EVERY F-ING GAME IN HISTORY EVER XD). you don't design levels by how they look (you don't put a switch in because it looks nice visually in the frame), you design them by what they require the player to do (you put the switch in because it starts this elevator and thus requires the player to do a 360 ollie double-jump rocketwhammy to get to the elevator in time to progress, thus forcing (or just encouraging/prodding, if it's not on the main progression path) the player to engage more deeply with some mechanics and their interactions. 3:15 okay yeah, i write comments first and continue watching the video later, should really work on that one, flip it around, sorrry =D in any case, yeah, again, spikes, the symbol is not just randomly chosen, it plays into our instincts of "spikes bad", honed by spiky plants and spiky animals, and all the experiences and witnessings of various kinds of impalements and such =D same goes for any other symbol - they are derived from already existing primal instincts. a good symbol finds the simplest visual representation of a concept that it can, one that can be ideally understood regardless of language or pre-existing knowledge of any kind, and uses that visual to... "trigger" the idea/concept. ...and then there's this whole huge topic of non-verbal thinking and concept-pointers vs concepts themselves, and... stuff... ehhh... i'm not sure if there was any proper research done into this, and i'm not even qualified to check, let alone do any proper research of my own, but... I am pretty sure all of those things are real things, regardless of my lack of education about who actually discovered them or what they're actually called, and thus reinventing the wheel. P.S. from the universal iconography standard, therefore, the floppy disk as a "save" icon is... well... was.... temporary, at best, from the start, and... not ideal, let's say, in the worse case,, because it requires pre-existing knowledge of what a floppy disk is and what its affordances are, even though... the concept of "saving" itself, in the meaning of storing the current state of things for the option to recall them later, was also a new thing, so... associating a new concept with a symbol derived from equally new piece of hardware with affordance related to that concept is... understandable, even if still ....embarassingly short-sighted. however I'd be curious about your ideas of what a true iconographic save/load pair could look like? is it even possible to express those two concepts visually in a way that... "triggers" the concept on a primal, instinctual level? does even, or CAN even, this "flavor" of save/load meaning exist on that instinctual level, or can it be properly understood and processed only by our sapiens analytical minds? ruminating on this... ( =D yeah why the fuck not, this is already an essay, so let's lean into it and enjoy it =D)... an idea which many people might find offensive because of their own dirty mind... but I see a squirrel collecting nuts from all around and putting them all in its ...hole/home/whatever the hell it's called. so that would be a visual representation of "into a hole/hideout/pocket/nest", and "load" being the squirrel during winter taking the nut "out" (even though not really *out*, since it's *inside* the hole along with the nuts?, but the concept for taking something out of a container, and (destructively) using it from within it is... the same thing from the inside-of-container frame of reference.... i'm getting too distracted now XD)... in any case: if anyone actually read this whole thing, thank you. and if any of those few people are actually willing to share their thoughts on the thing... please do :) and thank you for doing so. oh and btw merry christmas. we in europe already had our christmas eve, but i think the americans will start having their christmas day (25th december) in a few hours. Merry Christmas, americans! :) Please stop being crazy? A bit? Somewhat, somehow? It's making everyone else be kinda on edge... Have a nice christmas. Did you know, that... on christmas, during world war, people went out of their trenches to play football and cards with the "enemy", and those "enemies" did the same, and... ...they all kind of... realized they're all just desperate people desperately trying to keep being alive because that's what live beings do? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas_truce people... are... WEIRD. in kind of the most horrible and also the most magical ways one could (or couldn't) imagine... have a nice christmas, everyone. i hope you made some truces at least for a moment :)

[@PyroMancer2k]

The elemental view of nature comes from a misunderstanding of the natural world as they do have corresponding relation with States of Matter which is why the relationship is still recognized in symbology to this day. Fire = Plasma, Air = Gas, Water = Liquid, Earth = Solid. It's the attempt to explain something that is not fully understood. Like before gravity was used to explain the motion of the stars the scientist of the day thought some invisible material that didn't exist on Earth and was completely undetectable to human senses held the planets and stars in the sky. Then along came the model of the solar system and theory of gravity which explained it all a very straight forward way that made sense. Where as now a days scientist believe that an invisible material that is not present on Earth and undetectable to our human sense called Dark Matter holds the galaxies together... Seems maybe we haven't come as far as we think.

[@kylethomas9130]

Thank you for pointing out the Zelda eye trope, it's proper game design for a no barrier entry franchise. Aiming for weaknesses is a learned feature for hunters and gamers. If you don't expect your players to pause the game, and extrapolate the physical characteristics of their enemies before properly engaging them, then you'll need to leave clues for how they can exploit the conflict. Weaknesses, flanking, or even means of escape don't need big flashing arrows, but should be intuitive if you want 'normies' to even hope to have a go.

[@PyroMancer2k]

People who complain about tropes in games so often sound like the bottle of the intellectual barrel that they are. Because it's not just a matter of symbolism but also of realism. Taking cover is something that happens in real life when people get into fire fights because getting shoot hurts. Height is a strategic advantage and often times games give bonuses to hit/dmg when you attack from on high, this isn't a trope it is a valid military strategy that has been used for centuries and the game mechanics are reflecting that advantage. But yeah it's often dumb complaints on tropes that actually make sense to have rather than the "why do barrels exploded" that I hear people complain about because those not really in the medium only see surface level stuff to complain about more so than the symbology recognized by experience gamers.

[@Great_Olaf5]

Don't forget the use of darkness as a navigation hindrance as a contrast to light as an aid. Darkness is used to hide secrets and make horror games starker and more intense of an experience in trying to evade the horrors you have no hope of fighting.

[@caspardghost204]

9:47 Nice to see Spellbreak getting a mention in this!

[@InMaTeofDeath]

Funny to see CinemaSins still annoys people in 2020.

[@revimfadli4666]

At least a lot of the "sins" are self-aware lol

[@oldchannel2652]

@@leeroyjenkins0 The channel is still hypocritical tho, cause something could be a "sin" in one video, but a "win" in the next. Also what's the point of analyzing things that have no effect on anything besides " oh, the cup was here last frame, but now it's gone???". The channels just annoying, and I use to watch it.

[@ZeroKitsune]

@@oldchannel2652 Dude if you actually think the number of sins really relates the quality of something, you have already missed the point of the channel. It's just taking the piss. That is all. It's not serious critique in any way whatsoever.

[@oldchannel2652]

@@ZeroKitsune Yeah, I get that. But it's still just annoying on how hypocritical it can be. Also I feel like the way I view movies changed because I watched them. Like, I couldn't just enjoy it anymore without analyzing it, and I've seen alot of people who have said the same. That's not the channels fault, but I still feel like it's held at a higher degree among younger people.

[@Frog_Wizard801]

I don’t think anyone ever took it seriously, it‘a just funny for some reason

[@BramOuwerkerk]

I like how he asks the question what color explosive barrels are, while it is in the title