WHY ARE VINTAGE CLOTHES SO SMALL? Survival Bias in vintage fashion || Historical Ponderings

[@StephanieCanada]

UPDATE: while height hasn't changed much over the years, weight has. This was brought to my attention and there is a study I will link below showing that indeed weights have gone up since the study was done in 1962.

[@katypowers105]

Fantastic video, I really enjoyed it! One thing I'd like to add to consideration is that larger size items were likely worn more than smaller size due to there being less if a selection available. Smaller sizes had a bigger selection and more variety, which likely lead to smaller women having at least a couple more clothing items in their closet. This would lead to each item being worn less and more likely to survive. Where are larger size gals would have worn each piece more due to having less of a selection, and those pieces were likely worn until they fell apart.

[@StephanieCanada]

Katy, excellent point! Still a commonality today. My favorite dress designer has started only making about 20-30 of each size about size 20, yet makes hundreds of 4-12 sizes.

[@PrairieTownHouse]

These are some really interesting things that I've thought about before. I sometimes wonder if the reason why there are so many 30-32" bust sewing patterns from the 40's was because all the larger sizes were used more and worn out. I am very small, and actually have a hard time finding modern patterns that fit me, which is why I've gravitated towards vintage patterns.

[@StephanieCanada]

I am so glad to hear that you use the tiny sizes! I try my best to find larger sizes, but primarily what I find is 32-36. I love when folks love using them as much as I do.

[@ImTash]

@@StephanieCanadaYeah i wondered that too about them surviving just because they weren't used as much - same as when you go to the stores in the sales the only sizes left are the super tiny ones or the xxxxl sizes

[@lizcademy4809]

Excellent video on a topic that needs more attention. This is why you won't find vintage plain white socks or gently used nylon stockings or average-large sized men's work overalls ... thousands were made, thousands were purchased, thousands were worn to death. You will find the fancy "wedding night" lingerie, the best man's tuxedo, and the bar mitzvah suit. And if you don't understand, you'll think everyone was tiny and only wore special occasion clothes.

[@vlw4165]

You've raised many interesting points, but I'm not agreeing completely with your conclusions. Obesity rates have gone up steadily over the decades with the advent of fast food and convenience foods. I remember reading one doctor's account of his early years in medicine in the 1960's; that it was a rarity to see a patient over 300 pounds, even in a hospital setting. Another factor to remember, as my own mother pointed out, women wore "foundation garments" in the mid-century years. A good girdle trimmed many a waistline. Kids were more active then, too. No one in my generation was glued to electronic media as a pastime; we rode bikes, built forts, played running games with the other kids in the neighborhood, climbed trees, did chores. Take a look at the vintage "chubby" ads... they don't look like today's idea of heavy at all. I do remember middle-aged women who were on the stout side, but they weren't the ones wearing the (then) trendy clothes, either.

[@StephanieCanada]

Victoria, you raise a very good point. And I did indeed find a study from 1962 that shows the average weight based on years, and looking at the average weight the CDC provides now, yes indeed weight has gotten larger.

[@melms739]

I really enjoyed this video. So clever and love your sense of humor. Also, learned some stuff. Thanks, Stephanie!

[@StephanieCanada]

Thank you so much for watching Melissa! I am glad I can make you laugh. :)

[@asilverfoxintasmania9940]

So a really great video about clothing sizes especially through victorian and edwardian eras was done by Abby Cox. Larger sizes existed because over history we have all types of body sizes as we do now. A lot of larger clothes were cut down to be handed down, or refashioned until they were no longer wearable and turned into rags. A lot of the fashionable stuff was also bought by young unmarried woman, trying to catch a mans eye, and then once married and pregnant, her figure changes and then she moves into larger sizes and isn't quite as cutting edge of fashion, a lot was also frowned upon wearing. So as the ages change what they wore changes. Also a lot of the smaller dresses got put into storage and because fashion changes started happening more quickly as we moved into the 20th Century they weren't handed down to be refashioned because they were too out of date and buying clothing became easier so they stayed in attics and wardrobes.

[@annabelsheron1055]

Thank you for doing this Stephanie! Loved it and learned something new today!

[@StephanieCanada]

Thank you for watching Annabel! I am glad that I can find new things for folks.

[@obsidianrosestudio2663]

I do love talking about survival bias. I do find a wide range of sizes in vintage clothing, but the clothing I most often find in each era are more dressy/special occasion garments. These were of course worn least often. When I do find more everyday items I love the stories their wear patterns, mends, and alterations tell us.😊 I get most sad about are the shoes I find are way too big for me. 🙃

[@MisSiszY]

Not to mention the 19th century and before habit of refashioning old clothes to newer styles all the time, especially if you weren’t filthy rich. I get obviously people have gotten bigger more recently, but key things like foundation garments and the fact that this stuff hasn’t really been worn always seems forgotten! Add in Rationing times and make do and mend being pushed, and there’s an awful lot of stuff not being kept safe, but instead being extensively loved. Men’s jackets being turned into women’s, trousers into skirts etc. I think the old mentality is great. Especially pre-plastic clothing lol.

[@StephanieCanada]

So very true! Undergarments can really make a huge difference.

[@erinlempkowski7969]

What a fun video! Great points! Another thing to consider about men's clothing is that their fashion doesn't change as quickly and they are much more likely to wear things until they fall apart even if their clothes aren't handed down or repurposed before they are totally worn out.

[@StephanieCanada]

Such a good point

[@estherbriggs1120]

Thank you Stefanie, Really enjoyed your insight

[@StephanieCanada]

Thank you so much for watching Esther!

[@marlastone17]

I just discovered your channel and am LOVING it!

[@StephanieCanada]

Thank you so much! That means a lot to me.

[@paulguthrie9337]

Also - Men's clothing was often cut down into women's and children's clothing - especially suits - during World War II.

[@StephanieCanada]

Paul Guthrie you are so right! I even did a video on how to make a woman’s blouse from a men’s shirt. You think I would’ve remember that.

[@courtneywillard4738]

Survival Bias, I have learned something BIG today. Thank you! Also, I think in ye old days, as well as now, small women tend to buy/make/have more clothes because it is easier and more socially acceptable to be a fashionista. They are more likely to buy more clothes, wear them fewer time and get rid of them. If you go to Goodwill in my area, if you wear a ladies small, 2-4 even 6-8 you can find infinitely more nice, name brand, newer clothes. If you wear a 22-24 there is not so much- they tend to be lower end brands and they tend to be more worn. Not always, but typically, at least in my area.

[@shammydammy2610]

Lol...I had the "My God those shoes are small!" moment walking through my city's rather macabre mummy museum. Many of them still have their shoes on and yes, they are pretty small. But average heights here, even now, are smaller than when I lived in the US

[@annettehauler1033]

Your humor is the best!!

[@StephanieCanada]

Thank you so much.

[@ImTash]

interesting about the heights - i think it's also subjective about where people live too - in the UK there was quite a difference in heights between city vs country because of diet and disease. in 1870s in the UK the average height for a man was 5ft5 - an unflattering name for the police about from then was 'plods' or 'flatfoot' and regarded as being a bit dim becuase they hired in farm lads from the countryside who had no education but actually had a decent diet and immune system so grew to be the desired strapping 6ft humans the police force wanted. There's a random fact on a saturday for ya.

[@jessicadrakemd]

Thank you for this one!! It allllll makes sense now! ♥️

[@StephanieCanada]

You are welcome! Always happy to help.

[@emilyburton4236]

Just found your channel and I adore it! So many great tips and such good info!

[@StephanieCanada]

Thank you so much! I am actually working on a partner to this video discussing pattern sizing through the years. It will be launching on Friday, 11/13/20.

[@amber7253]

This was great!!!

[@johnettehaines6291]

I still have my senior prom dress and coat l made from a vogue pattern. I keep it in my cedar chest. I was 17 when l first started making it in my senior home economics class and 18 when l finished both the dress and the coat. I am 74 now.

[@jackiejames4551]

Yes, its true, large people existed in the past. Hooray!!!😂

[@alexar.h.5031]

😆 I laughed so hard at the "I don't know what I'm doing" bit... I shall pray to the holy mother Goddesses Fabriconica and Paternissus that I don't mess up my 1941-1947 unprinted pattern (will be tracing them) & I don't like reading instructions, I just dive in head first. Oh and 1 pattern has no instructions anyways, yay me! 😆 Oh God what have I gotten myself into?

[@alexar.h.5031]

Patternissus*

[@StephanieCanada]

You got this!!! Just take it slow and line up the notches. Remember vintage garments “eased” between the notches A LOT!!

[@CharleneCTX]

I was born in 1965 and my parents didn't have a lot of money. My mother made her maternity clothes. Then she remade them into my clothes. Then she remade those into doll clothes. I had a set of curtains that became doll bedding. Reuse was the name of the game.

[@button4631]

There is a reason I no longer have my favorite shoes, I wore them till they died screaming. I was heavily influenced by my grandmother who lived in the depression and in turn my mum, so I reuse all our old clothing and linens if I can

[@StephanieCanada]

Way to go!!

[@zeusathena26]

Sometimes it is true! My mother's parents adopted my mom, & a boy who became her brother. My grandma was 4'10 when I was 10, & I w@s taller. She was super skinny too. Her kids were much taller. When young she was about 5 ft. My grandpa was 5'5 when he was young, & 5'1 when he was old. She was rich, & had 3 massive closets full of clothes from 30's through to 80's. Most was 50's & 60's. It's weird to have grandparents shorter than you, when your still in elementary school. LoL I know people were not shorter as a hole, but these 2 were. We knew of no one who wanted the expensive, fancy clothing, & it all went to the thrift store.

[@zeusathena26]

I had a great grandma who was 5'11, & 300 pounds. She was born in 1900. She passed her genes to every woman born in our line. We start going out, at puberty. It's of plus size, curves, etc but the age 30, or a kid, & it all goes away. 🤣

[@alecoloxa]

Interesting

[@nathalieduran7355]

My mum is 88 and lived through the nazi occupation in France. She always says that there were no overweight people during and after the war. This is simply because there was VERY LITTLE food to go around and what little there was ,fell under strict rationing. There was little milk, butter, oil or flour. sugar or meat. Only the men were allowed rations of sugar. My mum told me that when they had meat, they saved any fat they could scrap to melt and used it as cooking oil. It was that bad. Most of the food produced was going to feed the Germans and under their rules, the european governments also had to pay millions to the Nazi government for 'occupation costs.' Unfortunately ; the people who were already overweight were the ones who had the least chances of survival .That is the sad truth. Furthermore, after being malnourished for 6 years, the women who had kids gave birth to smaller babies. It affected the health of millions. For example, lots of kids in europe grew up with calcium shortage due to lack of milk and cheese. This caused growth and teeth long term issues. There lies one of the main reasons for the small sizes in european vintage clothes. We are a lot bigger now.

[@StephanieCanada]

I completely understand where you are coming from, and yes I do agree with all the points made. However, in the US the situation was a little different, and while I mainly covered topics post WW2, there was a wonderful panel that addresses this subject more indepth (I believe it is on Costuming Drama's channel) over a much wider time frame.

[@kiracraft3360]

I am a giant human too! My greatest sadness (for clothing purposes) is that I have 1 size too large feet for the really pretty American Duchess shoes ...the dreaded size 12

[@StephanieCanada]

OMG!! Me too! I actually commented on their shoe video that I would buy from them if they offered 12’s. They responded that they do intend to offer some 12’s in popular styles.

[@kiracraft3360]

@@StephanieCanada yessss! I comment the same. I would snap up a pair of 12 Manhattans in an instant!

[@StephanieCanada]

@@kiracraft3360 RIGHT! There are so many styles I would love, so I am just happy for anything that fits my feet.

[@ashleym.beaufillecook5699]

Also: a lot of times the man dies before the woman, so she gets rid of his stuff and passes 10-20 years later and her kids have to dispose of her stuff... and they sometimes know to sell to a vintage store or something.

[@StephanieCanada]

Very fair point

[@margaretdean4485]

Where do I buy fabric?

[@LovelyGyunyu]

Love it! I learned something new :)

[@StephanieCanada]

Thank you so much!

[@zeusathena26]

My grandmother said she always are bags. That she didn't have time for paper bags to break. She had 8 kids, & grew up during the depression. She grew up before toilet paper was a thing!🤣😂🤣

[@StephanieCanada]

I think my grandma was a chicken feed bag lady.

[@MaryTsugawa]

I took my dad's late 1940's wool suit and made myself a vest and mini skirt.

[@babetweirdgirl4103]

Or they make menstrual rags out of them

[@zeusathena26]

I had a great grandma who was 5'11, & 300 pounds. She was born in 1900. She passed her genes to every woman born in our line. We start going out, at puberty. It's of plus size, curves, etc but the age 30, or a kid, & it all goes away. 🤣