WinWing F-16 EX Throttle Review

[@RedKiteRender]

1 Year on update: My Antenna Elevation knob has broken, a little rubber washing holding it in place failed! I opened it up and replaced the washer, and it's good as new. A pity to have something fail, but an easy fix. A video is coming on the issue, however it'll be a while pending other commitments first. Additions to the video and minor correction: So, As a few commenters have pointed out. We think you're meant to pull an extra inch of cable out from the base which eases the pressure on the wire in cut-off. However, this is very poorly worded in the manual as follows "Pull the connection wire from the right side of T2, connect the wire into grip;" Which you could interpret either way. It's got no visualisation of the step, nor how much to pull. Not being in the habit of senselessly pulling on wires i only 'pulled' the wire to the clip, and clipped it in. So, That should help, I'll talk to Winwing and ask them to clarify it in the manual going forwards. Manuals link: www.winwing.cn/en/download

[@crash8926]

Question: Can I use the Taurus and/or Libra mounts with this Orion? Is that an option? I don't have anu controls on the desktop. I use the Monstertech mounts for my TMWH setup. Thank you for the review BTW! I'm sold, I just need to know what to buy!

[@larryssuperhomearcades]

@@crash8926 See 0:38

[@crash8926]

@@larryssuperhomearcades Ah, I missed it! Thanks! I guess I shouldn't get it. I'd hate to have to have it sitting up high on my desktop!

[@72ndEchoes]

Will add a note to this to perhaps save any future purchasers the trouble - if you pull it too far the connector on the circuit board may pop out. It's an easy fix by opening the bottom plate and plugging it back in (dark wire to the ground pin).

[@gerryabbott]

As a user for many years of the cougar (modded with hall sensors and a TUSBA I/O connector), It's great to see a successor finally coming to market. Thanks for review and look forward to the stick review.

[@michaelkphoto8344]

Is your Cougar still functional? And if it is, why replace it with the WinWing throttle?

[@gerryabbott]

@@michaelkphoto8344 I have no intention of replacing it until if fails and i run out of my spares for it. Nice to know there's a worthy successor.

[@infrared337]

I have been to a military expo and sat in the F-16 Blok 70 training cockpit. I thought the way to access the throttle afterburner section by rotation and push was very cool and incredibly satisfying. The USAF members stationed there thought so too, great guys. Im happy to see there is an actual throttle for flightsims that mimic this.

[@jasons9564]

That looks great! I just got the take off and combat ready panels, mostly because of your review of them and I love them so far. Thanks for a look at another cool product!

[@ColonelAkirNakesh]

That's so rad. I really dig the Warthog/Hornet/Viper/Eagle agnostic button layout on the throttle base, too.

[@RedKiteRender]

You can bet we'll see an A-10 / F-15 hotas handle some day judging by the Orion base labels.

[@rcoplien]

There is actually extra slack in the wires so if you actually pull them up you can gain about an inch extra. I do agree it was a pain in the butt as well wish they would have put the whole thing together before shipment.

[@RedKiteRender]

Ah! I gave that a rather cautious go and yes, there's some extra wire in the base, makes it feel a little better.

[@malcolmandiano8480]

I would not pull them more until i check how they are assembled internally. As quality assurance guy in electronics/electrics i have some concern on wires and soldering lifetime... even if winwing said "it s made for" . I would love to look inside the base and see the technical datasheet of the wires.

[@RedKiteRender]

@@malcolmandiano8480 It's poorly worded, but the assembly guide does tell you to do this, which I'd missed. But, yes, I'm not 100% comfortable pulling on it.

[@BastianSchwarz]

Thanks!

[@RedKiteRender]

Thanks Kindly!

[@wilbuzllf5057]

Nice review, well done! I have the old Thrustmaster Cougar and the ergonomics of the F16 Throttle are indeed superb. Sadly that HOTAS was a big miss otherwise though.

[@RedKiteRender]

Couple years ago, i very nearly bought one, with the intent to convert it to usb and fix it up a bit. I really wish Thrustmaster had re-mastered it!

[@Shrike200]

I've just retired my Cougar - probably about 16 years of hard-ish use. BUT, I installed a Hall effect sensor mod from Cubpilot (anybody remember those mods?) as well as a stick extension. The ministick was terrible, and I disabled it via software when it began to spike all over the place. The design of the joystick base internals isn't great either, mine had worn the rectangular slot in the rotating device which allows for pitch movement into more of an ellipse, meaning the roll input had a side to side dead zone in the middle. Still......16 years isn't bad service. Albeit modded.

[@jomartin3850]

yeah right you can mod the throttle to not require the cougar stick base? Amazing. I’ve got stock Cougar throttle connected to the cougar stick base, which has been modded with IJ gimbals and with cub pilots HAL effect sensors. If it ever dies I’ll now look at modding the throttle to USB but if I had get get brand new this is of huge interest. Love the off mechanism and burner detent. Gee wiz, I got l cougar in 2003, that makes me old and marks a long long time since a new f16 throttle was released.

[@fonesrphunny7242]

Still loving mine. Got a new central gimbal piece milled from steel, put in bushings and some MR sensors for stick and throttle. Surprisingly only the MAN RNG knob has any jitter. And Foxy is just a great tool when you need more options for mapping buttons.

[@IK4MS]

@@Shrike200 The fact that the base had worn instead of snapped apart is honestly quite incredible, all the ones I've seen had a side of the rectangle fly off, which seems consistent with putting so much force on an incredibly thin piece of brittle alloy.

[@SonesBen]

Nice overview--thanks! I'm looking forward to your impressions on the stick.

[@OfLtnAnctryKinglsy]

You could always choose to use Velcro that works as well and is very stable . A good friend of mine opted for that solution w/ the F-16EX Throttle and he allowed me to try it it feels very stable, and stable it doesn't move at all . he is very satisfied and has never had any issues with this. so whether you bolt it down to your desk, table etc....consider this as it is a better option in my opinion and easy to undo if necessary . I'm on the hunt for a new Throttle this may be it, . I'm currently researching VKB, and Virpil choices as well .

[@ralph_f16simulator]

Great kit, I'm saying it as a F16 simulator cockpit owner. A few thing would have been nice: - cable relocation - white lettering engraved in the metal - force sensor radar cursor

[@asphelite]

Really nice video, thanks for that RedKite

[@marcseclecticstuff9497]

I just received my throttle today. I could tell that it would be a bit of a pita to be swapping between the F/A 18 and the F16 so I just purchased another Orion base. I'd like to do some KZbin content and cover stuff like this but I'm a bit Aspergery so I just can't put myself out there. Instead, I figured I'd add to RedKite's review. I haven't assembled the throttle yet, just wanted to make a few first impression comments. It looks like Winwing was rushing these things out and there are few minor QC issues that they really need to address. Most importantly, the large aluminum Slide Rail was poorly deburred with several sharp edges that could potentially result in a minor cut. It's CNC machined so it should have been deburred as part of the process. Most of it was, but there were several areas that weren't touched so I'm not sure if it was a programming, tooling, or offset issue, but in the end several areas were missed. It just took a minute with a small warding file to break the edges so not a big deal timewise but still. There was also quite a bit of glue residue (appears to be a polyurethane based caulk) on the upper section and top of the rail likely from applying the graphic. Please note that the graphic is not a thin decal, it's slightly over 1mm thick so it should hold up well over time. The residue was easily scraped off with a plastic tool and 99% alcohol was effective in cleaning the remainder. Another concern is the bearing that rides along the rail. It's a small ball bearing with a nylon outer cover. I suspect they are having issues with the nylon cover failing. Despite the throttle arriving with the bearing installed, one of the first items in the manual is how to change it. Also, included in the parts bag is 2 spare bearings (thumbs up for that) so I'm guessing they will potentially fail over time depending on how much the end user abuses the unit. Besides the range wheel being a bit difficult to manipulate, I found the Antenna Elevate control is a bit rough. It incorporates a single ball bearing detent to engage detents at the center and both ends of its travel. This adds a bit of friction to the system making it more difficult to manipulate the control, and it feels a bit rough as you turn it. I think it's because it's riding on top of the painted casting and hopefully will wear in and get smoother with time. Finally, on the Orion base, the 2 silver axis levers surface finish is dinged up here and there. They are cast metal with a matte finish so they are easily scuffed up with handling. They really need to put masking tape/film over them during assembly to prevent cosmetic damage. I had a few flaws on the F18 throttle I originally purchased, but the new base is noticeably worse. The mounting rails for the side plate are all extruded aluminum and once again suffer from improper deburring. Nothing like the side rail but still they should have had all the edges broke prior to finishing. The slide locking mechanism to lock the 2 throttles together on twin engine things is very sloppy allowing a 4-5mm difference between the 2 throttles. On early units folks were complaining that it was hard to get the lock into the other side so I suspect they opened up the holes resulting in the extra slop. They need to redesign it with a taper on both pin and socket to positively locate the 2 halves, and reduce the size of the hole the mechanism sits in on the other side as it currently rocks back and forth considerably. Keep in mind folks these are all minor issues, I'm a bit OCD and nit picking the crap out of it. It's a beautiful throttle (the stick as well!) and well worth the money if you have the disposable cash for it.

[@parab225]

This type of very detailed feedback is always great to see, so thanks!

[@doifeellucky]

Agreed, thanks.

[@alcmann]

Excellent workup as always sir ! Appreciate the time and video and the price. Hopefully will bring some competition and variance to the peripheral market. I'm SOLD ! Now just waiting for them to come to the market.

[@Spelljammer1]

Can't wait for the F16 grip review! Make sure to include the switch action section like here. :)

[@v0id683]

I've been waiting for this!

[@WhereNerdyisCool]

I'd be really concerned about those wires failing over time. I'm from the 3D Printer world and wires that move back and forth a lot can fail...some better than others (silicone wire, etc)

[@RedKiteRender]

I've been running the Orion with Hornet handles for a year thus far, and no failures. WW did beef up the cables. But yep, that's the trouble with all moving parts. there's also some extra slack you can pull up from the base (see pinned comment)

[@michaelfriscia8166]

since they're only taking back orders right now you won't have to worry about that for a very very long time that being said it's a simple din plug you can probably buy an extension cheaply on Amazon.

[@simonhouel1984]

Very nice ! I'm more in the market for a UFC and the Hornet throttle does a very good job in the Viper but definitely something I'd consider if I get further into that jet. It will mainly depends on Eagle Dynamics on that point ...

[@charlies40556]

cool viper skin at the start, I live in Toledo and have seen it in person :)

[@fonesrphunny7242]

Looking at my Cougar, I think WinWing has replicated the shape and positioning of everything very well, but didn't think of the ergonomics with the MAN RNG. It's pretty much in the exact same location, but if they had moved it a bit or reshaped the grip around it, it would work so much better. Not expecting them to change it now, but maybe they can improve on their prototyping in the future.

[@RedKiteRender]

I'm thinking I'll design and 3d print an extension to clip over it, to make the dial wider.

[@jomartin3850]

@@RedKiteRender that would do it. The stock MAN RNG also looks like a detractor for me.

[@DeltaGolfProductions]

Great review! Looking forward to delivery of mine. (Hopefully Monday) I have a real Viper throttle, but this will be a good placeholder while I am working the mounting, wiring and implementation.

[@RogueSpecterGamingOfficial]

I wish the RDR Cursor/Enable was a bit bigger to match the real thing. Still looks really amazing and will be getting for sure

[@ambercopley831]

Shout out to the Clan mechs on your desk!!

[@Brazouck]

came here for that :)

[@homeworxchannel4120]

Waiting to get mine. Just a few more days!

[@DeltaGolfProductions]

Same!

[@onethirdlbofbeef]

I see those Battletech figurines :D

[@yogiparashara4016]

Hi Redkite - Im thinking of placing an order for the WinWing F16EX Orion Throttle and Stick but wanted to check to see how your getting on with it since the review? There seems to be some good offers from WinWing so hence the enquiry. Look forward to hearing from you

[@RedKiteRender]

Still plenty happy with it, I've been designing a 3d printed switch extension for the man-range knob, to make it a little easier to turn with a single finger.

[@yogiparashara4016]

@@RedKiteRender thanks buddy. Do you know if you can mix vendors? I.e I have a Thrustmaster F18 stick and a Winwing Throttle in DCS?

[@RedKiteRender]

@@yogiparashara4016 You can use any combination of usb controllers that you like. I've got Virpil, Winwing, Thrustmaster, Totalcontrols, and even my own homemade button boxes all working with dcs in my home setup no issue. It's only an issue if you attempt to literally combine hardware from separate venders. For example a WinWing F-16 stick handle will not plug into the joystick base of a Virpil WarBRD.

[@johannesb3044]

@@RedKiteRender Any chance you can share the design for the 3D printed switch extension for the MAN-RANGE knob?

[@tripltred65]

Thanks for the videos. Very helpful. I and having issues Bidding the ANT Elevation on the f16 throttle. And advice you can give would be a big help.

[@parab225]

Nice review, WW def crank out some interesting designs.

[@SlapGRW]

I wish they made a larger version of the f-16 ex throttle and joystick like the super tarus that would be great.

[@tofajvito]

Hello... I'm completely new to the HOTAS world, but I like the wingwin throttle for the viper. What I don't like is that, as you said, there can be problems due to the cable being too short. If I understood correctly, you pulled the cable out...but it is not clear to me how you did that. Otherwise, did you have a problem with anything other than the fold? And also... do you think that, being a beginner and not very technically proficient, I could manage it anyway, or should I use the Orion2 HOTAS Metal Warthog instead at the beginning. Thank you in advance for your reply and greetings from Slovenia, Europe. Good luck!

[@RedKiteRender]

Just grab the wire and gently pull it an inch out, i address it in the review video on the F-16EX stick. Not super difficult to do, and solves the majority of my worries.

[@tofajvito]

You're great!!!!!! THANS!!!!@@RedKiteRender

[@MarcReisSyllogism]

Thanks for the review! What do you prefer? The Super Taurus or the Orion Setup? Compared to the TH Warthog HOTAS? I am tempted but cant make up my mind if to step up to taurus or orion from the warthog. And if to stay F18 Style or go F16 (I love and have both in DCS - coming from Falcon 3.0 days)

[@RedKiteRender]

I do like the Taurus, but the Orion is so much easier to live with, has better switches on the base, for things like zoom level. So my Taurus collects dust, as it's just kind of inconvenient, but then i like to swap my throttle fairly often with others.

[@michaelfriscia8166]

For those that might be wondering as I was I read through people's comments and somebody said that you can adjust the throw on a throttle on a per aircraft basis both for afterburner detent position and I assume full milpower for aircraft that don't have an afterburner such as the harrier or the collective on a chopper as lifting the handle up to go over the detent would not be ideal however don't quote me on that I'm just throwing this up here based on my understanding & because it's a concern for those of us who fly aircraft with NO afterburner. but if anybody knows for sure please do reply to this or post your own comment.

[@RedKiteRender]

You would have to adjust the curve so you reach full power at the afterburner detent in dcs, or just live with the detent.

[@michaelfriscia8166]

@@RedKiteRender thank you so much for your reply I had been very worried about this and thank you for the experience of your reply. now if I could just get this thing shipped this quick...... oh and by the way thank you for the video as well it's awesome

[@ceruleanskies1414]

I would love to like that throttle, but unless and until WW start offering cheap replacement cables or improve that design so the cables are not constantly being stretched and bent, I am going to pass. Looks great otherwise, but that is definitely going to be a maintenance problem.

[@Mak10z]

How well does it hold a position? it seems to move pretty freely, and it appears the grip has a bit of weight to it. if you put it to 75% throttle, how likely is it to shift its position due to gravity? is there a friction control knob?

[@RedKiteRender]

Base has variable friction control, it easily holds it's position with the friction setup correctly.

[@marcseclecticstuff9497]

There are recessed socket head cap screws (Allen) that can be used to adjust the friction on both levers. Since the F16 is single engine, the F16 throttle handle attaches to both for better strength/stability/ergonomics. Well worth the $$ if you have the cash. According to FedEx mine is supposed to be on the truck and arriving in the next couple of hours... which usually means it will get lost and not show up till Monday. At least it made it out of China before the New Year shutdown :)

[@Mak10z]

@@marcseclecticstuff9497 Ahh so its a add-on to the regular WinWing throttle. I was outta the loop. that makes a lot of sense.

[@jefflowry4112]

@@marcseclecticstuff9497 how is how is yours on way they show out of stock for weeks now

[@marcseclecticstuff9497]

@@jefflowry4112 I managed to purchase it when they 1st released them in January. It was a nightmare, their website couldn't handle the traffic. As I was trying to order it I kept hitting the buy it button with no response. After maybe a half hour I finally got thru to find I had over $60,000.00 worth of them in my cart. Took another hour to get them cleared out and just a single one ordered. After the order confirmation I went back to the store and they were sold out. Was lucky to get it ordered in time. It then took Winwing about a week to ship it, and then it got caught up in the pre-Chinese New Year shipping rush where it spent another week stuck in Shanghai waiting for a bus. Once it got to Japan, it moved pretty quickly, getting to my door in less than a week. Of course they ship FedEx so one of the packages was still stuck in Shanghai until yesterday, but fortunately the other 7 actually made it here without FedEx shipping them somewhere else (I also ordered the Blackshark collective in anticipation of the upcoming Apache release thus the additional 4 boxes).

[@Fester_]

Thanks for that review.

[@DoradoFever]

So no more RShift+Home to start with this? One of the frustrating things with the Warthog that works fine on the A-10CII but not the Viper

[@RedKiteRender]

Yep, the virtual buttons on the throttle axis, are perfect for that job!

[@stefanorossi137]

Engine start and cutoff works on the Warthog too

[@DoradoFever]

@@stefanorossi137 I am saying yes, it does work on the A-10 seamlessly, but doesn't on the Viper

[@stefanorossi137]

@@DoradoFever No, I meant it works on the Viper. You just have to map it to Throttle - OFF/IDLE in DCS controls.

[@DeltaGolfProductions]

@@DoradoFever yes, the TM works perfectly for the F-16.

[@mumblerinc.6660]

How practical do you believe it is for non F-16 play? Does it have enough buttons to work out as an A-10C HOTAS? How does the detents line up with the detents for other planes such as the Hornet, the Tomcat, etc.? How easy is it to dismount the detent “rig/wall” on the side for when you want to play planes that lack afterburner detents, e.g. the A-10 or warbirds?

[@RedKiteRender]

So, It's great for single engine aircraft, okay for multi It has enough for the warthog's throttle controls You can change the throttle detent % position (ingame) in the software, but it doesn't align with the hornet out the box, so you have to configure it per aircraft, but you can save profiles for each one. Only the Viper/Jeff align with the default settings. If you remove the plate the throttle becomes very light, and can drop/fall over, to correct this you can add lots of friction but that makes the throttle a bit stiff, with stiction. It'l still have the soft detents of the Orion throttle, but it'l be a little too easy to accidental fall into the cut off position. Hope that helps!

[@mumblerinc.6660]

@@RedKiteRender it helps a bunch, cheers! How “complex” would you say that the “wall” is? I’m pondering the viability of either WW or customers themselves manufacturing custom “walls” with different detent positions and switching between them as you play different planes. Would semi frequently changing walls out be inconvenient?

[@RedKiteRender]

@@mumblerinc.6660 I don't see why you couldn't 3d print yourself a replacement detent plate, although it won't be as sturdy, and designing it would be a pain. removing just the plate isn't too bad, 4 bolts then lift it off the top.

[@nickduan4949]

@@RedKiteRender It does align with the Hornet out the box. At least for me, I did not have to change the afterburner detent settings in the software when switching from Viper to the Hornet. Remember, don't refer to Hornet's nozzles lighting up in the F2 view, because it does not light up in the first stage. Instead, turn on the loud afterburner sound option and use the sound cue or refer to the fuel flow.

[@SDsc0rch]

QUESTION... 2:20 --- are those two buttons on the real F-16 ??

[@RedKiteRender]

The two on the underside? no, they're extra, easily ignored if you don't want them.

[@SDsc0rch]

@@RedKiteRender - okay thanks and thanks for such a great review :)

[@jimmy8x541]

to Redkite and anyone else who owns the Winwing F16 throttle, a question for you please: how would you rate the accuracy of the RDR Cursor analog joystick? Mine is NOT up to my expectations.. it is less accurate and more difficult to use than the analog stick on a Thrustmaster TWCS throttle. It is asymmetrical and on the X axis it only has a tiny amount of space to move to the left, so moving to the left is quite twitchy and hard to control. I will be contacting winwing to see if they can offer a replacement or any way to fix this but I'm not holding my breath...

[@Sonic32084]

Could you please give some pointers on how to set WW up for BMS? My friend has the kit and I’m trying to get him a key file sorted.

[@RedKiteRender]

Pick up the bms alternative launcher, and enable extended inputs support (lookup g_nButtonsPerDevice) Then bind the controls 1:1 with BMS.

[@Sonic32084]

@@RedKiteRender thanks for the super fast reply RedKite! Desperate to get him away from DCS for a bit 😆

[@ColonelAkirNakesh]

Does the detent frame get in the way of the Ka50 collective? Thinking ahead to if they do an Apache collective grip!

[@bullitthead7853]

Hey RedKite, is it possible to leave the F-16 throttle "track" installed while using the F-18 handles or will it interfere?

[@RedKiteRender]

It fouls the hornet handle if you leave it on, so it's got to come off.

[@ytdlder]

Hi RedKite: do you really bind all the buttons in DCS directly? That would mean you have to configure it for every. single. module. Right? (or there is some trick I don't know of...) Wouldn't it be easier - as all the modules share mostly the same key presses - to program the buttons with the WW-software to use the respective keyboard shortcuts?

[@RedKiteRender]

The problem with all modules sharing, is they physically have different controls, and you can't share much more than pitch, roll,yaw, trim and trigger. You've got to bind them each by hand really as the sim's too complex. Many mainstream controllers have pre-setup controls, but these less common ones usually don't.

[@ytdlder]

@@RedKiteRender That's true for specific functions (like MFD buttons and such), but most are "common" (autopilot, gears, flaps, ...) and use the same keybind (Alt+1, G, F, ...), so it would be easier to just program those keybinds in the driver profile.

[@Chris-ly8wt]

Red, were you playing on 4YA server yesterday?

[@RedKiteRender]

I was not, to be honest i don't actually fly under my youtube name generally, draws too much attention.

[@ESOFUNANDBUGS]

Hello nice video! Do you know maybe if there is a way to tighten up the tension of the Throttle way ...the way it goes mechanical ? Its a bit too soft for me...any idea?

[@RedKiteRender]

It has friction adjustment via allen key from above, look for the little holes.

[@ESOFUNANDBUGS]

@@RedKiteRender thank you so much..i will...big thanks

[@becauseiwasinverted743]

Hi there ! Received mine today and I'd like to know if you have the same issue : when I remove my hand off the throttle at mid course or more forward, it's sliding all the way to the AB detent stopper... I mean a throttle is not supposed to move on its own and I couldn't find any friction wheel on the base, how's yours behaving in that regard please ? Thx, love your channel 🤘🤘

[@RedKiteRender]

You'll find the friction controls on the outside, roughly centre of the throttle arm's cut out, insert the included allen key to tighten the nut found below the hole for each axis until it stays put, try and keep the friction even on both.

[@becauseiwasinverted743]

@@RedKiteRender I just found 'em thanks a lot !

[@Mako-sz4qr]

Yeah that cable is about 1/4” to 1/2” to short but I wonder if it’s easily replaceable. Good job on the product though.

[@RedKiteRender]

Turns out, there's a little more wire you can pull from inside the base, which helps. See the pinned comment

[@michaelfriscia8166]

another alternative to pulling the extra inch of wire out which is shown in his other video on the stick that pairs with this one is simply getting a din plug extension cable. I'm sure one could be purchased easily on Amazon

[@86abaile]

I want it, that way I can finally retire and sell my whole warthog set, but I'm not in a position to get it just yet.

[@SonesBen]

One thing that kind of bugs me about Winwing's version of the F-16 throttle (well, aside from that terrible man range/uncage dial) is that the angle of the grip is way off. On the real thing, the comms hat is pointing almost straight forward when the throttle is in the idle position. On Winwin'g version, it's pointing up to almost a 1 o'clock position, and you have to push it forward to full military power before it's at the same ~3 o'clock angle as the real throttle at idle. Ergonomically, this seems... not ideal.

[@robertzurawiecki7837]

Ordered my stick and handle (already had the bases from my hornet Orion order) on the 21st, said it shipped the 26th, been stuck at a FedEx facility in Shanghai since the 31st with no pending delivery date. Originally it was the 7th now it's unknown. Sigh.

[@RedKiteRender]

Mine got stuck in the post for a while too! :( Seems to be a general issue these days. Couple that with the Holidays at the moment, it'll be a little while before it arrives.

[@numbers111222]

I had the same issue last chinese new year. Didn't move from Shanghai until a day or so after the new year ended :(

[@qiyuxuan9437]

rip, there is a 7 days national holiday in China for Chinese new year, so it will probably start moving again next week.

[@robertzurawiecki7837]

Yup, it says in transit as of today. Should have remembered lunar sale means lunar shipping delay!

[@biffrapper]

Are all of the buttons and dials metal, like the HOTAS Cougar?

[@Data-FlightSim]

Redkite: How do you program the Idle/Cutoff functionality on this throttle in DCS?

[@RedKiteRender]

Just bind it to the Idle/Cutoff keybinds in dcs ( R ctrl Home/end) It's got virtual buttons for those positions on the axis, so you just move it in or out.

[@JackThelRipper]

I just got my new Orion 2 F16 throttle and stick kit and they sent the wrong brackets, the L brackets are not assembled and sent 2 rails that don’t go with anything :( the cables are to short and won’t clip into their holder. $600

[@mikemulder1792]

Thank you for the detailed video. Can I ask how you mapped the AB detent in DCS to match actual throttle position? Thanks and keep doing the great work!

[@jalsina01]

This is a beauty, but I wonder if it will cost more than my car.

[@nev0076]

When can I expect the Orion HOTAS F-16EX product?

[@toonsis]

well done, you may have sold me on this

[@thewarthogproject]

I'm jealous. I have no need for it but I want one.

[@albertzhou23]

We are waiting for your F16 project. Nice work on A10

[@RedKiteRender]

Your Hog pit is an inspiration! One day i hope to build even a lite simpit. Just need, money, space, and probably retirement for the time Hah.

[@abdulmismail]

I upgraded from the Saitek X56 to the Thrustmaster Warthog (also bought the F18 and F-16 sticks) as well as the TPR pedals. They're OK but two of the iron switches were loose. I contacted Thrustmaster support and they were absolutely foul people to deal with. When talking, they talk over you. They sent me a faulty item but refused to replace it - only stating they'd repair it. I should have saved up for the WinWing instead.

[@RedKiteRender]

I'm sorry to hear that! When i went through TM email support, i asked for replacement parts for the master lights switch so i could repair it myself, and they sent it to me no issue for free, perhaps i was lucky.

[@abdulmismail]

@@RedKiteRender My specific complaint was that I received a defected item. I should point out that functionally, both iron switches on the bottom left of the throttle quadrant, work. It's just that when they're both in the "off" position, the bit that protrudes swivel and wobble. But, when they're in the "on" position, they're quite sturdy. I pointed out that something that is shipped without quality control (as mine were brand new) should be exchanged. They said I could return them and re-order but then I wouldn't qualify for the Black Friday discount. When I uploaded a review on Trustpilot stating that I was working with one air force and that we may need 20 to 40 units and TM wouldn't be considered, I received an e-mail the following morning offering to exchange mine (after arguing with me for several days). I just ignored them. Anyway, appreciate the review. Thanks for your continued work on DCS content!

[@RedKiteRender]

Hah always good to get one back. It's honestly a good thing you didn't get TM warthog hotas's the stick's plastic gimbals are a nightmare. TM sorely need to re-design / remaster it for the modern market.

[@abdulmismail]

@@RedKiteRender Oh, that's the thing. I did get them. I was so impressed with their TPR pedals, I decided to get the entire HOTAS plus the F-16 and F-18 sticks. But, you're not the only one who has said that Thrustmaster need to seriously redesign their hardware. It's just fortunate that I don't fly DCS that often. I'm more of an aerospace engineer and private pilot who is interested in assisting ED secure military projects so I use it as a marketing tool (have all the modules) but I'm not like you guys who are avid sim guys.

[@CallsignWombat428]

just ordered mine with the mfssb ex stick and shaker kit , switching from the f18 throttle. questio, how does the throttle work with no detents on the orion base? how do i bind throttle off and idle? is it just calibrated in the simapp settings? seems a little unreliable if thats the case. on top of that, if thats the way of doing that, would that be compatible with bms?

[@RedKiteRender]

Has a virtual button in and out of the idle position, and you configure the AB location via software. It works with both BMS and DCS no problem. It uses 10bit Hall effect sensors so it's pretty accurate on that front.

[@CallsignWombat428]

@@RedKiteRender wow very cool! thank you. im excited

[@paulf1389]

Would this fit an Obutto Revolution throttle base? I have the Warthog throttle on this currently

[@TheSd1cko]

I really wish they would sell just the throttle. I have no need for the stick with having a Virpil base along with the A10 and F18 grip.

[@RedKiteRender]

They do! You could even buy just the grip on it's own.

[@albertzhou23]

uh you can pull out that cable a bit. There is a certain reserved length inside. Anyway, good review RedKite.

[@nickduan4949]

Yep. You can pull out the cable.

[@Gunfreak19]

Might get it once they make one Taurus competableone.

[@einarabelc5]

The whole cable thing with 100,000 repetitions support is a bad idea. I get it's metal but some sort of port needs to be designed, the thing is, they worked with what they had which is the Orion platform. Something has to be designed from the ground up to solve that issue and route the cable inside. Btw, remember, just because you don't see the cable doesn't mean is not getting pulled, try opening an old hotas and see if that doesn't happen.

[@okpail]

Eh great review, but I am wondering how does the real F16 do this? I see a lot of very expensive equipment coming to the market, but very rarely a comparison to the real thing... and what the design desicions where the led to doing things differently?

[@RedKiteRender]

I'm not sure i follow your question. I do point out divergences from the real throttle to add extra functions not present on the F-16 handle, which were added to accommodate extra features like vr zoom / trackir recentre, or the JF-17's extra hat. With exception to extra simulator specific controls it can be bound 1:1 the exact same as the real aircraft. It was designed to be more ergonomic than other aircraft (in fact the F-16 has a lot of that design philosophy in general) to provide the pilot with greater controls on hand and less fatigue during flight, along with ease of control whilst pulling G's. So you're not reaching off the controls during a dogfight for example to toggle a switch like master mode, instead you flick the dogfight switch as needed. Now obviously, the real deal is higher grade components, but, given I've not sat in a real pit, or flown one, i cannot say how that varies in detail. I can tell you whilst the mechanism for the AB detent is different, the handle motion is more or less the same however.

[@MasterNorris2014]

2:45 tell me you’re a hornet pilot without telling me you’re a hornet pilot. Yes that RDR cursor is odd if you’ve never tried to bind your controls in a similar matter to the viper, but it honestly feels more intuitive using your thumb anyway

[@RedKiteRender]

Not really got anything to do with a specific airframe. 90% of throttles we can buy have their slew on the front, even the X-55 with the side slew, up was up. The F-16 slew feels canted 45 degrees, (it's not) but because of the large range of rotation the handle goes through it feels that way.

[@sethr.4600]

Will the base attach to the same products (mounts) that work for TM?

[@reload54]

Just got mine today, how do you get the throttle to go from off to idle or back again, Idle/mil/AB is all working fine just can't turn it off or on without a keybind, thanks anyone for the help

[@RedKiteRender]

Physical requires you to pull the lever and rotate the handle then move. In game requires you to bind the virtual buttons which activate when you enter or exit the cut off physically.

[@reload54]

@@RedKiteRender Thanks, I didn't have throttle idle and throttle off bound which after binding all three it worked great! So smooth and I'm loving it.

[@digitalsignal.]

great review thanks kite. jea that cable length makes me worried so i pass that sadly till maybe a bether version comes out.

[@SlaggedGhost50]

If one has this Orion throttle, are you able to buy the standalone hornet throttle and hot swap then when you want to? On the website it seems like the hornet throttle doesn't have the metal plates below the throttle to attach to the base.

[@RedKiteRender]

Hornet handles don't use a plate, just the Orion base. It's possible to swap between them as you wish, you'll need 10-15 mins and some tools to change the parts over however, so not ideal if you're flying both frequently.

[@SlaggedGhost50]

@@RedKiteRender Awesome! Well done review, love your videos!

[@Madeyes6]

Can you leave the detent frame attached to the body but change the throttle tops back for twin engined jets?

[@RedKiteRender]

The detent plate has to come off in order to use the hornet grip, otherwise it collides.

[@Madeyes6]

@@RedKiteRender that’s a pity. It would be worth a buy if it could be left on but I wouldn’t want to set it up every time I changed jets. Cheers for all your vids.

[@Iknowwhyyoufly]

Question: I have the TM F-16 Stick but need the Winwing F-16 throttle. Are they compatible?

[@RedKiteRender]

Yes, in fact i use the TM A-10/F-16 stick, with a Virpil base on it, with the WW F-16EX Throttle!

[@Iknowwhyyoufly]

@@RedKiteRender Wow, thanks! Now, where can I order one from?

[@RedKiteRender]

@@Iknowwhyyoufly Links to WW's store should be in the description.

[@justaguydoinstuff]

Is the base orion made of metal or plastic? I just received my v2 version and it's a lot lighter than I expected...

[@RedKiteRender]

it's aluminium structure, covered with plastic for detailing and unlike the TM Warthog doesn't have a weighted base.

[@justaguydoinstuff]

@@RedKiteRender ah ok, so the top is aluminum and the base is plastic?

[@rwhunt99]

I didn't see the price of it, is it just the grip or is it the whole shebang? You went pretty fast so I had a hard time catching what you were saying.

[@RedKiteRender]

You can find the store page links in the description, you can buy just the handle, base, or both combined.

[@Marcin79W]

Anyone can run this throttle in MSFS2020? Mine is not seeing it. Thank you for the video.

[@ashdonsimmons01]

How often do they restock? Can I find one used?

[@nev0076]

Would it be possible to play with VR devices ?

[@WICKED_WABBIT]

Could you use this with the hornet module or would that detract from the functionality?

[@RedKiteRender]

It should be okay, but not ideal, given you've only one throttle. Will depend a little on what stick you've got it paired with, if you go with the F-16EX stick it'll be no issue to bind all hotas controls.

[@WICKED_WABBIT]

@@RedKiteRender I’m trying to upgrade from my current setup and not really sure what to get. I like the buttons on the stick but you can swap the f16 and f18 throttle handles?

[@RedKiteRender]

The Orion joystick base can be used with both the F18 and F16 grips interchangeably only takes a minute to swap.

[@justin5221]

Hi, where can I buy this Orion HOTAS F-16EX?

[@RedKiteRender]

Video description

[@thomasmaier7053]

Spot on, I want one!

[@cbet25]

What button/switch do you use for zoom?

[@RedKiteRender]

I use the rear of the two sliders on the right side of base. With the hornet grip that works well, but with the taller F-16 grip it's not quite ideal. I've been thinking about extending that lever with something.

[@kurt120032002]

does this work with BMS? That is an ancient platform with strange limitations.

[@RedKiteRender]

03:53 and 04:35

[@kurt120032002]

@@RedKiteRender thank you, I missed it

[@prodog2355]

is there a way to disable one axis for the throttle? since its single engin jet?

[@RedKiteRender]

Just ignore the second axis when binding your controls.

[@prodog2355]

@@RedKiteRender i want to disable it as i cant get mine to work with more then 8 axis

[@RedKiteRender]

@@prodog2355 Ah are you talking about enabling extra axis on the rotary knobs? Yes there's a limit unfortunately. I did ask WinWing myself on the Orion 1 if they'd implement the software to disable the second throttle axis with the viper handle for this purpose but they've not implemented it.

[@prodog2355]

@@RedKiteRender it a little stupid no? That they advertise so many axis and buttons but can actually support it

[@prodog2355]

@@RedKiteRender i wanted to have Man RNG and the hmd knobs as axis but they will have a conflict...cant find a work around and all ww said was windows doesnt support it. When binding it in dcs its too slow in game and with 5x acceleration it doesnt feel 1 to 1 in the cockpit

[@JAMESMARCALLINUS]

0:16 ALFA DELTA ROTARY 1:41 2:06 F-35;TROTAL 2:32 ALTITUDE AND COMUNICATION/ 3:09

[@ArianvanPutten]

That wire tension makes me physically sick. Oof. Apart from that very nice

[@RedKiteRender]

Another commenter discovered you can gently pull an extra inch of wire out from the base, which helps.

[@راشدالشيخ-ه9ح]

Where can I buy

[@azaryhaaurilen181]

I want this... throwing my money at them as soon as it is in stock again

[@harksgaming7455]

Have you had any problems with it so far?

[@RedKiteRender]

As of last week my Antenna Elevation knob broke. There's a rubber washer inside that split, I've since opened it up and replaced the washer and it's good as new again. I've a video on that coming sometime in the next week or so, but other priorities atm. Otherwise I'm quite happy with it. rather disappointing to have a simple part fail, but an easy repair.

[@harksgaming7455]

@@RedKiteRender Were you able to fix the atenna elevation knob?

[@RedKiteRender]

@@harksgaming7455 Re-read the above, yep, i did fix it.

[@harksgaming7455]

@@RedKiteRender Thank you so much for the response! Thinking between Virpil and WinWing right now.

[@cychosz]

im sold

[@leorcm]

Problem with winwing is that 60% tax to inport. I live in Norway and this makes it just too xpensive to buy

[@TheSaintArmando]

In terms of the throttle itself, to me it looks fairly cheap (plasticy) and the dimensions look a bit off, i own the cougar and i find that the cougar seems and i assume, feels much more like the real thing.

[@RedKiteRender]

Couldn't speak for the exact dimensions, but the body of the throttle and handle is all metal, just the switches are plastic.

[@nexus888]

The buttons looks like cheap plastic. Are they properly done?

[@RedKiteRender]

They feel solid, plastic isn't 'high grade' but it's certainly not cheap either. They've nice and tactile switches underneath too.

[@fjb5894]

It's all GREAT for those getting it for free and peddling as their marketers. However, if you're a paying customer, that is a COMPLETELY different horrible experience. Tried to order, waited weeks, and then went to complete the purchase and the order DID NOT EXIST!

[@JAMESMARCALLINUS]

HANDLE ALFA FOR RIGHT SIDE WIRING ANDBFUNCTION

[@sam80036]

How do I buy it?????

[@RedKiteRender]

Store links in the description

[@LoosMoose]

@@RedKiteRender I see the link to the manual, but not to the store?

[@LoosMoose]

Never mind, sorry, reloaded page and found it.

[@jim5118]

Too bad WinWing only accepts Paypal, was looking to purchase their products.

[@chocks9350]

Orion2 F-16 works perfect in all ways....

[@JAMESMARCALLINUS]

Booking F-16 handle to me 0:57

[@SteelbeastsCavalry]

How much?

[@RedKiteRender]

$531.90 full price, currently $329.90 on sale, but out of stock currently, restock on the 9th (plus any postage and import taxes)