Woolie Vs MMO Real Estate Practices | Castle Super Beast Clips

[@tychoazrephet3794]

Every time Pat explains some grotesque MMO shit to Woolie I imagine the Darkest Dungeon stress damage effect over his head and the Ancestor chiming in: *There can be no hope in this hell. No hope at all.*

[@billvolk4236]

Welcome home, such as it is.

[@PickaxesandPonies]

Dazed. Reeling. About to break.

[@boldandbrash9447]

In time you will know the tragic extent of my business practices.

[@laharlkent]

I want this made as a series.

[@nocturnGER]

Old Irish Ancestor Madden, Lord of Maddentown

[@LilAnonomus]

Pat: "here's shitty mmo bullshit." Woolie: "dear god..." Pat: "so here's the thing." Woolie: "no..."

[@CastleCombatBrothers]

I get it! I understood that reference

[@malikoniousjoe]

Pat: “I have done nothing but craft farm for 3 days.” Woolie: “YOU WHAT?!”

[@TheStrxggler]

Watching Woolie vomit blood over MMO shit is the fucking best.

[@aliciafraser1835]

thing is though, most of what he vomits blood over is either out right false info from pat, or lacks necessary context. Though that being said, mmo';s are in their own weird world with it's own weird problems.

[@Blagno4]

Nah while Pat was somewhat inaccurate about housing shit and didn't mention one or two things about PVP, Woolie wasn't deceived

[@ImpeccableZentertainment]

@@Blagno4 pat puts the worst spin on all the information though

[@adamruiz3683]

Every week, Woolie is exposed to the madness of MMO conventions and Pat has to explain just how ingrained so much of this is.

[@leithaziz2716]

His reaction is as shocking as mine considering I've never played an MMO. Considering how I tend to feel depressed over some decisions (or at least how the community reacts to it) with fighting games, this shit here is 10 times worse. At least FF14 seems to be in the right place.

[@iller3]

It's a Good thing Pat doesn't know anything beyond the basicbitch stuff about BlackDesert or NewWorld or EVE or FGO because the things he explains to Woolie about WOW and FF14 are pretty CAREBEAR by comparison to how deep the well actually goes.

[@iller3]

...(and then there's people like me, who are still playing Planetside2 which is like... taking Woolie's WORST experiences from Titanfall2 Multiplayer, and sprinkling on the Salt levels he's experienced in Dokapon or FighterZ)

[@Holesale00]

I remember playing early Archage and seeing this realestate bullshit playout in REAL TIME. people waiting next to a plot of land waiting for the lease to expire cause the guy didnt log in intime to new to snipe it up

[@TheDapperDragon]

@@leithaziz2716 Well, heads up, Pat is WRONG. The housing stuff is rough, but it's not the core, or even a side activity. Its tertiary at best. Everything else is the top 10% bullshit. To explain it in Woolie terms: its like seeing the Daigo Parry, and expecting every single match you have with your friends to be that exact.

[@theotherjared9824]

The real reason people are so impressed with yoshi p is that the world of warcraft team have been in a similar situation where they had to delay an expansion. They were bombarded with questions of if they were going to add requested features and fix or remove hated ones. They literally laughed these questions off and basically said the players are at fault for playing the game wrong and not being satisfied.

[@Agent_Cobalt]

Don’t worry guys. They are renaming mccree. That’s clearly more important

[@george_denbrough]

@@Agent_Cobalt And changing pictures of women to bowls of fruit! We're SO progressive guys! We're totally not trying to distract you!

[@comingupooo]

@@george_denbrough We did it guys! We stopped sexism! Now please stop paying attention to how we got caught destroying evidence, or those violations of labor law, or that $18 million EEOC settlement.

[@Agent_Cobalt]

What do you mean you guys are just going to keep calling him mccree?

[@Lokaror]

@@comingupooo It's almost as if that ALL of the changes that happen ingame wow and overwatch have been made by individual/groups of developers in those studios because they may want to not stare at the name of the guy, or were uncomfortable with painting ect ect. Its very disingenuous to pretend some fucking suit made an active decision to say that these changes will cover up that shit. People are actually trying to do things in acti blizz, and they are the one y'all are saying the changes aren't enough at, as if all of these problems are going to be fixed in one fell swoop. Have you folks actually looked at the promising changes that have came out of this, or do you guys just dickride the hate train?

[@SkitariiRoro]

As soon as Pat mentioned the XIV housing market, you could see a sliver of Woolie's soul evaporate from his body. Having been through the hell of the Housing Wars before, I can honestly say that is the correct response.

[@SuccubiPie]

I won a house on Balmung. That should tell you everything about my PTSD.

[@coreylemon]

Yeah, there's a lot done better and right with FFXIV, but the housing market is terribly designed, and change can't come soon enough.

[@gettingannoyedquick]

I literally had to whore myself out practically to get mine and now I have a little voice in the back of my head saying "hope you don't lose your internet and or job so you won't have it anymore"

[@nonemitigation]

yeah but they're going to eventually add a whole one thousand new homes per world in endwalker!!!! (in a game with roughly four hundred quadrillion players, where entire gameplay mechanics are locked behind you having one of these homes)

[@ShadowtheRenamon]

The part that gets me is that for an FC specifically there is soooooo much tied to housing that is entirely the point of an FC. If they would just divorce that shit from housing and stick them in like an instanced room accessible from the grand companies would mean that at the very least the only thing important about them would be looks.

[@johnnyboy90528]

My favorite part about this is the fact that Pat is actually wrong about something here. You don't get the Feast armor if you're in the top 100. You get it if you're in the *TOP FUCKING 10.*

[@lewdcoffee7411]

No it's a top 100 reward lol

[@boxtank5288]

Honestly, good on Yoshi-P and the FFXIV team for pushing things back some.

[@Aeonknight87]

That top 100 feast set isn't per server, it's per data center. You have to fight it out against everyone on your server cluster to get it.

[@shoestealer2259]

i am somehow even more disgusted now

[@cephaloncurry834]

Man you can really see clearly how many times woolie hollows himself out during the explanation of Housing (Savage)

[@bplup6419]

Yoshi P has built up so much good will that he could come out and announce the game will be shut down for several months with no explanation and I'd be like, "Oh man, I can't wait to see what Yoshi does in that time."

[@weirdo3116]

24:19 I remember years ago when pat tweeted about this and the dude who did that started defending his actions by saying "well we where here first so it's our right to hold on to these houses forever. We wanna role play"

[@10kRats]

"actually I really like this system because I get to have fun at the expense of everyone else" lol

[@RawkLobstah88]

There's a subward in our server that is owned entirely by two people in a single FC, one of whom made one of the most entitled rants about people saying it wasn't fair they had an entire subward all to themselves. It's awful.

[@gettingannoyedquick]

When I see people having houses on alts it upsets me because there are FCs out there who have the money who would kill for that

[@JusteFantastico]

I feel like it's putting the blame on the wrong people in a way, though I agree it's kind of shitty behavior given the situation. If people have the time to get the gil to buy that many houses they should be able to in theory. The issue is that SE just won't fix the housing system. They create the scarcity because they made a terrible system. If houses weren't limited, who cares if someone owns so many houses? Wards were a mistake and everyone should've just had a personal housing instance. Other games have done it. FFXIV can do it.

[@whiteblacklight9603]

As an economics major, Pat's spiel made me actually hold my head in abject despair.

[@EduardoFlores-bt4fo]

Well from my experience, don't trust economist, they just do everything worse because they don't understand economy but pretend they do.

[@mortimerwake2974]

Woolie discovers the parasitic nature of the bourgeoisie in real time

[@darthrevan6]

Marxist-Leninist Woolie when?

[@Abdega]

@@darthrevan6 Marxist-Woolieism

[@acceptablecasualty5319]

I like how socialism went from "rampant real estate speculation and exploitation should be illegal" to "if you own a house you are satan" in people's heads

[@mortimerwake2974]

@@acceptablecasualty5319 I know you are just going for an epic dunk, but the subject is literally MMO real estate speculation. But the origin point for socialism isn't what you describe, that's more like "social democracy" (liberalism with leftish reforms). Socialism is more like "the people, not the bourgeoisie, should control the state and dictate to the bourgeoisie what is and is not acceptable". If you've ever heard the phrase "the dictatorship of the proletariat", that's what that phrase refers to.

[@jacobl4699]

@@mortimerwake2974 technically socialist don’t believe the proletariat should control the bourgeoisie, they believe there should be no bourgeois at all. It’s not about making the proletariat and bourgeoisie equal, it’s about eliminated the class all together. Also yes, dictatorship of the proletariat essentially means democratic rule by the majority

[@dunethewanderer8944]

TBH the most impressive title I've ever seen is the Necromancer title, which requires you to just be a fucking chad and grind out 1-200 floors in Palace of the Dead *solo* , no buying or anything

[@KhronosTrigger]

People still pay others to log onto their account and do it for them.

[@squidlump]

@@KhronosTrigger literally who?! PoTD solo is a massive grind that takes like over nine hours at least to complete a successful run with tons of ways to die very late into the run and the need to grind up the potions and equipment levels needed to get through. Besides that you’d also need to find someone who is isn’t just willing and able to do all of that but also perfectly fine with being paid to take control of your account for the time necessary to get through it all. And like if your the kind of person who can do all of that why not just sell ultimate or savage clears instead since those are easier, safer, quicker, and have an infinitely bigger market of people willing to pay for that instead.

[@DrakeSilvos]

Just recently had one of my fc members get that and he'd been going at it for months.

[@TheRockMouse]

@@squidlump you can buy runs for like several hundred dollars lmao.

[@squidlump]

@@TheRockMouse what does this even mean? Have you seen someone selling one? Have you seen someone buying one? How many unearned necromancer titles could even possibly be in circulation from this sort of business? Like seriously how big of a market even is there for buying necromancer titles? Like it’s just the title and several hundred dollars is a lot of money. Also again, a full PotD run can take 9-10 hours to complete assuming you already have everything you need and that you don’t die at any point. Like the main thing that bothers me here is that you and the other guy are talking like this is something that is even remotely common like wtf how?!

[@swagtasticpanda]

Nah I'm with woolie on this one. Buying digital houses shouldn't work like Zillow ripping off renters and buyers holy fuck.

[@Coconut-219]

I am convinced that 'most' MMOs are 'the Standford Prison Experiment' of videogames, and as such I don't touch them with a ten foot pole.

[@777mobin]

@@Coconut-219 buuuuuut FFXIV you can absolutely play it just for the story and raids and dont have to deal with any of this shit at all so there is that, i hate most mmos but XIV respects your time and they are improving it constantly

[@ricardomiles2957]

12:26 woolie witnessed another eldritch truth from the MMOs

[@inktoxicant]

I want to see Woolie's reaction to the fact that New World, an MMO funded by a company that pays zero federal taxes, has property tax on player housing and crafting/refining taxes

[@leedixon682]

What.

[@Gitskreig]

Do you reckon that is being done on purpose to act as anti-taxation propaganda by pissing off players by taxing them?

[@fearanger1]

wh Excuse me WHAT

[@iamnuff1992]

@@fearanger1 All crafting is done at crafting stations in cities, which are maintained and upgraded by the guild that owns the city. When you craft something you pay a pittance of gold towards the guild and they in return use that gold to upgrade their crafting stations so that you can craft better items, or if all the crafting benches are full, they spend it on defences to prevent other guilds from stealing the city from them. I don't know how housing tax works in that game, but the crafting tax is a nothingburger. It's literally just "crafting a new sword costs a tiny amount of money as well as iron bars."

[@UberWolfy]

I love that people (Our subreddit) are acting like Pat is ruining FF14 to Woolie and any potential players with these dicussions, when woolie could not even play Monster Hunter cuz it requires you to grind material for gear.

[@geneirai]

honestly this video is the best advertisement for the mmo I've seen "hey kid you wanna hear some BULLSHIT?"

[@Gamsterjeff600]

Grinding in monster hunter isnt that bad. In fact he can play a mh equivalent called toukiden 2 which has open world and has lots of weapons to experiment with. You gather materials by the cleanse button u dont waste time carving. Materials are easy to get

[@nozzrik4472]

@@Gamsterjeff600 That doesnt matter, if memory serves. Woolie doesnt want to waste time to gather and then craft just fit some niche fight that he is only gonna do once maybe twice.

[@autumnlotus6250]

@@nozzrik4472 exactly. Woolie has no patience for crafting or resource management that isn't brain dead fighting game mechanics

[@Hawkbreath36]

"Burn it" No Woolie that would kill the entire nightclub scene which you'll take from me over my dead body

[@Sumowning]

When did he say "Burn it" I might've missed it? xD

[@MrSaturn113]

@@Sumowning @ 29:00

[@Sumowning]

@@MrSaturn113 Cheers!

[@malikoniousjoe]

Woah woah woah, I’ve never found a Nightclub in Mist, are those actually things?

[@7U57HTJRYGHG]

It's late but.... burn alongside it

[@theotherjared9824]

Woolie slowly grows more socialist every time Pat talks about MMOs.

[@grandarkfang_1482]

Gods, no....

[@just_matt214]

Woolie boutta become The Deserter in a few podcasts lmao

[@bw6188]

Comrade Woolie

[@joebin3106]

N-pass for all

[@Agent_Cobalt]

Well for Canadians the bar is lower

[@The5lacker]

So the conversation at 30:50 is interesting in regards to Destiny because it has the same exclusivity problem, only coming from the other direction. In FF14, the Exclusivity is a hard, numerical limit. There are a set number of houses. There are a set number Feast slots for top players. If the population doubles, the number doesn't change, so it gets even more exclusive. It's a nightmare. The opposite method of exclusivity can be even worse, though. For those who don't know, Destiny has its pinnacle PvP activity called Trials of Osiris. The actual gameplay is pretty good, but the reward structure has basically always been the absolute worst: In order to get the peak rewards, you need to win seven matches in a row. In the pinnacle PvP activity. Against, presumably, other people going for the exact same thing, at the exact same skill level. The problem is, mathematically, getting a run like that is borderline impossible. Like, assuming every match is "fair" with a 50% win rate, the odds of any given run of 7 games being Flawless is 0.7%. Imagine playing a hundred matches of Trials and getting *jack shit.* This means the only way Flawless runs happen is if your matches aren't 1:1. Players seeking Flawless runs NEED there to be a large population of trash they can get easy wins against. But if you're the trash... what reason do you have to stick around? So everyone with a sub-50% winrate drop out, and then the winrate for EVERYONE REMAINING drops because it HAS TO. It's a 3v3 game mode. Three winners, three losers. The winrate across the active community always, always, ALWAYS averages out to 50%. So as the game mode hemorrhages numbers, it gets harder for everyone else, and then THEY start leaving, and it gets HARDER for everyone else, and the cycle continues until it's only the saltiest, hardest core motherfuckers sticking around, complaining about how much Trials sucks. Bungie's recently been doing a lot of tweaks to Trials, and the first big rework was to make just playing the game more appealing, and it worked... for a bit. But then Bungie did something either brilliant or completely moronic: They kept tweaking the game mode, and each tweak was widely hated by the community. So now the fact that players were naturally leaving the game mode (because even with the changes, there's no reason to spend time being someone's Flawless fodder) was muddied by the impression that players were leaving because of the changes, and the important lesson that Bungie somehow hasn't learned in SEVEN YEARS continues to elude them: Trials will NEVER work long-term, because its core assumption is the idea that the entire Destiny community is so delusional and has such a poor memory they won't realize their sub-50% win rate will get them NOTHING, so the few consistently good players never have to match up against each other and tank their respective win rates. The entire core concept of the game mode is based on what would in any other circumstance be a MISTAKE in the matchmaker. A player winning seven matches in a row means YOU AREN'T GIVING THEM BALANCED MATCHES. And that's the core of the intended experience.

[@Double512]

why didn't they just reduce the required wins or make it a tournament reward where it's conceivable that someone would win enough matches in a row to win the tournament

[@The5lacker]

​@@Double512 Because "That's not what Trials is all about!" The Seven-Win Flawless ticket is the heart and soul of the game mode. The whole idea, from its inception, is "can you win seven matches in a row to get to the Lightouse?"

[@tbotalpha8133]

@@The5lacker Honestly if it was a 1v1 mode, that would almost be viable. Because then your contribution isn't being diluted by other players. The game becomes a crucible, that burns away the weak and leaves only the strong. And eventually some invincible killer *will* arise, who can achieve 7 wins in a row.

[@bloodyidit4506]

A lot of this translates to real life. This includes shit like why slavery was a thing for so long. And the thing is there still is slavery because of this type of conflict, specifically in places with shaky laws like the rich-private entity-controlled city of Dubai.

[@abakedtater8553]

Woolie, "what does it look like?" Inevitably the person with all of those titles and unique gear is going to be a minimum height female lalafell in the frat boy plastic sunglasses. They top all leaderboards because it is the uniform of a nolifer.

[@yukaiyami]

I get so unnaturally happy when CSB talk about MMOs because Woolie’s reactions to things are pure gold.

[@Blackbeltsam5610]

hearing Woolie freak out about normal MMO conventions is hilarious

[@ryukenxx2]

Yeah but the normal conventions are terrible.

[@aydennuula979]

Because they should have never been normalized.

[@normandy2501]

If I have to take a week off of work just to play a game then I've already gone too far. I used to be into Warcraft pretty heavy, but never was I using leisure time to essentially work another job with how much MMOs ask of you typically. That's just madness.

[@Nekros4442]

@@normandy2501 I mean....its not another job to some folk. I want the week off so i can binge an entire jrpg(endwalker) in one go

[@iller3]

@@ryukenxx2 Yes. Yes they are. ...and they have barely **anything** on just how bad the not-so-normal "conventions" are in Korean _Grinders_ and niche western MMOFPS's

[@thomaslam8448]

I went back and watched this segment twice on Twitch. Chat was going crazy lol

[@leithaziz2716]

Twitch seems to have taught me that (most) chats always overreacts to anything mentioned by a streamer, for better or for worse. Usually for worse if you disagree with the streamer's opinion cause that opinion'll either be laughed off or taken to the extreme as a statement, even if the streamer never directly stated anything. Blizzard does something terrible? MMOs are trash. He didn't like this story, was bored, or thinks it's too convoluted? This story is trash, no room for argument and you cant like it. Guy says he likes linear games? Open worlds are awful. Someone in chat says something and the streamer disagrees? ONE GUY plastered all over chat. That what I've been seeing at least. Feels like the yes-man attitude taken to redicillous heights. Personally speaking of course.

[@iller3]

@@leithaziz2716 In this case I think Chat was mostly right except for one thing: These problems are still really really "CareBear" in comparison to a lot of the other MMORPGs that these guys never really experienced the End-Games of

[@loganwernicke7604]

These systems will eventually lead to the throne of want for MMO players

[@Trussme96]

This entire problem is literally just the Ontario Real Estate crisis caused by land developers and investors parking their infinite money inside of empty condos and town houses.

[@treefingers6572]

Gotta love Elmo fucking shit up by staring absently at a wall and letting his tail do what it will, shortly after sitting his dumpy on the couch cushion for a second, looking like a real goof.

[@SharkofGames45]

Knowing how VILIFIED you would have to be once you obtain this exclusive shit, I feel like it really defeats the purpose of being the biggest badass. Like why would I want a nice car if everyone is just gonna throw garbage at it and yell when I drive down the street.

[@Zenkirune]

Thankfully unlike a lot of social games, XIV's GMs take reports of aggressive harassment fairly seriously and do hand out actions. They don't enforce a "Play nice or you're gone" culture or anything, but if you're going out of your way to be a toxic PoS in XIV and get reported, it will be looked at, you will be actioned with increasing bans.

[@gunararayhanramadhan2304]

Consider the garbage like an extra challe ge to prove your extra badassery. And there are people who take pleasure in being hated

[@minmoreal]

Very true. The Free companies (guilds) on my server sandbag anyone with the armor. It's fucked. And funny.

[@JackgarPrime]

It depends on the game, honestly. I don't find people getting terribly upset with those who have Feast ranked gear or Restoration ranked titles very often. I'm sure it happens, but I don't think it's this widespread thing.

[@matehiqu9905]

you just gotta increase your snob levels

[@JackgarPrime]

Pat getting SUPER DUPER REAL with the student loan joke!

[@SoaringLettuce]

19:58 Woolie's face, holy shit

[@rollinnollin546]

Having one person be able to buy only one house seems like a really elegant solution to this housing crisis…in FF14

[@KaedeLanyo]

God, more of this stuff. I'm not bitching, i'm _enthralled._

[@kaizerdeath12]

submitting your life into MMOs and its many circles of system Hell really do be the closest to going "I reject my Humanity!"

[@ashura9699]

that’d be mobas

[@RawkLobstah88]

Replace MMOs with fighting games, or MOBAs, or FPSes, and you have the same thing, to be fair.

[@iller3]

I Absolutely DID. Right around 2001, after finding out we had lost Warcraft-Adventures forever, and the RTS & FPS market was being overtaken by doo-doo brown mil shooters ... I said those exact words, and retreated into the Hermitage of those earliest MMORPGs. ...yes even Lineage II **shudder**

[@just_matt214]

@@RawkLobstah88being good at fighting games or FPS requires the level of committment you need to be good at a sport. MMOs need you to literally run a second life.

[@RawkLobstah88]

@@just_matt214 Not really, no. They all require the same level of commitment. Back in the day, sure, MMOs were 24/7 second job grindfests. Nowadays, especially with FFXIV? You can play incredibly casually (logging in for an hour or two maybe 3 times a week) and still keep up with the gear grind. Want to commit to raiding? You might be on a bit more, but it's definitely not a "second life".

[@starwalker9188]

I would've lost my shit if, when Woolie was asking about what it looks like when someone goes around with all of their mega titles and ultimate gear, Pat just goes "Fucking *everyone* makes fun of you." Because, honestly, whenever I see someone roll into like, an RP housing and refuses to put away their fucking UWU weapon and stand around as a giant glowy asshole trying to flex, it's *hilarious* because they want to do one of the last pieces of content they haven't done but they also won't bite their ego and actually involve themselves properly IC, and everyone knows it.

[@Haru-spicy]

Elder Scrolls Online has instanced housing. You buy a house with gold or premium currency, it unlocks for everyone on your account, it's instanced, you can decorate it and position everything the way you want up to some arbitrary object limit, and you can invite friends inside and throw guild parties or whatever. Simplest shit yet somehow other games just lose their minds over it.

[@juter1122]

Some games want to simulate economics for some reason

[@sharkodile22]

On this week's episode of "Fuck Capitalism," Woolie learns that it is in fact hard for a pimp when he's trying to get his money for the rent, all the while Pat says "It's fucked up where I live, but that's just how it is . It might be new to you, but it's been like this for years."

[@grandarkfang_1482]

Clearly Socialism is the only solution for this.

[@tbotalpha8133]

@@grandarkfang_1482 Yes, unironically.

[@softie_love_beats]

I would genuinely love to see Pat's take on Old School Runescape. I feel like with how unbelievably grindy the skills are (with no real reward for maxing them out besides a cape), it would trigger his mind goblins and the goblins would all be addicted to seeing the number go up from clicking.

[@tbotalpha8133]

Classic Runescape was a fucking trip. A friend of mine got really into that hilariously sleazy side of the game, and used to tell me all about it. I remember hearing about people being in-game con artists, fraudsters and hustlers. People setting themselves up as mining barons by paying kids for their mined resources way below market price (because the kids didn't realise they were being scammed). People acting as literal merchants, buying low in one region of the map then going and selling high somewhere else. At the time it sounded scummy. But in hindsight, giving people an environment where they can play as genuine dirtbags is honestly kind of amazing.

[@Terithian]

@@tbotalpha8133 Yeah, I remember playing Runescape as a kid and having some guy tell me about an "exploit" where you could take an item from a church and sell it for some good money. Being a gullible child, I did it and was immediately beaten to death by priests, causing all my junk to explode out of my body like a loot fountain for that guy to swoop in and grab. In retrospect it's actually kind of impressive.

[@FloyDJode]

Y'know, I've been following these chucklebungers since 6th grade. I'm 24 now. 12 years and still comfy as fuck. Way to go fellas 👍

[@dianatheascian8701]

Wooile dying inside whenever Pat talks about MMOs will never not be funny

[@JcGross93]

When woolie asked "what does it look like..." I felt that. I really felt that shit.

[@rub-a-dub-ducky]

Gotta right some wrongs Pat said regarding Firmament ranks and the Hand Of Creation title. Hand Of Creation is for scoring 500,000 points on every single crafter and gatherer, or in other words, crafting and gathering an immense amount of shit inside of the Firmament. Every item turned in is worth a certain amount, so reaching 500,000 on all 8 crafters and all 3 gatherers is fucking monumental. I know ONE person that has it and she grinded out for MONTHS for it because she was bored. The "top 10" thing Pat was talking about is the Saint of the Firmament title. It was awarded to a handful of players across every data center for placing in the top 12 scores on any crafter or gatherer. It can't be given twice, even though I know people who placed within top 12 more than once. The scoring period for this was 10 days, and there were 3 seasons of this. For reference, I placed #1 on my server's scoreboard on one of my crafters, earning around 1.1 million points. That was 10 days of crafting for about 12 hours straight. It sucked and I was only able to because I have class one of those 10 days So yeah, people who have these are kinda insane

[@Holesale00]

39:43 perfectly sums up my experience as a kid. I had always wanted to try WoW then I finally played it had a good time leveling and then the situation pat describes happens, I was a kid ,I had no job, and no allowance and my parents would NEVER let me use their credit cards online even if asked I barely got the prebuilt system they bought for me, and you tell me that this will likely take MONTHS to get this cool shit this rogue was wearing? After the 30 day trial period I uninstalled it.

[@bennymountain1]

Even Woolie's volume mixer is upset by this practice.

[@mep15067]

Sorta wish Nikolai Tesla was right about the part where these man made horrors were beyond my comprehension because this is making me feel like I'm in the darkest dungeon

[@CaesarCallaway]

Just so people understand how bad the housing is one night me and my friend sat for 5 hours with 10 other individuals trying to get a house because he wanted one. At the end of the five hours the Houston sell I went to bed at like 4 in the morning and it sold about 15 minutes later to a set of lalafells which all had the same name and we're buying all the houses in the they could to resell for three times the value

[@UCannotDefeatMyShmeat]

I think it’s elite dangerous where the “I want to own this static place and officially claim it as mine for money” is literally being asked for

[@HandsFreeProductions]

Yes, but the world of ED is essentially infinite. They could do that, and they wouldn't run into housing problems for decades even if they sold off whole planets or solar systems/space stations

[@SorakuFett]

I've always taken the stance that an MMO is not the kind of game you are actually meant to *try* and 100% Like, I refuse to get on twitter so unless I stepped up my cosplay game irl and go to a FanFest, I'll never have the Cloud hair. That's just the *first* thing I ever saw that I had to come to terms with never getting. In the end, I'm now quite satisfied taking pictures of my hot musclegirl character and making small reasonable lists of collectibles, like getting every non-paid hairstyle or getting one of each Trial series mount, or every glove-type Monk weapon.

[@MoogyMook]

You have reached true enlightenment, Monk-bro.

[@disk3001]

I love experiencing MMOs craziness through Pat without having to play it. Because I love the Stories of how bonkers everything is, but actually playing it seems like torture

[@The5lacker]

That’s where 90% of enjoyment from Eve: Online comes from. The other 10% is from the rush of committing fraud.

[@malikoniousjoe]

14 is a lot of fun imo, I tune in about 3-4 months of the year, catch up on some things and have fun with the timed events. I can totally see how it becomes a second job though, even after 2-3 years I’m still not through the first expansion

[@Blurredborderlines]

It's actually a good one tho Source: Dude, Trust me

[@ExaltedUriel]

To be fair, most of the crazy shit they talk about it 100% optional. If you want to be a scrub (like me) and basically only do MSQ and the few side story raids, you totally can, I'm at "endgame" and I've never touched PvP a single time. But there are definitely people who no-life the game and do this housing and insane grinding shit.

[@R0kushi]

I didnt' knew how much I needed to see woolie visually suffering about MMOs

[@DMGamer_PC]

Genuinely listening to Pat talking about his friend and I'm thinking, "Yeah, that's some dedication. I think if I had the time I'd like to do some of that" and then he starts talking about the BIG FISH and my brain just goes "OH HEEEEELLLLLLL NO, FUCK THAT SHIT, I'M OUT. YOU'RE FRIEND IS FUCKING CRAZY."

[@danherondraws]

eesh, and now I'm reminded that the Hololive girls are going to play FF, Pekora already started, so that means even more people will flood the game

[@leithaziz2716]

I'm surprised none of them have done that untill now. FF14 always seemed like the most popular game out there that I've been hearing about from the sidelines cause I dont play MMOs.

[@kot4311]

@@leithaziz2716 MMOs are pretty bad to stream if you have over, like, 1000 viewers, since you can’t really control being bombarded by other players

[@leithaziz2716]

@@kot4311 I feel like fighting games are worse to stream to your audience as a casual unless you're Calli. They either end up playing against way better opponents and get bullied all day, the opponent plays too easy for the V-tuber, or they just stream training sessions and that's it. Shooters are technically the same way if you're bad at them and play with randos. Ina streamed Strive once and when she talked about watching the story and not understanding a thing, OOF, I don't even watch Ina normally but that that response crushed my soul as a lorehead, I couldnt even look at chat. It sucks when an influencer makes something you love look bad. It either feels like you cant relate to the majority or something you like is just bad and you're dumb for liking it :( They say your opinion alone is what matters, but then you face shit like this. Anyway, thanks for listening to my TED talk.

[@riastradh]

@@leithaziz2716 that’s entirely on Ina for getting into the story this late lmao

[@jjrambles683]

@@leithaziz2716 I mean she doesn't even play fighting games regularly did you really expect her to grasp all the lore in the story mode in Strive?

[@VerbalLearning]

It's NOT free real estate.

[@dylanfarris7647]

The difference between SEs FF14 communication and Blizzards with WoW is staggering. Square understands they are selling a product and need to try their best to live up to a certain level of quality with the IP they are handling. Meanwhile Blizzard devs actively attack their player base for daring to question poor decisions. While blaming nearly all problems the game has on the players not understanding why their shitty decisions are actually great.

[@afterpasthours7504]

Crazy Talk proc’d when Pat said “it’s the only MMO where you can play the day it comes out”

[@mgskomododragon10]

Pat talking about running the market board resonated so hard with me because I did that with some fuzzy slippers worth 800k

[@AndrewTraver]

"And they'll be goddamned if you repay your student loan" XD I'm done

[@jollykami]

in regards to other people being impressed by gear, in WoW 9.1 I got slyvanass' legendary hunter bow first kill and I had people whispering me to talk about it. You DO get a little satisfaction from the cool thing being recognized by others

[@corwinchapman4565]

The thing that made me immediately dip out on MMOs back when I tried them back in... 2010? Ish? Was the idea of 1) buying a game 2) paying a monthly subscription 3) then also paying money in-game for extra stuff which went entirely against my entire ethos of videogames as a concept

[@Volothos]

One thing Pat forgot was that; for context I live in central time. If you want to be on top of housing, you need to log in at 5 IN THE FUCKING MORNING

[@joelsheffroth9398]

15:15 I am the growth that is encrooaaaaachiiiing

[@leon2550]

"I don't know a whole lot about anything" -Darlington "Woolie" Madden, 2021 2:21

[@DoctorThundah]

The gigachad lalafell in a Starbucks uniform truly is the highest state of being

[@ErrantHomes]

Pat's explanation of people taking off for MMO releases and getting snubbed is so fucking appropriate as I watch my coworker do exactly that and get railed because the of the delay holy shit

[@CoalMineTed]

19:35 Real Estate Practices

[@Michaelanthony24680]

What I'm hearing here is that MMO's are exploiting mental sickness.

[@just_matt214]

Not really - they enable it.

[@charleswisconsin9196]

@@just_matt214 why not both?

[@maninredhelm]

If they weren't exploiting these ancient human instincts, something else would. People have to overcome these feelings themselves. You don't need the shiny rock the other caveman has. You need food and water. And a good internet connection.

[@sluggger3753]

The " I am sweating" had me dying lol

[@Killjoyreign]

Man I was covered in sweat/wanted to vomit up blood with how Pat explained the FFXIV economics and housing market. AND I'M A SUPER CRAFTER ON LEVIATHAN! I've been playing on and off since 1.0. What have I done with my life?! Oh hey a new mount...

[@Biodeamon]

MMOs had the fake real estate market cornered even before they were a cold gleam in zucc's glass doll eyes

[@billvolk4236]

The omegabotch of MMO housing is giving me newfound appreciation for Animal Crossing

[@ArchArturo]

like I said on Twitter... As someone that wants to play a game as an escape, the thought of grinding online to pay my online home, and then go to work IRL to pay for my IRL apartment... That is fucking Bullshit. I rather die/respawn in Dark Souls.

[@ricardomiles2957]

Just to point out the problem here is the toxic environment that was created and not grinding per se. Some people like to play Mario Kart and some like to play Euro truck simulator while listening to hour long podcasts

[@ArchArturo]

@@ricardomiles2957 Oh yeah, I sometimes do that with MtG Arena as well; to each their own fun, of course. But... You are right, it was the scum attitudes that some people got that made the problem.

[@RawkLobstah88]

Eh. Once you get it, you just need to walk in once every 45 days and it's yours to keep. Getting one is awful, but once you get it, it's smooth sailing, and now with the lottery system and all the restraints added to even entering the lottery, bots, FC-swaps, and alt buying is going to be cut down immensely and the system *should* be a bit more streamlined.

[@OCMOOO]

Just want to say thank you Square for not mistreating their female colleagues like Blizzard Its the little things

[@tbotalpha8133]

...That you know of.

[@ricardomiles2957]

29:01 Joker Woolie rises

[@meteor22]

This was my favorite part of this episode. Woolies reaction to all the real estate BS in ff14 was hilarious.

[@MrDalisclock]

This conversation reminds me why I don't play MMOs. The amount of time and effort required to do some of stuff, assuming you even can if you joined right now, is exhausting to even think about.

[@attackofthecopyrightbots]

Woolie is always the outsider in anything that’s not fighting games or dmc

[@Gilbals]

Ya know, some of this problem could be alleviated if they offered Free Company guild halls for purchase by admin that work like the old City of Heroes bases, where you could decorate and build within the private instance however you like, make room for everyone, and alleviate a bit of the private housing need.

[@patrickmcpartland1398]

You can have a private room in your FC house

[@Gilbals]

@@patrickmcpartland1398 CoH was a full private instance for bases, and could be built as you wanted (as long as you had the capital to keep adding) including multiple floors, private areas, materials, furniture, etc etc etc. No fighting over unclaimed plots or stuff like that. Just, jump in the base portal, area in town, and boom welcome to your fully customized house.

[@B0110CK5]

My eyebrows lifted at the exact same time as Woolies. Had no idea the Feast was *that* bad

[@UltimaKeyMaster]

Woolie: Animal Crossing. Pat: Yes. Me: *NO NO NO NO NO NO, YOSHI-P EXPLICITLY SAID DON'T COMPARE IT TO THAT, YOU FOOL.*

[@throwdown1776]

This sounds like an MMO or isakai manga/anime, konosuba, always sunny in Philadelphia plot for a season

[@cyberninjazero5659]

This finna be a subplot of Log Horizon

[@JayceCH.]

Its community is great.

[@thehoodedteddy1335]

37:43 this build up and payoff made me laugh way too hard at work

[@fennrir9809]

I played WoW several years ago Got to level like... 70, 80. Had tons of fun with the guild and raids and crafting and PvP and stuff But hearing about the insane stuff that's lurking behind every MMO, makes me question if I was even playing the game hahaha

[@austin.....]

MMOs don't respect your time - once you finish with your casual enjoyable content, they hit you with the timesinks, grinds, and RNG bullshittery. By then you'll possibly be too invested not to commit even more of your time to get less of that satisfaction you received as a noobie. This is the way.

[@darylsummers3338]

@@austin..... Depends on the MMO. You talking most older MMOs? Yeah, you're definitely correct. Even some modern ones too.

[@Reaver259]

So anyone know the discord he's talking about with the moogle bot at 43:10 asking for a friend

[@darkdestiny661]

Fuck, I'm asking for me. I need this in my life

[@AndrewTraver]

The last mmo i think i actually enjoyed was the playstation 3's "playstation home(?)" Just a literal "say hi to real people" simulator XD

[@b_l_a_c_k-l_i_t_e]

This video should of been titled, Pat explains the Japanese School System to Woolie While he vomits blood.

[@b_l_a_c_k-l_i_t_e]

Top 10 top 100 scores for all to see social superiority ensues

[@hyonizaki000]

I could listen to Pat talk about MMOs all day.

[@TomDwarfThrower]

I doubt it, but I would also love if people's houses arent grandfathered into the new lottery system. You own 5 houses? Well, you're going to lose 4 of them (with refunds).

[@Blurredborderlines]

No refunds, people who hoarded houses should be punished for making things worse for literally everyone for no reason.

[@TomDwarfThrower]

@@Blurredborderlines That would be even better, but lets temper our wishes :)

[@TysonRex37]

People already can only own one house, Pat was wrong (well, thought that the old system was still in place)

[@TomDwarfThrower]

@@TysonRex37 I checked the wiki, it does say that players can have one house per character, and they are changing it to only one house per account.

[@krodmandoon3479]

Nah, fuck that noise, gatekeeping rules. Look upon my giant Moogle mansion and despair.

[@gold_spin1639]

The only experience I have with mmo’s is a niche text based mmo in a discord server called ENDLESS WAR. If you know about endless war you know that everything revolving the game and the community is fuckin bonkers cause the lore and game itself is built on the actions of the players. To put it in simple terms, the entire game is based around gang warfare between two gangs, the rowdy’s and the killers (I’m a rowdy myself) within New Los Angeles City aka Neo Milwaukee, NLACakaNM for short. Everything revolves around players grinding for slime by mining, farming or killing other players. The more slime you have, the stronger you get which obviously leads to players getting massive amounts of slime and becoming unstoppable titans where it requires coordinated attacks to take them down. And that’s only scratching the basic surface of the gameplay. Over the years there has been dozens of features added and currently we are in a transitional period called the dream where the game reverts to the very first version of the game while the next season is being developed. In other words there’s still gonna more crazy shit added. I’m honestly more of a passive observer than anything since I don’t one hundred percent vibe with mmo gameplay but just watching stuff happen in the server and reading articles on the wiki about past events is insane. There’s an entire wiki article about a rowdy named doopedy shmoople who had their soul stolen in a Pokémon match against the kingpin of the killers, ben saint, and the resulting Pokémon tournament that occurred in order to win their soul back.

[@nekroz_of_super_dora3477]

What the actual fuck did I just read

[@Revan058]

@@nekroz_of_super_dora3477 Something really, really stupid.

[@music79075]

45:02 everything is a circle Woolie. You can (not) escape.

[@TheMisterGriss]

I think the top 100 getting unique rewards as like a status symbol is pretty cool it's just a shame that in most games it ends up with hackers or people using bots and stuff that end up with those rewards

[@NihilTruth]

I don't play the game but I work with a guy who got the crafting title. He took time off to do it and did nothing but craft.

[@ryukenxx2]

I might actually play an MMO again if FF14 is actually holding true on removing the bullshit.

[@Sumowning]

I recommend looking into a better MMORPG

[@TysonRex37]

FF14 is definitely worth the time. Even some of what Pat said has already been removed, like people being able to own multiple houses (you can only own one), and now players also can’t buy a house just to sell it to scalp it to someone else.

[@TysonRex37]

Also while Pat is right that Apartments are limited, they’re also so abundant there’s 100% enough for everyone in the game and they’re pretty cheap. Hell, me and my friends all own apartments in a single, otherwise empty apartment building.

[@ExaltedUriel]

FF14 is definitely the best one out there right now, especially if you're a fan of Final Fantasy to begin with. And the free trial™ includes the first expansion, up to Lv 60, so you'll have well enough time to tell if you like it or not before you start paying a sub.

[@Sumowning]

@@ExaltedUriel Sounds awfully subjective, especially if you consider the outdated MMO mechanics FF14 has

[@JOfJaZ]

I love it when someone destroys the housing market for XIV If I were in charge of the game, if you are in an FC with a house that has enough rooms for every member, you shouldn’t be allowed to buy a house. Period.

[@BestFf14Player]

theres also a random 2-24hr timer on actually buying the house. took me 12+ hrs of active camping vs others, in click war to get mine a few months back. ...and anybody who wants to relocate an already existing plot can just run up and bypass the timer. that alone causes toxicity like crazy

[@lodestarrobot]

I spent 20 minutes searching for my first apartment in 14 and i only got one cuz i found a ward with 4 vacant ones

[@zerwif]

On Elemental, nearly every server seems to forget about subdivisions. Every ward had 60+ vacant rooms if you are fine with a rotated map.

[@TysonRex37]

Same with Kurtis. Me and my friends are literally the only people in our apartment building, and it’s in the Kugane zone too.

[@benlunaris]

If you think you have enough time to develop a game/patch/update/exspansion assume it'll take atleast a month extra because MMOs are a massive trainwreck of constant things stacking on each other like a game of Jenga on a needle that's on top of spike in the middle of a hurricane. I'm not gonna play it but I've played enough to understand. It's usually also a good idea to assume that any new content will be done by someone like day 1 because some people are insane or find the initial bugs/glitches and abuse the fuck out of that so delaying the release is a little pointless but worth it.

[@Shiibbae]

6:48 Pat witnesses a crime and turns a blind eye to it

[@cattibingo]

Cats doing cat things