Wrapping and sizing paper patched conical's for Muzzleloaders

[@blueridgeboy6791]

The legend has a KZbin channel so glad I finally found it. Idaho lewis brought me here.

[@idahoron]

Thanks for watching.

[@pearcherry9859]

Thanks for taking the time to explain this. I have watched all of your videos and was able to replicate the accuracy and hunting success by following your instructions. You have saved me years of work and experimentation. My Lyman with 32 twist and my Knight Bighorn will reliably hit an 8 inch paper plate at 200 yards with your load and after installing aftermarket peep sights and shooting from a bench. I have shot a cow elk with your load based on 500 S&W mold and the penetration has to be seen to be believed. Thanks again.

[@idahoron]

Thank you for the review. I developed that load over a dozen years ago. That load has been so reliable that I just quit experimenting. I just use it and enjoy it. Keep me posted on your success. I like hearing these stories.

[@idahoron]

How is your muzzleloaders shooting. I thought i would check in.

[@wildrangeringreen]

that's kinda interesting that you don't lube your paper after wrapping. I usually give them a quick dip in a melted soft wax and I get good accuracy. goes to show everyone does stuff a bit different! I've actually went to weighing my charges now and making up Pritchett style cartridges. POA has shifted but accuracy doesn't seem to have changed, and it makes shooting super convenient.

[@idahoron]

I might have to try some wax just to see what it does.

[@kevinroberson1985]

I'm so glad you told not to lube my paper patch boolits because I was having problems loading my bullets in my muzzle loader. Is it okay to lube the barrel after I push my bullet all the way down and seat it on my powder charge. And I mean a lite amount of lube in my barrel in front of my patched bullet?

[@idahoron]

You can. I don't worry about it for my stainless steel guns. I have lubed blue steel guns. I would test it to see how it affects the groups.

[@Modernwarrior12]

I just saw on a post where Doughty enterprises makes these dies going to see how long it takes to get one from them.Thanks

[@idahoron]

+Modernwarrior12 He made my .496 sizer. He makes good quality stuff. he has been sick and I had to wait for a while but I think he is better now.

[@JonJon205]

I'm sure you know by now that Doughty does not make dies anymore. They emailed me and said to look for Buckshot I think they said on Cast Boolits.

[@idahoron]

I heard that. I waited a couple years for Doughty to do mine. I asked Buckshot to do one but he wanted a bullet and something else to make sure it was the size or something. I know Buckshot does good work.

[@Prairie7777]

I'm just starting out in this so please forgive my ignorance. When looking for a sizing die to perform this paper patching function, how do you find the measurement of the bore to know what sizer to buy? Do you measure the distance from the top of the land to the opposing land? And after finding the measurement of the bore, what ratio or measurement of the sizing die would you order: I shoot a .54 cal. Hawken and I'm certainly interested in this paper patching concept. Any info you could give or reference to more in depth instruction will be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

[@idahoron]

If you have a 1-48 twist factory barrel this process most likely wont work. The factory barrels have too deep of groves for this to work. If I were going to try it anyway I would get a Lee mold. Check this one out. leeprecision.com/mold-533-410-m.html This one drops out of the mold at .533 two wraps of paper and you bullet will be .538 to .539. You probably won't need to size at all. If you want to look me up on Face Book I am under idahoron. I can also answer questions there.

[@johnhoward7298]

What twist rate & barrel length & cal. do You recommend/ use ? to paper wrap bullet

[@Modernwarrior12]

What are you using to size the Lee .501 bullets down so that there is room for the paper patch to be added before going through the Lee 501 sizer?

[@idahoron]

+Modernwarrior12 With lead softer than 7BHN all you have to do it wrap the .501 bullets with the paper and run them through the .501 lee sizer. If the lead is harder then 7 BHN they will need to be sized to .496 before they are wrapped because the hard lead won't size and it will strip the paper.

[@ronpardue]

Are you using a .446 sizer for a .45 caliber. I do not see a .446 sizer listed for Lee.

[@idahoron]

+Ron Pardue I am using the .446 sizer with my 45. I got it from Lee but it was a custom project. It was expensive like 100 dollars. Doughty Enterprises can make you one for under 50 dollars. I think my .496 sizer was 30 dollars. He has been sick but I heard he is back to making them.

[@kevinroberson1985]

P.S my long rifle is a green mountain barrel 40 cal. And the dia. Is .410 and my barrel length is 42 inch long. With a twist rate of 1 in 36 I hope and pray it will shoot long paper patch boolits. I'm only wanting to shoot at the maximum of 200 yards or a little more and I hope it will stabilize my boolits. Please let me know what you think about my barrel twist it is the only barrel at the time I could find in 40 cal. With that twist rate all the others were 1in48 twist rate . and I have a Pennsylvania Lancaster long rifle I built my self and it has pedasoli back sight and Lyman aperture front sight with a level bubble and like 10 or more apertures for it. I have spent a lot of money and time building this rifle and if it doesn't shoot real good I guess it will be a expensive wall hanger.

[@idahoron]

I would look at bullets in the 300 grain range. 400 will be too long. If you have a Lyman 17 style glove sight, use the Lee Shavers BPCR inserts. They are awesome

[@idahoron]

I was thinking 45 cal. On a .410 with a twist of 36, I think I would look at 200 gr to 250 gr.

[@tonycalp9162]

what is the barrel twist on your Green Moutain Barrel?

[@idahoron]

The 45s are 1-30 the 50's are 1-28

[@gregdavis7204]

Is the purpose of this to save the barrel?

[@idahoron]

Actually the purpose is increased accuracy using full lead conicals. Here in Idaho and well as many states a hunter has to use a full lead projectile, and no sabots. If a guy shoots conicals a little bit of lead is deposited with each shot no matter how well you clean or how well your lube works. After some time accuracy falls off and guys are disappointed with their rifles. With a paper patch bullet the barrel is protected from the bullet and the bullet is protected from the barrel and the fire. No lead is being deposited so there is no gradual degradation of accuracy. Accuracy is easily achieved out to 300 yards with a proper sighting set up on the gun.

[@gregdavis7204]

idahoron thank you for the clarification.

[@idahoron]

It really is about consistency. If your load is consistent you will be more accurate.

[@paraplegichistoricalsports5700]

Mr. Ron, what do you think about the lyman "Hunter" barrel, 1:32 twist? Do you believe it will perform well with a paper patched bullet?

[@idahoron]

I think it will. A man from salmon Idaho is using them in a 1-32 and claims they shoot well. I would use a over powder wad and 80 gr of pyrodex P to start with. Those bullets work best at 1310 to 1350 fps.

[@paraplegichistoricalsports5700]

@@idahoron I shoot Goex and Schuetzen. I have wads. What type of bullet mold does your buddy have, if you do not mind asking for me sir? Your a big help to all of us.

[@idahoron]

He has a Lee 500S&W bullet mould.

[@paraplegichistoricalsports5700]

@@idahoron thank you sir!

[@wilmamcdermott3065]

To shoot paper patched bullets in my sharps it has to be reamed ??

[@missingthe80s58]

No. The bullet needed will be about .442 to .445 and you'll use paper between .002 to .004 thick to bring the bullet to .450 - .454 depending on your land to land diameter (bore diameter). The bullet it resting on the surface of the lands like they're guide rails. How tight this resting fit is it entirely up to you, some guys like a slip fit, I prefer a snug fit. The bullet isn't hollow base. It's not a minie style bullet. It relies on the black powder detonation to shorten the length of the bullet and expand it along the length of the paper, but not past it. This depends on how soft your lead is and how much of either 1, 2 or 3FG you use. The finer the grade, the more pop it has and the more upset happens. You can upset too much and slump the nose. Most guys use 80-100 gr of 1.5FG or 2FG and an alloy between 20/1 and 10/1 lead to tin respectively. I use pure lead and large 1FG powder for less pop, my long 34" barrel is plenty of length to completely burn the large grain powder. It's a balancing act.

[@commonsensehomestead]

What do you use as a template for cutting your patch?

[@idahoron]

I got a template from Buffalo arms.