Winds of Winter Predictions: Jon Connington - A Song of Ice and Fire

[@Darksun93]

2:05:46 "Not everyone is someone in a glamor!" sounds like something someone in a glamor would say hmmm

[@DavidLightbringer]

I can't deny it

[@lewicron]

I think Connington might go mad when he hears the bells ringning for Faegon's coronation just after learning that he's a Blackfyre.

[@sterlingorganicfarm421]

Thank you David and Tim for a great stream. I also really enjoyed the nettles video earlier this week. Wow we are spoiled. Rest well you guys.

[@ThommyofThenn]

the Gruesome Twosome are in effect!

[@ThommyofThenn]

That's a reference just in case someone doesn't know it

[@RolloTonéBrownTown]

​@@ThommyofThennI know what its from

[@ThommyofThenn]

@@RolloTonéBrownTown i come into the ring...and then i start eatin' garbage**

[@gatlingrove]

I don’t know how I’d get through night shift without Dave and Tim

[@DavidLightbringer]

stay solid homie

[@LunchThyme]

38:22 At his throat he wore three huge square-cut rubies on a chain of black iron, *a gift from Magister Illyrio.* "You look a proper prince," he told the boy. *"Your father would be proud if he could see you."* I read this as another clue that Faegon is Illyrio's son, more so than a glamour or deception thing.

[@6tiple6ix6afia]

There is nothing in what you quoted that is more in line with one being the father over the other. You are making is out to be as if he said "Your father would be cheesing right now if he could see you now that you aren't in a disguise. BTW your dad still loves you. And cheese. He really loves cheese" There is nothing in the actual quote that logical infers Illyro OVER/INSTEAD OF Rhaegar. You might be right in general but even if YOU ARE, it has nothing to do with this quote.

[@ThommyofThenn]

welcome to all the new viewers today😊 we are glad to have ya. And thank you frens* who gifted memberships for everyone to enjoy

[@KingEdwardMMVIII]

LML you've been on a roll lately brother. Praise garth. Winter is coming. Can't wait for how you handle a book release

[@caseco4979]

🙏

[@willem-janageling3907]

I would love the live streams as podcasts so I can listen to them during my long runs! I love your channel and your chats with Tim especially.

[@hinakhodiyara7883]

Thanks for keeping the Blackfyres stoked. Love listening to you guys. Nice one.

[@ghostdreamer7272]

I wonder if… Griff doesn’t know Faegon has gone into KL for secret negotiations, perhaps at the Sept (or Dragonpit like the show), Griff has been cut out of the inner circle, only hears there’s some plot there and decides to do the Tywin thing… and blows it up. But it kills Faegon. So he throws himself down the well.

[@DavidLightbringer]

ok, ok...

[@jonhauge-evaldsson783]

Tragic and beautiful!

[@matthewdavis9715]

Tim’s reading is killing me. Lol! My new head cannon for how every Golden Company officer sounds.

[@farahgiovanna]

Thanks David and Tim… loving the voices❤ you guys are always so much fun to listen to. ( caught it just now on the rewatch)

[@SSquirrel1976]

Always make Monty Python jokes. They will always be appreciated.

[@Mackerlee]

Y'all look like twins! BTW, so freaking excited to see a JonCon video!

[@duncanwells0088]

I like the little bit with lemoore/lenore because David’s brain goes straight to definition and symbolism when this is one of the times George is probably just doing silly word play so David doesn’t catch it immediately. Great stream guys!!!

[@itzfifson6140]

we need another ASOIAF con, im tired of partying alone with a raging Throner!

[@DavidLightbringer]

it'll happen

[@itzfifson6140]

@@DavidLightbringer Dallas was so fun, seems like a life time ago.

[@RolloTonéBrownTown]

How about a Jon Connington con. Or a Jon Concon. That's adorable. Idc if anyone has made this joke

[@therunningman_]

the boys are back! you two are fantastic together

[@WatashiMachineFullCycle]

You know, when y'all mentioned Duck being the Dunk stand-in, I remembered that he originally served Lord Caswell at Bitterbridge. Interesting...

[@aaronedwards6452]

“i do declare”- Harry Strickland

[@BaldingClamydia]

Sure, Jon Donne, but Poe also wrote a poem called "The Bells." It's a rhythmic poem; you can almost hear bells in the background while you're reading it. I was just going to copy it into the comment, but it's a bit longer than I thought. It talks about several aspect of bells from a section about the loveliness of wedding bells to the terror of alarm bells, to the solemnity of death bells. It even mentions kings and hearts of stone. HEAAARTS of Stooone :D

[@jorahtheexplorer3262]

If you want a wild "not the real name" for the series I give you what my father thought the show was called "the Phoenix of ash and thrones"

[@Nerdixy]

My dad still calls it “crown of thorns” 😅 Right tracks but completely wrong train lol

[@kashikoicat]

"Death in 4" didn't come into play until Tyrion's dragon was flying into position, so the countdown for fAegon might not start until after Dany comes to Westeros

[@panzertorte]

I think Tim's really on to something in regards to that false surrender brainwave; it just fits all the clues perfectly!

[@lewicron]

Just realised Toby Stephens would have been perfect as Jon Connington. Man, imagine they'd done the series properly. :(

[@mihrimahsultana1263]

Great stream. I agree with Tim on his prediction of faegon possibly dying in a false surrender just like the young dragon did. I agree this is a pattern forming. It would be a such a tragic ending if throughout this he never finds out that faegon isn't rhaegar's son and maybe that makes him go mad with grief and maybe some how cersei is at the sept baylor so he decide to blow it up just to kill her. It would also be like for him the ultimate slap to the face for Jon con, if it's tywin's daughter who ends Faegon he would see it as robert and tywin laughing at him beyond the grave.

[@cowboyoutlaw2444]

I believe when I started watching your channel it had 40k subs. Seeing 111k is totally dope I'm really happy for you LML congrats I haven't seen every steam but I appreciate you giving us an accepting community to enjoy. Been having a hard time lately just wanted to say how much I appreciate the effort. Much love myth heads

[@tristanescure7384]

If you're thinking about french for Lamore's name, it's actually a little double sided because it sounds both like "love" and "death"

[@bebethebard]

Wonderful stream!

[@KingEdwardMMVIII]

Winds of winter release date soon confirmed ❤

[@AuroraExhale]

This is exactly what I need to get through my shift today. Analysis on JonCon and the Blackfyre rebellion will keep my brain chugging for sure 🎉

[@mercedescreates]

Great stream as always!

[@RolloTonéBrownTown]

Much love to Tim and Dave. You are the BEST!!!😊

[@MrHws5mp]

Alternative JonCon in King's Landing scenario: Faegon takes King's Landing, but Cersei either escapes, goes into hiding, or sets things in motion before she dies. Faegon's _coronation_ (4 week's later?) , with all the "turncoat" nobles who switched over from Cersei to Faegon present, is at the Sept of Baelor. When the bells start ringing, JonCon can't stand it because of flashbacks and has to run out of the building. While he's getting his head back together, Cersei blows up the Sept with wildfire, killing Faegon and "decapitating" most of her rival houses/power bases. JonCon loses it completely because, yet again, he's been defeated by a Lannister's ruthless move. He throws himself into a well/water-tank either in sheer madness/grief, or as a calculated "I'm going to have the last laugh and out-ruthless you if it kills me" move.

[@thereader6667]

Tywin: *Commits Genocide* Jon Con: Hold my hair dye…

[@derekalexandersmith]

Connington is in the sept when Cersei sets it on fire, he jumps down a well to try and escape the flame but drowns

[@wyattbuckingham4656]

I really enjoyed this stream & last going over the Blackfyre rebellions + WoW predictions. Love the collaboration with Tim. Keep up the great work!

[@cmschmidt]

Poe did write a poem called The Bells. It has such a good rhyme pattern and is applicable to bells and snapping.

[@three-eyed_magpie]

Hair in George's world is one of those things that don't work quite the same as in our world. We see that often with Blackyres concealing their identity. It is possible to dye very light hair blue or black with natural dyes like indigo and henna, but it's time consuming and messy and impractical when traveling. Changing hair color in a way that creates a convincing illusion of undyed natural hair is a whole another game and much more difficult, because that would involve frequent application of dye on roots while keeping the overall color even, coloring the eyebrows or even eyelashes without skin irritation and staining, removing the light body hair etc. - that would be hard to do when undercover. I guess that John the Fiddler could have pulled that off since he needed to have black hair only for like three days. However returning dyed hair to its natural color overnight like John or fAeagon did would have been impossible. Dye cannot be removed from the hair cuticle that easily unless it's some sort of temporary color like Rudy Giuliani used and then John would have black sweat running from his head all the time. Varys too would have a hard time to consistently look like a bald man, not shaved, without a hint of silvery hair visible. Maybe Essosi theatre makeup was that advanced. Ghiscari hair that can be worn sculpted into roses and things also seems hard to believe. Obviously, George is no hairdresser, but many readers do have experience with hair coloring and makeup. Maybe that's why theories about glamours keep popping up. Anyway, thank you both for the great stream!

[@chables74]

Varys and Illyrio surround fAegon with intended to educate him in certain ways; who better to teach him how to be Rhaegars heir then someone who wishes he could’ve had his kids.

[@Scroliv]

Left this on when I went to bed so now it time to rewatch lol

[@everettreynolds5167]

Great stream guys

[@SuperWaffles-i3k]

Edgar Allen Poe wrote “The Bells”. There is another called “For Whom the Bell Tolls” written by a man called John Donne. Hmmmm.

[@joshwells3782]

Thanks guys love it abd i agree with this one completely

[@sinthoras1917]

111 000 subs! Congratulations!

[@WhoIsCalli]

Very fun stream guys. Love when you too get together

[@anneconner1108]

I feel like David looks different in every stream. Like you can see his hair and beard evolve thru each Sunday stream lol . But not tim, Tim stays the same. just different shirts. His consistency is impressive 😂😂😂😂

[@anorangetabby]

Rewatching the stream and now all I'm hearing are innuendos (in innocent speach) because of all of the Cock-a-too references. 😆

[@ThommyofThenn]

Sometimes the humor can be so funny it's distracting lol. Also me having the maturity level of a 12 year old doesn't help

[@anorangetabby]

We all have the maturity of twelve year olds when our chat goes there, Thommy. 😂 You're not alone.

[@BearusAurelius]

The question to me is, how contagious is Greyscale? We know Shireen has had grayscale essentially her entire life and has been in contact with many other people. No one around her seems to have any fear of the greyscale being contagious and we have certainly not heard about her infecting anyone else. It isn't until Val and some of the wildlings infer that Greyscale may lie dormant for some time that we hear anyone bringing up concerns. So what makes Jon Con more contagious than Shireen? How does the disease spread? It seems like you need to come into physical contact with actual greyscale skin to have a chance of becoming infected. This makes it seem unlikely that JonCon would infect anyone else imo. Tyrion was in the water with the Greyscale zombies and didn't get infected.

[@thevolunteerfiredepartment816]

Isn’t Shireen’s greyscale dormant?

[@BearusAurelius]

@@thevolunteerfiredepartment816 Yes I think that is implied by the wildlings. I don’t think it is as contagious as some may think though. You would have to touch the grayscale on someone to even have a chance to be infected. Unless Val is right and it is far more contagious than we think. Interesting question.

[@LargeMichael68]

We've been told that the bells ring when a king dies, the Sand Snakes are desperate to kill Tommen, maybe the bells are rung if/when Tommen gets assassinated during his blessing and JonCon blows it tf up

[@joe-sz7kv]

Wanting to be like Tywim is honestly irredeemable

[@jessjess23brooks89]

Someone's gotta tell that to show-only Tywin stans. I mean, I've tried. I only get aggressive Chad comparisons and grunting in response 😅

[@copyninja8756]

Tywin is badass

[@Huhbroski]

​@@jessjess23brooks89Tywin caused 20 years of peace and prosperity that your favorite characters lived and enjoyed in.

[@joaoparga]

Great stream. Chapter re-reads with @GreyWasteTim are the best! I was thinking: maybe Jon Con flipping with the bells might be related to him finding out that (f)Agon is fake. As you mention constantly, as a writer, George is always finding ways to put characters, and their desires, in conflict. Jon Con has dedicated the later years of his life to the legacy of his former romantic interest (Rhaegar). Plus, he probably has begun to care for the (f)Agon. He realizing that this life-purpose was a lie, and that he has been ruining his honor and being a pawn to Varys-Illyrio machinations would be a great opportunity for George to explore how he reacts. Jon Con would find out that not only he has been manipulated by them, but have been actively contributing to put a Blackfyre on the throne (furthering spoiling Rhaegar legacy, the one thing that he actually cared about when he took this path in the first place). In other words, George has carefully built a twisted scenario of the heart in conflict (Jon Con caring for an abstract legacy of his former lover/interest vs. caring for an actual kid that depends on him), and it seems too precious for him (George) not to explore. So maybe he finds out during the taking of Kings Landing during the moment Cersei is ringing the bells, conceding the loss (but in a treachery situation, as you've mentioned). Because of i) the realization, ii) the PTSD, and iii) the grayscale, Jon Con might actually turn against (f)Agon, and that's when Duck throws him down the well (protecting (f)Agon). To sum up: I got the impression that you guys didn't consider Griff figuring out that (f)Agon is fake. And that would be the perfect scenario for George to explore how that realization shatters everything Griff knows and, consequently, turn him against (f)Agon.

[@Proudfeet2701]

Maelys the Monstrous gives me such big Adam Smasher vibes but medieval dragonspawn

[@kashikoicat]

In Dany's vision at HOTU, she saw a mummer's dragon cheered by crowds. I wonder if fAegon will have a role in putting down JonCon's devastation of King's Landing

[@Shady_580]

I was the one that got it to 800 likes!! Long time fan but never I never comment on the live streams, even though I’m there for most of them.

[@Shady_580]

Go follow @GreyWasteTim. If you haven’t already, give my guy some love he puts in the work.

[@ThatDangerousWolf]

I can’t believe you did this without Quinn the GM

[@nathanlovell3718]

Good stream 🎉

[@drgordo112]

Connington got that dawg in him!

[@kdubwines5384]

Tyrion telling them to go west may be bait, as in that's what he wanted them to do, but probably because he just wants trouble for Cersei. He cares not about Faegons' cause.

[@KBlanca513]

I think Septa Lemore is Serra Mopatis Blackfyre. Tyene’s mother is in Westeros, Tyene and Arianne went to visit her.

[@darrellwalker4053]

Night gathers and my watch begins

[@nonfiction9849]

Maybe JonCon sets KL’s wildfire on fire, when the people hear it burned, assume it was Dani.

[@meganinthemountains]

It makes me sad for Faegon that he has been lied to about his identity. He's just a kid.

[@konawalchuk333]

Always good

[@johnracine4589]

Garth bless these boys!

[@nont18411]

It’s funny that Tyrion, who’s with Illyrio for a few days, was so perceptive that he wondered why would the Golden Company that had supported the Blackfyre since the beginning suddenly chose to support a Targaryen cause. Meanwhile, we have JonCon who never suspects the authenticity of Aegon Targaryen’s backstory even once even though JonCon himself had been working with the Golden Company, known to support the Blackfyres, for years. That’s why I think JonCon will kill Varys and Faegon once he discover the truth and then Cersei will bomb the sept he’s in which will cause a burning JonCon to jump into the river. JonCon’s stony charred corpse will cause the plague of Greyscale, which will force Dany to burn the city to stop the spreading of the pandemic.

[@ryanlewis7761]

The one with filed, pointed teeth, I assumed was biter, either running from some destiny if his own (he’s on the way to the nights watch same as Jon after all), or he’s also a faceless man and arya never saw the real biter, just someone wearing his face

[@Henbot]

Seems plausible that either they win and put Cersei on trial and she blows up them all or if Fagon dies in the battle and the bells are rung in celebration and then Jon Con nukes them and the city, if we take the event in the show as occurring

[@memyphoneandi15]

Tim’s South Park references 😂😂😂

[@Henbot]

Also if Jon ends up in the well it easily could be his body is dumped into it or he dying from wounds from the battle and does an FU to them all in king’s landing water supply

[@meganinthemountains]

Or it's the bells are ringing as Jon Conn surrenders to Dany + Dragons

[@dylankmitchell1992]

The fact that fAegon DOESNT look Dornish is more evidence that he’s not truly the son of Rhaegar and Ellia of Dorne. In George’s world, Dornish physical traits seem to override Valerian physical traits - most, or perhaps all - targs with a Dornish parent have the typical darker Dornish features.

[@GreyWasteTim]

Not quite. Of Daeron the Good and Myriah Martell's 4 sons, only Baelor had Dornish looks. Aerys and Maekar had traditional Valyrian features. It's possible Rhaegel may had more Dornish features. We never get a full physical description of him. Just that he was meek, mad, and sickly.

[@Roaringmoonbeam]

David, do you happen to play Puzzles & Chaos? Someone named lightbringer was in the arena.

[@kashikoicat]

You don't think JonCon might kill fAegon if he finds out, somehow, that fAegon is not Rhaegar's, and he has sort of been cuckolded into raising a kid that isn't his beloved's, and sacrificing all other aspects of his life to get this kid made king?

[@tylerbarrett6652]

Everyone seems to refer to this Aegon character as "Faegon"... but after reading Varys's monologue to Kevin Lannister, I have to wonder. After 4 generations, I'm not sure anyone cares whether it's someone from the Blackfyre line or the Targaryen line... just so long as they have THEIR man in power... and better that this guy was raised to understand that he serves his kingdom...and not so worried about his kingdom seeing to HIS every whim. It's a good plan, but I missed where it was laid out for us with 100% certainty that THIS guy is a Blackfyre. But what do I know? I still think people are wrong about R+L=J.... lol.

[@6tiple6ix6afia]

His name is Faegon because is it short for "Forreal Aegon".

[@Elle_n9]

What about the golden company having golden arm bands? So do Mance & Tormund. I think you need to do a Dario chapter review. He mirrors yuron it’s odd. His description followed by her dream of a man with blue lips.

[@thomasj3701]

Man, missed a second King of the Hill reference. Bills ex wife is also named Lenore. Almost full circle! Loved the Buck voice. I kinda like the false surrender hypnosis. Back in December 2001, Bin Laden did the same thing to the escape. He happened across some helicopters.... rabbit hole not worth the effort on that one!

[@chicotheworld9763]

35:35 i like davids joncon

[@DavidLightbringer]

THANK YOU

[@tinahs8269]

Blue dye cancels out red tones in hair...hairdressers color wheel says so.

[@bizzy6845]

Pretty sure it's reading like this is the reason he will never finish the book. genius who publicly say "hey I know exactly where this is going" if I'm George I would be like why bother since you already have it figured out

[@rai2423]

The only reason why people are doing that is BECAUSE he hasn’t released the book. The man in 12+ years late, and people only started doing this a few years ago. These conversations are keeping the interest for the story alive, which any author should be grateful for.

[@bigwigcthulu6902]

For Whom the Bell Tolls is a novel by Ernest Hemingway, FYI.

[@meganinthemountains]

Pale Mare reference !

[@joshpaul6064]

For whom the bell tolls, Hemingway

[@MC-el2us]

Maelys is Tyrion Mk 1 👀 Tywin and Aerys son merged into one.

[@ejml6532]

Death on 4 means that the game will be over in 4 moves

[@WhitneyAllisonGG]

Faegon could easily die from ignoble death from Greyscale and not from battle. I think Cersei Lannister will blow destroy Septa Baelor it is matter of context. However, expect it after Tommen somehow dies and Cersei goes off the deep end. I have a lot problems with the show but Cersei Lannister destroying Septa and killing Elaria Sand. I think that Conningham will body wouldn't be destroyed by Cersei but fell into the water way thus grayscale will spread.

[@bklyntraveler9705]

Monty Python sketch?

[@DavidLightbringer]

the Architect sketch

[@Shaz1993xoxo]

Maybe the death in 4 is going to end up be a reference to the number of moves FAegon has left to make 1. Invading Westeos without Dany 2. Taking Storms End 3. Taking King's Landing/being crowned 4. Attempt to claim a dragon/the action which leads to his death. If you combine 1 and 2 within the same "move" then perhaps the other move would be his decision to marry

[@guycross9869]

You get thrown down a well from the top

[@lordofthehouseofstormcrows8615]

The whole Jon con plotline is just a distraction/filler so we keep forgetting the real conflict....Patch Face vs. Euron as monsters for rights to use the porta jon in Old town

[@LSK1]

☄️☄️☄️☄️☄️

[@davidbadillomirete8226]

I think Faegon will easily take Kingslanding, the Lannister regime is falling on their own, the faith can now declare Tommen a bastard without making a Stannis who worships the Red god king so they will join Faegon adding another symbol of legitimacy that Dany will lack, Cersei will be tempted tu burn the city bu won't yet instead will leave with Myrcella and crown her in Casterly Rock(I don't think Cersei's story could end without Tyrion and Jaime), then Daenerys will fight Faegon, at some point Tyrion will take the rock but Myrcella won't be there, Cersei and Qyburn will arrange to blowup the sept with Faegon inside and frame Daenereys, Daenerys will go North to fight the others and Cersei will take the chance to take the capital and the Griff and the Golden company will join her to avenge Faegon, the living will loose at Winterfell and go south , Daenrys will by forced to deal with Cersei before the Others cross the neck, Jaime will go the the red keep to get Myrcella and leave, but Myrcella will die somehow, maybe greyscale, leading Cersei to want to burn the city, Jaime will kill her, and the city will surrender, at this point Griff will trigger and either start the fire himself or shoot Drogon with and scorpion in a tower while Dany is Landing, he will fail and Drogon will breathfire into the tower starting the fire, Daenerys will be treated as mad queen, several atempts will be made against her, she will respond with brute force, I think Jon and Euron will recreated the battle above the god's eye from the dance of the Dragons and people will asume Jon died defeating the other's when the body is not found. with Jon gone tension will rise between Daenerys and the Northern lords and Tyrion will poison her to end the war, then Jon Snow will reapear and rule as king for a short time, an hour of the wolf 2.0 to make justice and stablish a new system and then leave for the wall and maybe join the other's as part of some peace deal.

[@DavidLightbringer]

some good ideas in there thanks.for the comment

[@AiltonOfClawIsland]

tim in bestform

[@thelateescapist8266]

Tezcatlipoca: a god of darkness, night, the invisible, storms. Is associated with obsidian (dragonglass), & conflict. Demands blood sacrifice. Represented by a black Jaguar (a big black cat) If this god is the inspiration for the Lion of Night that's soft confirmation that the Lion of Night and The Great Other are one and the same! 🤯

[@cherylbaxter8986]

🐈‍⬛🐈‍⬛🐈‍⬛

[@chicotheworld9763]

19:00 :o

[@jonhauge-evaldsson783]

Septa Lemore -L'amour -love

[@outrageousrave4036]

Davidddd. wish you'd grow your hair out again and show your eyes. You have beautiful hair and eyes. Im a gay dude so grow that shit out and take your glasses off

[@DavidLightbringer]

🤣🤣🤣 thanks for the feedback haha

[@pablopicaddo]

How good!

[@deeptrlp]

What would Tywin Do... well... he died shitting his pants.... what about you Jonny Boy 🤣😂🤣