Yoshi-P Comments on Oversimplification, Gameplay Goals & The Return of Kaiten

Source: www.gamesradar...
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[@Rewwgh]

Some of his statements a week BEFORE the 7.2 comments: Our goal obviously shouldn't be to stress players for the sake of it, but at the same time we must take into account the degree of satisfaction they feel when completing content. I mean that there must be a right and appropriate amount of stress so that the satisfaction at the moment of completion also increases. And this is something we are already working on in Dawntrail and in the 7.x patches , we absolutely don't want to wait until 8.0 but we intend to tackle this challenge immediately. Our desire is to create a situation in which each Job is equipped with its own skills, manages to shine in its own unique way, and there is also a sort of pride in playing a particular Job. By strongly differentiating the Jobs, we will be able to reach the goal we have set ourselves. This is why we would like to take a step back and put things back to how they were before. So why not act now? The Battle Content and the Job mechanics are strongly interconnected, so we set ourselves the challenge of refining the Battle Content and the battle mechanics first, and then focusing on the Jobs only afterwards. If we were to rework everything at the same time it would be extremely chaotic for the players, and that's why in the Live Letter I wanted to explain to the players that we will first fix the battle mechanics and give the audience time to get used to it, then only then can we work to make Jobs more exciting. I meant this in the Live Letter, it's the reason the Job work is coming later in the future.

[@RockR277]

That's good to hear. I was a little worried they'd feel a need to rush. Glad we're not waiting a full 2.5 years, but I wonder exactly how much they're willing to change mid expansion.

[@Naoto-kun1085]

We'll all need to have patience, large sweeping changes will only be bad for the health of the game! It's better that they're slowly improving the game and listening to player feedback along the way

[@mazakcanadaunofficial1276]

FFXIV fans try not to jump to conclusions: CHALLENGE IMPOSSIBLE

[@voistar5387]

Jumping To Conclusions (Ultimate)

[@SubduedRadical]

@@voistar5387 Hyper-Savage

[@thelonesage3146]

😂​@@voistar5387

[@ArchieGamez]

​@@voistar5387Reading Comprehension Downfall (Ultimate)

[@StormierNik]

Videogame fans try not to jump to conclusions

[@Marcomax742]

If anyone reads this article, please follow the link in it to the full Gamesradar media tour preview. It gives Yoshi-p full answers and not just a summarization.

[@kn0bhe4d]

Preach's interview with YoshiP is great to hear more about this, that interview is a goldmine about his design intention for the game in the coming future.

[@Nimoot]

Plus the "patch 7.2 and beyond" was NOT in quotations from Yoshi-P ... meaning the article is assuming.

[@PokAmakute]

Commenting just to say you did a great job on the physical transformation, I'm in the middle of one myself and seeing you doing so well motivates me as well. Keep up the good work Happy.

[@opiekunn1866]

I liked Kaiten just for how the animation looked lol. Still got it on my hotbar because I believe it will come back one day copium

[@ich3730]

i do that for every removed button, its a cool little collection you can cultivate over time. I got my "boomer bar" with MNK's evasion buff, the old SMN pet summons, many crafting icons and kaiten for example :D

[@CMReina]

Lot of SAMs still have it there lol

[@bluumberry]

In the same boat, it looked cool and felt good to use. Otherwise I couldn't care less.

[@DeadEye364]

For me, it was the soul of the class. It just felt good to use and it flowed really well not only in your rotation but also it’s animation.

[@kos-mos1127]

@@ich3730Old Sumnoner pet summons can stay gone because players just ended up using Ifrit the majority of the time and they are not designing the encounter around pet swapping.

[@rfactor1502]

So, given the comments in this article, and the original 8.0 timeline, I suspect nothing's moved up, but more 8.0 was their point of "we want complexity to start coming back by this point, at most." Their plan may well be to start adding complexity back in over the next several patches, with groups of jobs at a time (possibly even around roles to also keep jobs within the same role from looking too similar), with an endpoint of 8.0. If this is the case, this is good news, as with the recent reworks up to the ones coming in 7.0, we now have a very basic structure for each job, something that can be built upon. Trying to add in complex ideas when button bloat was high would have been a very difficult task. Now that we're starting to see systems in place to help with button bloat (the new option for having actions share buttons comes to mind), they have more tools to start building up jobs once more. Which is thematically appropriate given the idea of Dawntrail being a fresh start for a new arc.

[@mocmeo4425]

I will believe it when i see it

[@proudwhovian5161]

The 7.2 in that article isn't in quotes while everything surrounding it is. So you can't assume the inclusion of 7.2 was directly from YoshiP. Good chance is he just said something about that being the first patch after 7.0 launch where they'll start including job tweaks. Could be wrong, but that's my take.

[@VideogamesPang]

Yeah I think more likely it refers to this general "enhanced player fulfilment" direction he has been talking about rather than job changes, as in it will be evident from 7.2 onwards. It feels like it's taken a bit out of context in the article. I hope to be proven wrong but it's just too crazy to me to think they will make jobs more complex mid expac.

[@userbunny14]

@@VideogamesPang that being said, they DID change Paladin in 6.3, and HAVE made smaller changes mid-expansion. So if they started making SMALLER tweaks in 7.2, it wouldn't be so far off what they have done before. Not saying it WILL be how it goes, but they have actually changed jobs mid expac before.

[@voistar5387]

7.2 would be the ideal patch to start doing it since they would be able to balance the next Tier of the raid series and Ultimate around them, unlike the first ones which are probably too far in development to do so now.

[@Naoto-kun1085]

I feel like this article is quite misleading, as well as how they present reddit as being the "majority" when I can guarantee the majority of FF14's playerbase is not represented by the subreddit! Unfortunately I think that's just part of modern videogame journalism

[@silvergrove8517]

​@Naoto-kun1085 it's crazy to me that anyone commenting on the game would feel confident enough to claim to represent a majority of any type.

[@TsuchiGamer06]

Knowing how far ahead the devs work, I think the 7.2 comment was definitely just on "we have everything locked and loaded for 7.0 and 7.1, in 7.2 we'll start looking at things"

[@Paien75]

I miss stance dancing as a tank personally but I get that majority wouldn’t want that.

[@Bistai949]

As a Heavensward stance-dancing hater, I think it's worth mentioning that there's nothing inherently wrong with the idea of stance dancing. The problem with Heavensward tank stances was simply that the devs were trying to force a separation between doing damage and being a tank despite that idea running counter to how the game works. Personally, I think the dev team were scared off of the idea despite the fact that the idea is perfectly workable in concept. I think they could totally bring stance dancing back in some form as something to give one of the tanks more flavor. Could maybe make it so that inner release is a more active stance that the player goes in and out of based on situations instead of just a cooldown to press every so often. There's plenty you could do with it. And who knows, we might see some stuff like that in the futures. YoshiP specifically said that there have been a lot of ideas over the years that they've abandoned instead of trying to fix, and he said he wants to change that. Maybe we'll see old job mechanic ideas like tank stance dancing get revisited in some form or another.

[@cressposting]

There wasn't really dancing it more grab aggro then swap. I miss aggro being a thing and tanks taking more damage more than having different stances.

[@Squallyboo]

Looking back at it - it was okay, but really unnecessary. Current state is much better imo.

[@ProlificPianist]

Tank stances that were just pure DPS/Mitigation was not the best of ideas. Sadly in a multiplayer environment, sweaty metas will definitely emerge and take over a significant chunk of the playerbase. The DPS stances, while a good idea, were poorly executed as they simply just became the standard and removed the whole need to stance shift. People call it stance-dancing but there wasn't any "dancing" to it: Grab aggro and jump into DPS stance. Should've put a cap on DPS stance in some way or make it unsustainable. Also, tank balance back in 3.0 was total ass. So that screwed up tank stances reputation too.

[@zeening]

as someone who's played multiple MMOs with stance dancing as a high level raiding tank in each... i don't at all. there's so many other ways to introduce difficulty or non-monotony than fucking stance dancing -.-

[@taco_sensei]

7.2-7.5 will surely be small changes but it's perfect time for them to test stuff and ideas for 8.0, where they will probably anyways do a major battle content related reworks

[@dongshenghan1473]

i haven’t watched him for a year and he is jacked now??? Bro touched grass and evolved

[@Glenningway]

My take is Stormblood - mid-Shadowbringers jobs had a happy balance. Heavensward jobs needed changes like shortening exp gains, eliminating subjob grinding, better job balance so other jobs don't get denied by groups for raiding. As for Kaiten, I remember the comments that asked for it's removal and suddenly it's like the playerbase did a 180. Same with healers wanting to focus on healing which was reaching a fever pitch by the time Shadowbringers came out. I knew friends that played healer that hated getting talked down for not doing enough DPS while keeping everyone alive and actually liked the new healer changes. Sometimes the loud minority forgets that not everyone thinks like them and gatekeeping is inherently wrong in a videogame. That being said, maybe they could rerelease some DPS skills for healers to give them more to do for the face roll content.

[@wackantheduck6883]

"I want to do more healing" =/= "I want one damage button to press 99% of the time with 567 oGCD heals that are never used, not even in ultimate/savage".

[@ich3730]

@@wackantheduck6883 Its mind boggling. Like, just give healers 1-2-3 combos that would already atleast provide some variety in animations. SE not being able to implement solutions that other games would need around 30 minutes for is truly crazy.

[@Zakjuh]

Kaiten is pure contrarianism, really. The animation is cool, yes, but it's one of those abilities that didn't add much. You're seeing the same with Spineshatter now. If I asked people to give their opinion on what DRG ability, if any, to prune, Spineshatter was always at the top of the list, even above Dragon Sight. And since the job actions trailer, there's a sudden 180 where we all collectively pretend Spineshatter was the core and soul of the job. Ludicrous.

[@banriswirl6414]

I was one of the people calling for the removal of kaiten and I was right.

[@christhagod]

@@ich3730 they dont need a 1-2-3 they can easily have Bard where you have a single button proc into another button. they just need SOMETHING to do in dps outside of spamming 1 button.

[@ShaggyLad]

Please Yoshi. I don't care if the game isn't completely balanced. I just want it to be fun.

[@purgatoriprytania5382]

AKA, Heavensward.

[@LargeToastie]

Tell that to the PF lmao. Though I do agree to an extent

[@Elidan1012]

@@purgatoriprytania5382 lol no

[@edwardben-eboh7965]

I can only imagine the dumpster fire when what you say you want actually happens

[@reshypoo9447]

Feels like anyone who raids, disagrees with you.

[@Amooseable]

Me on PLD: Yeah new atonement animations, thatll be nice! Also me on WAR: If you change Fell cleave animations there will be problems

[@SwordmasterChannel]

hear me out, increasingly bigger saws

[@RockR277]

​@@SwordmasterChannelI love it. Fell Cleave, Feller Cleave, Fellest Cleave. Make 'em get progressively louder as well.

[@rafaelmendonca1272]

I'll miss Bloodspiller, loved the animation.

[@RockR277]

@@rafaelmendonca1272 I don't think bloodspiller is going away. I think the new combo happens during delirium.

[@Xorua]

I feel like I very rapidly made my peace with the way jobs are. It’s not ideal that some jobs can feel too simple or too similar to each other, but I think I still find that preferable to an environment where it is possible for a job to be genuinely “bad”

[@Cervarius_K]

I wish I could relate. Out of curiosity, what jobs do you play/when did you start playing? I'm just curious if there's a correlation with player sentiment

[@Theheadless1858]

I agree this is far preferable to having 2-4 specs suddenly suck every patch. It is beyond frustrating to genuinely enjoy something and suddenly have to pick up something else because no one will play with you. Dragoon saw a little bit of that a few expacs ago. And look at Pictomancer. These people do not want homogenized jobs or kits but the second Pictomancer was announced to not have a rez it was declared to be "dead on arrival" and many people are already opposed to bringing Picto to prog for that reason unless double caster becomes the optimal composition. So what is it then? Perhaps if the community could reign in their elitisms we could consider niche jobs but so long as this is the way the community at large behaves, this is the best we can do.

[@Rainfires]

@@Cervarius_K not OP, but I feel similarly and started in 2.0 beta. I’m firmly a believer that a game community warps around the emergent efficiencies in gameplay. If it’s efficient to gatekeep, not only will the community do it, they’ll do it zealously. I absolutely would love some job identity, but I don’t want it to be sacrificed for jobs that can’t be respectfully played in content. And, I don’t think that’s the track we’re on. Let ‘em cook.

[@Theheadless1858]

@@Cervarius_K I wholeheartedly agree with Xorua. I have been playing since ARR launched. I mained Warrior on release up until I cleared the HM primals for the relic grind, I switched to NIN when it came out and I cleared Twintania on it but then I switched to SCH for prog for all other coils. I did not raid during Heavensward at all but I played DRG through it. I completed SB as a SMN and used it for extremes but switched to WHM for Savage because our group needed healers. I completed ShB as a SMN again but used DRG during all of the extremes and it became my main for the rest of the expansion when RPR was announced because I wanted to practice a melee for RPR. EW was Reaper time but I had a hard time finding a prog spot after leveling (there were a million reapers trying) so I had to settle for DNC since that's what the group wanted. We cleared Asphodelos and cleared up to the 1st phase of Hephaistos but during the 2nd phase of Hephaistos I left that group. I switched up to NIN briefly after viper was announced and though I initially found Picto to be a shock (not in a good way) because I was expecting a Shaman or Green Mage, I eventually got really excited, switched to RDM in preparation for Picto and cleared Anabaseios Savage though I still have to go back and actually kill Hephaistos at some point. I am preparing a Viper Alt as well because after how much hate Picto got for not getting the homogenous raise that RDM and SMN have, I imagine if I want into the next savage tier I will have to be willing to not play picto. To me that's the problem. People don't want homogenization but when a job does not offer the exact same kit as another they are very quick to turn on it. When DNC's kit did not benefit the reaper (which was initially seen as a must because of its damage) dancers were reviled and exiled from prog groups prompting SE to quickly come in and patch DNC. Also, no matter how many people hate the 2 minute meta the reason it exists is because people were always trying to align CDs but some jobs had incompatible CDs with others, so it you had one job in your group, then it likely meant the incompatible jobs were no longer welcomed. This was particularly bad with NIN because any kit that struggled to fit its burst into the Trick Attack window was immediately dead since NIN was seen as mandatory and only those jobs that synergized with it were welcomed. As a matter of fact, often the hallmark of a good player at the time was how good they were at aligning their CDs with others.The same people who now have an issue with homogenization were screaming them for "synergy" between jobs.

[@Xorua]

@@Cervarius_K I started in like 6.08 or something, so I’m not gonna pretend to have a lot of experience with major job changes or the way things used to feel, but coming from other games to this game, it felt much more fun not having to deal with a stupid flavour of the month meta where the current best thing gets nerfed and something else which was previously garbage suddenly becomes overwhelmingly dominant with every major content drop. I started with Dragoon and have stuck with it since, and I’m pleasantly surprised how intact it seems with the Dawntrail “rework.” That said, I’ve levelled everything to 90 and try my best to learn the opener/rotation and the theory that goes into high-end play for all of them, so a few of my other favourites are Paladin, Scholar and Monk.

[@Pikachu-qr4yb]

Just the acknowledgement makes me sooo happy. I was afraid because the game is def getting a bit more in the rails. Hope this breaks that dynamic a bit

[@Ascarion47]

So, FFXIV has how many different jobs? Seems like having some jobs be more difficult and some less so is something that could easily be accomplished...

[@felixryan9798]

No it's not, because at that point keeping all of them perfectly balanced is awkward. You can't make an easy job perform as well as a difficult job and vice versa because that's unfair on effort-result axis

[@wackantheduck6883]

It's not "unfair". I would gladly play a more difficult job and deal the same damage as a SMN crayon eater. The reward is not dealing more damage, it's getting to have fun by not pressing one button. RIP healers since ShB.

[@Ascarion47]

It seems to me you absolutely can do that. Just look at WAR.

[@Nezard0]

@@felixryan9798 In EW, BLM smokes SMN in damage, but SMN is still the most played job and the job with the most clears because of its ease of use. What you're saying here isn't reflected in actual data.

[@felixryan9798]

@@Nezard0 BLM is its own thing, but I'm more talking about stuff like RPR vs every other melees in first tier, or SMN vs RDM. RPR was far ahead before they buffed other melees to catch up, and RDM felt like griefing for TOP first month when you absolutely needed LB to kill p2 comfortably BLM also didn't pull that far ahead until abyssos so it was a debatable choice also

[@ShanaGartrex]

As an anime watcher... the comment on Sword Art Online and Viper is... accurate... Kirito in SAO is called Jesus-kun for a reason.

[@raarasunai4896]

I know there will be a lot of Kirito cosplayers, but my glam for Viper is going to be Lloyd Irving. The main Protag of Tales of Symphonia and the first dual wielder I ever saw, and while it may sound odd to say this about a fictional character who isn’t uncle Iroh, he was a role model for me in my teenage years with his almost always happy, never say die attitude

[@DeadSpaceWing]

Edward Kenway.

[@jooko91]

​@@raarasunai4896 "If one sword has a power of 100, then using two swords would make it 200, right?" Has stuck with me ever since I first read it. Definitely going to figure out a cosplay of him as well

[@raarasunai4896]

@@jooko91 I’d be glad to share mine if you like 😁

[@raarasunai4896]

@@jooko91 I’d be glad to share mine with you if you want. Also sorry if you’re getting this twice. I think my connection blooped the first time I tried to post and it got ate

[@wavypavy4059]

Other interviews really made it sound like the dev team is still not sure what they're doing for post level 100, so it really doesn't feel like they're making any big changes before they figure that out. But I could imagine that the new exploration content could get a little wild as an experimental job design zone since it seems reasonable to assume we'll get another special skill system in that, which will be a lot closer to 7.2

[@nebula8851]

What I want, more than anything, is for the devs to just revert everything to Heavensward-era for a week, to dispel any illusions that things were ever 'better' then. As a Heavensward veteran, Endwalker oversimplified a couple of things, but Dawntrail looks like a good step forward for the future. Oh, and make the healers regret ever asking for 'more engagement', I want to see the salt when these people get filtered by ACTUAL healing requirements.

[@silvergrove8517]

Honestly? Call it schadenfreude or not, but I would LOVE to see what the game actually looks like if the decisions were in the hands of few identifiable people. So easy to just say in the sea of people what you think the game should be like but actually have it play out and see what comes of it. From the hyper casual who would be okay with a one button rotation to clear the latest Ultimate to the sweatiest raider who thinks that drifting your GCD for any reason is worthy of execution.

[@ich3730]

Damn, we are at the point of the game being so lost, people unironically playing with the idea of HW classic xD

[@WolfstarGaming1]

I want the return of Job-specific quests, role quests are so bland, you can only do them once and it gives no individuality or expansion toward the job you're playing I would LOVE to have them make a comeback. I felt like it was a pretty lazy change for Shadowbringers and Endwalker to have these generic "Healer" and "Physical DPS" or "Tank" Or "Magical DPS" quests. If you're worried about job identity bring back the importance of the jobs!

[@ArceusShaymin]

The Shadowbringers role quests were no less bland than the job quests before them. They told the story of the Warriors of Light from the first and what happened to them after the Flood of Light. It was a great story, even if it isn't unique between every single job in that role. I don't mind Role Quests replacing Job Quests as long as those Role Quests continue to be good stories, but the Endwalker role quests were just kind of okay. I mean, helping the realm get rid of the big, nearly-unkillable monsters born from peoples' despair is a cool idea, but the stories written for them didn't really stick as well because they weren't really personal.

[@xTyith97]

It’ll probably just be minor changes that won’t massively affect gameplay but at the very least test the waters on providing just a tiny bit of identity into the jobs. If the changes are well received they can look to exploring further options that provide a different flavour in 8.0

[@DacianGradaMusic]

I think people need to realize, as Happy said, that there's no real "majority" here. People are very vocal and the critiques are mostly valid besides the usual doompost when we don't even have the final builds to analyze, not even official patch notes; however most people have a different approach, they don't min-max rotations, they don't pay attention to every little detail and they for sure don't care about this weird non-standard rotation that lets you dot two enemies at the right time for maximum dps or using a final despair before transposing and banking on mp server ticks will optimize the damage the best way for that fight. There's validity in all opinions and we shouldn't disregard the casuals' take just because "they don't know better so they shouldn't speak on balancing or job identity"; the ultimate goal for the game, for better or worse, is to have more people enjoy it, more players, more revenue, big SE is happy, the game lives on. To me, simplifying a job helps people play it more easily and there's certainly a way to still make the ceiling higher for the min-max enjoyers, but it's so dumb to see takes about not wanting accessible jobs, don't you want more people enjoy the game you also enjoy? I'm glad the devs are seeing the problems, though, because there of course is a degree of "dumbing down" that is reaching critical levels with how the job/fight design has been recently, so I'm excited to see what this entails considering 7.2+ would probably have enough data on new raid design, how the alliance is going, maybe even criterion/field operation depending on how they go about it so they can have a full picture on what needs to be changed... I'm fortunate enough to be excited about all my "main" jobs going forward, no complains there not even with BLM, so we'll see!

[@ich3730]

Ngl calling double dotting on 2 targets "weird non-standard rotation" is crazy to me, thats like basic DOT class gameplay we had in vanilla WoW in 2004.

[@Castersvarog]

I can only partially agree with listening to casuals, they should definitely be listen to, they make up a bulk of players, but there needs to be a point where Honey Buns the limsa afker really shouldn’t be the main audience listened to. This game really needs to say, ‘hey, you need to get good, it’s been 100 levels and hundreds of hours of play time, you need to pay some attention’

[@storm99_]

I'm gonna say this. Casuals are fine, and their input matters for most games. But not every job should BE casual accessible. There should be some jobs that are simple, easy to understand absolutely, but there should also be jobs that require a greater amount of skill.

[@Naoto-kun1085]

I agree, the silent majority of players are satisfied with the current job meta (myself included) so if they kept the skill floor where it is and just increased the skill ceiling, I would be quite happy!

[@ronin1361]

"there's no real majority here"... right, so SMN and RPR, the simplest Caster and the simplest Melee DPS being also the most popular jobs in the game throws that out the window. While it's true that every job having an overly simplified rotation is bad, it's also bad that every job has a ton of complexity, there's a reason ppl only remember HW for its story, because everything else, including job design, was not very good

[@irishgoblin95]

I think there's some mistranslation going on in the interview. Another interview he did (think it was with a JP outlet) also called out 7.2, but specfically as the starting point for DT's "enhanced gameplay experience", with a hint at that being the ETA for the exploration zone. Nothing about jobs was mentioned. Either way, I'm with you on people jumping the gun on the job changes and reducing homegenuity. Most I expect is a unique action or two per job in the exploration zone as a soft test bed for future updates. I don't think there'll be anything major done to jobs during DT (unless they hit the "oh shit" button for whatever reason). Maybe 1 job will get a small rework mid expansion, since while they are reluctant to do them it is beoming tradition, but even then I doubt it'll be anything bigger than NIN's 5.1, and that's pushing it. What job that could be, anyone's guess. My money's on SMN due to how whelmed people are with Demi Hyd- I mean Solar Bahamut. But as I said, not much will happen to it.

[@vaan_]

I really hope it's actually the start of field operations on 7.25 and not just the start of the questline. x.35 is way too late to add grindable content to the expac.

[@kos-mos1127]

We all know it was suppose to be Demi-Hydaelyn but for whatever reason they changed it to Solar Bahamut.

[@zeening]

@@kos-mos1127 solar bahamut seems super lame D:

[@watchtings3092]

I feel like this well is poisoned before it's even begun, you can see it in some comments right here. Identity and complexity are already being used interchangeably when they're not the same thing. There is absolutely crosssover, oversimplifying a job will eventually impact job identity but there's a vast middle ground of interesting mechanics that are neither too simple nor too complex. I think you're correct that its a minority that want more skill management/complexity/difficulty, but I'm not convinced that's true for job identity. Anecdotal of course but anyone i know that's tried ffxiv and hasn't bounced off the msq has bounced off because all the jobs feel samey and boring, note that boring is not inherently the same thing as easy. If you like melee classes but don't enjoy positionals and a fairly strict rotation (compared to most other video games, not between ffxiv classes don't start y'all) well bad luck. Want to play the DoT job identity? Do you really think bard fulfills that class fantasy? Want to focus on riding the line between damage and holding threat as a tank? We don't do that here. WoW went through this crisis back in the day with the "bring the player not the class" philosophy shift and it caused a lot of issues that took multiple xpacs to work through. FF xiv has it even worse because the jobs are less diverse to begin with and now there's so mant of them to manage. Ff's strength is also its weakness here, most of the interesting gameplay is delivered through the mechanics the game throws at you rather than the toolset you're given. And you're strictly unable to use gear to tailor your character due to linear progression. I don't have all the answers but I think there's a very real risk that in mistaking complexity for identity jobs simply get made busier rather than more interesting, they start losing players and kneejerk back to simplyfying things to retain players and you're stuck with stuff all job diversity for another 5 years.

[@KissMyKimchi]

been with it since the beginning gave them two expansions shadow and endwalker and now even in dawntrail they triple down on making every role a homogeneous clone of each other which is even worse for healers because of way damage and combat works. They took away elemental dmg and resistances, they took away positionals, they just take and take chipping away at what makes a job unique and then with healers at least throw so many ogcds that we have a ton of healing options and nothing to heal because once you learn the fight everything is scripted. you know when damage is coming you know when tank busters are coming. Heck tanks themselves are practically a third healer they pump out so much mitigation and self heals.... so what's left for healers. Spamming one single dps button with an occasional dot thrown out. FUN!

[@ich3730]

gear is just so bad in this game. My lv1 starting sword has the exact same stats on it then the weapon i got for clearing TOP, the hardest content in the game. Only difference is the number.

[@riel0563]

​@@ich3730The game is not built around set effects or weapon effects. So it kind of makes sense that it doesn't work that way. Gear just being a number is not really much of a problem if all the other aspects of gameplay are properly addressed. The most they could really do is change what number means, but it's still just a number.

[@ich3730]

@@riel0563 There are so many cool things we could do with gear and equipment that go above "Numba go higha". Just look at the many RPG's that came out over the years, there has to be something more.

[@mathewkloepfer664]

So what I'm hearing is.... bring back skill points? :D

[@Manawolf25]

I really don't believe that kaiten gave all that more thought/intricacy to samurai's kit. Especially when every combo gave enough kenki and the yukikaze combo being the fastest to get that 20 kenki. It also lost a lot of importance when guren and senei were dropped to only needing 25 kenki. You could get more kenki with using meikyo, but it wasn't significantly enough that if you weren't sitting on kenki that you would need to use a shinten. The only thing kaiten had going for it was that it was a cool animation. Honestly at this point, kaiten is just an overblown and overhyped ability that a lot of people keep nagging on its return. They should also look into mechanics for the tanks and healers to do that would use their kit more often. Have the tanks defend party members, let tanks dash to party members and give that person a defensive buff for doing so. Then let them use their low cd single target party defensive or cover to protect that person. Give healers something to heal and not focus on using a basic spell and a dot for the most part, especially since they did this before in multiple instances. Even more would be cool, but they could possibly reward doing these mechanics with a buff or damage to the boss. The fights would have more personality brought to them if they could utilize the abilities they gave the jobs.

[@yanipheonu]

It gave more thought than pressing Shinten a bunch. But the bigger issue is they haven't actually done anything to improve Kenki after removing Kaiten in over a year.

[@Manawolf25]

@@yanipheonu By that logic they should bring back seigan as well. It uses less kenki(at 15) and plays around with samurai's kit as well, along with having the option to use a minor heal instead of damage. The kenki gauge was never that deep from its inception. It's just a resource used for any hissastu skill. The devs never put in any other skill that uses the kenki gauge but has had a few different ways to fill it up between normal weaponskills, ageha, ikishoten, third eye, or hagakure. I would say bring back seigan and have it at around 200 potency and keep its combo after third eye and keeping its cost of 15 kenki(or maybe you can make it 20 kenki with my suggestion). Just let it replace third eye whenever you meet the requirements for it. Then you give it the effect of increasing the potency of the next hissatsu action by 100(or whatever for the sake of balance) that last for 15s. If you give seigen this, I think it gives more intricacy to samurai's kit than what kaiten ever did. With the changes they're bringing in Dawntrail, you don't even need to bring merciful eyes for that aspect for seigan. (Post edit) Ok so zanshin is the only abiltiy we know of so far that outside the hissatsu skills to use kenki. I did forget about this but considering that to use zanshin you need to use ikishoten, that just makes the kenki you get from ikishoten dedicated to zanshin. That's fine considering that samurai gets a ton of kenki in a fight and the amount you get from ikishoten isn't gonna be missed too much in the big picture for samurai. I still think that modifying seigan like above would tie together samurai's kit very well though.

[@reidypeidy]

I mean it's possible to completely rework jobs within patches. I remember the Ninja rework in 5.1 really changed everything about how that job worked. They could change alot by 7.2. The only difference is I don't remember them ever adding new abilities or skills in patches, only changes, subtractions, or re-adding old ones. I still think AST needs more damage but it seems they are fine with having AST always being the lowest DPS in the game no matter how skilled the player is.

[@vincentbeton]

I do not expect notable changes coming in 7.2 or 7.4 for that matter. Just imagine them shaking up a bunch of Jobs right before a new Raid Tier and subsequent race to world first. It would be massive Drama and understandably so

[@Double0Anims]

They reworked Paladin on the same patch they dropped TOP.

[@profanegaming2829]

3:40 you say we are not the majority and that's true, but you are drawing a false assumption here that when he says "the majority" he is referring to just us because we are loud. You aren't privy to all of the feedback he receives. While we are the most obvious and outspoken, it doesn't mean that other portions of the community haven't expressed similar concerns through avenues through which we are not able to access.

[@WannSky]

There's no way they'd do all the changes in 7.2 because they probably have a vision of where they want the classes to go but they require time to implement it, tweak it, and see what works and what doesn't work. 7.2 will only be the building block by which means the 8.0 abilities will be stacked on to provide those class identities.

[@Draylin41]

They've rarely made big sweeping changes to anything in FF14. Think they realize the interest brought on by such a shake up is temporary and people will just go back to nitpicking other things in a few weeks or less. It can be annoying just how slow some things come online for the game, but I do feel gradual smaller changes benefit us more in the end.

[@alloounou6900]

They made half of astrologian cards be support focused again, like people wanted, and they're still complaining.

[@hayalmatnu9919]

​@@alloounou6900I'm not complaining:)

[@voistar5387]

​​@@alloounou6900 better example would be that in Stormblood and Shadowbringer, people (mostly high end raiders, streamers, and the streamers' parroting followers) about jobs being "worse" then other due to odd rotations or buffs not lining up, and then praising the changes in the patches that were the testing ground of the 2 min meta. Then the devs implement those changes in all the jobs people were complaining a out and then in Patch 6.2 suddenly everyone does a 180 and hates the 2 min meta, which again, was a meta of their own making due to their previous feedback. Between that and the complete 180 on Eureka (it was heavily dislike in Stormblood and Shadowbringer), I don't blame the FFXIV devs for being cautious and taking it slow since the people that complain can't seem to make up their damn minds, but will sure as hell yell as louding and obnoxiously as possible.

[@ich3730]

@@voistar5387 Its like having a kid that wants to eat cheeseburgers all day. If you give the kid his burgers and then someone says "Hey your kid is pretty unhealthy, it might be because you changed his diet into something bad" you cant answer with "But its what he wanted, you cant blame me for that". Its literally the dev's job to protect players from their own wishes.

[@voistar5387]

@@ich3730 Copy and pasted this from another comment and it didn't work there either. The jobs of the devs, especially in an MMO is to listen to feedback and plan changes accordingly so that the people playing the game are happy playing the game. They can't just ignore feedback from the people that determine if the game makes money or not. If players say they aren't having fun due to something, its their job to figure out how to fix/change/improve the thing so that its now fun. Your entire example doesn't work because the fundamental nature of a MMO.

[@UltimegaSeven]

I see this article as they wont rework the classes to be simplier than it already is. Doesnt mean jobs wont be simple or lose buttons to stay simple. They already do this with the transform button system much like the system in Tera Online.

[@chickenface521]

Hissatsu: Kaiten II Each press will gain 1 stack of Kaiten II. At 5 stacks Increases potency of next weaponskill by 69%. Duration: 15s Kenki Gauge Cost: 4 Maximum Charges: 5 Each stack will have increasingly flashy animation telling others of your amazing techniques and expertise of pressing a button quickly consecutively 5 times.

[@yanipheonu]

I wish they had just made Kaiten do something more interesting. Removing it always felt like a lazy answer.

[@wormwoodmain6677]

If he says its the majory im going to takes his word over yours. Im a casual player that doesn't speak up and youd have to be blind to not notice how simple some jobs are.

[@Shiirow]

I feel like alot of these people writing articles about interviews deliberately take things out of context to try and push views. There have been so many Yoshida comments misrepresented for clicks to take anything this says at face value.

[@newdecca]

My biggest issue with this game is it doesn’t have much incentive to coordinate attacks or positioning. I need more synergy abilities between players or play styles.

[@Exaltable]

Honestly it should be urgent for them. This is something that a lot of people have been talking about the game trending towards for many many years and it's finally getting to the point where the newer job kits from the previews have a very clear lack of optimizable things within their kits to improve at past a basic level of playing the fundamental game "correctly". A lot of jobs within the same roles also play very similarly to the point that they are just reskins or combinations of a few flavors present in other jobs too and it's concerning. From newer casual players' perspectives the jobs are verging on becoming mostly style over substance in terms of becoming attached to any one of them in particular. Add in the "QoL" changes each expansion frequently make the jobs worse to play at a lower level or just fundamentally broken during the leveling experience and it's kind of a mess. For as much as the game is polished and high quality, the polishing to the jobs has continually gotten rid of interesting mechanics to manage in the name of QoL and refused to add anything actually substantial in terms of new mechanics to jobs since about Shadowbringers. I'm very interested to see whatever 7.2 brings and whether it's copium or not I do feel some hope hearing yoshida and team acknowledging it as a problem that they are actively working to fix it.

[@tyswendson754]

Love your videos 😃 have you heard about the article released about the Healers Strike when Dawntrail releases? I'd like to hear your thoughts about it

[@Armadan7]

Honestly i want cleric stance, shadewalker, smokescreen and flash back... But I'd settle for Aero III. Please 🙏🏼

[@erickmejia1643]

Hey, I know that this isnt game related, but I just wanted to say that you have been looking very good lately! I'm not sure if its just the haircut or if you have been working out, but I wanted to congratulate you regardless on the clear attention you have been giving yourself over the past several months. It shows and keep up the good work bro!

[@Aisenheim]

Did mr Happy lose weight? Anyhow, my concern is about individuality in the “job”. I wish there was some degree of build customization for the jobs other than the melding and playing with the stats.

[@KingTaltia]

I wonder if this idea comes from the old gag of "Summoners get to keep Resurrection... for now" and the more he thought about it, the more he realized that's a ridiculous thought driven only by 'game design' and that realistically, trying to healthily convey a jobs INDIVIDUALISM while keeping them in rough wheelhouses would do a great job of honoring the legacy of "Jobs" in Final Fantasy history. Because that's the throughline I see there.

[@zeening]

i mean taking away rez from jobs that have had it for 15 years at this point would be asinine and overly punishing to people that main those jobs in large part to the utility of having a rez instead of just spamming BLM

[@KingTaltia]

@@zeening I mean, I dunno about punishing, we Summoner's have a ton in our kit, Res does at times feel like it's just an "add-on" but it really does make the job feel, well "like summoner" because it feels like we're pulling from the opposite side of the coin that is our class, and pulling a Ressurection spell from Scholar. Oh? Actually, thinking about the topic of feeling "like summoner" man I'd love them to change Res to something like "Phoenix Tears" or something and have us actually summon Demi-Phoenix briefly. That'd REALLY feel "like summoner".

[@providencebreaker1558]

XIV needs a Legion like expansion that really focuses on job identity. Bring back job quests and tie the relic progression to that storyline. It might seem like a lot of work with 21 jobs, but the game needs new levels of depth to remain relevant going forward.

[@klistel2557]

Yoshida wants to talk about Samurai's Kaiten removal making the job too simple but boy I'd love to hear his thoughts about a certain other overly simplistic job that starts with an S...

[@rafaelmendonca1272]

Scholar? Summoner? Sark Knight?

[@ronin1361]

you mean the most played job in the game?

[@libertylizard_]

Have to love the *** who keep chugging out the idea that 'most played' is somehow equivalent to something being a success. People lean towards the path of least resistance in life because for the better part they are lazy pos who can't be bothered to expend any effort. And that has spread across the world. The idea of 'low stress' became 'avoid any challenge or effort' - and even here in Japan it's a known quantity in the game. People refer to it as being comfortable for raiding because in an english sense, 'its brainless' and allows a focus on other things. This isn't a competent design. Its the equivalent of making every musician into a crazy frog combo. Simply because it's low effort and catchy. I suggest you stop playing mental gymnastics with people. I am one of the least outspoken in my peer group and even I grow tired of your pseudo-intellectual and dishonest rubbish. Easy things become monotonous over time. It's about time more challenge returned. In the voices you used when you laughed at people years ago for having a different opinion and wanting some effort in their job -''cry more''. You lazy types are disgusting. I hope my English, is sufficient for you.

[@stormkeeper1741]

I thought smn change was obvious? It didn't fit the two minute buff cycle and core identity of smn from the franchise in general.

[@yanipheonu]

Honestly both SMN and SAM are like proof they don't actually listen to really vocal complaints.

[@SaphireDragon89]

I suspect the MOST we'll see is nudging a few jobs back in the direction of having 60 second buffs/debuffs/abilities in general since that would be a welcome and a simple enough to balance change.

[@brandonn161]

When are the preorder keys going out again? I'm afraid that I might've delete it by accident

[@DantoriusD]

There are no Pre Order Keys. If you preordered and already have access to the Preorder Stuff that means your account is already registered for early Access. You usually get your normal licence during the official Release but the early access i playable till couple of Days of the officiall Release due to maybe people got their Keys later cause of shipping. Just check out the Mogstation if your Acc has the licence for Early Access.

[@SubduedRadical]

Yeah, people are...overestimating a bit. Probably a lot. I'd love to see more individuality/flavor/distinction between Jobs, though balance and viability are still important. Still, interesting quote, though again, I think people are overestimating.

[@dakre18]

Just to add, I doubt they would make such drastic changes quickly, because that would make it harder for people to adjust. Starting in 7.2 and working up to 8.0 is much more realistic, because it is more gradual.

[@KalaamNozalys]

Imagine if come 7.3 Dark knight gets some changes to some abilities. Like Abyssal Drain being a spell again, having the choice of either using it to sustain yourself at the cost of damage and not increasing darkside. Or Living Shadow giving ressources on the skills it uses. Small things Or a bit bigger, like the new combo consuming darkside and being slower than it is under delirium. Like have it be a 2.5GCD that consumes 20 darkside each, and delirium costs nothing while being a 1.5gcd that gives mana back on top.

[@BoredDan7]

So what I'd personally like to see once they actually do get to any sort of rework whenever that might actually be on the timeline is something of a middle ground between the two minute meta and the more wild west of the older style. I get why they wanted to homogenize things to 2 minutes to really ease the issue that come with different classes not lining up making for weird balance issues and certain classes not playing nice together or getting sidelined etc. However two minute only has issues with overly punishing certain deaths, feeling to strict and restrictive, etc. So my thought was more that there really need to be three windows that every class has something for. 60s, 90s, and 120s. This would keep the importance on keeping that 2 minute window going but would move some of that power to more smaller windows that can more easily be realigned. It would also make for the more interesting aspect of some windows being busier and more important then others with the opener and 6min being where everything lines up. But you'd also have alternating 90s windows lining up with the 60s. This would also make for more interesting adjustments for boss invulnerability windows that could lead to cool or interesting optimizations and decisions. Many classes used to work essentially this way, but I think if you want to homogenize the timings then homogenize them to the more interesting and dynamic system rather then just the rigid 2min.

[@craigpridemore7566]

I'm not usually a fan of simplification but NIN having huton as a trait, I'm looking forward to. As a MNK main I'm in 'wait and see' mode.

[@WillHuizenga]

I haven't seen Mr Happy in a long time. When did he get swole?

[@SniperKing-O]

He had his anime training arc this year.

[@XMarcus101]

Unrelated, but where is everyone getting the extra half year expansion cycle from? EW was 2.5 years because they released in late fall/early winter due to the delay and covid right? Otherwise, it would have been a 2-year cycle like always I assume.

[@PurpleAlzir]

They did increase the time between patches in EW to give devs more breathing room

[@DeadEye935]

I'm not expecting big sweeping changes in the middle of Dawntrail, but the sentiment seems to be adding actions or new job mechanics over the patches. Curious to see how it pans out.

[@ch0biq]

Shrinking of the hitbox most likely wont happen, they will hopefully just make the hotbox to be more reliable Kaiten being brought back will probably happen 8.0 as more homogenization occurs and people realize every gauge is the same thing for every other job and people realize it was taken away not for button bloat but rather dps deviation between jobs, where now that “combo actions” being the highlight design of DT, kaiten will be most likely brought back as one of those. Completely accurate for my groevance of they had 2 years to “fix” ast and drg and what we got was barely anything reasonable Just all of it is falling down the mcdonalds pipeline - if they dont make job identity their core prospect through 7.0 and 8.0, then expect every job to be the same exact button inputs no matter the job by 9.0

[@bigfoxki]

Only believe it when I see it. Not a lot of faith when they left the sun out from the moon and made summoner the only 4 minutes rotation for something no one asked for.

[@storm99_]

I hate to use the most overused line ever in these kinds of situations, but I'll believe it when I see it. Honestly, the thing I most want them to do, job wise at least, is nerf Warrior and give healers somewhere around 1-3 more damage options.

[@vintage_jd]

Hi Happy, Has your signoff line ever been, "... And stay happy." 😅

[@johnathansanford8206]

Here comes Mr. Happy to curb your excitement for the game.

[@benoitrousseau4137]

Am I crazy or they really seem to be pivoting a lot. When Dawntrail was announced at Las Vegas, the expansion legit looked like Endwalker 2.0. Now we 2 weeks to launch and Dawntrail seems to be 180ing on pretty much everything: job direction, more MMO less solo, field ops/relics, etc. I'm not gonna complain because I did not like Endwalker as much as the previous 2 expansions and I even somewhat agree with the angry healers, but I hope this isn't sign of internal turmoil and overpromising at CBU3. Dawntrail still looks good to me.

[@MrSpensix]

for the love of bahamut please do something about DRK... as far as I'm concern there's only 3 tank right now and the fourth one belongs to fashion report only.

[@Zakjuh]

Honestly, I'm glad there's no like public test realms that can be used to datamine everything ahead of time. But sometimes I wish for stuff like job reworks, they added some sort of testing ground. Could be a bland set of squares aligned to look like an indoor zone with some combat dummies for all I care. It would be good to give players the opportunity to test jobs (if there's large reworks in the pipeline) ahead of time so they can give their feedback and maybe even protest these alterations if they really don't land well Rather than going live with it, waiting for people to hate it, and then either backtracking, or going, "Well, you're stuck with it now, so just try to enjoy it."

[@jtwhat3004]

I think a public test would have been a good idea if devs actually talk about class changes on the regular. The devs say talk in the forums about stuff but we never get a response about it or it's a response 2-3 years later in an indirect way

[@Zakjuh]

@@jtwhat3004 Fair enough, yeah. I guess what I wish is not to be pingponged between major changes without any input. More communication in general would be good.

[@PastaTime88]

I have no preference when it comes to job complexity to be honest, I main WHM because I love the aesthetic and and it’s a staple FF job to me, if it got more complex I’d still use it, if it got simpler I’d still use it. My main concern is the “individuality” or job “identities” becoming one of those situations where certain Jobs are blocked out of content because they’re good enough

[@hylianspectre359]

The lack of any meaningful Summoner changes for 7.0 should speak volumes in itself. 6.0 SMN was pretty rough for those who liked old SMN, but there was still hope that the devs would build upon the new job over time to make the class even slightly engaging. However, not only did that not happen, but 7.0 SMN does nothing new in pre-100 content. Where are Ramuh, Leviathan, and Shiva?? Alexander?? We're getting a reskin of Bahamut that nobody will see in 99% of content, and next to no changes to spice up any prior content. TL;DR: I'll believe it when I see it!!

[@foxyfoxington2651]

We've been asking for Ramuh, Leviathan, Shiva, etc since I started back in 2.2 and still haven't gotten anything. I laughed when some content creators pointed out how much room there was to expand Picto. I'm over here like, in 3 expansions they're still going to have the same number of paintings, etc.

[@ich3730]

@@foxyfoxington2651 It would be so easy too, there are dozens of fan-made updates to the class on the forums. Shiva/ramuh/leviathan all have animations and spell effects already in the game, heck, modders have done it ALREADY FOR YOU.

[@manuelsalvadori1701]

7.0 SMN does nothing new even in 100 content.

[@voistar5387]

Ramuh and the others is okay expectations, but Alexander is setting yourself up for disappointment with no one to blame but yourself.

[@kos-mos1127]

Hydaelyn is more likely than Alexander because Solar Bahamut has the same signature ability as Hydaelyn’s Exodus.

[@raiky015]

"there's people who like difficult stuff and others who like simple stuff" yes, that's why the game have more jobs, what's the problem to have a difficult job and a simple job, it's better than have only simple jobs or only difficult jobs. i personally think more dmg the class deal more difficult is , easier the class is less dmg they do but more raid buff they give. That's because even a bad player can choose a easy class to buff the try harder ones, then everyone will have their raid spot.

[@anteprs7908]

the problem is 80% of players dont do or like difficult stuff(causal players) and 20%( midcore and hardcores) do.

[@davidstubbs2361]

Does this mean we’ll get ice paradox back

[@arturprakapas9766]

In my humble opinion, we can have it both ways can't we? Why not have some jobs that have a higher skill ceiling than others? I too am in the camp where I feel like the jobs are all dumbed down too much. I loved playing SMN in 2.0 through 3.0 and then they completely dumbed it down so I switched to SAM and then that also feels dumbed down now and now I feel like I don't get the same level of fulfillment as I used to get. And the higher skill ceiling and job identity we used to have is what is lacking, I think.

[@Gofr5]

I agree that's a route they can take. Problem is you know there will be people complaining that X job pressing a 3 button combo and doing as much damage as Y job pressing a 3 button combo with 2 OGCDs mixed in is not fair and that the "high skill" job should do more, when in reality it's just a different playstyle for those that enjoy more complexity. But, some people will always equate "more complex" with "more power" as opposed to just "different playstyle".

[@lightknightgames]

TL;DR "Let's acknowledge the problem for 2 years, but push back the solution for 3 more years, probably 4 if we can use it as an excuse to delay 8.0" So SB end to Unnamed expac beginning, is going to be oversimple. 9 years+. ARR to SB was only 2013-2019, 6 years. So in 2027 60% of the game's lifespan is going to be using this disgusting design philosophy.

[@IcyPrisoner]

Honestly SE just need to make more feedback survey for every patch so, just a simple one with options to tick

[@lawlmaster]

Boy I can't wait for all those reddit threads to go from "Jobs need more complexity!" to "How come everyone in duty finder & party finder suck!?"

[@Fain255]

I wish they added an actual aggro system like Xenoblade 3. Managing aggro in that game is genuinely fun. Everyone gets hit with autoattacks in order of aggro and everyone has to contribute to avoid getting hit and also heal. In this game all it takes is an AoE in tank stance and that's it, enmity is a non existent mechanic. At least give us stances back.

[@bssL25]

Pfft. Its naive to think massive changes will come in a blink of the eye so I agree with you. And I do not think fans understand the request they make of when they gripe about jobs becoming oversimplified and lacking individuality. This is a two way street. The jobs becoming simplified happened because whatever data they possessed led them to that conclusion. Professionals don’t just do things without cause, because it is a lot of work to act on emotion. Data does not lie. Can be misleading, but it must be interpreted. I would not hold out hope about them adding complexity out of no where. Guess what will happen when there is a higher ceiling to achieve? More people will find shortcuts and cheat to gain an edge. Thats just in our nature and we’ll find a way to complain about those changes too. And the vocal players will always seem like they come from the “majority” when it’s anything but. This game had 20+ million people at some point, believing that any one of us has reacted with even 3% of the total fanbase is delusional.

[@lunamaria8788]

Bless

[@Tobeh]

Yoshi P said a while ago the 2 minute meta was a direct result of player feedback. Raiders everywhere said it was annoying that their burst phase never seemed to line up with group buffs and felt clunky to try and make happen. The result of that feedback is what we have now. Now everyone is upset that everything lines up too easily and it feels like it’s on rails. This was in Heavensward,

[@nozelxo6514]

@@Tobehsomeone said it 👏🏽

[@ich3730]

@@Tobeh I mean, thats like a parent saying "The kid wanted it so!" after feeding the kid in question only cheeseburgers for the last 5 years. Its the dev's job to protect the players from their own wishes.

[@TheKrzycho5000]

​@@Tobehthis response from YoshiP is just pure copium though. They introduced 2min meta as kneejerk reaction to Loud minority of bad Players doing high end content and then found an excuse for it. They made an almost exclusively hated change and instead of fixing it they went "we didn't fuck up, players WANTED US to fuck up"

[@nicholasaragon4126]

Sure, make them extremely complicated and convoluted with 20 different rotation mechanics and every button on the keyboard and a 12-button mouse and a footswitch modifier bound to a skill. Then players will whine like they always do. Then give the jobs extremely different playstyles, affecting balancing. Then players whine like they always do. There's no way around it, the community will never, ever be satisfied. I want at least a 72 button opener at a minimum.

[@ruta1133]

They'll rework BLM because Yoship only took this stance because his job finally got the simplification stick. Real talk I think they'll just try to make the dungeons and raids more difficult slowly until they notice people complaining about things being hard. I can also see them maybe buffing the damage on skills that may be hard to execute in certain situations and then creating more of those situations. Things like that.

[@drchocolatetv]

I still have kaiten on my keyboard, I still press kaiten I miss kaiten

[@raiky015]

Same bro, it's still in my hotbar

[@bigfoxki]

Me too...look what they did to my boi...

[@NoxAevitas]

When I was on my old chr I still had kaiten on my hotbar. its spot is replaced but its place in my heart is not...!

[@TranceGurl20]

Aww it's ok there are many skills that I miss come back old astro 😭

[@yanipheonu]

There was a good old comment that was basically "What have they done to make you *not* miss Kaiten?" The answer is nothing.

[@OldManInternet]

The problem is they've been trying to walk that fine line to make everyone happy for so long, and in an effort to appeal to as wide a base as possible, they've started to annoy everyone. I think at some point they'll have to pull the trigger on some tough decisions that'll ruin the game for some people in order to put things in a state most people can enjoy. But making a decision like that shouldn't ever be taken lightly.

[@Scerttle]

People surprised by the jbo simplification coming in 7.0 after the last time they jumped to conclusions and started huffing coping from the last time Yoshi P said something like this.

[@Kraidoz]

The issue is most players that are content with the game will just get on with it and not say anything, and they are likely massively in the majority. Yeah, sure, some players want the game to be brutally hard, they are in the minority for sure. Looking at party finder, the majority can't handle simple mechanics or get their rotations right. There should be a popup ingame 2 weeks after the game launches so everyone can see it, and directs to a poll where you get a small reward, like 5 venture cashes and a minion. That would get a more accurate representation. In my opinion, it's absolutely fine to have the simple jobs like dancer and summoner, where you don't need to think about rotation, letting you just focus on the fight mechanics. Having a few jobs that are more involved is also fine, but as a purely optional thing where dps shouldn't be higher, you play it for the challenge, not the higher dps because that forces a meta and player rift.

[@eviljoshy3402]

I remember learning to be the kiter as SMN during T7. Then after I learned how to do it they made that fight brain dead simple compared to what it was.

[@ame5445]

Who!? Where!? Who was complaining about kaiten??? Wtf were they submitting feedback from the game window or some crap?? I've seen more people complain about kaiten's removal than support for it

[@drewlarsen5226]

Would high end players be ok if say said complexity came at only being a couple % more damage so its not a big difference for induvial players who do not want things more complex but a entire static could be doing 15-20% for the complexity if the entire team is doing so?

[@jameysotelo540]

Personally excited still going to keep my expectations low but will be interesting to see what they are doing only thing for me i really hope they don't remove death's design from reaper but we will see.

[@StormierNik]

For a while ive heard about SAM talking about Kaiten. I finally picked up SAM recently and was wondering on how it was before, thinking that "Maybe it was a really engaging experience to use Kaiten". I look up what it did, and all it is, is a fucking 50% extra damage buff on your next action or whatever while costing meter. That you would only use (obviously) for the same things in a static rotation. You'd use it for your DOT and your hardest hitting attack. And that's it. That's literally JUST button bloat and absolutely zero skill expression. But because there's a lack of any skill expression otherwise in the game, SAM latch onto that so much as if it isnt akin to the potencies being higher. I cannot believe that's what people were up in arms about. Get rid of random bloat shit like that so you can introduce more engaging things instead. Just like how positionals should be dead right now

[@balazsszucs7055]

Time for the new Samurai combo: Kaiten, Kaita, Kaitaga

[@jt1973]

7.2 mention is wrong as Yoshi-P cleared up in LL. No Major job changes/reworks coming by then, probably expect 8.0 +

[@varmintx0]

I'm jumping to the conclusion that all this means is that SMN is getting Shadow Flare back!

[@courtgame]

Didn't yoshi say 8.0

[@ilikecatsandstuff1]

I'll believe it when I see it.

[@wickanchaos7781]

guess ill wait til next years xpac, i wanted inidividuality returned for dawntrail but its all just more finishers, the ast change does bring hope tho

[@foxyfoxington2651]

This is the same guy who, in response to any interviewer who ever suggests changes to anything in the game, says "We can't do that because it would upset the player base." So... a) I don't know he he expects to meet that goal and b) I'll believe it when I see it. And anybody who has played this game for any amount of time knows these changes aren't coming any time before 8.0. It's kind of irresponsible for YoshiP to suggest that they will. Makes me wonder if perhaps the sub or preorder numbers aren't where they'd like them to be.

[@BloodRawEngine89]

As a Warrior main, I feel like it still hasn’t entirely shaken off its Threadbare feeling since SHB’s homogenization. EW helped it feel a touch more active with a few changes but 7.0 feels like they’re just abstaining from what’s been overdue.

[@mathewkloepfer664]

I actually heavily agree with this. EW was/is given a lot of forgiveness because of COVID but this was the time to start righting the ship. We can't just keep going years between expansions only to get yet another capstone finisher after your finisher.

[@ilfirinuluthrek5244]

8.0 : a lot of rework to add uniqueness, and to have the ressources do that, they will not add new jobs in the next expansion. I would be ok with that tbh

[@ich3730]

For one of the biggest MMO's on the market with a rich history and franchise to rely upon for content, doing BOTH NOW should be child's play.

[@genesisSOC]

If 7.2 doesn't make 7.0 look like it's absolutely pointless, I'm blaming Happy. (jk lol)

[@sherrons88]

"Promises not to make jobs more simple" Looks at DT BLM in spanish o.O

[@akamadmaxx]

I kinda feel like the left hand isnt talking to the right hand at FF14. one hand says take breaks go enjoy new games come back when more story is available. The other hand is we are going to make picking back up where you left off harder for people that dont have every job they play memorized. I understand the content creators that have the name and effects of every spell memorized and know what every change to each spell has been since 2.0 are like "uh what's your problem this 20 spell combo dependent on situation rotation for this ninja is easy AF... just get better dude", but the everyday casual player who might focus on something other than the min/max in and out of a hobby will have a hard time coming back and being even half way decent at their rotation.

[@bauloprete3905]

I understand im a way why they are waiting for 8.0. Didnt they said that lv100 might be the maximun, and from that point a new sistem will emerge? Maybe thats are they may solve the job individuality

[@Zaela_Zhezzaia]

To me I feel a lot of classes felt like a Warrior clone. Give everyone a simple 123 rotation. Build up a bar and spend it on the class version of fell cleave. Loosing more and more personality and becoming simple to play. I really think tanks are pretty much just became warrior clones. Even going as far as having their one version of Inner Release. Where you spammed your Fell cleave 5 times in a row. With the exception of Gunbreaker but they do have their own burst dps phase.

[@mathewkloepfer664]

This is probably a natural progression since job gauges were first introduced. The problem is that over time the only identity for a job gauge has quite often been to spend it ASAP and only for damage. If there were other ways to interact with the gauge like spending it for a self-heal, a utility, or damage instead then players would at least have choices to make. AST and BRD are probably prime candidates for interesting interactions with their gauges but we have yet to see a good rework of either.

[@Double0Anims]

@@mathewkloepfer664 Paladin used to be like that, because our gauge is defensive. The thing is that gauges are also just stand ins for buffs. Now Paladin hits Req and does his fell cleave (Confiteor) 4 times as well :p