Why does everyone HATE Smash Ultimate now?!

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

Videos to Watch Next! : kzbin.info/aero/PLSiyMitT1hbD0T8ftoVlZtAQasBncCfFe&feature=shared

[@gigantomastiaCuddler]

Whose tier list was that at 3:00 ? I can't find it on reverse image search.

[@Lord_Stardrifter]

To be honest, the biggest problem with Ultimate isn’t the game itself, rather it’s the spoiled community that can’t appreciate anything good that Ultimate did for us

NOOOOO, BUT IT ISN'T MELEE! I NEED TO PLAY MY 23 YEARS OLD PARTY GAME FULL OF BUGS LIKE IT IS A COMPETITIVE MARVEL! WAAAA!

[@mrsnake333]

I fell like people are just never grateful,Sakurai and the workers designed more than 80 characters and some people have the audacity to whine about a problem.People always finds a way to complain about something

[@MasterSprintersan1]

So agreed! I’ll keep on playing it, though.

[@whitescreen493]

They just can't go a day without whining about Waluigi not being playable in Smash, and then begging for random character requests

[@scintillam_dei]

Gamers are generally libtards whose gods are Mario and such.

[@lacasadelvideojuego3880]

The thing is, competitive players assume that this game was developed for us and not for the casual players. We are not the center of their player base and we should never expect or beg for anything because in reality we are a minority in sales. Btw: I do hate the state of the game in my competitive eyes but the game is good if I wasn’t trying to play it competitive.

[@quillion3rdoption]

It's still perfectly valid to bash the current Smash devs for wasting the potential of what they currently have. Why SHOULDN'T we say criticism that the team is making a fighting game... for everyone who doesn't play fighting games. Besides, with Rivals Workshop, and Smash Flash 2 and Smash Crusade/CMC modding the appeal of Smash's "have everyone and everything in a platform fighter" is completely redundant. So official Smash SHOULD shift to improving its gameplay (and not necessarily making it mechanically bloated like other competitive fighters do).

[@EWOODJ]

True

[@lacasadelvideojuego3880]

@@quillion3rdoption I understand that sentiment but just look at the sales, that potential that we try to push is minimal in the greater scheme of sales. I’m a competitive player in Mexico since melee and a TO in my locals a lot of people have the game here yet we always have from 20-26 players we are just not important and we will never be that’s a fact but that doesn’t mean we can’t built a competitive scene with what we have and we shouldn’t blame Nintendo either they sell their product for the casual audience and for them the game is fine.

[@quillion3rdoption]

@@lacasadelvideojuego3880 Eh, tbh both casual and competitive extremes are bad. On one end, leaving a game "casual" leaves little room for gameplay depth beyond zone-spamming. But the competitive end sacrifices intuitive gameplay for balance, leading to mechanical bloat. Still, I'd argue that Smash needs a more synergistic slight rework of its gameplay.

[@lacasadelvideojuego3880]

@@quillion3rdoption hard to do, we are consumers of an industry and that industry has no interest on minorities, we could blame them all we want but at the end of the day is their business and sabotage is impossible because like I said we are a minority.

[@Rickxekken]

How I feel about this is, casual players slowly leaving a 6 year old game. Where most single player content are exhausted. The ones remaining are the die-hard, competitive players. Who are people who have to deal with the bad online features, and the balance and match ups of Fighter Pass 2. Which are easily the worst parts of the game. That was me a year ago or so. I was so exhausted where I can barely find matches on Elite Smash, and the only ones there are people who play extremely well. I either get matches that are mentally draining, or needing to deal with the game going 5 frames per second. Usually both. But then, my Nintendo Online expired and I decided not to extend it. Since then, I still play Smash Ult whenever I may. It became a comfort-food kinda game. Where I just fight CPUs in auto-pilot, and genuinely just relaxing. Or, I have friends over, where games are not competitive at all, and we usually laugh until our stomachs hurt due to how something ridiculous happened. I find myself slowly loving this game again. There's just something magical seeing Mario fighting Sora on Shadow Moses. This game is really a dream come true and it's easy to forget that.

[@CartoonEric]

Well said.

[@MrGameguyC]

People don't seem to recognize they're in the Old Married Couple phase with Smash, which leads to them hyper focusing on the negatives and finding new problems they didn't have before.

[@The_SafeKeeper]

You don't have to hyper focus on Ultimate to find it insufferable now. I'm not a competitive player, but Sonic, Mr G&W, R.O.B. and the plethora of overpowered DLC cheese destroyed our local club. Starting around 2022, every new member who joined was maining one of these characters, and so the rest of us who played Ultimate for the roster variety simply stopped turning up. Last I heard, the club shut down because the soulless tier whores we left behind realised that playing nothing but dittos was too monotonous even for them.

[@guyfauks2576]

the mechanics are terrible and the balancing is awful

[@yagirlmayalazarus6713]

@The_SafeKeeperYou say that but who did everyone in your club play before 2022?

[@Cattildo]

@The_SafeKeeper how is that any different watching melee and seeing the same spacies, marth, and the occasional jiggly, falcon, or peach even that scene is starting to fade into obscurity. I stopped watching when the 5 gods retired and haven't looked back except for maybe zain or amsa. "soulless tier whores" See above.

[@The_SafeKeeper]

@@Cattildo I don't know what you're talking about. What part of 'I'm not a competitive player' did you not understand? That means I don't speak PDF file, so your comment is meaningless.

[@ThatGuy-me8wb]

Because the shift of the meta from "get in there and fight" to "avoid/discourage interaction at all costs" makes the game annoying as shit to play, and boring as shit to watch.

[@greateststam1]

Yea they really need to figure out how to give players more incentive to approach. This is easier said than done in a platform fighter though. Its the reason why we don't see a lot of arena space in most standard fighting games.

[@justsomebird4285]

@@greateststam1if you give the player more options to actively force interaction from an opponent rather than passively force interaction from the opponent the pace of a game increases. Ultimate doesn’t have much in the way of universally available tech skill though much less anything anybody actually frequently uses.

[@mac_chappy]

I called this out Day 1 when I realized when the dodging in this game is too strong I thought it would get patched but it never did. Spot dodge canceling along with with barely any lag on air dodges into frame 3 jumpsquats with no repercussions makes it hard to hit your opponent and doesn't reward you for trying to fight.

[@justsomebird4285]

@ right. And then a few months into the game I noticed there wasn’t any kind of significant tech any character could do it was an issue. No perfect pivot, no kind of viable wavedash. Not kind of defensive tech skill either. Hell in Sm4sh you could utilt out of shield which would make for a better out of shield punish but you can’t do that in Ultimate. Also I noticed that there were a ton of moves you could hit someone’s shield with, especially aerials, that didn’t need to be spaced at all to be safe.

[@EWOODJ]

Meh

[@ironencepersonal9634]

Honestly I can't blame Smash, considering that in most high levels they ignore a solid 50-60% of the game. Like it or not, this ain't a game designed to accommodate no items, no hazards, battlefield only, 1-on-1

[@justice8718]

Have you thought that maybe be casuals and competitors don’t like walk off stages, stages that make their eyes bleed, or are badly designed? Make casual stages actually fun for instance.

[@paradoxzee6834]

So you give every game mode equal attention? You give every charather, every stage equal attention? Or you play what you like the most? I'm sure you are not giving equal time to everything, if you can have a choice why others can't also?

[@BurnerAccount-zg5qj]

​@@paradoxzee6834Because that tiny part of the game is given a huge amount of attention and then people have the gall to treat it like it's "real" Smash

[@HypercatZ]

@@justice8718 Who are you talking to when you say "Make"? To Nintendo or to the casual players? Because, yes, some stages and items are pretty broken, but even when they were more balanced competitive players were never satisfied with them. So Sakurai snapped and said:"Here! Battlefield and omega version for all the stages, so you competitive players can play the game YOUR way!" While at the same time he introduced more chaotic stuff, counting on the fact competitive players would play without it anyway, which made the separation between competitive player and casual players even more intense, with the first ones feeling like the white people of Smash.

[@HypercatZ]

@@BurnerAccount-zg5qj Precisely! "It's tourney rules!" "Git gud!" The kind of people for why Sakurai wants to quit Smash. P.S. I forgot the best one:"Winning is not always important. Just have fun!" While forcing casual players to fight according to their rules and horahorahoraing them. Yeah! Fun!

[@thedevilofparadis6107]

Basically what I'm hearing is that people are gonna complain no matter what.

[@elvinobiakalusi7505]

That is the reality of everything

[@thevangsta9892]

Of course people are gonna complain!! People will nit pick and complain!! Nothing is perfect that's why people complain!!

[@vandagylon2885]

"There is always something to complain about. Why? Because nothing is perfect"

[@pokéman-q7m]

It just goes without saying, don’t always rely on the competitive scenes of video games to determine whether to like something. In other words, just have fun playing the game.

[@thealientree3821]

World of Light being worse than Subspace be like:

[@pokéman-q7m]

@thealientree3821 I’ve enjoyed playing through both.

[@pikminologueraisin2139]

but Ultimate is only fun if you're couch gaming with friend the singleplayer is lackluster and online is too laggy

[@pokéman-q7m]

@@pikminologueraisin2139 I guess you’ll find me boring then…

[@pikminologueraisin2139]

@@pokéman-q7m naah don't say that!

[@Koenji_YB]

Still my Top 5 Games of All Time idrc what other people think

[@davidward9550]

Right? Feels like videos like this are everywhere about everything now. Like it's ok to dislike something but I can't stand the people that'll like, "oh wow this 7 year old whatever no longer meets my specific needs or wants! Bad game! I hate this now and you should too!" If you think like this? Touch grass

[@LexiiAlijaiStan]

FR

[@MasterSprintersan1]

SAME! ♥️

[@Yokai_Yuri]

If you really didn't care as you claim, you wouldn't be commenting this.

[@NickMario1]

SAME I still really like ultimate and it’s still in my top 10 favorite games

[@Feesh322]

One or two more balance patches beyond the final DLC would have been nice. But on the whole, pretty happy with the game's balance and Sakurai definitely accomplished his goals. Whatever Smash 6 will be, it *won't* be Ultimate.

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

I hope it isnt ultimate delixe. I could essily see it being so... but if it were Smash 6 who would you want in // what changes would you want?

[@watermelongaming3698]

@@JoeKVideoGameEssays Remove Mewtwo's tail hurtbox for the love of Arceus 😭

[@dariobenzina]

​​@@JoeKVideoGameEssays I mean I highly doubt that Smash 6 will be an Ultimate DX. Just imagine how many copyrights and rights they should buy once again for third parties before getting even newer ones. It would be expensive as hell.

[@RandomAnimeGamer]

They had exactly two patches after the final DLC, both of which balanced Sora and others. 13.0.1 = Sora 13.0.2 = Balance 13.0.3 = Balance

[@Smeltee1]

@@JoeKVideoGameEssaysWE WANT EEVEE, WE WANT EEVEE

[@lasercraft32]

This is one of the biggest flaws with competitive imo. The stuff people can do when they optimize the game is insane, but it can also be blatantly degenerate. When you're playing to _win_ and the prize is money, everything goes. If spamming or camping or simply running away is the most reliable strategy, you can bet your bottom dollar its what they're gonna do. Reminds me of that one quote: "given the opportunity, players will optimize the fun out of a game." Smash Ultimate has reached that point for a lot of people.

[@ShyGuy-op8vd]

My biggest issue with Ultimate is honestly the incredibly lacking single player content. There are barely any fun side modes like in previous entries, World of Light is such a boring slog, Classic Mode can be fun but does start to feel a bit repetitive after a while, and... that's about it. It really just seems like the characters and reveal trailers got all the focus this time around while everything else felt like an afterthought. I just can't help but feel that Ultimate leaned too far into the hype gaming culture rather than actually fleshing out the content of the game, which is what I'm hoping the next Smash game prioritizes first. But of course, I dare not voice any personal criticisms with Ultimate or else I'll be labeled as an "entitled, ungrateful brat" who's never satisfied with anything and is disrespecting all of Daddy Sakurai's hard work. Ah well... such is life, I suppose.

[@benjaminmedrano4493]

I side with you brother. We are indeed a rare breed in this discussion

[@ShyGuy-op8vd]

@@benjaminmedrano4493 You got that right, and all you need to do to prove it is to just look at most of the comments on this video and their replies, especially some of the top ones.

[@mannysilver211]

Idk.I'd say that's a valid criticism.The game could've used a mode that felt fresh every time you played it.World of light in my opinion is fine for what it is.But it and classic mode can feel repetitive at times, and there isn't anything else in the game that doesn't feel like that.

[@brandonwilliams6119]

Singleplayer Fans really suffer, it’s like you got all these characters but there isn’t really much to do with them.

[@ironencepersonal9634]

I thought WOL was fun :(

[@nindieboy4194]

Smash ultimate is awesome, i would love to play it more but the online is quite not working at all. I mean, some matches are good but too many times its just doesn't work properly and thats crucial for smash. Every millisecond counts. That's why I (if I play) set items on and play just for fun.

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

im so hopeful the next game has good online. it would be sick to be able to play online and not feel like the game is broken ya know

[@Ethan-yd4gn]

This is unironically such a good introspective that creates a cool peer into gaming in general, and what competition does to something meant for fun

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

you arent wrong

[@typhlosion7872]

The community. Yeah, the top tiers may not be the most entertaining, but the way the community goes about it is worse than any other community, and I've been a part of the fortnite and pokemon communities for years, that's how bad it is. The constant death threats to those who play "boring" characters, the top players and commentators not discouraging, sometimes even encouraging or straight up spearheading harassment towards those who play the "lame" characters. If smash had a different community, it would have so much more life. Countless people distancing themselves or outright leaving the scene, some even quitting smash entirely, because of how god awful the community acts, and that's without going into the countless amount of SA situations the community has been in. The Ultimate community is like if 95% of viewers acted like Leffen has acted his entire life. The game has its issues, there's no doubt about that. There are a lot of incredibly unbalanced characters and mechanics. God knows how much I despise Kazuya. Even despite that, though, I would never actively say Kazuya players are talentless and harass them for their character and playstyle choice like so much of the community does.

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

I think the community being fully grassroots has led to some... issues lol. thanks nintendo

[@LG555]

And there you have the reason, why Nintendo tries to snuff out communities from forming around their games/IPs. Because communities always seem to be the worst thing about a game/series.

[@minixlemonade]

Most of the community is nice and great to be around. However, the higher up you go in skill, the trashier they are I will say. There are massive ego problems in the community and it ruins the vibes.

[@HypercatZ]

@@minixlemonade Yeah! I have met even nice competitive players.Such kind people that are really hard to hate. The problem is they are the most quite ones. Too quiet!

[@GooseBibleTunes]

Idk, maybe they just should play those characters in boring ways

[@sebastiennault8466]

But Nintendo doesn’t want you to do tournaments with their game

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

Seeing all the cups die was so sad :

[@crazyfire9470]

They have a built in tourney mode…🤦

[@raam2023]

​@@crazyfire9470Which Is absolute ass

[@givlupi2686]

​@@crazyfire9470And they also get their legal team on your ass if you ever try to host one

[@Nosidda]

​​@@crazyfire9470 Sakurai has been extremely transparent that Smash is meant to be a party game more than a fighting game. In his eyes, trying to play Smash competitively is not far removed from trying to play Mario Kart or Mario Party competitively. Sure, it has competitive modes. But the thing is those competitive modes only really exist because the competitive Smash community kept shouting at him for them. That doesn't necessarily mean he sees Smash as competitive, he really doesn't. He added these modes at fan request, but that doesn't change the way the core of Smash's gameplay is designed. As an example, the game is designed to be played with items and hazards on, but he added the options to turn them off because people asked for it. But because it was designed with items and hazards in mind, it diminishes a lot of what the fun is truly meant to be. It's similar to how the devs of FF7 Remake added a mode that allows you to play the game the same way as the original, but it could only be used in Easy mode due to how the AI works and scales. People begged for it to be available in Normal mode, so they added the option in Rebirth, which made it the worst way to play the game. Often times, the fans really don't know what they actually want when they think they do. Yeah, it has a tournament mode. It's there because fans asked for it, not because Sakurai is pushing for Smash to be more competitive.

[@yagirlmayalazarus6713]

The reason Nintendo hasn’t touched the game is because the game isn’t developed in house by Nintendo. Smash is developed by contracted devs from Sakurai’s company and Bandai Namco. So if they wanted to get them back into the office to make a patch then they gotta all three to discuss terms again and that’s not accounting for if they’ve started on new projects meaning the man power might not be there.

[@Manley156]

Not really correct. Sora is over 70% owned by Nintendo and falls under their first party studio developers. Nintendo or rather Sora hasn't made changes because the game is simply fine and sold millions and is near 7 years of age. It is done, this is what companies do and Ultimate is not a live service game and does not function like other fighters in regards to updates.

[@yagirlmayalazarus6713]

@ That’s also not correct. Sora Ltd is a freelance company. The company you’re thinking of was Project Sora which was a joint company that Nintendo owned 72% of. But they only developed one game before they closed the company which was Kid Icarus Uprising. Bandai Namco now is the main developer of Smash now that they have started Studio S.

[@zetamangads]

Sakurai made Smash for people who are new to the fighting genre. He played fighting games on the arcade, and he knows how much of a learning curve those games can be. Smash is supposed to be the antithesis of fighting games he wanted the game to be approachable, easy to learn, and understand. The Smash community, mainly the melee stans, are the ones that ruined it. Just because melee was a technical game like your typical fighting game doesn't mean that the series should be that.

[@Nebulisreconx]

It’s not the game not the balancing. It’s the players. Gamers now have instant access to cheese via the internet, and will just look up the worst strats just so they don’t loose. It’s the same in every fighting game with online these days.

[@XyamaProductions]

The thing I hate about Ultimate is there isn't trophies

[@Exl6243]

I have to agree with a lot your points, and would like to add onto this: 1. Online is even more annoying now because you have to PAY for it. In previous Smash games, it was fine that Smash online was awful because at the very least, it was free. You didn't have to pay for a crappy service. For the Switch though, you do have to pay for an awful online service that couldn't even do emulation correctly when it launched Ocarina of Time on N64 emulation. 2. It is definitely mind boggling that Smash stopped any meaningful buffs or nerfs after Sora when Nintendo HAS the resources to continue patches. How do I know this? Because Splatoon 3 hit the end of its life cycle months ago, and it STILL has balance patches. Heck it had one November 20, 2024, 2 MONTHS after additional content ended. Nintendo could fix the buggy mess that is Steve and all of his glitches (like PMLG). They could try to nerf all of the campy characters like Sonic, or heck, incentivize interaction by making moves that encourage interaction more rewarding like parrying.

[@brandonwilliams6119]

Speaking of paying for online, it’s crazy how we lost For Fun and For Glory, while instead we got “For $20”

[@yagirlmayalazarus6713]

Because Splatoon is developed in house by Nintendo. Smash isn’t developed by Nintendo but by Bandai Namco and Sakurai’s team. They would have to get the two companies together to discuss making a patch.

[@brandonwilliams6119]

@@yagirlmayalazarus6713 Instead Sakurai dumped lots of money into his KZbin Channel which I enjoyed lots of them but leaving Ultimate to rot is just sad.

[@brandullio]

How does one nerf Sonic?

[@HoboWithAShotgun]

​@@brandullio make him slower and have more lag. Tweak his weight to make him easier to ko. Lots of things to do

[@CaptainFalcon333]

1:59 Mario and Kirby having the fight of their lives.

[@dave9515]

Melee is also super campy lol. People who say it isn't are watching matches blindfolded and don't see the paradigm shift occurring lately.

[@HypercatZ]

Melee is the episode that made Sakurai having the first regrets, because people started abusing of the option of deactivating items.

[@brandonthomsen8929]

Hope next game has less input delay and the online be better, as well as characters have more accurate cannon kits from there games. Ganondorf has no need anymore to be a slower captain falcon, let him use his magic and such.

[@carlrygwelski586]

9:20 This might be an indicator that people are taking things WAY to seriously and stopped having fun with the game because of that reason. They cycle just repeats. Enjoy life while you're here, you might not live to see the next game.

[@darkglass3011]

My only complaints: 1. Echoe Fighters should have had their own unique move sets 2. Latency issues with online should have rollback netcode to correct it Other than that, I'm fine with Smash's chaos even if some characters are more broken than others.

[@brandonwilliams6119]

There’s so much missed potential with echo fighters, they could’ve repurposed customs moves into said echo fighters like Daisy and Dark Samus having Peach and Samus’ customs for example. They could’ve used the concept itself to add more but the more I think about it, the more I think Sakurai only made up the term so he could sneak Chrom in which means Fire Emblem has 2 echoes, yeah there’s Dr. Mario but they don’t count him as an echo for some reason and Luigi evolved into his own characters as the games went on.

[@Morphop3]

@@brandonwilliams6119 Dr. Mario isn't an echo because his moveset is too different from Mario.

[@SeaToon]

2:11 I know this isn’t what you meant by this, but this is actually why I like to play time matches rather than stock when with a party of people, because then everyone can play the game until the end, and nobody has to sit there and watch til it’s over

[@youcantbeatk7006]

Is the entire Smash community just its esports scene? Genuine question. I remember years ago I could click on videos about Smash and find all kinds of players talking about all kinds of things, but now everything is just about esports history.

[@Nikolas0269]

That's the reason why Smash 6 for Switch 2 will be rebooted as a whole.

[@Stardust_Torna]

I loved For Fun and For Glory on Smash 4 and honestly, For Fun kept me entertained until I got a switch and Ultimate. The spirit of For Fun from what I've played still lives on in Playground arenas which keeps me playing Ultimate.

[@deedeedeedeedeedeedeedeedeedee]

Its sucked since the honeymoon period ended, and i realized it has a bunch of input lag.

[@DrCoeloCephalo]

The reason Project M and HDR are beloved because aggressive playstyles are rewarded thanks to the implementation of the perfection of Melee's mechanics. Smash Ultimate, 4 and Brawl reward campiness. Neither casuals or competitive players enjoy campiness. It's clearly not a "COVID" issue with Ultimate's DLC characters. Have you forgotten how the final Sm4sh competitive tournament was a Bayonetta ditto? All the DLC additions from 4 went unchanged and unbalanced until the next game. Ultimate is just doing that same thing as if they never learned from Bayonetta in 4.

[@justsomebird4285]

Ultimate is actually doing the same things for 4 did while also not doing the things 4 did right, and the things 4 did right are basically what Melee and Project M do right but just less so. There is basically no legitimate tech skill in Ultimate except for some niche character specific stuff. No microspacing like with perfect pivoting or wavedashing. And new mechanics like parrying just aren’t strong enough at all. In Melee, projectile camping can be countered by every character regardless of moveset because perfect shielding can reflect projectiles. In Ultimate parrying a projectile literally provides zero benefit. And you have to already be shielding to do that. So annoying characters that just avoid interacting with you then do 50-80% off one conversion if you do try to push the pace like Steve just have to be played carefully against without any deliberate counterplay

[@DrCoeloCephalo]

@@justsomebird4285 So true! Because combos are so linear, even if you get in against a projectile character, it is hard to really get a combo going as opposed to Melee or PM where even getting a single hit will open up a flowchart.

[@hbtwov8227]

anyone who has seriously played hdr or p+ would never use the word perfection in the same sentence. they have their own problems which leads to characters like project+ lucario or 3.0 mewtwo or duck hunt in HDR. but they're moving in the right direction.

[@DrCoeloCephalo]

@@hbtwov8227 Better than not touching it afterwards, hence my point about 4 Bayo lol.

[@hbtwov8227]

@@DrCoeloCephalo don't know about that, melee had even less updates than 4 and to an extent brawl and then game turned out fine. issue is more them trying to sell DLC. Why would anyone buy a character if they're bottom 3?

[@superjesse645]

I'm still upset that they never added Rayman.

[@InsertQuarterPlz]

I JUST WANT FOR GLORY AND FOR FUN🗣🗣🗣🗣🗣🗣🗣

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

THIS KIRBY IS SPEAKING THE LANGUAGE OF THE GODS

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

but fr for glory was so nice to swap characters and not stress over a meanless rank elo. (even tho it has a hidden one, it was just nice to try and play and not feel mad when losing lol) while for fun was just so funny loool smash 4 is the goat

[@dashinxkatchin]

TAAAAALK

[@Stardust_Torna]

Loved For Fun, kept me playing Smash 4 untill I got ultimate. thankfully it's spirit lives on in Playground arenas which keeps me playing Ultimate at this point

[@carnage0685]

@@Stardust_TornaPlayground absolutely does not resemble For Fun in any way. It much more closely resembles the chaos of Basic Brawl

[@Thedawg2604]

My biggest problem is that 90% of the players just play eithou any items, stage hazards, final smashes or fun. At this point why even buy the game if you're not gonna use two thirds of it?

[@sergeanthuman]

Cause its annoying dying to factors outside of your control

[@sicklysweetdenouement]

Firstly, I think you are overstating the ratio on players here. Regardless, the awnser is simple. Nintendo wants the game to play like a party game. A large chunk of the playerbase firmly disagrees. Having factors that can so widely shift the tide of the match, based on random chance? Great for a party title. But fighting games really aren't good party titles, and Nintendo's attempts at pushing this is just sad.

[@Lightdragon773]

The fandom gave it a bad reputation. From people getting outed due to numerous allegations, the fan base being spoiled, their over attachment to melee, and people losing their shit over the Panda and Nintendo partnership

[@Nefaliss]

It's a game with a lot of issues that have been there since day 1 and never adressed. With the worst of all being the terribly slow Online. If you dont have buddies or locals, Ultimate just feels awful to play. There is also just no more patches or extra content that further change and improve upon the game. Ultimate is far from dead however, especially in Japan where it is still huge. Simply less popular.

[@brandonwilliams6119]

Never forget, you have to beat World of Light if you want to change the menu music and keep in mind WOL is a long monotonous campaign

[@Mike-di3mo]

​@@brandonwilliams6119worl of lightis actually pretty fun for me

[@MetalB1985]

There are no patches anymore, because the team separated. There are probably just a few people to call up, when small technical stuff needs to be addressed and no testers anymore.

[@severath19]

I think that the biggest problem with super smash bros (in general, across ALL of the smash games) is that the game absolutely promotes spamming as a mechanic. And I don't just mean spamming projectiles....I mean spamming a move set like crazy (while weirdly spamming jumping) because it's super exploitative and usually guarantees an absolute kill. It makes the game absolutely unfun to play, even IF you win.....mainly because it's such a frustrating bore to win against a sweaty spammer. You either camp out the player to punish their spam eventually, or you do something exploitative and spammy that out spams their gameplay. I'm honestly surprised no one really talks about this. As it seems to be an obvious loud issue.

[@TopOfAllWorlds]

I'd like to let it be known that this love hate cycle happens to nearly every fighting game.

[@Manley156]

Ultimate is a party game

[@Notaro_D_Ryogami]

its just every video game series really

[@MintJoyPictures]

0:14 Oh hey! That’s us! Jokes aside, great work here! Personally it’s just a topic I’ve wanted to cover for a very long time, but it’s interesting to see this has become a growing sentiment in the community.

[@12DAMDO]

i predicted this all the way back in 2019/2020 when i left the competitive scene and proudly accepted the "filthy casual" status.. because, sure i may not play to win, or be competitive, or play by tournament rules or whatever, and i may not concern myself with metas and tier lists anymore.. but at least i'm having fun.. i blame EVO, of course, but that's just my bias and yes, i do play with items on..

[@Impalingthorn]

This was basically my stance and why I never supported calling Smash a "Fighting Game". People were conflating genres while simultaneously gutting Smash of everything that made it Smash. They basically removed all the fun from the game just to try and make it simulate Fighting Games closer and I think it made Smash worse and muddied the waters for the FGC.

[@varietychan]

4:33 Probably because most patches are small and change a few small things, a new patch would have to completely rewrite basically everything about these characters

[@cheeseburger8448]

yoo what a great video i feel like you had a lot of good points and i'm definitely going to subscribe to see the next one

[@theleaderturtle]

I still love playing Super Smash Bros Ultimate.

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

is fun :))

[@cidtrip2183]

Being good isn’t just winning. It’s winning while everyone else is having fun also.

[@Strawhatsnow]

I played all the smash games growing up since n64 at age 4. Now as I’m reaching my 30s, I still play. Sure I don’t play everyday but this game holds a special place in my heart I’ll always cherish it. I modded my switch recently and gave smash ultimate a new life with characters I’ve always wanted in smash like crash, roxas, and even meme characters. Because of this, I don’t see myself ever stopping. Yeah I can’t play online (it was ass anyways) , but the base game itself (and all the other ones) were amazing. Thank you sakurai. I understand the criticisms and I agree with them. I would love better connection, rollback netcode, better balance etc. But as you said casuals (like me) are fine as is.

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

modding your switch makes ult into such a fun experience. even for online, you can reduce the lag with a mod which is wild lol

[@supersonicstyleatsonicspeed]

Technicals rightfully destroying this putrid community is something that should be brought up as well.

[@chaotixthefox]

I take issue with your portrayal of the game's progression in the first half of the video. You make it sound like the current state is exclusively the natural result of people getting good, when in reality mearly every character mentioned was knocked off their original top spot by nerfs, and characters who replaced them were elevated by buffs, greatly compounding the issue of optimal space utilization.

[@retelefe]

I never cared about competitive and balance, barely played online. And I still dislike Ultimate. It has the best roster of all time, I love most games those characters come from, and they put so much love into the movesets, stages, I love that. But that's about it for me. They clickbaited with a story mode cutscene to build hype before release, and then that was it, no more character interactions for the rest of the game. The characters where so easy to unlock that seemed to not even matter, in previous entries you felt acomplished because it was hard to unlock everyone and every stage. No break the targets, no trophies, classic mode has only one platform stage... My last nitpick is that the theme songs for both Ultimate and Smash 4 get so repetitive and boring, I don't wanna hear them anymore. I would stay on the menus in Meele and Brawl just to listen to the songs

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

To any older ult fans, yes I am the same dude And yes I will be back when smash 6 comes out.

[@2Dens695]

@@JoeKVideoGameEssays This comment got me curious. I didn’t realize you had another channel! I watched one of your Greninja videos, great analysis. Greninja is my favorite Smash character (I am in no way competitive haha)

[@dawsonbryant56]

Did Nintendo confirm that someone other than sakurai would work on a new smash title cause I'm pretty sure he said he was done after this one

[@jvdude9061]

Competitive players really know how to take the fun out of a game.

[@dianceperez8540]

Tbh they should’ve made a actual Story Mode/Adventure Mode where there’s a constructed builded story to actually make the Pre Render Cutscenes actually feel like your actually in a Story Mode….the fact that the Hub World is basically Smash Run on steriods DIDNT sit right with a lot of fans who was looking forward to a SubSpace Emissary type of Story Mode

[@ghostbaleada]

Path culture ruins meta development. Melee has "never" been patched, and the meta is varied and developing to this date.

[@makotost8425]

No game has ever given me better memories than Smash Ultimate. Thank you for making my high school years enjoyable and bringing me together with so many friends. My life literally would not be the same without this game. Thank you smash ultimate and sakurai

[@mcfry13]

Maybe this is a problem at the competitive level, but this is still one of my favorite games of all time at a casual and semi-competitive level. Heck, even fighting level 9s to kill some time is super fun to me

[@dahuterschuter]

It's the normal Smash cycle after Melee. New Smash releases, people play it and cope with it not being as good as Melee. Glaring flaws come to the surface, but player base tries to maintain it's the hot new thing. New Smash releases a few years later, now the player base can finally admit the last one sucked and move on to the hot new thign that's totally better even though it's not as good as Melee. Glaring flaws come to the surface, but player base tries to maintain it's the hot new thing. New Smash releases a few years later, now the player base can finally admit the last one sucked and move on to the hot new thing that's totally better even though it's not as good as Melee. Etc.

[@DrCoeloCephalo]

Melee will remain immortal and Nintendo has to either cope with that or take advantage of it.

[@gatolf2]

I wouldn’t go as far to insinuate that melee is the best title. It’s loaded with bugs and half the cast isn’t even viable because the balance is atrocious. Not to mention, you have to be ok with wrecking your controller and hands to play it well and good GameCube style controllers anymore are like 70-80 bucks and some are over a hundred.

[@DrCoeloCephalo]

@@gatolf2 Hence why Project M is so good. You get the character balance in addition to the mechanics that reward actual aggression and combo freedom and it has an auto L cancel feature and a switch to help overcome input delay. Why would Nintendo fans pretend to care about bugs and glitches when they proved they will pay through the nose for first party Nintendo games like Pokemon Scarlet and Violet? 🤔 Also isn't the Nintendo GameCube controller pricing thing an issue of Nintendo not producing enough of those anyway? Pretty sure the multibillion dollar corporation can afford to make more of those instead of flimsy joycons, can't they?

[@187bronco]

😂 melee is garbage and only kept alive by the same 10 players with autism

[@EWOODJ]

Melee has always been overrated. Being loud can do that

[@TNinja0]

That's the nature of games. Once the most optimal way to win exists, everyone goes there. And if the optimal way to win happens to be annoying, or not fun, that's how it's gonna be.

[@puchkix2276]

0:16 It really isn’t. It’s the meta around the game that people don’t like. Casual players don’t complain about the games as much as competitive players because they aren’t play optimally which would usually mean playing a lame character. The last 3 smash games had lame characters in high and top tier.

[@HDMFanatic]

What exactly do you mean by "lame characters"?

[@israelrocha1831]

​@@HDMFanaticCharacters those playstyle and counterplay revolves in avoiding interaction. Either becuause their advantage state is unfairly oppresive or are imposible to pin down at neutral/disadvantage (Or both like Brawl MK). It can manifest in projectile spammers, characters that have very high mobility or others who take stocks with low risk-high reward options, usually in a few interactions.

[@HDMFanatic]

@@israelrocha1831 Can't that "lameness" be literally any character in Ultimate though? Even someone as low tier as Little Mac can be "lame" by that definition, just not as extremely "lame" as characters like Steve

[@israelrocha1831]

@@HDMFanatic Of course, it's just that some characters lean to it much harder than others. And that's disregarding tiers, focusing more on character specific design. I think it comes down if the counterplay is engaging at a high level.

[@shaneh3109]

How can anyone hate this game. It's awesome. The only thing that woulda made it better is more dlc. I would have absolutely kept giving them money. Keep balancing etc. The gane isn't meant to be played by pros...it's meant to have items on and people at a party having fun

[@sonicthefox2478]

Admittedly, I do think a lot of the balance in this game was designed around the items. Something I've noticed from playing in 1 vs 1s with my brother (We're about the same skill level, items or not.), is that items can make a game of camping and waiting turn into a very tense and nail biting game. Say a bomb-omb spawns? Ignoring who grabs it first, this gives the character who grabbed it a time limit to use what can be a killing blow to the opponent. If you don't throw it in time or drop it, you blow up and die instead. This makes it to where characters that would normally be at a disadvantage against steve or kazuya, now have a chance since they can get a kill on the opponent quicker if they are skilled enough to know how, and when to use said items when they appear. Items like poke balls and assist trophies are a bit too random for this, as are smash balls, but I think most items have a specific purpose competetively that no one seems to be considering. Smash Ultimate doesn't have to be melee two. It can be its own thing, and to be fair, it is a fighting game with items, and the items have to be considered when balancing said fighting game. A good example of this balance can be seen with Little Mac, who has no projecticles or easy ways to get back to the stage. But there are items for these issues, granted it isn't garunteed to spawn due to randomization, but if it spawns, Little Mac suddenly has a chance to deal with annoying problems in his tool kit which feels intentional. I know I hear competitive smash players hate random factors, but maybe it is worth looking at items again just to see if maybe that can fix the meta a bit and make it more fun for folks again. Just an outsider's two cents, though.

[@Heavy_Blues]

Competitive players have a rare mental illness where they're only capable of experiencing fun when they're winning. Making a game where you can have fun regardless of the result is ableist, and we need to maximize accessibility for these poor, struggling comp players.

[@RTU130]

It's just a bad game with ugly graphics. Smash 4 somehow had better graphics despite being on a weaker console

[@thetonberryslair]

That's objectively false

[@Raylightsen]

I wish it has the melee art style. The new one looks way too childish and kiddy friendly.

[@DAFORCEFilms]

My guess is something unremarkable and so obscure that it’s only noticeable to those top 0.01% competitive players whose entire career is based around exploiting a balance issue or their playstyle has been blocked by some balance issue.

[@MBYui]

Steve next question

[@kyuubifox33]

I don’t hate it. I still love playing today. I’m ready for the next game and hope for an even fatter roster.

[@ViceN53X]

I'm still disappointed they didn't put in all of Kazuya's movesets into the controls. Would have been a lot more interesting to see how the Kazuya mains in Tekken would apply that skillset onto Smash.

[@carlitosdinkler5213]

he would've been more cancer than he already is

[@mayobot4590]

They would still play exactly how they do now because of the optimal way to play him and how he's designed. There is no reason to waste your time learning all those inputs when 95% percent of them are useless and only 5 get used.

[@diamondmemer9754]

This is what happens when you turn videogames into a "sport" Play with someone that actually wants to have fun

[@Rizzy_K]

The game is boring now. Been 6 years I’m so over it

[@poppyfrancis7338]

Genuinely, so many issues with Smash stop happening once you stop taking it seriously. This is a game for kids and meganerds alike, go turn on the items and play it with more than one other person on a map that doesn't suck but still has stage hazards and you'll remember what this game really is

[@TeeArCreep]

if it actually was a good game, maybe people would still like it

[@DrCoeloCephalo]

Like Melee lol

[@Bluzlbee]

which is true, games like KOF98um are timeless

[@Melonposting]

I can't believe competitive Smash players would be contrarian and dissatisfied with something that everyone else likes, who could have ever predicted this?

[@unknownsoldier6731]

Smash ultimate is a sorry excuse of a modern online game. Online games on Xbox 360 were more capable of the bare minimum.

[@EWOODJ]

🙄

[@BleedingDaze01]

I'm not a very competitive player, so this is all coming from someone who favors single player mode. I don't hate Ultimate or even dislike it, but I do feel like there could have been some improvements and even so better effort into some things. World of light was in short a letdown for me. I remember getting this game day 1 thinking world of light was going to make up for the lack of story mode in smash 4 and.... well..... it was really mid. Like honestly I almost preferred smash run. Compared to the Subspace Emissary, World of light felt like a discounted knockoff. It was so mid to me I actually dropped it after like a week and only decided to come back and finish it last year (6 years after release) out of randomly struck guilt. It had like 4 or 5 cutscenes and the only ones that stood out for me were the first and last. The first one was a great introduction but ultimately (hehe pun) was where the mode blew it's load. The few in-between only featured characters that were mandatory to unlocked, which for the most part featured the same couple of faces we always see. Kirby, Mario, Samus, Fox, Link, etc. Then the last cutscene was beautiful sure but it still felt like it was missing somewhat of a conclusion (or maybe I just need to watch it again). I'm also admittingly bitter because I know what Sakurai is capable of but if you know the reason why the world of light is the way it is in comparison to Brawl's story mode, you'll probably know why I feel like it's somewhat him being petty and giving us a halfhearted story mode but that's a whole other rant I'm not going into right now. Then there's the characters. I won't bother going into the surplus of fire emblem characters and still somehow NO SECOND SONIC CHARACTER thing, but some of them just get stale after a while. Speaking of Sonic, take him for example. Yeah I'm always glad to see him but how has he NO other specials yet? He's had plenty of games in-between Brawl and Ultimate and you mean to tell me his specials STILL are all spin dashes? Sonic can do more than just roll, and run. Other characters also have move sets that haven't been updated since they've been introduced and some have move sets that were kinda just odd. How did they miss EVERY SINGLE OPPERTUNITY to put Ness' PSI Rockin and Lucas' PK love into their move sets? That's their most iconic psionic abilities! Smash 4 on the 3ds had a great feature that allowed you to customize character specials in setting so that could solve issues to appease both people who want the old moveset and people who want to mix it up. Despite these gripes, I once again don't hate Ultimate. I do think it's fun for a while if you're in the mood but if I had to choose between playing it and brawl, I'd go back to brawl (when it comes to story mode and other single player activities). I don't regret buying it but I wish I didn't pay full price for it.

[@midoriluma705]

The community is the only bad thing about smash ultimate if I’m being honest.

[@thegingerrobot]

It's hard for me to be surprised when the general community for SSBU tries to play the game in a very technical, competitive way, when the purpose of designing the series was meant to be a party-like, casual fighting game.

[@GokuMcDuck]

Smash Bros was ruined forever when they added Minecraft into it.

[@Kafei01]

Exactly. Playing him is fun but fighting him is not. I saw that coming from miles away and saddly I was right, I never have fun when I fight against a Steve player.

[@Sparker-d8r]

If you get mad at a character, learn them. If you don't want to turn into one of those players, then don't lose to them.

[@carnage0685]

Bad DLC ruined this beautiful game

[@FreakinSweet1987]

It's still my second favorite game of all time. I had no idea people hated it.

[@pneuvac]

Do people know how much of a hassle it is to be a crossover game sometimes the people who own the ips you wanna collab with sometimes are very picky with how their character is depicted.

[@ODINxMOON]

I love this game. I can spend all night running online duos with a friend

[@Alizamk1]

I think the game suffers from a lack of content. and world of light isn't very good

[@Manley156]

You've got to be kidding

[@Alizamk1]

@@Manley156 no

[@Mike-di3mo]

​@Alizamk1i like world of light man

[@redgerran]

I personally don't think people hate it now any more than they did when it first came out. There have always been platform campers, and while a good chunk of us get tilted when we lose, most of us are totally fine with getting in there and taking risks. I think the only ones who have really suffered from characters like Sonic or Steve are the top-level competitive players, but honestly, I think that's best for everyone. It's a game we play to have fun, not to be the best in the world at. (Also, it was really fun to see one of my videos shown at 0:12 even if it didn't really fit the "smash ultimate is bad" search)

[@lightvoid7089]

What killed the game for me is it having no online leaderboard. How am I supposed to prove that I'm the best online player without a leaderboard? And also, there's just nothing to work towards once you get into elite smash. 😕

[@KevCast]

For me it was definitely the online that killed my drive for this game, it's almost unbearable to play with lag + buffer mechanics and is really one of the only reliable ways to practice against real players at or near your skill level. It made trying to compete in this game a chore, and coupled with the other issues you mentioned, just didn't make the grind fun or worth it imo.

[@JesusDaLawd]

Ive always hated ultimate from the beginning, i still loved alot of what smash 4 did it was nearly perfect

[@cd7848]

Bayonetta

[@JesusDaLawd]

@cd7848 yea unfortunately that did happen at the very end of its life cycle

[@brandonwilliams6119]

Ultimate is just a Smash 4 port anyway🤷‍♀️🤣 Still has the same devs Bandai Namco

[@JaycodaJr]

Maybe this is because I’m not chronically fused to my couch, but I could never say I hate Smash, let alone Smash Ultimate. I used to play in tournaments and I still play with my friends to this day. Online still sucks, but that is something we’ve more or less just gotten used to. At least my online practice makes me better at the in-person battles that really matter. Ultimate is the best entry in the series so far… although Melee fans will argue over it, tooth and nail. I can’t believe it’s already 2025 now. I feel like I remember this game’s launch in December of 2018 like it was yesterday. I am grateful for this game, truly. All the positive aspects far outweigh any of the flaws, so I will never dare to take this game for granted.

[@minieval_6391]

"What happened over COVID?" Lack of in-person tournaments = less data to know who was actually strong vs just being a wifi warrior. By the time we got the last patch, in-person tournaments were only starting to pick back up.

[@supersparks25]

Smash Ultimate isn’t just a video game. Smash isn’t just a love letter to the people that love Smash or fighting games. Super Smash Brothers Ultimate is a love letter to the very idea of video games. To the entire video game industry. The amount of quality put into every single characters, except Sonic’s, moveset. All of the references in their spirit fights. Every single piece of chosen music. The way they included Mii’s and the absolute hype behind the character reveals. Minecraft getting a whole character. This game is so special. There will never be another game like Smash Ultimate. It is honestly a little disappointing that Ultimate had to end. I wish it could’ve just gone on forever, adding character after character that people loved with all the quality behind it as those before. It sucks that Fortnite is seen as the biggest crossover when this game is the one that really deserves it just based off of work and quality. Smash Ultimate is one of the greatest video games ever created.

[@TheRedRationalist]

The player base is toxic, online sucks even tho you gotta pay for it and theres still fundamental issues with c stick aerials and buffering that never did and never will get addressed.

[@f687sNFM]

Pay to win, existed in sm4sh, will continue to exist

[@Jesus-hu4lq]

Its crazy how the fanbase and even in the fgc want a game where they can just rushdown and avoid defensive style gameplay and but overtime it does change to a campy spacing game once you figure out the meta. My grips with the game was mostly online i don't like the elite smash smash i would've preferred for glory or for fun again the ability to change a character after a match would be good too. They seem to give up trying to balance the cast and they didn't want to nerf pass 2 except min min apparently if they had more to offer the sora patch nerf g&w steve rob sonic to the ground buff the low to mid tiers and a few underused characters could've been good

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

Why did they remove my og main Pichu from the game with nerfs and never put him back to full power 🫠

[@JoeKVideoGameEssays]

most wildly. why did they BUFF boring characters like sonic and samus. They both got huge buffs and im like... why? I understand wanting diverse good playstyles but maybe dont buff the most degenerate characters past mid tier my guys

[@Jesus-hu4lq]

@@JoeKVideoGameEssays most of the cast should have their op day 1 moves to compete with the 2 dlc pass characters pichu included

[@minixlemonade]

@@JoeKVideoGameEssays Sakurai does not care about the competitive side and never will

[@ZachaRicO]

Smash is a series I enjoy for its crossover aspect. Seeing characters who would otherwise never interact with each other in situations that they would otherwise never find themselves in is a lot of fun. Ultimate should, by all accounts, be the pinnacle of crossover magic, but because my brothers and I have gotten so good at Smash over the 20+ years we've been playing it, we take it more seriously and eliminate all the things that make the game chaotic in favor of no-nonsense skill-based 1v1s. In other words, it's not about the characters we're playing as and who's the most fun; it's about who can win the game for us. I say give us more solid single-player content in the next game that gives us the chance to unwind and not worry nearly as much about winning or losing. Ultimate's offerings in that arena are the worst in the series' history: easily the biggest flaw in an otherwise stellar game.

[@Cyrus_Nagisa]

"Why does everyone HATE Smash Ultimate now?" No... not everyone, just the overly competitive people that really need to find something else to do.

[@ultraspinalki11]

That sucks. *_Goes back to playing fun Brawl mods_*

[@thenineironman1260]

What happened after COVID? The allegations... No way was Nintendo giving Smash Ultimate, nor its players, anything at all after misconduct allegations, and admissions, in the competitive scene started flying.

[@nekoblue77]

Why do I hate the game now? • Horrible patches and a lack of patches too soon after the last DLC. • An obvious focus on quantity over quality throughout the entire cast of characters • A horrible camping meta. Even if you dont play comp, every comp wannabe player will play like this with their shiternet. • The horrible input delay + how bad online is, making it impossible to reasonably practice let alone have fun. • Atrocious single player options. • The absolutely atrocious character designs of certain characters, especially in the DLC, that basically force a camp or die counterplay, and just are blatantly pay to win. • The complete lack of a training mode basically. • Spirits basically being nothing more than stat modifiers and adding barely anything of actual substance to the gameplay. • Online lacking certain modes from offline like squad strike, and even disallowing couch co-op in arenas, which was literally something you could do in smash 4 And overall the complete package just not coming together. The game is slow, has one of the worst onlines in the genre, has some of the worst built in latency of any fighting game, has a meta that revolves almost entirely around camping, designed a liteny of characters with no consideration as to how they are to actually fight against, added mechanics that serve no purpose but further punishing aggressive play and or just make movement and responsiveness even worse, and there are better, more affordable and more customizable games in the genre. It literally just isnt a fun game outside of casuals with items, and even in that category, previous smash games, specifically Brawl, are superior. The one thing it has to set itself a part, that being the character roster size, is nothing but a novelty that doesn't really matter. The game could have twelve characters I'd never heard of but if it was fun and actually handled well at all, I'd play it. Oh wait, Rivals of Aether already exists. Literally just go play that.

[@heyhackurs]

Don't forget -Adventure/Story "Mode" is just a glorified series of Event Match and no unique environments or terrains like SSE, or even on a small scale like Melee's Adventure mode (which I would vastly prefer over World of Dogsh!!t) I've been playing Slap City recently and it's Story/Adventure mode gets so many things right on a fraction of the budget of Smash Ultimate. "B-But people who dislike Ultimate are just entitled" for not slurping Sakurai's knob.

[@nekoblue77]

Lmao right? WoL isn't even just event matches it is inarguably worse because 90% of it can just be auto won by having a lvl 99 legendary which you can get minutes in on a fresh save. Literally only like 2 cutscenes with horrible voice acting might I add, and the only things that are truly unique, being the Galeem/Dharkon fights or playing as master hand, are boring and cannot be repeated without replaying the entire game respectively. The best part of the entire thing and you can only do it once every 30 hours. Cool. Oh and don't you dare try to go in no frills without spirits because you will face nigh impossible challenges just for not wanting to cheese everything, just because your number is lower. Real cool.

[@metaknightjudgesyoursins4710]

@@nekoblue77Even though this wasn’t in the convo. This is why I decided to mod Smash Ultimate. Unlike most people now, I like the game.. even today and even with all it’s problems. But I just felt the game could’ve been better… and those issues addressed my problems right there. It would’ve been nice to have a patch even after DLC.. or hell even post DLC content like free costumes and shit- My boys Sonic and Pac Man have the SHITTIEST costumes in the entire game and yet Shulk gets a alternate costume of him in his swimwear. . . Br u h- Like I said, I like this game.. I think it’s not as bad as everyone says (unless you’re saying Online that.. that is undoubtedly ass).. but I can see why people don’t like it-

[@nekoblue77]

​​@@metaknightjudgesyoursins4710 I just dont understand how shit like the 6 frame input delay, and the fucking horrible short hop macro, and basic shit like not designing characters that are blatantly ass to fight and have done nothing but harm to the game, like Kazuya or Min Min, was just, never addressed in the years this game was being developed and supported. You're telling me not one person play tested the game during any of that and thought "Hmm, maybe having a significant delay before everything, not having shield dropping and forcing a short hop every time you wanna do a quick aeriel, is ass." And theres literally no way any of the staff played against Min Min ever because they would've realized in 5 seconds that she's literally the worst designed smash character of all time and is the definition of anti-fun. Like, hello? That's what games are supposed to be for? To have fun? Could you start designing it like that and make it not feel like I'm fighting my controller and the opponent's wallet more than I'm actually fighting them? Is that so much to ask?

[@donaldjgumpofficial5754]

The game also lacks in interesting tech/movement options. The ground feels so sticky.

[@mccsnackin]

This video could just be a tweet that says, “Smash Ultimate: this game is old.”