Why Star Rail Can't Make More Shielders

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[@bamboozled_again]

they could make a sustainer that buffs hp like aventurine gives shield, would be a nice Blade buff

[@RoyalTfrii]

A preservation character that specializes in the "Quake" mechanic from sim universe would be a nice addition and could be a possible kit for a 4* preservation character

[@IPayForYouTube]

I'd like an ice character that does damage similar to "Dissociation".

[@Mewongus]

They could have at least released some 4* preservation as 4* aren't expected to perform as good as 5* tbh

[@sovyenn]

but it's hard to design a 4* preservation that is not as good as a 5* but at the same time isn't completely useless

[@ronaldverdegaal9078]

Agreed just do a trial and error with 4 stars hoyo

[@boikluber7747]

you got march 7th, the goat

[@ronaldverdegaal9078]

@@boikluber7747 new 4 star

[@NearAir]

Yeah, they just DON’T DESIGN 4 STARS

[@lillyie]

one word: aventurine dude is the definition of overloaded character. -provides teamwide shield -can deal.... chip damage so he isn't just a walking damage sponge unlike fu xuan and gepard -traces and eidolons make sure the shield stays forever there's simply no way to design more shield characters without having to powercreep the shielding monster that is aventurine

[@claudiowiseman8488]

More res eff 😂😂😂

[@Otherface]

Actually, there is, and the idea is simple: make Preservation follow the same situation as Abundance (which is doing more than what they were designed for) Take Zhongli as an example. To this day, he is the absolute best shielder in the game. However, other characters provide similiar values. Xilonen, for example, gives no shield but provides insane buffs, making her one of, if not the best geo character. Or Diona, who has a much weaker shield but provides more speed. Or Layla, who isn't called the 2nd bet shielder in the game for nothing. If Aventurine was (and is) designed to be the best shielder in the game, so be it. However, other Preservation characters could be designed with more in mind. More tunts, extra buffs, Fire MC but better (seriously, he is so fun, but he is lower than mid), and a long etc.

[@ibrahim5463]

Fire mc kit too is super good but the scaling is so bad he fails at being a sustainer

[@BrianLin-ur1gu]

Chip damage( no pun intended 😂

[@servandogomez4849]

I feel you could make a equal unit to Adventurine if like a unit sacrifice their own health to cast a shield. That way theres a higher Risk and reward to that unit that'll balance out. As for the reward for sacrificing health, that's a big question though I was thinking maybe Not to overlap on existing preservation and Harmony units would be to give them a Fei Xiao/Acheron meter to do Nihility style detonation attack for DoTs. Probably would replace Ruan Mei in DoT Teams but it would give the playstyle a shot in the arm. This is just off the cuff food for thought idea than anything really spent pondering but it has merit I think

[@epicazeroth]

I just wish they'd release a Lynx or Gallagher equivalent for Preservation.

[@chrissolace]

Honestly that’s Gepard at this point

[@JyyceKrato]

@@chrissolace its really sad fire trailblazer is literally better then him

[@naw613]

@@JyyceKratoare you on crack?

[@nicolas._.2294]

​@JyyceKrato and that's why I still use him, sometimes, on specific stages

[@227someguy]

@@JyyceKratonah, his shields are too weak. Gepard is much better at halting damage altogether.

[@silverhawkscape2677]

Simple. Because for a Shielder to be viable they have to do their job and with Adventurine they now need to help with some protection from Crowd Control. Because of that. Once you have a Viable Shielder. There isnt anything else you can do other than make the Numbers go up. Heck. Even Gepard is a Possible replacement if the enemy doesnt throw too many CC.

[@BunPrince]

Gepard is nowhere near aven's level

[@adityakharde4265]

​@@BunPrincehe becomes good when you start to get his eidolons hell my e4 gepard makes my character lea susceptible to cc now very rarely they get ccd even when I use a gepard yeah he is not good as Ave but what do you expect he is in game as standard from start

[@wingofshu]

​@@BunPrince I appreciate gepards freeze actually

[@EyesDontCry]

This is just wrong. Healers heal and cleanse, they have the exact same base requirements. The way a healer competes is just doing other stuff. Huo huo regens energy. Lingsha/gallagher break. Even lynx directs aggro. Aventurines unique mechanic is not that he gives shields or resists debuffs. That's the baseline for a good preservation character. Neither gepard or bailu have cc cleanse/resist. Fu xuan does and simply replaces shields with her own HP, but still mitigates damage. Aventurines unique mechanic is his follow ups. That's what sets him apart, he is not nearly as useful without it. All they need to do is exactly what they've been doing for healers but with preservation. Add more unique mechanics and give new characters something else that sets them apart more than just keeping the team alive and dealing with CC.

[@spyrothetimelord]

@@EyesDontCrythank you omg. I feel like a lot of people have videos and comments talking about the subject here but are missing the point. Future units need a little bit of novelty yes, but mainly will need interesting gimmicks and bonus abilities to warrant wanting them on your teams. So many people don't see that. Like yes the current sustains we have are amazing, but at some point hyv will create one that works even better with a newer dps and that will also add to the incentive. They will still need to do something to make them worth it besides that synergy though, because the sustains we have now are still great despite possibly not being the *best* to pair with future units

[@Grayewicked]

I mean... they kinda shot themselves in the foot when designing Aventurine, considering how overloaded he is for a Shielder...

[@cartoonvideos5]

He is absolutely braindead op, just like Zhongli.

[@Grayewicked]

@@cartoonvideos5 yup, and he does a lot more than he needs to.

[@sanguinetales]

@Grayewicked I think a Zhongli expy would be even more insane. Imaginary Preservation with a summon that resonates with DoT procs to deal quake damage, every time a DoT pops the shield gets 1-5% stronger(max level) Skill puts a Totem up that generates a shield Ultimate summons a meteor dealing quake damage based on the Total shield value of every member

[@TheTruth-dg5rx]

@@sanguinetaleswelt is basically Zhong dong exp

[@jerryeljeremy7790]

*Shield designs? Well:* • Barrier stacking mechanic like Argenti's barrier but stackable • Summon Shielder like Lingsha but shield • 4 stars Aventurine with no FuA refresh of course • Shared shield, like HP link in SimUni but shield

[@feeshslayer9525]

I cooked up a dot team shielder idea whose main mechanic is having an enhanced auto that can be accessed whenever a teammate has a shield and inflicts extra damage and bleed stacks, basically helping the archetype by applying more sources of dot and damage

[@abubakarboyi9766]

​@@feeshslayer9525 A Physical Shielder sounds neat, with some DoT application.

[@guystridsigne2691]

Stealth mechanic? I.e. a Preservation who can deploy fog that reduces "visibility?" Basically, there's a decreased chance of the enemy hitting the character - they "missed." Also - the HP-Link W/O a shield would be a direct buff to Blade. Just basically, your preservation unit deploys something (last 3 turns) that makes it so that all allies share incoming damage. Blade would be able to take more FUAs - basically, every 5 hits the enemies land on any ally, Blade does a FUA. DOT shielder. Has a skill taunt. Any time they are attacked, they increase the duration of DOT stacks

[@jerryeljeremy7790]

@@feeshslayer9525 Ohh and I might add: "whenever enemy attack a character with shield while X is in the field, detonates their DoT by ..%"

[@jerryeljeremy7790]

@@guystridsigne2691 Keep cooking my man

[@julioramirez8179]

The funniest thing I've seen recently is aventurine droping the entire IPC bank account on hoolay, since he attacks soo much aven does his follow up a fuck ton

[@darksplash873]

I honestly prefer shielders because they stop you from being one tap-combo'd by unlucky enemy targetting rng. Your character might be lower on hp and closer to death now, but they are still alive thanks to the shield, you can just put a new one on them, and surely they won't get targetted by everyone twice in a row... right? My solution to this would be to have some more path overlap, allowing for a double sustain comp to be meta. Have a preservation unti give you damage resist or small shields like FMC, but also make them give decent buffs or debuffs, more effective than what we have right now. Introduce a abundance character alongside them who would also heal in smaller amounts than current meta sustains, but in return maybe gives more energy compared to huohuo and/or action delay on enemies, or other things that make them worth using. You could still run these characters solo in higher risk but also higher reward teamcomps, like in break where enemies already attack infrequently, but they'd make a powerful but more stable double-sustain line. I also like sustains that are based on a condition, like aventurine giving more shields in fua teams or gallagher's ult requiring you to attack the debuffed enemies to heal. So maybe breaking an enemy could give you additional dmg resist but increase your chance to be attacked. Another way they could imitate what Fu Xuan does is making an aggro based preservation unit who also slightly heals but is tanky AF, putting dmg resist on themselves and instead of tanking teammate damage, putting a high amount of aggro on themselves or straight up taunting like FMC. There are a lot of creative ways they could experiment with Preservation and I especially like what they did with Fu Xuan, but your points are still valid. The current design-philosophy of shielders is quite limited, but that doesn't mean they can break away from that. It just means they have to be more experimental. I wouldn't like seeing aventurine 2.0 in the future and there definitely are a lot of ways to make shields work, borrowing from FMC and Fu Xuan. Maybe an extreme March 7th, applying a taunt to a teammate while giving them a massive single target shield? Or maybe not a taunt, but significantly more aggro than march gives, while giving other teammates a smaller shield. Maybe having a special type of shield that heals a portion of damage that went beyond it once it breaks, or that heals if it expires but not when it breaks. We don't need to limit heals to abundance and shields to only preservation, as showcased by Fu Xuan, it's more about the general idea of the character as you've said - mitigating damage proactively, or reversing the damage dealt by attack after the fact. edit: also, glad to see you upload this frequently again :D

[@speedcheetah1630]

Very perceptive of you. This is a great example of what could work. Just like how March's shield will heal allies in it on their turn due to one of her Eidolons. If they made an Aventurine type shield that healed when attacked they could lower the strength of the shield while also mitigating damage. This would allow for cross-path team building since you currently can't use Jingliu, Blade, or Arlan in a shield composition without a crazy strong shield as their shield becomes their HP.

[@emanyzal9813]

Best way to avoid getting one tap-combo'd is to one tap-combo your enemy before they get a turn

[@Shay_D_Mann]

Let's be real. HSR doesn't release too many sustains simply because sustain banners don't sell well relative to other types of characters.

[@liongson9431]

Wutt???? Woah

[@_Yuputka_]

Yeah, they are adding specific ones slowly. People started by thinking they needed 2 limited sustains. Now that archetypes are fleshed out, they can add sustains which buff specific archetypes

[@Otherface]

That's not the problem. The true problem is that Hsr does not reward survivability. The closest thing to it would be Simulated Universe, but that only works with very specific blessings. Everything else is a dps race, which harms you if you sacrifice too much damage for greater survivability. The only way this can be fixed is by either giving more gamemodes that don't necessarily rewards you for killing everything fast, or more characters that rewards you for survivability (ex: Furina from Hsr).

[@silverhawkscape2677]

There isnt as many things you can do with Damage Mitigation. Compared how many ways you can deal damage to an enemy.

[@Fakejordans...]

It’s really hard to balance a shielder in a turn based game where their shields can be accessed basically forever.

[@Sang_Akrobatis]

I am imagining that Preservation could punish enemies: Aventurine is an example of punishing opponents who attack allies. But then, I can propose this concept: A Break Effect Preservation character creates shield to entire party and a limited time area effect just like Ruan Mei or Huohuo but this area effect punishes the opponent who is attacking. If enemies attack characters with shield, their toughness is somehow reduced and if they get broken by this effect, apply break DMG and break effect according to the character's element and opponent being broken by this effect would have their recovery delayed once before they can truly recover. Another idea is to taunt opponents, then each times the preservation character gets hit, it will increase it's stats. It's ultimate makes it unable to lose health until some time. Every after three moves the character heals itself. Or a preservation-harmony who is always considered to have both paths. They boost Atk, DMG, Defense, and reduce DMG taken (up to 80% DMG reduction). Therefore, your characters will survive despite getting DMG numerous times.

[@sirensong1794]

i feel like they should definitely release at least a 4 star preservation that's solid but i dont expect preservation 5 stars to become any more prevalent. rn its like, one per year (not including the standard banner gepard)

[@elysiaplushie]

Aventurine ruined the preservation meta by being way too overloaded. The only thing he's missing is just debuff negation like FX, once they decided to release a unit like Aventurine who can also negate debuff there's not much point in rolling other sustains.

[@nicolbolas1092]

What about a Preservation DPS? Scaling with DEF and turning shields into damage - Quake from SU comes into mind or simply straight up consuming shields and turning them into nuke dmg.

[@ffcmobilelegends2825]

I want a preservation character that have a shared shield like from the Sundays boss and when the shield is down, it can taunt enemies for one turn as a passive (kinda meh design but with a good polishing it could work)

[@daitoushoutou]

There appear to be no new limited 5* preservation and hunt units on the horizon for 3.x Amphoreus. But of the seemingly very few new abundance and harmony units being planned for 3.x Amphoreus, a reliable source claims that a new, hithertoo unknown, quantum DoT healer, with new mechanics, will release in 3.0 or early 3.x. We shall see.

[@Poke_Leaf]

Didn’t even think about the fact that shields are considered a buff and are on a turn limit. Not sure if it’d be balanced, but I wonder how preservation characters would compare to abundance units if shields were permanent.

[@Poke_Leaf]

Also I wouldn’t be shocked to see a 5-star Preservation unit early into the 3.X updates, so it’ll be interesting to see how they compare.

[@talukita1915]

Sustain banners have been consistently performed worse than others, and there's also little reason to vertical invest into them outside of playing favorites. E2 Acheron / Feixiao / FF can roll over contents but E2 sustains basically to provide a bit more utilities. And for whales you don't even need to bring sustain because things just explode before they can even touch you / sth sth 0 cycle. The reason they still make healer over shielder is because the latter is inherently much harder to balance for both spectrums. If they make the shields not strong enough (like Pres MC) it will create gaps between for enemies to punch through / your team will die eventually, but if they make the shields too strong and consistent like Aventurine then the team will be borderline on the verge of immortal assume well built. Basically just lose lose situation.

[@darkdude1996ify]

The primary issue I think right now is that teambuilding is basically banking on you using only 1 sustain character. I feel like some Abundance characters like Huohuo and Lingsha are meant to steer people in the direction of double sustain, by making them able to act as a support or dps respectively, but in the end people just don't want that, since most team archetypes already have a core of 2 characters, be it 2 dps (FUA) or 2 supports (Break) or a mix (Topaz or Kafka for example are half dps half buffer/enabler). If we get more character that can fulfill multiple roles, or more enemies that can force this, we might see more dual-sustain comps in the future

[@spyrothetimelord]

Long reply but, I just said this on a different video for a different reason, but the thing about new characters is just that the level of utility ultimately has grown, and they need to still feel unique. A healer without a cleanse is considered bad, but all healers cleansing the same way becomes boring. So they gave Gallagher a cleanse with eidolons. They gave Huohuo a cleanse when the turn happens. Lingsha cleanses when Fuyuan attacks etc. They will have to do similarly with preservation. Eventually a "better Gepard" will come out-a preservation unit that shields on ultimate but the way it runs out or refreshes will be different (maybe it stacks the more turns/attacks a character has, or the character gets their burst quickly through means like Robin does, or perhaps they will have energy overflow like Yunli and Argenti to have emergency shields available). Maybe this new shielder will have a cleanse mechanic instead of effect resistance, because even with C6 Aventurine, sometimes those stupid aurumatons can still CC my characters. Maybe they will provide buffs because all new units have some additional utility, like HH providing energy and attack, or Fu Xuan providing crit, or Aven providing crit dmg increase. Maybe a dot focused shielder provides extra energy the more a character is hit (since that's one of HH's bonuses for dot players), or maybe they will have their own ability to add dots like their basic attack does Luka skill or when your units get hit the enemy gains the dot of the character type (whether that be the preservation character's or the shielded ally's). There are ways to continue growing the roster but I feel like most people aren't thinking about it correctly. They've been focusing on different dps units because they're introducing a lot of places dmg is considered useful, and truthfully once you have a few good sustains, you will never "need" future ones, so they can focus on the flashy dps while deciding which sustain is needed next based on upcoming content. Then they create the character and try to convince you that you need them because of their utility, because of the way they synergize with that shiny new set of dps characters they recently sold on you. Also for the record, for both types of sustains, they're considered the least necessary since most hard content (MOC zero cycle, AS action value, PF full points) uses speed tuning and enemy aggro to get things done, and almost none of those challenge runs want sustains. Harmony and nihility may have more units, but realistically every path has this. New dps characters will need a way to shine despite Acheron Firefly Feixiao (all of whom have varying usefulness for their overworld technique for example). All nihility will need some way to shine despite how great the initial 4* roster was. And we are already seeing how hard harmony units are fighting to be competitive at E0 and at low eidolon with what they can offer.

[@KudaGeatsune3821]

Funnily enough Yunli a hunt character mitigates damage better than the dedicated defense supports In her ability to draw aggro and self heal while also offering reactive damage instead of reactive support

[@eclipse5708]

Yunli's Destruction, not Hunt.

[@Dekarowski25]

It's hard to make better character than our perfect friend.

[@RinTohsaka-vm9cq]

Gepard-almost as good as limited abundance 5*'s Fu Xuan-amazing unit both as a shielder and crit support, especially at E1 with her effect res amazingly useful too Ave-an absolute beast. Crit res down on his ult, a stacking shield from his FUA and skill, effect res and some minor dmg E1-makes him pretty much fully SP positive AND gives him a party wide crit up E2-he becomes a GOD. Amazing for Feixiao, amazing for Acheron. Works with most other DPS too

[@K-dis_Boher]

as someone who skipped Aventurine and now wants to get him, I will gladly take more shielders; it's been a pain fighting the robo monkeys from Penacony without being able to properly use the shield mechanic when my best preservation option is Fu Xuan who doesn't have a shield apart from Texture of Memories LC, but that only shields herself and is otherwise unreliable as a shield

[@jacobmiller9527]

They Could Do it based of of DOTs, based off of Damage deal, One where more shields means more damage. Could even make another counter character that gains a sheild when hit. Plenty of room. All being SP friendly since DOT is taken care of with other characters, Damage is damage and counters take no SP. Heck, imagine a Imginatary preservation character who gives one character the No damage shield like March does.

[@reddos5]

Well tbh. If they create new mechanics, they can definitely make new preservation characters. Also, I think a dot based pres could work on paper.

[@ganyunyuu]

it'd be cool if they make a spirit bomb dewdrop character that'd negate and instead absorb any healing into their dewdrop and in results narrowing down the sustain options to shields, action fw/delay or weakness break

[@Carlisho]

They just need to make Preservation units do more than just shielding, Abundance units already do a lot more than healing. Make a character that shields by basic attacking instead skill points, another one that shields on a timer like lets say a Lighting Lord that provides shields. Make them shield in relation to other stats like shield scaling with speed or max hp. And of course give them buff/debuffs or damage in addition to shields.

[@sanguinetales]

I think there's some untapped potential. Imagine a Preservation that basically does what Svarog does for Clara but does it for the whole team. Let's say they have 3 charges. Every time an Ally gets targeted they physically intercept the damage with their whole body and lose one charge. They replenish charges with their ultimate as well as recover their own HP. Their DPS output relies on their Skill and Counters. Another option is someone who turns enemy Debuffs(like Bleed or something) into Thorn Shields(Damage mitigation for allies that hurt enemies on impact) the skill will "Pop the Debuff" to convert it into a shield kind of like Kafka if she was a knight of beauty. Then there's the option of making a Yunli clone whose gimick actually mitigates AoE damage making them want to be in the middle rather than the end. Another option would be good for Low HP meta teams where the less HP you have the bigger the shield becomes or it doesn't even spawn a shield unless you have 25% left and you heal some HP when it breaks.

[@someoneinasia]

imagine if they make a debuff/dot specialized shielder, if enemy hit shielded characters the enemy will get debuff/dot. basically trend LC for the whole team with way better debuffs/dots.

[@Marky-Mark1337]

A shield that negates all damage for one action, when shield gone either action advances, heal, plus 1 skill point. A specialized shield that applies the respected break effect effect. Ideas are there. they just need to be balanced

[@normalostrich6250]

They could make a really viable DOT shielder. Dot healers wouldn’t work as well since they would heal then an ally would get attack, but with shields it would work quite nicely to block the damage as it comes. Make them physical and count as bleed, give them a def down, and boom dot has a bis sustain

[@ChikyuuKun]

Aventurine is the Zhongli of HSR.

[@BrandonNguyen-jz8hl]

It’d be cool to see a DoT/Debuff sustain unit. My idea would be a Physical Preservation unit that applies team-wide shields on skill based on the unit’s DEF. And Talent could be applying a shield that stacks on top based on unit’s DEF (lower multiplier) and damage dealt on DoT procs + applying Bleed based on unit DEF on-hit. This would be an Acheron team’s BiS sustain due to the amount of debuffs applied and (current) DoT’s BiS sustain allowing for more Black Swan stacks and Kafka proc’ing the Bleeds.

[@XX-br5bn]

Any 4 stars preservation better than March would see play, even if weaker then Aventurine, as long as you give them some kind of utility tools. Why not make a preservation Lingsha, whether 4 or 5 stars. Or something like Sunday boss, where there's an amount of dmg you can block for the team, with this amount refreshing every time you weakness break an enemy

[@mrdrphdexpert]

If you play any of the trails/kiseki game (which hsr is inspired by) shields are a MUST if u need get max score for better rewards and kinda op in certain games. I think they saw that trap and really tried to diversified how they work (yet as of now daybreak/kuro has been trying to get away from that too lol)

[@cartoonvideos5]

I've been interested in trails

[@gypsyofthebard]

You raised some pretty good points, but I also want to point out how the first 5 star LC for Preservation gave Effect Hit Rate. I feel like they could do some interesting stuff in terms of damage mitigation by leaning more into Debuffs such as how March was intended to freeze/stall enemies with her ult. For another example one of Sampo's Traces has it so enemies affected by Windshear do less damage to him. Apply that same concept and make a party wide effect. Thinking of Debuffs it does remind me of Taunt and how it ends up not being very good on the Fire MC. I'd say there's two reasons it isn't very good. First is that it only lasts 1 turn and the second reason is that the damage reduction tied to it also only lasts one turn. If the taunt lasts 2 turns it'd be infinitely better and he'd be able to cycle between basic and Skill much smoother, albeit even then he'd still consume far too much SP compared to most sustains. I do understand why the DR is a Buff that lasts 1 turn to lean more into the "Parry" concept of it since while it is active he effectively takes -2 damage. Still though since it's a Skill and not an ultimate trying to actually "Parry" with it is clunky. Of course that's not the only reason I'd say Fire MC is bad. Sadly the other part is his Shielding. The shielding definitely suffers a lot from low numbers, and they kind of have to be low due to how they're applied in order to not be broken. Literally any action they take grants a shield. Adventurine also gets shields consistently, but keep in mind that it is at least more conditional and there are moments where it isn't able to be refreshed as easily. Some enemies focus on single target attacks and that doesn't give Adventurine many stacks on the passive which can make it much easier for enemies to break through it and the Ult can sometimes Bust and not give enough stacks so it's a lot less consistent. He also has small parts of his kit that just don't make too much sense such as the random self-healing, an AOE ultimate, and Enhanced Basic Attacks which don't really contribute to any form of defense. Some people just straight up build him as a sub-DPS due to the later two and it's pretty easy to forget he even has self-healing. Honestly talking about all his little issues and why they exist can lead into an interesting writing prompt on redesigning him to be a more cohesive design. I'd love to see Red's take on that

[@colorfulcookie8961]

I once attempt to Design a Preservation kit, but it also have damage to them, then I realize it fall into Destruction more. If anyone want to have a read I will commented it.

[@colorfulcookie8961]

I just read my old ass kit, and I also realize it broken as hell

[@nidlezgamez]

I don't like heal, because it requires more tanky stats on other characters to prevent one shots, while shields require only one unit built to tank all damage

[@animesquish4314]

How about a preservation unit that reflects the damage directed at allies for three turns? And make it a tall female model so it's very marketable.

[@Avidz26]

I just talked about this with my friends and you upload this video, what a perfect timing

[@lucianof9080]

honestly, if we consider the amount of mediocre 4 star dps characters, i don't mind having a 4 star preservation character as long as it can preserve me better than March and Trailblazer.

[@MeneTekelFares]

Strongly disagree, there are endless kit options for shielders right now, Hoyo just need to want to make them. Just to name a few: a character who can generate a pool-shield, like the one we get during Sunday boss fight// A character who gives every teammate smaller personal shields that buff or heal their targets when broken or expired// A character with a more persistant Taunt + a shield generating summon // A Fu Xuan-like character that sacrifices own health to provide shields for the team and then heals by leeching health from enemies // A Quake-enabler that can let allies turn shields into damage and enable teams with multiple Preservations, etc. The possibilities are quite literally infinite, just like in all of the other paths, Hoyo just need to stop pigeonholing themselves into stale metas by focusing on very few mechanics/playstyles at a time.

[@ottersaurus]

I think the way to go from here is right in the SU. We still don’t have Quake and Dew on preservation and abundance units yet.

[@fufu-jh]

preservation units are unique and very important ofc will take forever for a new to be released. we aint geting a new one next few patches for sure, maybe after 3.0 they will drop one from the new world. so far been like this, we started with march and gepard who is from 1st world, then we got fu xuan, and last we got aventurine in penacony, it make sense if you ask me

[@keve5534]

Enemy design and their preference for damage shot them in the foot here. The enemies do to much for teams to not have some defense or healing but because characters were made more potent and diverse in dmg it meant enemies had to match up to keep it a challenge. Enemies are faster now too so just being kinda fast isn't enough to ignore a fight. To be worthwhile they both need to protect against some bs dmg usually aoe and provide another path benefit. Geoard is left behind because he at best is pres/nil. Fuxaun and adventurine are both pres/harmony with fuxain also providing healing. If they released more preservation during 1.0 then they'd have a bit more tested space between Fu and adventurine.

[@3kxi761]

Theyve really been experimenting with zones recently for harmony characters, so that the buffs they provide are based on the harmony character's turns and not any faster units, so why not have something like that for shields? Additionally, the shields from the sunday bossfight are very unique in that they support the whole party rather than a single unit each so maybe they could apply that concept to a character instead of just one bossfight.

[@lokrj]

I think they made Aventurine a tad bit too busted. Especially in FUA team with Feixiao and Topaz, that comp is immortal

[@marshallwhite202]

Agreed. I want to get him to complete my fua team cuz luocha doesnt cut it for me in moc 12 anymore but with sunday and fugue coming in 2.7 i just might have to skip him again

[@Tanuki-Sama]

They just need a DoT shielder to work for that niche 😂

[@cartoonvideos5]

Yes, you can beat the entire game while sleeping with this team. It plays perfectly in auto 😂

[@lokrj]

​@@marshallwhite202It's the opposite for me, have anyone else except Feixiao. I was really lucky to get Kafka with her lc and Robin in a single patch. I figured Feixiao was just a luxury pull because i already have a well-built Ratio, but after using her from my friend's list and watching youtube runs, she's just so much more comfier to use. The constant FUA in her team is just pure dopamine rush.

[@sct77]

Nah he still struggles with debuffs and cc. He looks op because he's the only up to date preservation unit.

[@SyverX]

Preservation is the reason why Deff-Stats und Substats have almost no Value. Because not many Chars uses them efficiently.

[@ThallesTales]

They keep making these Shielders OPs and end up leaving any healer obsolete.

[@shirousagiexe]

Yeah they can. By scaling specific element types vs standard shields, then releasing shielders of specific element types. Which i assume they're going to do in the future just like every other rpg gacha game.

[@variareaver4658]

The thing with preservation and the way sustain works in general is how they designed sustain at base game and how they designed sustain now. How do enemies threaten you in current game? Half shot you constantly. Mostly caused by the fact that sustains can super easily sustain you if damage is low because healing numbers are far too high. The way the game presents sustain to you in base game is for you to run “sub-tank” characters like almost every Dest unit including Blade and Hunt attempt to avoid further damage through aggro down. The tank or aggro setter role was pointless as a whole as well as early versions of the sub-dps role or breaker role. A lot of the mistakes in 1.0/Beta like healing numbers, the completely unbalanced state of pure supports (mostly harmonies), the SP system, harmony imbalance locking out the sub-dps role from existing for a long while, weakness break as a mechanic not being good, off-handed debuffs being ineffective, and having little reason to hold ults, are every reason why they pivoted to a completely different game almost immediately. So why does this matter to preservation specifically. Lack of using targeting as a strength. Lack of using a strong body as a strength. Lack of using off-handed debuffs like freeze to leverage enemy damage. The low SP system locking out the preservation units from using their skills to defend. Uptime being an issue Breaker sub-role was underutilized and weakness break is a weak mechanic. Sub-dps doesn’t matter because buffing the hypercarry was the best thing to do at the time. These are all the things they wanted preservation to do and failed. Now the path identity is completely incapable of pulling something together without being a +SP Utility laden heavy sustain that can deal with the game’s current damage and pace with what was supposed to be a limited resource. Oh btw The basic team design intended in early star rail was supposed to be dps dps support/dps sustain with one of the dps usually carrying a sub-dps or sub-tank role, but that has less to do with Pres and more with why every base game dps is hot garbage and why the SP system is kind of bad.

[@rizkyhidayat147]

I start playing HSR at 2.2 after knowing the game i really want Aventurine even though i pulled for Fu Xuan back in 2.2 Sometimes i forgot to use Fu Xuan skill and the team died instances 😂 and not to talk about DoT type enemy like Sunday goons or Doggy, Fu Xuan really dried fast Especially after some enemy that can give you CC like Cocolia freeze and Kafka Dominate 😅 Meanwhile aventurine doesn't have problem tanking those DoT and CC with that high res and can fully use basic attack if played right as skill point battery (or kinda lucky getting high number in ultimate)

[@frostboi77]

we shd have a shielder who's shield depends on their turns, like Ruan Mei n Huohuo n Asta

[@kawaiimika7974]

Yeah they're shot themselves in a foot with Aventurine. He's too good. The only thing they can do is make a preservation buffer 😭

[@greenvega]

That's just e1 fuxuan with 12%cr and 40% cdmg

[@Nevwermore]

They should change how shield works, like instead of absorbing 100% of damage reduce it to absorb 60 - 70% of incoming damage.

[@o0ugi860]

They can't nerf characters. Like at all.

[@TwoToo_]

dont worry we're getting finality and remembrance sustains soon, one path will make you take 0 dmg, accumulate it over time cut it by a % to make the team tanky, and just kill you when it exceeds your health pool + dps that needs to be full health at all times or must not take dmg like yanching will either win or instantly die. and the other path will already know you died but will bring the units back and give em a bit of shield or something to protect against the upcoming damage. trust me, zero cope in this comment, my uncle is character developer at hoyoverse inc. first design works cause you survive if you eliminate the threat, the other works cause you are saving yourself before you take dmg. both are the same but both are different. such magic right?

[@Nevio1810]

Please Mihoyo, for the Sake of Fu Xuan vs Aventurine wars, Release a new Preservation😭😭

[@joshuaqwertyx]

Basically 3 shield characters is absurd

[@markmatthews2391]

I think they should experiment with adding different properties to shielded units

[@ibrahim5463]

Preservation MC is the definition of a good kit but bad numbers, he is aventurine before aventurine before was a thing but is held back by the poor scaling on sheilds(6.2% of def at lvl 11)

[@MichaelKing015]

Just wait till an enemy removes shields y'all gonna pull for an abundance characters

[@alfianfaudzi4097]

Whats make Preservation characters hard to design is the scalling percentage of shield, flexibility without eidolon (to 4*), and uptime for shield itself Aventurine fullfill all of that 3 things, make him less gets powercrept or maybe never get one, even his eidolons make him better. If want some combination of mechanic, just add healing if shield broken after getting hit (heals scalling with total shield receive), reflect dmg if have shield, reflect debuff if enemy already hv one, absolute resist for one character onfield, hp convert to shield for targeted ally (only work for blade, maybe), gets speed up if shielded character gets hit, summon like lingsha but getting shield instead, etc. Devs can actually make all of that, IF that character not much more broken or barely unuseable without eidolons, and of course 3 things I mention before

[@MF_Floppa]

just a easy path to fix brah, how about character that shield only during when enemies aren't broken, aoe shielder thats acts like huohuo, hp boost character like fu xuan but it benefits blade and jingliu, march7th/jade shielder that gives more shields the more the character attacks/more amount of enemies it attacks, hanya type shielder where they place down the burden thingy and if the allay attack they gain a shield, they could just make the trailblazer sheilder but make one thats faster, shields that scale of ef res or ef res distributors, nihilidy/preservation fusions where if the character gets hit they apply debuffs or remove buffs, how about the argent type shielder that the more energy the character accumulated the bigger shields it provides, maybe a shielder that synergises with sparkle for every skill point team consumes they gain one shield, maybe a mono shilder where they provide shields only to characters where there's at least 2 of the same element

[@Sunrose-]

Aventurine is probably a bit overtuned to be honest. I got Luocha literally the patch before him and Aventurine almost immediately eclipsed him. It’s hard to justify using anyone else in the sustain spot unless they offer something team-specific like Gallagher’s break effect because Aventurine just kinda does it all

[@dedifer2]

We need more conservation characters

[@harukazi5154]

They should release another preservation character with counter like March 7th.

[@yoloroki1329]

make a character that if shield hit apply s debuff or deals a set amount of damage based on the shield amount or make the shielded character have ther crit increesed or just straight up dmg buff. ther is a lot of ways to make shield characters (basicly adventurine)

[@technicallygood4620]

I think this is just a failing of creativity. There's lots of room for interesting preservation guys, not all of which have to be shielders, but there's a lot. Full-on situational damage negation is one option, basically super-shields like Record from the Sky. I could this as a Svarog/Clara alt where Svarog uses the hand units to protect allies. Maybe a Fu-Xuan style unit that can give themselves shield for every active unit, and then whenever allies take damage they take that much damage too and heal the ally by that much, maybe with a teamwide buff based on HP lost. Basically a Blade-buddy. A DoT Preservation with a built-in Trend effect would be cool, too. Maybe they have a unique DoT status a-la Black Swan that, when triggered, gives all allies a shield based on the damage dealt with their status. Maybe they can also spread other random DoT whenever they apply their own effect, too. This also means that Kafka's Detonation can make shields, too. I could also see an Elation-themed preservation character that makes small, easily-breakable shields, reduces damage taken by an attack that breaks a shield, and does break damage to enemies based when a shield is broken based on the shield-ee's stats. Put a small break effect boost for all allies on it and you have a good break team shielder that can bring the break application sky-high. I could also see a premium March 7th style shielder (both Preservation and Hunt March). Could be someone whos a body guard for flavor, their special selects an ally to be their client. The client has a 100% taunt and gains a shield automatically at the start of bodyguard's turn while the effect lasts, whenever they attack or get hit the bodyguard does a FuA, and while they're shielded they add a portion of the bodyguard's defense to their attack stat. This is perfect for someone who wants to be hit a lot like Clara or Yunli, has good FuA potential, and has a nice damage boost.

[@HeavenOnHigh]

There are only like 2 that work well, aventurine because of constant aoe shild who will make healers obsolete. And fu who will take a portion of the dmg dealt to outhers and heal them and herself. Not much some could do, especially wen nearly every new enemy, normal, elite or boss only dos like AOE dmg with makes tount or covering early impossible. And "higher chance of getting targeted" is a bad joke, I have gepard and he's weapon, and robin still gets attacked 7/10 times.

[@promc2890]

Aventurine is HIM simple as that Good thing he is my favorite character in the game outside of gameplay as well.

[@MythoricGaming]

if there's a way to suggest characters to hoyo, i have a fully planned 4* preservation kit about losing hp to give the team shields

[@mazhermehdi8793]

I mean they need to put high dmg enemies so that we need preservation and stuff the bosses these days are so weak istg

[@SYMgenshin]

Aventurine is definitely overtuned

[@jakeail1995]

i don't think the problem is with design shielder is hard, there is lot of idea and way to do it without break the game or trivialize the game but the problem is from the lack content needed that strong of a shielder char yet, basically there is currently no need or high demand for shielder so mhy just don't release them more often, and saving shielder idea when the game shift with new system and new meta would be better. It would be kinda dumb of releasing a bunch of shielder while there is no need for 2nd or even 3rd one for most players acc then dry up their idea when new meta and system drop. It just easier to not release shielder or general preservation as whole often until there is a need to in the future, it would make everything down the line easier, no worry of overlap with already existing shielder + have bunch of ideas to choose from and more chances to have better sale of preservation char while trying to avoid powercreep on preservation char

[@multibubbled-il2bp]

I think you are falling into a trap of over-defining what a preservation unit is. I mean as they are now preservation units "are" shielders, but Fu Xuan provides 0 shields. You can make characters that mitigate damage and provide some amount of healing, like Fu Xuan. In addition, the single sustain meta is currently driven by the game's endgame all being dps races - but you can fit in extra sustains if their sustain is not their primary purpose. As an example, a shielder that buffs your team whenever their shield takes a hit, but has a weak shield. If their buff is adequate, then you can run a healer WITH your shielder. The shielder in this comp would serve as a buffer with an added utility of a small shield protecting against oneshots allowing your DPS characters to more confidently run less hp/def. Alternatively, you can make a character that provides buffs to characters while their shield is active. Or provide a character that gives other units the opportunity to do quake damage. If the only thing your character does is keep other characters alive, then theres only so mane ways to do that. But if you spread out their utility, then you can create plenty. I actually think hoyo is making so many more abundance characters because they feel that preservation is too prized by the community. The characters are TOO good, and they want more healers in the meta, at least for some time.

[@joshuaqwertyx]

Bro make more genshin video. That game has so much more dynamic

[@JustSkii]

i have a strong believe its just going to be the same thing as genshin, they added zhongli quite early into the game being the best shielder, making dying impossible, after that they released very little shielders compared to other types of characters, and most of these are quite bad. They completly abandoned giving us any shielders yet zhongli always was the most popular pick, so they decided to instead make healing better by adding furina, pretty much the best unit in the game, the only catch is you have to use healing with her so shielding is of no use. I assume by the time we get abudance based planet and with it an abudance trailblazer, healing will be the superior type of sustain in general

[@cartoonvideos5]

Aventurine makes the game braindead. You can auto everything. Topaz and him turn HSR into an idle game.