Why we might not get another good MMO

[@J1mmy]

always a treat hearing your thoughts on my stuff :) much love dude

[@vail2367]

JIMMAYYYYYY

[@peeko_luxx2873]

Jimmy comment on a xaryu video? Multiverse of Yt

[@Xaryu]

Enjoyed the video, thanks for creating it Jimmy!

[@xmar5]

ayyy i hope more wowtubers keeps reacting to jimmy contents

[@mortalux]

Why does every forget guild wars 2 ? The new expansion really raised the bar on par with WoW, it just seems like it doesnt have enough advertisements.

[@timurrte5694]

I've never played Runescape in any form in my entire life (tbh never even heard about it). Until 2023, when i got hooked, and now it's my number 1 game of all time. So, i guess, OSRS is not just about nostalgia.

[@PhotonMonkey]

wait that's incredible, Ive done that exactly playing a main account in 2023 and swapping over to iron man in 2024 the game is fucking great

[@emma_tm]

i also feel like the graphics don't look 'good', but it has a very distinct personality that starts to look gorgeous when you get over it being low-poly

[@topsofwow]

@@emma_tm osrs has super intentional design. With so many constraints on what they were able to do every item has character and is super stylized. This makes it stand out so much.

[@TitusAndromadon]

I started a couple years ago. I'm 43, had never played. I always come back to it. I love osrs.

[@Harrison_Rs]

Been playing Runescape for the last 15 years. I dont see myself leaving anytime soon. The players vote on what we get and that is so rare. I cant see many other MMOs which aren't being rushed for money instead of taking it slow for the love of the game.

[@lyric9285]

its super hard to explain to people how osrs feels to someone who has not played it alot. Quests are not kill 3 goblins but actually storys. made a lot better with the runelite quest helper plugin. game is filled with a lot of hard solo mage tower type content. the feeling of getting drops/milestone levels on your acc is top tier. game has hard endgame raids that you can even solo if you want. has content for about all types of players from end game pvm to casual skilling bosses to even more casual content to pvp content. has a massive collection log scene for achievement hunter type players. the game pretty much never has massive power creep things you got yesterday and things you are trying to achieve tomorrow don't get thrown away by the newest update. you can quit the game with a goal in mind come back 3 years later and its still a relevant thing to get for your account. IMO the ironman gamemode makes the game feel 10x better once you are more knowledgable about the game. we get weekly updates we get to vote on 90% of things added into the game. we get no P2W items/cosmetics. OSRS is amazing and its very sad that people i know would love the game get turned away by the game not looking like the newest UR5 tec demo

[@SOLExCARRR]

You should check out the video, "Why osrs isn't an mmorpg or why it's awesome". It's a very good disertation on why the game is awesome in a very well thought out, well written form. It's like 3 hours. I've personally listened to it 3x now.

[@dannyp9210]

How to get started with it? Is one required to pay a subscription like in WoW?

[@Phreeman]

@@dannyp9210 both version of runescape are free to play, but you are limited to where you can go/what quests you can do/ skills, etc. If you have never played before you can start for free, play for honestly many many hours just getting your feet wet. If you decide you want more content (or to be more efficient, as much of the members content is more time efficient) then you just pay for the subscription and 'upgrade' your account. You can always go back to f2p if you dont want to pay for more

[@BrainDamage255]

@@dannyp9210 Yeah, monthly subscription. You can also play for free but the game is very limited. Or you can buy membership for in game coins but thats late game stuff since its so expensive.

[@LehtiMarssi]

​@@dannyp9210 osrs has A f2p but p2p is obviosly better.

[@umarrii]

33:50 - What's so insane about this topic of trying to articulate solutions in response to complaints and questions from players is that OSRS hosted weekly dev Q&As where the team would instantly respond to players without pre-planning for the questions, get immediate feedback from Twitch chat if it sounded good or not, then went off and pursued that further if it was good, propose the more fleshed out solution to players who then have to majority vote it into the game. That's how OSRS became such a good game, that communication, transparency and actually giving players what they want

[@animaai_mai]

Original wow animations were made by one guy they got in specifically for that job. The old ones are better than the new ones to this day.

[@maxpowers4436]

"Animations" you lack of animation. They are not remotely close to better than the ones now.

[@Helscribe]

@@maxpowers4436on a technical level they are certainly not better but the old ones most definately FEEL a ton better, same goes with the damage numbers and visual feedback.

[@Freestyle80]

you are just someone who is salty about WoW and will hate everything about it because you spam watch Asmongold everyday

[@ramp622]

Put the shitty graphics aside, osrs is genuinely like a top tier mmo, in terms of progression, worthwhile grinds, rare untradeable pets you can get, amazing raids and content like the inferno that is truly difficult. It's actually a amazing game overall. My brother was a pretty hardcore wow player, and he played rs back in the day as many did. But he just recently came back to osrs and is loving the game. He actually wanted me to try out wow again, I previously tried it before and couldn't get into but my reply was telling him osrs is pretty simple compared to like wow which is why I enjoy it, and he said "bro, you say that, but raiding or things like the inferno and super difficult and is actually very complex and very hard to learn". Which I completely agree with but I always viewed wow as much harder but I've been told its really not. I say all that because people really write off osrs because of the graphics and they miss the truly beautiful and challenging mmo that it is. Not to mention the playerbase and the socializing is top tier and its something I haven't been able to find on any other game.

[@Seanenanigans]

Only MMORPG that i am still playing is LOTRO. Not that the end game is perfect but, the story and questing is a freaking vibe. Really enjoy my time in it chilling and reading quests. Maybe i am just weird

[@joshholmes1372]

I still pop in and out for that game

[@chuckbass7276]

Nothing wrong with playing bad games man, as log as you enjoy it.

[@Seanenanigans]

@@chuckbass7276 aw thanks 😊

[@littletweeter1327]

This is the same reason I keep playing swtor so much story and rp opportunities to have fun with. Already done the whole endgame grinding thing in multiple mmo’s. I do it with each SWTOR expansion too because it’s easy but that’s not why I play mmos anymore, i just wanna interact with people

[@SandyandJoshAus]

Yeah bro i loved LOTRO, i think they closed the aus servers though? DND was also pretty decent vibe.

[@thebillington]

Never played WoW but I’ve ended up watching your content after the J1mmy WoW analysis. As a long term OSRS player (RuneScape the only mmo I’ve ever played, 20 years going strong) I’d love to see you collab with J1mmy to explore OSRS and discover the hype of new content in an old game. The divergence from the 07scape backup vs RS3 has made for an incredibly healthy game and although RS is click to move, the depth of movement and tick mechanics make end game content unlike any other game I’m aware of.

[@gabrielturcato1235]

The next big MMO it's going to be something based on soulslike games, cool maps to explore and movement based in attack, heavy attack and roll, New World was so good at launch because it tickled people's curiosity in that formula, but they weren't quite in the right spot yet

[@VictimaePaschaliLaudesEst]

The problem is not the mmos, it's who plays them, most players have what some authors call revolutionary mentality, in other words they are always eager to change something or turning things around, always dissatisfied, even if it is good, they are taught that changing is synonymous of improving, but IT IS NOT, sorry.

[@bookbookbook1]

new world was really the closest thing I feel to a true fun modern mmo experience, so sad that it died extremely fast as soon as people got to end game and realized how bad and just unfun the endgame content was. I remember the faction banter was so much fun and the random outbreaks of mass faction pvp that would randomly happen outside the gates of towns and such was something that I just haven't experienced in any game in a LONG time.

[@dannysoria6143]

I still think new world would of worked if it had servers that had locked pvp would of made farming more of a challenge areas would be heavy contested would of slowed down end game and I think people would of enjoyed the open world pvp but the choice to flag or unflagging ruined open world pvp people would unflag and farm for hours even bots where a big problem open world pvp would of fixed a lot of things keep pvp servers separate from pve I loved new world but yeah it sucks when there’s nothing to do and no open world pvp

[@sh.renaud]

What I've noticed recently is more on IRL subject, when you look at it today and how we grow up along with the games we played. As Millennials, most of us were born with a long-game mindset.. what we could do in MMOs we're also doing IRL.. Gen Z & Gen Alpha have grown into technology and can't even think of long-term goals like Jimmy said.. everything is fast, colours are everywhere, and numbers rolling.. have to get it now or they get bored. Notice that Gen Z looks also older now than Millennials? This is how important the grow-up stage in the first years of a human sets his life up Games are a big factor in this because we learn every day as we go and the more we do and accomplish goals & achievements, it's all based on Dopamine.. Our brains do not understand the difference between virtuality & reality.. as long as you get the dopamine hits one way or the other. Long term.. your brain gets used to it and send the signals to your body. So this made me realize that Millennials are one if not one of the most unique generations that existed ever! I quit gaming for a while and started to level IRL, technology has its benefits but it does more harm, so balance is key (in everything basically). And Dopamine in real life is so much harder to get, as with games, movies & social media dopamine release is easily accessible. You need to get out! and I encourage more of us should start to be outdoors way more and limit yourself on everything on the web tbh. So if you're bored of games.. go travel or do something you never did before and just have fun! It's as fun as playing an MMO, you just have to move your ass and set priorities.

[@Whathefaqs]

Unless we get rid of walkthroughs or addons, we won't get another good MMO, since most of the "goodness" comes from discovering the game by yourself and/or discovering it chatting with your friend or people you want to befriend on the internet. We all know this, we just don't want to admit it since it's way too convenient to look at walkthroughs on the internet.

[@Sephiroso.]

The existence of walkthroughs or addons have absolutely nothing to do with an MMO being good or not. If that was true, Baldur's Gate 3 would be a trash game because it has walkthroughs and addons. What matters is game design first and foremost. If you design your game around your players having addons which forces people who want to be competitive or efficient to use addons, then that's how you damage the quality of your game after a long enough time like WoW has. The existence of addon didn't cause that. The developers did by developing the game under the assumption/requirement that people use addons.

[@Whathefaqs]

@@Sephiroso. Baldur's gate is not even an MMO. I mean, on the internet it's easier to disagree, but at least do write something useful.

[@BlijfEric]

​@@Whathefaqs I'm not picking any side. However, in any discussion, you'd not just say "write something useful", but you'd rebut the presented arguments. His being that it's not the AddOns but the design surrounding it. If you disagree, at least come with some substantive arguments on why. It's rather lazy and ignorant to just say "you're wrong". Which is sad, because you both presented valid and substantive arguments.

[@Whathefaqs]

@@BlijfEric Nah, I simply won't. If the basis of his argument is inherently wrong, there's no actual need to waste breath. It's not like you have to answer to everything and everyone just because. We're just going to shift the entire argument to what he's saying, instead to what I'm saying, if I do what are you suggesting. Totally ignoring people who just want to come and say "you're wrong, now I'll write a wall of text that has nothing to do with everything so you'll look dumb" is just the way to go. Are you new on the internet or what

[@sbirzo7250]

I get what you're saying. You skip 90% of the content the developers worked so hard to provide to you. And WoW is a prime example of that. Quests? You don't read them. Let's just use questie or WoWhead. Runes on SoD? You just "discover" them on Wowhead. Your character build? Wowhead. Dragonriding Glyphs? Let me put these coords I saw on Wowhead on TomTom. Boss strategies? Internet. It's not design or mechanics that matter (well, they do, but try to get what I'm saying) if you're going to skip them anyway.

[@Brewbear313]

My hope is that the rise of AI will make game development SIGNIFICANTLY easier, cheaper, and more cost effective to the point where even smaller studios can make big MMOs. I think one day MMOs will be much easier to make and hopefully that’ll mean not only more MMOs, but more GOOD ones

[@IvanchuuuV]

I agree, AI creates assets by itself

[@ElliotNess-jg8gt]

Over saturation

[@naejimba]

You're right about being able to tell from the movement... game feel is such an important part and it's why WoW is the king of tab target. This is especially true of MMORPGs, because 95+% of how you interact with the world is through combat... if the combat doesn't feel good, the game has no staying power. If the combat is viscerally fun to play, and even just running and jumping around feels good, it helps with immersion and getting you into a "flow" state. Fun fact: much of that with running and jumping is JUST the animation. Animation, spell effects, sound effects... all of those things add up to make actions feel impactful and have weight. Many companies think of this as "polish" instead as one of the main cores your game will live or die based on. Too often companies haven't put much thought into the combat and class design, and you MUST compete in this area. This was NOT an accident; it is intentional and the so called "Blizzard polish" is simply having a good understanding of game feel and giving developers the time it takes to deliver on that. When Shigeru Miyamoto was making Mario 64, he spent at least a month (or two, depending on the source) with just placeholder graphics for Mario on a plain white background. Since this game involves physics, he spent this time tweaking every aspect of running, jumping, sliding, etc. until it felt perfect. He thought if the core gameplay loop of running and jumping felt good, then a game built around that would be fun. MMORPGs are all built around combat; that is the core gameplay loop. So IMO nailing the combat should be one of the top priorities, not something you figure out as you go along as I'm seeing with other developers.

[@bullbae02]

We will eventually but it might not be a traditional mmo like before.... its gonna have multiplayer aspects to it but the next good mmo must be something else that captures the attention of gamers from all sort of gaming genre.

[@hunterjohnston1330]

I really disagree with you about movement. Osrs has no jump, its click to move, and yet it’s extremely successful and makes a ton of money. Not everyone views movement the same way you do

[@know_Name]

retail is a full time job. idk why we play this game. i hardly feel unemployed

[@McMTG]

If you take it like a full time job then yes. We have forgotten how to just play a damn game for fun. Stop min-maxing and lose that completionist attitude and you'll be much happier

[@NaPIGzi]

Have you played dragonflight?

[@know_Name]

only 16 hours a day :D@@NaPIGzi

[@lol_Rekt_Bro]

Did our j1mmy dirty with that cowfield pause 😂😂

[@RitotheAvali]

New world being 40 dollars is nothing, you can unlock your account on guild wars 2 for 7 bucks i kid you not (on sale, without it’s like 25. Still less than new world. And play it for free for the rest of the time. You can unlock everything in the game, even premium currency to buy all the other expansions or store stuff. So, it’s possible for them to stay afloat if they only had players in new world.

[@fleagaunag]

There won't any a new revolutionary system that pushes a game to the next level, it's all already been done. What hasn't been done yet is taking the best bits of every game and successfully integrating it all into a coherent end product. An "endgame" type of situation if you will. Runescape's quest system, Final Fantasy's lore/story delivery, Guild Wars 2's movement/travel system, WoW's polish/fluidity of gameplay, and any number of korean mmos' action combat systems. Imagine all of that in a single game. That would be THE one we're all waiting for.

[@wthwasthattv]

Then next big thing is going to be using AI LLMs or something like it to create npc's that will be so relatable or realistic that the players develop an actual emotional disposition towards them. It would create a reason to log in so as to either try and help their chosen faction reach goals or to destroy another faction because they killed your faction's leader. The leader that may have given you a hand when you thought for sure you were about to die and lose everything you had worked for. you know, something meaningful. Just my thoughts about it. Why not? AI is just an infant and already more than capable of performing such tasks.

[@IvanchuuuV]

add to that VR and then BOOM!

[@MrShady2099]

I do want to say, when you said you love the osrs graphics, he's using an HD plugin, but everyone is. it's crazy how the hd plugins managed to keep the look and feel of the game, while making is smoother, even if its just an fxaa

[@Joekary5]

People are just obsessed with their nostalgia for the past. Ever since 2010 people are just chasing the dragon. I think we'll continue to have great MMO's, we just won't have 2005 MMO's because it's not what people want

[@brianmurphy6480]

That, and the fact that there are SO many options of varying levels of complexity and competence available to try. There's no one game for the critical mass of players to focus on any more. So instead of studios trying to make a niche product to appeal to that niche market, everyone making an MMO(RPG) is trying to make that "everything to everyone, 10 million concurrent subscriber" MMO and call it a failure if ALL it does is please the fans and make money. No; it has to CRUSH all competition and DOMINATE in online discussion forums. 🤦‍♂️

[@truthseek3017]

Not just nostalgia, quality and depth.

[@haveaseatsir]

There's a reason nostalgia exists. It's a collective agreement that things were simply better during (insert time here). Nothing will ever be as awesome as WoW and RS when they were in their prime. They're a vestigial shell of what they once were now.

[@sere971]

@Joe-no7gs For you maybe. There are a metric fuckton of solid quality games releasing every month-- if you have fun with none of them, that's not an issue with the gaming industry, it's an issue with that individual consumer. That or they just buy AAA slop and nothing else. Even just looking at retail WoW or other similar MMOs that have a divide between new and old players, it's gotten a lot better for the modern audience of the game. It's just not better for you/people who liked the original version of WoW. And that's fine.

[@Anima18911]

​@@sere971idk about a metric ton of quality games.

[@kylesmith987]

I understand not liking lost arks isometric camera and click to move but lets be honest that is far from the reason most people quit lost ark. The reason lost ark fell off hard is because its uber grindy pay to win garbage. There are plenty of really successful isometric click to move games. Mainly the ARPG dungeon crawling genre and a lot people love this genre. Lost Ark was trying to be an MMO version of an ARPG so it makes perfect sense they would do the isometric click to move thing since that is kind of part of the genre. They killed their game with the arbitrary gatekeeping on daily content, an atrociously bad gear upgrade system that required you to grind a ridiculous amount of limited daily content just to progress through the game, and finally the stupid pay to win aspect of the game just so you can by pass all of these garbage systems. Now i don't want to diminish anyone's dislike for an isometric camera or click to move. I can definitely understand how that would lower the immersion for some people. I just wanted to point out that this is far from the reason lost ark failed and for as many people that don't like this design there are just as many people that love this design.

[@hatearmy]

Apart with competing with all the other MMOs, a new MMO, if it will be a true MMO, has to compete with basically every game on the market. And this is true not just for "MMO gamers" but literally everyone, zoomers, boomers, millenials, etc. Especially in an environment where every game is GAMING your attention, with things like login bonuses, streaks, daily/weekly quests, in game events, etc, a new MMO is ALSO competing with things like shooters, BRs, MOBAs, card games, roguelites/likes, extraction shooters. If we ever do get a "new breakthrough" for MMOs, I think it will be from an established player, and I suspect it will be WOW. This dovetails with your take on how retail wow is changing to not *really* be an MMO any more. It's actually becoming more of a live service or maybe social single player game, if that's even a thing. They've mentioned they want to cater to the "midcore" audience who are gamers who know what they want, but have limited time. So rather than have them commit to a raid schedule, or sitting in a city for 30 minutes to find a tank and healer, they jump into a queue, get matched with a group and blast through a dungeon for 20-30 minutes, get an item or something, and then maybe go back to AFKing while taking care of their kids, or something. I think Ion mentioned this as well, when they announced war within, they want to be more respectful of players' time, hence warbands and delves. So as time goes on, people will be able to sustainably play wow, while ALSO enjoying other games, without feeling like they're missing out on one or the other.

[@Zenistful]

31:34 There's a video of the WoW Devs talking about how they have made each character have around 3000 different animation combinations. While new games these days have like 10

[@TheLiquidCastle]

i mean i played all kinds of games from pokemon, over RTS, CS, COD, league, dota, monster hunter, etc. but in the end, despite having me tilt every now and then, MMOs were the best experience long term, while everything else didn't manage to compare on some level. therefore it's kinda hard for me to relate to the generational thing and why people (besides the fucking entry barrier of wow with expansion+monthly while being packed with micros, that makes u feel like blizz is actively trying to keep new players away and had chance and mitch talk about free2play being the better option years ago) wouldn't wanna try an MMO.

[@burntfish123]

Games in the past had to be good to make sales. Games today don't have to be good they just have to trick you into giving them money with predatory monetization and mtx. So it's not just nostalgia, it's longing for when companies actually gave a shit about making good games rather than trying to stuff the shareholders pockets even more than they're already stuffed

[@spiderzz1]

i said it once i will say it a million times osrs has a style and its a sort of claymation stop motion style i love it but it is an artifact of its time!

[@alectriciti]

For the record, I've seen a significant overlap in the RS3 and OSRS communities. Mostly, it's people transitioning from RS3 to OSRS. I'm sort of on that boat, though not fully committed, OSRS just has a healthier player-base in both numbers and interactions. Yes, there are many bots. But more importantly, many real people playing, chatting, and enjoying their time.

[@TheLiquidCastle]

see that's the great thing about PVP payers, we dont need new content that frequently, we're just having fun with what the game offers and we're already hyped, if some new spell gets added instead of a whole new doungen or raid with different bosses and mechanics xD

[@天使霜]

I'm pretty sure over half of all wow players currently ARE playing alternate versions to retail. If you combine classic/hardcore/sod/private servers

[@Scavs_Inc]

Asmonds 3rd channel is growing. Nice to see

[@Mindy_T]

How to make WoW better for new generation: 1) remove levelling. Boom 💥 2) make Mythic plus more accessible, more mobs to pull, more avoidable mechanics, less one shots and less damage. 3) remove trash in raids 4) gear vendor you can buy targeted items with currency found in dungeons and raids. Yeah, GG. 🙃 that’s about it. Young people don’t want lengthy grinds, old people don’t have time for lengthy grinds… why the F we have lengthy grinds and gear acquisition? 😅

[@Gegota82]

20:40 all the faces look like wooden scarecrow heads, they have no mouths, the eyes look like the eyes on the mask in "the mask", you know?

[@alchemyty]

Anyone else think Xaryu would love black desert online, especially the pvp scene?

[@zoltan9760]

I remeber my first time logging into wow night elf hunter, jumped and was like holy shit, smooth af, but also i tjink be able to fly anywhere is fucking awsome

[@99sonder]

21:07 the funny thing here, is that he immediately jumps onto the fact that the cosmetic is a shitty rehash, and that the massive amount of in-game money being a prize for their lootbox-thing (which completely shits on their own work of introducing gold sinks and keeping the economy in a less volatile place) is just an unfortunate foot-note. RS3 players really just continue to eat that shit while asking Jagex to stop putting it on their plate. I'm not even trying to make fun of RS3 players who spend money on the game, they (try to) help keep the game alive, I'm just concerned for their well being, like a man who's happily married worried about my neighbour being in an abusive relationship with my sister-in-law.

[@AkiRa22084]

WoW Token is not buying gold. It's an exchange between players. That's why it's not causing inflation.

[@whitenite373]

when you talked about plunderstorm and then said Blizzard Please! lol that really made me laugh man. I feel your pain with that though for sure.

[@Hanging_Brain]

I wonder if i could make a channel that combines asmon and xaryus reacts into one react

[@TheZeagon]

did xar watch jimmys other wow vid?

[@itsprivate3061]

If RIOT ever does release a MMO, its totally gonna be a run your pockets store cashgrab, its just sadly the way things are nowadays, you cant expect corporations to not be greedy leeches

[@kristoferkravis1474]

Xaryu have you tried Warhammer Online Return of Reckoning? A PVP focused mmo, could be another interesting perspective at what games were like again back in 2000s. And tbh the PVP last i played was good and fun.

[@02bluehawk]

Personally i think people have the mind set that MMO = med-evil sword and shield and magic world. When in reality i think the future of mmos and one that could be extremely successful is something like Gun Game from the sword art online show. A FPS pvp MMO would work in todays age however people's idea of a mmo just isnt that.

[@BasedHorrigan]

Thats because MMOs stopped being a DnD-like campaign that you would play with other people, to being wow like clones which erase the RPG elements and prioritize antisocial features for farming comvenience. Rob Pardo said that WoW had become the best DnD campaign like and now what do we have to say for it? Jackshit. People tend to forget that games like UO and SWG existed and pushed the boundaries on what was possible with sandbox features, features that the players have more control over.

[@richardkim3652]

Out of all the games I played from the worse to best gameplay and the worse and best community are probably WoW (Ok combat, not flashy but SHIT toxic community and too much addon) ESO (Combat is not really great but bearable but the community is good) OSRS (Graphics are bad but the gameplay and the community are really good plus they have the best KZbin content creators and best challenges) GW2 (Everything is overall good) FF14 (Just like GW2 where everything is overall good but just better and the community and the events they do in the game are S+) For me at least. I have like 500-1k+ hours in each of these games EXCEPT for WoW because I wanted to try WoW but the community was bad the the party I was in was bad and they told me I needed like 20+ addons or I can't play with anyone so I just lasted like 10 hours and gave up. I really tried my best to play it.

[@ItsABnuuy]

I love watching the chat "ackshually those arent mmos". Forgetting he mentioned it as "other games that come out". Chat on that goofy juice.

[@matthewlongo6404]

Problem with him bringing up Warzone and Fortnite is, there were Cod and Halo when WoW was big.

[@sadusko7103]

Calling Legend of Ares a stinker is painful. LoA was one of the key stepping stones to me for MMO's, and it was so much fun in the days where they had peak amount of users, so many people just PVP'ing, questing and actually socializing. Although, yes.. agreed, it's still a stinker. The team behind LoA did not understand or know how to handle going against hackers on their game, which ultimately caused it's downfall.. Many people quit because of that.

[@beandean356]

What is the average age of the current wow retail players?

[@sunnygo8469]

There's a lot of time invested by the people that play mmo as their main game. Moving to a different one means leaving behind the time spent. You have to be really good to make people make the switch. There's also a lot of time investment in picking up an mmo. Now more than ever with the way they make their games to keep you online grinding. Micro transactions and store skins cheapen the ingame reward structure and that matters a lot in games meant to feel like the world is alive. That did it for me at least. There's a lot going on here. At least in terms of immersion i find modern mmo games to be the weakest. The best example i can think of is playing cod. You are in the trenches and mid this war like experience you see a dude in a clown costume running around.

[@shelly6482]

SWTOR had great PVP and i enjoyed it more than WoWs PVP in many ways.

[@N.Oriiii]

i played both swtor and wow and i feel like stwor is just better in almost every way, though i wish we had the freedom of mount travels like wow, would be awesome to go underwater n all lol

[@shelly6482]

@@N.Oriiii People probably think we are crazy for saying this but during them dark times of failed WoW expansions SWTOR was our little under rated gem that kept us going.

[@andrewshandle]

I wonder what would have happened if Blizzard didn't join Activision King. While I think it's way too easy to blame Bobby K for everything bad with WoW, there's no doubt he kind of killed creativity. At that point Blizzard's entire purpose was raiding ABK's stock price. I guarantee devs were pitching Plunderstorm for a decade.

[@MaggleTheMage]

Something that make an MMO great is mystery, season of discovery was meant to be something for players to dive into without any out of game knowledge but we had google telling everyone where their runes, gear ect are still. If we want an MMO that will be good the game needs to be released with some kind of copyright to stop people from streaming/recording it like i get that might be where your money comes from and I'm not saying the fault is yours or anyones fault but as a big streamer you cant deny that your viewer base is a big part of the player base and that if you were to stop playing a version of a game then alot of your followers would also stop playing. a good game isnt something lots of people want to watch a good game is something lots of people want to play but if everyone just goes online and looks up the 'meta' then only plays that and uses the talents that they are told to use by such and such guide all we end up with are players that are actually just sheep/bots copying what everyone else does and that is what makes a game die out , IMO.

[@eliteone6122]

Runescape ...... logging in not know what adventure I would end up on........ never wanting to log off 😅

[@Slackii]

With a lot of the things you say about movement and feel, and how you like certain combat. I am surprised you didnt play more BDO, was it too hard to get into back in the day? too hardcore grind? This is no longer the case, could be an idea to look into :) Best regards from BDO player47 :p

[@AverageYTer]

I can’t stand react content. You literally do nothing except watch someone else’s work and get paid for it.

[@Rose337]

right, and the absolute nerve to literally not even have 'reaction' in the title at all is insane, knowing people will click it not realising it's a reaction. especially considering the work being reacted to clearly had a lot of time and effort spent making it. so shameless

[@andreichetan4694]

I agree with the wow movement. I played ffxiv even tough movement is more clunky, i accepted it for other things. I dabbled with GW2 for 200 hours, its polished but is not silky smooth as wow movement. Movement and ability usage in wow is nr 1 in terms of player retention Goood, rly goood take

[@Zenith-ly7pr]

New World is an obvious example of how the MMO genre isn't dead. AND you can absolutely design an MMO around grindy mechanics, as long as the combat and movement are well designed. New World failed because of the things it didn't do, not the things that it did. It was released AT LEAST 2 years too early. I'm convinced if it had more development time that we would all still be playing it.

[@doubleshot9448]

I’d honestly say BDO is an even better example since it’s essentially a pay to win MMO through the AH and selling costumes, but the combat is fucking amazing imo. They really kinda mastered the combat system, grind system, even traveling, that combat is unreal. If it wasn’t good people wouldn’t grind the same spot for 5 hours straight just to farm xp with a good buff on or whatever it is they are tryna accomplish. I’ve wasted tons of hours just doing random bullshit in that game, like afk fishing 🤣🤷‍♂️. I think GW2 does combat pretty decent too, new world I liked but it felt kinda limited to me. There is like a fine line of too many buttons and too few buttons, I think somewhere between GW2 and Wow is the sweet spot but idk. You really think new world had better combat then bdo? I did like that it was purely skill based but so it bdo no tab target shit.

[@venumus1]

​@@doubleshot9448bdo was incredible when it first came out and before it got its 3 rebrands 2 devs and it's phone game gotcha. But for me it's biggest draw back was frankly to much freedom I had hundreds of hours in the game yet I spent most of my time hunting wild horses for breeding and doing trade routes

[@doubleshot9448]

In the part about Battle Royalws games. People talking in chat about PUBG being first clearly weren’t around when H1Z1 was out a year before and was better imo, it was also supposed to be a survival zombie game and turned into the Br as we know it today, that game was such a shit show but it was soooo much fun at its peak. Then Activision came out with blackout before warzone, that was a dud until they completely re did everything. Now it’s basically Fortnite, warzone and apex as the top 3 from what I see.

[@FIanKyy]

so you can keep this in mind its reported that osrs has 336k players active on average

[@FF7Cloud]

as a gacha player on phones microtransactions are good until it starts to limit those who dont buy. I'm always happy to enjoy a game like star rail or genshin for free because a handful of ppl will spend 10s of thousands

[@chuckbass7276]

Not seen the video yet but i agree with the title. Its impossible to make a truly great mmo. And any kids growing up today will never end up playing mmo's as their main game. It will die out as a genre completely. Making an mmo as good as wow is physically impossible. Making good/decent mmo's like New world and Lost Ark isnt that hard but it wont keep people playing.

[@pblack2409]

I feel the same way when modern games don't support 21x9... black bars are a bane to humanity.

[@allentheaverageoldjoe]

Everquest was the start the devs of WoW legit said in their own doc that EQ was what inspired them to even try and create an MMO. Also, the entire community did not like WoWnite. My 8yr old did enjoy it. He had plenty of improvement recommendations but he lives for his victory royales and skins so...

[@apensalesman]

A lot of people really enjoyed Plunderstorm. I personally didn't try it. It didn't look up my alley. But every friend of mine who played it actually thought it was entertaining. Until they last minute grinded out the stuff they needed for cosmetics lol

[@allentheaverageoldjoe]

@apensalesman my brother liked it for a couple of days as well till he saw the impact it had on retail PvP when he tried to come back for push.

[@musiclayer5192]

Ashes of creation, tester here. You have no idea what's coming.

[@Kiiltec]

Personally my experience was different. I never was much of a WoW fan, even when it came out it hardly caught my interest. But what I did notice was that prettymuch every single MMO that got released after World of Warcraft... wanted to be World of Warcraft. Many different kinds of MMOs got prettymuch stomped into the ground brutally and no other formular existed but the WoW formular that every dev strifed for. So... while WoW was influential... I don't think it was a good influence whatsoever... it caused the era of WoW-clones and the unaliving of innovation in other games and in my eyes is part of the downfall of the genre as a whole... weirdly enough because of its popularity. I atleast haven't enjoyed an MMO since.

[@yoshiwhere148]

the next mmo is 100% going to have kill 20 goblins

[@sonicmaxwell]

My mate tried getting me into ruins cape 3, I played it for about 100 hours or more, maxed out smithing and necromancy. I really didn't like it. The grind is so choresome. It looks like a Disney them park mmo, not immersive at all. I cant understand why people like it. I think its purely nostalgia. I can see it as being alright back in the 2000s but it is very dated now.

[@jackalo34]

click to move is fine n doesnt kill an mmo- thats a personal preference. I think click to move should at least be an option bc wasd or arrow keys only is very restricting.

[@OmniDan26]

I heard steve jobs died of ligma.

[@seffievondionysus3198]

wats ligma?

[@AleksanderCarter]

XAr and Asmon legit reacts to the same vids, is it a part of an intricate plot? Reminds of Rogan who. invites the same people over and over again

[@whenisdinner2137]

Old school makes more money than RS3 and has been for half a decade. So I don't know what he's talking about 😂

[@user-ck9tb4fv2x]

Yea but like if anyone has experience with Riot games flagship league, they take their sweet time with making changes.

[@didnt_ask_for_handle]

People who are against click to move forget that runescape plays on a grid so you need click to move to make "precise" movements People who are shouting at you "But Runescape works!" forget that click to move just feels bad for non-grid environments

[@MatthewHulett]

RuneScape has the best questing system and other MMOs should do something similar. Cause it is very disappointing to do the same quests over and over again in these so called new MMOs.

[@devilrobrob]

Whenever Ashes of Creation comes out and it flops that will officially be the end of NEW MMO's

[@skippyzk]

Ashes of creation or bust! Swg was the best ever

[@eleventeen3926]

Xaryu please fix the sound on your videos, lit can't hear anything and when i go to another video its BLASTING. KZbin will put you lower in the algorithm for sound quality.

[@Eldenbruh]

It will never happen, as a grown man with 2 kids, its clear to me they LOVE gaming...but MMOs they just cant get behind. They want instant gradification, build and create, chase down quests and run around...no,they cant. Nobody in their class touches those kinds of games.

[@mohamedmalekchaabane2286]

@Xaryu Riot Has not only the mmo players that currently playing the other games and maybe look forward a better expertience in the New Riot mmo , they still have their Fan base from TFT , LOL , Valorant And Legends of Runtera besides the Fans of their NETFLIX TV Show and Their Lore

[@Chaoticsaur]

The guy who took over the riot mmo worked for ea, and on runeterra. Has 0 mmo experience, and is a greedy pos. Riot mmo gonna be doa.

[@sere971]

@@Chaoticsaur I had a bit of faith in it when Ghostcrawler was the lead, but my hype for the Riot MMO has been dead since he left.

[@mikedavid1945]

@@Chaoticsaur Think they may not do the mmo as the mmo will more likely take away from league players

[@mohamedmalekchaabane2286]

Tbh we'll wait and see but what i said it still facts Riot has Huge Fanbase and most of them willing to try all riot games

[@Coldkill2001]

Now this is ridiculous. Xar and Asmon released the same video within the same hour on the same day

[@francoisturgeon1176]

bajheera does that too now .. even pikaboo .. its ez content u dont have to do anything .. u dont create content .. u dont brainstorm u just put a fucking video of someone else and let it play ... meanwhile doing thousands of dollars .... with broke viewers that donate to millionaires tthats how the world is going now

[@Kralamelo]

i have a very good idea about an mmo but i dont have money for create it

[@freshairkaboom8171]

Lets hear it.

[@TheMorninGlory23]

I wanna see a WoW 2 with realistic sized cities full of AI NPC's that have their own personalities and goals where quests are dynamically created based on things the NPC's need help with and the results of said quests actually change the world. If the horde wins the battle for ashenvale then BOOM that forest is getting chopped down. Expansions could like actually cause arthas to wake up and try and take the world over or a portal actually opens up to Outland. Work together to save the world or the horde/alliance could actually lose, tho you'd need Game Masters to nudge events to keep it so there's always a narrative maybe lol like a giant dungeons and dragons session :3 absorb the survival game genre mechanics and let's get a real simulation created!!!

[@zedorian6547]

The riot mmo wouldnt be the first “real” competition WoW ever had

[@DemoliciousGG]

i 100% agree with the movement stuff u said, as a long time pvp enjoyer, you can tell INSTANTLY how good an mmo will be within the first 5-10 seconds haha :D Problem is, runescape is popular, and it has the most janky and delayed movement ever made(it literally feels like you have perma connection issues lol ) , so i dont think the majority of people agree here

[@Blackbaldrik]

OSRS manages to make a very, very strong first impression in spite of that delayed feeling, by just being really dang fun to play. Every stage of the game is enjoyable. It's an absolute masterclass in "number go up." And _then_ once you've gotten far enough, you learn that the delay isn't a flaw, it's a feature, it's consistency. On first impressions it feels like you're lagging because actions in OSRS only execute every "game tick" of 0.6-seconds, which is perhaps off-putting but also very ignorable at low levels, but at the mid-to-late game it is the heartbeat of OSRS. It becomes one of the single most involved and learnable movement and action systems ever created. When you hit content where you benefit immensely by performing actions around that 0.6-second beat, you begin to understand a level of depth you'd never think possible in a game with only mouse-movement, almost no hotkeys, and zero ability bar. I don't do PvP in OSRS, but I love watching it. The skill ceiling is crazy.

[@DemoliciousGG]

@@Blackbaldrik yeah i get that :p alot of the unique feelings in games is something you grow to love, im not talking about the small delay on skills, i refered mostly to movement, and the 3-4ish sec delay in moving ur char, is the sole reason i never got into it, so i agree with xars opinion on the movement "feeling" is key And for the longgevity, i wish most games had am RS like endgame, i wish i got into it really early so the nostalgia would overtake the clunk, kinda like classic does 😂 unfortunatly we played Adventure quest instead RS 😂

[@Sephiroso.]

Making a good mmo isn't easy, but let's not pretend most of the mmo failures in recent years weren't seen from a hundred miles away due to decisions either the developer's were making themselves or the publisher forced. So while making a good mmo might not be easy, the reason most mmo's fails isn't because it's hard. It's because of brain dead decision making coming from the top that ruin any potential the game may have had. Anyone who thought after looking at New World's development cycle that it had a chance in hell to be good long term just wasn't using their brain. They literally changed the entire sub genre of the game less than a year before launch. How do you expect a game to be good when the core vision of the game got changed so late?

[@kbob9625]

Did people just forget about Final Fantasy XIV lol? FFXIV Hsa over 30M registered players.

[@iN_O_O_B_Y]

Ashes will take over

[@Deezzer1212]

In 2030

[@zengineer3369]

"Bethesda should focus on making MMOs it's easy money" I've never heard something this stupid ever... MMOs are one of the if not the hardest games to make and the one of the last companies i would trust to make a good one is Bethesda, They haven't done anything other than assembly line slop games for the past 10+ years with that poor poor engine that has been violated with modern shader technology etc and it should be just put out of its misery by now.

[@Kristian282-u6b]

i play World of Warcraft for like 5 years and i can just play night elfs because of movement :D

[@Buttz2Buttz]

Why? Because game devs nowadays, and I am including indies devs in this as well, seem rather focused on hopping the bandwagon than actually being imaginative and coming up with something interesting. Look at how many survival games are on steam, now how many of them are actually good? How about the sheer absurd amount of Hardcore Extraction Shooters, and how many of them are legit or fun to keep playing? Battle royales? Yeah, that good ole bandwagon is well over the weight limit.

[@pelopota]

The best MMO ever is going to be one that takes place in virtual reality. Sword art online comes to mind

[@mhalladaptive]

name one other than Arnold...I'll wait

[@BC_Joshie]

ESO the best MMO for dungeons and raids as well as having a huge awesome map filled with great quests etc, BDO is probably the best for PvP, and in depth non combat skills.

[@dysexlic3161]

Riot MMO is our last hope. If that shit is bad, I agree. Not to give credit to league, but I think they can pull it off.

[@NartrachGaming]

MMO will be big again when our kids will be playing!

[@Eiszahn]

I cant imagine anything but a full dive VRMMORPG beeing the next "revolutionary" thing

[@joshholmes1372]

Gonna be a while

[@Eiszahn]

@@joshholmes1372 most likely yeah