LOW vs HIGH Volume: Which is OPTIMAL for MUSCLE GROWTH?

[@vedmodikauratg1865]

Next video: how to grow beard optimally

[@vittoclavijo3616]

whats the optimal frequency of shaving

[@prod.bygygahurts304]

Minoxadil

[@Viking_Raven]

Not natty beard. That's the only way for someone who doesn't have the genes for it.

[@cartoonhanks1708]

Dermaroll/microneedling or stippling with micro needles there's a maximum and minimum length of the needles (longer than 2mm bad but shorter and it's just irritating the skin) and you shouldn't do it more than one or twice a week, sometimes I think every few weeks because you create scar tissue thus not allow hair to grow there. Use Minoxidil but take it in pill form (topical and lower percentages works too) because it's stronger topical doesn't work any better. Dihydrotestosterone/things that convert into it such as Testosterone. And pretty much friction and slight irritants on the skin, anything that draws blood flow to the skin. And just wait basically. Gary Linkov a plastic surgeon has some videos on it go look up his stuff.

[@cartoonhanks1708]

@@Viking_Raven If you have a patchy beard if you let it grow long enough it covers the patches otherwise you just wait until you're older or just don't grow where the patches are

[@GreatDomski]

Shout out to the high volume uploads 🤙

[@WolfCoaching]

Thank you for the support!

[@Jimmy29li]

I appreciate the science behind lifting and study the literature constantly, but also compete and coach. There are so many ways to go about training with volume, frequency, rep range, etc that it comes down to the individual and how THEY respond. The studies show this as we still can't pinpoint the BEST way to train.

[@I_Might_B_Wrong]

I'd love a video with your perspective on building muscle while also participating in another sport and avoiding burning out by doing too much as well as touching on the interference effect.

[@cameront3596]

Thank you for the detailed breakdown.✌🏾

[@deboraharnaut989]

Excellent video! Keep up the great work

[@00HoODBoy]

Appreciate the realistic approach and contextualization.

[@gerym341]

Excellent video. Very helpful. Thank you, Doctor

[@josephmoore977]

Awesome video. Dr. Milo is one of the best in the industry

[@cicciuzzu5032]

Excellent content, new subscriber here!. I would be interested in growing my shoulders as well as the entire portion of my legs (from gastrocnemius and tibialis, the latter most of the times neglected, to quads and hamstrings). Thanks so much and keep up the hard and high quality work!

[@newsean6771]

Please make a neck hypertrophy video

[@LouisSerieusement]

great idea

[@user-ii7xc1ry3x]

he can't, he a pencil-neck :( we aren't allowed to grow neck, ever

[@WolfCoaching]

I’ll do it if enough people are into the idea!

[@user-ii7xc1ry3x]

@@WolfCoaching let's gooo

[@uscmhudson5504]

@@WolfCoaching What about multiple work outs per day and how it affects hypertrophy? Would that comparable to longer rest times?

[@joaoamstalden6321]

Excellent vídeo, as always.

[@G.Bfit.93]

Yeah, I train HEAVY DUTY and easily get 10+ sets per muscle for most muscles per week.

[@geneharrogate6911]

TL:DW High volume. Ask any competitive bodybuilder.

[@hmquadros]

ALWAYS take sets to failure an you won't need more than 6-8 sets per week.

[@spurzo-thespiralspacewolf8916]

Exactly

[@LNBarbell]

Hey Milo, does tendon adaptation have the same trends as muscle? I.e. does low volume high intensity build tendon strength and high volume lower intensity cause tendon hypertrophy (or thickening)?

[@michaelbarletta1024]

4:10 I think I asked this in the comments of a video recently so thank you for addressing it. I am still unsatisfied with the answer because I feel like there should be a better way to more accurately determine how much volume you get per muscle in a given exercise but knowledge is limited at this time😕

[@liamhuse6597]

I don't agree with the rest periods thing. Rest pause has been seen to grow the same amount of muscle by not fully letting muscles recover, rather make sure all rest pause sets ensure every rep is highly effective for growth. I had the best growth doing 10-12 reps to failure, then take short rests (30-45sec) and do 3-4 rest pause sets of roughly 5 reps.

[@frog6054]

So all you do is rest pause for all exercises?

[@joojotin]

rest pause is different from low rest period straight sets. All the literature shows low rest is worse and less time efficient, yet rest pause, dropsets etc show same result as longer rest period straight sets but they create more fatigue so they should be used sparingly. They are as effective but the plus is time efficiency, yet they create more fatigue, pick your poison.

[@liamhuse6597]

@@frog6054 I hate spending ages in a gym especially just to rest between sets, I also am a 'low rep guy'.. look up bulldozer training if you want to see more of this style, works really well for me!

[@liamhuse6597]

@@joojotin agreed - so types of short rest training is effective, just wanted to clarify that as the video misinforms that short rest periods is always worse, when actually it's a really effective tool for people short on time or don't want to spend hours in the gym 😊

[@joojotin]

@@liamhuse6597 Yeah absolutely true

[@salvarunatortuga5396]

Can we get chapters, please

[@SergioGaitePaz]

Does a Dropset count as a Set?

[@georgesarreas5509]

Roughly half. 1 set and then 4 drops found roughly equal hypertrophy with 3 traditional sets. If you count the first (activation) as 1 you are left with 4 drops and 2 trad sets. Myoreps also seem to be on the same. So I count them as half

[@papaspaulding]

Ive found in the past from my own experiments with time efficiency and maximising gains that a good rule of thumb is to simply count the reps. it equates to about the same as what the other comment here states (re: about half) For example I spent some time doing pyramid sets 1 rep, rest 2 seconds, 2 reps, rest 3 seconds, etc etc and up and up to absolute failure, which I count as 1 set. basically rest pause or myoreps in an easy to track rep structure. Basically I found 2 sets like this equalled the same results as 4 straight sets to failure (so about half) but the total number of reps performed equalled the same as the 4 straight sets. drop sets would equal the same ie so long as you get the same amount of reps total roughly it will equate tot he same in terms of what you gain from it

[@dannybyrnes1052]

Another good useful video

[@corenko]

I'm doing 20+ weekly sets with 0-1 RIR on every set. -no one ever

[@slackerm1]

Sam Sulek - Hold my cereal

[@BradSchoenfailed]

@@slackerm1 Anything works when you’re on a gram of tren.

[@user-ii7xc1ry3x]

Editor-kun has been really worried about that peach for the last couple weeks. I say we have a video about squats vs hip trusts so that he can finally relax and focus on optimizing those kaboose gainz.

[@G.Bfit.93]

I train Heavy Duty and get 10+ sets per body part easily. I wouldn't call 10 sets high volume.

[@wesrobinson7506]

I would be curious to know if using a 3 exercise superset (of differing muscle groups) would allow enough rest time for “optimal” growth

[@mushfiqurrahman1359]

i love your content but i think it would be better if the videos are bit smaller

[@Yoram-Edan]

hypertrophy is great What about doing A series of videos on Power and strength ?

[@syg1886]

Shoulder workout ?

[@baronmeduse]

With regard to the 'takeaways' I assume that this general principle of 20 sets refer to sets which are not even close to failure? So a slower accumulation of fatigue? If I consider my last session (Saturday) I did a total of 4 sets for triceps, though the total set tally included overlap from prior OHP, C.G. bench and a final set of dips following the main isolation which was skull crushers. Thus counting them in the way you set out in the 'primer' section. I should note that I am currently back training in a more 'Mentzer' fashion after a period of higher volume, due to needing to cut down training time. I am still experiencing both strength and hypertrophy gains on less than half the previous volume. What is there to say about this? I'm cognisant of the possibility that periodic change in training can be beneficial and that this lower volume approach could also stall at some point.

[@mufasaputasa3599]

I am not able to mke heads or tails of scientific research papers. Can someone tell me what is the actuall observed difference in gained muscle size in these studies? By how many milimeters, inches, square units, cubic units, or whatever other understandable units did the measured muscles grow in what time period in these groups? Answer will be greatly appreciated.

[@Han-nk3io]

measure cross sectional area in mass(kg) and then they average it out campare to pre and post training cycle. The measuring method might vary depend on the study.

[@joojotin]

I have found for me 4-10 direct sets per muscle group or movement pattern works best, all to failure and with 3min rest periods. For example I was doing recently 10 sets for back (overall), one arm pulldown was at plateau. Decreased 2 sets and started getting more reps again. I dont care what the volume is, I just care if I can progressively overload or not, if I cant, I either decrease or increse volume based on different factors. Believe me I would do 20 sets or more if it meant more muscle growth or strength for me but it just doesnt. Can you say how this relates to the high trainig volumes? If I cant see progressive overload on 10 sets but can with lower volumes, how could I do 15,20,30 etc? Is it so individual or what is going on here. Im flabbergasted that the volume recommandation has been for years 10-20 hard sets per week in the science based circles. I just refuse to believe that Im outliar. This isnt discussed enough imo.

[@user-ii7xc1ry3x]

You can perfectly be an outlier. For instance, my Back can handle close to 40 sets per week, and biceps 12 sets on top of that. This doesn't seem to be normal. My quads can't handle 10 sets per week. Again, this doesn't seem to be normal. And the other muscles are in the normal ranges. We don't have to belong to the perfect average values for every muscle group. Also, the average long rested period sets is 6-8 per session, so if your back frequency is 1/week that might explain your results.

[@joojotin]

@@user-ii7xc1ry3x Yes I agree, and of course there is many factors that go into this. I have done bro splits before, and if anything, I can possibly do more volume with bro splits because its so much easier to recover after 7 days off for that muscle group. But that isnt to say that volume is effective or more effective than doing less. Tho it also could be. It is good to take science and the research we have into account but personal experience is the only way to know for sure what works for our own bodies. I also used to be able to handle a lot of volume in the past but since getting stronger I find it harder to recover and also joints take beating from higher volumes.

[@joojotin]

@@user-ii7xc1ry3x I wonder tho how these fitfluencer coaches would approach training a real person 1on1 vs the information they share on their channels. Have they not had any clients who are on the extreme spectrums of this low and high volumes? Seems odd to me that their advice is always the 10-20 sets. Why not more general range If its "scientific" 4-30 sets or something like that. Then you could say most people fall on The 10-20 spectrum. Also there is something funny. I have seen a lot of training programs from these influencers and most of the programs are quite low on volumes vs the information they give online. And it varies a lot between muscle groups.

[@theiceman7590]

I dont think you're an outlier. I used to think you should do more volume as long as you recover and I got mediocre/zero gains. Went to single digit and I'm progressing. If you seen Peter Khatcherian recent plan he has low volume. Sean Nalewanyj said he built great progress with low volume too. I think people in studies arent training hard(volitional failure - stop when you feel like it) and they use short rest times which significantly reduces the quality of volume which is why they do more volume to make up for the lack of quality. Lastly go check out Brad Schoenfeld train to 'failure' with the late John Meadows. Dude has a RIR of like 5 😂

[@joojotin]

@@theiceman7590 Yes I know all of these things but it sounds like a conspiracy theory. I have thinked like this for a long time. But that would mean 99% of the "science based" researchers and influencers are lying. But I also cant close me eyes to what is happening right in front of me. Either everyone is lying or the research is interperated/explained poorly with no nuance.

[@Anoxerr]

Does-it even make sense talking about volume without taking "effective reps" into account ?

[@agentofenhanced2428]

yes it does, for powerlifting for example you should 99% of the time never go to failure, itss not uncomon to do 2 sets of 3 reps at an rpe of 7 to 8 and max and call it a day, they arent grindy reps or hard reps as you have 2 or 3 left and its only 2 sets but guess what? you get stronger. muscles feel volume

[@Anoxerr]

@@agentofenhanced2428 I hear you, but you missed 2 important words at the end of the video's title. Effective reps also refer to hypertrophy.

[@agentofenhanced2428]

@@Anoxerr anything above 35% of 1rm will build muscle at any rep range so all reps are effective, not all are optimal tho

[@OhDevBeard]

Vshred ad interrupted my watching of this video

[@CarneGranada]

Milo could swap his beard and hair and you wouldn't be able to tell.

[@CH1C4N0444]

Dr. Wolf, how does one determine if a muscle group is being worked directly or indirectly? Like, for bench, are the medial delts working as well? Also, how many sets/session/muscle group is an optimal range?

[@user-ii7xc1ry3x]

6-8 hard sets (with longer rest periods) per muscle per session. That's the average, but there are people who can handle higher volumes.

[@marcinz.3570]

Also keeep in mind that the more muscle groups you train in one session, the less sets overall you should do, because if you decide to do chest, back, hamstrings and quads, all in one session, by the time you get to quads, your overall fatigue may be so high that you may give up during quad sets due to fatigue and not due to muscle failure

[@marcinz.3570]

As for the secondary muscle groups (like front delts and triceps in bench press), there are few different ways on how to count them. But long story short, for most purposes, it’s best to count them somewhere from 1/3 to 1/2 of a proper set. (So for example, you would count 3 sets of bench pressing as 3 sets of chest and 1-1.5 of front delts and triceps) And how to determine which muscles are working during different sets? Well, google “excercise name + which muscles are working” :P

[@andresforero]

I don't know if you got Mike Mentzer as the embassador for low volume and then you got Arnold and Ronnie as embassadors for high volume, seems pretty stacked on one end of the spectrum.

[@theiceman7590]

Dont know if I'd describe Ronnie as high volume. His training videos suggest he used pretty normal volume, maybe even low on some muscles

[@Han-nk3io]

Both works for different time. Volume is literally dosages of stimulation. You do more when you are recovered and less when you need to lower the fatigue. The Low Volume, High Volume does not make bodybuilders champions, the genetic and drugs does.

[@theiceman7590]

Btw for low volume there was also Dorian Yates dont forget

[@le_rayon_vert]

Does anyone have any opinions on switching up bis and tris on a typical PPL i.e. doing chest/bis and back/tris? I know basement bodybuilding does something like this, and so far I’ve found that it’s allowing me to train my biceps with much more intensity after chest. But then I’m wondering if the trade-off is wise in the long run or as some have suggested it might not allow for enough rest time to maximise back and triceps. On the normal PPL I found that my arms were absolutely cooked from doing the major compound lifts. Wondering if anyone else trains this way to bring up their arms?

[@GuaridoNutri]

i like doing push with biceps touch up legs pull with triceps touch up off repeat having in mind i do bi and tri on pull and push

[@Viking_Raven]

You might be able to push your biceps and triceps harder, and they can recover in 24 hours so there should be no issue. However if you notice overlap between biceps and pulling the next day, that might not be great.

[@joojotin]

I do arms on leg days.

[@dakkitoto3467]

So 20+ sets for triceps can be for example 6 sets of chest pressing and 6 sets of extensions on monday and friday for example? = 24 "study" sets, that makes a bit more sense now..

[@Han-nk3io]

yeah if only people actually read the study.

[@elhant4994]

Is it worth it for a beginner to go higher than 10 sets per muscle per week?

[@papaspaulding]

not really. leave room to grow. so long as you are training hard with roughly 10 sets a week you'll keep make gains for a good few years at that volume. you wont make any more gains at 10+ sets a week, as a beginner you are already making gains at optimal level just putting the work in within those 10 sets Doing more would be counter productive and using time and energy for no reason, then by the time you could be using more volume later down the line your muscles will already be used to it so wont benefit as much as that extra stimuls wont be extra it'll just be the norm and you'll be forced to put even more stimuls on the muscle as well as volume. As a beginner think of progress as racing a car going up the gears. If you start the car and go straight from 1st to 5th it'll take longer, you'll struggle and then be forced to come back down the gears to where you should have gone and ultimately the transition/progress will take you longer as a result.

[@Olyrous]

So Mike Mentzer and Dorian Yates are being proven right after all?

[@diabolicamires]

YES!!!!

[@tmanthemotivator]

You look like one of Alexander the great soldiers , when you do your videos you should wear one of those badass uniforms with the helmet and a bad ass spear

[@Leffe123]

How do you even recover from more than 20 set per week on your quads :O

[@antinataliz9633]

U eat and rest. And if needed, AAS.

[@jackdemoguitar]

There needs to be a scientific review on myo reps / rest pause

[@Antonio_Serdar]

It is BS, there, I helped you 😅

[@papaspaulding]

ive found from myself in the past so long as the total number of reps per exercise over sets remains roughly the same the results will be roughly the same (if taking out other variables such as fatigue, and load, etc)

[@warrenhenning8064]

Algorithm. TAKE YOUR PICK, BROTHER. YOU CAN DO 1 LIFE-CHANGING BLINDINGLY INTENSE SET PER MUSCLE GROUP PER WEEK AND BE LIKE MIKEY MENTZER OR LIKE 80 GOD DAMN SETS AND BE LIKE ARNOLD

[@rabidraccoon1201]

And meth..

[@warrenhenning8064]

@@rabidraccoon1201 WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT MIKEY M., AMPHETAMINE ABUSE IS IMPLIED AND NEED NOT BE EXPLICITLY STATED, SO YES

[@Gargarks]

If Mentzer had actually built his physique like that I'd be all over that method.

[@theiceman7590]

Arnold did that insane high volume as a pre contest plan. Not a 365 approach

[@Mr_Clumsee]

Neck hypertrophy

[@saturnine1979]

Have you done the video about an efficient workout program? I've been doing the one Dr. Mike presented in this video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fqupeXR-hLR0aqMsi=D-8F1qfGuqiQ-ru_ Have you seen that? I would be interested to hear your thoughts on it. It seems to incorporate a lot of the techniques you spoke about.

[@sirlost94]

I feel like prison would be a great way to get candidates for studies

[@TheHybrid350]

Great

[@mc80466]

I’ve literally never heard of someone growing their triceps to any significant degree from pressing movements. So counting bench press as a set for triceps seems stupid. By that logic, you could replace sets of triceps extensions one for one with bench press, and triceps volume would be the same. Clearly that’s bs

[@papaspaulding]

I agree, its one of those universally adopted measures of volume always used which makes no real world sense. sounds good on paper but as we know you cant tag a couple of sets of bi's or tri's on the end of a push or pull workout and expect good result because "they've already got lots of stimuls bro" lol

[@mc80466]

@@papaspaulding For sure, at least it's not as bad as people who count cardio as leg training lol

[@antinataliz9633]

Count it as half a set. But yeah most people can't make any meaningful gain in arm size with compounds. I spun my wheels for years by adopting a minimalist approach to arm training.

[@Yokazz]

About half the amount of hard sets where u press counts roughly for triceps… the things looks very different for the biceps tho. There is evidance that Pulldowns for example count 1:1 as a biceps set. Same hypothrophy for the biceps Pulldowns vs biceps Curl Set. For typical rows on the other hand, it also counts against just about half a rep for biceps, evidance shows that biceps stimmulus on rows is significantly less then in pulldowns. Sorry for my bad english.

[@לאוןקוקר]

A little off your normal topic, but maybe make a video about how can you use plyometrics to enhance strength gains and athletic performance? if that's even a thing

[@Coachahmadreza]

🎉🎉

[@jacobmoney]

We don't need college. KZbin is college.

[@gokukakarot1855]

For the algorithm

[@alexanderchernoshtan9898]

Woof woof, snif snif 🐶

[@heibaimao]

Someone tag Sean and max lol

[@eddiegrant58]

Milo, do you have a Scottish accent or do my ears deceive me?

[@ArchStanton340]

He's from Belgium and not a native English speaker.

[@KurokamiNajimi]

Assuming that your muscles aren’t getting outright sore from highly effective exercises where you were fully warmed up for peak performance and taking those sets to 0 RIR with 3-5 minutes of rest between sets and splitting up those sets between multiple workouts (so that performance will go back up) I can’t imagine doing upwards of 20 sets for most or any muscle because of overuse before we even entertain CNS being a limitation. You can improve work capacity but eventually there’s just only so much abuse the body can take and it’s not good for longevity

[@antinataliz9633]

Higher volumes were never meant to be used for extensive periods of time. A smart person would periodize 1-2 muscle groups at higher volumes while reducing volume for other muscles to maintain those. Rinse and repeat.

[@KurokamiNajimi]

@@antinataliz9633 Yeah I think a 3x per week frequency could work as a form of specialization but if your goal is to be balanced it doesn’t work you’ll make more progress long term having everything at 2x per week

[@antinataliz9633]

@@KurokamiNajimi wdym by balance exactly?

[@KurokamiNajimi]

@@antinataliz9633 Each muscle group getting enough attention long term. Yeah you could cycle through each with specialization but in that case it would make more sense to just keep everything at x2 indefinitely

[@antinataliz9633]

@@KurokamiNajimi fair enough but some people find it impossible to progress on certain lifts/body parts without specializing, and that's certainly the case the more advanced u get.

[@andrewmueller9986]

You're not jacked in either picture

[@jonnyoneplate]

Clearly neither has worked for you

[@agentofenhanced2428]

yeah hes obvi a pencil neck

[@diabolicamires]

He looks good enough. And he is natty

[@jonnyoneplate]

@@diabolicamires you test his piss bro??

[@diabolicamires]

@@jonnyoneplate I tested your mother

[@diabolicamires]

@@jonnyoneplate I tested your mammoa's pu$$y