Why Men Are So Afraid To Approach Women - Louise Perry

[@ChrisWillx]

Hello you legends. Watch the full episode with Louise here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fnLQgmqKmNebbKM. Get a 35% discount on all Cozy Earth products at www.cozyearth.com/modernwisdom

[@peterGnash]

hey chris, can you address the social construct that is the mating value of formal education. seems like its an outdated measure of "value" in dating and is just an ego thing at this point. "i need someone with equal or higher (formal) education status than me" will mean nothing in the coming years and thus one aspect of these dating issues should be corrected. Women will be 'humbled' a bit (i.e. some of the hot air let out) and in the meantime men will set a new criteria for status (since it matters more for men's access to sex than a woman's).

[@nekemli2622]

Why don't we talk about how women don't approach men? Women approach men even less, than men approach women.

[@taylorc2542]

How about women approaching us? They sure do talk about equality a lot.

[@schadenfreude2555]

Chris, perhaps "pyschodynamics" is a better term for the subject of male-female social interactions than "thermodynamics".

[@barrypeters5136]

Wise beyond your age young man. You guest was great

[@JezaLoki]

2 female friends were having a conversation about dating. I sat quietly, drinking my beer, listening in. After 2 hours of non stop chatter I said to them "Hey, did you know that all this boils down to 2 main complaints : the 1st complaint is that you hate it when guys approach you. The 2nd complaint is that guys don't approach. ( they were nodding in agreement) How can you have these two complaints AT THE SAME TIME?" They looked at each other, looked back at me like I was a homeless who just pissed themself and said "We just want the RIGHT guys to approach us". What followed can be summarised as "men must read our mind and know when we find them attractive".

[@chriscampbell9191]

Exactly.

[@bullballsallday]

🍻 Women. Can't live with them...the end. --- Al Bundy

[@stevec3526]

In other words they don’t want to take on any responsibility.

[@yukisnoww]

Apparently they don't get it...but it's fine, they can wish (not hope, wish, lol). It might happen, but probably never.

[@SillySpanish]

If I sit with my female friend in a bar no we are not open targets for any man sometimes we just want to enjoy a drink. Read the signs guys. Approach yes love it support it appreciate it thankful for it but not constantly everywhere. Politely Sent 2 guys away and yet a third comes over and thinks he’s the one to take us home. Didn’t even for a second watch the scene or serious interest in us as human beings

[@JF-xm6tu]

In my experience if they find you attractive they appreciate the approach. If they don't find you attractive they will shame you and they will abuse you. It's pretty demoralising tbh, literally playing a gamble whether the girl is going to be nice or really nasty

[@chrisazure1624]

And the men who are immune to the rejection are horrible people. But women do get what they train. I have met women who fell in love with people they would not have been attractive to, but got to know the guy in an organic setting and fell in love with the man.

[@rrwholloway]

You might call it toxic femininity

[@tgheretford]

Worse still now, new laws are coming in to deal with unwanted communication and behaviour. Dating apps will also have a legal duty to prevent and act. One wrong move toward one person will destroy your social status and potentially risk your liberty and give you a criminal record for life.

[@macmcleod1188]

Plus there's legal risk, social risk, and career risk.

[@JF-xm6tu]

@@tgheretford it's just insane. It's like it's engineered or something

[@ElonTrades]

Like 15 years ago my father who’s from Eastern Europe complained that he can’t even talk to women in the USA, in the sense that they’re awfully unapproachable. And he’s absolutely right.

[@graceg3250]

lol Eastern Europeans aren’t known for being approachable in any context. What’s probably going on is he doesn’t have the right accent down, which heavily influences the tone he interprets from others and the tone he projects onto others. Cultural differences will also heavily influence how you expect someone to respond in a given context. I’m sure he has had many missed opportunities to engender friendly connection with others. And I’m sure he has been utilizing the wrong methods to get it.

[@ronnie_5150]

The crap women watch on TV and the internet TELLS them they are better than us. @@slow-adhesiveness-4933

[@MMK86]

@@graceg3250 uh oh, we got an expert here 🤡

[@Just_a_Lad]

@@graceg3250 I am from Eastern Europe and you're actually wrong. In general we're quite approachable. We engage in conversation even if this conversation is difficult.

[@RenegadeManta799]

100%. Even in casual customer employee conversations I have always found the women far nicer and more approachable whenever I'm in Eastern Europe.

[@JennyT101]

I met my husband at work. We chatted a lot and i thought he liked me but no matter how many hints I dropped he never asked me out. One day I found out that he was being transferred to another of our company's locations in our city and I wasn't going to see him regularly anymore. I decided that I had to do something, so the next time I saw him I walked up to him, handed a piece if paper with my phone number on it and said "Call me some time if you want to go out" and walked off. I am not generally an outgoing person and it was so unbelievably nerve wracking to do it! I have so much sympathy for guys having to ask women out. Anyway, he called the very next day and 15 years later we are still together. Ladies, ask THEM out! Many times the shy guys are the sweetest!

[@MrWaterbugdesign]

Cool that 15 years ago someone could ask a coworker out without getting fired and blacklist from other jobs. And yeah, of course ladies can still sexual harass, oops, I mean ask a coworker out, with no repercussion. But perhaps we're even getting into the era of women losing that ability. Men are now so thoroughly instructed in sexual harassment that if a woman passed me a note with her number and invite to go out, I'd have to take the note to HR immediately and file a sexual harassment just to protect myself. If I didn't file a complaint and didn't then call that woman, ask her out, etc... I'd be risking retaliation from her. To seek vengeance against me and make up a harassment claim. It's a war out there and we have no idea who the friendlies are. In the choice of risking career vs asking out a coworker I have to go with career being more important. Focus on career, retire early and move to another country. That's what I did and planning to move to SE Asia next year. There I can ask out a woman without risking criminal charging assuming I'm careful about her age. Just a much better deal all the way round.

[@initiatorhater0688]

why can't it be more socially acceptable for women to shoot their shot with men they like or for women to be the initiators?

[@mindclinic1244]

You’re a unicorn

[@GoldChocobo77]

It's both cute and annoying when a man isn't getting our clues ❤

[@samuellahniers7430]

@@MrWaterbugdesign You're way overthinking it my friend. You can tell a "friendly" from not with body language, smiles, looks, etc... Be a masculine man with the 1.62 golden shoulder to waist ratio, and they'll stare at you. It's that simple. Besides, you're not supposed to get your meat at the bread store anyway. Just be nice to them on a friends basis at work if you're afraid of losing your job.

[@thomasel9171]

As everyone else in the comments has said, society treats attractive men well, and unattractive men like the plague.

[@PTMcMullen]

and women consider a '9' to be an 'average' man that they'd be willing to settle for.

[@danielcraig9666]

That's the thing, "unattractive" isn't even the problem. An 8 who isn't the most interesting man in the world will be treated as poorly as a 2.

[@danielcraig9666]

@@brianmeen2158 It's not nonsense, there's literal statistics about this stuff.

[@chriscampbell9191]

@@brianmeen2158 Only partly agree. Unattractive men can develop attractive personalities, learn to play the game, and if they're loaded they will -- or can -- do well. Women are drawn to wealth and charisma. I've seen that in bars, where women were drawn to well-paid factory men and well-dressed professionals like iron filings to a strong magnet. But I don't think that every comment in these threads about unattractive men being overall treated like shit is an untrue comment. Even working out and lifting isn't a guarantee you'll do better. 60% of younger men (age 18-30) being alone in the US is an indication that something is haywire, and you can't tell me all of those 60% of men 18-30 are unattractive. There are other factors at play, obviously.

[@skinnyguy7773]

@@chriscampbell9191 Unattractive men have nothing to gain by being flashy. They would do well to hide their wealth, and not attract users. This is garbage red pill advice you are peddling.

[@FrankM]

I went to a speed dating event back in early December 2023. Two women complained that men don't approach them. I mentioned it's because women often don't do anything to invite an approach, like eye contact and/or smiling. They each looked at me dumbfounded. Women don't really understand how dating and relationships work, because most of the responsibility falls on the man. The man has to initiate, the man has to ask, the man has to be consistent, and the woman is just there receiving.

[@xDUxEXcluSIvE]

@FrankM men have to do all this lol it’s just not worth the effort anymore

[@GentleFlyer]

I am 59 and can say that I believe that women are absolutely terrible at navigating and improving relationships. I have been dumbfounded so many times....

[@hiteck007]

I did speed dating nights for short period. And it was always the same Gold Digging questions, that was a total turn off & I Never returned

[@GentleFlyer]

@@hiteck007 Well, a very common , expected, and fair question for a woman to ask a man at an event like that is "What do you do for a living?". So unless she asks directly "how much money do you make" .....well I'm sure you can see where I'm going with this.

[@hiteck007]

@@GentleFlyer That was usually about their 2nd question, every question was centered around MONEY and how much you have. Once I saw they all asked the same questions well I was done with that lot. They were ALL GOLD DIGGERS. They weren't impressed with my answers either. LOL

[@barneymiller4088]

I am older and back in the day women considered a man approaching them a compliment and responded gracefully. Today, a percentage of women consider it an opportunity to humiliate a man and signal their independence from men in general. They will brag how they shot the guy down with heir girlfriends. This ruins getting approached for all women.

[@HotelMari0Maker]

Yup. Literally how my parents met. My mom says back in the day (she grew up in the 80s) it was normal and flattering.

[@prussiansocietyofamerica]

@@HotelMari0Maker It was still pretty bad in the 80's though...

[@loganzamanwalker8763]

Yeah true 100%!! I saw it with my own eyes. Socialising after work and all these ladies were bragging about how they string men along

[@loganzamanwalker8763]

I could imagine how they would like in group chats..

[@MarthaAnthony]

That sucks. I always appreciated the compliment and the guts it took to approach me. As long and the guy was also courteous, and not too persistent, vicious if rejected etc. I think a lot of women have also seen men turn nasty if we politely refused them.

[@coreymoore1443]

The "why don't men approach me?" argument is basically asking the question "why doesn't the right man just fall into my lap with no effort or risk on my part?" Because life isn't a fairy tale, and you're not Cinderella, that's why.

[@jasondashney]

Amen. We've set up society these days in a way that the woman has to offer up nothing but herself. The only role she plays is as the rejector of guys until she finds one she is willing to accept. But the men have to approach in exactly the right way at exactly the right time, and both of those depend on him being exactly the right guy because until he is, he's approaching in the wrong way the wrong time and he's intrinsically in the wrong. He has all the risk and has to put in all the effort and he has to be able to read her mind. Her role is to accept or deny? That's not an equal endeavour now, is it? It takes two to tango but only one has to play by any sort of rules.

[@B.E.Z.nOtLayZ]

This

[@Peaches4Rent]

Hey Cinderella had it hard

[@jagr06]

You don't need to have them fall into your lap, you just need to be put into places where you end up encountering each other so there's a balance of "some work and luck"

[@SakuraDove]

@@jagr06 Exactly... Women should not hand out their phone number to any bozo who walks up to them because of violence. It's just harder to meet people nowadays in organic ways . E.g school, the workplace, gyms and dates sets up by friends/mutuals are great first steps to meeting the "right" one.

[@ethanonan7709]

To fix this issue society either needs to either increase incentives for relationships or reduce risks for relationships to work. Preferably a bit of both.

[@endgamefond]

What do you think is the incentives that is greater than the cost?

[@check4v]

Japan has a ton of marriage incentives and they have an even worse problem of people not getting married than America and the UK do.

[@kevinpankanin6222]

Almost like our society should encourage heterosexual marriages which lead to family units. Hmmm. What a novel idea

[@Jay1971lion]

I’m my view, one of the reasons is the high cost of marriage and family, divorce and the unbearable cost of childcare. We do have economic tools to increase the viability of starting a family. I’m looking at what we can do over an idealized actions.

[@tgheretford]

@@jamewakk And increasingly now, it carries a potential criminal risk as there is lobbying to criminalise unwanted communication and behaviour.

[@journeywithin9155]

When men approach me, I am warm and welcoming, no matter who he is. It takes a lot of courage to approach a woman. I am married and can set my boundaries confidently. As they leave I tell them that I admire their courage and appreciate the compliment. Made my day. Rejection doesn’t have to be cruel. It can be done with kindness.

[@Areso2012]

If there is a karma-thing, I hope it would return you your kindness.

[@Thinker1985]

Thank you for being a decent human being. We are quick to shame those who misbehave and often forget to simply praise those who appropriately behave.

[@Trancymind]

Sadly here in USA in this century, you'll see women shaming men and reporting them creepers to the human resources despite accepting his phone number while she said 'thanks' to him while she smiled. When this type of things happen very often to men, you'll see a different shift changing within society. Man would rather be alone instead of putting him under the bus by her. Manipulation at its best. I can never put any woman in trouble in that type of situation despite her unknown outcome with her courage.

[@poetsrear]

1%

[@RAntonio93]

I hate to break it to you. But whether you know it or not the reason you are warm is because you are married. Man or woman when they are taken have 0 defensive barriers up because they have nothing to gain or lose interacting with the opposite sex. The women who are taken are always the friendliest and those who are single are often very cold and stand off ish.

[@PaperStCo]

A women can have a great conversation with you one day, and the next day look at you like you’re a fool for talking to her (personal experience). Literally just depends how she’s feeling that day.

[@jonevans870]

Yeah, it’s weird. I actually do approach women in public. Sometimes I get dates from it. But the amount of times I have met a woman and she seems to be really digging it, flirting, asking me questions, looking excited. They seem enchanted. And then when you text them later, they are just lukewarm at best. It’s like they can’t hold on to whatever excitement or interest they felt. And that's fine, nobody owes you interest. But women sure are strange and fickle creatures!

[@Ben-Ken]

That's why it's best not to flirt or be overly friendly at work. All it takes is a vague complaint from her to HR and you can lose promotions or your job. I've seen it happen too many times.

[@PaperStCo]

@@Ben-Ken agreed. I work at a bar and I don’t even bother trying to be flirty. It’s very tempting but just flat out not worth it.

[@PaperStCo]

@@jonevans870 yup! Honestly I think it’s social media and phones. As soon as you aren’t in front of her all she has to do is pull out her phone for instant gratification from dozens of other men. You just become another crab in the bucket.

[@jonevans870]

@@PaperStCo yeah, probably that’s a big part of it. I also think a lot of women just like leading men on. They are more interested in validation than in actually meeting people, it seems.

[@stoptheworldiwannagetoff4780]

Reading the comments, most people seem to think fear of spiteful rejection is why men no longer approach. For me it's, most women these days aren't nice to be around.

[@AndreVeaseyJr]

Valid

[@Chatelaine0]

Have u seen how rude guys are when they are not attracted to a woman? It's horrendous!

[@captainstabbin1230]

@@Chatelaine0 You're talking about Chad and Tyrone, who have so many women throwing themselves at them that it becomes like static noise. Alot of women don't know how to take a respectful rejection, either, get pushy, emotional and insist. If a man did that, you'd have no mercy. No means no, right?

[@MrWaterbugdesign]

The worse part about chasing a woman is catching her.

[@Eidolon5150]

Why hang around someone men and uninterested when you could be hanging with the boys who 99% of the time got your back

[@midasthestallion4105]

They say "if opportunity doesn't knock, build a door". If the ladies are upset that men aren't out here approaching, rather then blaming men either ask men what will get them to approach and make the necessary adjustments OR approach a guy you like and shoot your shot. Be the stunning and brave ladies the media proclaims you to be! 😮😊

[@mfawls9624]

🤣🤣🤣 Brutal takedown

[@uhnborhn5032]

Women take ownership of anything? 🤣

[@reedmckinney7426]

Lol never gonna happen. They love DOING the rejecting, they could not possibly TAKE the rejection.

[@somenuttysquirrel]

At this point, I see no alternatives. The insane amount of courage we had to work up to just ask the girl was enough to deal with... _now_ we have these cut-throat political and social boundaries to break through on top of that..... Traditional women who are victims of the current sexual market climate would have much better chance at approaching... And, on behalf of men, I'd say we'd be stunned and honored; we might stand a little taller under the weight of Clown World....... The _most_ that would happen is a soft let-down; surely never a "beat it, creep" episode.

[@M0viLover]

Ha, ha. Good luck with *that!* I've seen quite a few videos of w0men complaining on Bumble, that men don't initiate (more). Uh, it is website *designed* for w0men to initiate contact?!

[@OmegaIL]

Not gonna lie, being laughed at for approaching a girl is not a nice feeling.

[@Eleriol84]

Getting rejected with a sneer and to see her and all her friends laugh at you is quite the experience

[@OmegaIL]

@@Eleriol84 yep

[@valentingartner3793]

Who tf does that? That’s so scummy.

[@averagejoe7860]

so what? if theyre not interested, then boo fucking hoo. lets adapt the approach, put on a fresh smile, and go get the next one. its all a mindset. get some thicker skin

[@OmegaIL]

@@averagejoe7860 you're not wrong. But it sure as hell doesn't make things easier.

[@Kraterlandschaft]

Ask women this: What's worse: 1. When unwanted attention happens. 2. When it stops.

[@shreypethkar8724]

One hell of a good comment and no replies, lemme fix that

[@thystaff742]

The attention has essentially stopped. Not unless they're posting their backside on social media or OF.

[@siriusfun]

The original post is challenging that. And yes - when the "unwanted" attention stops, and it will, many will not be okay with it. @@Adele5554

[@korbendallas2508]

That is an excellent inquiry🧐

[@jb894]

When it stops. For sure 100%

[@Bloodcurling]

They always ask "Why aren't men approaching...?" Never "I wanted equality, so why don't I approach also? "

[@alvianekka80]

Feminism's double standards.

[@mrmf613]

When I was a kid growing up in the 80s, all kids had some common ground where they met in neighborhood groups and played together. That was the beginning of romantic encounters in teen years. That all seems to have disappeared primarily with females focused almost exclusively on cell phones and social media. I think this was very destructive to male-female relationships.

[@tetedur377]

I grew up in the '50s and '60s. It was a running joke about women and telephones. I mean, my earliest recollections are of old-fashioned, wall-mounted telephones with a fixed mouthpiece and a separate ear piece on a cord. Even in those days, that's what women did: gossip on the phone. If you needed to make a phone call, not only did all of your neighbors get to listen in, but you had to ask them to break up the party so you could get through to the operator so she could connect you to the doctor or the vet, or whoever. In the latter part of the '50s and through the '60s, the teenage girl and her tying up the phone for hours (and later, her princess phone surgically attached to her) became standard gag material.

[@Sixsoul]

Smart phones ruined EVERYTHING

[@nateoliver3285]

To be fair guys are also into it. I suspect that most of that is because women are into it so they have to play that game to get a girl.

[@luisdetomaso867]

No mention of males focused almost exclusively on video games?

[@Ghostrider-ul7xn]

​@@luisdetomaso867 You're getting it wrong, males focused on video games often times is the effect of women ignoring them, not the cause. Just like how many guys turn to alcohol/drinks to numb pain and depression, most guys turn to video games as a substitute for lack of romantic affection/attention from women. This is the main reason. If these guys weren't invisible to women, most of them wouldn't spend majority of their time on video games.

[@clownshow5901]

Most of the women I see, whether at the store or at work, walk around with a pissed off look on their face while staring at the floor or the ceiling, doing anything to avoid having to look at anyone. Who the hell wants to approach that? Update: apparently I need to clarify my comment. The video is about WOMEN who are complaining about how men don't approach them. I made the observation about how they present themselves in public and who in hell wants to approach that? This doesn't mean * I'm * complaining about how women present themselves; I couldn't f-ing care less. I'm pushing 60, I no longer care. I'm not interested in "drawing them out of their shell", nor "disarming them with a smile" or any other such crap. I. DON'T. CARE. What I'm suggesting is that if women are complaining men aren't approaching them, then THEY need to be the ones to look up away from the damn floor or their phone and look at someone and engage them as a fellow human. I engage with people all the time of all walks of life. But I'm not looking for a partner. If these women want to stare angrily at the floor, have at it, but don't complain about men not approaching you. And for the guys who think the man should be the one to draw her out, have fun because you're going to spend a lot of time constantly trying to make her happy.

[@highnoon7097]

This sounds like a you problem. Don't be so bitter about your own failings

[@masteryoda498]

@@highnoon7097 Failed PUA/Simp detected here.

[@redactedcanceledcensored6890]

Interesting, they stare at me while pissed off somewhat often. I must be attractive and they are pissed off about that fact. They are still rude though.

[@bloodymares]

A kind word can do wonders to change that pissed off look to a genuine smile. A lot of people have it hard, not everyone can smile 24/7 at strangers who they have no reason to trust. But breaking through all that can make anyone's day and they'd think about you at least a couple of times even if you simply decide to leave after a friendly interaction and don't ask for contact info. That applies to both men and women because almost all people need friendly interaction. Don't focus on unpleasant talks, focus on the occasional positive interactions where a person shows interest in the conversation.

[@friedfrawg]

​@@bloodymares sometimes it can be challenging to offer kind words to people who only see you as an ATM machine.

[@schroederluck7984]

Because women only want to be approached by attractive guys, and men have wised up to this. Most guys who know they aren’t attractive have given up, and a lot of normal, average men have also given up, as the effort required isn’t worth the end result of having to deal with a modern woman. All the super attractive men now are just living on easy mode. They don’t have to approach to get women because women’s increasing expectations have funneled themselves straight to the most handsome men.

[@thekey429]

I was not very physically attractive in my teens and early 20s (always always with lots of acne) and I got laid a lot by approaching women; I just had GAME. Learn bro; or watch yourself become bitter

[@jonnjones8263]

@@thekey429 Or he could just learn not to be bitter. It's not like he needs women to be happy. I'd be more concerned about men being successful in life and becoming wealthy.

[@kirkbespokeify]

@@thekey429how tall or short are you?

[@themodfather9382]

It took an extremely long time to wise up. The pickup artist became popularized again in 2005 with neil strauss' book the game. before that, 99% of people really only had TV. It took almost 20 years to put facts about hypergamy up on the internet...

[@fasteddy9312]

​@@thekey429Did you consider your "GAME" made you attractive?

[@lpsoldierPZ]

Men are not bad at receiving signals, women are terrible at sending them...

[@blackzilian83]

FACTS society only blam men thats insane . Their mother and frand mother knew how to send straight clear signal to men back in the day... Nobody talk about that

[@alvianekka80]

Women expect men to read their mind. Did they think all men are psychic?

[@ptealixpaint]

Communication is a two way street

[@birdstwin1186]

S P E A K ! 11 !

[@fleetinghopes6448]

@@alvianekka80 yes.

[@tgheretford]

Women told men not to approach them in public places if they don't know them. There is now a push for new laws to deal with unwanted communication and attention from men both online and in real life. Police are now being stationed in nightclubs and online dating apps will have a legal duty to protect women's safety from said behaviour. That's why men are not approaching women. One person feeling offended or the "ick" could destroy a man's life. Never used to be the case.

[@kc1973able]

Fking crazy fk up world. I’m a 50 year old married man. Glad I missed this Death

[@lennard5393]

Stop being paranoid

[@SithicusPL]

@@lennard5393 It's not paranoia, it's healthy self-preservation.

[@fnordiumendures138]

@@lennard5393 Why? Even if the fear of being shamed and prosecuted is exaggerated, look at what created it. Think about the sex hostile and/or male hostile attitude that women would need to have for them to support all this so wholeheartedly. Why would I WANT a woman who is afraid of men and sex? Or who is traumatized from previous encounters? Or who feels disgust towards men whom she deems beneath her? It's all wholly unattractive.

[@averagejoe7860]

no girl is getting offended if you approach with a friendly smile and some manners. this isnt a legit excuse, its cowardice

[@jackspring7709]

I remember when I was a youth - having a girlfriend was something to strive for: I see my nephews now: in their teens - they don't seem to give a hoot about girls: they study hard, do plenty of sports, they're driven and they seem to be a lot calmer than we were at that age.

[@garden_dork]

It's easy to feel peace and content when you know you don't have to lose half of your assets to someone who "changed their mind"

[@cashcowcommissions6790]

I think you meant they’re a lot smarter 🤣 Intelligent men, even young men see women for the nonsense they prioritize! Men have woken up, no matter what age!

[@pronounshismajesty3542]

Low test

[@fuzzypanda1684]

Seriously? With all the sex constantly shoved in our faces, and the façade that we all have unlimited options, I'd think they'd be borderline obsessed with chasing tail.

[@RemziCavdar]

The opposite is reality and maybe because it's shoved in our faces@@fuzzypanda1684

[@HeavyK.]

We hear from modern women: 1) Men approach me. 2) Men don't approach me.

[@DavidMatias79]

It's true

[@frozenskies1718]

Translation: 1) Men I'm not interested in approach me. 2) Men I'm interested in don't approach me.

[@DavidMatias79]

@@frozenskies1718 verily

[@WaddyMuters]

Exactly. When are men supposed to approach women? I have heard literally every single public space where strangers meet described as a no go place to approach women, by women.

[@AliBhai-sl8gc]

No my definition of incel is the most accurate and backed by data. First, let's look at my definition of incel. Incel: A single male that is not in a long-term loving relationship with a partner that THEY find attractive. They may or may not have kids. These men are likely to be excess men of low social and financial standing. But due to our Darwinian high pressure, society...."more above average men" are finding themselves locked out of having a long-term loving relationship. This is what will cause society to destabilise and fall in quality and safety. Indeed, we are seeing it NOW already. And these men will either check out or become destructive. Both are not good news for society in terms of economic, social, and security reasons. Remember, the media and even others are not correct about what an incel is. It's not about just getting "3ex"......its realising that you have been unable to find a long-term loving, mutually validating relationship with a partner that YOU find attractive. My question to the world is this..... If a man IS IN a long-term loving relationship with a partner that THEY find attractive and they have kids. And that man is close to his parents and relatives and family, kids and friends. If he does a job that may not earn him all the money in the world. But it's enough to get his family by in dignity, and he finds purpose in that line of work. And that man is respected in HIS family, community........ TELL ME HOW MANY MEN LIKE THIS DO YOU FIND COMMITTING CRIMES, RIOTING, LOOTING???? THEY ARE THE PILLERS OF A STABLE SOCIETY. Now, "chads" that trun a lot of plates and have a lot of options are not strictly speaking incels, providing they don't have prolonged dry spells between "relationships".....but make no mistake these men are not necessarily destructive like incels, but are ultimately unfulfilled.....they are not as happy/stable as the man I described above. And that's all these is to know on the matter..... Peace

[@KensleyHomeschool]

Great stoic quote "Every person is an opportunity for kindness" -- You live & behave with this attitude and you'll attract the right people.

[@OlivePittsOnDesk]

I had just begun seeing a woman when at a dance, another man respectfully approached her, and her ugly response to him was so hateful I never called her again. Her friends later asked my why I dumped her, I told them her true character had been clearly exposed.

[@Bada_Boom78]

You are the real MVP 🏆 You are also smart, good on you.

[@lambchop6278]

@@OlivePittsOnDesk As a woman: well done!

[@TopFlightSecurity415]

I've seen that at clubs also, it's one thing if guy is aggressive but if a man is respectful there no reason to be rude smh a true sign of bad character

[@monicad7222]

This is so real. I notice it when I go to the bars all the time, ESPECIALLY in the sacred space where women reveal all their secrets; the women's washroom lol. I'll see a girl that I think is absolutely beautiful, but then I'll catch her with her friends making the nastiest remarks about a man just because she didn't find them attractive. This ironically makes her and her friends less appear less attractive with their hateful energy. The way some of these girls talk about men is so dehumanizing, it actually makes me a bit sad. That's someone's child they're talking about :(

[@timtim818]

Good discipline 🏃‍♂️

[@Sav-b9i]

When the problem is me there's no hesitation in blaming men, when the problem women, it's oh no no no. This is another session of moving the goal posts. The behaviour, attitude, language, privileges, policies, predudice and laws that protect women, are the problem. When solving a problem only allows accountability on one half of the problem, it won't work.

[@Yeetus223]

When the western human female is literally the pickiest mate selector in the known universe

[@Billy-bc8pk]

@ralphfurley4217Yeah and he's one of the 9/10 guys so it's easy for him to say "Men do better", he is literally the archetype for the kind of man that women throw themselves at on dating apps.

[@Lorenz-k8p]

Although I think your assumption is correct, I fear that female preferential treatment is partly of genetical / evolutionary source, not only by society / learned behaviour.

[@johnmac333]

Great post , u-b , so true .!

[@ashleyalexander7388]

its always our fault, that's why more men are just doing their thing. expectations of to be perfect kind reader.

[@brushstroke3733]

I'm 46 and have approached women maybe 5 times in my life. I'm a quick learner, unfortunately, so it only took a few rejections to train me away from ever doing it again.

[@alterego157]

It's just a conversation. But you build up some wild fantasies and expectation in your head and turn it into a question of life and death for your ego. Just go into it without any expectation, have fun, have a conversation. That's all.

[@brushstroke3733]

@@alterego157 You're exactly right. Well said. But these days, most women that I'm attracted to don't seem to have any interest in anything that interests me. I'll try to be more positive and keep trying though.

[@samcurtisrobinson]

Would be interested to know the type of women you approached and how you went about it. All these things will hugely effect your outcomes

[@samcurtisrobinson]

@@brushstroke3733so you need to be looking at why you want women who have no mutual interests. You don’t have to necessarily have common interests with women you like. There will be multiple factors at play

[@DavianSinner]

If at first you don't succeed, try again. If you then don't succeed, give up. There's no point in making a fool of yourself. I heard that once and have stuck by it.

[@DeadCat-42]

I realized years ago I'm not attracted to women who don't Express attraction to me. When women act disinterested, I become disinterested. The big difference is, I'm not pretending.

[@youdonthavetocomment]

Attractive girls can be undesirable. I often remember Eminem saying "What, I'm gay 'cause I don't like bitches?" and it rings true lol.

[@DahcipheR]

From recent experiences, there are a few reasons: (1) The mass demonization of cold approaching over the years has talked me, amoung others, right out of doing it. (2) Dating apps are hell. (3) In areas of personal interest, worthwhile women are either already taken or few and far between. (4) Did I mention that dating apps are hell?

[@vladimirofsvalbard9477]

Well, humans are extremely abusive with power. The ability to report a guy to a YMCA front desk (simply for saying hi) is 'power'. Modern technology has given people a sense of total immunity and anonymity; this ONLY promotes more abuses of power. Not to mention people are lacking major 'meaning' in their lives It's easy to fill that void with contempt and narcissism.

[@hgff69]

True that brother

[@rogerreynolds5822]

Right there with you bro

[@southernprideyankee]

If ur handsome its flirting If ur ugly its creepy ...im ugly and approaching is not worth the humiliation

[@Werewolf.with.Internet.Access]

Most guys who think they’re ugly are out of shape and have a bad wardrobe. I promise you my bro, hit that gym, eat right, find good clothes. Dont gotta break the bank to get the best out of life, my dude. Go forth and conquer yourself, she’ll show up eventually 🤝

[@Proximity94]

@@Werewolf.with.Internet.Access preach, you have no idea how checking these on the list improves your self-confidence

[@p382742937423y4]

I am somewhat goodlooking, and its a gamble.

[@Proximity94]

@@p382742937423y4 that’s true but a gamble with more favorable odds

[@graveyardshift6691]

@@Werewolf.with.Internet.Access Stop lying. If it didn't happen 15 years ago it's not going to happen now when they're all on the same bandwagon.

[@RF590KG84]

Blessed are they who expect nothing, for they shall never be disappointed.

[@fuzzypanda1684]

Ah, the ol' Dodgeball philosophy.

[@half_real]

"I expect nothing and I'm still let down."

[@Grail_Knight]

Beta!

[@Grail_Knight]

Get on semen retention now!

[@harryv6752]

Amen, hallelujah! 🤘

[@user-qi4lf1of1h]

It doesn't matter where or how to approach a woman)It matters who approaches.

[@R1pTheJacka]

Colombia was such an eye opening experience for me, and I'm sure lots of Americans who have gone there have experienced similar. It was so refreshing to get CLEAR and OBVIOUS signals of interest. Women who were interested in me would stare and smile so hard at me that it would be weird if I DIDN'T approach them. Coming back home felt so disheartening. RBFs and closed off body language everywhere I went. Unnatural conversations where I had to consciously decide whether I should just be myself and say what's on my mind or walk on eggshells since every word and action of mine is hyper fixated and analyzed. I just feel like a jester in America - expected to entertain someone who thinks they're above me and grades my performance. Kills me to know that I could be my more authentic self in a foreign land more than my own home

[@courtneyharris1006]

passport bros✔️

[@michael10613]

american dating is dead. Getting your money up and passports are the way to go

[@tonysamosa1717]

You did not just seriously compare going to Colombia as an American (presumably) to the regular dating scene. You’re talking about tricking. I’m gonna guess these interactions with women who were “interested” wasn’t in a small city like Jardin or Solento; it was in el poblado.

[@R1pTheJacka]

@@tonysamosa1717 you're not wrong that working girls will do that as well, but yes many normal civilian women will genuinely act the same way. The entire culture is way less rooted in individualism. They understand that going out means socializing, dancing, and actually making your night worthwhile instead of just sitting in a circle looking at your phone all night

[@davidorozconpollo]

They just want your money bro

[@redjacc7581]

That was such a great term "the blast radius of dressing in revealing clothes" they are sending out signals to ALL men not just the one they like.

[@perpetualprocrastinator]

exactly

[@zibbitybibbitybop]

Phenomenonal choice of words, Louise is so great as a speaker. I'ma remember that phrase and use it whenever this topic comes up later.

[@Rick_Cleland]

Maximilian!?? I thought you were inside the black hole!!

[@duxliberty7593]

BIG logical problem. A woman LOOKING GOOD to me is not the same as a woman SIGNALLING me. Wow fancy that..

[@opposingshore9322]

I love meeting a woman who has natural beauty, calm confidence, and dresses modestly with no desperation to reveal herself or be a thirst trap. That’s who I approach.

[@obud3777]

"A Man can be himself only as long as he is alone, and if he does not love solitude, he will not love freedom, for it is only when he is alone that he is really free." - Arthur Schoppenhauer -

[@gumdeo]

Wise words.

[@andrebaxter4023]

Weak.

[@obud3777]

@@andrebaxter4023 Anyone who calls Arthur Schopenhauer weak has absolute no clue about psychology.

[@nathanielknight1838]

the man lived alone with a poodle...

[@brentrosencrans3968]

@@nathanielknight1838 sounds good to me!

[@moviesynopsis001]

Juice aint worth the squeeze. If it all pays off and I "win" and we get married, then I am at the whim of her mood swings.

[@M0viLover]

You want a divorce? Why?? What did I do wrong? - Nothing ..; I just need a change. I'm bored.

[@caucasianafrican1435]

​@@M0viLoverAnd You still LO$E

[@tonyadams8812]

💯

[@M4dM4n96]

​@@caucasianafrican1435 and... AND it was also your fault

[@BUDDYCB4]

Also, the quickest way to stop having sex is to get married.

[@JacobStein1960]

Marriage. I've heard about that. It's the thing where you have a little ceremony, buy a house, have a couple of babies and then after a few years when the wife is having some kind of emotional breakdown you are kicked out of the house, cut off from your children but most of your paycheck still goes to your ex. That's an amazing deal. Men are rushing like mad to take advantage of that arrangement. Not.

[@tricatame7427]

You are the reason she is having an emotional breakdown and wants to kick u out. No woman ever kicked out a man who acted like a real man. No man complained a woman taking his stuff if he was a true alpa giver generous and fatherly soul. Only the weak men who only have crumbs to offer both materialistically and emotionally, whine about having to be the giver. You sow what u reap w women. Alwsys. You plant shit in her grounds, she ll give you fruits of mysery.

[@Yoshi-Mooch]

I’m ugly and have been married 11 years today. I don’t have children. Marriage is what you make it!

[@andrewpizzino2514]

@@tricatame7427 wow how did you get so naïve?

[@tricatame7427]

@@andrewpizzino2514 not having witnesses it in real life, i went on internet to see recorded evidence of men protecting women, serving their purpose in the world. So few videos...most of which were men protecting women from other men. When we live in a world where we feel safer because thereis a man there and not less safe because a man is there, only then men will be worth marrying and keeping around.

[@maxwellanderson007]

@@tricatame7427it's always men's fault. LOL. Keep pushing it, you will see marriage rates improving in the other direction.

[@WillieFungo]

Society needs to leave young men alone, tbh. I remember around a decade ago when guys were doing the pickup artist thing and everyone was shaming young men for being harassers. Now everyone is shaming young men for not approaching. Leave men alone, damn. It's just non-stop attacks.

[@baskey3723]

Ofc thats all on the internet

[@gf6x3gkmfw38]

The pick-up thing was incredibly creepy and manipulative. People into that shit should be shamed.

[@WillieFungo]

@@gf6x3gkmfw38 Cool. Then people shouldn't start shamming men into bringing it back. Approaching culture is dead, and society should move on.

[@coldones9505]

@@gf6x3gkmfw38 This word 'creepy' has runs its course. Its 2024, time to expand your vocabulary.

[@JewTube001]

@@gf6x3gkmfw38 i think it's was mostly the same handful of PUA guys that were creepy and everyone would focus on them. the one I followed was a very tame and boring guy (Eben / David DeAngelo)

[@billwedeking797]

I'm an old guy, but my Military Father taught me to NEVER make first move on a woman. "If she wants you, she'll let you know."

[@markreyes5818]

How did that work out for you? Do you have someone you love? Wife?

[@JolPil]

And HOW will she let you know? What are the signs no man could ever miss? And how many hotties are you dating now? And how are YOU making them magnetically pulled to you without making any effort what so ever?

[@Ryan-cb1ei]

@@JolPil I think just keep interacting with them, to feel them out, and they’ll reveal it eventually if they like you. He didn’t say don’t talk to women or whatever lol, he just said don’t make the first move. A lot of guys need to just have conversations and do things with women without seeing them as a prospect first. In fact I think they have a greater likelihood of falling for you this way instead of only ever interacting with them by asking them out at first.

[@RobertMorgan]

My dad was the same, and his wife, my mother, asked him out 3 times before he said yes the 4th time. Married 59 years, 3 kids, 2 grandkids, 2 great grands .

[@Ufu4847]

I always ask myself: What has the person done to deserve the approach? Remember, nothing is free.

[@beersmoker4444]

100% Fact.

[@Kaizan27]

There was a time where women were mysterious and complicated creatures, now thanks to social media we can see how predictable and simple they really are

[@SillySpanish]

That actually made me think, I’m a woman. I think you may have a point

[@SillySpanish]

Not all of us though, I’m not on social media 😊 there’s hope

[@marienmorand]

​@@SillySpanish being on social media doesnt turn you into a cheap and dull woman. I think its a good way to find the right man through the same values , political views and way of life

[@SillySpanish]

@@marienmorand no not what I’m saying. The transparency is interesting new factor and thought. Haven’t thought about that. Sadly know many women with a distorted man/dating pov. Obsessive and prime target. Target achieved never leave the house again. He’s right it used to be better hidden but they’ve always been there. I think social media not only exposed that but also is obviously not healthy on so many levels for personal relationships and ego

[@SillySpanish]

@@marienmorand and to give you peace I had/have a distorted dating pov as well. Just different. Not desperate.

[@DefaultFlame]

The best advice I could give to teenage girls is to dress and behave the way you want to be perceived, but remember that you will be perceived that way by EVERYONE who sees you not just the person you want to see you.

[@Francois424]

I would tell them to wear dresses or long skirts. There's absolutely no need to wear very tight clothes that reveals anything and everything the have to offer. Make the guys you're interested in EARN that right to see these parts of you. And you don't send "the wrong signal"... But hey I'm a guy wth do I known right?

[@DefaultFlame]

@@Francois424 That was kinda my point. If you want to be seen a certain way by one person, then dress and behave that way only for that one person, not for the entire world to see.

[@Volkbrecht]

Plus, a good figure will look good in any clothes. See it at work all the time. No need to run around half-naked.

[@Francois424]

@@VolkbrechtExactly ! And you'll attract the kind of dudes that appreciate it too ! 🙂

[@sofiabravo1994]

@@Volkbrechtall these suggestions are wholesome, I’m not a teenage girl I’m close to 30 but this exactly what her dad and I are instilling our daughters, wish I would have known better growing up. I’m setting the example now! I dress vintage because it’s not too revealing but still feminine! I want all girls to see you can look beautiful without compromising and self exploitation.

[@WarriorPoet01]

I’m late to this conversation, but I had this lady friend (I was in her friend zone) who, at the time, was using dating apps. She described the men who liked her dating profile as looking like ray-pists, or pay-do-files (making sure my comment doesn’t upset the algorithm). Anyway, when she said that, I was shocked, saddened (for those who liked her enough to reach out) and disgusted. It instantly cured of any feelings I’d ever had towards her.

[@midatlantic09]

Why aren't they approaching? Perhaps because the juice is no longer worth the squeeze. Men have likely analyzed the cost of pursuing women and the potential benefit of doing so, and have concluded that the likely return on investment isn't high enough. Generally, when the potential return on something is low, most people simply don't bother.

[@GjVj]

Precisely this. And, we keep telling them, but they just don't - won't - listen. LOL, you don't even need to be married, these days, to know exactly what it must feel like...

[@ZeeCaptainRon]

read The Book of Numbers, the analysis has been done and the answers are bleak.

[@zrebbesh]

I used to give casual compliments, like "I like your outfit," or "you have awesome hair" or whatever. Didn't mean much besides me thinking they had a nice outfit, or great hair, or whatever, and I'd usually just keep walking or shopping or whatever I was doing instead of trying to start a conversation or anything. But I still kept running into women who were creeped out, or who felt like they immediately had to tell me they were already dating someone (heck, so was I...) or whatever. I don't give casual compliments any more.

[@JolPil]

They were only crreped out because they did NOT see you as ALPHA top G etc.

[@RobertMorgan]

If they don't know it about themselves, no one can tell them, so compliments don't work. Then you learn that compliments are for the complimenter, not the recipient, it makes sense not to.

[@nonyobisniss7928]

@@RobertMorgan But if they do 'know' it about themselves, then it can feel good to get the positive reinforcement. Most people have insecurities and receiving positive comments can improve their self confidence. It's not even about the specific compliment, it's about the fact that somebody, a stranger, went out of their way to say something nice to you. The complimenter may have wanted to test the waters to make a connection with another human being, and there's nothing wrong with that. It's actually vital to human happiness that people make such attempts.

[@aligenc659]

I do still approach them and get rejected constantly. If you are not good looking, it is over - you have no chance..

[@jimdavis8391]

It's only a rejection if you were actually interested. You need to treat them as a mildly diverting distraction. Most women are dull after a short conversation.

[@SillySpanish]

You both need therapy

[@jimdavis8391]

@@SillySpanish From some loopy leftist? Don't think so 😉

[@SillySpanish]

@@jimdavis8391 just so sad don’t you think? Sounds like giving up! It’s not about the looks! Not for me. Every man has something charming and interesting. If he’s in his power. Worth thinking about

[@SillySpanish]

@@jimdavis8391 of course some basic hygiene and body care helps

[@humanityunlockedpodcast]

My husband approached me in a bar 21 years ago. We were 25. We married 3 years later. Crazy to think that this is not really a thing anymore. Internet dating sites were very new when we met. With that timing, I feel we got lucky to meet each other when I did!🍀

[@andrewevans7992]

Good for you..

[@Quantum-ne7bc]

This topic has become like dissecting rocket science... No wonder why people aren't approaching each other. It's become so complicated that it's becoming more and more unappealing. It feels like an inorganic nightmare. At this point I'd rather stay single, work on myself and keep my health & sanity. Not to mention I literally know zero married couples that are happy and healthy. They all give me the impression that a huge part of them regrets getting married, having kids and that they envy the single life. I'm not opposed to being in a healthy relationship but there sure as hell doesn't seem to be a whole lot of incentive at this point in time.

[@marienmorand]

They are not happy cause they are not in love. They ve been pushed by society to follow the rule and get married with the first partner they 've met.

[@opposingshore9322]

I’m middle-aged and single (divorced) and nearly all of my married friends envy me. I’m having a great time meeting women, dating, pursuing my interests, holding off until I meet someone who clicks. If that doesn’t happen I’ll be fine, I feel very at peace inside and love my life. It’s a shame there is so much resentment, loneliness, and anger out there.

[@Marcustheseer]

ya keep things simple,if a guy approaches you give him a chance if you wanna know what youre dealing with then ask them what kind of person they are,if youre interested go on a date and find out more if youre not then just say you seem like a nice fella but am just not the girl for you be nice,you can keep talking but let a guy know where he stands. hek if you know a girl that might be for him then hook him up.

[@Thinker1985]

I am married with one child (7 years old). While I don't regret my trajectory in life, I readily admit that I do envy the single life. Like everything, married life with children has its ups and downs; the problem is that it is very difficult for a guy to achieve any sort of balance as your needs always come dead last, far behind those of your child and wife. Prepare to have very little agency except in how you do things (because a lot of 'what' you do will be chosen for you). Want to go out? If your wife allows it and after you put your kid to bed. Want to sleep in and lazily wake up and go straight to your computer to watch TV or play video games? That almost never happens. I love my family, don't get me wrong, but man, if you need some alone time, prepare to sleep a lot less because that's the only way you can have time for yourself.

[@ForeverRetro31]

Kramer was right. They’re man made prisons. Kramer, thou art wise.

[@rrmackay]

Imagine that, relationships are based on your family and friends introducing you to a good partner. The exact opposite of what we do in America today, meeting total strangers with no references, no background, nobody who knows their history or behavior..

[@DanielH874]

I would be much more comfortable with that arrangement. At least then someone you know and trust can vouch for the person you will be seeing. Going in blind with so much on the line absolutely terrifying.

[@raze956]

family and friends introducing you is only great if you are passive. for the more active ones of us, this sounds terrible. i want to have the control about with whom im interacting with, i chose who i approach and who i will not. no need for others to do the work that is my responsibility. but if you are too fearful and never approach at all then yeah, i get why you might want this. its still a terrible mindset and should be overcome. basing your wishes off of fear will not make you grow. at all.

[@raze956]

@@randomisedrandomness how often did you try?

[@DanielH874]

Being fearful is valid when so much is on the line. If family and friends could speak highly of someone's character that would increase the odds of that statement being true. My judgement + family/friends judgement. The idea is to reduce the chances of getting financially destroyed.

[@raze956]

@@DanielH874 how about you dont marry then? if the fear is that high, and you can be financially destroyed that much? also, how are you supposed to enjoy the process of getting to know each other if you are that fearful?

[@snoglydox]

. *A problem is past history; most women are used to men responding positively, while most men are use to women responding negatively.*

[@Chatelaine0]

Pretty women get rejected by guys alllllll the time! Men who have Mommy issues and Narcissists are all over the map and target high achieving or great looking women all the time to break them down and humiliate her all the time. I used to have this happen to me all the time and when I gained 50 lbs after an injury, it magically stopped despite being a different size and shape! A few years later, I'm working on going back into fitness and shape and I see it happening again. It's a twisted world indeed.

[@MacEwanMouse]

@@Chatelaine0 This comment is immensely incoherent.

[@fleetinghopes6448]

​@@Chatelaine0 "X get rejected by guys alllllll the time!" -> this is literally the definition of "not pretty". "Men who have Mommy issues and Narcissists are all over the map" -> perhaps *_your_* map. Women are *_selecting_* the same "high value" men (it's called hypergamy) and they thus *give licence to* those men to treat the women with disrespect _because the women _*_keep_*_ queuing up for these very same men _*_no matter what they do_* !!! Meanwhile ignoring all of the decent nice men ("oh, 'nice' is so boring" - you get what you ask for ladies). "and I see it happening again" -> only if _you_ keep *choosing* the same guys! You have the power of selection! Use it *wisely* !!! But good luck getting back into fitness and shape. Its good to be fit and healthy.

[@fleetinghopes6448]

"A problem is past history" -> this is actually evolution. This applies to basically all males and all females of any species on the planet. Females have a high personal investment in reproduction (laying eggs, giving birth etc) and so are very selective in their male mate. Males have a very low investment in reproduction (e.g. compare sperm count to egg count or ovulations) and so can afford to "spread their seed about widely". Females are always the "gate-keepers" of their reproductive investment. Traditional, population-wide (and early) monogamous marriage made all of these difficulties easier and limited how long they had to be put up with. Modern women are confused by inappropriate ideologies and by social media/dating apps that give them a false perception of "unlimited Chads forever" and by a medical system that pretends that there is no age limit to childbirth. Both of these things start colliding when the women hit their thirties. Human culture, traditions, societal norms of the past, religion, all worked to accommodate the animal natures of men and women. But we threw all of that stuff out based on some new ideology so here we are.

[@halrox247]

I dislike the use of “scared” here. I prefer unwilling, unenthusiastic, averse or reluctant. While cold approach is definitely daunting that’s not what stopping men now compared to 10-20 years ago. The reason is simple, it’s just not worth it.

[@RobertMorgan]

You do all this work, and at the end all you end up with is a woman, lol.

[@TheSpicyLeg]

When I got married at age 21, I had to go with my wife to marriage counseling with our Father. During it, I had asked what we do if we fall out of love with each other. Father said, “No, son, you’re not getting married because you love one another, but because you’re creating a space for your children to thrive.” It always stuck with me. I really do love my wife, but it long since stopped being that lustful kind of love. It’s a deep appreciation for her, what she is as a woman and a human being, as a mother and wife.

[@42hamneggs]

Well said twice. Marriage IS about the kids. Love is not lust.

[@tizodd6]

@TheSpicyLeg: That's the thing though...a woman will throw everything away, to get that lustful attraction. Familiar love is boring for them. My ex-wife told me after seven years together that she loved me, but wasn't in love with me anymore. I later found out she was cheating with a co-worker. Most women don't realize that all long-term relationships turn into familiar love after a while.

[@42hamneggs]

@@tizodd6 Sorry for your pain. Some women. Some men also. Hope you're recovering from the betrayal.

[@piotr004]

@@42hamneggs Did he stutter? MOST women, especially when women are rewarded for cheating and divorcing.

[@PS-lv1mr]

That sounds depressing tbh

[@manfrombritain6816]

this is like 5% of the issue. the main reason I don't approach women is cos (a) dating apps have made me feel so unattractive, and (b) women are always in large groups, usually where the gender ratio is heavily skewed towards male. it's very difficult to go chat to a girl when she's most likely with her boyfriend already AND 5 orbiters we're often told to meet people through hobbies. well. i asked a girl from my martial arts gym out for a drink and she said yes but then got extremely flaky. i vented my frustration on reddit - the frustration of not being treated like a human being. I don't mind if she wasn't into it, but i do mind her not just being honest and instead hoping I'd get the message from her being rude. well, reddit being reddit, i got hundreds of responses saying i should never hit on a girl in a gym, i probably made her feel unsafe (!?) harassed her, I'm a creep etc The funny thing is I acted like it was no big deal and we have been friendly ever since and have fun banter. all she had to do was just be honest and respect me as a person but girls almost always try to fob you off like some kind of pest

[@jonevans870]

Reddit is the worst. Their advice will always boil down to ‘do nothing’. I actually think as a man you have to risk ruffling some feathers occasionally. And give yourself permission to be ‘creepy’. The only way to never be ‘creepy’ is to never talk to any women, and that won’t end well for you.

[@swedishpagan2150]

​@@jonevans870 Spot on, but do try to not shit where you eat.

[@fluoroantimonictippedcruis1537]

@@swedishpagan2150 And by that you mean at work?

[@swedishpagan2150]

@@fluoroantimonictippedcruis1537 Pretty much yes but could include other places aswell where appearing creepy Will put a huge cost on your lifestyle

[@samcurtisrobinson]

The thing with this mate is that many people won’t tell you the truth because they don’t want to hurt your feelings. It’s just the way it is, all you need to do is look for enthusiasm. If she’s in to you she’ll make definite plans with you and it’ll feel effortless. If not, move on to someone who’s worth your time. Attraction is not a choice

[@robertjohnson7038]

Social media ruined everything.

[@anneyoung2310]

Pretty much! Narcissists run rampant on dating sites, and they can screw anyone's chance to find love because of their own misery and toxicity. Some will resort to cutting off access to potential candidates, i.e. isolating the desired target (aka coercive control tactics, which are illegal and punishable) because of rejection or lack of mutual interest. It's horrifying and can go on for years until the perpetrator/stalker is exposed and imprisoned.

[@KGS922]

How do you know what it was like before social media?

[@Diego01201]

"Acknowledging the existence of tradeoffs is a fundamentally conservative trait. There are no solutions, only tradeoffs." This is such a great line to end such a profound conversation.

[@davida730]

I take my dog to the park and commonly get approached by women. Even when they approach first and I'm interested its just not worth the risk of rejection/me too. I know ladies like for the man to take charge but that is simply riskier than ever in the current environment.

[@averagejoe7860]

bro how are fumbling the bag rn. if you put on a smile and have some manners, girls aren't gonna get offended

[@VaronPlateando]

yeah, and j.o.m.o. can, and needs to, be appreciated, sincerily. the likelyhood of any hetero 1-vs-1 encounter to lead to else than pain-in-arse is about 1.5%. Simple probability maths, btw. Abundance thinking: almost all xx.s are to be avoided.

[@dbmdrums1105]

​@@averagejoe7860exactly what is the smile?

[@davida730]

@@averagejoe7860 I live in a city with an extremely liberal university. I was once honked at while going for a run and some girl made the comment "That's what its like to be a woman." I do just fine on the apps but simply would rather not deal with the potential fall out of meeting in public. Age is also a big concern. With how far make up has come good luck telling if that girl is 17 or 25.

[@tbd407]

@@mickethegoblin7167he's 100% correct

[@adoringfan1924]

21 year old young man here. I’ve started approaching women in person and now I only do that now. I don’t do the apps or anything I just got up and introduce myself. It’s been working a lot better for me.

[@FenrirFinance]

really? how many do you approach like per week or per month? How many numbers/igs have you gotten and/or dates? really curious tbh because it's been feeling hopeless

[@anneyoung2310]

Good call.

[@ADobbin1]

You must be really good looking.

[@RobertMorgan]

That's awesome, if you have anything around worth approaching. That's my answer, I don't see anything worth being attracted to. Women, get more attractive!

[@user-lt1jd1ye3v]

@@RobertMorgan lemme guess, incel?

[@daveg4417]

When I was in my 20's back in the 1980's, before the online and cellphone revolution, everyone that I knew who was my age met their romantic partners through groups that hung out together. From 2012 to 2017 while in my 50's, I tried online dating, since most people stay home now and meet online, and with more than 100 cold approaches and 25+ dates, the women all told me they wouldn't have a relationship with me for a wide variation of reasons that they actually said, but that all boiled down to because I'm not 6 foot+ tall, I don't make $100k+, my car isn't expensive enough or my house isn't fancy enough (read further in the comments for some exact examples of what the women said to me). Hypergamy really hit in over the past couple of decades. I even tried Tinder and got no matches. I'm not exaggerating. I think I have a lot to offer, but 50+ aged women don't think so. So I stopped approaching women in 2017, and I haven't dated anyone since then, I fully expect to be alone until my death in 30+ years. I totally believe the stats on men not approaching.

[@christopherhazell420]

That's been my experience to an extent, seeking to meet women online. In person, well, many times, one would think I was on a Candid Camera skit. Some situations have been ludicrous, while others had no interest in even carrying on a conversation with me. A few were married, just not wearing their ring while exercising. My last relationship was in 2018 & lasted approximately 4 months with single mom, who is one year older than i. Her child is grown & serving the military. But that was certainly not the problem for us. Her lack of functioning in a relationship sabotaged us.

[@manifest2203]

Actually marriage and relationships happen to men across all socio economic levels. But the thing is, dating older men has no benefit for any woman. Younger women prefer virile younger men. Older women prefer to be single over being in a relationship because most men are dependents who will nag endlessly for things like his food, his laundry, s3x, his medical follow ups and so much more. Older women want less work, but most men don’t do anything but bring more work. If a woman wants to avoid stress, she has to be single.

[@daveg4417]

I'm 5'8", I make $70k a year and increasing every year, I have no debt and $100k in Savings and even more in my RSP's, I own my home and car, my net worth is $1 Mill+. I work out daily, I sauna a few times a week, I'm not obese, I own my own small software company, I'm a good cook and I keep my place clean. Yet to women, I don't hit the "magical" 6+ foot tall and $100k a year that they demand for minimum entry just to be in their presence, so that disqualifies me even if I were a good guy. They won't even give five minutes to get to know you. So I have zero empathy for any of them. And I just stopped looking all together. Sure, I've had obese older 65 year old women who showed a lot of interest, but if I can't get equal to what I bring to the table, then I just pass. Hypergamy. Women want more and more every year.

[@chriscampbell9191]

Most of the women I met online already had partners, which is actually backed up statistically -- 30% of people using dating sites have a partner already (not so sure about the stats on hookup apps). They were looking for something on the side, or just looking to get their egos inflated. One or the other. Some were bots.

[@daveg4417]

@@chriscampbell9191 - I think that a lot of the women that I dated were just using me for a Foodie Call. They were all pleasant up front, but then dismissive as soon as the cheque was paid.

[@daboys1215]

They aren't scared. The just are not interested anymore.

[@theucheao]

Don’t want my time to be wasted anymore… Too much to ask apparently…

[@AldershotDave]

It's so hard for guys nowadays. You can't tell a woman she looks nice, you can't tell a woman that she's beautiful, she cant ask a woman out at work, you cant go to talk to a woman in a pub/club. If you do any of the aforementioned things, you get accused of being a pervert, a weirdo, hassling a woman, sexualising a woman, scaring a woman, endangering a woman!! JEESH!!

[@TonyZoster]

I don'T live in the US. I am an older man and in a shop one day out of the blue I complimented a lady on her hairdo which I said to her looked lovely. She smiled and thanked me for my compliment. Well I am a widower and the lady's hairdo reminded my of my wife who always took good care of her hair which was something I enjoyed when I looked at her. I am not sure whether a young woman would react like this mature lady did. Perhaps the younger women of today never learned there are also king men in the world who still know the Art of complimenting. There is more to life than sex which is a rather primitive form of enjoyment.

[@TonyZoster]

Correction: Kind men not king men.

[@grumpy_wolfman.]

Hello is now considered a pick-up line; that you're "trying to make a connection" or "hitting" on them.

[@sookibeulah9331]

It’s all about how a compliment is given. If it’s too personal it can be really unnerving. I will instinctively recoil and be on my guard if I get from a very personal compliment from anyone I don’t know well. Something less directly personal like “great outfit” “that’s a lovely colour on you” “what beautiful shoes/ dress/ coat” “cool car” that’s more about the choices a woman has made rather than her body is a safer place to start and I guarantee you’ll have a more receptive response.

[@staceykersting705]

There's a huge difference between telling a woman she looks nice, or her dress is your fave color and making lewd remarks. If young women aren't getting that, I'm sorry, guys!

[@R1pTheJacka]

The worst is when you approach a cute girl and her overweight friend jumps in to tell you "SHE'S NOT INTERESTED"..it's always the fridge protecting the snacks

[@xannecorinnex]

“It’s always the fridge protecting the snacks” that analogy has me dead 🤣💀😂

[@andyukmonkey]

I love that line, heh

[@ChristiansPlaymo-Ecke]

And just by the way you wrote this everybody can tell she is not interested for a very, VERY good reason.

[@Werewolf.with.Internet.Access]

BRO STOP 😂😂😂 too good

[@sourceeee]

This line deserves an award

[@markbills4122]

I've been with enough women to know that I don't want to be around them anymore. Frankly, my life has never been better.

[@seb_travel]

Left my city to renovate a rural cottage, raise some food animals and quite literally go monk mode to get centered after a rough relationship. Nearly two years have passed and I just did my first big social event back in the city for Christmas. Plenty of catch up and back and forth with the lads, - that - was great. Good to see the boys. Solid feedback on how well I look - shared some of the beef I've raised. Cheers Lads! But the women (30-35 bracket) - they were - well, I'm content back on the property and not dealing with city women ever again. A week on and I'm still astounded with the level of narcissism, psychological plays, entitlement and loutish boss-bitch I had become enured too in previous years. Cold shower moment if ever. I really drank the kool-aid on modern women this past decade. Never again. In other news, lads bbq on the property end of Jan. Noice.

[@markbills4122]

@@seb_travel BBQ, bourbon and a bon fire.... I'm in! Good luck to you my friend

[@seb_travel]

@@markbills4122 Agreed. And you too, best for 2024.

[@tonyadams8812]

💯Exactly! Apart from an occasional 'cuddle' you don't actually *need a woman.

[@GjVj]

@@seb_travel Incoming call for you - it's the Based Department. No joke - that's the way to live. Godspeed!

[@jf8461]

I remember when a guy could and was expected to make the first move. It was chivalrous and romantic. At some point all men became viewed as potential rapists or something, and men realized that very quick, and that aspect of chivalry went out the window!

[@zibbitybibbitybop]

The extreme atomization of people in modern society has made the sort of semi-arranged marriage that Louise describes increasingly difficult to pull off. I stopped being religious in my mid-20s, and that was my last remaining tie to a community group. Now I'm 40 and still single, and it is really tough sailing to do all the searching on your own, let me tell you.

[@youtubebannedmymainchannel]

I sincerely hope that you're bullshiting about your age

[@petebarber6778]

being religious ...and having a personal loving relationship with Jesus......are "worlds apart" Jesus is your best friend ....just with ultimate power. check him out.

[@jimdavis8391]

​@@youtubebannedmymainchannel Why? He's not said anything controversial or unusual, I occupy a similar position.

[@Billy-bc8pk]

@@youtubebannedmymainchannelMajority of us between 40 - 50 are single. What are you on about, mate?

[@brushstroke3733]

I'm 46 and haven't had a date in over 8 years. Still hoping the rain will come again soon.

[@batman5224]

My main problem is that I don’t have a lot of opportunities to interact with women. If you work from home, don’t online date, don’t go to church, and live in a semi-rural area, where are you supposed to meet people? Yes, I could hypothetically strike up a random conversation with a woman at Walmart. However, most men worry about being perceived as creepy, and rightfully so. It’s also difficult for me to pull conversation out of thin air when I don’t know anything about the person I’m speaking to. It’s also a fact that most women don’t want to be bothered while shopping, and even if we do by some miracle have a decent exchange, it’s highly doubtful she’ll trust me enough to give me her number. There’s also a high probability that she will already be married or in a relationship.

[@michaellombardi7766]

Exactly dude. I been saying the same thing forever.

[@christopherhazell420]

I have been attending church fellowship for decades, only met two ladies who were available to date. The other women who in attendance, that i spoke to were already dating, just divorced, only visiting or just not compatible, personality wise. Even ladies who say they are "christian" end up not actually being ones...

[@christopherhazell420]

I first attempted online dating in 2008, after seeking to date the old fashion way... This supposedly narrowed down who is single & interested in dating. Problem there, women ended up being DM overwhelming more than men, 10 to 1. Now I was competing against dozens of men versus cold turkey walking up to & talking to a lady in person. i did Interact with a few ladies via online, but did not get past the computer screen for obvious reasons. One being, attitude!

[@batman5224]

@@christopherhazell420 I spent two years messaging around two or three women a day. Nothing ever came of it. I got close to meeting some in person, but they ghosted me. I’ll never forget the time I spent an entire night messaging this woman only for her to tell me that she was just killing time.

[@restingsmirkface]

100%

[@ricksazama]

Imagine going back In time and telling your grandpa that one day every women will have a little black box in their pocket and they talk to any guy they want whenever they want in the whole entire world. I stopped dating when I realized the girls I were dating were never single to begin with

[@PeeGee85]

Underrated comment.

[@j-ymoney5112]

Yeah and think of all the girlfriends those guys looking to hook up with you are hiding. Some of them have a 2nd family!! Some of them have pregnant wives at home! Yikes!

[@maloxi1472]

@@j-ymoney5112 He's not talking about lying or hiding anything though. What he's pointing out is happening in plain sight and it is so deeply rooted in modern culture that your brain couldn't even process what he was talking about fast enough to formulate a relevant reply

[@j-ymoney5112]

@@maloxi1472 and u missed my point entirely lmao when some individual generalizes an entire gender, of course they’ll have trust issues. Stay single. Not every man cheats, not every woman has a roster on her phone 💀 U keep reading through the comment section tho & telling people what they don’t know 💀💀💀

[@louisjwiese5515]

We worked with a few couples at one time. It was interesting to find that the women complained that the men showed them too much sexual interest. Professionals then worked on getting the men to focus on other things (career, health, etc). After this, the women were unhappy with not getting enough sexual interest. Most of the men however, were so happy with their "new" life and not being so overly focused on how females viewed them, that they continued on this path permanently. However, the women were less likely to do the same over the long term (i.e. focus more on self instead of the attention from males). Was a very interesting difference and interpersonal dynamic to observe.

[@emem2863]

For most people born before 1990, having a random guy approach you in public was the norm. Sometimes, a friend would do it on his behalf. Now, you have people who think this behavior is strange and possibly dangerous. It's more normal to meet them online if you don't meet them through friends, school, or work.

[@triggerskull]

You can check out all their candid pics, know every unnecessary info on their private lives online yet approach warmly and chat them up and it’s scary. Weird, weird times..

[@brianthesnail3815]

Yes that was very common and actually a very nice way to begin dating someone in the 1980s. It's how my wife did it. After first of all ignoring me every day for two years of course. 😉 I still really advise men to not do the cold approach in a bar thing. It is so false and cluncky and I can see why women think its unwelcome.

[@emem2863]

@brianthesnail3815 Personally, I never minded strangers approaching me in public. After all, at one point, everyone not related to us was a stranger. However, people you see often - co-workers, classmates, friends of friends, etc, - are easier to speak with because the interactions are more natural, and you already have something in common.

[@BigBubbaTakeYoAzz]

@@CharlesNauck Well, the drinks at bars, even beer, seem stronger to me than drinks outside of them. I drink faster at bars therefore I get more hammered. I can usually recoup some of my losses by charging strangers to use my breathalyzer. Which is interesting. I can approach women to get money out of them but not for a date.

[@RiruKrypto_]

You're lucky if you got a friend that does this because they be gatekeeping them from you.

[@frankjrock]

It’s crazy to think this is an issue that many countries are facing. I used to think it was only in my area. I’m glad the dynamics are being discussed.

[@yaazarai]

Even after spending 2-3 years in the gym, I am pretty skilled in calisthenics, muscular and at minimum average looking... And even then approaching women is just a chore. Knowing the difference between "I'm smiling at you to be nice so I can escape," vs "I'm smiling at you because there's something here," is a fine line that's just a pain in the ass to navigate.

[@tonyadams8812]

Personally , I go to the gym to get stronger and improve my health. It never ever enters my mind to approach women in the gym. But I guess that's me being a middle aged man who has got to the stage of life where I genuinely feel very content with being single which means having the freedom to do whatever I want to do.

[@Joe-fj6dj]

I think We all had “im smiling at you be nice so I can escape” type lmao lol

[@samcurtisrobinson]

The trick is to just keep it effortless, have a non threatening feel about you. Women can sense that and if they sense you’re indifferent about them and just being friendly, 99% of the time they’ll be polite back to you

[@ginavanulzen6681]

Sorry your social skills suck man…. But you have to learn how to communicate .

[@youdonthavetocomment]

I tried with a girl at the gym once - gave her my number to make her more comfortable I guess.. never heard from her - I told my friend and he instantly laughed and thought what I did.. they get scared and won't call, but we would have likely got somewhere if I took her number instead lol.

[@nobodyatall7039]

This woman basically summarizes what I've thought for over 20 years since highschool. "Approaching" women is a completely unnatural way of meeting romantic partners and our generation has been greatly harmed by being taught that this is normal.

[@letsgobrandon416]

Society has to eliminate the unacceptable risks to men. It's not just me too, it's also divorce and family court. You can spend your life building something with your wife and she can take all of it, keep mooching off of you for child support and alamony, and run off with another guy to boot. Happens all the time. Young men have watched it happen to their fathers. End no fault divorce.

[@chriscampbell9191]

Won't ever happen, but yeah, that is definitely a problem. Men aren't stupid. Statistics indicate that most modern marriages fail, and in most of those failures the guy gets the bad end of the stick. And we're supposed to jump in headlong? Boomers, GenJonesers, GenXers, older Millennials did perhaps. These younger guys are faster learners.

[@PossibleBat]

It’s not mooching if you had a child with this person. It’s literally your responsibility to provide alimony. Keep the child and let her pay alimony.

[@ronbaxley8105]

Totally agree

[@letsgobrandon416]

@@PossibleBat end no fault divorce, problem solved.

[@marienmorand]

Why do you get married then?

[@dareedle]

Until women realize that the social contract of marriage for life has been broken by feminism, there is no incentive for men to approach women. Dating Apps provide plenty of available sex partners, not ideal long term relationship partners. Like many other things, women want their cake and eat it, great career and be supermom, make equal pay but expect a great choice of attractive men their age who make twice their income and pays for everything.

[@SillySpanish]

Wow dude you need to talk to some women out there

[@danielevilone]

​@@SillySpanish You too...

[@greyman6353]

@@SillySpanish take a look at all the dating apps and do a survey of the requirements from women from the first 100 hits you see. Go ahead. And take off those rose-tinted glasses.

[@BossMax511]

I went on a date recently and as soon as I mentioned my financial goal in a conversation, she asked if I could aim for double that. Lmao! she didn't say it like that, but when I type that, it sounds ridiculous.

[@joea363]

It is not a matter of low Emotional Intelligence or being oblivious to signs of receptivity. It is a matter of not trusting the sign being given.

[@drewashington5001]

Glad someone else caught her saying this her perception and stigma on men’s eq sounds so dehumanizing

[@MohamedAhmed-ms9eu]

Women often give signals of interest when they're not interested just to get attention from men to boost their own ego. I know women who used to go clubbing, take wedding ring off, flirt with men ONLY to reject men at the end and tell them they're married.

[@BlueFish-kq9fh]

@@drewashington5001 Yes, whether she meant it or not, she came across as very condescending and patronizing towards men when she implied (pretty strongly) that men who don't respond favorably to women's subtle hints are too stupid to read the signals. The possibility that the men are reading the signals alright but are too smart to respond the way the women want seems to have never crossed her mind.

[@arraelle7453]

I'm a woman who want to understand more about men, because I don't like what I see sometimes, how some women treat men, and I don't want to be like them even by mistake. When you say it's a matter of not trusting the signs, is it more like, fearing that you are misinterpreting them (thinking she might be interrested when she isn't), or do you not trust her intentions (knowing that she is indeed flirting but can turn on you latter on, or even try to seduce you to obtain something) ? What would be a way for you, as a man, to feel like you can indeed approach someone or trust their hints? Maybe even not giving any hints at all but being direct ?

[@joea363]

@@arraelle7453 Thank you for your kind and thoughtful words as well as your contribution to the discussion. Part of the hesitance in responding is that the response can be taken as an act of sexual harassment leaving the man open to a devastating accusation that is almost impossible to defend against even if you had no intention of harassing the women. The questions becomes, is this genuine interest or is just a trap?

[@xxFairestxx]

Last cold walk I did was 13 years ago. And she’s my wife now and the mother of my 6 kids. Stays home with the kids, homeschools em…absolute champ. Best friends literally from the first week. Traditional women 👍🏻 ☦️

[@earthflute2248]

Women were told they could have it all. They were lied to by their own sex. Men never had it all. Now women have jobs careers etc.. they are unhappy but are shamed by their own sex when they want a more traditional relationship. Men are not the problem. Women are, as they hold ALL the cards in relationships. Stop blaming men for your problems. Work WITH them rather than see them as enemies competitors. We are partners.

[@th3dudeabides1]

Men are NOT scared. We aren't stupid and see no benefit in engaging anymore. There's a huge difference

[@thomaskalbfus2005]

You could be thrown out of the bar for giving a girl unwanted attention. You could be arrested for giving that girl unwanted attention and for not being able to read that girl's mind. Some girls will play hard to get to see how interested the guy is and other girls are not interested, and it's hard to tell one from another. So, men risk getting a criminal record if they approach the wrong girl, that is the risk.

[@IDuBStepSZ]

I think men can read social cues of woman being attracted to them, but most of the subtle social cues that women give, have multiple meanings. So most men will assume that instead of her wanting to go out with you, etc. that she's just being friendly. Women also give signals that are confusing quite often, this is something that I've had experience with.

[@RobertMorgan]

My advice to women is be simple and direct, put yourself next to him, say hi, tell him he's cute, touch his arm, and tell him to ask you out sometime. Done. You got him. Most men would be flattered and into that, because it's straightforward and genuine. Just make sure your attraction to him is genuine and straightforward.

[@bernibeckmann9753]

The internet has exposed women for how they actually think and behave. The cat, no pun intended, is out of the bag. Back in my day there was still some mystery about women. If I were young today I'm not sure how I would navigate the gender situation but playing it safe seems like a very good option. I would not approach unless green lights were flashing like crazy and then I would have other concerns. While not always ideal, going it alone is better for me, the woman, the potential offspring and the planet.

[@Ghostrider-ul7xn]

They weren't always like this. Most people's behaviors/preferences are socially conditioned by their environment or surroundings. I know for a fact because I used to chat with women online way before any social media or dating apps became mainstream. They were less judgy, discriminatory, uptight, picky when it came to meeting new people. Things changed a lot after dating apps became popular..

[@bernibeckmann9753]

@@Ghostrider-ul7xn No, there's a certain way women think. Just like there's a certain way men think. Being a man, men weren't too much of a mystery to me. Women were a mystery because I wasn't having deep and honest conversations with many of them. In other words they wouldn't show their cards. Now there are endless videos online where women reveal who they are and what they want and who they want it from. There's this unfortunate cliche in the culture (as long as I've been alive) that says all men care about is getting laid, which isn't completely true. But now I see this unfortunate cliche in the culture that says all women care about is getting a top 10% man and social status and validation for physical beauty and moral virtue and "equality" while being provided for if choosing to not work etc. which is mostly true. Until they lose their power. And then they just become bitter and pathetic. Not all of them but it seems like a trend.

[@RyanBridwell-wq9bo]

Most women in public these days look pissed off if they even catch you noticing them - let alone make an effort to communicate.

[@NishkamTheGeneral]

So true

[@amdiary7]

IKR. I’m neutral most of the time BUT with a slight smile and people literally call me a weirdo for that. Wtf.

[@DisfattBidge-i2x]

I looked at a girl for like 2 seconds in the gym and she looked so creeped out 😒😒

[@derekfoehr9264]

A lot of men don't care for modern women and all the BS that comes along with them. We just do'n't want to deal with the issues and drama.

[@Lovecove4]

Then don’t nobody forcing you lol

[@Joshua-eo5hr]

​@@Lovecove4 Who said they were?

[@Lovecove4]

@@Joshua-eo5hr then don’t lol

[@Lovecove4]

English mush? no coprendo

[@debrachambers1304]

Waaaayyyyy more of an internet thing than a real life thing, the horny is just TOO strong for people.

[@cartwrightworm1317]

In high school I asked out a tall girl and she rejected me. Fine, whatever. A year later I overheard her complaining to a friend that men only want short women.

[@robotizedcyborg7788]

I got rejected by a tall lady too man, it fucked my baaaad. Frankly, I wish I could make some more female friends so I could ask them about getting a girlfriend for once since I've kinda always gotten rejected since like, middle school lol Actually, I might be oversharing a tad bit lol

[@MonkeyDIvan]

What if she rejected you not because of your height but something else?

[@etrangray-mane8610]

​@@MonkeyDIvan Every time I see a response like this I can only think "why can women assume a man said no for shallow reasons but a man can't?"

[@nonyobisniss7928]

@@etrangray-mane8610 It's going to be a shallow reason if you're basing it on limited information because you don't actually know anything about the person. Doesn't mean you know which shallow reason it was. There's also nothing wrong with being shallow, but you should try to be considerate of the other person you're rejecting. There's also a benefit to yourself of being a bit more open minded, and at least entertaining an approach from someone you might have some initial 'shallow' reservations about.

[@a2d]

My parents met because my mom lived in a small town and my dad was a traveling sales rep for a car parts company. Her town was part of his territory and word got out a single man was in town so my mom found him and started hitting on him. So basically the community connected them. That was almost 50 years ago and they are still together ❤

[@M4dM4n96]

Travelling sales rep = serial killer

[@ridethelapras]

@@M4dM4n96 serial (lady) killer

[@QKuKier]

an outsider ventures into town, gets the bitches; classic western tale

[@misterwhipple2870]

He got one of the last pieces of good luck to come floating down the highway.

[@misterwhipple2870]

@@QKuKier So beware of a Tall Dark Stranger If he comes ridin' into your town A Tall Dark Stranger is Danger (danger) So don't let no Strangers hang around Buck Owens 1969

[@peterfigueroa4570]

I’ve been told by a couple of women that having someone looking at them or approach them in public is creepy….then proceeded to get on a dating website. 🤦🏽‍♂️

[@mrconfusion87]

Translation: "If we find the guy ugly, it is creepy! If we find the guy hot, it is flirting!" 🤣🤣🤣

[@Nabagabo22]

Hmmm... Dating sites allow Ladies time and space to check out the talent without commitment, and give a considered Like. A direct approach means direct response - and being caught unawares. A ship doesn't just bang into the ground - that'll create massive damage on both sides - instead maneuvers gently alongside the pier before throwing lines of attachment out...

[@seven8519]

​@@Nabagabo22 dating sites are the mcdonalds of dating. quick, unhealthy, and a mistake. they are used primarily for one night stands and hookups. this isn't something that can be argued, it is fact.

[@thehoxtontrend]

or set up an only fans and get paid for it instead lols

[@SaintMatthieuSimard]

Approaching women is legally terrifying.

[@johnclayton4946]

There has never been any timeline in the human history where a woman is the scariest and most dangerous creature a men can face!

[@GomuGear4]

Women joke that they'd rather be approached by a bear than a man. Some men would rather approach a bear than a woman

[@sparkplug8763]

@@GomuGear4 yeah I'd love to have a spar with a bear and become bros like the Russians

[@nba3927]

Most women would never consider any man approaching them yet they encourage it because it is constant validation and approval . NEVER cold approach women . If a woman needs you and wants you she will make SURE you know . Women are the choosers of relationship partners , let them choose .

[@99999janice]

I used to teach English and my male students from the Arab world said they always preferred their mom choosing their wives. That it usually works out better.

[@everythingisfine9988]

Their world is not a meritocracy. Everything you have is via your family. Choose the wrong partner and be cut off from that. But they're going to have to change, because of the whole world's moving towards meritocracy. That system will not last

[@jimdavis8391]

​​@@everythingisfine9988Really? You think affirmative action and DEI are part of a meritocracy? The western world is actually moving towards an authoritarian technocracy.

[@user-ds8gf3ki2g]

@@everythingisfine9988disagree completely that’s not just arab culture that’s Islamic culture and there’s a billion of them

[@Tubes12AX7k]

My mom tried that after she didn't like some of my dates. You really don't want your mom selecting your girlfriend or wife. You might have absolutely nothing in common and you'll have to deal with that.

[@everythingisfine9988]

@@user-ds8gf3ki2g 100 years ago the entire world function like that. But a lot has changed and a lot will continue. The trend is unstoppable

[@DanielH874]

It boils down to a simple cost/benefit analysis. Previously the fear of approaching a woman was the possibility of rejection or ridicule. If you were a decently well-adjusted man you could handle that rejection or ridicule, move on with your life and try again. Not a big deal. Now the consequences of rejection may carry a far greater consequence. Being accused of sexual harassment, being ridiculed beyond the vicinity of the approach, threat of job loss, attacks against reputation and even possible civil litigation against you. A lot of rational men look at those consequences, throw in the towel and say why the hell would I bother. The risk is not worth taking on, so they won't engage. Furthermore even if a man is successful in attracting a mate and starting a family the consequences of that family breakdown down the road is absolutely catastrophic. Upon a marriage breakdown the likely result is loss of possessions, paying child support for your children you get to see a lot less now, supporting your ex wife financially, and basically having to start life all over again. The majority of divorces are initiated by women and you can suffer the consequences listed above (and many more) even if you remained faithful, attentive, a good father, a provider and so forth. The idea of taking on such a grave loss when you did nothing egregious is absolutely horrifying so a lot of men are just flat out deciding the pursuit is not a logical path to take on. Until this is changed we are going to continue to see a societal breakdown in our values and society as a whole will decline. Sadly I feel as if this is all by deliberate design.

[@Tee55118]

Exactly. Modern dilusional women say, the worst that can happen is that she says, "No," the man respects that, and he moves on, and she does not shame or sue him. The fact is too much risk of social shame and legal hell until death.

[@GjVj]

Nailed it. And +1 to 'by design'. S'not an accident.

[@FlamingCockatiel]

I mentioned a shorter version of what you wrote in a reply to a woman on another video, trying to induce understanding. Her reply, paraphrased, was, "Whenever I hear men complaining about being victims, I roll my eyes." I'm trying to figure out if it was a real woman or a troll. I've always been aware of the size and strength difference between men and women, but I have never tried to be paranoid because of it. I'm trying to figure out the reasoning behind writing that it's lazy to say not all men are abusive but peak prudence and intelligence to have an attitude of guilty until proven innocent.

[@BlueFish-kq9fh]

@@FlamingCockatiel "I'm trying to figure out if it was a real woman or a troll." More than likely a real woman. The majority of women in the West these days don't much like men, many even hate us.

[@BlueFish-kq9fh]

@DanielH874: Good post. One thing you missed IMO is the significant possibility (I would say, strong likelihood) that your wife will cheat on you and feel she's doing nothing wrong, i.e. shameless and guilt-free cheating. Very common in the modern West.

[@ky7299]

I don't live in the UK so there may be a cultural difference but I am a Gen Xer and during the nineties women would never give hints to men they found attractive. They demanded that the men approached them cold. I corroborated that impression by asking several female friends and they all told me the same thing: no hints or encouragement whatsoever. The man would have to jump through hoops to get to them. And yes, they would check out all men in the vicinity but would do it in such a way that men couldn't see it. It was the time young women had started to see themselves as trophies to be won by "hunters". Social media has exacerbated that attitude.

[@LuckysLair]

Yep, sounds similar to my Gen X experience

[@stevec3526]

True

[@Crukren89]

In the 90s.....Goddamn that sucks. I thought women would be better behaved back then. 30 years on and as you said its a shitshow

[@jonevans870]

Women are rubbish at hinting. They will do these ambiguous things like making eye contact for a second. But any time you're in a busy place, you're always going to randomly make eye contact with people around you. So if you are going to approach women who are 'hinting' at you, sometimes you will be right, sometimes wrong. It's ALWAYS a risk - so you might as well just approach whoever you want, regardless. That's my own philosophy. I've also approached women who didn't even see me, and they were very happy to talk to me. So I don't believe in waiting for their crappy ambiguous 'hints'.

[@GentleFlyer]

the 80's were no different..I think their lack of dropping hints ties into them not wanting to seem slutty

[@josephtomaselli9181]

She nailed it in first minute. The norm until recently was ‘semi arranged’ relationships where family is involved in making introductions. We somehow forgot why things were done the way they were. A lot of thought went into it and worked better than the deplorable mess we have today in the West.

[@orlandolopezdevictoria243]

I’ve tried to approach single women these days. They seem stuck in their cell phones and not engaging at all. It’s like talking to a wall. All I can do is give them their space and walk away.

[@fahkjlage23]

From my experience approaching women around 2013-2014, there's just too much attrition involved. You would probably have to approach 1,000 women to get a girlfriend out of it. But I would say it's slightly better than online dating.

[@dshannon565]

I would say don’t be looking for a relationship and enjoy the chase. If you happen to meet a girl you like then happy days.

[@Ghostrider-ul7xn]

I'm not exactly sure if its "better" considering there's more risk involved in approaching a random person irl than trying to meet someone through OLD. In OLD platforms, they are less likely to accuse you for showing interest since both of them are on the same platform to find partners.

[@JustNo8808]

Online dating was so much better than though. You can message any girl you want without matching them, without any kind of maximum in the day, without paying any amount of money.

[@SillySpanish]

No just 1. the one, pick wiser

[@jonevans870]

@@Ghostrider-ul7xnwhat is the risk in meeting people IRL though?

[@gemox3225]

I've approached women face to face almost my entire adult life. At first, in my teens, I was really petrified of doing it, but an older friend pushed me into trying, and I got used to it. However it can be demoralizing if the woman is mean. But I don't like meeting people online at all.

[@ChefofWar33]

How old are you? 50? 60?

[@martinmollerup2265]

I'm like this too, I'm 24 :)

[@opposingshore9322]

I’ve never used a dating app and only meet women in person. Those who try to be mean just make me laugh, I don’t take it personally, they are doing me a favor by revealing their true character up front.

[@GunBreaux]

I met my wife at a coffeeshop, dated for 6 months, engaged for 6, now married 2 years in and pregnant with twins. Don't forget it's not all doom and gloom.

[@maloxi1472]

I'm all for the few remaining unicorns to get snatched off the market ASAP and live happy lives for as long as possible. Without stories like yours, humanity would've already gone extinct.

[@dalewetzel3029]

Give it time.

[@D_402S]

You are an exception. Unfortunately, this is nothing but a dream to a lot of men. A dream far away from reach

[@AccountNr1-iv3qf]

Rookie numbers. Get back to us in 20 years.

[@d_s_ctube]

Most men don't know 'the signs'. Women should communicate their interest directly.

[@M4dM4n96]

Millions of years of bad habits condensed into a 26 year old bar maid from Nuneaton

[@CelestialWoodway]

I'm Generation X, 53 years old. Bars were very much a way to meet people and hook up. That was the whole point of getting a little buzzed or drunk. Lose your fears and inhibitions and go say hello to a pretty girl. And people played video games since the 1980s as well. Play Nintendo all day then go out Friday and Saturday night, drink and try and take someone home. There was no Internet back then, people were itching to get out of the house and blow off steam with loud music, dancing and alcohol. It was a funner and better way of life actually. Most people weren't obsessed with politics. Having a good time was the common goal of most people. You can see that culture in so many 80s movies.

[@fuzzypanda1684]

The most frustrating part is that you hear about people going out to the bars and hooking up all the time. But then you go out to the bar, walk around, talk to people, flirt, dance etc. yet go home alone. Not just once or twice, but every single time. I've had times where I went out 2 or 3 nights a week for months on end, and went home alone every time. It gets tough to keep going out when you realize that tonight was your 47th night in a row going home alone. The pressure to NOT go home alone the next time is so powerful, it makes you desperate and all but guarantees that the next time you go out will be the 48th. Hearing your friends talk about how they pulled a girl an hour after arriving, then went back later that night and pulled another doesn't help your self confidence.

[@ForeverRetro31]

@@fuzzypanda1684just rent Home Alone

[@easportssucks4347]

You hit it on the head. Fun is dead, plain and simple. Everyone takes themselves way too seriously now. Life is all business. An entire generation of "corporate" personalities. Play dates, speed dating, dating apps.. all so business like. No wonder people are so miserable

[@yesnomaybe1048]

What you have today is the result of your X generations actions without a CLEAR CUT limit of where it should stop

[@ChiakiNanami736]

I wouldn’t trust someone I met in a bar as far as I could throw them…

[@jasonmartinez9051]

It's more difficult if you live in a dense city. People are accustomed to walking past several dozen strangers everyday and not acknowledging them. If one of them approaches you and speaks to you, you may be tempted to think that they want something from you, such as directions or a financial contribution to some charity. If you're a woman, you may think "Why is this strange guy talking to me? What does he want?"

[@BLACKAAROW]

I would say that's true for the most part. I live in NYC and women in my age bracket (i'm 29) barely even look at you, smile, say hello etc so it's hard to even have an interaction even in places like bars etc

[@fuzzypanda1684]

I'd argue it's easier in a big city. You can talk to as many girls as you want without repercussion, and if you've put time into making yourself attractive, you might get some results. In a smaller town, you'll get a reputation really fast and soon every girl will avoid you like the plague.

[@jasonmartinez9051]

@@fuzzypanda1684 You can talk to many, many girls, true. You'll probably end up making lots and lots of short, 30 to 60 second conversations but will they lead to a date? I'd say probably not. You can make yourself attractive (nice hair style, nice clothes, etc) but women usually gauge men by status, personality, mental strength, physical strength, wit... lots of variables. It's difficult to display all of those features in a brief encounter. In a small town, you only have to worry about a reputation if it's a bad one. However, in a big city you have a myriad of potential dates. In a small town, you'll probably run through the dating pool very fast and when you're done then you're out of options.

[@Super-lucky-7777]

from my experience living in a medium to small town the girls have all disappeared onto only fans, and if they want to hook up with anyone its as simple as posting a pic on IG or opening a dating app to check for hundreds of messages from simps for a quick one. where as the normal hard working traditional local man has no options other than to be single or play the stupid dating game for delusional women

[@glenbateman5960]

We were told to stop that. We stopped. I have to admit, I'm not really seeing the mystery. It's all pretty straightforward.

[@WhirlingMusic]

Bet you there are some men reading the title of this video and thinking to themselves, "Wait men aren't asking women out anymore? Maybe now I finally have a chance if I approach women since they aren't getting asked out anymore". Then they get rejected.

[@bloodymares]

Most actors get rejected 100 times after audition before they are hired. Approaching girls is no different from said auditions. Sometimes they'll say "We're going to contact you" but don't, but sometimes you'll get an excited response because you happened to be the right person in the right place in the right time. Every rejection is an XP boost.

[@patrioticaussiesams8581]

Yep

[@VideoGram13]

💯

[@lexman8678]

​@bloodymares what a dumb statement just like trying to get a loan over and over and getting rejected no point trying when you already know the outcome

[@bloodymares]

@@lexman8678 false analogy. Women aren't banks.