Why The FIA Banned 6-Wheeled F1 Cars

Unless it's a Reliant Robin or broken, cars tend to have 4 wheels, and the same goes for F1 cars... 99% of the time. Jump back to the late 70s and Tyrrell unveiled it's P34, the first "6-wheeler" F1 car, and caused a storm with the potentials this new innovation could unlock.
It wasn't long before it was banned, but this didn't stop other teams trying to find loopholes though, and in the 6th episode of Banned, Jake Boxall-Legge take a look at 3 times we saw 6-wheeled F1 cars, both on the track and behind closed doors.
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[@masrisyal8714]

Manufacturer : "we're going to make tons of innovations" FIA : "this is car racing, not a science fair"

[@Fatmouse25]

I'm sorry? - Toto

[@thethirdman225]

Seriously, SMH. F1 would not exist today if there were no rules. Furthermore, what do you think innovation is? Why do you think Red Bull is so far ahead of everyone else?

[@matthewbourne75]

I’d love to know what a modern F1 car would be like had there been no restrictions on innovation.

[@joaopedrosambatti2474]

@@VarianteMobile and probably enough driver aids that there's no way the driver can mess up

[@dyslexofficial2798]

See... Porsche 919 Hybrid Evo I only say this because im sure they would cover up the wheels to clean up the air.

[@alieffauzanrizky7202]

Redbull X2010 is a good exampke of that

[@AbrahamArthemius]

Well that's Can-Am in general. There's no real restrictions in its early years.

[@chadchadison2591]

*Red bull x2010 and x2014

[@nidharshanprabu5535]

An Era where innovation was very mechanical and raw. Every car had an unique identity and speciality in the technology.

[@gokartbob6478]

I bought and built the Tamiya 1:12 scale Elf 6 wheeler MODEL in the 70s, I still have it today.

[@Troy05]

I brought one earlier in the year

[@Parassassin]

Troy Hack where did you bring it from 🤪

[@Troy05]

Rob Adams got it of eBay

[@bikezonly]

Am currently building the 1/20 scale Tyrell P34. Even the model’s complex, what more the real car!

[@cschnauz]

Great model, I put together the Tamiya 1/20th scale a long time ago. Good times

[@nestoNESTOnesto]

I would like to see Mercedes'es double pit stop with 6 or even 8 wheels :-D :-D

[@xXxjayceexXx]

Merc would double stack them

[@adrianpenate5302]

I would like to have seen Mercedes' Germany 2019 pit stop with Hamilton, had the car had 6 wheels 😂

[@MrSupercar55]

Changing the tyres on a 6 wheeler? Fuck that for a laugh!

[@thethirdman225]

😂😂😂

[@RedCometXIII]

The Tyrell Project 34 is one of my all time favorite race cars. I love the innovation that car represented along with being so outrageous. I'd love to see a modern take on the 6 wheeler.

[@alexzanderroberts995]

It was really go for being a first year too.

[@jeffcanyafixiy]

Legend has it... That the initial performance of the p34 in 76 put some of the teams back on their heels. Ferrari reportedly negotiated and purchased all of the production time from Goodyear that manufactured the 10" front tires. Thus destroying any future development for upcoming 77 season. So Tyrell had to run 1976 tires on the front and 1977 tires on the back. They could never get the car to handle again even after moving the front tires out 6" on both sides, destroying the drag reduction altogether. Legend has it,,, Ferrari being unscrupulous.

[@andrew-rn9ui]

Idk if it was ferarri but someone in another video was saying every single car had battery failures or something like that over a weekend like to the point where it was a ridiculous amount and they all died and it just seemed really suspicious it happened last year I believe and I think it might have been Honda?

[@bicyclist2]

I love the Tyrell P34. This was very interesting. Thank you.

[@SONICX1027]

It would be amazing to see modern F1 cars with 6-8 wheels. I know I love Cyber Formula, but it would be cool to see

[@hachiroku7999]

I mean, imagine seeing an actual HG Stil on the track. A literal motorcycle with training wheels. That would be cool

[@a_yan6581]

Imagine if all 20 cars that are currently in the grid had 6 wheels, pitstops would be a nightmare for the pitcrews. Though it wouldn't be that big of an issue for the RB pitcrew

[@alieffauzanrizky7202]

Remind me of a joke from somewhere about the tyrell that went "I have no grip on the front, okay which front?"

[@dr2stroke611]

the good old days of innovation in F1 , alas gone but not quite forgotten

[@007KIMITANO]

Bono my middle left is dead.

[@jonskhag]

bono my car is dead

[@thatlithuanianboi6812]

Bono my diff is dead

[@scottl.1568]

Those small front tires are just too cute...

[@realjonmandude]

Huge fan of the Tyrrell P34. I race slot cars for fun and have a large collection of them. There was 1/32 slot car versions made in Spain and Mexico in the late 70's. I have well over a dozen, all different, a couple worth serious coin, like the Banco Occidental version. Scalextric also did a few versions of the March (I have 3). The Williams was never created as a slot car, although one enthusiast did make his own. Two years ago, Scalextric did a new box set of the Belgian Grand Prix winners

[@zachlee7945]

3:38 i thought i had another tab open

[@andrewbailey7999]

Ngl, I wanted to listen to that part properly

[@PescaraProductions]

Often thought to only exist within F1, 6 wheeled racing cars even appeared in Autograss and GP Midgets. They're seriously worth a look if you can find them, they're awesome home built specials (also the 6 wheel ban should be lifted in F1)

[@vaska00762]

Traction Control? That's a banned technology that you find on most road cars. Same with launch control.

[@bmstylee]

Active suspension and 4 wheel steering as well. F1 seems to be going backwards in the tech game. Especially if they want to argue it will transfer to road cars. WEC seems more relevant to road cars. And is more interesting to watch.

[@vaska00762]

@@bmstylee 4 wheel steering was already in their previous video. kzbin.info/www/bejne/mXvJZaNjlNKgm8U

[@andrewbailey7999]

Trying to keep up with modern pit stop times with a 6 wheeled car would certainly be interesting...

[@javiervasquez29]

There smaller

[@danialnoble6346]

I loved 6 wheeled vehicles.

[@bmstylee]

BANNED!!!!!!!!!!

[@DavidGarcia-oi5nt]

ILLEGAAAL

[@DeepPastry]

That Tyrell car got third place... In its first year, it was on the podium. Varying success? Try a huge success that was probably taken out by having GoodYear tire stop working on it.

[@jan__itor]

Flexing front wings would be a great topic for this series

[@elmadi7391]

Thank you for sharing 🙏

[@scottl.1568]

The legend of the Tyrrell-Ford P34 will never die!!!

[@TheCymbalProject]

"an argument which the FIA, naturally, disagreed with..." F1's entire governing body history explained in 5 seconds... lol

[@knightofthenine3121]

More like "if Ferrari doesnt like it, SHUT IT DOWN"

[@Lazbotable]

Ferrari International Assistance

[@brandonripley7783]

Love your videos autosport ♥️

[@Duschbag]

Since it has just been banned by our friends at the F.I.A., I'd like to know more about Mercedes Dual Axis Steering or "DAS" system. How much did it assist in Tire warming during a Safety Car Period and resulting rolling restarts..? Why was it banned so quickly..? And on another note The Renault Spring Damper system of years past was internal and hidden from view. It worked so well that the FIA banned it when I reguard it as a SPECTACULARLY EFFECTIVE SAFETY DEVICE.

[@korbendallas3661]

I got a crazy and ambitious idea; What about a 4 wheeled F1 car with the 2 forward tires and axles in the nose spread out just enough.....(here's the kicker) with a 3 dimensional axis in the front maybe the rear as well?? I doubt the F1 rulebook has thought of that.

[@benkirby]

a good autosport video not seen a good one in a while

[@FlyBoyGrounded]

My understanding has always been that there was no ban on 4 wheel drive cars but rather there was a restriction introduced very late for the start of the 1982 season on the number of tyres that constituted a "full car set" to four tyres meaning that Williams could build their car but they couldn't shoe it.

[@andymiles5156]

I loved the March Ford Scalextric car as a boy, it was always the best at staying on the track.

[@wheelie2701]

I agree it was. But the bigger rear wheels on the JPS Lotus in the twin pack from Argos was miles quicker on a long straight. So I never raced anyone unless the start line was close to the twisties.

[@chadchadison2591]

Forget v10 bring back 6 wheelers

[@richardpare3538]

One of the biggest problems for Tyrell with the small front tires was the available bearing grease - it gave up too easily , destroying the front bearings.

[@ArshedNabeel]

Weren't there tyre-change pit-stops back then? Wouldn't 6 wheels be an instant disadvantage during pit-stops?

[@cigmorfil4101]

As the wheels are changed in parallel in F1, just have a larger pit crew to handle the wheels. That said, the close proximity of the pairs of wheels on each side would make it extremely difficult for 6 men to be side by side and working on each side.

[@alexzanderroberts995]

This was before the planned pitstop. At this time it was more important to just drive.

[@RobBon12]

Well, thanks for absolutely NOT explaining why the FIA banned the 6 wheeler. You covered the pro-cons of the cars themselves well, but I want to know why the ban. Guess I find another video and hopefully not with a clickbait title.

[@Mr._Issu_Fresh]

I paused at 3:45 I thought something is interrupting the video. LOL

[@DeltaDS]

same

[@geoffnelson4777]

You didn't show the Ferrari which had four wheels in the rear - but they were side by side, not as shown in the March and Williams.

[@rogerhinman5427]

I was a senior in high school when the Tyrrell 6-wheeler made it's debut. I thought it was a cool and different looking machine. I still do though I like March's idea better.

[@Duke_of_Lorraine]

If 4-wheels drive are banned... double down and put 6 rear wheels !

[@Doug_in_NC]

Even though the March didn’t make it to the grid, there was a Scalextric model made and sold - I had one as a kid.

[@butchcassidy3373]

This was one of my favorite cars when I was a kid. I still have a Hot wheels six wheeler F1 car from those forty odd years ago.

[@gunshipzeroone3546]

I thought your video went into hay wire mode at 3.38 I thought w.t.f lol and then oh ok.

[@PLZFrosty]

I'd love to know how RedBull got away with that Flexi-wing

[@WideAwakeViking]

If you haven't already, on the "banned" series, how about the infamous Brabham BT46B fan car and the Chapperal 2J?

[@EyesOfByes]

I remember as a 7 yearold watching that Anime with the 8-wheeled racecar. Can't remember the name of that show 🙂

[@nikisepps]

Cpx Cyber Formula. It's a late 90s early 2000s anime.

[@ulysse21]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/oImtlHqthdKcgLs

[@EyesOfByes]

@@ulysse21 Thank you so much ☺️☺️☺️☺️☺️☺️

[@ulysse21]

@@EyesOfByes You're welcome !

[@leonardoaraujo8364]

I would like to know why FIA banned. What was The oficial technical issue FIA started?

[@justinreynolds2235]

It was banned in for 1983 onwards, mainly due to the ongoing war between the Manufacturers and Privateers. Along with ground effect, the manufacturer teams see it as a way for the privateers to gain an advantage through innovation instead of engineering better engines. The whole subject, the FISA-FOCA war (also known as FIASCO!) is interesting history for F1!

[@leonardoaraujo8364]

@@justinreynolds2235 Thanks!!!!!!

[@bynumjimmy]

Original Silver Arrows, on occasion, had 6 wheels (dual rears). Thanks for another great video.

[@DavidSmith-vz2hd]

brabhams had a huge fan on the back that gave enourmous downloaded and it won but Chapman and others objected and it was banned the idea was first tried by Jim hall and chapperal but the can am series banned it but downloaded will win

[@bmstylee]

These were cool days in f1. But it looks like any performance gained the extra weight seems like it would offset it.

[@julemandenudengaver4580]

When everyone could start a team, and cars didn't look like everyone else

[@alexzanderroberts995]

That's what a lot of people thought, but it got 3rd and 4th place in it's first year.

[@KingofFray]

If I have money and knowledge, I want to build an 8-wheeled open-wheel race car with a fan from Brabham BT46. A mass damper from Renault R26 and 8-wheel drive technology which 4 wheels at the front will be using electrical motors, like formula e, and four wheels at the back will be using normal V6 or V4 engine

[@thesciencesphere4273]

Good ol 6 wheelers looked pretty good ngl

[@nukehell3771]

You know what would be expensive, maybe dangerous, but Very cool? A competition similar to F1, but with no restricions on the car designs.

[@acr21957]

Always wondered what happened to it😊

[@baeruuttehei1393]

I once read there were attempts to built an 8 wheeler F1 car, Ferrari maybe? Any news on that would be greatly apreciated!

[@nickwyatt3243]

You have pricked my memory. I think I recall in the late 60s an article in Autosport magazine that reported that someone had abandoned their 8 wheel racing car project. I seem to recall that it would have used 10 inch Mini wheels and was possibly gas-turbine powered (?) It was a long time ago, but I think that was the case.

[@MarkAtkin]

Did you answer the question of WHY the FIA banned 6 wheel cars?

[@alexzanderroberts995]

Cause they wanna

[@brianvogt8125]

Yes, at 7:12 - because "the teams" (FOCA) unanimously requested the ban. Why FOCA did so is beyond the scope of this question, although Patrick Head reported at the time that they thought it would drive up costs and cause chaos during pitstops. (When observing a modern 2-second tyre change, consider adding 6 more mechanics to that scrum).

[@alexzanderroberts995]

@@brianvogt8125 just get 2 guys who are left handed and 2 guys who are right handed to work near each other.

[@brianvogt8125]

@@alexzanderroberts995 - It can sometimes be a problem, but is an advantage with F1 wheel changes - see kzbin.info/www/bejne/l3m2hqNtoth2f6c in slow motion. (I've corrected my previous post because each wheel needs 3 mechanics, not 1).

[@alexzanderroberts995]

@@brianvogt8125 ohhhh thanks

[@cynicalfella]

Yeah cool, but when was it banned?

[@brianvogt8125]

Late 1982 or early 1983, while Patrick Head was developing the 6-wheeled FW08B.

[@karlosh2422]

Surely Merc are the Great Grandchild of Tyrrell , (Maybe Great Great if Honda is slipped in) not "Great Great Great" as the graphic at 8:14 indicates ? Yes , I'm a pendant (sorry) !!! 😀

[@VenatorRobotics]

Nice video, but it doesn't really answer the question in the video title. Interesting history about the advantages and problems of the 6-wheel designs, but I don't think there is any point when you state the FIA's reasoning for the ban. Reminds me of a student's essay that discusses all the context of the issue but doesn't actually give a conclusion.

[@oliviersavard8676]

Where's the six-wheeled Ferrari?

[@blackbirdsr71]

Yes,I was hoping for a mention of that. The pre-war dual wheel cars also..

[@UnknownIdaho]

I was really excited as a fan when the six wheelers came out, disgusted when further development stopped, stopped watching races. Maybe the fans should be considered in such rules banning 6-wheeled cars when there really isn't a safety issue.

[@foraminuteforaminute4056]

I say they should compromise and try a five-wheeled design.

[@user-ns7tv2li1u]

Ι think that the March car would be the best...Tyrrell had a really awesome driver in Jody Scheckter...in 1977 Patrick Depailler struggled with the P34...

[@grooviefan]

There was no more tyre development for is why Patrick struggled .

[@EmperorXaozx]

This principle exists in the Covini C6W.

[@varunculas8236]

Any mind blowing F1 innovation : exists FIA : We don't do that here

[@popswrench2]

was a HUGE disappointment when F1 was supposed to be FOR innovation .... MORE crazy , just keep safe and let them RUN!!

[@jonnyscott8910]

Would be good but can't see the 6 wheeled cars reappearing anytime soon

[@ThiagoMarquardt]

F1 is basically braking innovation, not improving

[@dr2stroke611]

that March 6 wheeler is nothing more than a mock up as the rear wheels were held on with 17mm nylock nuts

[@jordanstriker1656]

Would red bull have the world record for changing 6 tyres?

[@spinach1999]

How about the Alpha Romeo downforce engine fan?

[@JoyManoppo]

BRING BACK ALL WHEEL DRIVE F1 CAR

[@andrewbailey7999]

I would have loved it if the 6 wheeled Williams had actually raced!

[@aegisofhonor]

so technically, 6 wheels aren't banned, just the more-then 2-wheel drive is banned which makes racing with 6 or more wheels incredibly difficult if not impossible to engineer into an effective racing car.

[@brianvogt8125]

FIA Technical Regulations for F1 are here: www.fia.com/regulation/category/110 Reg 9.9.2 prohibits driven front wheels. Reg 12.2: "The number of wheels is fixed at four."

[@SilverScarletSpider]

Four wheel drive and 6 wheels needs to be unbanned. 😔

[@nickschmitz7044]

F1 BRING THESE BACK NOWWWWWWWWWWW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@rooramblingon895]

F1...the pinnacle of saying "Ban it!!".

[@stacyobrien1729]

It would be expensive but to have someone incorporate today's technology into both old designs to see what comes of it but not to have FIA tie the hands of those who are willing to try.

[@pk7056]

traction and some modified 4 wheel steering in front may = better cornering breaking but with the displacement reqs and added weight n drag probably not good for speed / time maybe better for safety or just one more thing to go wrong. pit time or less tire pit stops too much to consider. does less or more rules make it more exciting engineers vs driver based. Today still seems to be the money wins races vs back in the day the cheeky/brains and innovators could break the mold and win

[@loektube699]

Why did the 6 wheel Williams not have a front wing in some pictures?

[@aribozzy4482]

Many F1 didn't have front wing in 1981 & 82 in some circuit

[@mfrattola]

@@aribozzy4482 even in 1980

[@richardwoods5534]

Definitely CVT and Active Suspension

[@y_fam_goeglyd]

What was it about Sweden? The fan car & the 6-wheeler won there. Bring back more open regs and Sweden!

[@mech0p]

i wish they wouldnt of restricted anything when it comes to f1. Keep the tires and gas as they are now but let innovation go wild.

[@codename1176]

Or every few years have an exhibition race were the teams can go nuts and focus on best lap time.

[@rouenpaulo3986]

didn't know that facebook were a f1 sponsor back then. just notice the f in the elf looks like the f of facebook.

[@speedymouse2859]

2-4-0 named like a steam locomotive haha

[@MrJuggernautishere]

just liked higher limbed animals (above insects) have four limbs, similiarly cars four wheels

[@kuvasik]

wheel domes!!!!

[@Yumenga]

You didn't answer the question in your video title.

[@johanrosenfeld3153]

Bonjour à tous, le FIA a banni les F1 à six roues fin 1982 et vive le règlementation technique 1983 des F1. Merci cordialement, Johan.

[@durodesduvo8424]

F1 used to be like WackyRaces...

[@y_fam_goeglyd]

I always thought Dick Dastardly looked like Graham Hill, except Hill was the opposite in character. Though he had a wicked sense of humour!

[@joshuabuilds3051]

Idk how many 21 year old viewers this channel has but ffs we dont need emojis in the edits.

[@zvexevz]

This channel is gong down the drain. Most of their talented staff have left, and now JBL is forced to make these subpar videos that don't make use of his in depth knowledge of the sport. He should go to the RACE.

[@JulesBrunoJjBaggy]

Small wheels mean small brake discs

[@user-gg1se7fx2b]

Кликбейт!!!! Нам так и не объяснили, почему FIA запретила шестиколёсные машины!!

[@chrisagnew2923]

How about water-cooled brakes?

[@jackytwix5956]

I might be wrong but water cooled brakes were never banned. They just became obsolete when the ruled changed about being able to top up fluids after the race before the cars got weighed. Once they couldnt do that the point of water cooled brakes made no sense as the 'water reservoirs' couldnt be emptied/dumped at the first corner. Making it ballast in the wrong place on the car plus there was no way to have a water tank big enough to last the race.

[@Crazyasianman286]

Fuck it. Give it 8 wheels. No...10!

[@discpad]

What other banned innovations would I like you to look into next? OK, it ain't F1; but I will NEVER forget ABC's Chris Economaki calling the 1970 Daytona 500 on Wide World of Sports with "Bobby Isaac in the Winged Dodge" - The Dodge Charger Daytona with the 426 Hemi; and also Richard Petty in the (nearly) identical Plymouth Road Runner Super Bird. Although Chrysler built only 500 copies of each with the 426 Hemi to meet NASCAR's homologation rules; they also built-I believe-2000 copies of each with the 440 six-pack (3x2bbl), also sold at dealers. While it was officially banned with the 426 Hemi in 1971 (it was legal with a small block), Buddy Baker in a "transmission test" at Talladega set the closed course record over 200. mph. Search KZbin for "The greatest racing EXPLOIT of all time!" (no quotes) and see why the Tyrrell P34 and Dodge Charger Daytona were the two most amazing cars of the 70's!

[@grahamballard7041]

Good old FIA let’s not have any innovation, why not have a speed limit of say 80 k and the race win awarded to each driver in turn.

[@oohahitsanrccar1913]

Dream car championship 6wd cars whatever anything goes along as it drives

[@CrimsonRegalia]

(3:59)... Minimal countersteer 6-wheel drift

[@alexzanderroberts995]

Six wheel drifto!!!!

[@CrimsonRegalia]

@@alexzanderroberts995 dorifto!!!

[@alexzanderroberts995]

@@CrimsonRegalia I see you are a man of culture.

[@nonyadamnbusiness9887]

Everything's been banned from F1. They might as well just run a Formula Vee championship and be done with it.

[@darkoneforce2]

Yay Mercedes Benz unprecedented level of domination, plus nothing innovative to talk about.

[@gohumberto]

They banned them because there was a danger of F1 becoming exciting? F1 is supposed to be the pinnacle of motorsport, but all they ever do is find ways of slowing them down. (DRS Zones FFS???? ... why not all the time?? Grooved tyres??? remember that?). My suggestion: (1) Give them the basic limits of maximum weight, length, width, height and engine size (2) Let them develop WTF they want after that. If they want fans, or 8 wheels, variable wings, or side skirts ... let them. Let's see what technology can really do. Let's go for it and see what shows up on the grid.

[@thethirdman225]

I disagree with your conclusion that the FIA naturally disagreed with it. For a start, I'm pretty sure this happened when the governing body was the FIA's predecessor, the FISA. Secondly, the end of 1982 saw a complete revamp of the regulations, which - whatever the FIA haters say - was done in coordination with the teams. The biggest concerns at that time related to safety and it was probably the first tranche of rules to attempt to _slow the cars down,_ something everyone agreed with. This was in response to the horrendous crashed which claimed the lives of Gilles Villeneuve and Riccardo Paletti and ended Didier Pironi's career.