How to FIX the WORST Stages in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate

[@TIN_Tevlev]

Part 2: kzbin.info/www/bejne/Y5S6aoGjbMSXjNEsi=SlLMrJLyHhKcTPnr

[@Beanie6900]

Could you post some of these custom stages that you made be posted I'd love to play them because they fo look genuinely fun

[@Beanie6900]

I was trying to say do but the F just kept coming back AAAA

[@TIN_Tevlev]

@@Beanie6900 Here's the ID for New Gaur Plain, RYQCFJXC - It's the one I consider to work as a stage outside of just being a concept😆

[@orangeslash1667]

@@TIN_Tevlev I think the reason 75 m was chosen instead of 25 m, is because 75 is more brutal. Since Donkey Kong games are known for intense difficulty, Sakurai thought it be fitting to have a stage to reflate that.

[@DNet-89]

I would fix 75m by having each of the 4 stages transition like the Fire Emblem stage Siege Castle. It doesn't fix it but it only appears ¼ of the time now

[@rueme4228]

It could transition by moving upwards in 4 segments since DK climbs the ladder at the end of each stage. The last stage could transition only if you hit all of the yellow square things. Just a thought

[@copynpastekevin4389]

@@rueme4228so pretty much Rumble falls but with the arcade DK layout instead? I like it

[@miner11realnofake]

I wouldve probably made it where it transitions ONLY IF you defeat your opponent in a multi stock game, like the original where after defeating DK it boots you to the next level, and with one stock matches, just make your preferred stage selectable from the stage select screen

[@SamLabbato]

addendum. instead of having the cycle on a loop, make DK a boss that players can kill, when he takes enough damage it switches stages

[@jomaq9233]

What gets me is that 75m probably would’ve been massively improved as a stage if the big platform at the bottom from the original arcade game was still an actual platform in Smash and not converted into a background element (one of the very few creative liberties taken with the stage layout turned out to be the one thing that majorly ruined the stage imo lol)

[@MizunoKetsuban]

They did it that way because it was impossible to stand on it in the original game without dying.

[@jomaq9233]

@@MizunoKetsuban I guess (still think making it an actual platform in Smash would’ve solved at least 50% of what’s wrong with that stage) I haven’t seen anyone on the internet discuss that aspect of the stage design besides Nathaniel Bandy for some reason

[@TIN_Tevlev]

Maybe they removed the floor so there would somewhere to actually fall off + that makes it too easy to ignore the whole rest of the stage, since people would probably be drawn to fight on the that floor instead...............which should have made them realize the stage sucked

[@JavierPietri-qg6kp]

Yes that’s exactly what that needs.

[@SleepyLuigi]

Yeah.

[@BeanoNintendo]

A lot of these "direct rip" stages would be better fits for a Melee style Adventure Mode

[@timohara7717]

I'd actuslly be able to solve solve too

[@orangeslash1667]

@@timohara7717 I think the reason 75 m was chosen instead of 25 m, is because 75 is more brutal. Since Donkey Kong games are known for intense difficulty, Sakurai thought it be fitting to have a stage to reflate that.

[@zsugarant8447]

Funny thing about your 75m factory concept: that's exactly how the factory levels look in Returns, including a robot DK.

[@brandonwilliams6119]

It really would’ve fit Brawl’s realistic aesthetic too

[@carnage0685]

No. Pac Land is actually great. It's so horrible that it's actually good. It's fucking hilarious playing on this stage.

[@TIN_Tevlev]

sounds like a lot of hoopla to me!!!!!!!!!

[@deserted4ever]

it’s true I can’t help but enjoy the stupid ways people KO on it

[@micahrobbins8353]

It may be ugly, but it's surprisingly playable

[@noahhamilton5974]

​@@TIN_TevlevHOOPLA!

[@Juno_Gin]

Thank you, this stage is so fucking funny.

[@boygame1955]

imo The best retro stages are the ones that aren't trying to recreate an old visual but rather be a reimagining; like the Zelda2 Temple, Ice Climber Summit & Punch-Out Boxing Ring.

[@KiwiAsh]

I really hate how all the kirby stages dont go over super star like just WHY?! why dont have a planet robobot stage?! Or a triple deluxe stage?!?! Instead we just get greens greens like if it was green hills

[@AveryTurner-ot9hx]

Toy tracks from epic yarn

[@KiwiAsh]

@@AveryTurner-ot9hx i just dont know why sakurai just doesnt accept mordern kirby at all i swear if in smash 6 instead of adding a forgotten land stage they just a kirby superstar one i swear i will do something

[@Gestersmek]

I remember way back before Ultimate was even announced, there was a fake leak featuring a stage based on Kirby Air Ride's City Trial. It wouldn't have been modern by any means, but it would have been *something.*

[@KiwiAsh]

@@Gestersmek the worst things is that it happens in songs too.. almost all of the remixes are before air ride except for one exception being the squeak squad main theme but aside from that all the music selection is just -first level music -the boss music -sakurai favorite song from the ost Like for example why the hell do we have sky tower IN SMASH?! Why dont put idk any other soundtrack or a remix for a song??? I think its a crime they didnt added "vs void termina" or "vs astral birth" to ultimate like we just have 2 songs for star allies like i know it was new but still

[@brandonwilliams6119]

If Sakurai is brought back for Smash 6 the meme of Kirby not having a modern stage from a game released after Superstar might age like a fine wine, ffs F-Zero has a GX stage Port Town Aero Dive, a game released in 2003, Earthbound has a Mother 3 Stage in New Pork City, from a 2006 game, Kirby only has stages from the 90s, let that sink in.

[@MrSkerpentine]

I do love that you did incorporate casual unconventional layouts like the walls in Guar Plain instead of just using the Brawl mod go-to of just making it Pokemon Stadium 2 or Yoshi’s Story but with a different background

[@Epicboy099]

Same because unlike them he's actually doing good stage design, competitive smash players aka 90% of the community somehow are DEATHLY allergic to change, and it's funny to see that instead of just making comp stages using the stage builder they just put every match on pokemon stadium, surprising how the stage hasn't become boring yet.

[@cosmicspacething3474]

People when the *Platformer* Fighing Game has *Platforming* stages: 🤬

[@sheridan5175]

@@Epicboy099 Stage builder for actual competitive stages sounds like a pain and it's also completely unnecessary. There's enough variation in the stages we have, people just need to stop defaulting to stadium

[@drakejoshofficialyoutubech5569]

@@Epicboy099 Stagebuilder for competitive stages could be cool, but you can only do so much with it due to there only being 3 options for blastzone size. The main issue would be getting the community to agree on something considering the community can't even agree on a stage list in general. Also Stadium being boring isn't that hot of a take among spectators, the issue is that the competitors flying out to events are the ones who love to just play almost exclusively on that stage.

[@Epicboy099]

@@drakejoshofficialyoutubech5569 yeah, it's surprising on how many people in the smash comp scene are deathly allergic to unique stage design and change in general.

[@DarkOverlord96]

Smash players when the platform fighter has platforms

[@TexTheGuy]

Real

[@RF-Ataraxia]

Madness

[@ieatbugs45]

Platforms are kind of horrible in this game sometimes especially with how sticky they are

[@Phelsuman]

how about a beat them all with 300 characters on screen ? how about a rythm game with 3 music playing at once dark lord ? HOW ABOUT A EFIN ZELDA GAME WHERE EVERY SINGLE METER OF THE MAP IS AN UNSKIPABLE PUZZLE ?????!!!!!! YOU WANT PUZZLE IN YOUR ADVENTURE PUZZLE RPG DON'T YOU DARK OVERLORD 96 !!!!!!!!!!!!????????

[@SageArdor]

​@@Phelsumanit's been three weeks, have you had a good breather, yet?

[@justad00d76]

Hannenbow is the worst stage in smash I'd improve it by making it a flat stage omega stage with that green background so you just use it for green screen vids

[@TIN_Tevlev]

HUH!

[@borkbork9541]

PM gave hanenbow a proper main stage but kept a few leaves as platforms so you could dynamically shift the way you play the level by hitting them but you still have the Main stage; it adds a fun gimmick that doesn't throw out the entire base of the game

[@jmurray1110]

The bubbles make it worse for greenscreening

[@phorchybug3286]

Honourable mention: the Mario Kart 8 Circuit. You got a constantly shifting landscape AND cars that just kill you in weird angles.

[@Josue_S_6411]

That's a pretty fun stage. Honestly better than Figure 8 Circuit.

[@Rinsankajugin]

Isn't Pac-Land the reason why Super Mario Bros exists? Like, imagine if modern Mario games were sequels to the OG Mario Bros games, still stuck in the sewers... festering... Also, Hanna-Barbera Pac-Man cartoon.

[@tailsBOOM1992]

Correct, it is genuinely an important game even if it hasn't visually stood the test of time and as remembered as other games from the time period.

[@jmurray1110]

And altered beast sold the genesis sometimes influential games aren’t actually that good

[@XBC3403]

I like the idea you had for Guar Plains, but i would go about it slightly differently. FIrst i would have it that the arches normally reach high enough that you can't get above them. only able to bounce off their underside. Secondly Instead of going a more generic stage floating in the middle of the area Id want to try a go for a layout that would stay a bit more unique while still emphasizing the size of the area. making it still a really large stage just easier to get around compared to the original. Id also aim to try and incorporate pieces from the region of the original game. like the main platform could be potentially made by one of those large mushroom looking platforms in Raquel lake. As for what Metal face could do, he could do the same thing as before. appearing to harass and attack the stage altering it. times he could destroy one or both of the arches which would then fall connecting and resting atop the main platform destroying any platforms on its side, and would make the stage temporarily a walk off on the respective side.

[@ehhorve857]

can you use text lines to show a stage? like thisV _ I _ __I_______I__ \ / / \ / \

[@Waltman13]

I feel like Stage 2's problem could easily be fixed by just using Tetris to represent the Game Boy as opposed to Kirby's Dream Land.

[@TIN_Tevlev]

That's such a fact

[@jmurray1110]

Depends how they balance the hazards

[@prestige8477]

6:04 I actually agree with Sakurai's philosophy here. With the online multiplayer focus games have nowadays, you can't make overpowered characters and unfair stages anymore because you can't make house rules. He basically said if someone's being lame or cheap, you tell them to stop or else you unplug their controller, and choke them with it while your friends beat them up. Further, wavedashing was removed from Brawl because not everybody wants to learn how to wavedash and L-Cancel. Likewise the drift system was reworked for Mario Kart Wii because snaking gave many players an admittedly fair advantage, but most people's idea of go karting isn't slamming left and right on the stick or getting last place. If these games didn't have online play, they'd more than likely retain their high level techniques. In fact, Nintendo's reluctance to patch glitches in their single player games is proof of that. They confirmed that they intentionally left many of OOT64's quirks and glitches in tact for the 3DS remake to give a more authentic experience. Meanwhile in MK7 they patch out an ultra shortcut on Maka Wuhu, but only for online play. So yes, online play is good, but we shouldn't let that completely overshadow the fact that some aspects of games were made with house rules in mind. But on the other hand, at least Sakurai had the foresight to remove the normal versions of giant stages like Hyrule Temple, Palutena's Temple, and Great Cave Offensive from the online rotation. My suggestion would be to make online versions of certain stages with subtle changes to make them less cheesy, but we already have Normal, Battlefield, Omega, 8-Player, 8-Player Omega, Hazards off and 8-Player Hazards off (Yes they're technically different) variations of every stage... At this point, I'm 50/50 on how'd they'd want to implement the cheese-free version of stages because the biggest problem I can see is that it sounds like a matchmaking nightmare.

[@sheridan5175]

Wavedashing being removed will never not piss me off tbh Appealing to a competitive audience of "maniacs" and appealing to casual players isn't mutually exclusive, there are better ways to bridge the skill gap between players so everyone can have fun and A LOT OF THEM ARE ALREADY IN THE GAME

[@prestige8477]

​@@sheridan5175 For the sake of game simplicity, they ARE mutually excusive. As a game dev myself I can assure you that the problem you face with advanced mechanics like Wavedashing and L-Canceling is that at a certain point, players HAVE to learn how to do them in order to keep up with the online competition which is something many players don't want to do (myself included). You never want a game with a specific focus to become "exploit this mechanic or lose" because people WILL be sweaty and they WILL exploit the mechanic. It's like fire-hopping in Mario Kart 8 Wii U; the game is supposed to be about drifting and managing your items well, but the focus shifted to firehopping after every boost, which TECHNICALLY adds depth, but not all depth is good because sometimes it can hurt accessibility. In theory, the easy solution for Smash would be a toggle to turn the advanced mechanics off, but in practice, you have to consider Nintendo's current online infrastructure, and I think you'd agree that including even MORE factors to slow down the online matchmaking sounds like a recipe for disaster. As far as old mechanics I CAN see coming back, I think lower traction, ditching the sticky platfoms, keeping your horizontal velocity during jumps and reflecting projectiles with a perfect shield are intuitive and allow for more options during games. A lot of those old mechanics, while fun, make the skill ceiling too high for online and I'd imagine that these are some of the things the dev team had in mind when deciding to remove mechanics.

[@sheridan5175]

@@prestige8477 I just cannot see a problem with making the skill ceiling higher. If you're not willing to get better at the game obviously you'll plateau. This is exactly what skill based matchmaking is for- you don't have to learn any advanced techniques if you're not worried about being good. Raising the skill ceiling doesn't inherently make the game less accessible. I can't even conceive of why someone would think that.

[@prestige8477]

@@sheridan5175 Maybe you PERSONALLY dont't see how it could be a problem, but I know that there are many people with disabilities and illnesses that prevent them from performing advanced techniques even if they ARE willing to get better. As it stands right now, a person with Parkinson's disease or arthritis while maybe not being able to play for long, can still pick up a controller and get a top placement in Mario Kart 8 Deluxe online WITH sweaty tryhards in the room. But if they were to play Mario Kart DS online with tryhards snaking everywhere, they physically would not be able to keep up with their opponents and no amount of skill or practice would change that. This is what Nintendo and other accessibility-conscious developers are trying to prevent. I'm don't blame you for not knowing, its an often overlooked factor most players don't consider when they want games to have a higher skill ceiling.

[@sheridan5175]

@@prestige8477 A person with Parkinson's couldn't place well in any competitive e sports environment. The reason mario kart has less of a skill gap is because of the random elements the game incorporates, i.e. items, hazards- which smash bros has always had, arguably to a greater extent. There are ways of changing the rules to make the game less competitively focused. Again, if you have some disability like Parkinson's, forget melee, you couldn't compete in Brawl. You can still enjoy the game in an environment where your needs are catered to. Unfortunately that won't be possible online until nintendo gets their act together with their netcode.

[@FerinitheBloodHusky]

smash fans "fixing" stages by making all of them battlefield

[@Genericspam_G]

Fr

[@TexTheGuy]

Some do need fixing but making them battlefield is not good

[@blocks4857]

The Mario main conspiracy

[@nintony2994]

I'd kill to see that guar plain stage actually

[@guthou2010]

Yeah! I liked how the new layout he proposed still felt reminiscent of the source material (Xenoblade Chronicles), while being more appropriate for a platform fighter.

[@didiercollard]

The worst thing about the Mario Bros stage is that it's still in the rotation if you choose to play on random stages with hazards off. So there are no enemies to toss. It goes from "annoying" to "excruciating" because no one can ever die. I usually just stand up top or right by an edge and let them kill me if I find myself there.

[@TIN_Tevlev]

bro I just had this happen to me...... twitter.com/TIN_Tevlev/status/1837938835210359100

[@timbomb374]

Even when I play casually, I don't enjoy the walking stages. Something about it just feels bad and too chaotic. It might be a platform fighter, but it doesn't feel like it's meant to be a platformer.

[@elkarlo1593]

To fix Great Cave Offensive I got an extreme idea, where the stage is actually 5 or so stages randomly selected each time you play in it, like Mario Maker, each based on the stages of the cave in the original game and all condensed into way, way tamer layouts to be actually able to fight on, and they can still keep the gimmicks in some of them like the cannons on the sky or lava layout or even, what if one layout was based on the minecart tracks inbetween levels to keep the minecart Hazzard they have right now, it's a better idea than putting everything in there at once

[@guthou2010]

This showed up out of nowhere in my recommendations, but I'm glad it did! While many people discuss Smash Bros's game design, not many people discuss the design of stages, and even fewer discuss the design of casual stages, despite it being so integral to the gameplay, so it's nice when I find someone interested in talking about this topic and brainstorming ideas. For example: I think most stages with walk-offs would be greatly improved if they utilized the invisible wall gimmick from the King of Fighters Stadium, where fighters only pass through the wall if they are launched at a high percentage. That way, you could still keep some stages having walk-offs for variety in the layouts and making them resemble their source material more accurately, while also not making it really cheap and boring to just camp on the corner and wait for your oponent to get close so you throw them to the blastzone. Edit: I didn't watch the video in full when I wrote this, so I had no idea he already proposed this solution. Congrats, me. You've added nothing to the conversation.

[@TIN_Tevlev]

A fellow KOF wall enjoyer 🤝

[@hyperfairy7779]

Haven't watched the full thing, but thank your for keeping metal face in hair planes opposed to just deleting the boss and actually trying to make the boss better as well as the stage itself

[@De_an]

I'd like to see this concept done with New Pork City, specifically because it's _so_ close to nailing the "big stage" formula, but it just doesn't quite get there. A lot of the good big stages have at least two of these three things: a large flat area that serves as the main fighting place; a hazard that isn't super intrusive and rather easy to avoid, but helps move the fight around/adds an extra bit of intrigue to the match; and a quick, easy way to get to and from each section of the map. For example, Hyrule Castle 64 has the flat area and the not-super-intrusive hazard. (You might argue against the hazard thing, but I only consider a hazard super intrusive if it's on the levels of something like Yellow Devel.) Temple has the flat area and the quick, easy ways to get to and from each section. If you look at New Pork City, you can see it has bits and pieces of these things, but somehow manages to mess each one of them up.

[@AgnesBooth-zu7tw]

That why they added chimeras Veyr lazy

[@trash-lol]

saw this getting grilled on twitter and i started ripping my hair out and crying

[@TIN_Tevlev]

they didnt even watch the video

[@SmashCrafter321]

Most of what you said about redesigning Mario Bros. Arcade I would also do, except I would sorta keep throwable enemies, where after throwing them once, regardless of if it hits an opponent or just collides with the stage, the enemy would be defeated and fall of screen like the original game. (and maybe have the coins that come out of pipes after as a purely aesthetic choice) As for the speed up gimmick, along with enemies getting faster if you fail to pick them up, they would also get faster depending on how much time is left in the game (if you have timer turned on) where the closer it gets to time over, the faster the enemies become. I would also make it so the easier slower enemies do less damage and knockback compared to currently, as to give more meaning to using the faster enemies to do more damage.

[@TntbirdWorld]

So basically you hate the throwback maps

[@metaknightjudgesyoursins4710]

I mean.. I like Pac-Land (….The game.. not the stage).

[@TIN_Tevlev]

Not the NES version I hope!!!!!!!!!

[@treenhintsin]

You could just replace 75m with 25m

[@TIN_Tevlev]

14:30

[@TexTheGuy]

@@TIN_Tevlevoh noes hes angry

[@RandomDude1487]

Game dev here, one does not simply make it suited for online play Let alone make online play at all

[@slamsauce6848]

I would fix KoF Stadium by adding Mai and Angel in the background

[@azurethecobalt]

Gaur Plain's idea is pretty cool especially since Metal Face could probably claw off the mountain walls too getting rid of the comfort of the rebounding until he's clawed his way to the fight which is again really cool. I do think the KoF Stadium's mechanic is cool but I don't think every walk off needs it since the gimmick is supposed to give the same feeling of a fighting game to do wall based combos and prevent walk off camping. I'd just recommend removing the scrolling and walk off elements of Dreamland GB with a stage with 2 long platforms that sit off the stage like Kalos Pokemon League because the main area is based on the boss room. Then the stage itself could transform into the different boss rooms swapping platform layouts and with hazards on being a bit of a boss fest. For Pac-Land I'd recommend more of a visual overhaul dropping the old aesthetic if to make the stage static by having the stage itself be the first neighborhood section but with Pac-Man's house in the background with those hydrants back there too but also with hazards on being able to spray water side to side or occasionally up. Then having behind and around the house trees from the forest, have the sides of the stage take from the water section bringing platforms that can give another method to reaching the roofs and for more visuals you can put the rocky mountain section and then the fairy land farther into the background to wrap everything together as recommended by Pac-Land's Number 1 Enjoyer. I like your 75m redraw because the concept reminds me of how Mushroomy Kingdom got grittier. You should play some Pac-Land, kinda fun game if you like arcade platformers.

[@cosmicspacething3474]

8:23 You know what? They should just bring back Pac maze regardless

[@kirbyofthestarsfan]

Since most of these picks are basically bad stages from having to recreate old retro game layouts, I'd love to see a 2nd video closer to what you were doing with Gaur Plain, a stage where they chose poorly on a layout they could have beek flexible about Anyways, my least favorite stages are: -Great Cave Offensive (I dislike everything this stage represents, both in layout and as a very unneeded pick). -Palutena's Temple (awfully big, and very ugly since the platforms are just floating there instead of being built into the architecture like Hyrule's Temple) -And my least favorite: 3D Land, genuinely one of the worst layouts in the whole series, I need you to look at its hazards and see how it absolutely fails at making good use of its potential hazards. Donut lifts are very hard to reach, music note blocks are only present very briefly, it just throws a bunch of stage hazards that could have worked, but they throw each of them *once*. It's legit a waste of resources, it's a very underhated level to me

[@vik.o1598]

The funniest yet most infuriating part about great cave offensive is that, it does represent the feeling of frustration of the place it represents in the source material, (representing the four sections of the great cave offensive) but ironically it only actually represents the section that actually feels frustrating (the abandoned tower) by just having it as a background decoration, making the entire stage represent the only section that it's meant to not be

[@MaraudingManiac]

How did they get so bad at making large stages? Some of the original large stages were some of the most iconic casual stages.

[@Jonathanbiden8581]

For once sakurai is spitting, it’s a party game so bad stages are there to be funny to fuck around on

[@TIN_Tevlev]

It's a casual game so it's allowed to be bad 🧐

[@dr.sabertooth3025]

Ironically despite "not being sutied for online play" smash ulitmate only has online VS matches as it's only real form of replay value

[@Specky_Decky]

15:38 I love this line delivery lol

[@DiagonalTanooki]

i hate the "pacman belongs in a maze" excuse so much because no, the maze is supposed to represent a big busting city, i mean look at the art for pac & pal for example, even then i think a better pacman stage would be the town from pacman world 2, i do like pac land (the game) but i feel like that would be better pacman rep

[@megamix5403]

Um, Pac-Land walked so Super Mario Bros. could jump. It's far from being a "shitty little platformer"

[@TIN_Tevlev]

🤓 every stage should be pong.

[@Crazy56U]

Yeah, it’s _the_ shitty little platformer.

[@noahhamilton5974]

A few of my changes: 75m: add the flat ground from the original at the bottom, make the other platforms thin. Now it is a worse version of final destination. Norfair: as a metroid fan, its fine. Just make the hazards a little rarer and remove the lava springs, because that's not accurate and it's just a stupid liberty. Brinstar depths: kraid comes in and shakes the camera, with minimal turning. He also appears less frequently. Hanenbow: make the branches a lot closer, make the water actual water, remove that one random leaf in the water. New pork city: remove a lot from the top, make the remaining area more compact. Port town aero dive: as an f-zero fan, i REALLY like this one. Just make the ledges grabbable and remove 1 or 2 stops for that fast paced f-zero action. Icicle mountain: put it on a platform and make the obstacles more hazardous, so you dodge them on your ascent/descent. Adds the hazard, and not the annoying platforming. Poke floats: make the stage more horizontal

[@udime123]

The annoying thing about the "it's just for casuals" argument is that casuals are the only ones who ever have to put up with these horrible stages. No competitive player has ever complained about Pac Land, we all collectively agreed that stage is horrible on minute 1, but Joe at the party isn't gonna remove it from the Random Stage Select before putting on 8 player smash

[@TIN_Tevlev]

yup, and most casual players dont go on youtube or discord or reddit or twitter to complain about it WE HAVE TO MAKE OUR VOICES HEARD

[@mazda9624]

I can't be the only one who always hated the super low quality JPEG they used for the background on the Minecraft level

[@FishVirus]

That always irritated me too, as the rest of the stage looks really good

[@TheBitsGuy2002]

"Nintendo if they tried" Game was developed by Namco though.

[@elumbreonespacial4361]

The concept for 75m sounds amazing. I like the idea of being abandoned for so long.

[@LoLoYT13]

bro, the pac land place doesn't need to be new, they are just trying to make it feel as nostalgic as possible

[@jackiexkh]

While I do agree that Pac-Land needs fixing, I don't really agree with how you approached it, at least as far as the visuals go. Instead of keeping the original graphics (or in the case of what they actually did, put a shitty upscale filter over the original graphics), I would've preferred them to reimagine the game in 3D, taking inspiration from the promotional art as well as later games like Pac-Man World. I think the arcade cabinet approach would work better if the stage layout itself was kept the same, since then it would feel like the original game is being played. But when you give it a more original layout then there's really just no point in doing the arcade cabinet thing. While the scrolling sucks, I get why they made Pac-Land a scrolling stage, as it was the first side-scrolling platformer. On that note, I also get why Pac-Land was included in the first place, as Smash's original identity was to be a celebration of Nintendo, so it made sense to have representation for the game that inspired Nintendo's most iconic game, Super Mario Bros.

[@iampinball3669]

Gaur Planes having walls you ricochet off sounds absolutely horrible.

[@DinoDude65600]

maybe im a sociopath, I dont hate any stage in smash.

[@douglewisamaanthro383]

11:47 i would turn this stage in to it's own game ware every platform is solid andf used to pick up some running animals and throw at eachother

[@puglife658]

I feel like just putting a platform at the bottom of the xenoblade stage eliminating the possibility of getting koed into the bottom blast zone would make it infinitely better.

[@sinenomine3517]

8:42 I now can't unsee Moe's Tavern

[@PaulWerner]

I was really hoping for Hanenbow. I hate that one so much

[@limitedlistener6460]

Easiest way to fix Great Cave Offensive is to limit the play area based on how many active players remain. 8 Players? Full stage access. Two players get knocked out and it's down to 6? The stage starts pulling in the blast zones a little towards a point of interest. Finally down to 4 players? The stage gradually pulls in towards one of the four corners/the center (and flood the extra space with lava to avoid being able to camp hard-to-reach terrain at an awkward location that the square blast zones don't cover). Now it's scaled roughly to the size of Battlefield, but with the interesting Great Cave terrain layout.

[@saturnmunchies]

my most wanted feature in smash 6 is literally just an OPTION to have the king of fighters stadium borders instead of walkoffs on every walkoff stage.

[@karisasani7006]

Ironically pac land is more bearable in the special game mode and you set the camera to fixed! What that does is apparently it makes the camera zoom out and you have more space to move around in

[@primrosevale1995]

A few suggestions: * If Gaur Plain was like you show it, I would just just the rock formations more accruate to the gaem since they're almost the shape you suggest for the stage, and make the stage Mechonis-themed. You could even based its layout on a particular Mechon. Shows how, like with the main one in the back it's alien to the landscape, just like in the games. * Honestly I think the original layout of 25m could work, just make the spaces between platforms a bit taller, make the platforms soft, and put the ladders in the background.

[@stealthgamer4620]

My favorite stage that’s unfortunately used in official tournaments is Lylat Cruise. It’s banned because of the slanted and thin ground, and there’s obviously glitches of its own. I’ll use Dabuz’s words (there’s a clip of him saying this but I’ve always felt this way), “Lylat would be the best stage if they just got rid of the angle on the stages.” One of the main reasons Yoshi’s Story is banned besides being another Battlefield dupe. I actually love Town and City but I’d definitely be okay with having Lylat in exchange though, so we have a consistent Tri-platform stage that obviously isn’t Battlefield. I personally like the angles, but that’s what’s preventing it from being a present day legal stage. It’s still often played online tournaments and smaller tournaments. Lastly, the stage is just cool AF! Like frfr!

[@jmurray1110]

Even if they fixed it there’s too much PTSD to unban lylat

[@stealthgamer4620]

@@jmurray1110 I think some of the coolest sets were on Lylat I’d argue. When Wolf players back in the day like Zackray, it gives a nostalgia factor. Also the tri-platforms add both more campy and combo options.

[@Jelly_shy_guy_man]

You should of made them all custom stages, it’s awesome to see them in game.

[@tjlnintendo]

Thank you for not just making them battle field. Your ideas still seem fun but also fits with smash.

[@evilocto22]

For someone who is a “casual map enjoyer” it is crazy that your favorite maps are the one competitive players use.

[@TIN_Tevlev]

Yeah Hyrule castle

[@DylynKay]

Hilarious commentary bro! 👍 Also 75m is hell if all the fire was put out

[@Floriaka]

All my friends use Tap Jump and they hit Elite Smash sooooo also for 75m, I would make some of the platforms wider and have the quirk of if someone picked D.K., then D.K would not have his 8 bit counterpart on the stage meaning nothing gets thrown

[@pigeonleader]

I have an idea of where Metal Face can go, to World of Light. Idk why no stage bosses became actual bosses in World of Light it's kinda strange that none were

[@Horatio786]

What to do with Metal Face in your Gaur Plain: Remove him from the stage. Place him in the World of Light (and some Classic Mode paths) as a boss instead.

[@CindytheRedScout]

11:49 - The only possible way to improve 75m is to make it exclusively Battlefield/Omega format, and never having to otherwise lay eyes on that monstrosity.

[@AveryTurner-ot9hx]

Paper Mario NEEDED spm to show up like the fractail boss fight

[@DylanJames-s6e]

For stage one, fill in the middle gap and make it so the boss breaks it when it comes in, after its defeated, the platforms will regenerate.

[@MrRedGreenBlue1]

Easiest way to fix Great Cave, imo, is to have the camera start out fully zoomed out then slowly zoom in on a random corner of the level and as the camera zooms in the blast zones pull in with it, so each corner then is designed like a sort of mini stage with a few paths and hazards connecting them as after a few seconds an arrow appears and the stage slowly pans to a different corner of the stage so everyone's gotta quickly platform that way and then when we get to the new corner we spend another 4-7 minutes fighting there and it's it's own little mini stage that we can all fight on like this is a normal ass fighting game about fighting people on floating stages and not chasing them around a giant maze.

[@robiginal]

I think it would be interesting if Dream Land GB was like Duck Hunt in that the borders of the screen are just the end of the stage

[@TIN_Tevlev]

That'd go kinda hard tbh , would be kinda trippy too

[@eeveewithcoffee9554]

14:06 my best fix would be turning the right side into slopes like you showed. Stretching out the left platforms and elevators. Making the ladders unusable. Giving DK a few flashes of white before he comes out as a hitbox. And making the springs move slower so you can dodge them or throw someone into them Edit: I straight up have never noticed the bottom long platform but I would add that in too. Maybe a bit lower so it doesn't look weird right below the first platform

[@richrouyer7037]

15:30 amazing art it should go in a museum

[@SuperCrazyfin]

6:10 youre forgetting "house rules" arent just to do with stages, he mainly focused on "cheap moves" which i doubt anyone online would agree to stop using.

[@cosmiclikesminecraft]

I can’t lie when I was a lot younger the adventuring stages or whatever we want to call the stages when they’re doing the scrolling thing, thus helped me get a hold of the games controls a lot and think about the stage in a strategic manor. Now if this is intentional by Sakurai to get young players to do that, he’s an absolute genius, but considering it’s probably not, it’s just a happy accident

[@KeppyPants]

For the dreamland one it would be funny if you could see the player who got knocked out fly out of the game boy leaving a hole for a bit or something

[@SaddieMoon]

2:57 It’s okay, it’s good enough. 😈

[@TheCommentNumberer]

I think having the upper area in stage 1 have metalface fly by often (maybe more often when people are up there) and have him in the backrooms when he’s not would be a good way to counter camping up there. The fly by could be like when rayquaza flus by in Kalie Pokémon league

[@mrmuffins951]

The thing that I think would fix a lot of stages is another stage form in addition to Omega and Battlefield: island form. It would essentially take the stages and turn them all into floating islands with no jank and unique platform arrangements. Imagine Pirate Ship but flat and floating in the air instead of water, Lylat Cruise but perfectly flat, Delfino Plaza with a bottom thick enough to prevent sharking, Spear Pillar and Luigi’s Mansion without caves of life, Pilotwings without the walls in the middle, Norfair with a bigger center platform, WarioWare with better blast zones. The list goes on and on. This would be a really simply way to make many of the questionable stages playable. Similarly, it would fix a lot of stages if we could choose which of a stages transitions to play on like how some spirit battles are in a frozen section of a stages. Delfino Plaza, 3D Land, and Arena Ferox would all benefit greatly from this. Sometimes I just wanna play on Pictochat Sunset or the 1st stop in the World of Light final battle stage. Plus, so many stages are banned competitively because they’re too similar to another one, they need to give unique layouts to the new stages that literally just fly around like Northern Cave, Yggdrasil’s Altar, and Hollow Bastion. Either way, this is a fantastic video and I’d love to hear you talk more about this topic.

[@colororb4105]

Honestly I think Guar Plain just needs 1 more platform in the middle. The robot guy can just destroy it if he needs room and respawn it when he leaves

[@JoonyTv]

id fix 75 meters by literally just doing the layout of muray towers, but with a donkey kong coat of paint. no stage hazards, no ladders, ppl will be so confused and mad on why this is literally just muray towers now, Trust me its beautiful to watch the world burn

[@morphstarchangeling8024]

I think a lot of the issues of Dream Land GB could be fixed if it just transitioned to different layouts. I don't have a problem with walkoffs in a casual stage. It's the scrolling that's the issue for me. They could have made the stage start out on the title screen for Kirby's dreamland where it's flat land with walk offs, but then it transitions into parts of specific stages, mix in the woody woods fight as a stage hazard where he completely blocks off the right and top blast zones, have Kracko come in from his boss fight and shut off parts of the stage with his attacks.

[@Doodle1678]

8:38 and the worst part is they didn’t even get the music. Like I know it’s from the Hannah Barbara cartoon but if they were gonna make a stage based off PAC-LAND at least get the rights to the music. Instead of the several remix’s of the pac man intro we got. They could have done pac land way better.. but Pac maze is definitely better they should have put it in ultimate like why didn’t they do that.

[@DjoingDalton]

I have a way to fix Great Cave offensive, and Palutena's temple too. Section the stage off into 4 quadrants, and then have the stage move between them kinda like the New Super Mario Bros. 2 stage already does. It wouldn't fix everything bad about them, but it's a start.

[@Jorgin_Legal6]

For Gaur plain, i actually think the center of the stage seems like a neat idea. I second making the arches solid as that gets rid of walk-offs, but also because it also blocks off KOs off the top and encourages players to use the center of the stage, especially because it'd also act as a wall to the left and right, limiting the space you could run off to. Removing a handful of platforms to streamline things and make you have to choose your options more carefully, and it sounds like a nice, fun stage to me. Then for Dream Land GB, i'd try to keep the core concept but just change it up a little: first off, add some more space to the side. I know its a game boy, but just a little more horizontal area would be quite advantageous. Second off, when the stage stops moving, move away the edges to prevent walk-offs. Change some geometry to streamline the experience, and that seems pretty good to me.

[@AnthonyMtheGamerArtist]

Okay, here's how I would fix each stage here: Gaur Plains: Add platforms to the center and to the sides that are a bit symmetrical, but keep the arches at the top. Keep them able to be passed through the bottom but not from the top downwards. Also have Metal Face actually have more presence if Hazards are ON, while having him cameo in the background if they're OFF. Dream Land GB: Make it more colorful, get rid of the GB border, and actually make it either stay still and stage-morph every couple minutes or do a diet Great Cave and combine a few layouts. PAC-LAND: Make it have a different art style (like watercolor or crayon), have the stage be a travelling stage like Delfino Plaza, and overall make it less overstimulating. Keep the ability to scroll through multiple areas but don't 1:1 it. Mario Bros.: Make the platforms able to be passed through and make the enemies being thrown deal less knockback. Also, make it so that the only actual blast zone is up top while the sides just continually warp you between them. 75m: Make it either simplified or have a central platform network with ladders and elevators going between them, while 8-bit DK throws jacks from the background to the foreground if Hazards are set to ON.

[@brandonwilliams6119]

I love how you called out Sakurai on his “not suited for online” and “weirdness” comments, the man couldn’t be arsed enough to give Kirby a stage from any game that came after Superstar, also this is an unpopular opinion but the Nightmare Assist Trophy should’ve been a boss while Marx becomes the 4th playable Kirby rep, just saying. Great fixes on a lot of the stages, you got lots of laughs out of me from talking about “Why is this stage like that?” And nitpicking the egregious elements too.

[@ameliajales5307]

You know what’d be cool? If there was a tournament that used a completely different rule set, where you can do basically anything, the entire point of it would be to just experience as much chaos as possible. Screw competitive rules, high item rate with fake smash balls! Ok actually maybe not that specifically. But I’m sure you get the point.

[@DevelonLP]

4:48 the dedede player is that the isuck from brawl days in Germany? He played alot of snake if i recalled correctly

[@oscaralfonzobastidaspena9363]

the animatronic kong in 75m sounds cool but hear me out: 1.metal head from the Donkey Kong Country animated series 2.Donkey Kong from Pixels

[@robloxianwasdude]

I was honestly fine with the first 75m fix...

[@MittensInc]

Aight you got me on the stick jump section

[@SonicTheCutehog]

Smash just needs to stop with the retro stages. They almost never work.

[@roxygaming5968]

Smash needs to just stop in general.

[@NorthSutherland]

@@SonicTheCutehog Except retro stages are a given when you still have retro characters who have yet to be playable.

[@goGothitaLOL]

Duck Hunt is the only good one

[@jmurray1110]

Retro recreations and retro inspiration are 2 very different things

[@spinzer101]

Actually I think the blue platforms on the Mario bros stage could let you jump through them and turn the enemies into projectiles when doing so.

[@dimetrodon2250]

The thing about 3rd party stages, is that the company who owns the IP likely gets a say in what the stage looks like/how it works. For all we know, Bandai Namco's higher ups insisted on PAC-Land being 1 to 1 faithful, instead of making it 3D. Its a shame there was no way to put the other PAC-Man stage into Ultimate without ruining the personalized pellets gimmick it had going on.

[@Kingklownmemes]

10:12 Wario mains: *laughs in side-b*

[@Toadfish10]

Electroplankton just sitting in 4th like 😳

[@DuckJohnn]

One thing I don't like about Dream Land (GB) stage is that it keeps zooming towards the players like in many other stages. The level would have worked much better if the camera worked the same way as in Pac Land or other auto scrolling levels, where the camera does not zoom in on the players.

[@brandonkong4299]

I know a way to fix 75m, remove the stage outright and replace it with a Tropical Freeze themed area like Big Top Bop, Autumn Heights or Punch Bowl

[@nostalgia6669]

Awful stages? I have fun in all of them. Not every smash player is playing competitive. Some of us just want wacky stages to have fun with.

[@MishKoz]

7:48

[@thememejester1792]

For Gaur Plain, I'd retain the two pillars on the bottom