Why is David Whitmer's Witness So Compellling? (Knowhy

[@cdeanneeckles]

Thank you for sharing this post of David Whitmer. I am grateful for him being one of the Three Witnesses to the Book of Mormon another Testament of Jesus Christ.

[@steelman1506]

Did you delete my last response? Oooh testy mormon

[@Spencerman1]

@@steelman1506 Why are you harassing members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints? God bless you, don't argue with others.

[@ddfstar7588]

@@steelman1506 Hey man i respect your beliefs, i would ask you to respect ours as well. I dont go on different religions and start arguments with them. It doesnt get anything done. If you are truly trying to help people then show them by example.

[@mikeboyd3225]

@@steelman1506your responses aren’t worth reading. You’re showing your ignorance. Leave this to the grownups. You’re not qualified.

[@dinocollins720]

love it!!!

[@samuelwolf2468]

Man to hold to what you saw and stand by it even after leaving the organization is interesting test of faith or of what was witnessed by him.

[@steelman1506]

How??? David ALREADY said he saw the Plates? There is ZERO evidence(outside church unsupported claims) that David would have benefited IN ANY WAY by recanting. So why why why is his lack of recanting in any way an argument? You people are stupendously easy to fool

[@havegottogitgud]

@@steelman1506 He reaffirmed his testimony when people were literally pointing a gun at him. "The commanding officer then called twelve of his men. And ordering them to cock their guns and present them at the prisoners' breasts, and to be ready to fire when he gave the word, he addressed the prisoners, threatening them with instant death unless they denied the Book of Mormon and confessed it to be a fraud; at the same time adding that if they did so, they might enjoy the privileges of citizens. David Whitmer, hereupon, lifted up his hands and bore witness that the Book of Mormon was the Word of God. The mob then let them go" (John P. Green, 1833) David later said: "The testimony I gave to that mob made them fear and tremble, and I escaped from them. One gentleman, a doctor, an unbeliever, told me afterwards that the bold and fearless testimony borne on that occasion and the fear that seemed to take hold of the mob had made him a believer in the Book of Mormon." On one occasion, "[one] soldier suggested that Whitmer 'had been mistaken and had simply been moved upon by some mental disturbance or hallucination, which had deceived him into thinking he saw' ""How well and distinctly I remember the manner in which [David] Whitmer arose and drew himself up to his full height-a little over six feet-and said, in solemn and impressive tones: 'No sir! I was not under any hallucination, nor was I deceived! I saw with these eyes, and I heard with these ears! I know whereof I speak!"" The soldier later recalled: "[O]ne thing is certain-no man could hear him make his affirmation, as he has to us in there, and doubt for one moment the honesty and sincerity of the man himself. He fully believes he saw and heard, just as he stated he did." James Moyle (later Asst. Secretary of Treasury in two US Administrations) wrote: "And so I begged of him not to let me go through life believing in a vital falsehood. Was there any possibility that he might have been deceived in any particular?" "But he described the scene to me of his vision, about noon in an open pasture. There was no question about its truthfulness. To have been insincere seems impossible." When he felt misrepresented about his testimony, he spent money in purchasing space in several newspapers to print a "proclamation": "He that hath an ear to hear, let him hear; it was no delusion!" The Richmond Democrat printed such remarks: "Skeptics may laugh and scoff if they will, but no man can listen to Mr. Whitmer as he talks of his interview with the Angel of the Lord, without being most forcibly convinced that he has heard an honest man tell what he honestly believes to be true." Impeccable in reputation, consistent in scores of recorded interviews, and personally capable of detecting delusion, no witness is more compelling than David Whitmer

[@chrisa6455]

Brings tears to my eyes

[@steelman1506]

Me too! I'm soooo sad you guys buy into this. Lots of 😢 tears

[@dinocollins720]

Another fantastic video thank you!

[@scripturecentralofficial]

Thanks Dino!

[@dinocollins720]

@@scripturecentralofficial thank you!!!

[@blossom7582]

This is seriously good evidence

[@steelman1506]

It is an ANECDOTE!!! HOW is that good evidence??? Some random dude lied....omfg call the media...because No one ever lies do they? My brother often beleives his own lies after a while...this is a COMMON psychological event.. . Nothing extraordinary has been presented here

[@steelman1506]

@CaptainRidley Google "Group hallucinations" and "Fire in the sky". Yes. Im saying three men could very well have had a shared hallucination. It's a well understood phenomenon. Three men in northern arizona claimed to be abducted by aliens and ALL passes lie detector tests as well as having identical stories. I actually KNOW the nephew of one of these men. And all three still maintain their stories last i heard. Now historically speaking Joseph Smith had conned people for decades before turning to religion. He convinced people as a teenager that he could find buried treasure with a rock. And during those cons he quite effectively conned people into buying all manner of supernatural joojoo. So you're asking me "Can a charismatic con man convince three idiots that they witnessed something which never took place?" YES! I already know this is something that happens ALL THE TIME. Muhammad's followers witnessed him leap into heaven on a winged horse. According to tradition, thousands saw this. Guess you should be Muslim. Millions have seen David Copperfield make elephants vanish from reality itself. Guess he's really Jesus. There's a modern prophet with thousands of followers who claims to do miracles. Many testify to having seen them. Are any of these stories credible? Why do i dismiss the testimony of those three duped idiots? Same reason you dismiss the evidence for Mohammad, David Copperfield, and other self proclaimed prophets. ANECDOTES don't become evidence in groups of three. There was a teenager recently released from prison who had three girls falsely claim he raped all of them on seperate occasions. They lied. Lying is a thing. Hope your fragile world view hasn't shattered too hard.

[@steelman1506]

@CaptainRidley So Mohammed was a prophet and really did fly into heaven on a winged horse? Well unfortunately the Koran states itself to be the last revealed word of God. You lose again. There are CURRENT prophets with MORE witnesses than Smith had. If you accept every conman based on the number of claims you're gonna be duped at every corner. 3, 8, 1000....none if it jives. Flat Earthers will state that they witness the sun itself shrink in perspective numbering in the hundreds of thousands. When a person already believes something they'll go to extraordinary lengths to protect the Beleif. So a lawyer and a Doctor were duped? So what? Being a professional doesn't make one less vulnerable to a con. That's called ARGUMENT FROM AUTHORITY...and it's a logical fallacy. I've seen my own brother tell a lie, convince himself and others the lie is true, and over time continue stretching it til it's impossible from every angle. This is a well understood phenomenon, oft called BIG FISH syndrome. Smith's power wasn't INDUCING hallucinations. It was CONVINCING people they'd seen something they never did. And it wasn't ALL AT ONCE. It was slowly over time. MOST of our memories are false. We know this based on physcological comparisons to film vs recall. Most of our memories rely on the retelling of narratives. Smith took advantage of this fact to slowly alter people's memories. It's well documented and well understood. Nothing amazing

[@steelman1506]

@CaptainRidley And btw the percentages are irrelevant because Smith's followers were ALL the gullible type. A man already known to be a lying treasure seeker and legally accused fraud tells me he was visited by an angel? I laugh at him and walk away. Anyone who sits and listens has already demonstrated logically that they are a moron

[@steelman1506]

@CaptainRidley Dealing with "The Eight." There are several possibilities, each more likely than magic jew scriptures. Bare in mind Smith chose the 8. He simply chose 8 gullible morons. 1. Lying. People lie. Nuff said. Although they are also susceptible to inception via story retelling. He just had to pick his victims well. 2. Fake plates. Contrary to popular belief, Smith had plenty of cash, gobs and gobs of it. So much in fact he even ran for president. However even with a lack of funds he couldve applied gold leaf over tin on a budget. Most people had no idea what gold looked like. He also could've heat treated brass or bronze and still fooled 8 idiots. 3. Optical illusion. Even in the 1800s this was a thing. Smith had decades to construct this and incredible incentive to do so.

[@ruthmartin3141]

There are several challenges with David Whtmer's version of the Book of Mormon translation.

[@georgeking6356]

Dear beloved bro. Whitmer. I hope he and Joseph and the Lord come together and his membership is renewed and he comes into Celestial glory with his friends Joseph, Oliver and Martin.

[@Greghuntersranch]

Is this the same person that was ex-communicated from the Mormon Church?

[@TheGrams56]

Yes, in fact all 3 witnesses fell away from the church at one time. However to there dying days none of them ever denied their testimonies of the reality of the golden plates. Martin Harris eventually went west to where the Saints were and was rebaptized there Oliver Cowdery was to sick to go west but went to Iowa where he was also was rebaptized. David was the only one who did not return to the church.

[@c.cannon1102]

Yes, the Video even covers that

[@michaelbennett7561]

The fact that he was excommunicated, and despite every reason to refute his earlier testimony if it were false due to bad feelings between himself and Joseph Smith, he chose to stay true to the testimony throughout his life, adds immeasurably to his testimony. In fact, it is one of the strongest possible affirmations of his testimony. If he had remained a lifelong faithful member, never excommunicated, his testimony would be so much easier to dismiss.

[@RegardingThePlan]

We have every reason to believe David Whitmer will be exalted. The Lord told the witnesses they would be “lifted up at the last day” (see D&C 17:8) if they were faithful to their testimony. It’s like God knew Satan would beat them up. They had one charge, which we have every indication to believe they fulfilled. Their charge wasn’t to stay in the church. It was to bear that testimony, which they all did. If they did that, they were told His grace is sufficient for them (see also D&C 17:8).

[@pvtpaulafmj]

Thank you for that. Ours is not to judge, but to have a perfect brightness of hope. That also includes hoping the best for others.

[@amandamacneill1100]

Mark my words David might had been excommunicated on this earth from the church, but surely he has been forgiven in heaven by the only true lord and he has gained afterlife.

[@dinocollins720]

love this!

[@jacobdominguez7808]

Great video!

[@benjaminmckay8567]

Love it!

[@dinocollins720]

thanks!!!

[@westlisbon6307]

I wonder if he seen a Jinn?

[@westlisbon6307]

A freemason top hat and golden plates?

[@steelman1506]

Soooo Angels, Visions, Golden plates, forgotten languages, Demigod zombies, and a magic rock in a hat is how you explain the fact that David didn't admit he lied? And any natural explanation rooted in psychology is just entirely IRRATIONAL right?

[@jlkbbk2003]

Soooo why do you capitalize "Angels", "Visions", and "Demigod" if your as brilliant as you say and figured it all out? I can't believe a guy who can't spell or use grammar properly yet can somehow debunk Whitmer so fast.

[@chischilisnez7811]

The ways of God are foolishness to Man. "It is a wicked and adulterous generation that demands a sign [evidence]." --Jesus Christ

[@chihangbenjaminting647]

You go write a Book of Mormon yourself and then you can tell me that you don't know it is true. I bet you can't even write something like the Doctrines and Covenants.

[@blanko5953]

"But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed." - Galatians 1:8

[@Dreammaster695]

Stephen Ally what about the book of revelation at the end of the New Testament?

[@blanko5953]

@@Dreammaster695 "*contrary*" gospel. The angel doesn't preach a contrary gospel.

[@marvinvieiradequeiroz8327]

@@blanko5953 exactly.. The angel didn't teach a different gospel to Joseph Smith

[@blanko5953]

Look more carefully Lamoni.

[@joeyjay1662]

Stephen: The Bible As We Know Today Was Never Compiled Into One Text.--Your Statement Is Incorrect As There Was No Bible Known As We Know It Today.--Isn't This What Was Exactly Said About The Teachings Of Jesus CHRIST During HIs Mortal Ministry...Hmm??!!

[@steelman1506]

THOUSANDS of people witnessed Mohammed fly into heaven on a winged horse. Do I believe it happened because people SAID it did? No. For the same reason none of you do either. LOGIC

[@williamhenley8593]

David fell out with Joseph Smith, surely if it was all false he would reveal this and try to discredit Joseph Smith

[@steelman1506]

@@williamhenley8593 FALSE DICHOTOMY & ARGUMENT FROM IGNORANCE These are known as logical fallacies. You're suggesting that Mr. Whitmore had a clear motive here, yes? I disagree. You've basically reduced the number of possibilities to two: EITHER David betrays Joe and gets a reward, or stays true and is persecuted. Yes? Problem is....there are more than 2 options. I don't pretend to know the mind of David Whitmore, and neither should you. There are a thousand possible reasons David did this sir. You are first suggesting ONLY two options are possible, then saying that because YOU can't come up with any other answer that No one else can either. So fallacious reasoning aside, It is entirely possible David truly believed he'd witnessed these things. Memories are incredibly susceptible to peer pressure. This is a well understood phenomenon, as is attention seeking. Attention seeking doesn't require that the attention be positive. It's also possible David liked the scorn. Some do

[@steelman1506]

@@williamhenley8593 BTW I myself have had a significant falling out with my brother. Why is it that I don't Go out of my way to discredit my brother? Same reason David probably didn't go after Joseph. I'm a decent human being. Why is it Mormons have such a hard time understanding that people can remain decent after leaving the church? You assume the devil is now in charge of us and everything David Whitmer did would then be Satan infuenced??? Jesus that's sick! David was demonstrating a streak of compassion you jackass! Joseph Smith had been his friend. So using Davids humanity to prove your religion.....wow!!! New low

[@williamhenley8593]

+James The reenlightened First of all there is no need to make this personal with name calling, in a debate that is also a form of logical fallacy, stay focused on the issue at hand. I have not provided a false dichotomy but think about it logically. If David no longer supported Joseph which he didn’t, why would he go out of his way to make statements that would support Joseph’s claims and would lead to more people following him. Also, as a side note I do not think people who have left the Church are evil. I have been in the same position. I think there are lots of very good people in all walks as life as well as evil people in all walks of life

[@steelman1506]

@@williamhenley8593 So why then sir, would you assume David would have any level of motivation to discredit Joseph? I would recommend my brother as a car salesman in spite of the fact he's a liar. Why? Because i love my nephew and neice. They deserve all the nice things my brothers salary brings. In much the same way, it is POSSIBLE David paid the same courtesy to Joseph. He was a close friend and even after the falling out remained a DECENT HUMAN BEING. You are assigning a motive where you lack understanding. This is by definition 'argument from ignorance.' I just came up with a possible alternative motive and could conceive of hundreds more. How are you not understanding that your lack of another explanation is NOT a valid point? Just because you are able to come up with ONE possible explanation among an infinite number DOES NOT lend credence to your view