Why dating apps are making it harder to date: the perception of supply and demand

[@psychacks]

Buy my book, "The Value of Others" Ebook: amzn.to/460uGrA Audiobook: amzn.to/3YfFwbx Paperback: amzn.to/3xQuIFK Despite the development of several technologies to facilitate the experience, dating seems more challenging and confusing than ever. In point of fact, dating apps are making it harder to date -- though why this might be the case is a little counterintuitive. In this episode, which is based on an except of my book, I explain why fewer sexual relationships are being transacted in the age of dating apps using the concept of perceived supply and demand. Book a paid consultation: oriontarabanpsyd.com/consultations Subscribe to my newsletter: oriontarabanpsyd.com Social Media Facebook: facebook.com/profile.php?id=100090053889622 LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/orion-taraban-070b45168/ Instagram: instagram.com/psyc.hacks Twitter: twitter.com/oriontaraban Website: oriontarabanpsyd.com Orion's Theme: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jaO7c62HZ613e7M Thinking of going to grad school? Check out STELLAR, my top-rated GRE self-study program based on the world's only empirically-validated test prep system. Use the code "PSYCH" for 10% off all membership plans: stellargre.com. Become a Stellar affiliate and earn a 10% commission for every membership purchased by a new student you conduct into the program: stellargre.tapfiliate.com. GRE Bites: www.youtube.com/@grebites4993 Become a Psychonaut and join PsycHack's member community: kzbin.info/door/SduXBjCHkLoo_y9ss2xzXwjoin Sound mixing/editing by: valntinomusic.com Presented by Orion Taraban, Psy.D. PsycHacks provides viewers with a brief, thought-provoking video several days a week on a variety of psychological topics, inspired by his clinical practice. The intention is for the core idea contained within each video to inspire viewers to see something about themselves or their world in a slightly different light. The ultimate mission of the channel is to reduce the amount of unnecessary suffering in the world. #psychology #dating #relationship

[@RealHomeRecording]

Your book is VERY reasonably priced.

[@amdg1499]

Does your book go deeper than to suggest that relationships are merely transactional?

[@NLTJNET]

Already got your new book!

[@feuerfuchsbrauser978]

Are you gonna publish it in different languages too?

[@jvinc]

@@psychacks I swear the first time I heard you mention your book, I thought you were saying: ‘The Valley of Udders’ and I couldn’t believe you’d written a whole book about titty-tunnels…going for the q-tips just now…

[@Gsp_in_NYC]

As a divorced man in my 40s--I tried online dating again and ran away in horror. The few matches were either younger women wanting an ATM ..or divorced older women (my age) giving me an extensive job interview for a job I didn’t even want (completely delusional to the fact that these women literally had nothing to offer). Or just a hard time to another guy since they couldn’t sufficiently torture the man she recently divorced any longer and needed a new victim

[@agatastaniak7459]

Let's face it, the only rational actor who benefits from dating apps it the dating app owner. The rest lives in inflated ego boosting illusion, regardless of the gender. Real people still stand higher odds of finding any sensible partner in real life and face to face situations. So good luck to you. As for females, those you seek probably ignore dating apps. Since yes, for them the experience is similar to yours.

[@jamesg1974a]

It is a horror for sure and depending on where you’re located, it’s even worse. When I travel to certain places, they seem to have much better options.

[@GerardoDelValle.]

Amen .

[@hugevagiine]

@@jamesg1974aplease disclose the locations 🤣

[@leeolie3728]

Great review of the whole process. Its the same for all men over 25ish unfortunately.

[@delawarehistory1675]

I am 6ft tall, make over 6 figures, I am a decent looking guy. Thin. I am invisible online. I can swipe 1000 profiles and maybe if I am lucky get a few conversations and no dates. Its garbage. a complete waste of time.

[@Stimros_halabad]

Location, location, location. And timing. Also, present a lifestyle.

[@garydrago]

Same here

[@dariuskelleydk]

It’s not you, you just have to be met in person. Social outings would do you good.

[@kellygreenii]

@@Stimros_halabadOr get off of them and meet people in the wild….

[@delawarehistory1675]

@@dariuskelleydk Thanks, yeah I am trying to do more of that.

[@NaruOotori]

Women don't need resources anymore, so it's a choice between chad and no chad, not between chad and non-chad.

[@epicbehavior]

Yeah I’m not sure why he’s still buying into this outdated script.

[@mikehawkins4752]

Chad gets all the women, and there's nothing left for the rest of the men. Women would rather share Chad than be with a good non-chad man.

[@epicbehavior]

@@mikehawkins4752 Except you can be a 3/10 physically and have the social pull of “Chad”. Look around, stop having limiting beliefs.

[@jamesg1974a]

At least they’ve convinced themselves they don’t… Even when there you know taking alimony, child support, free meals on every day… Etc. using pretty girl privilege to get free drinks at the bar. You name it but yes, in fact they don’t believe they need a man that at a very significant disadvantage.

[@mikehawkins4752]

@epicbehavior That's a nice sentiment, but I'm 66, and the pickings are slim in my age range of about 10 yrs younger. I make enough money and on paper meet most of their requirements, but women in their 50s...

[@kevintang8275]

Juice ain't worth the squeeze if you aren't a top 5% man, you have to do 10x the work for 10x less reward

[@peachtroll]

@@tspice11 Everyone can't be in the top 5%. There aren't enough spots.

[@shinymew2887]

@@tspice11lol that’s not how it works

[@peachtroll]

@@tspice11 You don't this person's situation, so don't be lazy and jump to conclusions.

[@funknotik]

@@tspice11 statistical reality. You’ll never make it to the top 5% of men in any area a cross the board, forever. And that’s ok.

[@TyChad]

@@kevintang8275 even when you are top 5 percent that doesn’t change how women are these days. Even the richest guys get screwed. There are no exceptions.

[@charlesdavid-p1y]

As I watch this enthralling video, it resurrects the painful memories of my recent breakup-a relationship of five years that ended just three months ago. The woman who meant everything to me decided to leave, plunging me into a vortex of heartache. Despite my desperate attempts to reconcile, I find myself trapped in a cycle of frustration and longing, unable to envision a life without her. Despite my efforts to move forward, I find solace in expressing my lingering affection for her here.

[@SusanVivian-g3l]

The struggle to release someone dear to your heart is undeniably arduous. I empathize, having experienced a similar circumstance when my 12-year relationship concluded. Refusing to accept defeat, I pursued every conceivable avenue to reclaim her affection. Eventually, I sought the assistance of a spiritual counselor, whose wisdom and intervention played a pivotal role in reuniting us.

[@charlesdavid-p1y]

That's fascinating! How did you come across a spiritual counselor, and what's the best way for me to contact her?

[@SusanVivian-g3l]

Suzanne Ann Walters is a highly recommended spiritual counselor, specializing in reuniting individuals with their former partners.

[@charlesdavid-p1y]

I'm grateful for this valuable information; I've just taken a moment to find her online. Very impressive!

[@AmazingRebel23]

When my best friend blocked me after our friend died I was deeply broken so I understand, if only a little. I am 25 now and I hope I will someday be in a relationship.

[@ceeIoc]

Dating apps will keep you in the hamster wheel forever. Meeting people through hobbies or passporting are the only options at this point.

[@successartistry3023]

If that's the case, why do 50% of people today meet their partners on dating apps?

[@Promet17]

@@successartistry3023 I think it'd be interesting to delve into how many men and women constitute this 50% (what's the gender ratio)

[@ceeIoc]

@@successartistry3023the success rate is a tiny percentage of overall users.

[@randyjb2]

​@@successartistry3023what percentage of men meet their partners on dating sites.. we already know by DNA statistics that women generally share men..

[@VolleKwark]

@@successartistry3023Because the biggest hobby of the majority of the people is being on their phone.

[@tiomoidofangle102]

Got your book--it's amazing. Thanks. These are not dating apps. These are rejection apps. Never before in history have we had the opportunity to be rejected by people around the world, not just in our neighborhood.

[@nowhereman7413]

Good one. You should write another book.

[@hughporter2541]

Lool

[@Abelius]

😂

[@La_anaconda]

rejection apps - kind of funny haha thanks

[@vladivf]

I envy generation X. If you were a young Gen Xer in the 1990s, you got a relationship by default, without even trying. It just happened to you. Back then people were infinitely more humane and cooperative. Back then loneliness was not a problem except for drug addicts.

[@globusdiablo]

You're forgetting that 80% of regular guys don't get a single match. 3 years on apps. Liked hundreds of women. Not a single match.

[@dna8269]

You’re doing something VERY wrong with your profile dude. That is such an abnormal result that there are absolutely things you can improve to get matches

[@eduardoleroy3660]

Buddy, with all due respect, that's on you. I get 3 matches per week on each dating app, minimum, when I'm active, despite not being a top-tier men in looks or anything else.

[@s.k.8263]

He's not forgetting anything. He's implying you should get the **** off dating apps and meet people outside.

[@Nobody98456]

I got 4 matches and i put half of my face. I deleted the app after 4 days, i must admit, you are putting the effort in but you must change something.

[@aliendroid1]

I was on an app, it was bumble and I am not good at making a profile and I had 12 matches per day, didn't put in my height or career info. Just my ugly mug shots. Most were of me hiking or in mountains. I had a lot of matches, I did move my location around to see how it worked. In cities like NYC and LA I got a lot of matches, also in El Paso Texas. In bogota colombia, and around latina merica lot of matches and Japan, china, Thailand a lot of matches. I didn't look like a good catch on there and got matches. It might be your age I'm 46 and older guys get a lot more attention from women.

[@pmaitrasm]

Dating applications, like most applications, thrive with more people using it. It is not in the interest of the companies operating the dating applications to get people out of the applications, ergo, they would prefer to keep people from getting married and to continue the dating game FOREVER.

[@jonathann5205]

💯- ‘Hinge’ may claim otherwise- but such claims are BS.

[@pmaitrasm]

@@jonathann5205, If Hinge claims so, then it is run by people who are are unhinged. 😂

[@jonathann5205]

@@pmaitrasm The claim is unhinged indeed, imbedded in their tagline: “The dating app designed to be deleted.” Um, no. All dating apps are designed to keep people single, desperate and scrolling/swiping for eternity.

[@artawhirler]

It's like our so-called "health care" industry, whose unofficial motto seems to be "Every patient cured is a customer lost."

[@jonathann5205]

@@artawhirler 💯

[@cougarlove8542]

I cannot stand dating apps. Other than Instagram and KZbin I have no other social media and it is so freeing to let it go. The cost of these to your mind is not something that can be calculated.

[@arranritchie3450]

Instagram is dating app #1

[@OneNiftyBoi]

@@arranritchie3450 Any social media app that one can post pictures, videos and privately messege in, eventually becomes a "dating app"

[@ssing7113]

You have social media…. Why lie to yourself 😂

[@pacov_dule]

It is really easy if you think about it: Since women all tend to want the same type of guy, If you are a top 10% guy the dating world is your oyster (online and offline) if not I don't see any point trying.

[@commentarytalk1446]

As with Catch-22, the solution to "damned if you DO and damned if you DON'T" is to: "Not DO X or Not-X but DO Y, instead." Wh-Y? = "Something Else!"

[@renaissance17]

Funny thing, I am one of those guys. I get a lot of matches, but the women still think i have to get on my knees and beg them to let me pay for their dinner.

[@jfkst1]

Might be getting even more exclusive than that. Top 5% at this point.

[@aliendroid1]

In the Phillipines any western guy is a top 10% guy, so yes there is a point in trying just don't try in the USA or an english speaking country.

[@404NotFoundIDontCare]

@@jfkst1no it’s 0.5%

[@MVProfits]

Its missing one HUGE consideration: supply and demand. Women get 100s of messages, even very average ones. While most men are simply invisible. I have had a lot of successes from dating apps, but it has become less and less true, to a point if it's a time waster.

[@danguidi2]

Probably in the book

[@banished6481]

That's probably why women think they're worth more than they are. Well, the book just showed up at my door, so here we go...

[@MVProfits]

@@banished6481 let's be real. On dating apps, women ARE worth a lot more, and us a lot less. But what women haven't figured out, is that's for HOOKUPS. The few men that can get women easy, won't date and commit to 95% of women. There are there to smash. Stats show men's preferences basically follow a typical bell curve, while for women, 90% of men are ZERO interesting to them. They basically all go for the same men. IDK what happened that I used to get many myself, and now near zero, but yeah, it is what it is.

[@Arafat.888]

Not only average ones but also my fake ones😂 Created to feel jealous to someone

[@codniggh1139]

@@banished6481yes, social media in general makes them believe they have more value than they do. In real life, men can only talk with as much that can but only if they are not seen. You have to be very wise to approach someone and not to be rejected, so if in a social event where there is too many people and all look for a mate, you can’t be rejected because you will be seen as loser. So you don’t talk or anything to everyone. In social media talking and sending likes is free, in real life most women are not that attractive and they would see that other women receive most of attention and they don’t, so they behind to understand that they are not that worthy.

[@ggusta1]

I think I found all the broken people. Just meet anyone on one of these apps.

[@SoDidWii]

@@ggusta1 All broken and no refunds!

[@paulbunyan9436]

They have figured out how to keep us apart...Hide men's matches while overwhelming picky women with choices, thereby funneling them toward the few, highly attractive men at the top, who ruthlessly use, then discard.

[@AndreyGreenYtube]

By the way, these "highly attractive men" are mostly physically unavailable. I observed a process of swiping by 21-years old girl: She disables location filters and swipes right only absolute gigachads that are 2K miles away. After that, she complains that neither of them replied. When I pointed to the distance, she replied like "the distance doesn't matter for me if I like a man". This isn't even a delusion, this is kinda insanity...

[@marcusmcgraw3519]

@@AndreyGreenYtubethen why are you taking them seriously? Stop begging for chances with them

[@nathand4500]

@@marcusmcgraw3519 where was he taking them seriously or begging for chances?

[@anotherperspective6247]

there's nothing ruthless about their behavior. It's the women who cannot distinguish between their SMV and their RMV.

[@marcusmcgraw3519]

@@anotherperspective6247 that is because you guys keep inflating their perceived value by continuing to show how desperate you are for them anyways. Do you see how men are the problem in dating and not women?

[@dw4956]

Like coach Greg Adams says, most woman are 49-ers. They are a 4 in value thinking they are a 9. And like you said, sex is worth far less than recourses. Recourses take hard labour and dollars upfront, sex just time and effort in the moment. The female expiration date controls the market. Relationships are always a buyers market. It always has and always will be.

[@maam-yj8ph]

*Resources

[@marcusmcgraw3519]

Women have zero control over the market. Don’t hand over anything and you don’t lose. Why is this so hard for you to understand?

[@FreeAgent99]

I’m a big fan of CGA 👍🏼

[@mudblood9699]

Except sex with a new person diminishes one's ability to effectively bond monogamously in a long-term relationship, especially for women. So for women, having sex with someone new costs a lot more than the 60-80 dollars the guy spent on the meal.

[@marcusmcgraw3519]

@@mudblood9699 I don’t think they care when they’re getting something they want. Anyone who talks about pair bonding in this way is just upset they can’t attract a woman in the first place

[@thebluelunarmonkey]

When I used dating apps years ago, I was already under the assumption that each woman was receiving at least 100 new messages a day, was talking to at least 10 ignoring the rest, and had at least 5 to date or hook up with. I understood it was a woman's market.

[@aliendroid1]

It's not a woman's market, most of the messages they get don't lead to anything except an attempted hook up, very rarely can they actually get a man who wants what they want which is a relationship, most men who are at the value these women want are fake accounts (F boys or married men).

[@florianb3935]

@@aliendroid1 Maybe but we always go back to accountability. Or lack of, thereof. I mean, would anyone pity guys who constantly hit on party b*tch OF kind of girls, and got used and jaded? Probably not a single person on earth. Yet, women do that and we just find them excuses.

[@2Oldcoots]

I'm reading "The Value of Others" right now and it is profound, informative, and filled with new ideas about how to think of other human beings!!!

[@GhostriderBA877]

Through chapter 1 of your book. Love the premise and like how it’s constructed so far. Great work!

[@danguidi2]

Just ordered your book. Very excited to read it. Also, it gives me joy to finally give money to you as you have already provided plenty of value to me.

[@NorwoodGuernsey]

If you are not in the financial market space right now, you are making a huge mistake. I understand that it could be due to ignorance, but if you want to make your money work for you...prevent inflation

[@MichaelGillespie-MG]

Interesting, This is superb! Information, as a noob it gets quite difficult to handle all of this and staying informed is a major cause, how do you go about this are you a pro Investor?

[@MichaelGillespie-MG]

I feel Investors should exercise caution with their exposure and.exercise caution when considering new investments, particularly during periods of inflation. It is advisable to seek guidance from a professional or a licensed expert in order to navigate this recession and achieve potential high yields

[@NorwoodGuernsey]

Prioritizing effective personal finance management holds greater significance than the sheer amount saved, irrespective of income source. Consulting a certified financial advisor can offer tailored strategies to optimize financial results by reducing expenses and enhancing income, regardless of whether it's earned through employment or investments.

[@NorwoodGuernsey]

Brian Humphery Services was my hope during the 'bear summer' last year. I made so many mistakes but also learned so much from it, and of course from Brian.

[@NorwoodGuernsey]

He is really a good investment advisor. Was privileged to attend some of his seminars.that's how I started my own crypto investment

[@k.alvarado6237]

I’ll add . Dating apps are for people 18-35 , who are very physically attractive with the pictures to show that.

[@morrismak]

I am learning more about the market, supply and demand than my university econ 101 in college

[@willemvanriet7160]

The apps make woman entitled. Came across a friend who I know to be down to earth and humble but on the app her entire profile arrogantly describes how a man MUST be to win her over...

[@toriandjojo2018]

Same from the female perspective-many men have profiles where they will even list what a woman “must have” or “must be able to do” to have a relationship with them

[@cameron339]

Except men aren't the ones with the endless options so it's not really the same.​@@toriandjojo2018

[@robicelus]

@@toriandjojo2018 that's normal because a healthy women would follow the man and not the other way around.

[@rejectwokeness1314]

​@@toriandjojo2018men are just learning from women.

[@TheBadGuy69]

i always try to keep the first dates cheap and i was get pushback requiring me to take them out to fancy restaurants

[@stephen876]

Dating apps gave women a false perspective that they are as attractive as their photoshopped photos.

[@ronj9448]

Ouch! True

[@user-ew3hh1mv9l]

His book is one of the best books I've ever read on the subject. Hard to put it down and puts things in perspectives I've never even come close to thinking about. He is on a other level.

[@La_anaconda]

he is! a sexy genius

[@trucid2]

This is not necessarily an unintended effect of dating apps. As long as a person is on the dating app and looking for a partner, they are paying the monthly fee. It's counterintuitive, but the incentive of the dating apps is to keep you from finding your match.

[@Dru2maBoii]

Men spend money on women and the chance to be with them. Dating apps are incentivized to keep you in that pursuit.

[@marcusmcgraw3519]

Why would you ever spend money on a woman

[@Dru2maBoii]

@@marcusmcgraw3519 Most men do not understand women or how to get them. Money is usually their best move.

[@baffinsansterre]

If men can't buy desire, why spend a lot on women?

[@Dru2maBoii]

@marcusmcgraw3519 most men don't know how women work, so it's all they believe they can offer

[@Dru2maBoii]

@@baffinsansterre you shouldn't. That's the point.

[@robertosheridan740]

Dating apps fooled women to think that they have the same leverage as their virtual, distorted high value avatars. It's literally an illusion of power.

[@mudblood9699]

It wasn't so much dating apps as it was the invention of the contraceptive pill and the normalization of promiscuity.

[@ssing7113]

As is pron for men Your point being? Both sexes are delusional and dabbling in things beyond their comprehension

[@robertosheridan740]

@mudblood9699 The contraceptive pill can improve the sex life of a monogamous couple, so I don't see adversity there. On the other hand, promiscuity will never be a positive trait in the dating world, although it can serve as narcissistic supply just like dating apps.

[@s.k.8263]

With the existence of simps, I assure you that their leverage is high in either case.

[@stasdev]

Jeesus, that kicker hit really hard 😅 500 new psychacks episodes is a gold mine gotta go grab that book

[@Jamal_Ginsberg]

Just got the audiobook. Thank you for everything you do, Orion.

[@NickyVerd1]

Most men are looking for sex... Most women are looking for a relationship on dating Apps...and therein lies the problem. Somehow this video seems to suggest that women have the upper hand on these dating apps (maybe a certain category of women but definitely not all women)... My experience has been terrible. As a woman, if your profile (photos) aren't dripping sex from head to toe, you're essentially invisible to most men and for those that notice, if you aren't offering sex on the 1st or 2nd date, you're eliminated, deleted, ghosted... and off to the next available woman he goes. Imagine if I had to sleep with every single man who took me on a date... how many men would I have slept with in a week, month, or a year? The dating market is brutal! Quick Question: Can I pay for the Date and get to know a man without the pressure to reward/pay him back with sex? The expectation that a woman has to sleep with a complete stranger shortly after meeting him just because he paid for the date terrifies me.

[@kidbu916]

Imo women would fare a lot better in dating if y'all changed the culture by putting more effort upfront into the dating process. As long as y'all continue to expect to be wined and dined on a man's dime, while simultaneously not giving out sex. It's always gonna be tough. Just like y'all don't want to be sex and ghosted. Men don't want to keep going on dates and paying for shit without getting what they really want above all else.

[@aquepaique]

Nah, most men are not looking for pure sex. The men that are looking for one night stands are the ones that you are attracted to. The guys that are looking for a LTR are invisible in your eyes.

[@Shifft-This]

Personally, I think removing the pressure from the first "date" is key. It's why I'm a fan of "coffee" dates. They can be quick (30 mins to an hour), cheap, and I expect nothing more than getting to know you better. If there's potential there, future dates can ramp up towards wining and dining as it gets more serious.

[@megalodon1726]

Not "most men". Most men YOU CHOOSE on the apps behave like that, because you're only choosing from the top 5% of men (or fewer), and those men have so many other women who want them.

[@megalodon1726]

You definitely shouldn't be sleeping with every man who takes you on a date, but you also shouldn't be agreeing to a date in the first place if you already know you'll never want sex with the man. Every grown heterosexual man who ask for and shows up for a date with a woman already knows he wants sex with her at some point, whether it is the first date, 3rd date, 10th date, or marriage. So if you know up front you won't ever have sex with him, turn down the date and don't waste your time or his.

[@Champ1988]

They sell hope to the ones looking for love, and "abundance" to the ones looking for hookups. The ones looking for love keep coming back for that elusive opportunity. The ones looking for hookups come back to trade up.

[@marcusmcgraw3519]

That’s why you don’t do relationships. They’re a man made prison and you’re doing time

[@OneNiftyBoi]

Of all the comments I've seen here, this could be the perfect summary of dating apps.

[@berger1968]

Orion I just started reading your book and it is literally overflowing with wisdom. This is a literally masterpiece the language is perfect and very well explained. Definitely worth every euro. Thank you for your work you helped me get into my first relationship and also helped me when it ended. So much to reconsider and think through by applying your wisdom into a perspective!

[@thabangmohomane648]

I think we gotta give Dr orion his respect, when this man cooks he cooks😤🔥🫡

[@thenightmare6204]

I just finished reading the book. The perspectives provided are quite interesting since there are no judgements but facts and ideas presented in an extremely eloquent and brilliant manner, as Dr. Taraban can do. Have been a follower for more than a year now thanks to the algorithm. Couldn't be more grateful than ever for that. Congratulations. I'm deep diving into the book once again.

[@cellularmitosis2]

That’s a pretty damn good sales pitch

[@thebeatfinder7559]

I’m not a big reader, however I’m still gonna purchase your book 📕 🤜🏾🤛🏼 I appreciate you that much

[@IfSemper]

Remember he has an audio version he narrates, too.

[@thebeatfinder7559]

@@IfSemper thank you

[@IfSemper]

@@thebeatfinder7559 Welcome. If you click the link for his book in the description, it'll give you the choice of the 3 options.

[@aaronjonellhall1937]

Just bought the book! Been following you for 2 years and is directly contributed to me obtaining my current monogamous one year relationship ❤ from a successful dating stint

[@RB-gx4qg]

Just bought your book dude. Thanks for all the great information you have given me(us)

[@XTheSpartanX7]

You can date casually very well if you stay in shape and stay well groomed. Don’t sign a marriage contract tho you will regret it.

[@alexp7274]

Correct

[@thefranticteacher2507]

Bought your audiobook! Now i have you in my head like a cricket.

[@Raftimusprime]

I've added your book to my cart and plan on buying it this weekend. I love to read, and i am sure this one will be great. Thanks !

[@kenolson3064]

I gave a dating app 1 shot 15 years ago. A woman tried to catfish me. I was done.

[@themick6586]

I was divorced at 20, at the beginning of the disco craze, It was a great time to be single meeting women at the clubs, dancing, drinking, music, in 12 months dated 15 young ladies, feminism was not running rampant like now, there were still some girls that weren't into hookup culture. I met a 20 year old virgin, that knew who she was and where she wanted her life to go. Been married forever. I talk to my grandsons and look around at what women are doing nowadays and feel badly for young guys that want a healthy family. As they say, " the juice is no longer worth the squeeze. Then add in the fact that family law is anti male, I absolutely believe that men should no longer get married. The odds are heavily against a lasting relationship.

[@ssing7113]

Wow. You’re a quitter

[@damienfowler2358]

The best answer I see, is for both parties to stop negotiating for gain, and both start seeking real connection. Women need to stop expecting men to pay for dates and experiences, and just meet for coffee or a drink where they pay for themselves, and men need to go into these interactions not expecting sex, but to get t know the woman. Also, be prepared to mingle to potential person with friends to properly vet. 3rd parties observations do a great deal more in finding what works vs sexual sparks.

[@mudblood9699]

Many if not most western women are not incentivized to act that way, they value the emotional experience of being gratified by a very sexually attractive man using them for sex over the value of a healthy relationship with someone on their level. The really sad part is when they get "stuck on their highest setting" and are then unable to have a healthy relationship with any guy who's actually willing to commit to them.

[@VivatVeritas1]

I’m glad someone pointed that out. You can take economic metaphors too far. I think Orion has been rudely awakened from his dream of true love, as have so many of us.

[@damienfowler2358]

@VivatVeritas1 I think as a metaphor, it works because most people go into relationships specifically looking for gain. The current issue is a pandemic of loneliness. When loneliness is the central issue, then holding out for gain gets us nowhere. We've lost the days when 2 people would build a life together. Unfortunately, it's largely on women who now have their own careers and money to look more for connection over "sparks" or lifestyle. How men do their part is to do our best in trying to stop simping, stop trying to take care of women and let them be the empowered, independant women they claim to be, and let them pay for themselves. Society isn't going back to a time when women stayed home and had men take care of them. So we need to adjust to the fact that more competition and success in women means less favorable outcomes in personal lives.

[@Looksmaxxedat41]

I’m 41, divorced, been on apps for 7 years straight. Dating apps work but you have to stand out in terms of looks department

[@roses6564]

Correct.

[@jfkst1]

Or status in some way. Loaded wealthy with pics that show off the wealth will do great too. Social credibility, I know a standup comedian with a radio show, not good looking or wealthy but he does great.

[@Looksmaxxedat41]

@@jfkst1 attracting women via resources won’t buy lust and unconditional lust for you. The only way to achieve this genuine form of attraction is to make her lust and desire you through your physical appearance as it’s either there or not there.

[@Looksmaxxedat41]

@@jfkst1 you can but they still won’t be genuinely sexually attracted to you.

[@aliendroid1]

You will still not get what you deserve on those apps, you could be a 10/10 and you'll have low value women coming after you. No matter how good you are as an honest man there are F boy scammers building their profiles to be superior to yours because they have unlimited allowance for lying and cheating, but you want a relationships so you have to be accountable for what you claim on your profile, you have to look like your pictures or better. and women are pretty much money sexuals.

[@savizzlekeys]

I look forward to reading your book Orion! Great content!

[@gottrekk5798]

For thousands of years there was a commitment before sex. One of the reason was the fact that men (generally speaking) don't want to be with a single mother unless she's a widow.

[@nowhereman7413]

If a man can choose would never choose a single mother or a widow.

[@Abelius]

For thousands of years there weren't faultless divorce and contraceptives either. A man could walk into a commitment with a woman and expect her to be "his" forever. We can't use the formulas of the past to solve the problems of the present.

[@dreddy_g]

When I used to be on dating apps, I always made sure I gave a positive experience to "self declared strong and independent modern women" and "stunning and brave single moms" who try connecting with me by telling them: "You are so nice, any man will be lucky to have you." If I am on an exceptionally great mood, I say: "Why can't I meet someone like you?"

[@oRuTRa45]

@@dreddy_g Did you meet any of them?

[@dan3696]

simp

[@Tgogators]

I stopped counting the times I saw "Boss lady!" in their profiles.

[@AndreyGreenYtube]

Have you managed to get one of them to bed this way?

[@asparrow9876]

Omg why did I never think of that? I'm so stupid 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@mateuszsan2795]

Orion's book, value of others is really stacked with knowledge, can recommend 100% to all, this video is only a single idea but book really explain much larger picture and shows how everything connects it is drawing the whole system/sexual marketplace big picture from a to z.

[@andrewsackett6243]

Thank you so much Dr. Taraban. Your insights and explanations are priceless and extremely accurate. In our value conversation(s) I hope this contribution shows my gratitude. I’m off to buy your book. Keep up your incredible work.

[@georgeradulescu7175]

Another problem with dating apps is that you can't observe the person you're interested in before you even approach them. Ten profile photos won't tell you what 10 seconds of looking at someone is person will. Their body type, how they treat others, how they dress in real life, etc... If all that information is not available and you just look at a profile, you are more likely to give people a chance that you might not otherwise have, thus leading to more failed relationships. It's like a recruiter going through thousands of resumes online versus meeting candidates in person at an open interview event. You're just relying on what the other person is willing to tell you about themselves, which is hardly 100% accurate and complete.

[@Aris-Darling]

I tried online dating, and while I think I found some decent guys to date, we ended up splitting after some years. I wouldn’t go back online these days… if my relationship doesn’t work out again, I would meet people the organic and slow way

[@ronj9448]

You dated some decent guys for a few years? I'd say that was a success. Certainly after a few years in a relationship part of the problem would be you and not the app.

[@limbica3477]

Orion:"What Do you think? " Me watching: "I think you are a great business man"

[@ghanshyam1990]

The one strength that men have is that of time. Just wait it out and see how the price falls, remember there is always someone turning 18 everyday and they will be priced out of the market by their own inflexibility. If they are willing to play the waiting game then so are we, and that is a game where we can't lose.

[@nonamesareavailabe]

Congratulations on your first published book

[@alexlitt8409]

Coming from a woman, dating apps are the worst in so many ways… and inauthentic. It’s making the normal world more difficult if you’re looking for a legit real relationship, 90% of the time.

[@Aliens-Are-Our-Friends2027]

Women can get sex from Chad but NEVER a relationship

[@brucehicks5817]

@alexlitt8409 I'm glad you said it. Women have it so much worse on the apps. Nonstop action in the dms and an endless list to sift through. So many homegirls have lowered the bar due to, among other things, having so many options that don't pan out.

[@OneNiftyBoi]

If you arelooking for a relationship, dating apps are a very debatable idea. If looking for casual lstuff, they work very well, especially for wom3n. For a relationship, it's reasonable to just struggle with the old methods of meeting through hobbies and other real life interractions.

[@Qpoueoor]

I dated online from 2001 until 2014. Things changed fast. 2001-2009 it was easy.. then something changed. I took a break after rejection after rejection. It’s been 10 years and I don’t miss it. Living my life free.😂

[@user-ge6uo2ry2b]

I am a women in my 40s who does yoga workouts, dresses well, can cook and maintains a household. Educated, traveled with a tons of hobbies and fun to be with. I get a lot of matches, the majority of whom ghost before a date. Yes, they don't even cancel. They just stop communicating after a date has been set up.

[@stephanie7572]

Men don't care about that stuff up front. They want to know if you're hot. Post some pics dressed sexier, be teasing and flattering in your approach, the idea is you just can't wait to get him into bed, you've never felt such an instant attraction.. All the yoga, travel, cooking is what you trot out later after he's hooked.

[@jonb8633]

Something you are doing wrong

[@cheekymonkeygirl3378]

With that look, you can easily find a senior in a nursing house. Buy these old farts a dinner! 🤢🤮🤮

[@terrorbilly1]

@@jonb8633 yeah, lots of lieing lol

[@PHILLYBULLDOG]

Stop trying to hook up with Chads.

[@Highintensityhealth]

I went on 40 Hinge dates over a 6-9 month period. Had some decent dates, about 3 were really good. Ended up in a LTR with my last date; we’re going on 1.5 years of dating. Lessons: it’s a volume game. Lots of trash but some good women on there too. You have to be patient, picky and open to having crappy dates knowing you’ll meet the right person eventually.

[@alexp7274]

No worth wasting so much time on the trash at the off chance of meeting someone decent. It's an inefficient and demeaning way of finding someone compatible.

[@nilesroberts3821]

Valid if you can get volume. I'm a man. After 3 years, spending around $1000 and 1000 hours on dating sites, I got only one date, and countless catfish and scammers. If you can't generate volume, and most men can't, dating sites and apps are a loosing game.

[@VivatVeritas1]

I agree. Do tell if you know more efficient and uplifting ways.

[@Kirbythediver]

I'm over 6ft tall, making around six figures in a low cost of living state and my dental hygienist says im beautiful lol. APPs don't work even for me. It wasn't always like this. Just 2 years ago was a stark difference. I have NEVER had so much trouble finding a date.

[@drtox06]

Ok sold. Just bought on audible. Look forward to listening.

[@classactracing]

Falling for the ‘Bare Minimum’ - A users standards drop tremendously when using dating apps. Seems as though one might settle for Dobby from Harry Potter after two weeks of using them.

[@kellygreenii]

No. The problem is that people, try to punch above their level of attractiveness. Especially women. So they try to wrestle relationships out of men who would have never gotten into a relationship with them had they met IRW, organically.

[@Tomsdrawings]

Thank you for all the great content, mr. Taraban.

[@rainerminusunfug]

0:57 Perfect timing, my paperback arrived just today. I'm thrilled to start reading... :)

[@Appl_Jax]

Also need to consider that most dating apps are sausage parties and that the ratio of men to women is very high. And the app's primary reason for existing is to make money, and nothing else. "Hey you see this picture of a girl? Well you can have her. You can message her if you subscribe for $50 a month to get a chance. $5000 if you want to get a special badge when she sees your message." And of course, most profiles are not real. They either are not active anymore or never was on the platform in the first place. And that doesn't even count scammers out there already, or the girls who are only there to promote their OF or whatever.

[@MatthewInJesusChrist]

I understand your point here Orion, and I'm glad that you're here with this knowledge. For I myself don't have the time to break down each logical step or aspect to these various different corners of the dating and mating world. I'm gonna be honest though. For as much as this perspective and understanding might be more functional for many others who are coming from this angle, I am more classic and traditional in the sense that I ignore the ways this modern world runs and wait until relationships formulate on their own in a sort of synchronistic or happenstance way. I like to think of myself as a character in a story and treat everything I do with a sense of classical stories. Is that a painting of Jesus Christ on the cover of your book I see? Another thing I wanted to say regarding what you say about what each gender is willing to lose, or what they expect. I know you said that men would have more to lose since they would lose money, resources and therefore hard earned labour. But sexual encounters are not necessarily as cheap as one might suspect. Even though it costs no money or resources to have sex, exchanging fluids CAN cost someone. By having sex you are introducing all sorts of transmitted fluids into the body, which not only affects males but even more so females since they are more sensitive to their bodies as well as hypochondria. There's also the whole thing about reputation. Not to say that it's the be all end all or that people should take it too seriously, but it is something worth considering. But I'm sure you have thought about this all before. Trust me, I am a man and I understand how valuable my time, resources and labour is. But I also understand how sensitive women are to exchanging fluids as well, for certain past sexual experiences have continually negatively affected my health and psyche until this day.

[@IfSemper]

No, the painting is called "The Judgement of Paris," Paris being the Prince of Troy.

[@kidbu916]

Imo women don't care about that shit like they do on the internet. Not once have I ever been asked for STD results and most times they don't even want to use condoms. These aren't gutter rats, these are women with jobs and college education. Only on the internet are women super responsible.

[@your_royal_highness]

Years ago even predating apps when newspapers were the only choice I wasted an enormous amount of time. It’s been 10 years since I tried apps. It was pretty bad. I have also seen the same women I liked from their photos after several years (good looking in their 40’s and 50’s). They are still holding on to their delusions!

[@stevenvanderheide6472]

I enjoy your videos because you don't have any cuts. Thank you.

[@steveburke7675]

Seems like what is being said here is that relationships are the same as pr0stituti0n....transactional.

[@jonathann5205]

Of course they basically are. Marriage is, at heart, religiously sanctioned and government-endorsed prostitution. No shame.

[@mojekonto9287]

Relationships can be partnerships and partnerships can be like companies.

[@LisaCulton]

He only focuses on sex and not real connection, communication, children and family life - which are the things most men and women are desiring.

[@mojekonto9287]

​@@LisaCulton​ exactly, that is the reason why I am reluctant to purchase his book. He tends to strip the topic down to sex, while in fact there is a lot more to it, as you mentioned, kids, family life or mutual household and I haven't heard him refer to those other things much.

[@steveburke7675]

@@LisaCulton He is specifically addressing dating apps. Little chance of finding any of those things while swiping left or right.

[@dimitriskep4488]

I am 6ft 6, triple digit figures, good to very good looking 35-40 years old. Had been in the shadows in my country and with dating apps,I changed my location, changed my lifestyle and downgraded how I was presenting my self to a lower mid class guy, and i became a player within a few months. A lot of Sex just for the chance to trade for my commitment. Last 4 years I am in a relationship and I am very very happy. Im afraid that most men and women are looking for people way over their league and this is a problem that Orion could use as a topic for a next video. Thanks for the video

[@cheekymonkeygirl3378]

You ain't shit! 😢😢

[@avconsultores]

@@dimitriskep4488 what country did you move?

[@stevenmccauslin5880]

Just bought your book. I appreciate your efforts Dr. Taraban. Hoping to be a Jedi master after consuming.

[@Frodo1000000]

Note about Orion's book though, his deep thought on sexual marketplace applies mostly to USA. Lots of "red pill" stuff isn't as quite adjusted to other countries in Central Europe, Italy, Greece, etc.

[@harveypolanski755]

I’d argue that’s because prostitution is legal in those countries. So it put a hard cap on the price of sex, and women know it.

[@moontreecollective6718]

Men could make this all stop real quick if we worked together to control the market instead of competing when we shouldn’t be

[@user-rj4xl5bl2s]

I think people choose each other through pheromones and dating apps are pheromoneless.

[@cynthiaschell7246]

that is an interesting perspective

[@BS_Profile]

That's a long way of saying that nobody's "good enough" for the average woman lol. If women could simply date "across", we probably wouldn't be in this mess. But social media has convinced them that they're twice as attractive as they actually are. So when they think they're dating across, they're actually dating up. Hence the modern dating landscape.

[@idolbass]

I’ve been on dating sites for 20yrs and there’s a few observations I can make about it that pretty much line up with the concepts or reality of this episode, excellent

[@andyjones3304]

Chase excellence, not women. Women will follow, and even if they don’t, you’re a better person for it.

[@valdius85]

An excellent men just needs to have his eyes open. The second sentence shows some hate twrds women, which is not needed to be honest.

[@andyjones3304]

@@valdius85 I fail to see how one could derive hate from my statment. Men should not be beholden to a certain outcome, nor should they strive to better themselves just to attain a woman, in fact, if a man does this, he will typically appear less attractive to women in general. As in a man who "has his act together" Men need to better themselves for their own sake, not women's.

[@valdius85]

@@andyjones3304 Maybe I’m just seeming too much red pill comments lately. Sorry. I completely agree with your answer.

[@andyjones3304]

@@valdius85 No worries, a good portion of redpill content is certainly hateful towards women, however, calling women out on their bad behaviors isn't, even if our culture is inclined to think so. Where I see a lot of men, and redpill content creators fail is they often don't hold themselves to their own standards, much like the women they complain about.

[@valdius85]

@@andyjones3304 True and sorry again. The pick up scene was very helpful to me as my “skills” with women were terrible at the time. It wasn’t who I was, just wrong thinking. Some content helped me, some confused my brain for long periods of time. Red pill guys project all available women flaws onto every single woman. In the meantime, as you point out correctly, they lack accountability. They should focus more on what trades a good woman has, what she’s looking for in a man and how to have a relationship with that woman. Instead they focus on how to manipulate damaged women into sleeping with them. BTW: my mother taught me not to glorify women and the same standards as for men.

[@rajahferrier7475]

Dating is for young. Go live your lives men.

[@davidm8030]

Its the global marketplace component that's the profound change in dating since 2010. Prior to that, it used to be the best option in the local area or tribe, now its globally and the top 5% get almost infinite demand. Age 18, women get given 144 credits and lose a credit each month until 30, so a shortened timescale to lock down opportunity. Its interesting to plot as a percentage over time as the wall is very visible 😢

[@hughnibley]

I honestly think there's a bigger problem here which is kind of implicit in a lot of what Orion talks about, but isn't hit directly on the head. I figured out, to an extent, how to crack the code on dating apps. I have zero issues finding physically attractive women to date, who want relationships, etc. The problem is, if you crack that code, that you discover the real issue isn't that women aren't giving you the attention/chance you want. Instead, the problem is that women who have anything at all to offer besides their body are extremely, extremely, vanishingly rare. If you're just looking to hook up, which you really shouldn't be for so many reasons, it's great. Once you learn what to do, it's the easiest thing in the world - you just can't have a conscience. If you're looking for a real companion in life, a helpmeet, someone to work with you to create a family and become greater than the sum of your parts...... you're simply not going to find her on dating apps, because she's been married since her early 20s.

[@arinzebenjamin8396]

Wonderful. Immediately I logged in YT I saw the video.

[@user-cc3ms3mh4h]

"Women demanding a significant relationship up front, is even more ludacris." This also explains why being just friends with a guy, is so pandering to many modern women.

[@marklawrence17]

The dating apps lose money if you quit your subscription. They're very carefully and statistically designed to keep you hooked on the app but not get you married.

[@theculturedgentleman3699]

I am 100% buying your book sir 🤝

[@JaySmith-pv2mw]

Completely done with dating apps and probably dating for good. I'm introverted, not very social and average looking so I have no chance.

[@micycle6474]

Try a life outside the apps

[@RedERscrubs]

With that attitude, probably so. 😔Since you’re giving up on others, why not take that same energy and focus it where it counts: YOU. Focus on the things YOU like…the things YOU want to do. Go all out. Watch what happens. Best of luck to you.

[@JaySmith-pv2mw]

@@RedERscrubs That's what I'm doing.

[@JaySmith-pv2mw]

@@micycle6474 I am.

[@JaySmith-pv2mw]

@@micycle6474 Yeah, I am.

[@JSFGuy]

Let's check it out.

[@knivgaffelskje]

I recently noticed something about dating apps I should have seen a long time ago. I barely get any matches on dating apps, and rarely anything with an actually attractive woman that goes anywhere (even answering my messages). However, the vast majority of these women that are swiping left of me would not really interest me if I met them in real life, neither their looks nor their personality (or lack of). However, more attractive women are giving me "the look", flirting with me or actually making a move on me if I meet them in different contexts in real life. I have never been a fan of dating apps, but as a lone wolf type of guy that has been focused on myself and my stuff for years, I perceived it to be the easiest way to meet women. It seems obvious to me now that the best way is to meet women in real life, and that I really need to work on my social skills and social anxiety in order to do that. However, I live in a country where people really don't talk to strangers, and you are seen as a creep/weirdo if you do.

[@babyelephant5098]

I bought your book the day it came out on Amazon. Can’t wait to read it all. I don’t do dating apps at all I stopped years ago it is a waste of time and money. I prefer meeting people through social events in person or mutual friends full stop

[@MrRmcbigboss]

Bought your book the second it was released and reading it now, red pilled lad former nice guy that has horrifically been played by women.

[@semyaza555]

You need to trademark “the gold digger spectrum” immediately lol.

[@bearclaw5115]

Yes, that is the best part of today's talk!

[@FethiDilmi]

Guys/Ladies, Buy the book, it is really worth it ! I binged-listened it in an afternoon ! It is really packed with fresh and original content that you won’t find here.

[@eedsYT]

Dating apps feel like a waste of time if you want to find a long term relationship

[@cliffthecoolcat]

I find that most women hate me for my creed. I couldn't get a state or union job because I was white. I ended up conservative business owner who can't help but like Trump.

[@robertduda6336]

Fell into the White Knight mode for a widow. Figured both our children were at an age of self sufficiency .Mine were, hers not at all. Horrible situation. To say she got a lot of value for essentially nothing is an understatement. News Flash: Widows can be Gold Diggers with the best of them. Love bomb then bait and switch with the best of them. I’m very lucky to have survived this parasitical relationship.

[@ssing7113]

Dude. She lost someone she loved…. You’ll never compare 😂 Fine if u understand and are open that.. hey I know I won’t compete with ghost chad. So we can have a good time while it lasts. Fine or not? If a widow can turn off her love for the guy she married and lost making him a god. Then you are a mortal. That’s going to go how for you…. And or you’ll sickly be in a relationship with someone who has eternal love for another man. AKA not you. So enjoy those conversations with the boys

[@alexanderpons9246]

Much success with your book Dr. Taraban! Gosh, humans we are all delusional especially in todays world.

[@user-em5ie3bb3e]

Dating is not a business, I'm hearing the word market a lot and incentives. If you want to be successful with women you need to be specific in what type of women you want.Even if you run it like a business, most successful businesses are specialized to certain group of people. Most men lack vision these days, you need vision.

[@Esta-Beed]

All the different apps are saturating the markets and full of bots

[@mahdman3]

That's the main issue right there, fake profiles! I'm talking about the fake profiles that the dating app employees create and encourage.

[@detroitvcw]

Not only that, the filters that women use are so astronomical, that you dont know what youre getting. Just as bad as running into a bot.

[@mahdman3]

@@detroitvcw Ohh man I forgot about the filters! Make up and then toss in filters... that's when things get sticky. Then they have the audacity to claim that men are the liars and dishonest.

[@agatastaniak7459]

Social research alreadys hows dating apps market is dying but whatever. If someone is still into this thing just like some people are into all kinds of overspending on gambling, that's their problem. As for dating, nowadays a huge return of professional match-making services is making waving big time. Especially among people who can pay premium price and who seek people with similar socio-economic status. So yeah, lots of high value people already gone from any sort of ree dating apps. And I think I have already seen some people complaining that their desired dating options have moved behind the paywall. And social research shows that yes, it's already going on.

[@Esta-Beed]

@@agatastaniak7459 it's a hell scape to try and find someone

[@hump1953]

That why as a 71 year old fit man I go abroad and meet much younger, fit, friendly, feminine women for little money

[@themick6586]

​​@@P.90.603let's face it the whole relationship game is a barter, you are trading a part of you for a part of her. So it's all prostitution, you may not exchange money, but you are exchanging something. It just matters whether you think you are getting a good deal. .

[@VivatVeritas1]

@@P.90.603In Orion’s universe, all of it is.

[@SandraJM]

@@hump1953 “meet” lol sure

[@astrot9802]

This video made me buy the book!!