Why NEOM is WAY scarier than you think

Between Saudi cities in the desert and Peter Thiel’s attempts to homestead the high seas, it’s clear that for some, money isn’t enough. That can be a danger in liberal democracies.
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Sources and Attributions: www.spectacles.news/mini-doc-...
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Saudi Arabia’s crown prince Mohammed bin Salman wants to build cities of the future in the middle of the desert - NEOM - with a ski resort called Trojena, a floating city called Oxagon, and a city built in a straight line called The Line. But the supposed motivations don’t add up. Rather than practical concerns, it seems MBS is animated by a desire to be a great founding figure: a motive shared by American billionaire Peter Thiel. Thiel, who first dreamed of libertarian utopias on the ocean - seasteading - has since redirected his interest and energy toward supporting National Conservatism: a far-right, anti-democratic political movement embraced by Josh Hawley and Thiel’s client-candidates J.D. Vance and Blake Masters. This dual-story reveals just how dangerous unlimited ambition can be when up against the limits placed by liberal democracy.
Spectacles is a love letter to democracy, its values, its caretakers, and its ideas. Around the world, individual rights and representative government are facing unprecedented attacks from the forces of reaction and revisionism. But despite liberal democracy’s real shortcomings and today’s all-too-fashionable cynicism, we remain committed to its preservation and improvement. Join us as we explore just what liberal democracy is, how it comes about, and how it can best be maintained in a changing world.

[@SeruraRenge11]

At every point in the NEOM story I go "it can't possibly get any stupider" only to be proven wrong yet again.

[@ZhoRZh37]

Require an app, account and internet connection to use anything in the city.

[@AngryChiropractor]

I met a traveller from an antique land Who said: Two vast and trunkless legs of stone Stand in the desart. Near them, on the sand, Half sunk, a shattered visage lies, whose frown, And wrinkled lip, and sneer of cold command, Tell that its sculptor well those passions read Which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless things, The hand that mocked them and the heart that fed: And on the pedestal these words appear: "My name is Ozymandias, king of kings: Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!" Nothing beside remains. Round the decay Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare The lone and level sands stretch far away.

[@shadiafifi54]

Exactly what I was thinking at the last part of the video

[@stephenkelly207]

Every city could use robot gladiators

[@logank444]

That would be so great

[@mikebar42]

For what?

[@logank444]

@@mikebar42 to keep the plebs happy, duh

[@willhebert576]

Because of the lagoon, Epcot doesn't have many underground tunnels (a few in the future world section) But mostly Epcot uses the lagoon for the transport of goods, and the currently unused pavillions as backstage facilities. The massive tunnel network you're thinking of, the Utilidor system, is found in the Magic Kingdom.

[@harryclennon6745]

While I hope spectacles never makes an error like this again, if we do I hope that the correction is as polite and informative as yours!

[@spectacles-dm]

I made a severe and continuous lapse in my judgement, and I don’t expect to be forgiven. I’m simply here to apologise. What we said about EPCOT was obviously unplanned. The reactions you saw on tape were raw; they were unfiltered. None of us knew how to react or how to feel. I should have never posted the video. I should have put the cameras down and stopped recording what we were going through. There's a lot of things I should have done differently but I didn't. And for that, from the bottom of my heart, I am sorry. I want to apologise to the internet. I want to apologise to anyone who has seen the video. I want to apologise to anyone who has been affected or touched by DCOMs, Star Wars, or Marvel. But most importantly I want to apologise to the Walt Disney and his family. For my fans who are defending my actions, please don't. I don’t deserve to be defended. My goal with my content is always to educate; to push the boundaries, to promote liberal democracy. In the world live in, I share almost everything I do. The intent is never to be heartless, cruel, or malicious. Like I said I made a huge mistake. I don’t expect to be forgiven, I’m just here to apologise. I'm ashamed of myself. I’m disappointed in myself. And I promise to be better. I will be better. Thank you.

[@spectacles-dm]

But seriously, thanks for the pointer!

[@whitedragondojo]

Nothing worse than a Billionaire with a new idea.

[@sammyjones8279]

This is the most well-produced video I've ever seen with under 100 likes!! :0 subbed!!!

[@spectacles-dm]

❤️ thank you!

[@sammyjones8279]

This channel is going places!!! Good luck man :D

[@Leftistattheparty]

Just shows that billionaires and democracy cant exist together.

[@CPTE5069]

*Coughs in Norwegian

[@shantanusapru]

Very few people have seen/can see through Peter Thiel's & Elon Musk's marketing, advertising, PR & spin to see/reveal their true agenda - which is pretty evil! Kudos for doing this!

[@uncertaintytoworldpeace3650]

Huh? I think you probably actually mean all representative politicians

[@callusklaus2413]

Pro musk people are gonna be malding

[@tallgnome3229]

@@uncertaintytoworldpeace3650elon musk isnt a politician

[@ripwednesdayadams]

They’re both horrible and shockingly stupid for being so rich. Dude really thought a city floating on the sea was feasible.

[@LibertyGoose]

And what, pray tell, are you talking about Elons evil intentions? Profit?

[@grahamball3596]

NEOM being a vanity project and having such massive mirrors seems too on the nose. Come on MBS, be a little more subtle.

[@SeruraRenge11]

You can't ask for subtlety from a man that was born with everything he could ask for in life whenever he wanted it.

[@lauraner99]

Up until when I was about 12, my dream for when "I grow up" was to build a big floating city in the middle of the Pacific ocean with me being it's ruler. I believed an autocracy by me would be the obviously best system since I was so clever and would know what was right and everyone would flock to live in such a wonderful place. I named the island a nonsensical cool sounding word that I made up and drew maps and flags and everything that I thought a new microstate needed... I wonder why that vivid childhood memory suddenly came into my head...

[@lynxf]

it's not a bad thing to dream up in your early teens

[@bonsai5753]

Your videos are by far the greatest. I’m in complete disbelief that you aren’t at 500k. Anyways..I’m here at at 992 subscribers! Let’s get to 500k

[@spectacles-dm]

Let's hit 1k today! Thank you so so much for the kind words.

[@raynerhandrian1486]

Man, it's truly amazing to see how Bioshock has become even more real than ever now a day

[@nikauadams590]

How does this channel not have more subscribers?

[@spectacles-dm]

GOOD question!

[@ccman322]

Here at 2.63k subs - hopefully we get to 5k by the end of the month :)

[@evandonovan9239]

Just a quibble - the palantir were not evil. They were created by the good elves of Middle-Earth in the Second Age, but then were later corrupted by Sauron, like the rings. Now, Thiel's corporation Palantir, on the other hand....definitely evil.

[@moptopbaku6022]

Another excellent and very informative video. Keep up the good work.

[@mariomovillon1613]

Mega egos, Mega ambitions, Mega fails. When people build castles in the sand, mega failure is in sight. Because when sheer stupidity overshadows simple logic and common sense, then we very know the likely outcome. Indeed, an outstanding exercise in Vanity!

[@kenzou776]

You are doing amazing and please PLEASE keep making these wonderful videos, I'm more than sire you'll find great success

[@TheSilver2001]

Great videos, have now watched everything you have uploaded and have subscribed to see what you have planned for the future. I discovered your channel thanks to Kamome, hopefully other channels give you shoutouts!

[@thevocatiousunspeakables709]

"Lets do Bioshock in real life. That would be sick!"

[@thecapeofnohope6018]

0:48 “Welcome to Rapture”

[@spectacles-dm]

No gods or kings, only Thiel.

[@connormclernon26]

Yup, that's exactly what I thought when I heard that. Hopefully they don't find sea slugs that provide superpowers, but even without that, the city was doomed. It almost feels as though Thiel played Bioshock and then thought "Meh, I could make it work."

[@dantetre]

5:05 "Beheadings are on Wednesdays." Worf ST Picard

[@theguy1506]

an entire video on how Seastead cities without government oversight sounds like something that would work well

[@jonathandidley5262]

Thiel’s embrace of anti-LGBTQ conservative nationalism is quite ironic considering he is…

[@spencerberg7477]

Wait how is this channel still under 1k subs??

[@spectacles-dm]

GOOD question, Stephen!

[@kalashnikovdevil]

"But why is Neom?" That's the trillion petrodollar question in the end.

[@Ostalgie658]

Pristine waters of the red sea, yeah, all that shipping traffic and oil sludge sure is clean

[@andrewroby1130]

It's not a question of whether, or even when, liberal democracy will be subverted. That is fait accompli. It's now a fight to see which autocracy will come out on top, and in which form. And you may think this is nothing but bad, and you will certainly be told so by the losing player(s), whoever they may be. But for some hope and perspective, see Spectacles's (also excellent) documentary on the Kuomintang, "This Dictator Chose Democracy." It may change how you approach the future.

[@emperorofpluto]

Rubbish. Nothing is inevitable. Did you even watch the video you mentioned? The only reason "the dictator chose democracy" in post-PRC Taiwan was because the Kuo Min Tang had no real opposition. They have elections in Russia too.

[@moeShuaibi]

NEO = new and M is short for mostaqbal meaning future NEOM = new/future

[@emperorofpluto]

Thank you for the explanation. I always wondered what the name meant. Always assumed it was an acronym.

[@courier.66]

Just a fact, my dad's company is working with Neom on this

[@dumbcat]

this video devolved into a hard left puff piece. you even attacked the promotion of conservative family values.

[@troybaxter]

I agree. It was good up until that point. There is nothing wrong with valuing traditional family values, securing our borders to protect our friends, family, and community from actual threats, or fighting back against an increased perversion against our kids (note, this doesn't mean one is anti-Pride community, but anti-pedophilia that has straight up infiltrated and taken up the pride community by wanting to teach sexual acts (not a joke) to minors aka elementary and middle schoolers).

[@doctorjekyll6125]

Would this be scary to you if it was being done in the United States, or is it scary because it’s happening in the Middle East?

[@chegu613]

nah, it's because it is supported by peter thiel.

[@dai6419]

similar to how disney froze himself and thought epcot would be a utopia lol, rich ppl things

[@emperorofpluto]

The notion of modernity seems somehow incompatible with a medieval theocratic monarchy.

[@nicholashylton6857]

NEOM has been cut back a bit from its proposed 170 km length. But 98.6%, actually. Down to 2.4 km in fact.

[@aboessam123]

M in is for the word future in Arabic "mustaqbal' مستقبل.. meaning new future

[@Jdses]

Could you do a video about Somalia 4.5 system

[@spectacles-dm]

Maybe sometime in the future, but if it interests you, or next video is another story of power-sharing. Thank you for suggesting this!

[@Jdses]

@@spectacles-dm ok 👍 np

[@alexanderveritas]

It’s all about showing you’re the dictator with the _biggest stick_ in the room. Consequences be damned!

[@homosapien.a6364]

fun fact about my country: capital punishment is still applied on gay and atheist people.

[@emperorofpluto]

I assume you're referring to Saudi Arabia. Or possibly Iran. Both medieval autocracies.

[@SincerelyFromStephen]

Sure would be a shame if Thiel’s cryogenic sleep was disrupted and he somehow didn’t survive

[@metroiddoom5178]

This Saudi guy played a lot of Bioshock

[@madimakes]

That took a weird turn. lol

[@austinschwartz7424]

so basically bioshock

[@bzipoli]

1) ok but i'm in with the dino island 2) saying "palantir is bad" is pretty shallow

[@hamdanyusron3596]

Nice

[@spectacles-dm]

Thanks

[@hurricanemeridian8712]

Neom kind of will neom the budget of SA into the big red numbers

[@Anonymity4LDAF]

Tiel sounds like he is trying to be John Galt….scary!

[@daegueric]

Lotsa spin in here. Great video in so many ways, though.

[@foghornleghorn2975]

Garden NEOMs...sweet.

[@spectacles-dm]

Masterful stuff, thank you hahaha :)

[@chicagofineart9546]

Spectacles, thank you for enlightening us on the mass delusions of privileged rich people.

[@maverickloggins5470]

lmfao yeah a music festival where you can’t drink, get executed for having drugs and ur girl gets thrown in jail for not wearing sheet over her whole body. Great plan!

[@lucre113]

All the district ideas sound like the Deathloop map lmfao

[@ConnorNolan]

All this bioshock Ayn Rand city shit is wild

[@KitsGravity]

Apparently, Thiel himself is homosexual, married to Matt Danzeisen. It's funny he is with conservatives while reaping the rewards brought by liberals.

[@UnderstandingBitcoin]

National conservatives are the same as JFK’s positions

[@lawrencefoster5608]

BROTHEL'S, BROTHER. One letter difference.

[@Rabcup]

When a video openly critical of a concept city gets a preroll ad trying to sway fools with more money than sense to invest in…that’s irony

[@ricosadao828]

Plato would agree with Thiel. The masses are dumfux...we need enlightened kings.

[@Laughwithmelol]

Makes me think of rapture or Colombia

[@calvinware7957]

lmao peter thiel learning nothing from bioshock

[@ChaosDarkLight]

Found this channel thru the algo, but videos like this and the last one make it really sus. 🤔

[@aidanwelch4763]

the difference is sea stedding is optional

[@skylern.spenillo9710]

You ask what is NEOM or why is NEOM, but have you ever thought to ask how is NEOM?

[@milesmcclure3485]

this video is just using neom as an excuse to talk about some random guy he doesn't like, and who has nothing to do with neom. I found the sudden change of topic quite jarring tbh. Why does some rich American nobody's ever heard of make neom "way scarier than you think" exactly?

[@emperorofpluto]

Just because you don't know who Peter Thiel is doesn't mean "nobody's ever heard" of him ... another evil billionaire with stupid ideas.

[@troybaxter]

Agreed, especially when it was also used to attack worthwhile values that people rightfully hold in this country. Values like the nuclear family and fighting for both parents to be in the home, securing borders to protect our already quite diverse communities from actual foreign threats that want us dead (seriously, come to Texas and you will realize how non-racist, diverse, and accepting that we really are), or stopping inappropriate teachings in the school such as taking sex education *way too far* and bordering on predation (sorry, but stuff like this does nothing but hurt the Pride community). All the guy did was regurgitate talking points by the media who clearly hate the average hard working American that wants a better life for their family and their country.

[@jekanyika]

It will never be completed.

[@D7EEEMA]

The element you are missing from your analysis is how Neom ties into the bigger webs of projects in Saudi, and Internationally. Also Neom acted as a catalyst for us Saudis to break out of the mental barriers for how to implement our passions, and it has been successful at that.

[@eamonnirwin5558]

Tiel is gay and “married” to another man. It would be rather odd for him to go after “gay rights”. Could you elaborate on that?

[@emperorofpluto]

Thiel (just like his buddy Elon Musk) is a fan of extreme right wing politics who doesn't think anyone other than him deserves freedom or rights because he genuinely thinks he's exceptional.

[@nobody687]

They are building it

[@uknown1100]

Bioshock: The Line

[@Kiyoone]

What is scary about a project that will never going to happen? At least in its original 150 km scale, but in a much reduced one? Oh, now i got it, the propagandas is supposed to be the scary part

[@user-cd4bx6uq1y]

Not gonna lie this was funny

[@spectacles-dm]

🙏🙏🙏

[@ghostface12258]

I feel like this rich people wishing to escape reality. Rich people despite having everything, also fall in to Escapism as well.

[@michaelbruce3773]

2020 did I have some major issues. Unless you deny the facts.

[@Avg-Usr]

Reminder: thiel bankrupted Gawker just because he didn’t like the fact that the website said he is gay (which is true), which makes his hard right leanings too ironic for words.

[@KitsGravity]

He even married his long term boyfriend

[@evandonovan9239]

Saying right-wing populism is a threat to democracy is too easy. It doesn't help answer the question of why this form of populism is so popular, and increasingly so both in the US and Europe. In my view, US progressives have been discrediting themselves in many ways such as: 1) Trying to cover up the lab leak theory for the origin of COVID-19 for years, even though now our government recognizes it as the most likely 2) Saying that masks were a strong protection against COVID when now the largest meta-analysis is more dubious on that 3) Saying the COVID vaccines would stop transmission when it is clear now they do not (I am not anti-vax, but I think we need to be honest that they only weaken COVID) 4) Saying that schools had to stay closed when it was clear that children hardly got sick from COVID, and now we see how much learning loss and psychological trouble it caused 5) In some states, keeping churches closed for months despite the First Amendment violation 6) Reporting on 2020 protests as "mostly peaceful" when there were literally buildings burning down in the background. I remember Slate wrote an article defending the burning down of a police station in Minneapolis. And of course NPR interviewed the author of "In Defense of Looting" 7) Supporting the "defund the police" movement when most people of color who actually live in high-crime neighborhoods recognize the need for police, although they should be reformed 8) Pushing for a carbon net-zero agenda that is destroying the economies of states like West Virginia, contributing to "deaths of despair" 9) Pushing for a globalized economy that is leading jobs to be outsourced to other countries, again leading to "deaths of despair" 10) Funding so-called humanitarian wars like Obama's war in Libya which turned into a disaster (Bush, of course, was terrible here also. Trump actually ended more wars than either.) 11) Failing to recognize that border cities across from Mexico lack the capacity to deal with migrants, to the point that now even Biden is building more fences. (I thought Trump's child separation policy was morally abhorrent, but it's literally impossible for the US to accept all the immigrants that want to come in, so some means of restricting the flow is necessary.) 12) Saying that Hunter Biden's laptop was "Russian disinformation" and actively suppressing news of it when it turned out to be completely true. 13) In a recent development, it's been discovered that the State Department has been funding "anti-disinformation" research groups that flag primarily conservative news sites, getting them defunded for advertising. 14) Supporting a redefinition of Title IX to permit biological males to compete in women's sports, against the plain meaning of the text of the law and undermining its goal of giving women a place to compete fairly against other women. 15) Overruling parents' rights to care for their teenage children by pushing gender-affirming transgender care, even though cases like Kiera Bell's are calling it into question in the UK and Europe. 16) Condemning Israel's actions against Palestine historically (fairly, to a point) while not as vigorously condemning anti-Semitic terrorism and violence today. It's easy to tar all of conservative populism with the brush of Peter Thiel and say it's just a bunch of people who hate women and immigrants. But even if you disagree with some of the points I've made above, you have to *try* to understand why people find them appealing. Otherwise you are so bought into a mainstream progressive narrative that you can't create a progressive vision that more conservative people might find appealing. From my perspective, I think someone like Bernie Sanders had the ability to speak to working-class whites in a way that most progressives cannot. He recognized that potential Trump voters weren't just a "basket of deplorables." When will the Democratic Party learn that lesson?

[@TheChangeYT]

Title not acurate, where is thiel in title?

[@ignaciomoreno9655]

Well, fighting overwoke corporations could be interesting, but they are making an excellent work destroying themselves.

[@therealuncleowen2588]

IBS strikes again.

[@AA-zv3nf]

Neom= “New” + “Yom” which means day in Arabic . You got that wrong

[@spectacles-dm]

It's from their website. Not our idea.

[@se44th]

Why bother posting blatant lies online?

[@user-il1nx9bl9z]

Built to fail Basically wait n see

[@reireireireireireireireirei]

The second half of the script is such a midwit nonsense. Billionaire bad because not ultra-woke.

[@anonygrazer3234]

Gee, you'd think they'd cover Klaus Schwab & WEF's, Bill Gates' & Geo. Soros' vision for _all_ our futures, but......crickets. So not surprised.

[@oquevix]

Bait and Switch

[@UnderstandingBitcoin]

100% it’s a Peter Thiel smear piece

[@freespeechisneverwrong9351]

Why should you be thankful for limits on man’s ambition?

[@se44th]

For the same reason we no longer have monarchs

[@freespeechisneverwrong9351]

@@se44th A monarch is hardly a person with unbounded ambition. They have for most of history been hereditary. So having answered your unsubstantiated point, tell me, how much limitation should we put on man’s ambition? We should limit one man’s power over others not anyone’s ambition.

[@Connor-vj7vf]

Thiel is odder because the true oxymoron is describing himself as a libertarian wanting closed borders

[@chinguunerdenebadrakh7022]

It's not an oxymoron because all libertarians are like that. Government involvement is shit except against things I don't like

[@petersamson5407]

Yeah, I think libertarians are often basically psychopaths annoyed with the thought that someone stronger than them (the state) is able to control them. When they get into power or see that power on the horizon, they switch gears immediately.

[@emperorofpluto]

Libertarians like Peter Thiel are just anarchists with money.

[@DogKacique]

It is unfortunately something very common. What made me leave libertarian circles in my country in like 2014 is that they got increasingly more and more into fascism as time went on. To the point that in the last elections the local libertarian party kicked the members against the guy who wanted to stage a coup and put a literal racist in the leadership (with a puppet as president of the party)

[@user-ct1kp8jg5n]

What I learned is that you only see the extreme right wing danger for democracy and you ignore the extreme left wing danger for democracy. That’s convent for those who want to overthrow democracy. They will just declare themselves as liberal socialists to you and you will give them a free pass.

[@zandaroos553]

If you live in a Western country the threat of left wing extremism is borderline non-existent. Any anti-democratic left-wing groups tend to be aligned if not active sock puppets of right-wing groups.

[@cronagorgon6435]

@@zandaroos553 You say that but which side decided to throw a "firery, but mostly peaceful" protest with 7 people getting stamped out in one night for defending properties?

[@cronagorgon6435]

Dishonest reporting. Convenient to leave out important information as to not "fully" lie but rather lie by omission. A common tactic used by people who realize what they advocate for has some serious holes in their logic. I say let these rich men build these utopias. If Bioshock taught us anything, it's that if it fails then it fails spectacularly. Not every country needs to be a democracy, not every state owned by the government.

[@randomchannel-px6ho]

Please highlight what exactly the extreme left wing threat to democracy is. In our age of Neoliberalism and billionaires it seems a bit ridiculous to argue that Communist guerrillas are the real threat, please tell me where they are lol.

[@user-ct1kp8jg5n]

@@randomchannel-px6ho Who wants open borders for illegal immigrants? Who turns the blind eye to criminality caused by imported Islamic terrorists? Who made Stockholm the continental capital of women’s rapes? And all this done in exchange for the votes of those immigrants? Your beloved ideologically extreme, very wealthy, media praised, easy living in fortified mansions, leftish elite. Who needs communist mountain guerillas you fool? The Islamic imported terrorists and looters will do the job. Take their recent riots in France for example.

[@bigboat8329]

This is a channel with good production, but is loaded with thinly-veiled political bias and commentary. The videos speak to me more as an op-ed rather than information, although it is easy to be "fooled"/not realize that all of these videos are indeed skewed. I've watched 5 of your videos so far and that's how I feel.

[@maarten1115]

He's too politically biased in favour of democracy and freedom of speech 🤢

[@bigboat8329]

@@maarten1115 Those are two words which are extremely subjective.

[@maarten1115]

@@bigboat8329 They more or less have a set definition.

[@bigboat8329]

@@maarten1115 What's yours?

[@maarten1115]

@bigboat8329 I suppose article 19 of the Universal declaration of human rights is a decent start: Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers. The idea that the government can not punish you for saying or agreeing with something if that thing does not actively hurt someone else.

[@tedthesailor172]

I think before an American academic criticises Victor Orban, he should pay closer attention to European politics as a whole and set up home in downtown Portland or some of the equally ruined cities of the EU...

[@SalmanKhan-qp5gz]

Dear Sir, You use the word Makkah for a region of absurd things like music and so on. Please remove that section of the video or mute it. It hurts Muslim's emotions. Thank you.

[@gdehoyos006]

This dude kinda hating. I hope neom succeeds lmao

[@zeecaptain3520]

Liberal democracy is kind of a terrible thing.

[@anthonypuch8473]

I think this guy really should stop saying 'democracy' and just say 'liberalism'. Democracy in America has been truly dead since the 2008 bank bailouts and was on life support decades before that. You can't have a genuine democracy in a country as large and diverse as ours, especially one in which massive financial special interests just buy out outsiders and radicals anyways. If you're going to claim that any vote that shifts the ruling ideology in any way is a 'threat to democracy', then what's the point of voting at all? What color hair or how tall do you want your corporate stooge to be? Which bank pawn is more handsome/pretty or wears better suits? If voting for a different ideology, whether it be left or right, constitutes a 'grave threat to democracy', then just say it like it is, you're trying to protect LIBERALISM. You're trying to protect INDIVIDUAL RIGHTS. You're trying to protect MINORITIES. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, by the way, but just be HONEST. If people are voting National Conservatives/Populists (right or left), then they're VOTING for what they want, and that's what we've been told for decades is what democracy means.

[@lucifer2b666]

Exactly

[@user-cx9nc4pj8w]

voting for people who want to get rid of things like freedom of speech and criticism of the government is democracy today, dictatorship tomorrow. When people tell you they want complete political control you should believe them, and you should recognise that this is a threat to democracy, not just a different ideology

[@ShankarSivarajan]

The bit about protecting individual rights is a lie: they're happy to destroy them if given a reasonable-sounding excuse, such as "climate emergency," "global pandemic," "mass shooting" etc.

[@da_revo5747]

This is so dumb. The reason people like Thiel support seasteading or charter cities is to try to create alternatives to our current stagnation in political development and to combat the widely held assumption that democracy is the only possible end state of political development

[@spectacles-dm]

How is that different from what we said? He'd like to get out of democracy, obviously. But the reason he wants to, as he said explicitly himself, is that modern democracy is no longer "free" enough, because of welfare programs and women voting. The man is pretty clear about his ideas. We quoted him. Check our sources. Thanks for watching.

[@da_revo5747]

@@spectacles-dm The difference is that you call all of modern 'liberal democracy' democracy. But democracy is just the method of accountability within that system. People like Thiel are only talking about the problems caused by that method of accountability. And to build alternative systems of accountability without those deficiencies, we will have to experiment. So those cities proposed by libertarians are not vanity projects but research projects which could potentially make government more reactive to society's needs and less like mob rule. These are people seeking to promote liberalism and has got absolutely nothing to do with authoritarian lust for power.

[@da_revo5747]

@@spectacles-dm The quote about the extention of the franchise to welfare beneficiaries and women is wildly out of context. The idea is that we have extended the franchise from people who had more of a stake in the state functioning well to people who have less and less of a stake in it. It's not just a women thing. We should try to find better systems to replace democracy with and so remove the franchise from everyone equally.

[@spectacles-dm]

Wrong. Liberal democracy is a better form of government than whatever techno-fascism Thiel would prefer. His ideas aren't new but merely derivative of ideas tried by quite a few in the 20th century. They failed, because liberal democracy was better, and they'll fail again. We don't need to "remove franchise" to improve governance. In fact, quite the opposite. History provides bountiful testament that accountable government in the long run excels compared to unaccountable. Everyone who lives in a state "has a stake in state functioning." To argue that somehow some people do and others don't is to argue the famous line of Animal Farm, "Some are more equal than others," and that is an idea which has not historically found success to match the simple motto, "All men are created equal."

[@HispanusCandor]

Agreed; this is basically a wannabe journo op-ed masquerading as an informative video essay. It's like the author couldn't make it in established journalism - he seems more interested in sub count than substance - so here he is. It is well-produced, sure, but the bias is thinly veiled at best. I'm here for education, not snarky political moralizing. Been there, done with that. On the video itself... The ideas Thiel is backing via lobbying are not as unpopular as is suggested here. There is a reason that GOP candidates keep winning outside the islands of Democrat control. Being inside said liberal bubbles might make it seem otherwise. Most importantly? As OP I too take issue with mockery of progress by cynical nihilistic "progressives". Would you have been one of those mocking the Moon landings as a vanity pipedream as well? Or are you the type to wear NASA shirts and say you f*cling love science... We owe our entire civilization to ambition. Demonize it at your own peril.

[@duke3346]

I'd probably leave my own personal political opinions out of your videos...unless you wish to carve chunks off your potential audience numbers.

[@spectacles-dm]

Not sure what you mean. We like democracy and peace, and pretty sure the vast majority of our audience shares this.

[@duke3346]

@@spectacles-dm "we like peace and democracy" is possibly the single most vague statement I've ever heard. Apparently "democracy" is open to interpretation these days. But what I was getting at, was the opinions expressed relating to "the other side trying to subvert democracy" bit. All that is, is playing to a certain demographic whilst ignoring the obvious subversion on your side around Hunter being kept out of the media so as to "not effect election results" because that's democratic.

[@phanomtaxskibididoodoo]

@@duke3346 stay mad.

[@spectacles-dm]

@@duke3346 bro i do coke with hunter all the time he's literally my friend what's the problem

[@JohnSmith-co1cp]

"Excuse me, I'm going to have to ask you to keep your politics out of this political channel, thanks."

[@besmith89]

Damn, I really really wanna like your videos, but then you always turn them super-preachy about "we must save our democracy", which is nothing more than a not-so-thinly-veiled ideological dogwhistle. Your videos would be so much better if you just stopped them before you get to the nauseating, partisan, dogmatic, and uninformed regurgitation of unthought-through ideas. And btw, the USA is NOT a democracy, it's a constitutional republic with democratic norms. True, unfiltered democracy results in absolute chaos, and thus must always be tempered with the cooling elements of constitutionalism and republicanism.