World of Warships- Hate CVs? Do I Have Some Great News For You!!!

Hey guys! Today we have some news concerning some upcoming changes to CVs! Enjoy!
DevBlog:blog.worldofwarships.com/blog...
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Outro Music: Stranger Think- C418
Music: Stranger Think- C418

[@rickwiggins283]

In my experience the more complicated WG makes something the more they are trying hide or obfuscate something else.

[@Taooflu]

Very true. Although I will say the sub changes haven’t been bad at all.

[@mungo7136]

Definitely standard WG approach in Tanks

[@janosch13100]

My first reaction: "As a cv player im fine with changing things as long as its still fun" My second reaction: "DID THEY FIX HIDDEN MENACE THOUGH?"

[@meneldal]

As much as I like nerfing CV spotting, it feels like they went a bit too far there. CV being able to spot his own targets was rarely the biggest complaint. And at least assuming your CV wasn't as stupid as your dds you weren't going to be entirely blind. I feel like they went out of their way to make it hard to understand and also entirely destroy the balance and will need tons of adjustments. They could have made most people happy with minimap only spotting and it would have been easy to implement. This system is going to be very hard to implement, full of bugs and most players won't understand it for a fair bit.

[@elliottbriggs3385]

Your thought on the bugs is right on the money. Remember when they tried to change the camera, and we got what? 6 artillery bugs? I can’t imagine what’s going to happen with these big changes

[@rekslegiune6004]

Ye minimap is cool thing, they can do this for all ships, no more island or smoke camping.

[@caniconcananas7687]

@@rekslegiune6004 Yours is one of those messages which make me wish can use more than a simple "I like it". Reading about naval history, islands are not an important tactical factor. Islands are not used as shields. That's a stupid copy of the hull down mechanic in World of Tanks. No relation with real naval combat in 20th century.

[@xel1206]

Never thought I might say that but: Could that potentially be too much of a nerf for CVs in the end?

[@caliburxzero]

No it's not. CV apologists and ignorant players need to suck up that the advantages enjoyed were just that crazy. Gaslighting the more skilled and informed players won't convince any of us of this bad take.

[@professorq4081]

I would have to disagree. We prefer balance not out right not make it fun for CV players.@@caliburxzero

[@OiiRobbi3x]

@@professorq4081 Are you playing the same game where is this balance you speak of i have not seen it in a long time.

[@kingmuddy5898]

Yeah I don’t know how I feel about CV’s not being able to spot at all. Plus defAA will be able to attack planes that can’t see at all (besides the defAA ship but that’s usually not a good target) I will say that if you ARE spotted, AA might be even more useless.

[@anthrax2413]

They cannot spot while traveling at high altitude. But they can spot while traveling at low altitude.

[@Sulfuron41]

So I have main'd CVs since their inception. I genuinely enjoyed the RTS style game play. It gave your ship more of a tactical feel as opposed to just flying around, spotting DDs and targeting helpless lone wolves over and over and over until they die a death of a thousand cuts. I feel removing spotting from CV aircraft pretty well completely is just fine for me at this point. I'm am 100% sick of players whining about me not spotting exclusively for them. It shifts that role squarely on their shoulders, and they can have it for all I care. My question is, has spotting been removed from the fighter squadrons you can spawn? Will fighters attack "high altitude" aircraft, or just attack run aircraft? Will fighters respond instantly (would love to see this for surface ships, honestly), or will they still pretend they don't see anything for 30 seconds? This alone makes me feel CV Captain skills are also going to be completely reworked as well. Only makes sense at this point. Overall, in my opinion, I'd rather get that RTS feel back. Remove spotting from CVs. I'm totally a fan because now I can concentrate more on attacking the enemy. I'd love to see the minimap interaction again. Hell, it'd be awesome to send out multiple squadrons of aircraft at once. Have the planes be AI controlled unless you select a flight to take manual control. Even have the AI attack enemy ships if one is spotted nearby. It would really bring that tactical feeling back again without making it broken (as AI controlled planes are more hilarious than dangerous currently). Or I guess you could make squadrons act like they did during the Piñata event. The CV player can select areas for attack squadrons to appear and the AI attacks whatever is spotted. Then you can select manual control of a squadron for more precise attacks. Anyway, shotgunning ideas. I'm genuinely excited for CV changes. Like I said, I have avidly played CVs since their inception. I've played since Beta. I love CVs, but at this point I not only feel and understand the frustration the community has, but feel it myself even as the CV player because everyone expects you to do absolutely everything everywhere at all times for them, including winning the game solely by yourself. It's about time the bulk of spotting was finally shifted to surface ships. Just imagine...... We might actually see brawling again.......

[@beardumaw24]

Good points !

[@anthrax2413]

We can not know for sure what will happen. These changes are so convoluted that they will most likely be scrapped. And even if they do get implemented, expect it no less than 6 months from now. But as someone who played CVs a lot, these changes can actually be a buff to its damaging capabilities.

[@benmo2227]

Agree, gotta see it first in game to actually make up my mind.

[@CaptainExoticWoWS]

Yeah these changes will probably make CVs more powerful lmao.

[@mertc8050]

Hmm yes my aircraft cruiser graf zeppelin is getting buffs here thats for sure

[@Frankon81]

not to all CV. The CV with bigger attack squadrons will see a dmg buff but those with multiple small attack squadron will see a sharp damage decline. Also it doesnt change most of tactical squadrons.

[@xel1206]

@@Frankon81 Will this be nerf or a buff for FDR, though? I mean your flight stays at high altitude, not getting eating by flak - as they do now. But the relatively small attack groups can get shred to pieces and heavily reduce the actual attack power.

[@MarvinWestmaas]

I find it highly amusing I floated this whole idea of different flight levels when I was a supertester, and got told it was 'too complicated' and yet here we are, few years later.

[@matteoorlandi856]

We supertesters were a strange breed, this Is sure.

[@MarvinWestmaas]

@@matteoorlandi856 Matheo, can't say it rings a bell. You EU or NA ( and probably got a vastly different ingame name ;) ). The worst thing was all this talk about not being able have your cake and eat it ;) Thought I liked the early days, when the devs and reps actually seemed to care enough to overrule marketing department based on player opinion. Artus was a good one :)

[@matteoorlandi856]

@@MarvinWestmaas orlathebeast was my in game name, EU server. Yup, at the start was good. I left After the soviet CVs went live, around that period. While years before the people working with were agreable and you could have a chat and share ideas and opinions, things changed a lot by the time i left. Turns out running a farm requires time... Sure i had my good moments but the direction the game was going was not the One i (and many, turns out) liked and since there was not much i could do about, i left.

[@MarvinWestmaas]

@@matteoorlandi856 orlathebeast I surely do remember, mtm78 here. Yeah, I remember those days. And it still bugs me to this day what they done to this game, even when we were warned at the start that eventually marketing would be the deciding department. I just hoped they would have done it in ways which better represented the wishes of their most dedicated playerbase.

[@MarvinWestmaas]

@@matteoorlandi856 btw for me the worst moment was when I got fed up about the dev's broken promises, and made a lengthy post in the ST section about why I quit. That post got removed, then edited to shit before it got placed back and I wasn't allowed to change it. I get it that they didn't want my rant visible in a public forum, but ST had their own section. ... ahh well, that's why WeGreedy did away with this whole 'forum' thing in the end right, can't have a forum without negative feedback so 'let's all move to discord' lmao.

[@octaviusmorlock]

A carrier needing surface ships to provide spotting is objectively STUPID. (Especially if DFAA can still attack the High Altitude planes.) But I can understand the CV only updating the minimap. Other than that, fair enough. (Although I think the passive increase should slowly run down after 4-5 minutes.) For anyone wondering, I play a bit of all five classes.

[@david_3248]

yeah that passive increase thing is to avoid cvs striking the same target over and over again but then how exactly are cvs supposed to play when theres like 3-4 ships left on both teams. and since cvs cant spot the surface ships will be chasing each other forever in a close engame

[@isaacrichardson103]

For me, it sounds like CVs will get a free pass to the back of the map and then start their runs from the flanks.

[@Gardenstategreat1225]

Exactly my plan. I can attack from anywhere and not lose plans that arent attacking. This will reward skilled cvs more

[@brandonsheffield9873]

Sounds like attacks on DD's will be none existant, unless they shorten rhe attack preparation time dramatically. This will be a huge buff to DD's.

[@larkinwilliams9651]

All I know is that these proposed changes will make it impossible for CVs to survive late game. DDs will just stay outside of spotting range and wreak havoc on the CV regardless of whether he can fire his own guns or not. The next issue is CV as the lone survivor of a team; what will the CV do with no one to spot for them? All of the nerfs are reasonable except for not being able to spot for yourself. To me the “immunity” of high altitude is a worthless trade off in comparison to looking at an empty ocean for 3/4 of a game. DDs will now control the ocean because they are going to be the primary spotter, can deal severe damage incognito, and have no counters other than radar for the most part.

[@rekslegiune6004]

Unicorns will be happy, island and smoke camping.

[@mennoafink1351]

I don’t think this is a nerf, but more of a buff. Cv planes now never die. When they travel they take no damage, when they attack they take reduced damage unless the target has pressed the priority sector at the exact right time. And he’s probably too busy to keep track of the (boosted) planes as wel as the sub that is pinging and the other ships are shooting at it. And regarding spotting, he’ll just keep going into attack mode without actually attacking so he’ll still spot everything like before.

[@Nost1974]

if you remove the ability of damage dealing aircraft to spot just balance it with a new class of aircraft that can ONLY spot.

[@DRod1517]

Exactly, it's not like they didn't have spotter planes during this period. Good grief.

[@keith6706]

The no spotting thing is probably a step too far as, in terms of teamplay, it pretty much eliminates one of the major reasons for the carrier's existence. What might balance it out is to add an additional type of aircraft: spotters. Doesn't carry weapons so it can't attack anything, and all it can do is trundle around looking for things, and just updates the minimap. That way, if a carrier wants to attack a vessel it spotted, it has to send an attack squadron to the last known position where the enemy was spotted, then switch to attack mode to find where the ship actually is. Simultaneously, the defending ship gets an alert it's been spotted from a spotter plane, so it knows it could be coming under air attack shortly, giving it an opportunity to get ready and try and time the priority sector at the right moment.

[@catguy9229]

I don’t think they need to add all these mechanics. Minimap spotting and slowly increasing AA damage would fix a lot of the current problems

[@Frankon81]

Imagine FDR going to attacking phase to spot enemy ships.... And the 30 second cooldown it has between attacks.... Losing planes from attack squadron - compare IJN attacks (2 planes per attack wave) versus Nakhimov (X-amount of attacking planes). When atack wing dies you have to line the attack again.... WG would have to rebalance all the CVs if this goes live. Also imagine we are talking about a WG... a developer who cannot give dutch cruisers ASW airstrikes due to the technical limitations and they are going to code such bizzare and complex new attack plane system..... It will go right.... right? Also how do hybrids count in this "rework"? edit. How will fighters work?

[@sealordmountbatten]

They did follow up on Discord and the subreddit by saying individual carriers will be adjusted as needed

[@Frankon81]

@@sealordmountbatten saw Gaishu post on reddit about it now. He is good at playing CVs sadly... He is not in Serbia where the devs are and knowing how devs work in companies they would mostly use the feedback of the guys on site about it (and those guys being from their dev team) so i think it will be a bit sketchy i fear.

[@WVGato]

@@sealordmountbatten I really think they are going to have to end up increasing the attack wings of most carriers in the end. Especially since the other planes will not be absorbing any of the damage and all the damage will be being taken by the attacking flight. I wonder if it will not come to the point of each carrier only has two attack flights. That being said, I don't think it will be as easy to deplane a CV now, since the planes will be immune to damage before and after an attack.

[@itsmebatman]

I think the change to spotting will lead to a situation where CVs can really only attack in places where their team is spotting, which means they have to fly into crowded spaces and shoot stuff their team is already attacking. They can no longer try to search lone enemies to harass. Depending on how well the changes to AA work maybe this will lead to people stop playing CVs, which will in turn lead to WG buffing the class again.

[@robertcras8151]

Food for thought, AAs and subs are too complicated for the community, that is why there is such a big difference between good and bad players. Now listening to this I really get the notion they really made the game more complex.

[@meme-qg7bj]

with how often my entire team is hiding in a smoke and no one is spotting this is prob going to be really frustrating

[@Cryogen69]

Hi These are my thoughts regarding this devblog, as a player who plays a roughly equal amount of all classes including CVs (except sub, fuck subs) The spotting thing seems like a good change, most heavy cruisers and battleships already have a large enough air detection range that new CVs will still be able to strike them no problem, though it may involve a bit more prediction to where the enemy is, which I personally think is a good thing, because it would make CV gameplay more involved and not just "click on enemy ship, remove 30k hp," but it doesn't make CVs completely useless without team spotting This should remove the random spotting of DDs when the CV is just trying to do something else, which is very infuriating for the DD The secondaries seem like more of a meme change, CVs generally have poor armor and would continue to be be ineffective if they used them as their main armament, and you will be unable to control the secondaries when flying planes, so it would only be an effective choice against DDs close enough to get spotted by your ship, or if you're deplaned and desperate to do anything. DDs like shimakaze will still be able to stealth torpedo you to death, especially because it's harder to spot them now with planes, which I'll touch on later DFAA/Barrage Fire will likely be limited to ships with very good base AA such as Jinan, if something like a zao or gearing used it, they would just make themself an easy target for both the CV, who ONLY sees you, as well as the rest of his team Active concealment seems like a good change, it's basically just a buff to the priority sector that would increase player interaction on both sides of the engagement, while raising the skill floor on both ends. This also allows for ships with otherwise bad AA to still be able to deter CV strikes even without shooting them down, because they're now blinded. This shouldn't stop CVs from attacking targets that are already spotted, which is fine, because it was more of a problem when a CV could easily pick off any low HP target behind the frontline trying to use their stealth or waiting to get a heal off The passive increase to AA seems kinda unnecessary and convoluted as it is. Usually, CVs focusing on a specific ship is due to a tactical advantage of targeting that ship, usually because they are by themselves. With all the other changes to spotting, this should already not be a problem for non-BB classes, as they are the ones being detected the most by enemy ships anyway. I believe this would make more sense as a battleship commander skill instead of something on all ships Overall, I like these changes, because it feels like neither a huge buff nor nerf, because CVs can now more easily reach their intended targets and avoid certain high-AA ships if they wanted, as long as they aren't next to the intended target. As someone who does play CVs sometimes, I think these changes will make CV-surface ship interactions more dynamic and less boring for both players sorry if that sounded a bit convoluted, i was writing it at 3am

[@rekslegiune6004]

What do you think about impossible aiming from smoke, you can't see anything outside if you are stuck inside. So removing vision sharing needs to be shared to all ships.

[@malguskerensky]

CV spotting, does seem to be a bit too much; allow high altitude planes to mark the mini map of the grind square where a ship was seen (unless storm/cyclone is in effect). As for the AA change, it should not blind a flight of planes; an 40% to 60% dispersion increase for the attacking planes seems a bit more fair.

[@ArterialCanine]

What impact or change, if any for the Fighter Consumable, will they attack only aircraft during an attack run and not at high altitude travel mode?

[@user-yc6sc4kt4v]

That’s some weird changes. Mini map spotting is a good idea and maybe give the CV plane a consumable like spotting plane that’s active for 2 min to lights up the enemy ships? I do like the DFAA charge up to deter repeat attacks.

[@pauljgebhart]

The thing that attracted me to this game was the look and feel. I like the WWII theme and the mechanics were understandable. But as they have added all these gimmicks into the game they have introduced physics defying mechanics and now I cant ignore it. I cant turn my brain off and these changes are ruining the game for me.

[@cerneysmallengines]

I cannot believe how complicated they made this change. I tend to think that Flamu is a little too flamboyant for his own good, but he makes a good point that it should be mini-map spotting for anyone outside a given radius. I would think the distance of the spotted ship's AA range, maybe times 2

[@Kyle-ir3bz]

They are going to fuck it up.

[@CUPAVI1]

The only change to CV spotting needed is for it to be shown on mini map only. Simple as that. The same principle could be applied for radar/hydro as well. OR we could have different dispersion depending on direct/radar/CV spotting - which would be closer to real life WW2 experience.

[@gustavocabrerea1341]

It took them long enough to even attempt changing CV’s like this.

[@bodasactra]

You must be new. WG has done like a half dozen carrier reworks since I started playing in 2015. I quit in 2020 so I don't know if they did more in the last 4 years but, it seems from your comment they left it broke and alone until today. Ironic, I just finished playing my first matches in four years just a few minutes ago and then I run into carrier rework.....again! See you in four more years, or not.

[@sweetpoison5341]

this will push some OP CV such as Nakhimov, which has fast and large size squadron but less health per plane further popular than before. in this update, Nakhimov will be able to avoid much of the regular AA during traveling and will be less subjectable to losing planes during attack because of the few second reduced damage effect and since its planes are fast and armament like skip bombs which doesn't need to get close, its skip bombers will be even more OP. while slower planes and/or fewer planes CV such as the Japanese/Americans will suffer more simply because their planes are either slow or too few to sustain lost.

[@TheFman2010]

Can fighters that an attack flight drops still be able to spot ships? Or will these fighters be considered to be flying at high altitude?

[@animegamesmoviesandotherst3037]

I hope the seconday control for other ships happen. That make BBs with mutiple 5in guns like the Iowa-class able to fight DDs that get to close. Also love to see ships with the oerlikon guns being able to shoot torps once seen. Giving ships a chance with Japan Ninja boats,

[@billwalker9509]

So, with the advent of AA changes, how much longer will Priority Sector, soon to be Active Concealment, duration be? Since now Active Concealment must be "preemptively and not reactively" activated, it reduces the time damage starts by however many seconds it takes the planes to enter the AA aura. Activating it after the planes enter the aura will have no affect on the planes.

[@Stephen__White]

15:25 Another way to word this is "This will disincentivize CVs from punishing bad play." as if bad players needed more hand holding. A lone ship should be the one being targeted. The thing I didn't see in the dev blog was talking about how CV income is going to change. For those who don't know, currently CVs get the most income from getting kill ribbons, and are second in terms of income from spotting damage. So they are currently actively encouraged to spot targets for their team, and finish off low HP targets. This change is going to make doing both of those things basically impossible. So that makes me wonder how Wargaming are going to changed the economy around CVs to keep their earnings on average the same as now. Another thing to note is that some CVs depending on the range of their "secondary" guns will likely be more effective as gun platforms than as CVs. Assuming CVs also get acess to standard equipment to buff their weapons Hakuryu will end up with 480k DPM per side with her 6 dual 100mm turrets per side that start at a 2.9 second reload. If she has any amount of range on those guns, the only squad a Haku is ever going to launch will be her torp bombers. Even without the slot 6 reload mod, Haku will have more DPM than most Cruisers at 422k DPM. The German CVs WISH they had that kind of firepower. Richthofen having 12 dual 105mm turrets. So the same number of turrets per side, BUT they fire slower, deal less damage, and pen less. MVR would have 254k DPM without the slot 6 reload mod, and 289k with reload mod. Though a thing to note is the 26mm pen making that DPM harder to apply than the 30mm pen on Haku's guns. Nakhimov has 6 total quad 130mm turrets but they aren't equally shared around the ship. 2 turrets on the left, 4 turrets on the right. Though 2 of the turrets on the right can likely fire over the flight deck. Something to note as well is that Nakhimov has a 5 second reload stock not the 4.5 second stock reload of Smolensk. Plus even Smolensk isn't as scary as she used to be. For some numbers Nakhimov has 345k DPM without reload mod, 393k DPM with reload mod. Midway 9 127mm guns per side, 243k dpm without reload mod, 276k with reload mod. Essex is a weird one, because she has 2 sets of 127mm guns, but we'll assume both are used. That would mean, because she has 4 dual turrets that are on her deck, and 4 single turrets on her left side her DPM would change depending on what side is facing the target. 216k off left side without reload mod 245k with reload mod. And off the right, 144k DPM without reload mod, 164k DPM with reload mod. And for the final tech tree T10... Audacious. 19mm of pen. Do I even need to bother with the DPM figures? She can't even pen some DDs. Well 4 dual 113mm turrets per side, 163k DPM without reload mod 185k with reload mod. Though as mentioned, those numbers are basically worthless because of the small gun size. So some CVs are going to be getting a lot from being able to use their secondaries as main guns, others will gain effectively nothing. So I'm going to predict now that Haku and MVR are going to see a boost in usage, with these changes, ether that or will get hit with HEAVY nerfs to their secondaries before the changes happen.

[@KingRat71]

The one thing i really really miss is MANUAL control of fighters and using a saipan to hutn down the aircraft from the enemy carrier.

[@PalisRudis]

Planes not spotting is just stupid. Make it minimap spotting only, have AA make an impact on attack squadrons, make it so a CV can loose all attack planes if ships shoots them down but give all CV's scout planes that replenish (so they still have a role if all planes get shot down, think DD with low health that cant risk being spotted). Thats just my two cents.

[@DvdV1337]

After the 2nd big change to cv, we have to pre aim the pre aim. Reckon we have to pre aim the pre aim, so we can pre aim to pre aim the pre aim?

[@rhyslewis2209]

If CV aircraft can't spot even for themselves until they're in attack mode (and can then be blinded with good reactions of the enemy) then they essentially become guns with the extra rules attached. I say this since their effective range is that of whatever spotter you have on your team.

[@walterhill9642]

I think CV's will do just fine with these changes. Their initial scouting will be to just go to attack mode in the center of the map in a few places, dropping torps or bombs into nowhere. The aircraft spotting range for most large ships will allow that dummy attack to spot most of them. I'm most excited for the impact of DD play. They might actually be fun again.

[@marty2129]

Interesting... Dunno about the AA priority sector. I would have kept it as-is functionaly, maybe with some adjustments to power (be it a bit more deadly, but at the same time a bit worse when set incorrectly) and maybe make it azimuth-directed instead of locking it to sides... As far as CV spotting goes, it might be an interesting idea to allow a spotter plane or spotter squadron in some way. Having the ability to spot ship at the cost of not dealing any damage with planes and/or having the spotting locked to an area and timer, or having a toggle between flight and attack mode with attack mode being quite vulnerable...

[@MarvinWestmaas]

"Dunno about the AA priority sector. I would have kept it as-is functionaly, maybe with some adjustments to power (be it a bit more deadly, but at the same time a bit worse when set incorrectly) and maybe make it azimuth-directed instead of locking it to sides..." No, you can't have mechanics reward skill, that would make most of the playerbase more worthless then they are now

[@neilharbott8394]

I usually play a few CV games when I have a mission to spot enemy ships - guess this change negates that option!! Maybe since planes won't be able to spot in travel mode, they could get access to RPF or the ability to spot aircraft, spotters, fighter squadrons, returning attack flights. This would give them the ability to guess where enemy ships might be close to?!

[@outofcontrolsjsgaming6200]

So the one thing I see is that the remainder of a flight staying at high altitude can be a huge buff for CVs with planes that have large hp pools (see FDR).

[@MOrab46019]

Just asking taking the AA skills for your ships worth it until they work this out? I miss the old days when you could use aa like secondaries and put it on a flight of aircraft.

[@CMDRFandragon]

Cant spot at all during travel is definitely to much. Are your pilots flying blindfolded now? Also, if you can only spot during attack run, how do you know how to set up your attack run if you cant see? Then how does a CV carry if they are the last ones alive? I despise CVs but that change is abit much.

[@rekslegiune6004]

Retarder as F, why not remove vision sharing to ships who camo inside of smoke. How can you hit anything while inside, no logic imo.

[@bodasactra]

Does anyone have a link to the video of when the content creators were invited to WG in St. Petersberg and Flamu told the devs they could never balance carriers in this game? You can guess how they felt about that.

[@Erich823]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/o4ixmHycncuXhbs

[@jimmitchell1066]

won't lie I miss how the old carrier gameplay was. wish they would just keep it to where you can control the planes, or just play the old way. I know it probably will not happen, just wish they would work on these changes a while and listen to our feedback. btw thank you for your last video. I will be buying Kidd soon. It has made a special place in my heart.

[@SpenzOT]

What I find funny is that people focus on how CV's were harder to play, AA was more nuanced, and CV's could run out of planes, as if it was so much easier back then, forgetting that a good CV player could nuke any full health ship in a single attack, pick on ships they knew had bad AA, could still spot ships, could use their fighters to sweep any catapult fighters in the air without retaliation (when they existed), and often appeared with a buddy since MM was not fair and could give a team 2 CV's while denying the other team any. CV's were monsters back in the RTS days.

[@cuchococh4977]

RTS nostalgia is just the past and it's perpetual rose tinted lenses, it was the most unbalanced shit we ever had. A single great CV player single handedly won games and literally so, not figuratively like good DDs. Every single RTS match was a coin flip to see which team got the experienced player and who got the newbie, one side always won. You cannot have a god on each side of the field playing chess with eachother while everyone else roleplays as pawns. Also you all are forgetting that RTS CVs could literally delete a full HP GK out of the game with a single torpedo cross drop. Every single CV torp had the same damage as actual DD torps and you had at least 8 of them making a X shaped drop on your ship at the same time from four directions forcing you to eat almost all of them

[@LtLuigi25]

Reading though this, I want to focus on what’s not being said. How much money is a CV expected to make in a match? If a CV can’t do spotting damage, will or where will that loss be made up? If you’re not able to be spotted by a CV normally, and you have ways to hamper a CV from attacking you alone, then do you expect the CV attack will have the same effect if they still manage to hit you? Therewas no mention of Fighters in this blog at all, no changes announced, Fighters, those things that spot ships, those things that every CV squadron gets multiples of. Are ship launched fighters able to spot CV planes, vice versa? Could a CV not find ships by seeing their fighter wings? Do fighters attack planes at altitude? Manually aimed secondaries implies getting CVs to move closer to the battle, but without being able to direct planes from on deck, or change course in the air, and Autopilot being worse than bots at path finding, it’s hard to see it changing any minds, especially with the speed increase that travel mode offers for cross map flying. Speaking of cross map flying, if you were mad at CV kill stealing before, how do you think it’ll be when they can only see ships that you see, and will only want to engage ships that won’t have intact AA systems. Now they can get there even faster than before. So, Planes have been made faster, more damage resistant, and since they’re locked out of earning spotting damage, likely do more damage.

[@darjeeling096]

so what will become of indomitable's slingshot mechanic?

[@KazuoLucas]

As someone who when playing CVs only use the Japanese ones, I fear how much will the changes impact the damage potential for the torpedo bombers and dive bombers because they are made of paper (in my experience because no 21 point commander so no dmg reduction skills active) and the way the game calculates credit gain is to me very BB centric.

[@groundbeef2]

I wonder if this will affect hybrid ships as well. If it does, pretty much all of them are going to be abandoned.

[@smoothkirito]

Several of us have already been discussing this, and this concept isn't going to get out of testing anywhere close to this, due to some fundamental disconnects in functionality that are going to present themselves.

[@bLockC1pher]

Hello Sea Lord Mountbatten!, got my 2cent ready. On the CV-RE-re-work I enjoy CV-play and BB and those two don't get along. When i started playing i wanted to undestand how CVs worked so i can make the right adjustments to my BB-play. I'll pretend the Game is New again to me, So i can learn the New way to CV np!. Restrucrturing of any type is inevitable.

[@a.nichols626]

I wish they would just make them work like the Dutch cruiser/ASW mechanic. Put them on a cool down with limited range. You don't have direct control of the aircraft and depend on team spotting or normal spotting from the CV. I would like playing them more if I was controlling from the ship and not flying the stupid little planes. Also they could then remove all of the automatic defenses as the player is directly controlling the ship not the ammunition of planes.

[@Jason-35D]

If all the planes attack in a group and won’t be replaced, is there going to be a reason to play something other than soviet CVS as they all attack at once?

[@mannyplayspoe7183]

Anyone remembers the "submarine nerf"? Looks like the same "nerf" is coming now to the floating airports

[@ucpmod]

One thing I do like s that CVs will not be able to spot at the very start of a game, like they do now. The rest of the mechanics sound interesting, let´s see how they come out of testing.

[@gn01873122]

Maybe a 300% damage buff for "balance".

[@demian7567]

Manual secondaries? That's going to be interesting

[@professorq4081]

I wonder how this will effect the hybrid ships.

[@balangas3910]

Why can’t we just reduce CV spotting to self spotting and ships that are attacking the planes with their AA get spotted? This would solve the largest problem, then on top of that it would be great if the attacking flight was directly affected by AA as in reducing the scope of the attack by shooting planes down. Buff DFAA and we’re almost done. I don’t see the need for these complex changes if the problem is so simple.

[@janosch13100]

iirc different ship types get different xp for certain actions. Imo this should increase the reward for the spotting damage you get as a cv since its going to be much scarcer. I hope they dont just forget

[@Joey_Liu]

Sealord! Can you make a speculation video of what might the New Jersey will look like in game in the future. How about its Vietnam era configuration and placing her at tier 8. So basically an Iowa down tiered but you have terrible aa. Overpowered? Too weak? What are your thoughts. I really want to see my Lukcy J bb in game one day

[@Echomage1215]

If their adding manually controled secondary guns to CVS, I want them to add the 8in gun turrets to the Lexingtons (as a module perhaps) lol

[@revolutionarybanana7296]

all i know is that graf zepplin gonna be fun with manual secondaries

[@bustermorley8318]

Playing as cruisers and destroyers in mid tier games, often against two carriers, I am definitely up for reducing the spotting capability of carriers.

[@Ilias_Goddess]

they should use the submarine dive mechanics for that , probably they will

[@davidfischesser2553]

Give CVS spotting aircraft they can earn experience for spotting and damage while spotting

[@GammaAKF]

2D spotting is the answer. High altitude travel with reduced spotting is an option, but if CVs can't spot, they have very little place on the team.

[@robjmck]

Next the subs that need real reform of gameplay!

[@hallasnackbar1865]

This is going to be a big buff for the FDR

[@Hornfel66]

I like most of the ideas, especially the no spotting while travelling. I'm not crazy about the passive increase to AA defense. I feel that the interaction between a lone wolf ship and the CV should be handled by the "priority concealment" ability. That alone in the hands of a good player that is paying attention can be devastating, especially in the hands of a DD. As such I think that should be the ship's primary counter play, along with strong AA defense. Considering that they intend on allowing attacking flight deplaning, which is good, I think that the passive increase to a single target will have huge negative impact on late game CVs.

[@rekslegiune6004]

OK no spoting while traveling, why not add option to have more plains in air, if they are usles while traveling.

[@izaiahdatu7794]

They can't spot now? Isnt that one of the reasons carriers were so important in WW2? The attack runs i have no complaints The manual secondaries are fine

[@Bigbacon]

I will come back to this game if this actually happens assuming "attack flight" mode is ONLY when they push the mouse button to attack and not something thewy can just toggle.

[@RicardoGonzalez-to7vb]

Of all of this, still not direct interactions between the ship player and the CV player

[@Gardenstategreat1225]

This makes skilled cvs stronger. With the way i play, i no longer am losing planes that aren’t in the attack run. My saipan just got ridiculous

[@sirtogii5216]

Well nobody will lose planes that aren't in the attack run now so not sure how you feel that will make skilled players stronger...

[@Gardenstategreat1225]

@@sirtogii5216 because not everyone hits their targets or chooses the right ones. Its not just because of that one thing. The fact that outside of the defensive aa you can fly and attack from anywhere makes alot of difference imo. If for some reason people dont use or have it, you could have a cv focusing out rear ships much better than before. Thats just one of many positives i see. In particular i was thinking of saipan when i made that comment since losing planes hurts so much with it.

[@bhutchisonbh]

Unlimited boost during travel height.....i dont think you realise just how powerful this is, especially for the germans or super CVs

[@garystew2077]

I think CV spotting should be way different. I think all surface ships should be able to be visible to the CV at their respective detectability range by air, but can only be spotted by the CV for the rest of their team by manually locking on to each ship for an extended period of time. For example, the CV would have to lock their reticle onto an enemy BB for 5 seconds for it to then be spotted for the rest of their team. For DDs the CV should have to lock on for much longer, lets say maybe 10 seconds. I feel like this is much simpler, but makes it more difficult and time consuming for CVs to spot enemy ships. I don't really care how they handle CV attacks, but the spotting that CVs can do at the moment is just silly. As a DD main there is nothing more frustrating than drawing the short straw and having the CV target you in the beginning of a match and continue to come back with wave after wave of planes rendering you practically useless.

[@user-vi9gw8pt9v]

Can't see how this is going to work

[@RUHappyATM]

I have not been able to dodge many torpedoes from tier X CV (in my tier X BBs). IMHO they are OP.

[@beardumaw24]

Agreed, they say just dodge the Torps, but in reality your maneuvering BBs don't just dodge torps, they get hit most of the time. And the sub homing torps are still OP.

[@revamp2245]

Maybe your not playing the dd right I don't have any issues dodging them..

[@RUHappyATM]

@@revamp2245 Who says anything about DDs? I'm discussing BBs.

[@Nexesys]

BBs shouldn't be able to dodge CV torp runs in reality, aside from shooting them down before drop.

[@RUHappyATM]

@@Nexesys You try and shoot down squadrons with 8 or more planes, 2 torpes per plane! I did not read that WW2 CV planes carry 2 torpes each.

[@anthonyware4033]

AA needs to mean something like it did when ships like the MO were no fly zones.

[@frantiseksedivy5136]

Well this may be a reaction to having all the hybrid ships everywhere, it makes no sense for planes not to spot. You know a good CV can be a pain just by spoting, not to mention damage inflicted on its own. Just like subs are now much more binded to stay close to their allies, CVs will depend on teammates also, it will be pointless for CV to run away across the map as if it survives alone, it can do nothing. Though to be fair, in many situations, I believe friendly ships were mistaken in reality, therefore the spoting or no spoting could make some sense after all... I don't mind CVs, but I do mind all the major changes, it may help to keep the game alive, but still, its bothering...

[@mkasrey7365]

But on the other hand they F up priority sector AA

[@davidwhitfield6025]

Well DD and Subs will be happy no longer being lit up by planes flying over. Frankly I would be happy if they gave me back my original AA. Given how every other class has to juggle multiple options (BBs excepted) I think its about time the little muffins had to think for a change. There fore it will never happen.

[@kickit6334]

When the rework becomes public back to drawing for me on cv.

[@b.b.5240]

Funny thing about CV secondaries: The IJN Kaga has 8 x 8 inch (203) secondary guns. Good Luck DDs. Have fun attacking the Kaga now.

[@broadside5994]

No joke, even if I took quite a beating in the process, managed to take out an overconfident Mogador who came too close to my Kaga

[@Boogaloo_Shrimp]

But the plane replenishment is so slow to begin with, especially when ur up tiered in a tier 6 cv to a t8 game or a t8 to a t10 game

[@kayasky7712]

Wargaming community to cv: perhaps we are too harsh on you

[@pR1mal.]

As a DD main, it occurs to me that some of the anti-cv voices get focused by cvs because they lone wolf.

[@beardumaw24]

So you saying everyone needs to bunch up together on one side of the map, lol Bad idea! Your suspost to disperses around the map and NOT bunch together.

[@majorborngusfluunduch8694]

​@@beardumaw24You're supposed to group up with the ships on your flank. Dont wander away from them, especially if they are ships with strong AA. If your ship has strong AA its your responsibility to protect your allies. As a CV player I can tell you with confidence that groups of ships are a no fly zone and it can be a bit paralyzing if all the enemy ships are properly guarding themselves from air attack. I would argue however, that joining a lemming train is better than going out on your own and getting murdered. If enough of the team commits to the the lemming train its possible to overwhelm a flank and then sweep over to the other flank to deal with the rest of the reds.

[@wramsey2656]

@@majorborngusfluunduch8694 Well said. This is in a nut shell WWII actual Naval tactics. Each ship class had its purpose, but as a team they were much stronger together.

[@faynk.6247]

@@majorborngusfluunduch8694yeah yeah the same old “Just group up and combined AA” here is my experience as a DD main, you can’t “group up” that’s the problem with CV right now it’s the spotting, if I hide behind a BB or a Cruisers for AA protection then i can’t spot for them and be useless and if I go and spot for my allies or contest cap then I get harrassed by a CV because I am alone. Also combined AA can’t do shit if the CV can abuse the mechanic and sling-shot thier way to strike you

[@majorborngusfluunduch8694]

@@faynk.6247 The spotting of DDs is an issue, I'll give you that. But I wanna point out that slingshotting isn't something most CVs can do anymore. There's like 2 of them that can do it or some small number like that.

[@gallusace6514]

I can think of something simpler... keep everything the same... just make it that Surface ships are only Mini Map spotted for surface ships. God forbid WG'ing try live testing a community suggestion... also... big thing, how do you change from high altitude to attack level... If you can do that quickly, whats to stop CV's doing the old Sub trick of bouncing up and down at periscope depth?

[@robertcras8151]

Blind pilots.... next is blind AA sailors that can't see planes. Strange that a torpedo does have eyes and can be curved at ships behind rocks. It's getting more and more a Harry Potter game to make it work.

[@AmocideB]

They are doing this now, cus their introducing support CVs and theyll give them the ability to do what CVs do now but with much less damage.

[@robertcras8151]

LOL pilots will temporarily be blind while travelling. Like the Dutch cruiser pilots. Is that like using a spell? Like the harry potter homing torpedo that can see or ping or magic through solid mass? Sailors manning the AA also blind when not being spotted and when they are being attacked they suddenly regain eyesight? Ha ha ha Ships spotting for CVs... now that sounds logical. ehhhhh...... Normally you can see planes coming and start turning in (torps) or away (bombs) if the plane can't see a 200m ship, can the ship see the planes? Or are we going to get torped/bombs by planes we see on the last moment? Is Rudder shift becoming a thing against these new CVs? How about... bring a in a new class of plane that ONLY spots and keep spotting for a while to guide in the friendlies (how defensive planes are currently used)?

[@Bohdisattva326]

Cool. Maybe now I can play cv with chat enabled 😂

[@frosty3693]

Sounds like WG may be seeing some player reduction that has finally gotten their attention and to actually do something.

[@howardcarr9625]

Wow, just WOW.

[@sardaukerlegion]

"Good, Good!" Palpatine

[@zelthevoidkitsune8625]

after watching this again... i would very much like to have at least personal spotting, because there will always be a CV hunting only DD and once your spotted you pretty much dead in the water

[@majestichotwings6974]

Im glad they are looking at cv gameplay again but man this whole system seems entirely convoluted, too many factors to try and keep up with ON TOP of what a cv is already expected to do. I wish a simple spotting nerf could be implemented instead as thats the biggest complaint. Maybe just slow roll changes out rather than having a repeat of the first rework’s balancing nightmare.

[@357Striker]

Atlanta having unlimited def AA consumable

[@wramsey2656]

Planes not spotting ships at all along the way is illogical. WWII normal tactics included airplanes being sent out to spot for surface ships (not the other way around as you indicate WG is testing). If CV planes are to wait until DDs and subs spot, what are CV players supposed to do in the interim (pester your team mates to spot)? Maybe i misunderstood which is entirely possible. I play all classes of ships and if WG makes it more difficult on CV players it will further reduce players who want to play the class. In our clan its difficult as it is to get players to play CVs.

[@mihtohnohmi212]

I was just starting playing CV as I can help the team by spotting enemies for them, but this update, if implemented on global, dammmmmnnn.. I may have no right as I am new to the game but I think this nerf a tad bit hard..

[@eiden1132]

even though irl carriers were the most powerful and important ship for naval combat lol