Yes, Goku is actually a bad dad

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

CLARIFCIATION POST you're probably here from the TSO_sage video. I wanna clear up some things about the video. Like what I actually believe, and why I acted the way I acted. This is going to be a huge novel of a post, so I'll be categorizing them if you want to just look at a specific point. WHY I OPEN THE VIDEO SO AGGRESSIVELY First, I don't really blame anyone for being antagonistic towards me here. I fired the first shot so fair enough. I made this video 2 years ago in a spiteful haste, I had seen some takes I had a very low opinion of to say the least. So when making this, I had perceived my opposition as those people. This isn't fair to put on everyone who disagrees with me, I was also trying to be an "edgy angry nerd boy grrr" which I've decided to move away from as a brand because I think it's overplayed and just a bad bit, hence why my channel art has changed since then. I don't actually have any beef with you for just disagreeing with me about anime, It's not that deep and I've made the choice that only people I think are morally bad deserve my venom. As much as It might pain me, having a different opinion than me on anime doesn't qualify lol. (If you must know the specific take that sent me over the edge was something akin to "goku can ride the nimbus -> only those of pure heart can ride the nimbus -> goku can't do anything morally wrong because he has a pure heart -> being a bad dad is a moral failing so he must be a good dad" I hope I don't need to explain why this is flawed logic, I will not be arguing this point with anyone.) THE VIDEO ITSELF IS FAR FROM MY BEST WORK From an objective standpoint, I wasn't really satisfied with this video, I had on multiple times considered remaking it because there are a lot of things unclear, I get some details wrong, and I just straight up don't mention some points that I think are integral to why I think what I think. If you think I'm just a crazy person who doesn't understand anime or art, that's fine but I recommend you check out my major or one piece video if you want an actually accurate representation of the kind of content I want to make. in all fairness, If I had known a channel nearly 100x my size would be looking at it, I'd probably have been more diligent in my efforts. MISCONCEPTIONS GOHAN ISN'T HALLUCINATING NO GOHAN DIDN'T IMAGINE GOKU TALKING TO HIM THROUGH KING KAI. THAT HAPPENED, I DON'T THINK THAT WAS GOHAN HALLUCINATING. I cannot stress ENOUGH that I think that's a wild thing to believe. What I was saying Is that the image of goku next to gohan as he's walking gohan through how to win, that isn't physically goku standing next to gohan. The post I was using to format my video called it "goku defying death" and compared it to the part in the bojack movie where goku just comes back to life with no explanation to help gohan. In other words, the meme/post I was going over is claiming that when we see goku next to gohan as he's doing the one handed kamehameha, that version of goku is supposed to be him in the flesh, back from the dead, on earth, next to his son. I have never seen anyone defend that position so I'm going to assume we can all agree that's not what's happening. NAMEK GOING TO SHIT This is admittedly my fault for being unclear, I was really tired of making this video by this point and was rushing to finish. I am NOT SAYING that goku should have just been with them on namek without gravity training, that's just a bad outcome for all. What I was arguing is that often times in DBZ there are instances where goku has some new training, new power up, new tech that lets him save the day but in the travel time or in the freiza example, time it takes goku to heal, people die/almost die. This happens with the sayians, this happens with the ginyu force , this happens with freiza. What I was trying to argue is that in these instances, it would be better for all if goku had gotten there sooner. I.E. instead of the gang having to stall for goku against the sayians, goku was just there from the start with the kaioken. The overall point I was trying to make is that goku being around during these fights would just generally result in better outcomes. You can disagree with that if you want, but that was the point I was making.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

RUNNING BACK SOME POINTS BUT GOKU DIED FOR HIS SON TWICE! Look, even if I agreed that this is something I should give good dad points, and not just what I expect from a parent, I still don't think these are that impressive. In the raditz scenario, goku is just on a respawn timer. Piccolo even gloats to raditz about the fact that goku is gonna be ressurected, it's how vegeta and nappa learn about the dragon balls because raditz was transmitting everything from his scouter. If one of the characters in universe acknowledges that this death is functionally just an extended vacation, I don't see why I should treat this as some big noble sacrifice. It's still bad that goku uses his only "get out of jail free" card but it's not death in the same way we understand it IRL. The Raditz death is only impressive on a surface level. For the cell scenario, credit where credit is due, goku doesn't know that he's going to have the option to come back in this one, but it's still not changing my mind. you can argue if gohan could beat cell without goku giving a senzu, so that's an angle I think you could reasonably take but lets say that's not true. For the sake of argument, the senzu bean doesn't change that gohan has to go SS2 to beat cell. This death is simply unavoidable, I'm sure there are some gigabrain DBZ scholars that could think of a way out of this situation but the show portrays goku taking the L as the only way to stop the earth from exploding. Goku is dying either way, the same way. The real questions is how many people die with him. But we can move past that. My question to you is, If you wanna say that this was "for gohan!" specifically. Would goku still make the same call of teleporting cell to other world if gohan were not in danger? The answer to this question is yes, as long as the earth gets destroyed, goku teleports cell and dies. So if I can remove gohan from the situation entirely, and the decision making and outcome are still the same, how can one say it's FOR gohan? It's not a techincally incorrect statment, gohan is one of the people goku is thinking about when making this call, but it would be just as accurate for me to say it's for krillin or for yamcha or for chichi. Goku is taking everyone he loves into account when doing this, so a more accurate statment is "goku died for his loved ones".... BUT AN EVEN MORE accurate statment would be that goku died for the planet since he is also absolutely taking the BILLIONS of people that will die from this into consideration. For all these reasons the cell death leaves much to be desired as a showing of goku's good dad status, even if I gave him credit for it. Not to mention, goku has the option to come back later, he just CHOOSES not to. Death in DBZ is not the same as real life, so while "goku died for him!" sounds really intense and epic on the surface, until we examine what the specifics of the situations are and how death really isn't as big of a deal in DBZ as it is in real life. My issue is the framing of these events, not it's technical accuracy. When you say goku died for gohan, leaving out the fact that death isn't the same as in real life. it sounds like you're leaving out details to make your point more palatable on the surface. GOKU STAYING DEAD So the reason goku gives for wanting to stay dead is that it will be more peaceful for the EARTH. He says earth here so he's thinking about the EARTH's health when making this choice. Even Sage agreed goku being around is just better for the planet in his reaction to this video, the planets health is intrinsically linked to gohan's if the earth blows up or is taken over, that's just bad for everyone living there. OG DB: pilaf gets his wish -> bad for the earth Red ribbon takes over -> bad for the earth King piccolo is unleashed via pilaf or some other method -> bad for the earth. goku being around to stop these things are all indisputably better outcomes, even with the encroaching danger to come from his presence. Frieza/sayians: The DBZ anime treats goku being sent there to wipe out the earth's population as cannon, from a pod of goku's projecting a moon and saying "kill all lifeforms" to freiza being reminded of bardock when he meets goku implying that the bardock special is cannon, to raditz saying as much with no reason within the context of the Z anime for that to be contested. I DO NOT believe in taking retcons into consideration when analyzing the material of just the Z anime. If it happens in the z anime, unless explicitly stated within the anime not to be real like a dream or vision, it's cannon to the z anime. Using OG DB is fair because, to my knowledge, nothing about DB contradicts the plot of the Z anime. This, to me, is like when looking at a show or a movie based on a book, they're two separate versions of the same story. I don't care what other versions say. Those are other versions. I'm only using information that was in the original 200-something episodes of DBZ. We don't use information exclusive to the books of Say Game of Thrones when analyzing events from the show, We don't use events from the manga when looking at the DBZ anime. To give you the logic, Goku was sent to earth to wipe out the planets population, meaning earth is valuable to sell, meaning it's probably going to be on frieza or the sayians radar at some point. keep in mind, namek is 6 days away from earth via sayian ship (The ship goku used was made of sayian ship scraps so It's reasonable to assume they scale), meaning even incredibly far distances can be broached quickly, also bearing in mind, frieza has a massive ever expanding empire, the idea that over passage of time frieza wouldn't just naturally encounter it seems off to me. Frieza's ultimate goal is to rule the entire universe, why he would just stop at earth is beyond me, If you wanna say it would take him a while, sure fair enough, but that's still a threat to billions of people later down the line. Dr gero: Even if you disagree with my logic on frieza, gero is an ez dub for my position. We literally have a timeline with goku dead, and the androids still pop up and wreck shop anyway. Gero was part of the red ribbon army. He ostensibly wants to rule the world. Yes, he wants to get back at goku because he hates him, but I see no reason why he couldn't be after both? The burden of proof is on my opposition to provide me with reason gero WOULDN'T want to still rule the world. if you're making a bunch of super powered terminators, and acting evil as shit, just killing random civilians (do not tell me that's the only way he could have found goku, dude definitely had other options of achieving that goal.) and punching a hole through yamcha, I think it is fair to assume he is just evil and won't stop because goku is dead. Buu: I get that nobody is contesting me on this, but that's kinda my point. I only need to be right about one of these events to be correct that goku staying dead is a bad thing. The earth getting destroyed/taken over under any contexts is an outcome that is counterproductive to goku's reasons to stay dead. For all these reasons, Goku electing to stay dead TO ME, only makes sense from a meta perspective. This is why I state that as the reason. To me, in narrative, this is just a choice that robs an 11 year old of his father.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

HOW WOULD GOKU KNOW? Lets just get some facts straight, Goku KNOWS gohan witnessed his death during the fight with the raditz. Goku KNOWS his 5 year old just saw a bunch of people get killed in front of him during the fight with nappa and vegeta. theres no getting around that one, goku is explicitly aware of this. Dude can see the bodies. In the anime, gohan has multiple nightmares about the events with raditz, waking up in terror, so he is INDISTPUTABLY effected by goku's death. Goku either doesn't understand these events are traumatic (which is what I lean towards) or he knows and just never bothers to have a conversation with his son about them. as for the namekians, goku could simply ask his son what occured on the alien planet while he was away. Goku doesn't do check ins with his son, something that every good parent should be doing. Most parents are not hovering over their kids on a day to day basis, they have to ask their kids about their lives. Goku never considers to do this. I know he doesn't because by the time of the cell games he still thinks gohan likes fighting, something goku would know isn't true from just one conversation with his son. Piccolo was able to figure this out, how is goku unable to? GOHAN'S RELATIONSHIP WITH FIGHTING You can have your own thoughts on what gohan's relationship with fighting is. I'm of the opinion that gohan's thoughts on it are like someone who doesn't like a video game his friends play. He might play the game to interact with his friends/family, or if someone has a gun to his head, but he wouldn't choose to do this of his own volition. It's why in buu, He doesn't train unless its with goten or his future wife, videl. He only fights as the great sayaman, to make the world a better place, not for strength unto itself. Gohan will fight to connect with his loved ones or to make the world a better place, not for it's own sake. That's my reading of the character, you can have your own, it's art, it's subjective. What's NOT up for interpretation is that gohan has a different view of fighting than his father, this is indisputably the case, I don't think anyone is arguing otherwise. The question is, why? I lean towards the fact that gohan's intial introduction with fighting is nothing but pain and bloodshed. He is constantly faced with choice after choice that boils down to "win or you and your loved ones die" even with his choice to go to namek, he wants to bring back piccolo and friends, the lives of people he cares about are held in the balance. I think this interpretation is supported further when we look at how goku sees fighting, sure he's a full blooded sayian but his introduction to martial arts was through grandpa gohan, a loving parental figure. Goku would have been around 4-5, the same age gohan is at the start of DBZ. We have another example, Goten. who I think we can all agree loves fighting, but he was introduced to it through his mother and brother not his father getting a hole punched into him. Goten loves fighting because he had the chance to be introduced to it under peaceful and wholesome circumstances. Not life or death matches for the fate of the planet. I look at the material and I see gohan as a boy who is constantly being forced into something he hates for the sake of others. He's a selfless good boy so he's going to do this, but it's not what he would choose if he felt he had any other choice. IT'S ONE MISTAKE I feel like people are missing the implications of what I'm saying. It is not one mistake, it is the SAME mistake over and over again, negligence. If you're someone like me who believes that gohan doesn't like fighting because of trauma, then the fact that goku doesn't know this information implies a lot of things. It means that goku has never had a conversation about these events with gohan, It means he doesn't bother to ask gohan if he even likes fighting which is not something a responsible parent should assume considering the stakes are life and death in these battles, it means goku is just not considering what his own child thinks for large chunks of his life. That is negligence, that is BAD parenting. GOKU'S PLAN I really should have done a better job on elaborating on how terrible this all actually is, so lets just hammer this home one final time. Goku plans the fate of everyone, his life, his sons life, the billions of innocent people on the earth, on gohan without ever considering how gohan feels about the situation. There are a couple of glaring issues with this from the start but the thing I want you to be mindful of, this is the fate of the whole goddamn planet. You do NOT get to fuck up here, I could potentially look past everything, if the stakes weren't planetary. I don't care how much goku THINKS this plan will work, if you're hinging everyone's lives on this, you better double check the math, you better make sure you're right. Goku obviously doesn't do this, which is at the very least incredibly irresponsible. He doesn't tell gohan about this plan in the year they spend together, which again, if he had actually talked to his son about the plan before hand, he would know that gohan doesn't like fighting and at the very least be able to come up with a plan that doesn't get 16, trunks, and himself killed along the way. Something I think we also tend to forget is that, goku's plan in execution, fails. Remember, that whole scene with piccolo is because gohan is getting his shit shoved in, when cell intentionally TRIES to get gohan to snap, gohan breaks down crying. They very narrowly avoid everyone dying, It is only through the efforts of 16 that gohan is able to reach his power. This is a variable goku could NOT have accounted for because he met 16 that same day. So it is only by sheer luck that they stay alive. I want to be very clear here, THE GOAL of getting gohan to achieve his hidden potential is a good one, no issues with it at all. THE WAY GOKU CHOOSES TO TRY AND ACHIEVE THIS GOAL is a complete fucking disaster. If goku had, informed gohan before hand about the plan, been mindful enough to actually consider what his son thinks about all this before putting the fate of the entire world on his shoulders, talked to his son at all about what he thinks and feels in the 11 years he's been alive, maybe 16 would still be alive. AGAIN really need to drive this home, FATE OF THE WORLD. YOU DO NOT GET TO BE RECKLESS HERE.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

POINTS I DIDN'T COVER because I used that post as the formatting for going over my position, there were somethings I just didn't cover I felt I should have so I'm gonna spend the time to go over them. THE BEAN This point has been beaten to death but it bears mentioning. I don't care how confident goku is in his son, goku is not a god incapable of making a mistake. In that same arc a few moments later, goku is going to freak the fuck out over a fuck up involving his perception of his son. It is just not a good idea no matter the circumstances. Some people have argued that goku was doing some kind of 5D chess maneuver and this was the ONLY WAY gohan could have taken out cell. I think that's giving goku way too much fucking credit. The stated reason of wanting cell to have a fair fight, and goku just thinking it won't matter anyway are both perfectly in character reasons for him to do this. This is akin to if my 6'7 jacked son got into a fist fight with another dude, and i gave that other dude a knife because "lol it won't matter anyway." It doesn't matter if i'm right, it's still not a good thing to do. Just because a good outcome results from an action, doesn't mean that action as a rule is a good thing to do. It's possible for me to throw a brick outside of my window and that brick to hit someone who was about to shoot a puppy and have a good outcome by saving that puppy. That doesn't mean we should throw bricks outside of our windows. I hope this logic makes sense. BUT THEY'RE ALIENS! I have never seen any evidence that gohan's behavior warrants a different upbringing from a human child outside of his abilities. To me, gohan is a clark kent situation, he walks, talks and acts like any human but he is a superpowered being. there isn't anything about gohan's behavior to me can't be explained by his upbringing. As for goku, yeah he's an alien with a functionally human son, I am not surprised he doesn't live up to my standards. I never expected goku to meet these standards, only that if he was going to be called a good dad, he's have to meet them. YOU'RE USING REAL LIFE LOGIC IN DRAGON BALL If this were about any other character, I would completely agree. Dragon ball isn't exactly hyper realistic. That said, when I look at gohan, the trauma and pain of fighting is what I see in him. So If the show is gonna acknowledge it, I will too. BUT THE THEMES OF DRAGON BALL Z ARE ABOUT GOKU'S RELATIONSHIP WITH GOHAN I don't disagree, I just don't think this relationship Is as clean cut as you all seem to think. I see a wild crackhead alien raising a FUNCTIONALLY human child, of course there are going to be some bumps along the way. There is a lot of theming in DBZ about the differences between the two. When Goku chooses not to kill frieza in his super sayian power up, it's because ultimately of the way he views fighting, as a means to self improve and grow stronger. Goku (tries to) leave frieza alive as a mark of shame. Gohan doesn't kill cell because gohan wants to torture him. That's what fighting has been for gohan, death matches, a way for others to inflict pain. While I don't think the themes of the story directly support my position, There is enough there I think it fits. GOKU SPENDS ALL THIS TIME WITH GOHAN AND THEY'RE HAPPY In real life, children idolize their parents even if they might be shitty, I think vegeta is a fucking awful dad but trunks still looked up to him in buu. I don't consider a child's opinions to be a good barometer for the objective quality of parenting. That all being said, Yeah goku does spend time with his son and they do get along. I'm not gonna dispute that, he gets good dad credit here. The things i'd like you to keep in mind is that this time is often just an activity, mainly training, sometimes fishing or just relaxing. This is time goku is spending with his son, but it's not time he's spending getting to KNOW his son. Bearing in mind, training is something GOKU likes to do, it's not what gohan likes. It is good that goku spends time with his son but it's not good enough to outweigh the bad. THE BEST CASE FOR GOKU AS A DAD The biggest dub in goku's career as a father is not dying for his son, it's the fact that gohan is a shining star of a person who will always do the right thing and make the right call for those around him. I will 100% attribute that to goku and chichi because gohan is like this even from the age of 4. If you want to argue that teaching someone like gohan, who is just built different and will eventually become one of the strongest beings in the universe, good values outweighs all of the bad, I think that's fair. I don't agree with this perspective obviously but I do think it is a really solid point, that's completely reasonable. CLOSING THOUGHTS Whew, yeah that was a lot. If you bothered to read all of that, I'm hoping it's because you want to interact with it in good faith and not due to obsession. If you still don't agree with me after all this, that's fine. you're entitled to see the show however you want. I just want to leave this behind knowing I did my best to explain myself and clarified some miscommunications. I will not be arguing any of these anymore, this whole process has been exhausting. Originally I wanted to make a response video but I think this will have to suffice for now. It's too much effort for something I don't have the passion for (trust me the video I had planned was way more effort than this post is) I'm moving on to castlevania content. if you still wanna dog on me, that's fine, I did my best.

[@zenkai4124]

So do you still belive goku is a bad father?

[@JoeRolde4]

​@@Too-Much-Caffeinegoahn is still a half saiyan. Does gohans saiyan side just yet ignored. To be honest sure he has human blood which makes it so that he doesn't want to fight but the saiyan blood in him should counter this no?

[@magozomodz808]

Bro you did not cook 💀

[@samuelbrown1283]

He burnt the f*cking water

[@dljennings26]

This is what you get when you are wrong and overconfident at the same time. It is not a good combination

[@bovineintervention6001]

Ironically being wrong and overconfident at the samr time is the mistake gohan made in the cell games that his "terrible father" had to die to bail him out of

[@lost.name636brother9]

@@bovineintervention6001 not to mention, he had instant transmission, and could just return back before cell detonated so his second sacrifice was pointless, and it's just an idiot.

[@IDK-dude1]

@@lost.name636brother9Maybe goku wanted to die

[@Koodllez]

Nope goku needs time to search for ki he did not have that time​@@lost.name636brother9

[@samuelbrown1283]

It's even WORSE than Saiyan Saga Vegeta

[@Guts124]

This is what happens when you only watch the dub of Dragonball Z. For you to say that Goku died for the planet and not Gohan twice, especially in the Cell fight is beyond going full re-re. Goku died because of Gohan being arrogant in the Cell fight. Some folks don't need a KZbin channel if their going to lie about Goku just for clicks.

[@S197_rexx]

Yea this guy in the video tryna explain is down right Retarded and 95% of his points are so invalid it’s crazy but what can I expect from somebody who says dying for your child isn’t good parenting it’s “just parenting “ 💀💀💀like yeaaaa he’s goofy

[@darksydedavid]

i just got finished with the cell saga watched it dubbed, that same scene where goku dies saving gohan from his arrogance GOHAN LITERALLY SAID THAT AFTER GOKU DIED i have no idea where he’s coming from at all

[@breyonnabutler8986]

Shut up goofy

[@esdlegend5309]

This is probably one of the most brain dead videos ive seen calling goku a bad dad while lying n completely being wrong in nearly 95% of the video

[@christophercastiglione2603]

Sage exposed you

[@jamemule5326]

Who is that?

[@Offender-eu8ey]

​@@jamemule5326 it's another KZbinr that literally showed all the reasons why Goku isn't a bad dad

[@GDKF0238]

He sent his 11 year old to fight someone none of them could beat, and then gave that same someone a reset on his health. Please shut up. The argument ends there

[@Slewind]

@@GDKF0238 love how you left out context, you know like how he trained with son for year so he knows that his 11 year old son is stronger then everyone at the time and if he wasn't then cell would have killed them all, or how if he didn't give cell a senzu bean then cell wouldn't have been confident enough to bring out the power of that 11 year to beat him.

[@TheSilverBoy24]

This man didn't watch Dragon Ball Z, he watched Lizzard Square X.

[@exaltedfalcheon1793]

For Raditz. What did you expect Goku to do. Goku did everything in his power to keep Gohan safe. Heck, prior to his kidnapping, he spent 4 years in the mountains with Chi-Chi doing what? TAKING CARE OF HIS SON! Goku was dead so he had no control over whether of not Gohan fought that Saiyans or not. In fact, when he felt his dad losing to Vegeta, he went back to go help his dad. For Namek, GOHAN TOLD HIS OWN MOTHER TO, AND I QUOTE "SHUT UP" BECAUSE HE WANTED TO HELP HIS FRIENDS. And when Gohan got his neck broken by Reccome, Goku touched down and healed his son and said "everything's gonna be alright Gohan" and beat the dude that broke his son's neck with a single punch. Goku couldn't interfere with the Freeza fight because he needed to heal (Ginyu had bodyswapped him, Ginyu in Goku's body was beat to a pulp, and Goku go his body back) And Goku's escape ship had random coordinates, he hopped in and was sent to a random planet. It jsut so happened that by the time he got back to earth. And what do you mean!? GOKU WASN'T THERE FOR MOST OF THAT! His training with Piccolo? Dead. His fight with the Saiyans? Hadn't arrived yet. Namek? Goku was, at first training on WASN'T there yet because Gohan, Bulma, Krillin had went without him. Then he went there, needed to heal again. And started fighting Freeza. And if Gohan didn't like fighting. He'd straight up tell Goku. What, you gonna tell me that Goku wouldn't care? And Gohan never had a problem with training. He trained with Goku and Piccolo 3 years prior to the Androids and an entire year with Goku in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber. And before that, Gohan was training with Piccolo for the Saiyans, if he didn't like training he would have said so! And the "Visual metaphor of Goku being there" yeah, i could dig it. But to say that Goku abandoned his family, simply because he possibly knew Chi-Chi had another bun in the oven is wild. Goku said that its was for the good of everyone that he stayed dead. Because Raditz only came to earth to recruit Goku. Vegeta and Nappa came to earth for dragon balls, which was because of Piccolo, which was because of goku killing Piccolo Sr. Freeza came to earth because goku "killed him", which wouldn't have happened if Goku wasn't there. The Androids were made to AND I QUOTE "KILL SON GOKU" because Goku destroyed the RR army. HOW DOES THIS MAE ANY SENSE

[@matthewdescorbeth4443]

FAXXXXXX

[@Darekiller1025]

Exactly. This dude didnt actually watcj dragon ball nor does he understand goku.

[@downd.stairs8313]

Goku also inadvertently saved Gohan by, in just four years, raising him to be such a good person that the son of the Demon King would have a change of heart and sacrifice their life to save him.

[@Ippothegoat-pq5xn]

Didn’t Goku team up with his mortal enemy TO GET HIS SON BACK?!?! Wtf are we doing?!?!

[@samuelbrown1283]

Are you talking about piccolo

[@xxstealerxx]

@@samuelbrown1283 ya

[@breyonnabutler8986]

Idk y yall think doing the bare minimum for your child is being a good dad.

[@file_thirteen]

@@breyonnabutler8986how is trying to save your son the bar minimum

[@bovineintervention6001]

Gohan CHOSE to go back and defend his father against Vegeta. He CHOSE to go to namek, he CHOSE to go after Dodoria, and CHOSE to fight Recoome. The only one who ever *forced* gohan to fight before goku in the cell games was Piccolo. You know, the supposed "real" father. Attacks him at random in the wilderness, throws him at mountains, and throws him at nappa. Even almost made him drown once. If anything goku in the cell games was just following piccolo's "good parenting" from the saiyan saga!

[@moonlitsamurai718]

Buddy is yapping about nothing

[@painvillegaming4119]

This man really just said sacrificing your own life to save that if your kid doesn't make you a good parent...Dude what's wrong with you?

[@painvillegaming4119]

@@xtale_crosssanseltaquero547 my god the Yap No jutsu is strong with this one When was the last time you watched the fight with raditz? It was trough fear and concern for Gohan that he got back up He literally told Gohan to run away after Gohan head butted him

[@sophiadebar382]

Blud is getting cooked in the comments. Saying that Goku saved the planet from Raditz and not his son just made me completely check out mentally. It’s literally in the dub that Goku says “please, don’t hurt him. He’s just a boy”. Goku grabbing Raditz is literally in response to Raditz trying to kill Gohan immediately after he says this. His hands are hovering above Gohan ready to kill him. THATS when Goku leaps in. Not when he’s about to do anything to the earth, but when he’s about to kill Gohan. He also does this with broken ribs btw, which had rendered him immobile up until then. He also literally tells Krillin to take care of Gohan right before he dies

[@DakotaP1997]

Goku’s reputation as a bad father is seriously overblown, possibly due to the popularity of DB Abridged, which exaggerated that aspect of his character. It is actually pretty obvious that Goku MUST have been at least a reasonably decent father to Gohan during the time gap between DB and DBZ and during the time after he returned to Earth from Namek and before the Androids appeared. We can see this simply in how attached Gohan is to him and in how, overall, Gohan turned out as a person. What deficiencies he has as a father to human eyes largely boil down to one simple fact. He is an alien from a species that simply doesn’t “do” parenthood, and has no innate psychological instincts for it. Goku is in fact the second best Saiyan father we see in the entire series. He is a better father than his own father, Bardock, a better father than King Vegeta, a better father than Paragus (both versions), and yes, a better father than Vegeta until the middle of the Buu Saga at least. We don’t see any other Saiyan parents, but given how all the Saiyans we do see behave, at least in universe 7, it is pretty safe to say that NONE of them had sires who would be deserving of “Father of the Year” mugs. Toriyama once said that Saiyans do not regard family as any different from friends and companions. In other words they do not have familial instincts. Most humans have paternal instincts, such that just knowing or being told that a child is their offspring automatically makes them instantly attached to that child. We do not actually have to meet our children or get to know them as individual people before becoming attached to them. But Goku is different. He doesn’t get that automatic instinctive bonding reaction. And this essentially explains his relationship to Goten. He never met Goten until he returns from the dead in the Buu Saga. Goten up until then is a stranger to him, and he regards and treats him as so. Even by the beginning of Super, he would only have known Goten for about a year or so at most. This also explains is most often cited and most egregious failure with respect to Gohan. ie His “abandoning” of Gohan to fight Cell on his own. This too follows logically from the fact the Goku is a Saiyan and Saiyans as a rule do not have explicit, separate, parental instincts. In the case of Gohan he does get to meet Gohan personally and bond with him as an individual during Gohan’s formative years. And, because Gohan is largely helpless, and Goku is fundamentally decent, this bonding also means that Goku is very protective of Gohan during those years. And there is enough overlap in what we humans think is a good way of treating a younger, less capable, less experienced good friend and good parenting that Goku arrives at a reasonable facsimile of thereof, even though he psychologically took a different route to get there. But come the Cell Saga and Gohan isn’t so incapable or inexperienced anymore, and Goku’s attitude naturally changes. Send your tween son out to fight an omnicidal maniac even stronger than you are? Even if your son happens to be stronger than you and you are confident he can win? Questionable for a father. But having a dear comrade in arms fight that monster, when he is stronger than you are, can get even stronger still when he gets angry, you already know you cannot beat this monster, and the monster is going to destroy the planet if it isn’t stopped? Well, that’s much more reasonable. Have at ‘em, kid! The other aspect with respect to the deficiencies in Goku’s parenting, relative to Vegeta also are consistent with the above. Goku is a static character who doesn’t change, while Vegeta is a dynamic character who evolves as the story progresses, and his improvement as a father is one of those evolving aspects. Vegeta was a TERRIBLE father at the beginning. He wouldn’t even acknowledge his own son’s existence. But he grew and changed until he eventually became probably the best Saiyan father who has ever existed in Universe 7, ever. But Goku is a static character who does not change. And one of the most important things that the parenting instinct does for us humans is that it changes us. Our priorities shift when we become parents, and observing how those priorities change in others is one of the ways we judge what is and is not good parenting. But Goku doesn’t change. His priorities stay the same. And to human eyes that stands out as a sign specifically of bad parenting, but actually Goku’s failures in this regard are not specific to that. His deficiencies as a parent as the same as his deficiencies as a person in general.

[@satamsonicandsonallyforeve]

All you are saying was bullshit

[@WADE-2]

People say goku is a bad father literally don't watch dragon ball

[@giosbizarreart9048]

I agrre with everything except that goku is easily a better father than vegeta throughout all of Z. Super is where it gets debatable

[@JARMIDz]

As soon as he made his first point, by saying that raditz threatened to blow up the earth, I knew the rest of the video would be bad, because raditz never made such a threat. He didn't watch dragon ball and he's saying that we didn't 😭

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

I admit I forgot the specifics sure, but the end result is the same, Raditz wants to kill everyone on the planet. The end result is the same, so the argument doesn't really change.

[@painvillegaming4119]

@@Too-Much-Caffeinedude the Guy leapt and put Raditz into a full Nelson when his son was in danger

[@JARMIDz]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine he never said he wants to kill everyone on the planet either. Goku was supposed to do that, but since goku didn't do it, raditz made him an ultimatum,(paraphrasing) join me and the other saiyans, or I'll take gohan to fill in your place, and to prove your loyalty that you're willing to join, bring 100 human bodies here tomorrow at this time. That's all he said, nothing about exterminating humanity. Which goes to show that goku didn't even try to make a plan, he got up and immediately went after raditz who one shot him, whilst teaming up with his biggest enemy, specifically to get gohan. If that's not very clearly built up just to astablish the relationship between goku and gohan, I don't know what is. You also seem to ignore the start of the arc entirely, as it depicts goku as being a caring father for gohan, with gohan very clearly loving him, which is a driving narrative in story, with the entirety of it being focused on goku's relationship with gohan, and that being one of the objectives raditz is specifically made for, also to show us gohan can snap when his loved ones are in danger. Raditz sets up DBZ perfectly, and you just straight up ignored it. This could easily go much more in depth, with things like goku's power increase, peace times etc... But you didn't even care to research or rewatch some episodes even when doing a video, saying that you're extremely smart and whatnot, so I am not going to explain the entirety of the show to you. I just wanted to talk about this very huge mistake you made, and the beginning of the saiyan saga, since it's the building block for all what comes next, except for maybe the buu saga. Maybe go watch kai or read the manga, and you'll get a better idea bro, because in all honesty you're just wrong

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@JARMIDz I feel like the obvious assumption is that raditz wants to finish the job of exterminating the human race. it's pretty apparent given the context of the situation. Maybe not right then and there cause raditz wanted goku for a bigger job but eventually, yeah they're gonna kill everyone. Considering that's what goku was originally sent there to do, idk why they'd just suddenly not do that?

[@JARMIDz]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine why would you assume that? And why would goku assume that? The context was that raditz came to take goku to join the saiyans. Am I missing out on something else? It was made very clear, that raditz was going to take gohan, and that's it, there were no further threats that were even implied, so anything else would be head canon. And not even in an interpretation type of way, you literally gave him new dialogue. Why would they kill everyone? Earth is considered a small planet without a lot of resources, they wouldn't even spend their time conquering it. Further proof of that is also raditz, vegeta and nappa being completely uninterested in conquering earth. I really didn't even have to say all of that, because what you told me is literally just head canon

[@GohanBlack56]

This is what happens when people don’t watch the show or don’t understand what going on. When people don’t understand nothing they just go on about what someone else tells them, I get that everyone has different views and point the this topic, but please understand that most of your opinions are just based off of what you didn’t like or just what you didn’t want to admit.

[@bladysante2903]

You say you have 10,000 IQ but then make this garbage excuse of a bad Dad video on Goku where you LIED about certain events...crazy

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

What did I lie about?

[@Zikuto_]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine”I always saw it as Gohan hallucinating his dad was there” GOKU was with king Kai trying his best to motivate gohan because he knew gohan was stronger than cell the entire time and was the only one who could beat him. Gohan wasn’t hallucinating or imagining his dad or whatever you said you must’ve forgot king Kai allows people to communicate from other world which we see when the Z-fighters attempt to wish goku back post cell.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@Zikuto_ I was arguing he wasn't PHYSICALLY there. I understand how King kai works. I wasn't referring to goku talking to him through king kai, I was referring to that image of goku next to gohan when he's doing the Kamehameha. I don't think that's supposed to be real, and the image from the video I was debunking implies it's supposed to be.

[@Zikuto_]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine LMFAOOO it’s a placeholder so the audience can see what gohan is thinking in the present moment. This is insane that you use an image and drag it like this. It’s symbolic of GOHANS DAD SUPPORTING HIM

[@Thereal_Dev]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine bro got cooked and stopped replying

[@Joe.F.Buster]

I could go and write a thesis on why this video is wrong and why the like to dislike ratio is as it is but You already have convinced yourself of this take and one random comment on the internet will change your mind so I'll just say this If goku making 1 mistake that he wouldn't have known as a mistake cuz gohan actively enjoyed training and enjoyed being around people who like to fight is proof that goku is a bad father then everyone has bad father's If You hang around the basketball team and your parents see You play basketball better then anyone else even them pro players from time to time they arent bad parents for assuming you like to play basketball and putting you on your schools team to face the championship team Thats really all there is to it your other points are circumstantial and rely on "he was saving the planet not his son" levels of logic and it ultamitely hurts your point

[@Zikuto_]

Ngl making a vid like this is crazy when you’ve only seen the funimation dub

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

It's the better adaptation 🤷‍♂️ I think gokus voice in sub is unbearable.

[@Zikuto_]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine there are so many Mis translations in dub dragon ball that it isn’t funny I watch dub I’m not saying it’s bad. What I am saying is you only watching the funimation dub which has a plethora of mistranslations isn’t a good thing. You don’t know the full context or picture because of this.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Well that's why I make the qualifier that I'm only talking about the dub. This is already a HEATED topic. The last thing it needs is bringing up translations of a language I'm pretty very almost none of use speak making an already nuanced discussion incredibly complicated.

[@Zikuto_]

Watch DragonballZ Kai it has the least translation errors but even then fact checking goes a long way in presenting a genuine argument or standpoint.@@Too-Much-Caffeine

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@Zikuto_ I'll be frank. unless someone speaks the language themselves I do not give a single fuck about their opinions on the translations. I certainly don't speak Japanese so by that same logic, Nobody should give a single fuck about my interpretations of a language who i have a barely glancing knowledge of from anime.

[@nezukokamado46]

Question….who threw gohan to the saiyans not knowing if he was able to? PICCOLO and goku only put gohan in the fight WHEN HE KNEW GOHAN WAS READY so point invalid and don’t bother mentioning the senzu bean

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

My guy, until the buu saga, he's ages ranging from 5-11. He is NEVER ready for bloody fight to the death. His age only has 1 digit for a majority of the show. I honestly forgot about the senzu, but yeah, super fucking bad parenting moment lol. "Let me heal the guy who is going to blow up the planet." 10/10

[@nezukokamado46]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine when he went against cell he was literally THE ONLY ONE with the power to beat cell cause goku even said “you’re too strong for me”

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@nezukokamado46 and? Still doesn't justify not telling him until the last second and then healing cell lol. He's 11. Fighting a battle to the death for the fate of the planet is a shit ton of pressure for anyone. It's why piccolo shouts at goku because he's not motivated by "being the strongest" he's a kid.

[@nezukokamado46]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine let’s see…what did cell do after being beat by ssj2 gohan? Oh I remember now….HE TRIED TO SELF DESTRUCT WHICH MESNS HE WOULD HAVE TRIED THAT IF HE WAS LOSING TO SSJ GOHAN…WHICH MEANS IF GOKU DOES THE THING CELL GETS EVEN FUCKING STRONGER BECAUSE HE GETS THAT ZENKAK BOOST IN PERFECT

[@DBZFANX1000]

​@@Too-Much-Caffeinepiccolo is a hypocrite piccolo is the one that made gohan a fighter. Goku at least knows gohan wants to become a scholar and doesn't care about him being a fighter later on. Ita piccolo who gets on gohan ass whenever he slacks of like in the tournament of power. Piccolo throws mountains leaves him in the wilderness. Piccolo was the first person that wanted abuse gohans potential what piccolo says doesn't matter. Also all the fights gohan eithe goku was dead or hurt and gohan made those fights himself nobody forced him to go to namek. Gohan said shut up mom i"m going. Of course goku is not gonna know he doesn't like fighting because he doesn't show it. goku never asked for gohan to be in death battles. Cell vs gohan tho is one scenario where goku needed to believe in his son. His son was the only one that had the power. Korin says cell is stronger than goku before the fight goku when he sees probably thinks cell would get his ass worked. cell is not worried about goku even eagers him to take a senzu bean at the end of the fight. Cell powers up against ssj 2 gohan showing he had more power all along. So everything implies goku is too weak and should he not rely on gohan goku would die and then gohan would have to fight anyway.

[@matsu7086]

Do you think Goku would've been a better dad if none of the DBZ/S villains occurred and they lived in peacetimes? Because it was shown in the beginning of Z that Goku highly prioritized his family and their safety before having to fight world ending enemies. Goku set aside his passions for training and fighting for years to make sure Gohan and Chi Chi had a stable life before Raditz interfered and openly supported Gohan's dreams of being a scholar throughout the show, but was forced to train him. So, I wonder how things would've played out without the overhead of looming dangers? I think Gohan would still take the initiative to train with his father (not to the extent in the show ofc). This could be seen from how he still takes some time out to train techniques like the SBC in DBS Super Hero.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Yes. I can't know for certain of course, but without constantly needing to death matches, yeah i'd say goku would make a far better parent.

[@nartendowarz]

Getting beat up builds character

[@anthomarti1105]

Broooo just say u haven't seen the anime, u didn't need to cherry pick that much lol

[@nahsiongoetre6874]

You can say He isnt a good Dad but calling him a bad dad is such a goddamn stretch

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

How so?

[@nahsiongoetre6874]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine Whenever Goku has any down time and the whole planet isnt at risk he spends it with his Family...Hell even in the Cell arc he spends the 9 ways chilling with Gohan and Chi Chi, He even kept his promise that he made to Gohan in the saiyan saga...And its not like any of the characters think so either...If Goku was such a bad father he wouldn't have been Gohans role model...I know people love to say how Goku doesnt spend time with Gohan or whatever...But when you think about it..He is the character he spends the most time with in fact

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@nahsiongoetre6874 he spends off screen time that doesn't really amount to much, the fact that goku doesn't know all that shit about gohan IMO tells me that while he may have been present, he didn't really meaningfully interact with his son. I mean why is piccolo explaining something as basic as "gohan doesn't like fighting" to his father? Seems like Goku flat out doesn't understand his son to me but to each his own. Ty for watching

[@nahsiongoetre6874]

@@Too-Much-CaffeineNp,I enjoyed the vid still even if I dont agree with some points, These discussions are for fun and to put our opinions on certain topics out there..Well anyways on the way I always interpreted the scene you mentioned is in Goku's eyes after coming back from death he has only ever seen Gohan be a fighter and trying his best and being brave, He hasnt seen him be afraid of a fight or a coward, He even trained with him and Piccolo those 3 years to prepare for the Androids and that was fully his choice, even in the time chamber Gohan was pushing himself to improve the most out of everyone that went in Gohan pushed himself the hardest saying Goku was going too easy on him, Honestly whenever he is around Goku he is always trying to impress him like any son. Also it makes sense Piccolo would know Gohan doesnt like fighting since he basically forced him into it...Alot of people would make this mistake, especially when Gohan doesnt show any disinterest towards fighting at least around Goku...Hell people still cant comprehend the fact that Gohan doesnt like to fight and keep calling him a failure, At least Goku learned from his misjudgement...In fact the first thing he thought to do when he realized this was to jump in right away

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@nahsiongoetre6874 you know what I think that's actually a fair point that goku at least bothered to recognize his mistake and try to correct.

[@Yakonsupremacy]

Goku didnt decide to stay in space, he went into one of the ginyu force members pod which was automatically set for yadrat, and returned home afterwards, its a long journey because its on the other side of the universe. Again clearly didnt pay attention to

[@denisgonzales4940]

If Goku was a good father, The earth would be destroyed right now

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Kinda true NGL

[@tuffmoney5203]

Well atleast we come to a agreement

[@nikidelvalle]

Is that actually true though? Or would not being distracted by parenting have given Goku the time he needed to become strong enough to defeat Cell on his own?

[@jamescadet4450]

@@nikidelvalleliterally in the beginning of the story Goku hardly did any training since he was busy fathering Gohan and because of that he was too weak to stop Raditz from taking his son right in front of him.

[@WickedKnightAlbel]

Bruh Gohan opted into every single fight including Perfect Cell, or else he wouldn't have trained so hard in the time chamber Because he was raised in a way that accepts moral responsibility to use how immense power to help people He sure didn't get that from Chi-Chi. She'd have preferred he ignore all that and focus solely on himself Yet he _still_ sees scholarly work as a means to help others, because he genuinely cares about others Same with superhero work because he's incapable of sitting by and ignoring problems You don't keep doing something with such effort if it keeps hurting you, yet his ambition to heroism (in all capacities) remains strong as ever You also need a huge center of self-confidence to even see things that way, because seeing the entire world as a thing you can just fix is often a combination of naivety and arrogance Now who was the parent congratulating him when he succeeded? Building that confidence. Molding him into an even greater hero than his predecessors Not Piccolo and not Chichi Always been Goku

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Dog gohan and everyone he loves dies If he doesn't win these fights. That's not an honest choice, that's a gun to his head. The question is, would gohan have willingly chosen to do this training and learn to fight if he didn't have the threat of death looming over him. DBS says no.

[@Zikuto_]

@@Too-Much-Caffeineit isn’t fair sure but goku realized in the chamber that gohan was significantly stronger than everyone including himself. Cell was gonna boom the planet if he didn’t get his way. There was literally no other options

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@Zikuto_ I'm not arguing otherwise. I'm only arguing that without a gun to gohans head, he wouldn't willingly choose to take these fights. saying gohan "opted in" to these fights is ignoring that fact. A choice under threat of death is not a real choice. I know gohan has to fight in order to save the world, I'm only arguing if it weren't that way, we have no reason to believe he would CHOOSE these fights of his own volition.

[@Zikuto_]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine You realize that can be said of the majority of the Z-fighters right? That isn’t ground breaking. They don’t want the planet they live on to be blown tf up.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@Zikuto_ But they actually proactively seek out training and furthering themselves without the need for an earth destroying threat looming over the horizon. Tien, piccolo, and goku all train and try to get stronger independent of a gun to their head. For gohan, that's not the case. We only ever see him try to get stronger if the world is in danger. DBS shows us that if given the chance, gohan will prioritize other things above fighting. If not for being born immensely gifted and thus being needed to keep the earth safe, I doubt he'd ever willingly choose being a fighter.

[@sammyboi8938]

Who let bro cook 💀💀💀

[@jamemule5326]

He did not do well👀

[@Yakonsupremacy]

The most basic is dying for your child? Theres a big difference between saving your child and sacrificing your life for your child

[@toonskiplays3610]

i enjoyed the video but at 8:40 where you say if goku has to be around for vegeta and freiza to protect everyone is completely wrong. if goku wasn't around for DBZ the only saga that would have happen would be the buu saga. raditz comes to earth to find goku, vegeta gose to earth to find the dragonball's which he overheard on raditz's scooter. so no raditz on earth no vegeta on earth. if vegeta dosen't go to earth freiza dosen't learn about the dragon balls so no namek, no goku around Dr guro would have no reason to make the andriods and/or cell. so Goku was right at the end of the cell saga, all the bad guys came because of Goku be it directly or indirectly, it all comes back to goku being there. you can take it a step futher, if no Goku but still Gohan, all the truma and hurt he suffered as a child wouldn't have happened, none of it.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

I understand the underlying logic, no Goku means no sayian saga so a bunch of stuff doesn't happen. But my thought process is that A) the villains of OG DB would still be an issue as well as B) I know Goku expedited the process but if Frieza's goal is to conquer the universe then EVENTUALLY, he's gonna set his sights on earth. Maybe not for decades sure but it's gonna be a problem at some point

[@toonskiplays3610]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine but then the question is would freiza conquer earth before Buu's revival?

[@RedBolt244]

The argument that everything is better with goku there is just generally wrong. The saiyans only went to earth cus they realized piccolo was there and went to get a wish Frieza would have never even got to earth till years ahead in the future, and would have no reason to rush there. The androids were literally MADE to kill goku, worst you can say is the red ribbon army takes over the world but that’s it. Only situation where it dont matter is buu

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Goku was sent to earth by the sayians to take it over implying that it is valuable to sell, (the Z anime treats this as cannon with goku's pod literally saing "Kakarot destroy all life forms") So if it's on the sayians radar to sell that means it's in the sights of the sayians/frieza. Sure it'd take time, i'm not arguing they'd rush it but I think there's plenty evidence to suggest someone was gonna show up trying to take the place. Goku died in the trunks timeline and the androids were still unleashed upon the world. Gero wanted to kill goku for sure, but he was also part of an authoritarian regime that wanted to take over the world, we have no evidence to suggest this goal has changed. The red ribbon army taking over the world is a terrible outcome for the earth. I just don't think we have sufficient evidence to suggest that the evil people goku encounters wouldn't be a threat later down the line.

[@Koodllez]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine The reason it tells him to do that is because it's a sayian pod it was programmed to tell the children to destroy the planets they were sent to

[@Eerie_bus]

@@Too-Much-Caffeineyou’re dead fucking wrong here too Goku was sent to earth by bardock to save his son and since earth had weaklings, Goku would survive there There is no “to take it over” scenario. That was the excuse bardock made.

[@jamemule5326]

Bro stop drinking caffeine

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

It makes me more powerful and higher IQ than my contemporaries. You just wanna see me nerfed 😤

[@jamemule5326]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine okey good for you bro👍

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@jamemule5326 thanks bro

[@Koodllez]

it ain't caffeine it's coke

[@pokemonjhotomaster]

Your whole argument is dismantled by the fact that Goku fought Raditz *solely* because he kidnapped Gohan. Goku was willing to chase after him while injured. He straight up puts Raditz in a full Nelson *because* he’s trying to kill Gohan. Like seriously the mental gymnastics that people go through to argue against the story is ridiculous. Your arguments are basically the same repeated arguments that pro have been using since day 1 lol.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

dude i feel like you don't understand my point at all. My point isn't that he hates his son, it's that saying he died "for him!" implies that he died specifically for Gohan, when the fate of the planet is at play here. You're forgetting the only reason Raditz kidnaps Gohan at all is because Goku won't join him. literally the first thing Raditz says to him is "why haven't you terminated all life on the planet?" so Goku EXPLCITLY knows that Raditz plans on killing everyone. Getting his son back is obviously a priority, but my underlying point is that if Goku didn't stop Raditz, everyone dies anyway, so this is for the planets benefit as much as it is Gohans, so implying it's for gohan when every single person on the planet is on the table is really misleading and isn't actually an accurate representation of events.

[@pokemonjhotomaster]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine Raditz kidnapping Gohan proves my point further if Goku was a bad dad why would that cross his mind? Again Goku *immediately* tried to give chase despite being injured and only didn’t because everyone stopped. A point you’re trying to gloss over.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@pokemonjhotomaster 3:47 I already addressed this. Keeping your kid alive is the only thing that defines what a parent is. Goku is a parent, he's just a bad parent.

[@pokemonjhotomaster]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine except he’s not a bad parent. Bad parents don’t raise their kids for four years and then die for them. According to you any police officer, soldier, fire fighter etc is a bad parent.

[@lordraiden7397]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine Who the hell would die for their kid if they're just a parent? That's dumb logic.

[@Jjk58174]

Dub only and cherry picking. No referring to the manga, ignores the clear bond they show before Raditz, ignores that Gohan went back to save Goku from Vegeta because of said bond, pulls every instance where Goku is incapable of being by his sons side, ignore the 3 years that Goku spent time with Gohan, forces limited perspective onto the relationship, fails to realize that most parents nowadays would not commit to self-sacrifice, and dismisses all other opinions. Sure, non biased, my ass. Goku is by no means the best dad, but he is not this shallow description this video presents. He is a better dad than the internet thinks he is.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@Jjk58174 idk what makes you have such a low opinion of the average parent .

[@Jjk58174]

@Too-Much-Caffeine when you see entire neighborhoods where kids are abandoned by fathers, mother using kids as tax right offs, and parents throwing their kids to a screen instead of caring for them, you would understand that the respectable parent is less common than you think. Thankfully, my parents were around when they had time outside of constant work.

[@Spiderpro2024]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine Ima just say this, 1, he went to save his son from raditz, it wasn’t for the planet, it was specifically for his son 2, In the cell arc, yes while he did misunderstood his son, he quickly makes up for it by sacrificing himself. 3, he was never against and was proud of his son for becoming a scholar 4, All the threats that come to earth in Z is because of goku, the sayians considered it useless so they would never come, frieza wouldn’t show up for the same reason, and sure, without goku the red ribbon army would still be around, but even then the entire androids saga is entirely because of goku.

[@Spiderpro2024]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine I don’t think goku is an amazing dad but he is definitely better than someone like thanos, peter griffin, or doofinscrimiz’s parents

[@Spiderpro2024]

Also, Gohan himself doesn’t ever say he is a bad dad, in fact, he described him as an angel

[@WADE-2]

I bet bro dont even know what he is saying only 5% what he said was true

[@CyberMan__0]

In all these situations that you mentioned (Raditz Fight, Cell Games, Namek Journey), can you tell us what Goku should’ve done to be a better father?

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Sure! Raditz: no comments, actually, he did fine. My point there is more about how I don't really think goku keeping his son Alive, the most fundamental trait of what a parent is, gives him good dad points. Namek: literally any conversation or check in with his son about the terrible events that occurred. We never get any sort of conversation of goku actually talking through the horrible events that gohan goes through on namek. Wouldn't even need to be during namek, just at some point. Cell games: Oh gee, where to start? Tell gohan about the plan and not blind siding him, talking to him and understanding his mentality about fighting so he can get his SS2 power up without needing 16 to die or get tortured by cell. Staying alive post cell to actually be a parent and of course, NOT giving a sensu bean to cell.

[@CyberMan__0]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine Namek: Goku didn’t know Gohan went through any horrible events because he wasn’t there. All he knew was that Gohan’s neck was broken, and the first thing he does is heal him. Cell Games: Goku didn’t there know if there was a form past Super Saiyan, so they trained to master Super Saiyan. Goku knew about Gohan’s rage boosts (he witnessed one during the Raditz Fight), so giving Cell the senzu gives the opportunity for a rage boost by being tortured and watching 16 get killed. If Cell doesn’t get the senzu bean, Gohan doesn’t get tortured (no SSJ2), but he still loses, and then everyone’s screwed because nobody is strong enough to beat Cell. Post-Cell: Goku was correct in the fact the everything in Z happened because villains follow Goku. Raditz came because of Goku. If Raditz doesn’t come, Nappa and Vegeta don’t come for the Dragon Balls, they don’t go to Namek becuase nobody dies, the Androids aren’t created, and Majin Buu spawns like 10 years later than normal and kills everyone. So everything pre-Buu doesn’t happen if Goku doesn’t exist. So then, if everything previous happened because of Goku, the logical option would be no more Goku. Which is what he chose and gave the Earth (which his sons are on) *7 years* of peace. Gohan is no longer fighting, and Goten is training with Chi-Chi. His family is happy.

[@Fear999.]

@@Too-Much-Caffeinedid gohan not stand up to his mother in the hospital and TELL HER he was going to namek?

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@CyberMan__0 namek: His neck is snapped... That is enough for goku to know his kid has gone through something traumatic. While goku may not have been around for the events on namek, he could figure out by simply asking his son what happened. Basic parenting 101, you have to do check ups with your kid. Especially if they're on an alien planet being beat within an inch of their life. Cell: I think you're attributing far to much to events we can't know about. The reasoning goku gives is because he wants cell to have "a fair fight." Anything more than that reasoning and goku simply believing it won't matter either way, Is reading into it way more than is warranted. We also don't know for certain that everyone dies without it, that's a reach. Post cell: Goku was NOT correct, Frieza will EVENTUALLY come for earth, It might not be soon but eventually he's gonna make his way there. Gero, We literally have a timeline where goku dies of an unrelated disease and androids STILL show up and wreck everyone's shit. So goku being alive is not the factor here. Gero was part of an authoritarian regime hellbent on dominating the world, I don't think he would stop just because the one person he had beef with is dead. You're attributing correlation without causation, we don't KNOW if those years were peaceful because goku was dead. It could also be that there simply weren't any planet destroying threats looming around.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@Fear999. Gohan is probably riddled with guilt and the lives of his loved ones, some of which died for him, are in the balance. Not only that but a world without dragon balls fucking blows so there's the grander scale of the world to consider. This is a choice Gohan makes because of necessity, not because he'd actually go and fight something like frieza if he felt he had a choice. bearing in mind gohan has no idea something like frieza is even waiting for them, their scale of what was to come was vegeta on earth, someone who was literally MILLIONS of times less powerful than frieza at the time. Also he's fucking 5, I wouldn't leave my 5 year old unattended at the house, much less go into space. We don't let kids make choices for themselves for a reason.

[@Yakonsupremacy]

You’re gonna ignore realism like trauma but then bring it up anyway later on? Ite bud

[@remoanimatesyt7321]

And also to help with the video he was actually nine years old when he fought cell 6:45

[@gianvittoriomarti9393]

3:33 Yeah, cause that's literally being a Hero!

[@canary6314]

Who tf let bro cook? 💀

[@andrewwhyte7602]

Crazy work bro

[@ashu6305]

Everything u said is shifting the story to make goku seems like a bad dad (which hes not)

[@That1Dbzkid]

I don’t know what show you’re watching because in every version of the show Goku tells Raditz to give Gohan back. To add on Raditz had an ultimatum so answer me. If Goku had an ultimatum, and he could’ve waited longer to fight Raditz Why would he fight Raditz right there and then.

[@doofers5003]

Raditz was gonna take Gohan away not blow up the planet. If Goku did not kill 100 people by the time he returns he was going to take Gohan away, after they were done with their planet they were conquering they were going to Earth. As soon as Goku got up from the ground he was heading after Gohan then Piccolo joined him. Goku died for his son which is the main reason hes there because he keeps mentioning it

[@Yakonsupremacy]

Goku didnt send out gohan like a pokemon, and didnt have gohan fighting cell as his plan A. You clearly didnt pay attention to anything that happened, Goku wanted to beat cell himself, but couldnt, he states that he was going all out, which nothing suggests to be wrong, and he tries to kill cell multiple times, especially with the IT kamehameha. Gohan was literally the only way to save earth, and goku thought gohan wanted to become stronger and wanted to beat cell.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@Yakonsupremacy you're forgetting about the scene with Corin before the cell games. Goku has his power compared to cells, and corin says goku would probably lose. To which goku replies that he figured as much. Of course, he wants to beat cell himself. However, he is also aware that he's probably not strong enough to do that. Sending out gohan is something he is EXPECTING to have to do.

[@file_thirteen]

@@Too-Much-Caffeineso how is this goku being a bad dad

[@somebeing803]

Question: what sort of upbringing do you think Goku had? Why do you assume Goku would view parenting and situations like you would?

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

So we actually don't have to guess as in the original dragon ball, we learn about grandpa Gohan, the man Gohan is named after. His relationship with Goku is that of a teacher & student. It's part of why Goku loves fighting so much because it's all viewed from that lens of what his parent taught him. From other quips like "oh he told me to bow before a fight" or "grandpa told me not to hit girls" we can infer that Goku got some basic understanding of right and wrong and being polite As far as Goku viewings how I view them, it doesn't matter? Parenting isn't an art it's a science, humans have been researching parenting for a long time and there are objectively wrong ways to go about it. We can even see by the end of the cell games, Gohan wants to torture cell rather than just kill him because of all the shit he's been through. That's a red flag. Gohan is basically just a normal kid but with a tail and the ability to shoot lasers, so using the metric of what's good for human children is comparable, and there's a shit ton of research devoted to knowing what is and what isn't good for children. that's the metric I judge on and he doesn't meet the criteria.

[@somebeing803]

@Too much caffeine Grandpa Gohan taught Goku some things, but he didn't teach him a lot about concepts of family, and what it means to be a productive member of society. There's a lot of "basic understanding" Goku was not taught. Your second paragraph proves Goku wouldn't understand or view parenting like any normal person. You even say "humans have been researching it for a long time". Where Goku have learned any of this from. Most people would learn about parenting; from their own situation, from various sources of media, and from the people around them. Goku didn't experience any of that. Gohan did not teach Goku what a family is, Goku did not get exposed to media portraying family, Goku did not experience families being families in his adventures growing up. Heck Bulma's mom offered him alcohol when he was underage. By normal standards Goku is a bad dad, however why even expect Goku to behave or understand parenting like most people would? Of course he didn't understand Gohan, he lacked human experiences to nuture Gohan in a more human way. Just because Goku had a kid does not mean he all of sudden gained a bunch of knowledge about parenting and then just choose to ignore it. The Dragon World is not like ours, it is a post-apocalyptic techno barbaric world, the Dragon Team are essentially outcasts of the world, and Goku is even more of an outcasts, of course he wouldn't see the situations in a "normal" way, so of course his way of handling things would be vastly different than the "norm". Not because he ignores what's "normal", but because to him his life is "normal", he only knows what he experienced.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@somebeing803 yeah goku never had formal education very true, but i don't think that excuses him for not learning things to be a good parent. a child is something you opt into, if you choose to take care of a kid, it is your responsibility to learn how to parent. If you are not capable or don't know how to be a parent, don't have a kid. its really that simple. goku choose to have a kid therefore he is responsible to equip his child for the future. I don't really agree with your interpretation of DBZs world, they have a shit ton of technology and society seems to function pretty well (with the exception of the odd villain nuking everyone) so i refuse to believe there aren't resources goku could use to learn how to actually raise a child. dude is friends with the devs of capsule corp, I'M SURE he could have asked someone for help. i do concede that overall everyone in DBZ kinda blows as a parent but that doesn't make goku a good parental figure. I judge them on all the same metric.

[@somebeing803]

@Too much caffeine Goku didn't even understand what getting married meant. He also never was really exposed to the concept of parenting to understand that he needs to know more. Also what resources would he have access to, to learn. You obviously did not watch/ read Dragon Ball, yes there is some technology in the cities, but there are also a lot of small villages, there are people in the Dragon World that can literally gi their entire lives without knowing anything about what city life is like. What you see during the Cell and Buu Saga is recent development, and Hercule played a large role in that. Dragon Ball is not a human or heroes story, trying to judge the characters especially based on standards from our World, makes no sense. That's kind of part of the series, that's why it's pointed multiple times how unlike they are to most normal people. Their lives have impacted them in such a way that for them the abnormal is normal, and normal is abnormal. Why do you think Goku should just understand what stereotypical parenting is. The reason most people even understand is because of experience. What about Goku's upbringing would have shown him what being a father by our standards means? Also you said "Goku has a responsibility to equip his child for the future" you do realize Gohan does not have to live in society to have a future, Gohan could literally live out in the woods and be perfectly fine, Gohan does not have to get a job to survive. It is nice that he wants to be a scholar, but it is not a requirement for him to have a good life. Once again look at the world that is presented, the Dragon World is not our world. You can think that Goku is a bad parent, that's fine, but do not act like parenting, especially for someone like Goku who experienced life in a way that is vastly different from normal people, that he should just understand what being a parent means and understand how he should do better. That literally makes no sense.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@somebeing803 "Goku didn't even understand what getting married meant." yeah goku's a fucking moron who gets other people into shit because he doesn't bother to ask questions or learn about things. you are entirely correct. being stupid doesn't give you a pass lmao. yeah its a different world but that doesn't really change the morality of the actions. roshi being a like a psuedo rapist is still bad, goku being grossly negligent of his kid? still bad. bro cities existed even in og dragon ball? what? society existing has been a thing lol. wait any good parent would give their kids the ability to do whatever THEY choose to do. i recognize its not our world but goku basically forces gohan to become earths champion, something he never asked for. putting the literal weight of the world on your kid is not a good way to parent.

[@StickingBreak]

2:28 Why do you think most of the show is about 'waiting for Goku to show up'? Because EVERYONE relies on him to take care of everything! Whenever people are confronted with a tough foe, everyone always fail in their attempt to defeat said foe. But when Goku faces a similar situation, he finds a way. If it wasn't for this mindset, Goku is just as absent as everyone else is. 3:10 Raditz's last attack was about to Skewer Gohan's unconscious body. That is what led to Goku pulling off that Full Nelson technique on Raditz. Goku could've done this at any time, or even tried to grab Raditz's tail again, but he took no chances. Why do you think that is? 4:32 "He doesn't tell him over the course of the year before the Cell games." That's just straight up misinformation. On the first day, Goku literally tells Gohan that he wants him to train hard and become stronger than he is. And throughout the course of that year in training, Gohan gets mad at Goku for being too soft on him. Heck, Goku told Gohan that he was a stricter teacher than Piccolo. Then came the day when Gohan goes Super Saiyan. Before that was achieved, he literally yelled at Goku saying he was wrong, that he was being way too soft on him, unlike Piccolo. Gohan WANTED Goku to push him to that level. It was only for that reason that Goku intensified the training hard enough to get Gohan Super Saiyan. We even get a flashback scene where Goku was telling Gohan that they should call it a day and get some rest from training, but Gohan STILL wanted to keep going. That was an important plot point because that was also the moment when Goku saw a glimpse of Gohan's hidden power, the power that could defeat Cell. 5:02 In contrast, that actually makes this entire scene with Piccolo wrong in a way. It may seem like Gohan feels this way during this fight, but Gohan DOESN'T want to feel this way. If Goku kept being the one to solve everyone's problems, no one could learn to be like him. Gohan wanted to be like him, so Goku pushed him to learn how like he wanted. 6:40 "Friendly reminder, he's 4." Which also means Goku spent 4 years living with and taking care of Gohan during those 4 years. Had things remained peaceful, he would've continued that lifestyle like a normal father would. But because of what happened on that day, he could no longer be a normal father. Goku had to make a lot of sacrifices to ensure that not only was his son safe, but that also the fate of the entire world was saved as well. Considering how many people have died over the course of all of Dragon Ball Z, in his entire childhood, Gohan never actually died. That part says a lot for how well Goku managed to handle the situation of both his son, and the fate of the world. 6:47 Gohan outright saying he wanted to get stronger is a perfect explanation for why Goku didn't know this. Maybe it was true, but again, Gohan didn't want to be like that. 7:52 You forget that for this scene, the initial reason why they couldn't bring Goku back was because Shenron's power couldn't do that. They'd need Parunga's power in order to bring Goku back. This would lead everyone having to jump through a whole lot of hoops in order to bring Goku back. Finding new Namak, traveling a long journey through space to get there, convincing the Namaks to use their Dragon Balls for that wish, all that. Either way, his decision on whether to come back or not isn't really all that relevant regardless of if it makes sense or not. The concept of bringing people back to life is not something that should be considered in the first place when it comes to parenting. Basically, this world has a VERY different concept for what makes a good parent than the real world does. A good parent in this world cannot be applied in the same context as ours does.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

I've already touched on a lot of these points in one way or another so I want to just address the unique things you said GOHAN'S RELATIONSHIP WITH FIGHTING: I think you're conflating gohan's feelings of uselessness with gohan liking fighting. The way I've always seen his relationship with fighting is that it's like a game his friends and family are all really into that he'll play to spend time with them. (also because sometimes the world hinges on them winning.) Remember after the cell saga, gohan STOPS training, the only times he fights is to train his brother and future wife, to spend time with his friends, and to save innocent people as the great sayaman. When he's talking about wanting to be pushed harder and wanting to train more, it isn't because he likes fighting, it's because he likes being alive and he wants his dad to be proud of him. If I told you that androids were gonna come kill you in 3 years, you'd probably be training a lot too! Gohan doesn't like fighting, but he will if he has to. GOKU'S PLAN: I'm not spreading misinformation, Goku never told Gohan that his plan was for Gohan to go fight cell. That is a last minute thing he drops on gohan. Gohan's look says it all, the kid is fuckin shocked. He had no idea that goku was gonna hail mary this. This is really stupid for two fold, 1) because gohan doesn't like fighting, he doesn't actually reach his inner power. It takes android 16 dying for gohan to reach SS2, a variable Goku could not have planned for because he met 16 that day. 2) if goku HAD told gohan about his plan, Gohan could have been able to talk to his father about his feelings about fighting and maybe 16 wouldn't have to die to beat cell. PICCOLO RANT: No piccolo is 1000% correct and the show never contradicts him on it. The point he's making is that even if goku is right that gohan has a hidden power beneath him. that's meaningless because he's 11 and doesn't like fighting. Goku's face says it all, he realizes he's fucked up. This is objectively bad parenting because he's gambling everyones lives on a hunch he has about Gohan and never bothers to talk about it with him. If not for 16 aka if not for goku getting lucky, everyone dies. DIFFERENT STANDARDS: I actually don't disagree with your last statement. If you wanna say that Goku is a good dad CONSIDERING the fact that he's an alien who is basically genetically built to like fighting and has never had a formal education in his life, i would agree. But I made this video because I see a lot of people making the arguement that he's a good dad, full stop. Under the same standards that we would judge steve down the street. I think THAT is goofy.

[@StickingBreak]

Point 1: I never said Gohan likes fighting. My whole point on Gohan was that he wants to learn how to fight. Liking something and wanting to learn something are 2 different things. The reason he wants to fight is, like you mentioned, because the world is at stake, and he doesn't wanna sit back and do nothing, watching all his friends die right in front of him. How the heck did you come to the conclusion that it's a game to him? It never was. It was something he was literally forced into, not by Goku, but by Piccolo. Point 2: I repeat: "On the first day, Goku literally tells Gohan that he wants him to train hard and become stronger than he is." The only total shock to Gohan is Goku telling him that he's actually achieved said power. Goku used his fight with Cell to show that. And that's NOT implying Goku lost that fight on purpose. He emphasized that he really was giving it his all in that fight with Cell. Gohan thought that whole time he wasn't using his full strength because, like Goku mentions, Gohan thought that his own strength was Goku's potential. It was surprising information, but that's what encouraged Gohan to agree. Point 3: As I mentioned before, Gohan DOES feel this way. The problem is, Gohan DOESN't want to feel this way. The part that Piccolo's wrong about is when he's saying he's wondering why Goku's watching him die. He may be right about Gohan not being a fighter, but Gohan doesn't want to be like that. He wants to be what Goku is saying that he is. And not because it's a game, but because he knows how much will be lost if he doesn't. It may have been a gamble. But without that gamble, everyone would've died anyway as Goku already proved he could not defeat Cell. Every decision Goku makes is a balance between keeping his son alive, keeping the world alive, and giving Gohan what he wants. Seeing his own father not having faith in him would've been the last thing he wanted. Point 4: If you wanna take the context of whether Goku is a good father based just on real life perspective, then that debate would literally end RIGHT AFTER the Raditz fight. Goku spent the four years of Gohan's life being with him and raising him like a normal son. His older brother Raditz came and kidnapped Gohan, threatening his life. Goku died saving Gohan's life. The end. No Dragon Balls, no being brought back to life, none of that. I mean heck, the Dragon Balls were literally the only reason why Nappa and Vegeta came to Earth in the first place, because Piccolo mentioned it to them, unintentionally of course. But if we wanna get real technical, reality wouldn't even have Goku existing in the first place, let alone traveling from space to Earth as a baby, and surviving...

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

​@@StickingBreak POINT 1: you're taking the analogy too literally. let me give a full example of what I mean. I hate MTG, I will play MTG with my friends because they like that game and want to spend time with them. Gohan's relationship to fighting is akin to my relationship with MTG. His friends and family all do it, so he learns how to do it even though he hates it. my criticism of Goku is that a father that is paying the slightest bit of attention, will be able to recognize the difference. I think it's inexcusable when the added context of "everyone dies if they lose" is added. Gohan doesn't really have a choice, he HAS to train or they all die. that's not a real choice to want to learn fighting, that's a gun to gohan's head. Goku spent a whole year alone with just gohan and yet he can't figure that out. Piccolo can just from basic context. That's pretty bad parenting if you ask me. Aggressively negligent. POINT 2: I show his face in the video around the 4:30 mark. that's how he reacts to goku telling him he's gonna fight. Gohan is shocked when Goku tells him he's going to be fighting. He is surprised to learn that Goku wasn't holding back, but he was ALSO surprised that Goku is calling him up to fight. Remember there's that scene before the cell games where they visit karin and he tells goku he's going to lose against cell and gohan freaks out asking him wtf they're gonna do. Gohan had NO IDEA he was going to be called up to fight. POINT 3: Gohan wants to be strong enough to beat cell for sure. Piccolo is still right tho, what he's saying is "hey Gohan might have SS2 power dormant within him. But he's not a fighter so he won't reach that power this way." The whole point of that conversation is that even though goku is right to think gohan is strong enough to beat cell, he still dropped the ball because he doesn't understand is own son enough to realize how Gohan will tap into his power. That's the big problem with goku, he gambled the entire planet on a hunch, was wrong, and then got with 16, lucky. Goku damn near blew up the planet due to his own lack of understanding of gohan POINT 4: Nah, I'm saying analyzing the show from a realistic perspective as in judging it as if the people and stakes were real. I think if you judge goku by the standards of "well he's a good dad considering he's an alien hermit who lives in the woods without a day of formal education in his life." then yeah I completely agree with that. If you judge him by "well he's a good dad by the standards of a real life human parent within the context of the shows world." then no I don't agree.

[@StickingBreak]

Alright, it's time to nip this in the bud. Your entire argument stems from thinking all this fighting is just a game to Gohan, and that Goku is terrible because he couldn't figure out that Gohan didn't like fighting. Let's take a moment and look back on why that is. Let's look at every single encounter they've had since the beginning and all the way up to the Cell Games. It all begins with Raditz kidnapping Gohan. Goku goes after him to save Gohan. When Gohan breaks out of his prison, the first thing Goku tells Gohan is to run away. What does Gohan do? He doesn't run away. He attacks Raditz, damaging him severely. This power surprises Goku, yet he's still telling Gohan to run. Gohan doesn't listen, gets slapped by Raditz, resulting in Goku having to sacrifice himself. (Fun fact, while it didn't exist yet, it was revealed during the Cell Saga that this wasn't even the first time Goku has seen this hidden power of Gohan) Their next encounter goes all the way to Nappa. After saving Gohan again, Goku tells both him and Krillin to stay back from this fight despite their protests. Goku fights Nappa alone and defeats him alone. Due to the complications that happened with Nappa, Goku tells both Gohan and Krillin to go home while he deals with Vegeta. They don't do this. They WERE absent for most of the fight, but both Gohan and Krillin come back to help Goku, despite his orders. Now, during the fight with Vegeta, this is the first time Goku has done the opposite and told Gohan to fight. And yes, Gohan did protest that he couldn't, but he had no choice. Goku was literally unable to move. He's seen Vegeta's power. If he told Gohan to run, there'd be nowhere he could run to. Vegeta would just blow up the planet. Even though it was cruel to ask Gohan to do this, it was also the only way to save his life. Letting him die would've been crueler. If this was where it ended, you'd have a pretty good case as to Goku being too brainless to know that Gohan didn't like fighting. But then comes the scene at the hospital where everyone's talking about going to Namek. Chi chi is yelling his ears off, telling him, "You're a child! Start acting like it! You're not going to Namek!" But Gohan explodes at her, telling her he IS going to Namek. Everyone was in earshot of this, including Goku. Despite his fight with Vegeta, Gohan still wanted to help his friends and fight. You still think this is just a game to Gohan? Let's take a look at a scene in which Goku wasn't present for, but KNOWS that it happened because he learns it from Krillin later on. The whole Namek slaughtering scene. You only wrote this scene off as being torture for Gohan's mind and saying that it wasn't good for him. Do you remember how that moment ends? It ends with Gohan straight up charging in there to attack Dodoria in order to save a complete stranger's life, that being Dende. Krillin was even telling him the whole time to stay calm and not do anything, but he did. And it had nothing to do with his life, or the life of his friends. Cut to the Ginyu Force where Goku saw Gohan's neck snapped. You're saying Goku saw this and thinks Gohan loves this. That is just baseless assumptions and a lie. After all, it was shortly after that when Goku read Krillin's mind and saw everything that they went through on Namek, including the parts where Gohan refused to back down against his battle with Recoome, despite the odds against him. If Goku were to see that Gohan didn't like fighting, he would've seen it here, HAD Gohan shown that side of him. But he never did. Instead, Gohan just keeps showing that fighting spirit side to Goku more and more, even when Goku wasn't around. This continues even when he had to fight Ginyu while he had Goku's body. This is shown even more during the fight with Frieza. Goku is out of the fight and resting in a healing chamber, but he can sense the entire fight playing out. Gohan, Krillin, Vegeta, and even an unknown power that showed up, (Piccolo) he felt all their struggles fighting Frieza. Yet despite this, just like a lot of battles, Nappa, Vegeta, Recoome, Jeice and Burter together, and even Captin Ginyu, he always tells everyone, including Gohan to stay back and let him handle the fight, even with how one sided the fight is. He never once asks them to come in to help him with his fight with Frieza. This becomes even more apparent during the segment when he turns Super Saiyan. With Frieza killing Krillin and injuring Piccolo, Goku tells Gohan to grab Piccolo and get out of here. Gohan hesitates, but Goku yells at him to do as he's told. And yet, this STILL doesn't stop Gohan from coming back and returning later, where Gohan fights Frieza BY HIMSELF to stall him. Goku sees this, and he isn't happy to see Gohan here. So he tells Gohan once more to do what he was told. All these segments are screaming at Goku that Gohan wants to fight, wants to help, wants to have the strength to be able to help his father and friends. So many times people have been telling Gohan to run away, to not fight, and Gohan never listened. Even when he did listen, he didn't listen.

[@StickingBreak]

(Part 2) Gohan still shows this side during the 3 year training for the Androids. Of course, we don't see much of what happened during this montage, so we can only assume that most of it relates the few scenes we do see. And in one of those scenes, we see a constant trend that we see in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber. After getting knocked down a cliff by Goku and Piccolo, and collapsing in heavy snow, Goku and Piccolo say it's time to call it a day. But Gohan refuses. He wants to keep going. He says this exact line. "I want to be as strong as you two!" (And then Goku and Piccolo learn how to drive cars.) Cut to when the Androids appear, Gohan actually didn't have any action for the longest time, except for one when Piccolo asked Gohan through telepathy for help when Android 20 had him held from behind. But there is one more significant moment that happened between Gohan and Goku before the Hyperbolic Time Chamber moment. Enter the battle between Piccolo vs Android 17, and then later Cell. During both of these fights, Goku and Gohan were feeling out the intensity of his struggles. Gohan was constantly telling Goku that they had to go down there and help him. But Goku refused repeatedly, saying that they have to finish their training, that if they go down there, they will die. The situation escalates further and further to the point Gohan decides that he has had enough. He gets up and tries to go down there by force if he has to. This is when THE MOST INFAMOUS Screenshot that EVERYONE constantly uses when referencing Goku as a bad father comes in. Goku literally PUNCHES Gohan in the face, to stop him from flying TO HIS DEATH. Could this have been handled a different way? No. Goku has BEEN trying the different way the whole time. Not only was this the only thing that could stop Gohan from flying off, but as Mr Popo explains to Gohan, it shows that this is just as hard on Goku as it is for him. Of course, eventually Goku does cave and goes down there to save Piccolo. This was a HUGE gamble since if it had failed, it could've been the end for the entire planet. Even though he has Instant Transmission, it doesn't guarantee that he could use it fast enough to get him there, grab Piccolo, and get out of there before Cell can stop him. But know what's important? He didn't allow Gohan to be put in danger during any of this. Yet he saw what Gohan wanted. He's been seeing that same side to Gohan for the past 4 to 5 year. It still burns so strongly even BEFORE they went into the Hyperbolic Time Chamber. How did Goku not know Gohan didn't like fighting? Gohan's been telling him the exact opposite for all these years, with the ONLY opposite moment being the fight against Vegeta. And you still think this is all a game to Gohan? Your MTG example has NO similarities with Gohan's situation. The fate of your friends' lives don't depend on you playing MTG with them. Gohan didn't even know Dende when he rushed to save him, or any importance that saving him actually had. Everything that Goku saw in Gohan was him constantly wanting to fight, wanting to help, wanting to get stronger, even when others told him not to. As a result, Goku decided to finally put an end to this dilemma that Gohan's had for all these years with the training in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber. What kind of father would Goku have been to say that after all that training, he would just tell Gohan, "No Gohan. You can't fight. You clearly don't like fighting, so you can't." As I've said before, even if Gohan feels this way, it's NOT how he wants to feel. Hearing words like that coming out of Goku would've been the worst thing he would've ever heard. It would've made him HATE Goku. Goku knew this. He didn't know the part of Gohan not liking fighting, but he definitely knew how Gohan would feel if he told him he couldn't fight. There is one more important thing that Goku knows about Gohan. And it's the core reason why he doesn't tell Gohan that he's gonna fight Cell. And that is Gohan's confidence in his strength. You believe that if Goku had told Gohan beforehand that he was gonna fight Cell, Gohan would've told him how he felt about fighting. After every example I've listed, that's 100% a lie. He wouldn't have told Goku that he didn't like fighting. Instead, he would be saying he doesn't think he's strong enough to beat Cell, that Goku was still stronger than him. This is why Goku had to prove that part wrong. He needed to give Gohan the confidence that he was indeed stronger than Goku. And most importantly, give Gohan what he's been wanting, asking for for the longest time. But no. Clearly all of that was just a game to Gohan according to you. Going to Namek to save Piccolo was just a game to Gohan. Saving a complete stranger from another planet was just a game to Gohan. Disobeying his father multiple times was just a game to Gohan. Trying to fly straight to his death was just a game to Gohan. It was all just one big fat game that he was playing. Goku should've known that Gohan was just playing this game for 5 years straight. Nothing's going to convince you otherwise. And you're not convincing us. But here's a question you should probably ask. Is Chi Chi a bad mother? Where was she during everything? Wbere was she when Gohan was fighting the Saiyans? Why didn't she go with Gohan to Namek? How come she didn't join Gohan to watch the Cell Games in person? I wonder if anyone else has ever asked those questions when they thought about Goku's situation.

[@theblacknexusyt]

Yall really coming at a video from 2 years ago and attacking someone with a smaller fam base than Sage. How toxic can yall be, fr?

[@theblacknexusyt]

After actually watching this video, I can agree that Goku is not the best father. You can actually compare him to someone like Big Daddy from Kick Ass. Just a bit. To make a comparison, Mindy isn't like Gohan being that she looks up to her father and wants to fight, unlike Gohan, who doesn't want to fight. But Damon forced the idea of vengeance and justice onto her. Training her to be a dangerous vigilante ever since he got out of jail, and she was like 6. He shot her in the chest with a revolver or sum, I dont really remember, for 11th birthday. And gave her a butterfly knife. But Damon wanted to protect her and help her fight against dangerous men like Frank D'Amico. But no one thinks he is a good father tho, right? So how can we day Goku is one?

[@Phoenix_Blader_93]

​@theblacknexusyt you can argue that hes not the best dad, but saying he's a bad fatther and showing you dont understand the story is dumb. Once again dont FW dragon ball fans they dont even watch their favorite show

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Thanks bro

[@nazjhirbrandon9441]

he made a video calling most db fans dumb, then proceeds to poop on the mc, with misinformation and mistranslations, head cannon and his own interpertation, acts as if he can just choose whats cannon and whats not, quite litterly poops on japanese even though its a japanese manga, is a ahole in the comments, and he himself said he only watched the fun dub and wont watch anything else even though almost everything else is more cannon, you cant just act as if you know more than the actual fans of the series with no actual info and call them retarded and act like people are gonna be nice

[@IDK-dude1]

I really like how you edited this video but information about goku being a bad dad is bad

[@saudbintalib5701]

THIS IS BULLSHIT!!!!!!!!Goku is at the very least an alright father.

[@animeboy2006]

No he a bad father he marry chichi for food nothing else and he out training over family

[@trevorphillips8415]

@@animeboy2006 Big brain moment:

[@clau91o97]

​@@trevorphillips8415 bro doesn't even have a brain 😂

[@IDK-dude1]

@@animeboy2006you didn’t watch dragon ball at all💀

[@Koodllez]

@@animeboy2006 bro he married her cause he promised to watch db

[@Darekiller1025]

This is honestly the worse "goku is a bad dad" video ever. Soley because of the fact that 95% of the video is just flat out lies. You my friend are the one who didnt watch dragon ball.

[@Kimihro]

Comments are good for the algorithm

[@painvillegaming4119]

Not if you're getting over 50% dislikes

[@Bankai23456]

Space Hitler 😭😭that explains why frieza is racist

[@Alt-Alt]

I think it’s fair to have an opinion. But morally speaking, if you want to compare the dragon ball world to ours in parenting. Then dying for your son is already at the top. We don’t have dragon balls here, we can’t just revive. Respectfully, delete this video.

[@power6487]

Bro people think piccolo is a good father Bruh when piccolo trained gohan he didn't even train him in the first he was tossing him to the natural life so gohan will get used to it Piccolo was harsh on gohan most of the times before becoming his friend When goku trained gohan he was rather supportive he is not the best dad he believed in his son which actually no one did. Bro saved gohan 4 times.

[@power6487]

When Raditz took gohan Goku immediately rushed out picked up his arch nemesis at that time and goes to save his son and the earth if goku does not really wanna save his son just the earth then he would fight raditz immediately.

[@jairusjackson7799]

At least Piccolo understood who Gohan was as person after all the time they spent together, after a whole year between Gohan and Goku, Goku never actually figured out his son doesn't enjoy fighting. And still barely seems to understand who he is as a person let alone care, in Super manga he said he doesn't even know when his kids where born!

[@power6487]

​@@jairusjackson7799first thing he knew that second most of the time gohan wanted to joined with the other guys before sayian saga gohan had the choice to go back to his mother or continue training to fight the sayians h chose number 2 In namek arc he also wanted to go with bulma and krillin dispute chichi wanting him yo stay and study gohan refused. In cell saga the only reason goku wanted gohan to train is because he saw the potential in him he saw the opportunitie of gohan becoming the new protect of earth who is much stronger then him and guess what he was right. Goku when he beating the heart virus and after training he stayed with his family and even says gohan I think its batter to study rather then fighting chi chi even had to check him if he is sick again. And guess what in cell saga gohan did the mistake by not killing cell earlier and now cell is about to blow up the earth but goku comes in teleports him to the king Kai's world and basically sacrificed himself for his son. Goku knew gohan needs to study he did not force him ever and he wasn't like vegeta who tells gohan how disappointed he is to him because he did not train in buu saga. When goten asked his brother a question what his father like Gohan responded by his like an angel goten and yes he said those same exact words.

[@power6487]

​@@jairusjackson7799I get you that in super they made him look like a shitty father while he actually is not

[@power6487]

​@@jairusjackson7799What goku did to gohand and the others is for their sake and for the sake of earth he wanted them to be better but also be strong enough to protect the earth whenever he is not there

[@tudoraragornofgreyscot8482]

Goku is a bad not not because he’s abusive or even necessarily a bad person, but his negligence.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Exactly

[@tudoraragornofgreyscot8482]

*Goku is a bad dad, not

[@dmarcobing4938]

@@emmanuelcharles9050 when he beat the shit out of him in the hyperbolic time chamber(physically), forcing to fight cell after giving him a senzu bean(mental)

[@TubZ_24]

If u watch the hyperbolic time chamber scene gohan asked for goku to beat the shut out of him

[@sabaibaikari7023]

@@dmarcobing4938 ?

[@Spiderpro2024]

Bro rewatch the series there are so many moments with Vegeta that makes him an even worse father

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

I completely agree, dude doesn't hug his kid. he's totally a worse father than Goku.

[@Spiderpro2024]

Ok I’m just happy that you aren’t one of the people that dies on the hill that says Vegeta is a better father than

[@EudaemonYoutube]

My biggest gripe with the Namek argument though is that there was only ONE person more capable than Gohan who could safely get the Dragon Balls from a planet filled with PICCOLOS. Roshi and Yajirobe probably couldn't even defeat one Demon King Piccolo little alone a species worth. Plus they didn't even know if Namek did exist until they got the coordinates off of Piccolo's ship, which we only know due to Kuririn paying attention to the words of Vegeta and Nappa. And Goku doesn't willingly say "Hm, maybe I want to get my son killed". He doesn't know that anybody related to Vegeta would be there little alone Vegeta, though Vegeta showing up could be deduced - of which if Vegeta got the Dragon Balls and killed everyone that went to Namek then yeah, that would be fair to Goku having a contributing factor to being a bad Dad for endangering his son. Though I will say, again, the ONLY person more powerful and reliable than Goku was the person who came up with the plan who not only saved everyone's lives, resolved Vegeta, everyone relative to Vegeta (Freeza) and unlocked Super Sayain (needed for the Androids, Buu, and pretty much every plot point going on in the series, like Beerus, Zamasu or Moro), was Kuririn. Goku isn't reckless for making his son a SPACEMAN by the SMARTEST WOMAN ON THE EARTH by his CURRENT BEST FRIEND AND STRONGEST PERSON ON THE EARTH. Cell I think you can't squeeze him out being a bad Dad more than the writer's officially acknowledge it in said arc and anything after Cell I don't think is relative since he's good to Goten who clearly doesn't need nor care his presence, Chi-Chi is clearly capable and willing to raise them alone if Goku keeps them safe from monsters (Like Zamas who took his body and, I dunno, killed his family) and Gohan post Cell I'd argue is on him for his mistakes. Yes he could have used more mentoring but I think it's weird Gohan or anyone else never thought to learn instant transmission and teleport to King Kai's world knowing that Goku kept his body and could teleport to earth. It is a hard technique to master, which is a fair argument but Cell and Vegeta could learn it so eh...? Sorry for the nerdy mega ramble lmao but Goku is not a bad Dad for me since he puts trust in people like Kuririn who without in the story we'd be screwed - who is kept safe by consequence of Goku and arguably Kami and Yamcha so that Namek can happen.

[@EudaemonYoutube]

The only argument that can be made for Gohan being poorly parented on Namek by Goku is that they couldn't have reasonably predicted that Vegeta would go to Namek - of which they couldn't have predicted he'd heal so quickly, not die on the way home, would 100% know how to get the Dragon Balls, and he probably would have killed all the Namekians and his wish wouldn't have been granted. You couldn't reasonably have predicted that that insane of a recovery would have happened, or at least to the point where Vegeta would beat them to it. They did everything they could, and regardless I don't think being a 'good parent' is the top priority when your opponents are Vegeta, Freeza and Cell. What, you're saying that your son, stronger-than-you-could-kill-a-being-with-the-DNA-of-emporers-kings-aliens-yourself-and-made-by-a-genius-scientist-that-you-couldn't's education and safety is more important that someone who could destroy the entire solar system in one shot. The issue was Goku's lack of communication and inconsiderate behavior for letting his son be in the plan, not Gohan fighting - little alone Gohan would probably be powerful enough to try and help regardless of what Goku did, without beating up Gohan into submission and staying on the sidelines. Gohan would probably have just got involved anyway. I hope you are well and I'm sorry for all the hate that has been sent your way, but I just wanted to give my piece.

[@TrueReverse74]

I know this is a year old but this is still completely overblown. You disregard upbringing, biology and only look at it through the human lens amd not as full-blooded saiyan, and I know the response is that doesn't excuse but you don't give him any credit for being as good as he is DESPITE having all those setbacks, like being raised with no social customs in mind and as a pure martial artist saiyan whose very dna and biology requires them to fight. You actively disregard the time goku spends with gohan the first 4 years of his life and ignore that what goku said was true. Raditz came to earth because of Goku, thus brought Vegeta and nappa, Because they killed people and the good guys didn't want to wait they went to namek, now Goku has to clutch up and save them again and frieza now CAME BACK TO EARTH because of goku. The androids were created because of Goku and babidi came because of the high battle powers there. Was goku naive in thinking that everything bad would stop because of his death? Yeah, but when damn near all of what happened in the story is because of him why wouldn't he think that? Because he left, 7 whole years of peace was brought to the world. He let his thirst for a strong fight be contained in otherworld and not let it cause destruction for others and left a stronger successor in his absence. The senzu bean with cell was bad but when he realized his mistake, he made an effort to put a stop to the madness. Hell how can you even be that mad at him when he TRIED to beat cell, that's why he fought first, to see if he could, but cell was too much, there was nothing he could do, so he put his faith in the one person, who was already stronger than himself and can go EVEN FURTHER. It was do this, or we all die. I could go on, but I don't want. No hate or anything, but this is so blown out of proportion it's ridiculous.

[@coldeed]

He does this after cell saga where arguably, Gohan would be the "new" lure to the bad guys. At the same time Goten was just flat out a neglected bastard. Goku tried to be a good dad to Gohan, I can give him credit for the effort of making the best out of circumstances he can't control and him not being perfect, but dude just isn't Goten's dad besides being his biological father.

[@Yakonsupremacy]

Holy shit you are so wrong on the raditz part. Raditz wanted to recruit goku, he then was rejected and decifed to take his son instead knowing he too is a saiyan. He gave goku a chance to proof himself by killing a bunch of people, but instead goku tracked down raditz with piccolo to save Gohan, thats the entire point of that fight, it was to save Gohan. Did you just not watch dragonball? Did you lie in the intro, its literally the core threat of the first mini arc in the series, how can one be so disingenuous

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

what do you think happens when raditz is done with that job and there is a planet like earth, that is valuable enough to send a sayian child to it, completely defenseless? As long as there are finite planets in the galaxy, the earth is on the chopping block for the sayians and the frieza force. Yeah obviously gohan's immediate danger is the focus but raditz still represents a planetary threat as far as i'm concerned.

[@Baconwantstoplay]

I don’t agree with this video but he’s still a better father than Peter griffin

[@Misscouchpotato-]

Is this the Dbz version of the horrible Godzilla take video? I understand this vid is two years old but... if you don't agree with this video anymore then just unlist/private it. 😅

[@apenasgiorno]

Bro watched Dragon Ball in YTB Shorts

[@lol0ajo]

on dbs manga. goku said he don't even know his 2 sons were born. vegeta said you may not be a bad person but you're a horrible father.

[@deadline6149]

that s why dbs is garbage, way to destroy characters

[@smananderson09]

That's why super is complete garbage in z it's literally show when Gohan was born goku was right there

[@thelettucebarrel7784]

It didn’t say that. Just for Goten and that was true.

[@painvillegaming4119]

He didn't...probably another Translation from viz where they took liberty

[@Koodllez]

dead ass mistranslation he didn't know goten was born dumbass

[@bbqtime5735]

he's out of line, but he's right

[@exaltedfalcheon1793]

Not really

[@painvillegaming4119]

No not even close

[@Koodllez]

nuh uh

[@moosesues8887]

I don’t want goku to be my dad

[@lolaelin_]

Bad dad confirmed

[@Kaidaone12]

I ain’t even gonna lie I agree with goku being a bad father after putting some thought but some points are still wrong like for example, the raditz sacrifice was more for Gohan than the earth because while yes he wanted to kill everyone on earth, the reason why goku caught him in a full Nelson was because right before this, gohan got a rage boost and damaged which led to raditz basically saying “yeah that kid has potential, too bad he’ll be dead before he unlocks it” implying he is quite literally finna off gohan in front of goku and goku was like “don’t he just a kid” so I think that sacrifice was more for gohan than the earth

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Provided the fight were somehow able to end in the same way without gohan. I think goku would make the same choice, even if gohan were to be removed entirely from the scenario, because Raditz is a threat to every human on the earth. Of course goku is emotionally invested in saving his son but that's not really the point. It's the factors involved. I think saying "goku died for gohan." Is less accurate statment than "Goku died for the earth." This is the same man who let his kids die so he could grab the dragon balls in the buu saga. The 6 billion people on the planet are always in the back of his mind.

[@IDK-dude1]

@@Too-Much-Caffeinehe could not make it to the kids in time

[@IDK-dude1]

@@Too-Much-Caffeinealso if it wasn’t for gohan hitting raditz goku would not be able to a full Nelson.

[@Kaidaone12]

@@Too-Much-Caffeinetrue true but the biggest reason he was there was cuz he kidnapped Raditz so I feel like it is more accurate to say he died for Gohan than the “earth”

[@24trn27]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine he couldn’t grab them in time for one and two… the people he saved is literally the reason why his children are still actively alive today… had he not saved Dende AND Mr Satan. They would have lost. MAYBE Gohan would have won against Buu but that was a gamble

[@KendegohLucavi]

I actually don't think there's a good saiyan dad in the dbz canon

[@GetDownKp]

Fax

[@IDK-dude1]

Goku

[@Koodllez]

except goku and vegeta not super bardock he is a mid dad

[@rfar21]

Sorry, but the first mistake you made trying to cook here, was using the dub as your main source. I know you mentioned that "for the Funi dub this is my take", but still, it's very disingenuous to go and try and make an "argument" on this topic and make it as an objective truth that Goku is a bad father. He either is it or not. Couldn't picked a worst starting point using the stuff Toriyama NEVER wrote, like wtf? And to even claim that "because you disagree here, means that you didn't read well or understood the story", that makes you look even worse my guy. Awful take, awful "arguments".

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

The funi dub is the version that most fans are going to be aware of. it was integral in DBZs explosion here in the west. I don't care about what is straight from Tomiyama's mouth because that would require reading the original manga in the original Japanese, a language most of us as westerners don't speak. I don't want to use scans or a sub for the same reason, because then you'd have you argue about what translation is the most accurate to the original Japanese, same problem. The funi dub is well known, it's the version we're all going to be broadly familiar with, it's the version a lot of casual fans are only going to be familiar with. I don't think saying "hey for the most well known and popular version of DBZ here in the west (well north america at least lol), I think this about the character" is a disingenuous statement at all. as far as understanding the story, that's fair. I don't think I should have said/ come off like that. I made this video while mad about a really dumb take I saw, and made that take representative of everyone who disagrees with me. In hindsight I don't think that's a good thing to do so fair enough.

[@ednafitzgerald3792]

You made some excellent points here! I like the way you emphasized how being a good parent is about more than looking out for your kid's physical needs or giving them hugs and kisses. A child is not a pet - parenting is a lot more complicated than being a pet owner. It sickens me that so few people seem to grasp this simple concept. Also, your stance on him dying for his son is one I agree with. As a parent myself I have to say if you would NOT lay down your life for your kid, you shouldn't even BE a parent. I find it ridiculous how much hate you got on this video. While I'm not what you would call a Dragon Ball fan(atic), I'm at least an appreciator of some of the DBZ content since it aired around the time I was in middle school. As such I can't fact-check your analysis, but based on the examples you gave I'm compelled to agree with your conclusions. I mean just because the guy is a hero and an all-around good guy doesn't mean he scores an "A" on every subject. Plenty of great men were lousy fathers. Even if Goku is just an "OK dad" that doesn't make him any less of a hero. Like you said, I think it humanizes him to show that he's NOT able to perfectly balance every aspect of his life. Most people's defensiveness on this topic probably stems from the alarming number of absentee fathers - a sad subject which the internet has turned into a meme but I (personally) find heartbreaking; not funny. As a result most people don't even know what a *decent* father looks like, much less a GREAT father. They have no standard to hold Goku up to, so how can they say one way or the other? The bar is set pretty low when you have no idea what the reasonable expectations are. (tbh parental estrangement is a major issue in this digital age - no wonder everybody's mental state is a mess.) Anyway! For what my little old opinion is worth, I LIKED this video (both figuratively AND literally)! I appreciate the effort you put into making it, and I offer my sympathy for all the childish hate comments you've received as a result of sharing your point of view. Thanks for offering a conflicting perspective! It keeps things from getting stale. XD

[@IDK-dude1]

I disagree I think goku is a ok dad

[@24trn27]

Two dumbasses agreeing with each other😂😂😂😂

[@cosmik411]

My biggest issue that makes absolutely no sense is how you're gonna say Goku's "pep talk" was all Gohan's imagination to downplay the fact Goku did anything to TRY and help Gohan at all. Then, in the next scene, use the fact that he CAN TELEPATHICALLY COMMUNICATE WITH KING KAI to show he's a bad dad for choosing to stay dead??? Your bias is 110% on full dislpay for your nitpicking. I'm sorry, but this is terrible...

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

See the pinned comment, that's not what I think.

[@ChiefShibaInu]

​@@Too-Much-Caffeine it is what you think

[@overaxel9498]

About ur point on how goku didn’t sacrifice himself to save gohan but to save the earth is technically true I think you’re being to literal here the reason he chose to fight raditz was to save gohan and him sacrificing himself was to ensure the safety of everyone including his son Edit: and btw this video was amazing u provided some really good points and changed some of my views too

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

I mean fair enough, he is fighting to save his kid but I just think people place too much emphasis on it ya know? Appreciate your comment.

[@imtheonehero9305]

this video is ridiculous. Dude took everything too literal.

[@ezragonzalez7075]

Most of the show is waiting for goku? Ok frieza saga yeah but that’s when he first went super sayian, cell saga no, Buu saga kind of, vs beerus yeah, vs frieza again is ehhhh cause vegeta could’ve gotten the kill, goku black was trunks, and top wasn’t just goku it was also frieza. Idk why people say everyone waits for goku when it was really only 2 arcs that happened

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Well when I refer to "the show" I'm talking about specifically Z, original DB and super don't have this problem at all IMO.

[@myvidskollerdenu]

You cooked and nobody can say otherwise.

[@williamwilkins-jones8715]

Goku might not be a good dad but that’s not the issue here. The issue is people pointing it out. Gokus a better dad than Vegeta but he has no part in any of this now does he?

[@BigYu2020]

You are the literal definition of Dragon Ball Fans don’t read…

[@crystalrouge537]

I disagree, sure Goku isn't a perfect father, but I don't think you understand him for what he is as well as who he is, Goku had no parent interaction with him since he came to Earth, bro was built for fighting and training under many masters, even his grandpa, and teaming up with friends made the difference, all Goku knows is fighting, he's learning to be a good father, he's processing everything he should do, he's a Saiyan, not human, so we can't expect him to act like a human, he has his own way of caring for his sons, it's not fair that everyone is saying he's a bad father without getting to know Goku at a emotional point of view, Goku is trying his hardest to learn and understand while balancing his life, he's a good person and a great father, but he's also a Saiyan, so we can't expect him to be there every time, he's not a superhero, but he is a protector, so I say give him credit 😠😤. I still don't believe in any this entire video, it's just not Goku, Goku is a great dad, I think people are thinking too human about Goku is weird, of course, that's the extent, at least

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

I completely agree with your points, actually. I just think this is why he's a bad dad by human standards, lol. When goku, the alien crackhead who lives in the woods, doesn't live up to my standards of fatherhood, I'm not surprised and I don't think it's his fault. He doesn't know any better. That's just my reading of the character at least.

[@crystalrouge537]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine well, he is at a learning process, and I can understand why people would think or say Goku is a bad dad, but he doesn't intend to, but let's say he has a lot to learn, he is overcoming not just his limits, but himself

[@crystalrouge537]

At least, he's trying to 😌

[@crystalrouge537]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine sorry if I came a little too angry, hope you're not mad 😅

[@CoolFang]

It always should be fun to discuss different readings of dragon ball and it’s cool you were passionate enough to share your own, even if I disagree with a majority of it. I’m sorry it seems that you’ve received flak for this video recently, dragon ball fans sometimes can’t take it when people have different opinions to their own. I saw another comment in this video where you said that, paraphrasing: humans have parenting down to a science. Bar the fundamentals like: guidance, teaching, and active presence (which Goku is shown in the series to do all 3 to the best of his ability), the “science of parenting” evidences that every different child requires different things from their parent based on many varying variables. I think this encapsulates why I disagree so much with your video, because IMO it glosses over these different variables in Goku and Gohan’s unique case for an assumed single and correct style of being a father for Gohan. I think my point is illustrated best with the fact that Gohan never once states or insinuates displeasure with his lifestyle or childhood, nor how he was raised. In the world of dragon ball, martial arts and fighting are a systemic core. Goku had a childhood absorbed by it which taught him that fighting, even when things get bad or violent, is a means for self-improvement and fulfilment. Gohan is born into an environment where this is also a familial and cultural value for him. Of course, he differs from this and wants to be a scholar. Goku is aware of this fact, and for the first 4 years of Gohan’s life, he respects this and just hangs out with his son. It’s implied that as much as Gohan sees training and fighting as a necessity, he also doesn’t dislike doing it - it’s more of a hobby for him. With the information and time he spends with Gohan for a majority of Z, it’s easy for Goku to interpret and transform into the mistake that he makes in the cell saga - that fighting means more to Gohan than it actually does. And when he realises this, he does the best he can by his son and ends up paying the price for it with his life. He misunderstood his son not because he wasn’t paying attention to him, but because he was paying too much attention-looking too far into something about Gohan that wasn’t entirely there. I think these variables definitely illustrate that in the world of dragon ball, Goku is a FLAWED father. But it’s cherry-picking material to say Goku is a bad father.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

I appreciate the good faith and the concern for me! I respectfully disagree of course and i've decided i'm just gonna make a response video to elaborate why. the short version is that, given how gohan is characterized in the funimation dub, I don't think gohna proactively enjoys fighting, I think he does it more as a way to spend time with his loved ones and because lives are on the line. I think this is the case due to all the traumatic events in gohan's life that were his initial introduction to fighting. this characterization is reenforced later in buu where the most fighting we see him doing is by being a superhero and helping videl/goten. Gohan is a selfless person who time and time again only interacts with fightings as a means to help OTHER people, not because he is interested in it for its own sake. I look at gohan and I see a frightened sobbing child who really doesn't want to fight even when he has to. That's the character I see and the only explanation I have for why he's like this is in the bloodshed and death that was inflicted on him. Edit: And I think goku not knowing about why he doesn't like fighting, implies he isn't aware of gohan's trauma. which is a sign of major negligence of the goings on in gohan's life.

[@CoolFang]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine The trauma angle, although interesting and fun, is headcanon. Maybe if it were written with some foresight or planning (Toriyama is notorious for writing the series by the seat of his pants), it would have been explored, but nothing in Z acknowledges this as fact--explicit or subtle. And material in Super outright either debunks or suggests otherwise that this is a concern for Gohan (not in the way that he got over his trauma, but that it was never there). But, I know this is where we ultimately differ in perspectives and I respect you're looking at this through that lense. Even so, the facts are that as much as a majority of Gohan's fighting is born out of necessity, he also treats it as sport. For examples in Z: training with Krillin on the way to Namek prior to their awareness of the Frieza Force invading the planet, and participating in the 3 years of training between Future Trunks arriving and the androids' first attack. He wasn't forced to do either, nor was anyone's lives on the line. And if he did it to spend time with his loved ones, that would imply he does derive enjoyment out of it. He treats fighting as either a hobby, sport, or a game. Goku simply mistook Gohan to be more in line with how he views fighting instead (which is as a philosophy and lifestyle). This is what Piccolo actually points out to Goku as his mistake in the source material, paraphrasing: "Gohan isn't the fighter like you are. He can't unleash his power because he doesn't know what your plan is, why you sent him out. So, he's not angry or playing for time, he's wondering why you won't step in to save him--because he's still just a child." There is a case that this is bad parenting: because it is. But, it's an honest mistake that Goku rectifies from the Buu arc onwards. Will be interesting to see your response. I highly recommend you experience the series in a more faithful translation however, as the original Funimation dub is widely known as a poor adaptation of the source material.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@CoolFang I personally think you can argue for that angle through upbringing. It all boils down to the question "Why does gohan not like fighting the same way goku does?" I don't know what your answer is but for me the fact that gohan had all these experiences is what makes the most sense. The krillin example is fair, It doesn't persuade me that gohan proactively enjoys fighting and in response I'd say "well I mean they're in space, eh what are ya gonna do." But fairs fair, yeah that's gohan interacting with fighting without coercive elements. The androids on the other hand, the fact that in trunks timeline they show up and kill everyone means that implicitly, yeah all the Z fighters are in the metaphorical sights of the androids. For me that is a coercive element, gohan is one of only a few people capable of fighting the androids and thus he trains to do so. I view that as being forced into the situation through life or death circumstance, not willingly choosing to train. I have actually read the manga up until trunks shows up. It's pretty good but the anime is still my preferred medium.

[@6ixman485]

Not only are you wrong but you state in in such a im better than you tone which makes this video unwatchable. Go read the manga

[@nazjhirbrandon9441]

my guy ngl if you not gonna read the stuff thats actually cannon to a series that you didnt make and then say you dont care about any other form of the series that actually is cannon and fits the story, dont make a video on the series video makes no sense, half of what you said is either head cannon or just not cannon, you not gonna read 5 ep of a version of the series and then make a video like you know more than people who spent their life watching the series, if its to hard to understand or read then do a video on harry potter and leave the anime videos to people who do actual research thenk you.

[@symphonyheart1384]

Goku only cared about training and literally putting half th planet or universe in danger for the sake of fighting the strongest warriors

[@smananderson09]

That's only super

[@cryingmetal9349]

If goku hadnt done that then all of the universes would have been erased.

[@cjteriyaga.v2]

@@cryingmetal9349 Was that really going through his mind? I mean which one sounds like Goku? A. Man, I hope this tournament of power can help save my universe. Or B. Man, I hope there's a lot of strong fighters in this tournament of power. If you guessed B, then you're 100% correct. How? What was one of the first answers he gave to a question Whis asked him in DBS Broly movie? "Why do you wish to become stronger Goku?" Goku - "The fighters in that tournament were really strong, they got me all fired up." It's clear Goku wasn't concerned about the safety of the universe even if it was a benefit to having this tournament.

[@cryingmetal9349]

@@cjteriyaga.v2 Goku didn't think that the other universes would have been erased. He accidentally saved all of the other universes just by wanting another tournament of power.

[@cjteriyaga.v2]

@@cryingmetal9349 I was talking about his own universe, not other universes

[@coldeed]

Up til cell saga ended he was a decent dad. He was flawed, tried his best and really did care about Gohan even if he made mistakes. Now think about how the dude made Goten and fucked off entirely. That's actually being a pretty bad dad. Because the issue isn't him making mistakes or being perfect. He had Gohan and knew all the issues that his son needed to deal with. He added another kid into that mix and entirely decided to give up on being a father to him before he was even born. While leaving Gohan as well. That's just not good parenting no matter how you spin it.

[@ieyasu_4872]

He didn't know Goten existed at the time, remember he decided to stay dead because he's like a villain magnet and thought the Earth would be safer without him. His reaction shows he didn't know about Goten when he came back to Earth. He didn't just give up, there was a reason he decided to stay in Otherworld.

[@StevenJones851]

Yup Goku's a bad dad

[@IDK-dude1]

@@StevenJones851no he’s not

[@StevenJones851]

@@IDK-dude1 he didn't even communicate with his family when he was dead for 7 years he could of used Telepathy to talk to his family there on earth

[@IDK-dude1]

@@StevenJones851 yeah that was bad, but he did take care of Gohan when he was alive

[@24trn27]

Brother, you lost the moment you mentioned the reason why Goku was there on earth… he was not sent there to conquer the damn planet. He was sent there because his original planet was fucking EXPLODING… they literally say that in the movie… also do you want to bring up source material but then use the Funimation dub is the most laughable shit I’ve ever heard in my life😂😂😂 especially when that dub is notoriously known for getting shit wrong not once not twice not three times but a multitude of times. It’s so funny when people try to add their two cents into a conversation conversation that they absolutely have no idea about. All this stuff is easily refutable if you just watched the actual show…

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@24trn27 plz explain to me then why his pod said "kakkarot, wake up, destroy all life" and then released an orb that turned him into a great ape then?

[@ComicallyGolden]

Goku is a bad dad to humans but to Gohan and goten he was a overall good dad as saiyans The dub fucked goku up and I completely agree with you it’s just some ppl forget that goku is not a human

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Oh, that's completely fair. If you wanna argue goku is a good dad by SAYIAN standards. Then sure I agree 100%

[@Haobey]

Also side note Gohan is a bad father. I wonder where he learnt that😂

[@jamemule5326]

Goku 😂😂😂

[@benbriefs798]

Exactly my point, and need I remind you that instead of saving his two sons + Vegeta's kid, he instead saves Dende and Mr. Satan without an actual plan? Still think he's a good dad?

[@smananderson09]

And that decision saved the entire universe

[@oatatus4102]

Dende and satan were spotted first, if goku went to the overs they wouldve died smh

[@jamescadet4450]

Goku Literally tried to speed to his sons to save them but they were too far and Buu’s planet destruction ball was gaining on them, he tried to use Instant Transmission but the situation was too intense for him to concentrate on it.

[@anitatan7627]

Keep up the good work. It was well edited and everything. Looking forward to seeing more!

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Thank you for the kind words!

[@BatmanTheKnight0]

Bro goku save gohan as a child so many times he even broke the a rule to save him from bojack so tell me how is he a bad father

[@jairusjackson7799]

Saving a child and raising a child are NOT the same thing. What is wrong with you DBZ fans not getting this! Beating up someone for you kid is the right thing to do as their protector yes, but there's far more that goes into being a parent than just being a body guard. Goku failed to understand his own kid's core character even after spending a whole year training with him, he's not a good dad bro. He's not a terrible one, but he's not a good one.

[@BatmanTheKnight0]

@@jairusjackson7799 and vegeta didn't raise his child and ever body likes him more than goku ya so gohan raise his kid thats because he actually went to school and aside the school thing gohan is half saiyan so he has human and saiyan dna and goku hit his head so he wouldn't know how to raise a child and chi chi actually went to school

[@BatmanTheKnight0]

@@jairusjackson7799 but i respect your opinion

[@jairusjackson7799]

@@BatmanTheKnight0 The thing is even if there are reasons to validate why Goku isn't a good parent, it doesn't change the fact that he isn't a good parent. Like explaining why a serial killer killed someone, it may explain why but it doesn't mean he's not a killer anymore. Also Vegeta is a shit dad as well, more than Goku if I'm honest. The fandom just loves to ride his dick tho, and excuse pretty much anything he does. So I wouldn't worry about it. But anyway thank you for at least respecting my opinion, I've met a lot of airheads in this community who don't know the meaning of that word. So I appreciate that you do

[@deedeeking4567]

So... Piccolo is best dad?

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

piccolo is the best dad in DBZ imo yeah.

[@sabaibaikari7023]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine When exactly did he became a “dad” to gohan?

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@sabaibaikari7023 I guess post his death on earth? I mean it was a stupid choice to sacrifice himself for Gohan, since if piccolo is still alive at the end of the fight Gohan can just be wished back with the dragon balls but one could argue that this shows just how much he cares, the usually smartest head in the room, piccolo, made a dumb emotional impulsive move. I'd argue he's certainly the most competent tho, considering he actually understands Gohan

[@sabaibaikari7023]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine Ok but couldn’t that kinda be said for Goku as well. His 1st sacrifice was not only just to save the earth but also for his son? Plus there relationship shows gohan greatly admires and loves his dad. Goku even shown to be very upset when he got kidnapped and worried for his safety. Plus while piccolo did sacrifice himself for gohan, in the beginning after killing Goku he kidnaps, threatens, abandons and forces gohan to train. Although he does get softer with him he was pretty much of a jerk when they got together.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@@sabaibaikari7023 you could argue that goku also sacrificed himself for Gohan as well as the earth, but that means the variables aren't as self contained as when piccolo did it. Gohan liking Goku isn't evidence of Goku being good parent, plenty of emotionally abused kids still admire and love their parents. Yeah piccolo isn't exactly good guardian either by my metrics, but he's the best of the bunch. Not only that but we need to consider that harsh training may be necessary, as Gohan is essentially a kid with an instinctual understanding of ki but has never been formally trained before in his life. With the information that sayians who are way stronger than Goku are coming to earth, it may be that they didn't have the time to do safer training because if Gohan isn't ready by the time the sayians arrive, they may have just all died anyway. In other words, Gohan could have gotten hurt/died from his time out in the wild but if Gohan WASN'T able to survive in the wild, everyone dies anyway.

[@satamsonicandsonallyforeve]

Yes he is bad father

[@ux67623]

He really isn't

[@beanieboi7743]

The thing is with the last point goku was straight the reason all 3 of the first arcs in z happened so him being self conscious about it does make sense also the dangerous stiff in the buu saga didnt start til goku came back. And while I do agree saying goku is not the best father which i dont think anyone has ever said is incorrect but saying he is a horrendous one is also incorrect. Goku did technically die for the earth but Goku's top priority was still to get gohan considering he tried to immediately tried to get him back when raditz first knocked him down and one of the first things goku does when about to raditz is check up on gohan. And the dieing for a child thing being the bare minimum to be a parent to me doesn't make sense just because it seems like the basic thing for a parent to do doesn't mean it's not good. Id argue that the bare minimum for parenting should be understood to be in the decent parenting to good parenting range as they are doing what they should be they jist arent neccisarily expectional. Also just because you are not a good parent doesn't make you no longer a parent and a dead kid isnt neccisarily a sign of bad parenting are Bad parents at the end of the day are still parents whether they are willing to die for them or not considering that dieing for someone related or not is a very extreme decision and I would say if you are willing to die for someone so they can continue living is a good deed. On the cell saga part Goku does know what Gohan's true passion is to be a scholar/scientist and i dont think it was Goku didnt know Gohan didn't like fight ( in the manga the conversation is worded differently so it seems like what Goku didnt understand was different) and immediately after goku realises his mistake he immediately tries to heal and go help Gohan its faster in the manga. I would say this is being a good parent when you are wrong about your child and immediately go to fix the mistake. Also the cell saga point against goku is kinda unfair because in context they literally needed gohan to win if gohan couldn't get angry in time more people would have died and potentially the whole world It also could be thought of that potentially gohan could also possibly have never told goku that he doesnt want to fight goku hasnt seen gohan scared to fight yet due to being dead and coming back to life during that saiyan fight like piccolo has and was also dead during piccolos training so he didnt see that either. Also goku faced some trama as a kid and still loves to fight so i dont think its unreasonable for him to think gohan was also wasnt a fighter in the same way he was. If Goku really was a bad father i dont think gohan would respect him the way he does gohan clearly loves and repsects him same for goku to gohan he never forces him to be a fighter i stead of a scholar the only kinda except for the cell arc but that was out of nessesity and goku still wants him to persue his passion. Again im nit saying goku is the best dad he could do better but acting like he is bad doesnt make sense

[@emeraldpichu1]

Sub is even worse than dub since instead of the planet is in danger because of me, it is your strong enough to protect the planet so I’m gonna go train here with strong people that are dead

[@painvillegaming4119]

Dude the manga itself Goku say people keep coming because of me...plus your stronger then me now

[@emeraldpichu1]

@@painvillegaming4119 if you’re talking about official translation , even those sanitize Goku to make him more appealing to our western audience

[@painvillegaming4119]

@@emeraldpichu1 that's the anime, (and the Ocean dub not even the ones afterward), not the manga. Hell viz does this with one-piece and big manga where they straight up butcher lines for jokes

[@emeraldpichu1]

@@painvillegaming4119 well not really there is plenty of people who look back on the older material to re-translate, because the super version of the character couldn’t hide his ego centrism anymore, due to have a storytelling changes people re-examined his character and realize that they were being lied to by the old translations it was pretty unilateral

[@frosinablazevska6691]

Not bad parent,but very Apsent as fuck

[@painvillegaming4119]

Guess death ain't a excuse anymore

[@Koodllez]

yep he was suppose to heal straight after getting his body stolen

[@1ab23c4d5e6f]

Very nice, love the outro.

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

thanks dad, i sure am glad you're not goku :^)

[@maliksanders7763]

Ok here my take goku ain’t a great dad but he ain’t no where near a bad dad I and didn’t piccolo kidnap him and threw him to a mountain left him in a wild at 4 year old and everytime on the battlefield who did goku check on first gohan and if anything everyone bad for gohan only person that don’t want him to fight is chi chi everyone else be letting or forcing gohan to fight and didn’t gohan go super Saiyan 2 while training his dad and he was out cause he was out in space cause he was recovering and two thanks to that he was able to teleport to danger or take the danger away and Ik pretty sure creating 17,18 would be pointless cause gero main purpose was to destroy goku so he ain’t wrong and earth was at king peace thanks to his decision to stay dead goku ain’t a great dad but he ain’t a bad dad

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

Piccolo is undoubtedly abusive to begin with. There's no doubt about that. I don't really care that much about it, tho cause A) piccolo isn't gohans dad it's not like he had any sort of initial connection to him B) piccolo was just straight up evil and planned on taking over the world, giving a 4 year old abusive training while bad is actually relatively tame compared to what he had planned at the time. C) there is line piccolo says at one point something to the effect of "we need everyone in fighting condition or we're doomed" I think one could argue that piccolo HAS to train Gohan in a hyper intensive way because they need him as strong as possible in a very short period of time (I mean Gohan became magnitudes stronger than goku had become in 10+ years of fighting in just a year that's pretty nutty when you think about it.) With the goku staying dead thing, I think it only makes sense from the meta perspective of "toriyama wants Gohan to be the protagonist" I mean literally the time-line where goku isn't around, everyone dies. And it's not like people like his enemies are just gonna be go "oh welp gokus dead, I guess I'll leave earth alone then!" Like, does that sound like frieza or cell to you? Nah I think that choice is wack af from a narrative lens

[@maliksanders7763]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine well in all honesty frieza did come to earth because of goku twice and cell was made by dr gero someone who want goku dead and the only reason that wasn’t cell main goal was because he gave cell Saiyan dna and goku don’t really be putting his son in danger like that the cell part was gohan was the danger

[@Too-Much-Caffeine]

@maliksanders7763 well sure they did those things because of goku, but the damage is done. Goku already has beef with those two. It's not like if they found out goku was dead, they'd suddenly just leave the earth alone. He'd have to have never started shit with them in the first place. And what would be the alternative? Red ribbon takes over the earth, and frieza remains space Hitler. Do you see what I'm saying? Goku staying dead doesn't fix the problem because they were still malicious without him. Him being around to combat the villains of the world is a net positive, not a negative.

[@maliksanders7763]

@@Too-Much-Caffeine honestly frieza was in the way of their mission plus he killed his friend so he had to get it back in blood but goku shouldn’t told him where he from tho that was stupid of him but gero would have tho cell wouldn’t be made if goku was left alone plus gero would have know if goku died cause he was spying on him but I see what your saying tho

[@matsu7086]

​@@Too-Much-Caffeine I'm curious how you feel about Dragonball Super and it's relation to Z? Since DBS unintentionally reinforces the notion that Goku largely attracts trouble. Examples: Beerus, Golden Frieza, Hit, the TOP (Not necessarily, but everyone blames Goku for that in universe), Broly (as a consequence of Whis reviving Frieza from Goku's promise), and partially Granolah. Potentially Daima too, depending on the plot's development. I also find it funny that less than a day into Goku being alive, trouble hit the fan. Like, his presence fast tracked the revival of Buu due to Vegeta voluntarily becoming Majin for a rematch. Do you think Vegeta would've made the same set of decisions without Goku? And instead aired out his grievances by fighting Gohan instead? Genuine questions btw, not being facetious.

[@MrKingkz]

Why do dbz fans always do mental backflips when it comes to goku just face it he's a trash character

[@jairusjackson7799]

Because they're not that smart, after all these years they still haven't realized that simply getting a new hair color is not a physical transformation.

[@May_Kai]

@@jairusjackson7799his hair used to be one color now it’s not that’s literally a physical change 💀

[@IDK-dude1]

Not really

[@HampsterHamburger]

LOL!

[@dawheat_]

nbs this video isn’t good.