Why I Stopped Mythic Raiding

[@pockit5107]

After spending a combined total of 1200 attempts on Mistress, Fallen Avatar, and Kil'jaeden; nothing in this game can burn me out anymore. I am literally dead inside from mythic ToS.

[@Xplsv_]

Fred Harvey And on the other hand you have a guy that spends one day clearing heroic/m+ for chest and has probably simillar ilvl to you, its just a fucking simulator of depression.

[@Meusberg]

Fred Harvey That’s why you stop playing shitty retail and start playing sweet vanilla

[@Mysterdion]

Soon all shall return to vanilla. Only to be a squishy who gets 1 shot by that geared arms warrior. ;)

[@Meusberg]

Aaron Colon And i’m gonna be that Arms Warrior that kills everyone kek

[@TheFierburn]

I gave up on guldan m when 3-4 people dragged the whole team down and i knew we would not take the boss for another month of braindead grinding on the boss because the leadership decided a indefinite extend was a good idea. The bane of mythic raiding is having a few people ruin it for everyone in the team that works hard, just doesnt feel as rewarding as it used to...

[@rubenloza1920]

Without a doubt the same boat in a lot of ways. 1. The guild died and well that was the end of mythic raiding. I didn't want to join a new guild and meet all new people and then learn all there ways, work my way up, apply.. all sorts of stuff. Often involves transferring and costing money. Bah.. just didn't feel like it. 2. The game just made it easier to not worry about it. I can run mythic+ with people on the friends list. I can pug heroic and normal raids. I can jump into a streamers raid, a friends raid, whatever. Just wasn't much of a point to worry about it because the rewards weren't that different. 3. Yeah, I just got older. Yeah, I got a job. Yeah, the raiding scene stayed very 18 to 25 and I am up at 30 now. So life got in the way combined with one and two so.. it got easier. 4. Then finally yeah.. I just didn't like raiding mythic anymore. It just felt like I was doing the same song and dance just on the remixed track. If those other 3 things above werent the case I might have still enjoyed it a bit but.. man.. it just got easier and easier to walk away. But end of the day I am not sure if I will NEVER RAID MYTHIC AGAIN sort of thing. But for now.. I am pretty sure I am done with it for this expansion and have my doubts for the next. Once it gets beyond that and I haven't odds are pretty good its over. But I am sure I will hit MC and BWL and stuff in Classic when it comes out. Looking foward to that.

[@moremusic14]

Hello, I've been listening to your real talks for a very long time and I can say I agree with what you're saying. I'm young. I'm 20. I picked this game up 11 years ago and only started raiding in MoP, in SoO. I can say that raiding was an amazing experience, I always enjoyed it and made me feel proud, made me feel like I had something to show. After my first guild was disbanded, I started living the so-to-speak drama of being in a group of people forced by circumstance to work together. It was nothing based on friendship, but strive and expectations. This year, the very GM has gotten sick of the game, but sticking through and trying to push us all for progress was what killed the whole mood, aura and fun everyone had. There is no more constructive criticism, there is constant fighting and contradictory ideas. There is the leadership forbidding players from participating in guild normal runs, and what made (at least) me see the flaws of the team was Mythic Mistress. With probably 20 consecutive wipes at under 20% health, it was hell to go through at the order of someone, without accepting suggestions to how we should approach things. As for myself, I can say it's offputting, when you get so involved in the guild, the people, trying to "fight the tide" and make someone listen. I sometimes regret stopping Mythic raiding, but, at the very least, I get time for myself, to recharge my batteries, and perhaps find a new place to put all my effort and enthusiasm in. Thank you for all the videos you make. I can see where you're coming from with this decision and this was really touching for someone who is still somewhat implied in the drama.

[@Parlance]

Mythic raiding is not fun. Its a job you dont get paid for. Heroic Raiding with people that have Mythic level intelligence is 10x more fun.

[@JamieSmith-kh4er]

subjective

[@djefr]

Completing a game on "very easy" is not fun.

[@queendasher4482]

ten times zero is still zero

[@Verrulz]

Heroic antorus is way too easy for mythic raiders though.

[@robinhood45218]

I agree COMPLETELY man

[@guibmx01]

when you bash on casuals so much you become a casual yourself

[@tylerdobson8312]

So mythic raiding is the only thing that distinguishes causal from hardcore? Not his 400+ mounts or achievement points?

[@ThatMayBeTheCase]

Takes one to know one ;)

[@justsomeguywithagoatee8337]

I've got nearly 400 mounts, well over 28k achievement points and server first Lich King kill (being the best geared and most skilled rogue on Illidan-US). But I don't play more than 2 hours a day now and don't touch anything but heroic/normal pugs, as such I define myself as a casual. Being "casual" by definition is very much in the moment. You can be a hardcore mythic raider all your life and stop, thus becoming a casual or be a casual your whole life, win the lottery, use all your free time grinding and become a mythic raider, thus becoming hardcore. Same logic for PvPers.

[@ninerdawg7749]

Chris C You weren't the most skilled rogue during Lich King, stop praising yourself

[@attackdefense1880]

Same logic for pvpers? nope, scrubs can play all they want and still be shit in PVP, look at METHOD players, most of them don't even fucking have 1K5 achiev in arena yet they had to play arena to get essences for legs upgrade every fucking tier

[@cherpa007]

I totally agree that titan forging is bullshit. Loot ilvl should be determined by the difficulty of the content not the RNG of if loot prices titan forge with gem slot or not.

[@christoffer5875]

cherpa007 titanforging is okay, it just shouldnt be to this degree, say a normal item is 1000ivl and heroic 1020ilvl, normal should titanforhe to 1010 max.

[@ginley2]

It's how blizzard keeps its players engaged and striving to play each week at a "shot" for TF gear. Ridding of it makes Blizz lose and only appeases neckbeards. Blizzard only cares about $.

[@Isthismylifenow]

or higher difficulties should have significantly higher titanforging

[@MrRocklizard]

dude, you established yourself. yes you are getting older, this stuff just happens. I wish you so much success on all of your endeavors.

[@SincereDoper]

"I'm still collecting useless fucking battle pets, so don't worry, it's not like I'm going casual." oh fuck... he doesn't even realize that collecting pets is for casuals... this is bad.

[@perikulum6102]

It's a meme you dip

[@TedKeyboardify]

I think you've missed the joke.

[@steliosfr]

Remember to take all things in moderation (even World of Warcraft!)

[@pvillelde]

I quit because I got older and realized the effort wasn't worth the reward

[@Ciggiesaftersex]

Laurie this comment though 👍

[@PrayingWarfare]

Laurie You will come back for battle for azeroth, let's be honest here.

[@Ecliptor.]

basically the tldw

[@AswollAlpaca]

Basically casual filth

[@alexbonds2538]

Alpaca why does it matter if people play casually? Some people have lives n dont wanna play a video game all day. Which is definitely not something to make fun of. If anything its more embarrasing being a "hardcore" gamer.

[@rapturedmourning]

Listening to your extended explanation, it does sound like the main issue is titan forging. With current mythic raid content giving 960 gear, I had a guild mate get a 975 from an M+15, a 985 from our Heroic raid 2 days later, and then a 97? from the order hall chest. That's 3 mythic titan forge level gear in a week without touching mythic raiding. As what's-his-name has said titan forging isn't going anywhere, Bliz probably needs to look at making mythic raiding flex size and cross realm to ease up a little on the cost.

[@lukegrim3858]

I feel like titanforging should either: 1. never exceed base mythic ilvl or 2. Give equal potential for ilvl increase (normal antorus gear can go to 960, heroic to 975, mythic to 990, etc) instead of lfr being able to roll 70 ilvls compared to mythic's 25... It's absolutely ridiculous that I had more Heroic/m+ pieces equipped than mythic ToS pieces after 240 hours of progression. QQ about how I'm anti-casual if you want, but the amount of effort it takes to successfully mythic raid warrants guaranteed better rewards.

[@Docerdoc]

My favourite time raiding was SoO at the end of MoP, I could just log in, raid, log out and have a blast. I quit Raiding in legion because of all the shit you have to do outside of raid time, spam M+, grind herbs/gold for consumables (more so than usual), grind out AP, do weeklies for legendary opertunitis. I understand these need to exist and always have but I felt overencumbered with them in Legion compared to other expansions.

[@beanbag4440]

WoD: too little content, i need more content wahhhhh Legion: too much content, i'm overwhelmed, less content plz

[@Docerdoc]

If_you_say_so Lol It's not content its busywork and after the first tier for gearing up should be mostly irrelevant like pretty much every other expansion.

[@peytonstein8616]

Or, realize that people go through boom and bust cycles in WoW. From playing alot to playing casually. And the fact that the content gap between those 2 expacs were huge.

[@mikebazowski2216]

Weeklies for legendary oportunities?? Ahahaha....comon its like i m farting and i get legendaries...i just breath and legendaries drops....from anything...if there is something on legion that doesnt need effort to get is legendaries..

[@Failedwizard1]

Congratulations, you got lucky.

[@metalhead4404]

Oh god, you know what this means.... In a year he’s gonna be quitting wow and moving to Hawaii with his boyfriend Dave.

[@thelawenforcerhd9654]

If asmongold was a rent boy he'd starve to death.

[@mathiaslindroth5961]

lmao

[@carstenhansen5757]

What you consider yourself a man because you raid? :D :D :D

[@TwitchVoDsDrama]

You wore that shirt last week im still trying to figure out if you havent showered or if you washed it

[@Zykla1]

he doesnt shower

[@jodyboles8208]

OctobersYT [Asmongold Stream Highlights] I mean most people wash cloths once a week lol. Why you care anyway?

[@tm0675]

Stop trying to be catdany

[@jacobrichards1220]

I havent showered in probably 2 weeks now

[@TwitchVoDsDrama]

Yungkibbz stop trying to be me

[@trentburgess4912]

Personally I just love the challenge and the feeling you get with your guild when you finally get that boss down.

[@TrampyPulsar]

I've not raided seriously since WOTLK, without progression raiding, and when they reset gear progression with baseline welfare loot that makes all your progression from last tier pointless, there is no reason. Then with LFR tourist mode, there is zero reason what so ever to really push end game, why would I spend 200+ hours progressing through an arbitrary hard mode of a dungeon I already have cleared 20 times over to get geared to do it on heroic or mythic difficulties, the gear isn't worth it because it becomes vendor trash next expansion, and the content is pointless because you can do it on normal or even LFR and get the same experience. What made raiding fun wasn't the raiding, the raiding is a job, what made raiding fun was character progression and getting stronger, but they stripped that aspect out of the game, what made raiding fun is if you got that weapon or trinket or set you can completely change how your character plays and become an OP god amongst the playerbase, but now everyone is an OP god and the only thing that matters is raw DPS, which is more based on random luck that your class happens to be good that patch rather then individual character progression, which sucks.

[@TrampyPulsar]

Yeah, MC gear got replaced by gear you got dropped from random bear in EPL when BWL released right?

[@niklasstahl98]

gear is only a means to an end, it means nothing, if you raid for gear only you probably shouldn't raid at all

[@sirkoltas4087]

BC was a reset inbetween 2 serious and stable progression systems. You still played VANILLA and BC. Nowadays the reset comes EVERY FUCKING PATCH. Extended gearing and gaps the size of an expansion in 1 tier... There is an enourmous difference between progressing trough an expansion and progressing trough a fucking patch. Blizz has been very clear in the last few years on the intent to deincentivize guilds life and raiding in general, Mythic raids were just a little treat to keep the most hardcore playerbase hooked while they figured out how to replace raiding with some easier to develop and more exploitable (timewise) content. Mythic + are the definitive proof, much faster and cost efficent to develop and they last way more than a raid conent. Raiding is a dying old lion who has been hammered by many features over the years and it's only a matter of time until he draws his last breath

[@Xplsv_]

Beard Hat I really loved this game since tbc and i cant stand how they can justify putting so much bullshit. In wotlk they added many QoL improvements that werent bad at the moment, but with every expansion they added more and more, 4raiding difficulties is a fucking mistake that anyone can tell you by now. There is no point in progressing anything, this game has turned from casual friendly, but only if you invested a bit of time to fucking time gated game made for typical 30y old that has few hours to play a week.

[@crashyburnymit4080]

Mattia Camiciottoli raiding is the very core of the game. Any mmo for that matter. It will never be replaced by m+ in any way shape or form. The two systems will complement eachother, but never replace.

[@MisterWeebles28]

Finally. Whatever your decision I’m just glad I get to watch the stream!

[@Margucci]

I couldnt agree more. I had been playing since vanilla beta. I have end game raided the entire time. mythic KJ killed the drive to raid. After wiping on the bullshit fight a few hundred times, and the stars aligned to get that first kill, i was done. I actually ended up cancelling my sub because i found that I just didnt have the drive to play anymore without progression raiding. on top of the mechanics changes, the gearing was also a major reason for my quitting. I think that heroic raiding in legion has been great. Excellent pacing and interesting fights. but the bump up to mythic was just stupid. it isnt that the fights were difficult, they wernt fun. This is coming from someone who did firefighter, 0-light, LK, etc. those were memorable fights and were tons of fun. I think the only fight I considered a great mythic encounter this xpac was gul'dan. it was different and intersting. aside from that there was nothing that stood out in a good way.

[@DarkestValar]

downvoted because vanilla is not a relevant credential

[@brimstonevalar6053]

Cesar Lima ye one of the best mmorpg in the genre is not relevant, sounds like a wotlk baby who never played a real mmorpg in his life, go back to colecting "relevant" stuff in Legion you pleb

[@DarkestValar]

Brimstone Valar its still irrelevant because thats nowhere near the subject matter of the video. Mmorpgs in general and their history are not up for debate in this video, only mythic legion raids

[@SaschaEderer]

Why should it not be? You can say "I have a lot of experience / I have experienced most raids in WoW" and it would mean the same, only that his phrasing was more precise.

[@SylarAtomic]

I agree with a lot of the stuff you said. I stopped playing seriously during Nighthold because our guild fell apart due to drama and I also became fatigue. As someone who is currently playing casually the fact that I can get very good gear by only doing heroic is nice but feels empty.

[@Krixen77]

Titanforge sucks

[@wallhackergotdammit]

Water is wet

[@danniboyvreden617]

True, ... true

[@SimonCoulton]

I got a titanforged pair of boots in N ToS first week. Still haven’t replaced them. The system sucks.

[@jayv8452]

Simon Coulton had someone in normal Antorus do bottom DPS at 600k and got a fucking 980 tier piece...bullshit I've done heroic and haven't got anything over 950. Also for 3 raids straight I got onl y 1 piece if loot on one of my toons.

[@jayv8452]

It's just b.s. that someone that horrible at the game got great gear for doing nothing. I get nothing for 3 raids straight

[@nvincible1354]

he just got kicked out of the core group for his high dps, he was doing more than the 1st dps so it didnt show his name ever

[@michaelcoffey498]

@Asmon, I am glad you understand what happens when life makes you grow up. This is why I never understood people who ONLY seek LFR. As long as Mythic has the best base gear it is fine. Life> Game period. We often do not live that way until we are forced to. When you play for passion an play for enjoyment. You tuber or not you will have a better channel, streams, and channel. Here is hoping you continue to grow and understand fun trumps everything. Even if none of us are wise enough to see that until late 20's mid 30's or whenever life takes up that precious free time.

[@charlesblake4245]

You picked the worst tier to “go casual” on lol. All those mechanics you said you don’t enjoy are no longer a factor in mythic antorus. I can understand where you are coming from though. I often had those same thoughts with the one shot mechanics while progging in NH and TOS.

[@Diavolo222]

It's not just about the mechanics. IT's about the fact that those wiping on mythic on those mechanics for so long causes a lot of burn out and you dont have the same drive to continue cause you feel depleted. Doesnt help that for 20x the amount of difficulty and drama you get just a TAD better gear.

[@Chronochrome]

The mechanics are only part of it. Most of what causes this type of burnout is the fact that you're just beating your head against a wall trying to perform the same song and dance with little to no variance hundreds of times just so you can say you did it and not because it offers any tangible benefit to yourself. It's pretty much a waste of time no matter how you look at it.

[@LionofMandalore]

Burke Boydell I felt that way PuG’ing heroics in Warlords, so I can only imagine mythic. Then again pugs offer their own kind of difficulty, especially as a healer. You get to see all the little ways that people suck at this game. It’s less of you challenging the ai and more challenging your patience in dealing with other players.

[@Robin_Coffins]

I had to stop playing when Mythic NH was on farm. i was logging in on raid days to only raid then wouldn't play for the rest of the week. I love to pvp and to get gear for pvp i had to raid. I was essentially logging on for 3hrs a week to gear up other guildies. Then the next raid came out and i thought "great, have to do it all over again". I really miss being able to just buy pvp gear with conquest badges.. pvp, for me anyway, is 100% more exciting :)

[@Mrfiufaufou]

This raid is MASSIVELY easier now that no mechanic is punishing. They need to rework everything if they want to keep everything difficult and punishing at the same time.

[@RukisYT]

just face it you are becoming a casual dood

[@buhlayke]

cant blame him when you have a bunch of sweaty twitchtard fans to carry you through heroics for mad TF procs.

[@RukisYT]

when you see $ thats how it goes

[@FANSpiele]

RoguecraftTV lets see what happens to you when you get older and maybe experience 20x times you get BiS a new xpac is hitting ur stuff what you earned is pretty much worthless than why bother earning something thats like 0.4% better than something u can earn less stressful and just a tiny bit less better

[@RukisYT]

well if you stream/youtube for a living this is going to happen just saying

[@FANSpiele]

RoguecraftTV i am refering to what he does ingame

[@selwrynn6702]

Yeah they really need to remove titanforging, or at least cap it below the next tier of gear. I got a 975 BoE on Normal, the system is broken.

[@InvaderTan1]

Selwrynn Yeah it's ridiculous. Before Antorus came out I got a Titan forged 940 Timestone Pendant from the second boss from Mythic Chrono... That was a 40 ilevel upgrade from the base 900 which is equivalent to Mythic gear from KJ in ToS.. ..I mean come on...

[@Fenoren]

My biggest gripe is how if you raid a lot in one tier, to the point of having a lot of warforged/titanforged gear, is that you now *have* to get warforged/titanforged gear in the next tier for an upgrade. Anything that isn't upgraded is almost instantly garbage if you raid frequently, meaning you have to get drops much more frequently before you actually start to replace your current gear.

[@fenixen234]

Ive been raiding since Vanilla, Started June 2006, Went hardcore or so in TBC with 5 days a week, 18:00-00:00 (6pm to midnight) and got some World around 50 on Illidan and Kiljaeden. We weren great but it was a nice bunch of mates wanting to spend time in the game. I must admit ive had a few breaks missing a tier here and there but wow always drags me back, And its the raiding that does it. I really dont feel raiding is my "Character should get stronger" thing. Im really one of thoose rare guys that sees loot as a tool for a guild to progress further, If i didnt get that tier piece i respect my loot council (which is amazing btw theorycrafting shit) to give it to the person that it benefits most. "But,but you say now hes over you on DPS/HPS meter? You want gear too?" Thats not how it should works. Of course its fun to a get a gear piece now and then but aslong as you are pulling the numbers your gear and pull and that is enough for the encounter you are doing thats all fine. But why do i keep raiding then? its very simple i raid cause i love the progression. Helping guildies figgure out whats best for what boss, Hmm maybe we can try it this way and bam ur 20% further down. Right now im not raiding hard core, Im in a 3 day a week guild and thats just fine with me, I got 75 traits on main wep, I do my weekly m+ but other than that im basicily a raid logger, And i know some guilds hate raid loggers but im fine with it, They know im reliable, They know i show up and they know i pull my weight. Its kinda ironic but i dont mind wiping at all, If you never wipe you never feel the accomplishment of making what you couldnt do before. Bosses i remember most is of course the bosses were i had the most wipes, Pre-nerf Muru in sunwell was 800 wipes, And that was months we was stuck there. I agree ToS was abit out of line, But it was still never gonna make me stop raid. You just need competent people in the guild do understand exactly what to do on a boss, And sometimes people dont and thats fine aslong as they understand after you explain it to them. And yes i know everyone makes mistakes but some giggles and laughs on Discord after a stupid wipe is always enjoyable. So even if it takes hundreds of wipes the accomplishment when you finally do it is what makes it worth raiding mythic, I couldnt give a flying fuck about a heroic raider having better gear than me even if we didnt kill a single mythic boss. He farmed or got lucky for it so good for him, It doesnt take away the fun i have in raiding. Only time raiding isnt fun is on bosses like Maidens or Kiljaeden or Fallan avatar in Tos when 1 or 2 guys are the reason for 80% of the wipes. Sadly you have to talk to them and explain that its not working, even if they have been in the guild for a long time. If you want a fun enviorement for all 20 people they gotta be on the same skill level. And thats whats hard today for guilds. Finding 20 people at the right skill level takes time, dedication and even the ability to be harsh sometimes and tell and old timer in the guild that he is no longer or currently playing good enough. Fix this issue and even tos / avatar / kj was fun, Everyone can make mistakes but you gotta live with that, Just get people on the same skill level and they will all find it fun to progress together. Might take one guild 50 wipes while it takes another 150. But both guilds could still have equal the fun aslong as the skill level of the members is the same. When Mr warlock from the 150 wipe boss guild jumps up to the 50 wipes one with a trial, Thats when its hard to be a guild leader. "Does he fit, is he nice, Is he good enough?" etc. And many guild leaders are to soft today, Yes you might need people but sustaining a long term guild isnt a 7 hour per week job, Triple that and i can bet some guild leaders even spend more. Keep raiding boys, Be its normal / heroic / mythic, And in pugs stick with equally minded people and the experience you will get will be good. If you got that guy "WTF IM TOP DPS ON THIS SHIT ALT, LOL KEK" You simply kick him even if hes top dps and try someone else, Even if the dps is abit worse the experience will be better for all of you. Peace out

[@ylioo]

"and tell the old timer in the guild that he is no longer or currently playing good enough". Never seen that happen, hope i live long enough to see it.

[@TheShyshy]

Irl issues and what asmon said is pretty much the same reason i stopped raiding this tier. Got lucky in ToS heroic got 940+ tier first 2 weeks then there was 0 reason to kill mythic bosses since i wasnt going to get loot.

[@benderbg]

Raiding got boring because getting gear stopped meaning something. You're never done with any slot thanks to tf/wf rng. Its constant ilvl treadmill without a break if you wanna stay at the top level. And at that same top you have added layer of FOTM class stacking each tier which hurts all of the players who dislike jumping from their mains just so they could help their guilds progress easier. In other words raiding in the past 2 expansions had turned into spread sheet monstrosity where every 1% is make it of break it which continues to be fun only to a handful of hard core guilds like Method whom players turned raiding into jobs, not hobbies.

[@pockit5107]

To be fair class stacking only matters if your guild is Method/Limit and you're trying to clear the instance on mythic in the first week. No guild below top 50 will force you to main swap and if they do they're retarded.

[@bloodangel420]

I'm still raiding currently 5/11 Mythic Antorus. What keeps me going is I like the community and the team work you have to do to get the job done plus seeing all the different boss mechanics is pretty cool too.

[@Mendelew2]

no longer a proffessional neckbeard, unsubscribed untill you become one again

[@Mendelew2]

ofcourse I didn't. Keep up the good stuff, Zack.

[@saphrix4587]

Bro so legit that it's legit bro

[@tambourineman6653]

Kiara Antonio Yea not funny....try again

[@kiaraantonio1210]

Tambourine Man Sure it is its funny to me though you sound a Lil butthurt you OK ? sorry if my comment made your nerdy glasses all foggy lmao

[@kiaraantonio1210]

Tambourine Man soooo angryy

[@UncleBogator]

Just came back after taking a break since October. We just killed Mistress and we're working on maiden. The wall of wipes coming up on avatar, etc made me feel like it wasn't worth it. Boosted a blood DK 3 weeks ago and made it my main. Stepped foot in Antorus for the first time last night after doing numerous 15+ keys this whole time. I was not impressed that mythic level raiding gear was dropping at 960 seeing as I was getting 960+ tf pieces from mythic plus. Like... where's the payoff?

[@TheTorridestCheese]

Personally I'm just tired of WoW in general. I'm a Wrath baby, and I've seen 5 expansions play out. I no longer get excited over new content. I'm thinking of giving Vanilla a go once the servers are released as kind of a soft reset, but I know I'll miss a lot of the features modern WoW has and being pigeonholed into one spec if I wanted to be viable on my main class (mage) will suck. I just hope Blizzard makes a revamped WoW 2.0 at some point in the near future (unlikely) and starts back over.

[@MetalandMGS]

Mages are great in vanilla, and from what I understand, once you get beyond Molten Core 2/3 mage specs are viable for the rest of endgame. Can't say for arcane though.

[@TheTorridestCheese]

I heard that if I were to play a mage, I'd be playing frost, lol. Shame about arcane though, as much as people like to shit on the spec, I've always liked it.

[@niklasstahl98]

Mage is 'viable', but you'd only spam one button the entire fight, so it's not really as fun as now

[@zenith_journey]

fire is the best spec once u get past MC and BWL!

[@tomi7947]

I respecced between frost and fire every week in Vanilla when raiding BWL and AQ.

[@pvebimbo]

i quitted raiding when ToS released, because of work, tried doing it HC sometimes but it sucked, Antorus is way better but i aint missing the 4-12h wiping on a boss every single week,, i played in a top 200 guild for almost 2 years in a row but damn i havent had this much fun just playing high mythic + and doing HC with my friends... its so much fun to be an casual

[@nvincible1354]

I quit raiding because it is a suffering getting a decent LFR group nowadays...

[@wolfshanze5980]

You don't quit raiding cuz LFR is easier, you quit LFR because guild raiding is full of far less nightmare players (and by "guild raiding" I don't necessarily mean Mythic, it can be normal or heroic guild raiding and be far less stressful then a night in LFR).

[@ravenmourne]

I am still raiding and enjoying it, because since I stopped playing on buggy private servers I was always looking for a mythic raiding guild that ended up disbanding mid-way. I think I finally got a safe spot in one and I can easily take my 3 years+ of revenge on countless trial spots that ended up like that because some guild members decided they will decline raid invites in the last second and so not having enough people to do the job. I agree with everything you said in this video, about titanforging, rewards and all that, but in my situation, I put everything behind, because this is what I want to do and what I like to do.

[@gassylammas]

I think asmongold deserves some insane level of respect for going as long as he did. Playing WoW at the highest level PvE wise, going on over a decade, will take a toll on anyone.

[@Xemozazk]

He didnt play wow at the highest level pve wise.

[@robinpettersson3071]

What motivates me is basically just fun. Im a guildmaster of a bottom tier mythic guild (we never get cutting edge but we go 5-8 bosses deep). And for me it all boils down to fun, and all the raiders in my guild is also my friends. Since we dont take it super serious we can kinda kick back and relax when things start being unfun. like Mistress for example, we got there, had a few nights on her and just said "Nope, cya guys in antorus". And now we are having as much fun as ever!

[@ChichiNaka]

These are mostly the same points people have been making since Wrath/Cata era when there wasn't just one difficulty of a raid and people shout them down as casuals, it's fine to not play a 13 year old MMO at the highest level, this shouldn't be some sad thing people want to rectify, if you're having fun raiding normal/heroic (like the vast majority of the playerbase) thats perfect, leave mythic for the people who still think anyone gives a fuck about their ilvl.

[@zeening]

appreciate you brother, you literally said word for word how i feel about raiding now, same reasons about feeling self worth and feeling good about raiding back in the day and now as ive gotten older and been among the top 3 guilds in the US raiding monday-saturday 6pm-1am and if you missed a raid you had to re-earn your spot lost it for weeks... not a fun way to play the GAME basically making it a second job,& ESPECIALLY the wow being the one thing I was good at while sucking at IRL lol. be happy about your decision bro your stream is better then ever and i've been following you for just under 3 years. also yeah fuck those 1 person can wipe the raid mechanics cause they may lag etc

[@BigBoy-vz3jo]

Asmonold go find a wifu and become a family man. Sonic BOOM

[@4S4L3]

Legendary items at the start of the expansion didn't sound so bad. Two weeks in, 70% a US 30 guild had stopped playing all together. Item locking classes was the stupidest shit they've probably ever done.

[@Kujamon]

wake up early for 8 pm

[@baneleaf7025]

I keep trying to step back from mythic but the holidays have people out of town so I am still on a set schedule. A while back I left my old guild and went filthy casual for a while and it was great. I plan on stepping back to that state soon and preparing for BFA and just chilling. I can't blame you at all for wanting to actually like playing instead of feeling obligated to playing.

[@jonathanthomas4498]

Come to the casual side of the force

[@juliansmit3770]

Jonathan Thomas *Palpy voice* “Goooooooood Asmongold gooohood”

[@Ihealz]

I have been enjoying not mythic raiding a lot lately, actually not having to hop on at certain times to like you said wipe for many hours is kind of like a weight off your shoulders. Albeit I was kind of forced out of mythic raiding due to my guild falling apart but still lol. I can really relate with what you said. Love your vids man, and thank you for keeping on making awesome content. =)

[@Tehgoat]

Raiding screws with RL responsibilities, especially if you're a parent

[@LazyMonkey24]

i most definitely agree with the titanforging point. I take a break and all of a sudden warforging has become titanforging and it is allowed to stack to give absurd ilvl increases. It makes me less curious why people want a vanilla wow to play. I hope wow does vanilla like jagex does OSRS, where players vote on what they put in the game.

[@adham400]

High five, i just quit mythic raiding and unsubbed,ToS left a trauma inside me

[@dawn6124]

Hi Zack, So I've been raiding since the start of the expansion (yes i'm green behind my ears) but i've managed to join a couple of top raiding guilds (2 top 300 in the world). I was a hardcore pvper before trying raiding so it was an interesting jump. My personal drive to be fair is to be better than the guy on the same class next to me and to do everything i can to improve my own gameplay.. When I achieve this, my second motivation is, obviously loot. I Love getting legendaries.. love it, it's my main motivation to play the game. When I just started raiding, I played rogue (what i've played for the longest time). After a while I got the hang of both assasination and sublety and could parse 90-98% on most bosses. After I've gotten all the BiS legendaries and got good at my class... I found myself rerolling to other classes... over and over again. I've played DK, Resto Shaman, Elemental shaman, warlock.. you name it. The satisfaction of doing the most difficult content pve wise the game has to offer on a class you're improving on.. amazing. You could say I enjoy mythic raiding for the challange of improving my own gameplay and potentially gaining legendaries. Do I enjoy mythic raiding for the boss kills? Yeah I do, but I agree with your opinion on the "This guy fucked up so we all wipe" opinion. So possible advise for you: Have you considered rerolling? if only for the thrill of potentially getting a new BiS legendary? ps. I rerolled DK but that backfired. played unholy, first 2 legendaries i got were my BiS (my GM is a DK and he hates me for it). I start playing frost, 1st frost legendary, BiS. 2nd one, 3rd BiS... fuck me right? Hope this wall of text is helpful.

[@JelloCrave]

Endgame PvE is a mindless grindfest. That's why I pvp, I find it more interesting to play against other players, not repeat the same scripted combat over and over to chase an item level that will only get scaled down when I get close to peaking.

[@Trainwheel_Time]

JelloCrave Awesome... that makes you and 3 other people. Enjoy!!

[@JelloCrave]

Timothy Jahn , hahaha i love the exaggeration. Reminds me of all the "WoW is dead" memers xD

[@JelloCrave]

IHS you don't know what I have or don't have. Form a basis before spewing your opinion.

[@JelloCrave]

IHS , Rofl "link your account" stfu scrub. Stay in your basic ass scripted lane.

[@JelloCrave]

^I love how personally offended these kids get because I like PvP better than PvE. Cry me a river, I like the color Green as well are y'all gonna form a picket line over it? Y'all spend too much time on the internet if you're getting your panties in a bunch over this.

[@theeddy1296]

I'm in a 2 night, 3 hour guild and honestly it makes a big difference with the whole 'commitment' of raiding. It doesn't feel as tying down, which is great.

[@roque7720]

It's okay Asmondad you're still Alpha mythic raider to me

[@zegetable]

I can agree with many of the points you have made so I am thankful that my guild environment is healthier. I almost stopped in tomb as well, but Antorus feels much better. Happy you have made a decision, don't feel guilty about it. I personally won't stop raiding because I really enjoy hanging out with the people I raid with, and I like being about to progress on bosses with all of them. Dungeons are okay, but M+ doesn't feel like you are progression through a dungeon like a raid does. We are currently 1/11 M so not hardcore, but not completely casual either.

[@TANFOcoloanfossi]

No problem... You are going to get carried at the end of the content.

[@arceptor]

Exactly. He's lazy now.

[@LOLBumstar]

Couldn't agree more Zach. I quit mythic raiding in ToS after getting Mythic Guldan down. The reward structure just isn't worth it anymore. I miss the days of walking around the capital city in full (mythic/heroic) gear and people knowing you're a bad ass. Now I look at players who struggle to get heroic cleared but they're just as geared as I am. Not worth it anymore.

[@druidactual]

You probably also need a break from WoW to you know, play RL.

[@Wryz54880]

Real life or Rocket league?

[@reesercliff]

raid leader

[@RazerhaxWoW]

The main reason I keep at it is because of the people in my guild. It's kinda the only thing that still compels me to do Mythic Raiding in general but that does extend to pretty much everything else in the game, honestly if they all decided to just up and jump ship or leave the game I would probably stop raiding and in turn would potentially lead me to just quitting outright.

[@lorenzo3]

why i stopped youtube for twitch $ btw ded game until bfa

[@forzaken1498]

Started raiding "seriously" in SoO, ended up getting all the cutting edges throughout WoD until NH and I started to feel the burn, was an officer on my ex guild and management was extra work that I had to do at the time (was in uni aswell) : Making sure we had the 20 players, loot council, etc. At one point progressing through ToS I got demoralized when we were progressing through maiden and after +200 pulls we managed to kill her, then I realized the harsh that avatar and kj were going to be, that was when I throwed the towel on my 14hr/week + extend guild to a much more "mythic casual" that raids around 8hrs a week, which made a huge impact on my schedule. Luckily for me, My motivation & sense of achievement still comes from downing mythic bosses, It's still a great feeling to kill bosses when they are hard & not nerfed to the ground. Keep your head up, I know from your pov how stupid it must be to see players that put no effort in their characters to get bis & highest ilvl gear from relinq / lfr thanks to titanforging. Great video as always.

[@swang6782]

Cant do this forever, get a chick, buy a home, make a family. Live well

[@Achille12345]

You don't need to "make a family" to live well.

[@zilvis1140]

Swang wow is life and life is wow

[@norlamin7847]

Don't create this false narrative where obtaining "The American Dream" is the only path in life, let alone the only path to happiness and contentment. Hell, for a lot of people, that life quickly turns into a nightmare that you can no longer escape from due to the laws of entrapment and the biological urge to raise offspring. Let the man do what brings him the most happiness without the enforcement of societal pressure.

[@ayoissac]

come on, does this world really need anymore reproducing humans?????

[@Alijamaru]

Whoah now calm down

[@spacebibba8984]

I stopped raiding in early Legion, due to my job preventing me from playing a few weeks and my guild falling apart. Titanforging is poisionous for mythic (or any high-end) content and just like you said, the reward doesn't justify the investment, which is HUGE compared to heroic, if you take it seriously (like 3+ days per week, I'd say). I never attended in high-mythic+ dungeons, but it seems to be cool. Definetily coming back for BfA, but not on mythic progress. I'm gonna chill a little bit, join a casual heroic raiding guild, maybe two days per week, maybe joined by a friend (trying to lure him into finally raiding (at least trying it once)). I think a proper raid guild is an AMAZING atmosphere, nonetheless most people need a little bit more than "yay first kill" or "yay an evening with my guild... on that boss... again... ...." to keep going. Enjoy the time and when the time has come, I hope you are as excited as I am, to come back to this unforgiving, painful raiding business (hopefully with a better reward system). BTW your thoughts on BfA systems?

[@gary6631]

I just don't understand how people over the age of 16 have the time to play this game enough to mythic raid

[@georgewillow112]

Gary It's simple, you dont do anything else. I'm a full-time University student and all I did (until very recently) was go to classes for like 3 hours 3 days a week, then play WoW the rest of the time... I hate parties, I dont drink, smoke, I dont do drugs... the only other thing I do in my free time are martial arts to keep myself healthy and fit. Also I dont really want a GF right now, nor am I interested in creating a family anytime soon. What else should I do with my time? I sometimes produce EDM too, in hopes I'll be the next best thing, but I doubt thats gonna happen, so I play WoW instead, lol.

[@gary6631]

thats a fair point

[@Moon-if3rc]

Theres 2,3 day guilds that do it. It depends on your schedule & what you’re doing in life. My Uni classes have always been in the morning & raiding is at 7:30PM. I don’t go partying or clubbing anymore, I sometimes go out with friends, maybe once a week or every 2nd week. My job I use to work was only early mornings too. So I mean for someone like me it’s so easy. There’s no interference with anything. Not to mention my girlfriend plays games a lot too & we still see each other a lot & she likes playing games by herself such as Sims, single player games on steam etc so she doesn’t mind if I need to go to a raid. Idk man everyone has a different life, mine so happen makes it work so easily compared to others. If I miss a lecture at Uni I can just watch it online.

[@TheFitDragon]

SPOT ON. Heroic raids are chill and fun, you can have a beer, and a laugh and still get 970 gear and I can parse at the same level as a mythic raider. Wiping on a boss x 80+ got old years ago. We wiped on heroic Coven 13 times, I was ok with that, but mythic is annoying, not just the wiping, finding 20 competent players is also too much.

[@TheTlMEWARP]

GO HORDE

[@Herbalist40]

first off i really appreciate the time and effort put in to all the videos ! And i completely agree on the reward system ... i dropped 985 tier shoulders on heroic coven with a slot and as much as i was happy to drop that i feel it isn't right to pop out max item lvl in anything other than the highest difficulty i.e Mythic.I can see why that would take out the drive to struggle through mythic raids. As far as raiding in its self i personaly have on and off phases i think a break can do a lot of good and allow for more pleasure in the future when and if you make a return ! Anyway that's my 2 cents for whatever it's worth ! look forward to more content form you !

[@MV3xWADExCOUNTY]

Annnnnd this is why I play vanilla where you are rewarded and feel accomplished for getting loot. And no stupid transmog so you actually feel like you stick out with full raid gear. Come at me retail babies

[@Trainwheel_Time]

Mini Magi Sounds good. Stay out of the real game.

[@ElHaddock]

True, vanilla had established gear that made a logical progression. Now you can just do a catch-up content and jump into the latest raid. Also, you have to repeat the same shit 3 times (x times on some raid difficulty to get the group full geared * 3), it's not rewarding in the slightest.

[@VideoGamesRus100]

Hell yea! I was super hardcore in Legion beginning to about 2 or 3 months ago and I recently picked up Private TBC servers and my god it's like I'm playing a different game. A game that isn't always trying to hold your hand, and that if something happens to your character, whether good or bad, it's 100% on you, comparing to how RNG based the current game is (even with combat it feels more like RNG than being able to properly use rotations and skills based on certain events). Current wow should just have a dice roll, and if you get anything under a 6 you should lose.

[@alversgamecorner]

I raid mythic 2 nights a week so it's not a very huge commitment either way, but the thing that keeps me going is my guild, being part of a team with the same goal is just a pretty cool feeling

[@zilvis1140]

I know this felling .You need to play Vanilla in Lights hope or high warlord grind

[@S1ick865]

I respect your choice, I have felt the same here in the last few months Iv played the game for 11 years and now that I'm older and my life is coming together I don't feel the same when we clear a tier anymore. I feel like my wow days are coming to a end and hopefully my son will take the touch here in a few years when he is old enough to learn the game.

[@piccolo3593]

tbh.,... the way you talk to your mates in guild during a raid is just terrible.... its better u stoped raiding mythic

[@ConeJellos]

piccolo3593 shhh weeb.

[@piccolo3593]

shut up idiot

[@ConeJellos]

Mungusoar Hugh there's a difference between liking an abridged youtube channel and going by piccolo and having some weeb avatar. Also I use my real name because I'm not fucking 12.

[@mungusoarhugh8932]

Cody Jones Wow, youre right, youre so proud of yourself and dont hide anything. Oh wait, you have make to make a "funny face" on your profile picture to hide your insecurity of how ugly your regular face is. And I guess people like pewdiepie, nigahiga, and smosh were all a bunch of 12 yr olds when they started their channels.

[@LunaTulpa]

lol if you use your real name/face and not a cropped rule 34 picture

[@dolerbom]

My reason is titanforging, it made it where quantity of dungeons and raids mattered more than quality. I could raid around my job, but not spam mythic+ for the chance of legendary or gear I already have titanforging.

[@ItsVarezen]

Longest wordiest response to, “Why am i not raiding?” Ever. I got to the 5 minute mark out of almost 16 and I was bored to tears. I hate to see how long you dragged that story on for.

[@ItsVarezen]

Not sure how what I stated was at all confusing or ill stated but you caught me. Graduated Summa Cum Laude! How did you know?!

[@Chef8898]

u forgot a huge point : The whole raid tier is completable (except for a small phase on the last boss) on lfr normal and heroic difficulty. I would love to have at least 3-4 Bosses (the last or optional ones) that are mythic only. So that their gear and the satisfaction of killing those encounters can only be attained via mythic raiding. I member beating Algalon or just being able to get to him ( required beating all the hardmodes in ulduar).. that shit was epic ( and im not just speaking about the 1 hour timer on him.. that made shit real)

[@wallhackergotdammit]

Streamers, you have the easiest ''job'' in the world.

[@Thrillkilled]

Happyfunrun I agree, I wish I could have that job lmao

[@EsfandTV]

It is much harder than you could imagine

[@Emajenus]

Ok just go buy streaming equipment and start the easiest job in the world.

[@Thrillkilled]

Emajenus I'll admit the whole gaining subscribers part of streaming would be hard, but after that it's a piece of cake.

[@Emajenus]

Thrillkilled Ok go get followers and see what a piece of cake it is. You only highlight ignorance with comments like these. No entertainment job is easy.

[@Goodpatron]

I feel you Asmongold. I reached this level of raiding burnout, and had the same epiphany about the game in general, after finally downing Heroic 25-man Lich.King pre-nerf back in Wrath after months of grinding. I took a way more casual approach to raiding after that. I did not feel the need to prove anything about raiding ever again after downing him and getting Shadowmourn.

[@Thincrust128]

Good thing I didn't sub. No reason to watch you if not raiding. I don't care about watching transmog contests and trying to get everything from old dungeons. Wish you best of luck though.

[@zeedom5848]

oh no! our mighty thincrust128! don't leave us! your so important! no one gives a shit

[@pkbroarmaldo7]

I stopped mythic raiding after Guldan. For me guldan and elisande was my guild's breaking point. We were so exhausted after completing mythic NH that we only did heroic tomb and we actually had our raid leader officially call the guild for a massive break. We're back for heroic antorus but just like you said yourself You can get mythic gear without doing mythic. So that's what's been happening.

[@k.a.492]

Gucci Gang

[@loke3107]

hahahahahahaha funny XD fuck off

[@fameus4423]

cmonBruh

[@Alijamaru]

Its GUCCHIIII

[@gshipley3745]

I raided mythic in WOD and I went entirely casual for legion. I have done heroic raids with my guild(in legion) and they still do mythic. But I dont have to do them every week, they are ok with my lower dps and I dont even feel the need the min max my gear/consumables. It has been the best decision i have made. I can take weeks off if i want to and just log in and do what i want to do. I simply just have too many responsibilities outside of WOW to commit 9+ hours a week, at night, to play with my guild.

[@vitanus]

Ohboy good to know...u stopped raiding...and made a 15 min video about it...let me give u the answer at minute #2: The Game sucks and does not offer enough rewards, but i HAVE TO find other reasons that are untrue, but sound better. DONe, bad video btw

[@ParzivalMcflyGaming]

T Onizuka He's just speaking his feelings, brother. Sometimes that's just what you have to do. You aren't forced with a gun at your head to watch him speak his mind. Let him be in peace. Much love.

[@johnhood1848]

I think the main thing that is getting me to that point are the mechanics. That 1 person can wipe a group. It gets really old wiping for 4 hours a night with 19/20 people doing things exactly right and one person messes up one thing and it's a wipe. Just like you said it's like we wipe back to back until everyone doesn't fuck up.

[@elusivenorman7498]

I personally feel like they need to have 10 man raids again. I use to raid mythic content up until night hold and eventually just got sick of raiding (for similar reasons that you mentioned). I feel that it’s really hard to not only get 20 people consistently on to a raid. It’s also getting them to perform as well. While there are other issues (especially the reward system currently/ get rid of titanforging) I feel the 10 man change could be really good.

[@jako997]

I hope you see this comment, I just wanna say that I completely agree with you. My main problem is the warforged and titanforged gear crap. ive had problems where when I was trying to get Tier, and when I got one it would come out as the base ilvl (example (945 for heroic) and someone would get the same tier as me and get it titanforged to 970. RNG sucks. I kinda want it to go back to the days of WOTLK where whatever difficulty you did is the gear you would get with no changes unless you did a higher difficulty or lower.

[@smightercal]

I stopped mythic raiding in ToS because it got boring very quickly and it was just the same wipes mechanics over and over again. I did join a guild near the end of ToS and started progressing mythic KJ which was fun and scary which is what a final boss should be like, though I didn't stay in the guild long and ended up transfering to a different server with some friends. I started doing a bit of mythic again last week and so far i'm enjoying it . The difficulty seems to have a good curve, its not like mistress where its a wall for most guilds despite it techically could be the 3rd boss in the raid. From the bosses ive done (garothi, hounds, command, portal) the changes are enough to make the fight feel different to a point where you have to adjust how you handled the boss previously. Despite all this, the only reason I do mythic is because it drops the best gear. With titanforging being a thing, it takes away the rewards from doing mythic when you can just do hc and get the same ilvl of gear. I really wish titanforging would go but unfortunately the casuals love it and because the vast majority of players are casual, Blizzard has to cater to them.

[@kignpala1]

my guild stoped trying to get mythic done the reson was (since we are all irl friends) it was breaking us apart so we changed the way our guild worked we just didnt talk anymore besides when raiding but atm we talk fairly alot again and i think the reson i still raid but not as hardcore as i did is cause my friends and i just chose to do it and we liked haveing fun like that every other guy goes to partys irl but for me and my friends its a party just ingame cause we had more fun and we didnt get wasted for absolute no reson :)

[@Carriesue1982]

I raided very seriously in tbc and wotlk, totally burnt myself out at the end of wotlk and just could not make myself keep playing with cata so I quit. I played super causally here and there when new expansions hit but I could never get that drive back until recently. A couple years ago I discovered private servers and was incredibly hyped to play tbc again(the game as I remembered it). It completely brought my love for the game back. Then I met a group of people, raided with them on pservers through various xpacs and then a few of us moved to retail and now I’m running m+ and uldir. Bfa has a heck of a lot of issues but for me, raiding and all that is all about my friends.. the rewards, loot and whatnot is all secondary to me which I think helps somewhat. Also my 7-8 year hiatus also didn’t hurt lol.

[@deejay4139]

I'm only progressing on heroic, will never try mythic but it's fun to learn new fights and have a solid challenge to try and tackle with a group of people I actually like. If I didn't enjoy the guild I run with I wouldn't dedicate 9 hours a week to raiding. But even when we wipe for 2 hours in a row we can still have a good outlook on it and know we didn't waste time.

[@fiffer13]

I honestly miss competitive raiding, but that was only alive for me because of the people I did it with. None of them even play wow now to my knowledge, and with all the races being far more global now the pressure is so much higher. I remember when we just were competing on our server, and that was a blast, you saw and interacted with your opponents, but anymore they are in different places in the world and have such different schedules its more like you are competing with an advanced AI and not real players. But that drive is still there in me but the people I enjoy the game with now are no where near that level. So I enjoy seeing the content and difficulty we get to in raiding 2 or 3 nights a week and its enough. There are only like 5 of us that preform at the level required to even enter mythic, instead I've been working on finding a new class to fall in love with to help me not mind being in the competitive scene anymore. That is my story in a nutshell.

[@baseballshorts764]

Good for you, Asmongold. I will still continue to watch your videos and your stream I however, am still progressing through antorus. My last guild was set up to go into heroic and be able to do some decent progression. My current guild hasn't stepped into mythic yet. The reason why I consistantly continue to raid on a schedule with the group of people that I have, is because that the teamwork that comes with it. I don't like pugs, I don't like LFR, and I really don't care for mythic keys as much. My entire "fun" comes from progressing and getting bosses down that we never have before even if were only in heroic. I have made stronger friends through the guild that i am in and the guild i was in, because it allows us to push through and overcome challanges that are in our way.

[@CookingwithKirby]

This expansion was a whole grind man, I am actually surprised you are barely getting burnt out now. There is nothing wrong from taking a break.

[@timg9397]

I went thru alot of the same things & can relate to the things youre talking about. I quit raiding a couple years ago & its been nice to just decide my own schedule & not worry about anybody else. I do miss some things about raiding, but its just not worth the stress that comes with it. Im sure all hardcore raiders go thru this at some point.

[@bloodscar1]

I feel two of your three reasons. I recently got a new job that leaves my schedule pretty tight. I struggle to stay awake through the whole raid, and raiding takes way a lot of the time I need for IRL. The incentives to raid mythic are definitely less than previous expansions(heroic if you go that far back). The time sunk into raiding mythic is not worth the gear. I am better off just raiding heroic for titanforges on a single night, than raiding three nights and wiping a shit ton. I dont share the issue of my raid team being a drag. In fact, they are why i still raid. I love those goofballs to death. We've gone through many tiers, droughts and kill streaks alike. I dont wanna see my guild struggle to have 20 like i have seen so many times. That pressure to keep the guild going, is what keeps me there.

[@Swift016]

This is a wickedly mature video dude. Good on you for prioritizing your happiness.

[@Mordak1989]

Those lynch-pin mechanics are always stressful for some people. Some people like dealing them, but usually when you have control as to who's dealing with them. But yeah, I have never touched the mythics mostly because I haven't been in a serious raiding guild since Cata. However, I agree with the whole if the difficulty jump is so extreme either the rewards need to be better or that difficulty needs to be toned down or tuned more appropriately.

[@magicooler6811]

I hate TF in raiding, but I think its a good thing for m+. If it weren’t for TF, m+ would quickly die out and after a while ppl wouldn’t even do their weekly after anymore. Perhaps they could to TF for m+ only?

[@jordy1729]

I started raiding Mythic during ToS and for me it's the challenge that comes with it, but also the people I'm doing it with. At this moment we're only 2/11M so we're not anywhere and I'm quite curious to see if I feel the same way if or when we kill Mythic Argus. Besides that I'm also running the guild as GM and that's a lot of fun for me to do aswell. All these things combined make it that I love raiding and I'll probably keep doing so for quite a while.

[@mlaurence08]

Different difficulties is killing my raiding enjoyment. With Antorus, I avoided LFR intentionally, but normal is such a faceroll in a guild that by the time we're doing heroic, I habe to actively fight the fact that we've already done the content.