Why Sainsbury's Smart Charge May TRANSFORM The EV Charging Landscape

People are constantly talking about how there aren't enough EV charging locations in the UK. And whilst that hasn't been my experience, it's clear there is a lot more infrastructure needed before everyone could transition to electric vehicles. That's what makes this announcement from Sainsbury's such a big deal. So to find out what's really going on, stick around as Dave Takes It On.
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[@user-jo3mp4nx6q]

Personally, I;m still inclined to wish for car parks to have a large number of low speed chargers as well as a few rapid chargers. Being able to guarantee some charge is better IMO than competing for the fast chargers.

[@marktownend8065]

Places where vehicles are left for several hours like residential, workplace, train station parking are most suited to slow charging. The more of them there are, the fewer people will need to use fast chargers but there's plenty of opportunity for both. A supermarket is here replicating what stores did decades ago taking over petroleum retail. This is better than that because you're refuelling while you're shopping in the place you were parking anyway and don't have to do the little loop afterwards round to the pumps.

[@bigbadthesailor5173]

I agree, for car parks you use for longer stays, but affordable rapid charging in places people already visit fixes the issues faced by those who can't destination or home charge.

[@rogerphelps9939]

Absolutely.

[@rivergladesgardenrailroad8834]

agreed

[@stephenbagwell8275]

The up to 7 kW supermarket chargers may be suitable for PHEVs

[@colingoode3702]

Anything more than home off peak rates is expensive in my book. Being able to charge at home was the reason we bought an EV for use as our local 2nd car. Haven't used a public or supermarket charger yet in 9 months.

[@dazaaw]

I’m made the same point they need to put prices undercutting their competitors just following the market also produce net zero change.

[@Joe-lb8qn]

Which means the odd annual trip that needs an "expensive" away from home charge makes little difference to your annual spend and convenience and reliability will become key differentiators for that rare charge.

[@dazaaw]

@@Joe-lb8qnI just don’t see the business model of this announcement. They need to lead the market, or else nobody will use them. Except those that have no choice. If you’re the only charger in town and you can’t charge at home. You will use the Sainsburys charger. However, as soon as a competitor enters into the market at a cheaper price, then that customer will be gone forever. And with apathy, probably will never return.

[@Joe-lb8qn]

@@dazaaw we'll see. More likely there will be vouchers eg spend £50 get £5 off a charge same as they do for petrol. And I see two modes of use. First I live nearby do my weekly shop here so my weekly charge here. Second I'm in the area on business / holiday etc and this is an easy and convenient location to find. The fact it might be £2 or £3?cheaper is neither here nor there if I've had good experience with them that where I'll go.

[@dazaaw]

@@Joe-lb8qn interesting point, it remains to be seen. It staggers me why they have to invent ways to make consumers jump through hoops though.. 🙄

[@alancobbin]

Perhaps Sainsbury’s could do a discount scheme with charging at supermarkets to all members with Nectar,that would take off massively,cheers Dave 👍😉💪

[@duncanbuchanan218]

Nectar card price war is inevitible.

[@markeh1971]

Hi, a charging price war will eventually happen. Regards Mark

[@peterpowis4145]

Great idea!!

[@tomooo2637]

One minor additional point, if all the supermarkets do this we will all know with certainty where we will find a charger when on a long journey.

[@rogerphelps9939]

But there will be inevitable queues.

[@Lewis_Standing]

They will cover the car parks with 50kw chargers - dwell time 1 HR so customers with no home charging can top up while shopping. Faster chargers will only be needed by those rushing in and out

[@pauldenney7908]

I'm not convinced, my local Tesco is 5 miles away, I go there a few times a week but I wouldn't charge there for 75p when I can charge at home for a fraction of that. The only time I would use public charging is if I'm going on a long road trip. If there is a supermarket close to a motorway I might use it rather than gueue at a motorway services. If it's a long way from the motorway I wouldn't.

[@pauldenney7908]

I should add that if I couldn't charge at home then it would be a different story, and these chargers would be very welcome. Mind you at 75p a kWh it's like owning a car that does 33 to the gallon, which is basically my old Land Rover Discovery. If I couldn't charge at home then I think that right now if cost was an issue I wouldn't replace my ICE with an EV but wait for Lecky prices to return to what they were. We have come a long way from the heady days of free charging on the electric highway, if you could find one and it worked, but not everything has been for the better.

[@foxylady1048]

As an EV driver, my wife and I regularly use the Sainsbury store at Kidlington Oxfordshire for my shopping. If they are going to put in chargers at every store, they will indeed get my attention and my support. Well done Sainsbury well done Dave.

[@danpowell5127]

Great feature but I think your numbers are out. Tesco and Morrisons don’t have that many sites, lots of the smaller stores are brand share so owned and run by others. Morrisons is 500 sites for example. Secondly, they used to be competitive on price for fuel and product but now it’s a price fixing cartel. You’d probably see the others drop to 75p but that’s it. The Sainsbury’s news is great and can only help but we’re some way from a solution outside using an open Tesla charger which is cheap and reliable. Those genie points are the worst chargers on the market, at best 50% uptime (I visit a lot of Morrisons). Keep up the great work, great to see something other than the misinformation and negativity that’s sucking the life from mainstream media.

[@gordonmcmillan4709]

Numbers may be a little misleading though. Sainsbury's has eleven locations in my city, two of them are large stores with big car parks and loads of space for chargers, the other nine are "Sainsbury's Local" with little or no car parking so no chargers there. At that 2/11 proportion there would only be about 260 Sainsbury's locations that may benefit from this.

[@rosso2017]

Exactly. I thought the same. Out of the numbers presented, I wonder how many have a car park

[@johnbaker5533]

That sounds about right the RAC say there are 313 Sainburys' petrol stations so that is more like their 'proper' outdoor large car park supermarkets.

[@therutlandflyer3184]

Good point but the proportion nationwide is better than 2/11. It’s actually 608/1424

[@johniooi3954]

600+ actual supermarkets. Sure not all will get the same number of chargers. but how often are the normal supermarket car parks get so full that they can not have 4 chargers?

[@garyhill9723]

The article in the background suggests 750 chargers at 100 sites by the end of 2024.

[@harveyschofield4619]

I agree that this is a gamechanger in terms of number of locations available as other supermarkets will have to follow suit. It will put pressure on pricing but they won't have to match Tesla as they can play the convenience card. Also, how long before the supermarkets are dominant and therefore price fixing?

[@thumper1747]

Agreed

[@AlanWilliams-su4bs]

This supermarket news is a a total game changing occurrence. Dave, I don’t think even you with your great indight could have foreseen this when you started your Blog. You are doing a great job!

[@ouethojlkjn]

I worked for the oil industry back in the late 80s and early 90s when supermarkets first started opening their own service stations. Initially it was a loss leader, but over the years the difference in price is slight and believe it or not not all diesel and petrol is the same. What you get in the supermarket for courts is the metaphorical sweeping from the floor. Of course, this doesn’t happen with electricity. And once supermarkets decide having charges as a loss leader is a better idea, there will be no more slightly cheaper fuel. In fact, if the figures don’t stack up, they’ll get rid of the stations altogether. People just think a refilling station nearby is a birthright - well over 30% of all fuel stations have closed in the last 10 years…

[@bernardcharlesworth9860]

As solar PV is under £70 per panel it would be nice if supermarkets had roof mounted panels to keep charging competitive

[@spankeyfish]

Some do. The Lidl built near me last year has a load of panels on the roof though there's space for a few more if they try. They have 3 chargers, iirc.

[@stevendavidson5808]

couldnt agree more. solar should have been done years ago. they could then charge a lot cheaper p/kw and attract new customers

[@davesound7188]

The new Sainsbury’s in Nottingham is covered in panels- must be several hundred 👍

[@Banyan314]

New planning regulations are making the provision of solar a requirement for new build commercial premises.

[@dontwastetimetoday493]

I want a Diesel pump outside the store close to the ATM

[@camlegs2423]

Ludlow Sainsbury's was designed to have a petrol station built, as part of being allowed to open a shop here. That part of the ground for the petrol station, is still not built and I have heard it won't be now. But the good news is, about 3 months ago they fitted out 8 parking stations with those rapid chargers that look like modern petrol pumps! And people are using them. Sainsbury's is on the main A49, so the word will get out and holiday folk will drop into charge, shop n pee before either visiting Ludlow or travel on their way.

[@steve-zschannel2729]

Hope this doesn't mean the 7kW Podpoint chargers which are still free at my local Sainsbury's will be ripped out anytime soon 😢

[@Lewis_Standing]

Think it will

[@GerbenWulff]

That wouldn't make much sense to me. More likely they are going to charge for it. Ultra-rapid chargers and 7 kW chargers could attract people in different circumstances.

[@johniooi3954]

Having used the one @ Harrogate, 79p kWh Kenpower & super easy to use & not hidden out of the way either at back of carpark. They are handy when shopping, if you have no home charger, as I did at that point. Add in larger stores have a cafe, so food to be had while charging. Ideal locations in big stores around the country for when on holiday or on a trip & needing a charge, better than some random carpark with no facilities. This is great news, to go with the charge hubs being built. As these complement them nicely due to the great locations. So add in other supermarkets catching on to match them & this is the winner for all EV owners. Add in pretty much every town has at least one supermarket chain. Happy days are coming.

[@tomsalmon5634]

This is an excellent point to make: "if I don't have a home charger". These people will still need to go shopping at the supermarket. I hope that this initiative helps to promote the take up of EV ownership.

[@trevorshields7347]

79p per Kwh is daytime robbery!

[@davidwilson4468]

Its the average price for public charging where I live@@trevorshields7347

[@terencereeder9830]

So about 40 miles of range cost £8,wow bargain.

[@Alan-ln3ls]

My neighbour has a large electric SUV, and when I met him recently in the Harrogate Sainsbury's I asked if he was using the new ultra-rapid chargers. He said "You must be joking - have you seen how much they cost?" He charges the car overnight in the road behind the house at off-peak rates: no footpath there, so no problem running the cable from the charge point he installed just inside the gate.

[@OldManTony]

I don’t think I’ll be using any of them, they’ll never be cheaper than home charging, and doubtful if they will be as cheap as Tesla when I’m on a trip.

[@DavidWilliams-cs5uf]

I love your refreshing optimism. It's probably too great a capital outlay for Sainsbury's initially to equip every branch with chargers; such is the nature of big business that they will first analyse the statistics as to whether it has been a commercial success at the first sites. My local Sainsbury's is one such at Alphington, Exeter...It is just off the A30, at the very bottom of the M5, ideal for travellers. The chargers have just come online and last night I walked over to see a car using one of their many " 150 kW Rapid Chargers", however, the car, a Renault was only charging at 49kW. That may have been the car's limit but in any event, any car needs to preheat its battery before taking that much current. These chargers were superior, spacious and more numerous than the compromised and inadequate ones on the M5 services and with contactless payment, I hope that they work well for the non-Tesla people on their way down to us from "upcountry" or going over the border of England into beloved Kernow (aka Cornwall) !

[@michaelleiper]

The 1,424 stores may be the number of stores in the UK. But how many of those are Sainsbury's Local - with no parking? If there's no car park, they won't be putting in chargers.

[@edward.robert]

Great video. This is great/massive news and will hopefully be a turning point.

[@rachelcarre9468]

One of the attractive things about supermarket offering charging is that they often have cafes and toilets on site.

[@davidwilson4468]

I must be the only person who never spends more than 15 minutes in a supermarket. I go in, collect what I need, pay at the self check out and leave. Maximum 15 minutes.

[@foppo101]

Then charge for 15 minutes if you want to.

[@petersimner7253]

Four x 150kw, Dual bay chargers recently installed at our local Sainsbury’s store - Kidderminster

[@peterpowis4145]

Great video! Im pretty sure our little Sainsburys in South Shropshire added 8 of these smart chargers to their car park several months ago! Surprising that our little town got them that early! I think there are 8 spaces served by 4 machines that can charge 2 cars at a time. Although when they put these in they removed the 4 free chargers....

[@jsouto77]

At free charging, everyone was for it and paying was a no go since most at this time had home charging. However, decent prices and faster chargers might actually be the thing needed for those without the ability to charge at home to get an EV.

[@maxflight777]

People who say there aren’t enough chargers fail to factor in changes !! What do I mean? Future EV’s actually charge faster than old EV’s, which reduces the predicted number of chargers required

[@PeterHartland]

I used the one nr Exeter in Aug. I heard the Exeter Services were full & my brother told me about these as he lives local. Had a coffee in the store & fully charged & stopped on the way back from a w/e in Plymouth

[@criticalbiker1273]

It won’t change the landscape when Ford, Dodge and VW are cutting manufacture and the cost of insuring an EV is going through the roof.

[@alextaylor7770]

They get together and charge 79p monopoly. They will not suddenly install 'cheap' chargers.. They will market price charging. Profit led.maybe max 15 chargers per store?.and still charge 2x price of petrol.

[@DB25k]

Thanks dave .. for that info..keep this content going...

[@MartinJonesamheuwr]

As some of the other comments have mentioned, there are only 608 stores with car parks and they would never charge at their local store while shopping. However, if they install a good amount at each store, they are sure to capture the holiday market as well as those traveling for work, who might decide to call there to buy refreshments etc. This can only be a positive, especially if other large stores do the same. Grazing is the way forward for EV's. Thanks for the update Dave

[@barryrathbone]

I pick up new Mokka e on Wednesday so this is definitely good news! Thank you for letting me know

[@dazaaw]

How have they arrived at a charging price which puts EV charging more expensive then a petrol alternative. It really doesn’t support an expansion plan when people will not use them when they can charge at home.

[@ingatestone100]

But Not everyone can charge at home all the time , cheap rate or otherwise. Okay How do they arrive at the price of Petrol at Motorway services people only use them if they’re needed..

[@dazaaw]

@@ingatestone100 yes I get that but they are clearly following prices not leading this will not generate incentives for people to seek out a charge at Sainsburys.

[@rogerphelps9939]

But in the case of EV charging there is no competition if you cannot charge at home. That puts people off buying an EV straight away. Things must change especially when all new cars must be EVs.@@ingatestone100

[@jamessmyth5949]

In my locality there's a trial scheduled which aims to charge an EV for $5. There's 200 people signed up for it. I bet if the trial is successful the price will soon go up because the government and private business are in it to make money, they've never been involved in anything with the intention of doing ordinary everyday people favours.

[@mikejsoames1996]

I just tried Sainsbury's new chargers. 79p per KWh. Discussing. They did not attempt to make a difference, they just joined the bandwagon of filling the company purses.

[@1grizzlyrizzo]

And you know what the last bit of the puzzle will be? Linking the customers loyalty card to charge sessions and then installing banks of 22kw units, I imagine it will be a sliding scale of the more you buy the less your charge session costs, more to the point earn enough points and get your overnight charges for free or even reserved slots.

[@mrxmry3264]

85 p per kWh? YIKES, at those prices driving a diesel might even be cheaper.

[@BuffaloDoctor]

So everyone will have to run out of the store halfway through their shop to avoid paying idling charges

[@rogerphelps9939]

Do you take maore than an hour for your shop?

[@BuffaloDoctor]

@@rogerphelps9939plenty of people do

[@anthonydyer3939]

As someone who can charge at home for 7.5p/kWh, the Sainsburys chargers at 10x the price are “chargers of last resort”. I’d only ever use them on a long journey if Tesla Superchargers weren’t convenient, and even so I’d charge as little as possible to get to a supercharger or home. With that in mind I do wander who would consider them to be the first choice. Someone without home charging would not be encouraged to charge here (indeed they wouldn’t be encouraged to buy an EV at all given prevailing roadside prices). I suspect the biggest customers will be company car or van drivers who have a company account for electric charging and therefore don’t care about the price.

[@Madonsteamrailways]

Well, I guess that’s a great thing!! I’ve been trying to get Sainsburys to get chargers since 2020!! So far, I have used the following: BP/M&S, Podpoint Tesco, Instavolt, Gridserve and Genie Point at my local Morrisons.

[@Roll_the_Bones]

Great news Dave, appreciate the heads-up on this, and kudos to Sainsbury for setting up the infrastructure. However, at 75p / kWh, it's a total pass for me, when I get home charging for 7.5p / kWh. The main thing is for them to get the chargers installed, the pricing can be managed thereafter. There WILL come a point, when the majority of drivers will have EVs, and it won't be as far in the future as people may think. I have absolutely no doubt that technology will improve in massive jumps, regarding batteries, and what we have now, although still great, will be considered pre-historic in 10 yrs time.

[@AlanTov]

The truth is big, coherent, strategic infrastructure projects need to be done by government. At the moment EV charging suppliers are basically just contacting grocery and coffee houses to look for outlets. That’s not good enough to meet the requirement.

[@jimmunday293]

Checked out Sainsbury’s brief and a bit dismayed they seem to be targeting the long distance traveller. Supermarkets are the perfect solution for the many who will not have off road parking for charging. I found 50kw chargers at Supermarkets plenty adequate for a good charge while doing a shop so you could have three times the bays for the same supply. As for an overnight boost to the to the EV community, Sainsbury’s say there will only be one hundred sites by the end of this year.

[@stephenbagwell8275]

The North West of England is a bit of a desert on your map of Sainbury's charging sites.

[@kburns4695]

As is the WHOLE of Scotland!!!

[@robinbettridge670]

I think you are spot on about the significance of this. One small reservation about the content: Perhaps it is worth mentioning that many cars in the winter will not be charging at 150kW, A lot of new EV owners seem to be unaware of their car's own rapid-charging limits, limited by their own car specification and particularly affected by state-of-charge and temperature. This doesn't seem to be limited to new owners either, because there are so many owners who mainly charge at home. Zap Map is full of what I can only call "ignorant" rants about "rubbish charger, only got 43kW and it says 150kW". So perhaps it should be mentioned that in winter there will be many cars which won't see the headline speed of charging. Much of the time it will be the car which is the bottleneck. The Kempower systems are very clever by being able to allocate and dynamically redistribute the power between the entire set of dispensers in 25kW chunks, so ideally more charge points can be operational from a limited grid supply, but just sometimes the dispenser may limit what the car can take (below the headline rate), but mostly it is the car's BMS limiting the charge rate into the battery pack. Personally I would be entirely happy with Sainsburys installing 2x more dispensers and calling them "charge while you shop" speeds of up to 80kW.

[@roundel52]

Sounds wonderful, but keep in mind the Sainsbury's nomenclature : 1400 stores, but only 600 supermarkets. The remainder are convenience stores. Only the supermarkets will get equipped. My local one, Crayford has 15 chargers! I also wonder whats "smart" about them? If they have Fastned style vehicle recognition, that woukd qualify, but they're not saying anything about that.

[@veronicathecow]

Nice Dave, hadn't thought about the scale of the supermarkets

[@glynmatthews2156]

There needs to be a price war because at the moment it is criminal what these public charge points get away with. I am lucky enough to do most of my charging from home but if I didn’t have that facility then running an EV is extremely expensive.

[@ouethojlkjn]

Running a petrol, diesel car is extremely expensive. And not that it helps the consumer but at the moment public charging attracts 20% VAT on top.

[@markeh1971]

Hi it basically doubles or more the fuel cost. Take care M.

[@SteveNC61]

Dave, Sainsbury’s web site says smart charge will be available in 100 locations, totalling 750 new high speed chargers. Not all sites unfortunately.

[@paulfrost3501]

Yes, that’s what I wondered. If Dave is including all the small ‘local’ high street shops instead of just the larger supermarket car parks

[@nickkitson]

And not all large Sainsbury's car parks are owned by Sainsburys - my local one is owned by the local council (and already has a GeniePoint charger) so I doubt if Sainsburys will set up their chargers there

[@lewisdillon8524]

Sorry to correct you as I love your videos. However I was charging up at Lidl on their 50kw Charger long before Tesco and the other supermarkets had them installed

[@rogerphelps9939]

Yes. I have done that.

[@johnmerriam8661]

Sainsbury's have about 600 supermarkets. The rest are convenience stores.

[@paulconnolly4483]

Thanks Dave it’s good to see what is happening in other countries. Sadly here in Australia the investment in infrastructure has not taken place so we are stuck with a local grid in many parts of Australia that can’t support rapid charging. Heck some places need diesel generators to provide 3phase 😂. We still seem to have reliability issues with the chargers and often they need apps on smartphones, yes you guessed it no decent mobile network coverage 😂 often means that you have no reception to use the app

[@StephenButlerOne]

Would t you think the out of the way chargers would have a built in network cell. E en if it's just a simple wifi login that only access their site/app

[@MrDAVIDATKIN]

It will be very good for those that can't charge at home. For the rest of us who can charge at home we'd be very unlikely to use them. Unless the supermarkets gave away a free charge with a shop of more than £50 say. Certainly won't ever pay 75p at the nearest suermarket when I can charge at home for 9p.

[@davetakesiton]

Snap but nice to have the option not to use them

[@AlanWilliams-su4bs]

I agree, but on cross country journeys there are often supermarkets on ring roads handy enough for through travellers.

[@chrisw3771]

This is a good start but of the 1424 Sainsbury's stores in the UK 770 are the 'local' stores that in many cases have no car park. There are also other branches like the Tenby Sainsbury's that has no car park (that is actually underneath the council multi story car park) They will still create a huge difference but probably at around 600 locations.

[@davetakesiton]

600 locations installing 8 chargers each (I have photos of 8 x 150 kW chargers in a Sainsbury car park sent in by a viewer) is 4,800 chargers which is 4 times the size of the Tesla supercharger network. Wd don't need them all.

[@chrisw3771]

@@davetakesiton Totally agree, it will make a huge difference. Just a bit of creative advertising as a headline. I'd like to see the government join in on lowering costs & overcharging customers as it has with petrol & diesel this morning

[@dalesimpkins2628]

This is great if you are away on a long journey, and for those that cannot have a home charger. My local Sainburys has added recently 8 of these rapid chargers. The nearby Tesco has also added 16 rapid chargers, although only 12 are operational currently. I do hope this does expand across the country as I have found since becoming an EV owner charging while away from home can be a bit hit and miss.

[@mikegipson1224]

This is good news the However only 100 sites by end of 2024... A reasonable start but need to move a bit quicker... 12 January 2024 - Sainbury's website... New research reveals that 80% of drivers admit to avoiding long journeys because of not wanting to charge at public EV charging stations, citing broken chargers (40%) as the main deterrent Almost all EV drivers surveyed (94%) said they would prefer to use just one trusted brand, with 63% saying this because they are looking for better reliability Smart Charge will have over 750 bays in more than 100 Sainsbury’s locations by the end of 2024, making it one of the UK’s top five providers of ultra-rapid EV charging

[@petersimms4982]

The roofs of the stores are enormous, plenty of room for solar panels 😮

[@bikes_camera_more]

As much as I fully appreciate the positivity of such a move by Sainsbury's and no doubt the others too, four chargers in one supermarket will be woefully inadequate. If a typical supermarket has 250 (probably more) parking spaces then the chances of finding a charger free when most do their weekly shop, Friday eve & Saturday is going to be nigh on impossible. Checkouts are often full with 4-5 queuing; self-checkouts are often worse, and there are often 30-40 checkouts. The chargers won't be any better.

[@robertbench4664]

Thanks Dave for this video but you seem to forget about those of us who use AC type 2 charging only and won't be supercharging.Also I regularly charge my Renault Zoe on 22kw AC on Tesco Podpoint chargers,so please investigate this a bit more thoroughly in future.

[@AdamAugustPhoto]

Not disagreeing with the overall nature of this, but a couple of points to note. Are those store figures taking into account the 'local' stores which often are on high streets with no parking infrastructure? Secondly, although they often do, supermarkets don't always own the land they are on. My local Tesco for instance is a leased store in a small retail park. As i say, even given these, it's still a massive boone, but maybe just not as big as the figures you mention.

[@davetakesiton]

You could be right but then maybe they install 8 chargers at half of the stores?

[@johnbaker5533]

Yeah there not be that many. Sainsbury's according to the RAC has 312 petrol stations so that is a good guide as to 'proper' supermarkets size. Looking forward to them coming though.

[@narrowboatlongpod4176]

@@johnbaker5533 apparently they have 600 supermarkets and 800 convenience stores.

[@AdamAugustPhoto]

According to WattUp: Sainsbury's are quoting 750 charging bays over 100 locations by the end of 2024. Still a significant amount of added infrastructure, especially if Tesco, Morrisons, et al follow along. One issue I see is that this move will add little to major trunk routes, which lets face it, is what is needed more than local routes. It'll mostly be beneficial for the minority who can't charge at home for whatever reason, or those who town hop rather than use motorway networks.

[@johnbaker5533]

@@narrowboatlongpod4176 I don't doubt it but some of those like where I live are in an indoor shopping centre, etc. I presumed that with a petrol station there is enough room for EV charging with an outdoor car park, flexibility to build on the land, etc. There are probably some more that could have EV charging that don't have petrol stations. So maybe suitable charging locations maybe 4-500. It is all good news though no matter how many.

[@davidkramrisch]

We are going from South Manchester in our Polestar to Kew later in the year. 12 Ultra rapid at Richmond Sainsbury’s round the corner from our hotel near Kew - Gamechanger !!!! 🎉🎉

[@peterjones6640]

This is a logical extension of the petrol forecourts that supermarkets have, and very useful if you cannot charge at home. But those who can charge at home are unlikely to rapid charge at a supermarket , because you tend to go to a supermarket which is close to your home not a 100 odd miles away. However on a long trip ( especially a leisure trip), if you are going to stop then a supermarket is a logical place to break your journey, you can charge, usually get a bite to eat, go to the toilet and pick up any snacks or other items you might need on your journey. When you are at your holiday destination ( especially if you are self catering) another reason to go to the supermarket which has rapid charging and you can do your grocery shopping. Let’s roll those chargers out supermarkets ( although my own use will be relatively limited as I can charge at home). As other people have commented can see in the future offers on your charging as supermarkets often do with vouchers on using their petrol stations.

[@grahamcook9289]

Not all of Sainsbury's 1,400 odd stores are large stores with their own dedicated carparks. Many are small with no carpark, or midsize and are accessed by a shared precinct carpark. The same is true for all supermarkets. Hotels also need more 7kW chargers for people staying overnight and 3 or 4 fast chargers for people breaking their journeys and using the hotel's facilities, toilet, cafe, restaurant. Again hotels either already have arrays of PV panels or roof space available to install PV panels.

[@paulover195]

I work for Sainsbury's so I thought I'd double check there announcement. It says they will only do 100 locations by the end of 2024. This is probably because they sold a whole load of their car parks in attempt to buy ASDA which failed.

[@anwenshahim741]

Thanks for bringing in the news ‘hot off he press’. Most of my charging is at home, but having traveled over 1k miles over the Christmas holidays , I would only use a Supermarket on a long journey if it was substantially cheaper than eg Gridserve. Over Christmas I took out a months worth of Tesla membership and managed to find a public Supercharger within 5 miles of each of our destinations. @ at around 41p/kwh it was worth the extra effort- but not at Sainsbury’s 75p/kw hr.

[@GreatBritishRailways1]

The majority of Sainsbury's outlets are Local stores many of which do not have car parks.

[@jimthornton2898]

Just imagine, canopies over the parking spaces with solar on top. Battery storage also connected. They wouldn’t only be charging cars, but also powering the whole supermarket. It’s already happening is the USA. Then some kind of loyalty scheme tied to your charging fee giving even lower charging rates. I’m sure it’s a business model that could benefit everyone. Probably quite high up front infrastructure cost, but over the medium to long term it would surely pay off.

[@solentbum]

The first Supermarket to install charge points was Waitrose , over 11 years ago. My nearest one has a rapid charger, the next nearest 4 x 7kwh chargers. My nearest Sainsbury has had four 7Kwh chargers for around 8 years, Since I charge at home I do not use them. I do use the Lidl rapid chargers some 60 miles from home on my way home from a day trip out, and almost invariably do some 'top up' shopping . It will be interesting to see what effect 'rapid chargers' at Supermarkets have , for me there is little benefit, but for those without a home charge point I can see a good market.

[@grahamemoss6262]

Our local Tesco's (Portland, Dorset)has 4 Podpoint 7kw chargers @44p/kwh and not 25p/kwh as you state.

[@davetakesiton]

Mine also are 44p now but when they first introduced charging it came in at 25p

[@prjackson7802]

Great video

[@rogerevans425]

When Tesco introduced their chargers you could often not find one free because all the Hybrid drivers plugger their cars in and then disappeared for a couple of hours, and you could see the car s were plugged-in, fully charged for a couple of hours with no sign of being moved . This will still probably still be the case at supermarket car parks that are not stand-alone and remote from other shopping/leisure faci;lities.

[@bwarey52]

You would think all the cinema companies would be jumping on the opportunity seeing as their current business model is struggling against streaming service's.

[@user-it7lf7kk8m]

Many cinemas have closed since COVID anyway. I doubt struggling businesses will want to invest a lot of money into infrastructure that will only supply a service to a few people who do not seem willing to pay for a premium service. Everyone cribs about paying over the odds for electricity ( I don't blame them) so why would the cinema spend so much money when the customers are unlikely to want to pay.elevated prices? It's the whole "why buy expensive drinks and nibbles at a cinema when you can smuggle your own cheap stuff in" argument all over again.

[@bellshooter]

Before Morrisons/Geniepoint there was Waitrose, with a free rapid charger service, 2017/18 or so. I drove 10 miles to shop a few bits and pieces, and get a 25 kWh bump, or about 90 miles in my Leaf 30. Lidl have a lot of Podpoints at their shops, at 65p....seems better to me! Don't forget that existing supermarkets will have power for old tungsten, and filament lighting, they all have LED lamps now, so they have lots of spare capability.

[@grahamcook9289]

If you have an EV today, then you almost certainly also have a 7kW EV charger at home. What the supermarkets need is rapid/super chargers for people breaking their journey to buy some takeaway food or use the supermarket cafe and toilet. Also good for locals who don't have access to a charger at home.

[@stephengowler5360]

Very interesting Dave. Competition 😊

[@shikoku14]

The Sainsburys nearest me (Halifax) has had a PodPoint charger since 2018 (at least), it’s always been free, but there is a 2.5 hour parking limit. But it’s great if you need a charge, however it split loads if both sides are plugged in so max 3kWh if two cars are plugged in. But still, it’s an oddity that they’ve never brought in a charge on the unit.

[@st200ol]

It’s free because of the 2 1/2 stay limit. Where I am before Tesco started to charge per kWh the chargers here were always blocked all day every day with the same cars charging for free so they had to introduce a cost per kWh.

[@timward2001]

Why would anyone pay 40p - 80p to charge at a supermarket when they can pay ~20p to charge at home? If if they can't charge at home, and have to pay 60p - 80p for all their charging, would they really buy an EV when a petrol car would be so much cheaper to run? BTW I simply don't believe that Sainsbury's are going to install chargers at all their shops. Try Sydney St Cambridge for example. You can't even drive to the shop, let alone park there.

[@davetakesiton]

Maybe Sainsbury will install 10 charges at half the stores. My local Sainsbury has a 300 space car park. Plus if you can salary sacrifice a Tesla for half the price of an ICE who cares about the charging price?

[@timward2001]

@@davetakesiton The salary sacrifice schemes I've seen go pear-shaped if you leave the job within three years. So perhaps not suitable for me, as I'm already past state pension age.

[@alibro7512]

For the most part only those who don't have home charging will charge while doing a supermarket shop. For many 75ppkWh is 10 times what they pay with an EV tarrif and they will be taking their shopping home anyway. Where this will make a huge difference is areas of the country where rapid chargers are not available but soon will be. Perhaps people seeing every Supermarket having multiple rapid chargers will encourage them that EV's are a viable choice for them after all.

[@garywright4233]

The Ukrainian War had a massive effect on Pod Point charging for their electricity. No free charging in Bournemouth, Poole Christchurch anymore. These Sainsbury’s chargers will be very handy if you’re travelling. Holidays ect.

[@philiptaylor7902]

Thanks for the video Dave. It’s great to see more rapid chargers getting rolled out, but until the price comes down it’s just more rip off charging.

[@thumper1747]

Very convenient for those who can’t charge at home too. I’m about to buy a BMW i3 with a 42 kWh battery and will charge it in the garage, timing the charge between midnight and 4am, but on the occasional road trip I planned to use whatever facility was available en route. This means I can target a supermarket at the other end of my journey, or along the way if convenient. Good news. I’m sure car parks will eventually have a charging facility with every single car parking space, like they do in Norway.

[@rogerphelps9939]

The idea of supermarket chargers like Tesco's was that you could offset your mileage driving to and from the supermarket while you shopped. They are destination chargers and the good thing is that you can run far more fast chargers than rapid chargers off the same power supply. Lidl have had rapid chargers for absolutely ages and with good prices too. If new entrants in the charging market are going to compete on price it hasn't happened yet and I am not holding my breath.

[@sfxx25]

I see that nobody is talking about the £75 pre auth charge on your card, this is way too much especially low income households.

[@narrowboatlongpod4176]

It was £99 last time I had to buy diesel but I imagine it's a lot more these days. Sainsbury's say it's £60, which is still a bit steep. With EVs, you can often avoid preauthorisation fees by using an RFID card or app.

[@mandismith89]

79pkwh is £61 for 200 miles in an ioniq 5 with heater on...its ridiculous

[@davetakesiton]

But Ioniq offers deal with Ionity for 30p. Any nutters you know paying 79p?

[@mandismith89]

@@davetakesiton did check this out further and those deals stopped a long time ago and it been increased now to about 55pkwh i believe if you pay a subscription cost

[@foppo101]

Taxi drivers misused the system.Free electricity and charging the same price for a fare.

[@mburgsey14]

Sorry, we are being ripped off here in the UK. I NEVER charge with any public charger if I can avoid it. Always charge overnight at home on a night tariff.

[@markwringe2826]

Very interesting, and thank you. A small word of caution on the figures - remember some of these stores are the 'local' versions which usually do not have car parks, but that in no way undermines what you're saying, as the numbers will still be very big. Sainsbury's don't have a lot of sites in Scotland - my nearest is 108 miles away, the second nearest 183 miles away. Interestingly Morrisons have not installed any chargers in any of their stores I have been in. Not even in the case of their very, very busy Fort William store where until less than a year ago there was only one old, erratic rapid (50kw) CPS charger available until Tesla opened up their 6 to non-Teslas, and two newer CPS chargers at last came on line (all of these incidentally just behind the Morrisons store). Nor have Morrison's installed any chargers in their huge car park in Inverness. My nearest Tesco (Dingwall, 82 miles) does have a podpoint rapid charger, and I do use it when I'm there. At 62p it undercuts the CPS price in Highland of 70p.

[@albertoporras04]

The main wrinkle in the price war scenario is the different types of location. I agree it will be very useful for those ev drivers who can't charge at home or at work, but for those who can charge at home, they main use of ultra-rapid charges is onwards charging on longer journeys. These drivers want chargers on or very close to the motorway/major A road network. Most supermarkets are a little way off these roads. I suspect the same pricing differential will exist as with fossil fuel, cheaper at supernarkets, much more expensive at motorway service stations.

[@davetakesiton]

Good point but if a healthy percentage of EV drivers who can’t charge at home use the supermarkets then the motorway services will be much quieter. No queues? And if the supermarkets drop prices maybe the motorway services will be forced to drop prices as well.

[@StephenButlerOne]

​@@davetakesitonthey have never dropped the price of fuel so I can't see them doing that. The service station plays on convenience and the desperate. If the services can rapid charge, then the price is worth it to the EV driver over a slower cheaper on up the road. But if you have a rapid charger 10 mins away from the motorway you'd go that over a slower more convenient one. Tbh if you're gonna be motorway driving don't get an EV. They are good for town and daily driving. The average person does about 30 miles a day. The majority of them will be fine with a small inexpensive EV. If you need to use the motorway more than once a month, steer well clear of them, more hassle than they are worth. Not to mention the electric prices are 3x that of fuel.

[@ouethojlkjn]

@@StephenButlerOne how did you figure out that electricity prices are three times as much as fuel

[@StephenButlerOne]

@@ouethojlkjn by way watching the macmaster videos, he has been competing against ice on many challenges with his own personal EV. And it looks a nightmare to do any real traveling inm . His car is costing him 60 odd quid for 200 miles on quick serve chargers. But even on the cheaper charger it's 40 quid. My car does 200 and a bit on £20. A diesel will double the cheaper price on the motorway, and treble it on the more expensive chargers. Every 200 miles he isjsving to wait up to 40mins, that is if there isn't a queue. That's why I said it was a rough guess

[@ouethojlkjn]

@@StephenButlerOne Well I am going to hazard a guess that your diesel is not a £100k Porsche supercar. So not sure exactly what the comparison is? My father in Law had a 911 Carrera 4 and on the best day of its life it would do 27mpg. It was not built for economy though. I recall that when he got it serviced, the bill was just over £1,700. I don't think though that meant my Citroen C2 was a better car or a realistic comparison.

[@v1nnyc]

Thought it would be cheaper than 75p kwh

[@darren100880]

The tesco i work for has 75kw chargers @ 0.69p per kw

[@teardowndan5364]

For a supermarket where people will be inside for 30-45 minutes, I'd rather have 20x 50kW fast-chargers (or a smarter setup where the 600kW feed can be split up anywhich way in 25-50kW chunks across 20+ dispensers) than 6x150kW ones and have to rush to avoid paying idle fees. Then you are 3X less likely to have to wait to connect and 3X less likely to pay idling fees.

[@JimT-RCT]

I suspect that the number of locations used will be considerably lower than the number quoted, but still very large numbers. In Canterbury, we have four stores, two have car parks, and only one is a large store, the other two are small enough to be able to do your shopping in 15 minutes

[@dublodave7860]

Whilst Sainsbury's are to be commended they will need to provide a decent number of charging points to make it attractive. When I was working in Saudi Arabia they passed a law (about 5 years ago) that made all new retail/commercial etc. developments have 10% of their parking spaces to have EV charging points - why can't we do this here?

[@tangerinestorm]

Used the one in Thanet a couple of weeks ago. very easy to use but quite expensive. Would be a great addition to all sainsburys stores. hopefully ASDA etc will jump on and there will be some competition to reduce the costs

[@stekeeley1936]

I recently saw a KZbin video explaining the cost wholesale of electric-ery & even tesla are charging 4xs the price...the others upto 8xs...thinking the regulations need to change...4 fold profit is obscene...8 fold,well it's got conservative written all over it.

[@peteglass3496]

Waitrose has unfortunately thrown in its lot with Shell which means they have no control of pricing. I know Shell is one of Dave's "bête noirs" and for a while I gave them benefit of the doubt, I even got enthusiastic when they were installed behind me. They were always the more expensive option but in December when I needed a couple of emergency top-ups for long trips to family I used the slow 11kW units which are now an outrageous 75p/kWh with RFID card. I'm afraid I'm joining Dave's boycott! The only amusement is the rapid charger pillar seems to have the same post-code as me and not the main supermarket!!

[@mrmawson2438]

Cheers Dave

[@jakeroadtonowhere4070]

That’s amazing news you won’t have a problem, finding the Sainsbury’s i’ve got one less than 1 mile and the next one is about 7 miles they will also be offering great deals on their charging. If you spend so much, you probably get your charging cheaper

[@amolaksinghsunnerd4999]

This sounds like a big game changer, like when supermarkets entered into fuel stations. I can envisage in future where these supermarket fuel stations could simply be replaced with charging stations too.

[@jezlawrence720]

Being able to fully charge when you shop, even when it costs more, makes the shopping experience much more like having a petrol car, but without the extra ten minutes on exit. Good news indeed.

[@steveorton2441]

Sainsbury at Bicester had 2 podpoint chargers in their multistorey car park up til last year. Then they sold the car psrk and the 1st think that happened was thr removal of the chargers in the renovation of the site. The new Sainsbury Superstore at Aylesbury had I think 4 which were free until Mer took over after the 1st year. At 7kw they aren't worth it. On the other hand since Tesco at bicester started charging they have fitted a new 50kw alongside the old 7kw podpoints. But you have to be lucky to get on it.

[@grahamcook9289]

Many supermarkets with EV chargers also have significant arrays of PV panels on their roofs.