Eternal Engine is Eternal Suffering

[@zoomzike]

This level was requested a lot, sorry to those that enjoy it lol MUSIC'S BANGING THO Here's the link to Raid once more! - clik.cc/KdlQv

[@theaa47]

Downloading Raid just for you Zike o7

[@Cliffordlonghead]

Kk

[@Cliffordlonghead]

First 😊

[@Cliffordlonghead]

​@@theaa47 CRIMINAL BOT

[@felicityc]

@@theaa47 don't encourage it

[@___8241]

the fact that tails' final level goes for more of a pacifist play as opposed to eggman's more destructive counterpart is kind of clever honestly

[@MisterTTG]

yeah, i always noticed how opposite they were as a kid, very measured, surgical combat versus just going balls-out and blasting everything around you racking up enormous combos the problem is, eggman's final level is fun, and tails' final level is also the opposite of that

[@voxelia64]

Thank you for taking the time to implement proper subtitles, truly a sign of the quality and care you put into your videos!

[@seematahir5970]

ZZ is a great example of how fans of older Sonic games aren't always "blinded by nostalgia" or incapable of critical thinking. They can acknowledge the weaknesses and flaws of the games they like, but that doesn't suddenly make those games bad or irredeemable.

[@moister3727]

Sonic Adventure 2 starts to suck hard after the first level. Some of them are good, but the rest in between, nah.

[@BlueMageDaisen]

@@moister3727 Nah, Sonic Adventure 2 is fantastic and the vast majority of it is great fun, with only a couple dips in quality and only one truly bad level

[@puseate821]

Tbh that stage is pure dog shit.

[@CaptainSwag]

Both Adventure games have a lot of good things, and a lot of flaws as well. But people tend to overshadow the good parts with the few REALLY bad parts. I guess Sonic can't have a break.

[@Infindox]

@@moister3727 Not really. Most of Sonic's levels are great (Crazy Gadget the only one making me go "hmmm"). Shadow's are fun. People disrespect the mech levels too much but they generally are fun on both sides with minor gripes. Only levels that are mixed are Knuckles and Rouge's but they also have some decent ones.

[@ZacSonicMee]

Admittedly i remember liking Eternal Engine, but after seeing this i 100% understand why other people don't.

[@sunlitsonata6853]

I still have memories of constantly getting all my rings lost to the Artificial Chaos, having to stand in place to hit them with the punch, and that leap of faith jump to the pulley with the floor constantly sucking you down. The hallway design really stands out compared to Cosmic Wall’s freedom of movement

[@amateraceon5202]

Man, you can really tell ZoomZike isn’t a big fan of this level just from the harsh tone of his voice as he’s narrating I guess you could say he’s feeling On the Edge… for Eternal Engine.

[@mangaprofilepicture5820]

When it comes to videos like this Thats the Way I Like It…

[@mangaprofilepicture5820]

for Metal Harbor

[@ge789]

I guess one can say that when playing this level, ZoomZike Won’t Stop, Just Go!… For Green Forest

[@KaiserMattTygore927]

A perfect comment.

[@noahmurad]

You have a fine taste in music

[@orealz]

I love how raid shadow legends is seen as just a milestone in a youtubers journey rather than an endorsement anyone takes seriously and doesn't immediately skip through.

[@almaelma11]

9:15 "There's little incentive to do so, other then score." That's the incentive if you care enough about the game to try to get an A rank towards 100%ing it. The TNT count towards the combo so when going for some of this levels A ranks another big part of this level becomes thoughts like: "Is it worth it to blow up a rooms worth of TNT and enemys for a perfect combo right now or try for another part later?" "Can I get through this section both fast and efficiently for the time bonus points to help with the A rank, or is speeding through here and taking out everyone in one swoop way too risky since death almost always means no A rank" "I can get great combo's on the bridge section outside but it means blowing off a ton of path and making it an death pit party! Whats the best way to go about this?" Its whats I asked myself anyway, and what I think. I do agree with some of the design choices though like the lazers after the 1-up. Come on Sega.

[@zoomzike]

I mainly focus on looking at these levels through the perspective of a first-time player and how the level teaches the player those mechanics and expands upon them. While a veteran or someone replaying the level will find value in shooting in Eternal Engine in order to get an A Rank, first-time players are simply focusing on completing the stage, where shooting is hindrance to them and they're better off walking by passively. For first-time players that do like racking up points regardless, I don't find the challenges the stage throws at'cha to be too interesting since it reuses the same rooms over and over again. I much prefer the boardwalk section of the level since it gives you a lot more to think about with how you shoot your shots.

[@almaelma11]

@@zoomzike That's fair, and thanks for the reply! If I could remember my first time 20 or so years ago I'd be able to back that up with my pov but iv played it a ton since then. Maybe young me struggled too haha. And who knows, maybe that boardwalk was pushing the dreamcast hard enough at the time so they only made a short section and didnt change it for the port cus port. "This outside is killing the Dreamcast ram. We are only using it once!"

[@luis-sophus-8227]

The lasers, the sudden Artificial Chaos at some rooms, and the first two issues pointed

[@rollinroby4920]

Still waiting for Final Rush. Definitely agree. Artificial Chaos alone make this stage completely unbearable. The music slaps though.

[@RickySama240]

Yesss can't wait for Final Rush and especially Speed Highwayyy!~ 😁

[@levthelion71810]

I think Final Chase would have some more interesting things to say about it. (Cylinders)

[@alecthegamergd3960]

@@levthelion71810 there’s already a video on it…

[@spimbles]

Skill issue

[@hezmo940]

When I played this stage for the 1st time I hated it, but later I grew to appreciate the challenge and it isn't just spamming the shoot button like in the other stages, you need to be careful what to shoot and I love that type of challenge.

[@hezmo940]

But The Artificial Chaos do kinda ruin it tho.

[@KaiserMattTygore927]

Same. I yelled at my screen back when I first played this stage, it pissed me the hell off the first 2ish times 22 years ago but like what happened with Crazy gadget I actually grew to like it (except those specific arbitrary sections where the dynamite is haphazardly placed with no consistency)

[@AkameGaKillfan777]

That was never the point of any mech stage. There is not one single point in the game that tells you mashing B is better, you're supposed to get lock-on bonuses.

[@aurafox1]

Not justifying the atrocious level design choices in this stage, but I've noticed there seems to be a thematic focus on how the characters' stages are designed to fit with their personalities and ideals. Sonic's stages are more passifist. They're almost all about escaping from danger in some way. He's escaping the MIlitary pursuit in City Escape, Escaping prison in Metal Harbor, getting to Amy and Tails to escape the explosion in Green Forest, rushing to save Amy in Crazy Gadget, and finally moving in to stop the Eclipse Canon in Final Rush. This is in contrast to Shadow's stages which are all more aggressive. He's attacking the military in Radical Highway, pursuing Tails in Sky Rail, and moving to stop Sonic in Final Chase. The only odd one out is White Jungle where he's going to save Rouge who got herself trapped, but at the end of the day the whole situation here was due to their plan to blow up the island in the first place. Knuckles' stages are generally large, open areas to soar freely through in his search for the Master Emerald. They aren't as significant to the overall narrative, but they are significant due to the importance of the Master Emerald itself. Knuckles is more rash and direct. He's single-minded on retrieving the master emerald so most of the emerald pieces he's able to find are in fairly easy to reach locations. (The Hero side stages are generally easier than the Dark side stages, which is especially fitting for this dynamic.) On the flipside, Rouge is more technical. She's a military spy and a thief. While her stages are generally similar to Knuckles', they all require a greater degree of precision and control. She's using a turtle to swim against a current underwater, hiding in the shadows to avoid detection from a patrolling security robot, breaking into vaults, and simply *existing* in Mad Space is a disaster. Not to mention that, as a treasure hunter, she's focused on anything of value to her, not just the Master Emerald. And then you have Eggman and Tails. Eggman's stages, like Shadows and Knuckles, are a lot more aggressive and direct. When faced with an obstacle, Eggman would rather blow it up and charge forward. All of his stages are about breaking into heavily secured areas with brute force. Meanwhile Tails' stages are more strategic. While the mech stages are all heavily destruction-focused, Tails is generally more focused on creating a path forward, using brute force where it's necessary rather than going in guns-a-blazing. Functionally, there's no real gameplay difference. You go into the level and shoot everything down either way, but narratively, that's what's happening in all of these levels. When looking at the levels through these lenses, it's clear that the final stages of each character are designed to highly emphasize the peaks of their goals. Sonic's trying to save the world by stopping the Eclipse Canon in Final Rush, Shadow's trying to destroy the world by ensuring the Eclipse Canon's activation, Knuckles goes out into space to seek high and low for the Master Emerald pieces that were carelessly ejected and left behind, Rouge capitalizes on that very same mistake, Eggman is closing in to stop Sonic and Tails's plan in Cosmic Wall, and Tails is fighting his way into the Ark to pave the way for everyone else. I suppose the logic with the design of Eternal Engine was simply an attempt to apply Tails' intelligence into the mix. He can't just carelessly blow through all the enemies in his path because he has to be wary of traps set up by Eggman. Eggman, on the other hand, has nothing to fear in Cosmic Wall because he practically owns the place by this point. I guess they wanted the two stages to be narrative opposites. Still not a good decision at all, though, and I'm sure there are much better ways they could've designed this stage with a similar concept in mind. It's very evident that Shadow, Rouge, and Tails were all afterthoughts as playable characters. The characters who were planned to be playable from the beginning generally have the far more enjoyable levels.

[@Blanktester685]

i highly doubt playing as shadow was an afterthought considering the whole identity of the game.

[@aurafox1]

@Blanktester685 While I'm not sure it's ever been confirmed; Sonic, Knuckles, and Eggman were stated to be the only playable characters in magazines, which lines up with early pre-release material. And it makes sense when you look at the levels, too. The only venue for the missing characters' levels that isn't reused from those three's is Radical Highway which could've just as easily been a Sonic stage in place of Mission Street. Knuckles and Rouge are kind of off doing their own things for the majority of the story while Shadow and Tails' stages don't actually have much, if any, narrative significance at all if you pay attention to the context around them. There's a lot of shoe-horning with these stages. I'm not gonna break down the entire story, so I'll just focus on the scenes surrounding Radical Highway. Shadow is standing on top of the bridge and the police are after him. Presumably, this is because he's just robbed the bank and stolen the chaos emerald. If he has the Emerald at this point, then surely he can just Chaos Control away, right? If he doesn't, why are the police after him and Sonic at this point? If they're after Shadow just because he escaped from Prison Island, surely they would know it's not Sonic they're after. If he dors have the Emerald, the only reason he would have to go back into the city would be to attack the military. But when he meets with Sonic, he insists he has "no time for games" and ends up warping aeay to evade the military anyway. Regardless, we're given no on-screen context for Shadow getting the Chaos Emerald. He just shows up with it at the end of Radical Highway when he encounters Sonic for the first time. An iconic cutscene for sure, but one that just doesn't make much sense the more you think about it from Shadow's perspective. And it's not just Radical Highway, either. The whole Route 280 and Sky Rail bit has no bearing on anything at all, and isn't even addressed on the Hero side of things. It's just Rouge and Shadow awkwardly floundering, trying to get the emerald from Tails. In the entire game, Shadow only gets three levels. He's also the only character that doesn't have a Desert or interior Ark level. I imagine the original idea was to have Sonic, Knuckles, and Eggman have their own stories like in SA1, but ultimately decided on the Hero and Dark story concept when they decided they wanted to make Tails playable. That said, I could certainly believe it if they planned to have the Last story secretly allow you to play as Shadow even in that early concept. These characters only being made playable later in development actually explains a lot about the awkward storytelling in the game.

[@GenreChowderStudios]

This has quickly become one of my favorite comfort videos. The humor, the well-thought out arguments, and the clear explanations are things I love a good balance of in these types of videos. Plus, I’m very attached to custom captions, so seeing them, including the way they capture changes in your cadence/emphasis, makes me very happy. Also, that ad transition was great.

[@bobbob1876]

For the double spring room with the large bombs, if you take the left spring, you can hover to the right one to avoid going back to the floor. For the Artificial Chaos, if you get close enough and wait just a moment, you can do a melee attack which pierces their defense! I'm not defending them or saying you should've known better before talking about them, just that it's an option. I think they're ridiculously hard to dodge too. Also! If you use cheats, you can play as Sonic in this level-- it's one of my favorites to do. You can get all the way to the end before getting stuck because Sonic can't shoot.

[@DarkKnightofHeaven]

still think they made the mechs with eggman in mind and then just slapped them onto tails so there'd be a mech in the dark and hero modes. Eggmans levels are fairly fun or at least thematically enjoyable and Tail's always feel more oppressive and awkward, like the levels are always forcing you to slowdown when you wouldn't need to otherwise or in this case just saying 'don't play the way you've been taught for most of the level'.

[@justinc.5591]

This is exactly what happened. The game was originally going to be just Sonic, Knuckles and Eggman, and then the other three characters were added late in development.

[@catcraze8673]

This could also explain why Final Chase is such an awkward final level.

[@islaamN]

Good morning and happy Ramadan Zoomzike! :] Every new SA2 video really makes my day better. You have such a happy and clean attitude that lights up the living room while I make breakfast with my parents, and Its like waking up on a cozy Saturday morning to see cartoons, even if it is just a Tuesday. :) ( 0 0 ) ANYWAY! Seeing you start off the video with "man screw Eternal Engine" really captures how I feel about some of the Space Colony Ark levels. :L Me, my older brother and my older sister have all died more times in that colony then we can count (God have mercy on me with Crazy Gadget). Well, have a good day Zoomzike and Godbless! Here's hoping SA3 out comes in all our lifetimes.

[@DrSalad-ye6hr]

♡Happy ramadan♡ :D

[@GlaceTheAce2222]

The music is the only thing that kept me sane through this stage.

[@lance2580]

I would love to see an analysis video of how Jade Creek from _Freedom Planet_ manages to make a water level fun! From the game's mechanics not taking away control while swimming, to how it introduces a rival character, to its color palette perfectly matching with Lilac as she performs an intricate prison breakout, Spacey Batotelli knows how to design a water level that does not frustrate the player at all!

[@zoomzike]

Haven't played Freedom Planet yet but it's on the backlog!

[@LainWithSweetTea]

​​​​@@zoomzikegenuinely great game and feels Like a proper love letter to genesis era and Treasure and Segas games while standing on its own merits. Cannot recommend enough!

[@lolAvalanche]

You don’t necessarily need to wait for the artificial chaos to emerge to kill them. You can also melee them.

[@VultureCultureDinty]

Wait, do people not speed through this level? I personally try to still shoot everything I can while playing it, I think it's a fun risk reward mechanic. This level is best imo if you're moving as fast as possible. This is probably my favorite Tails level so it's interesting to hear a different perspective

[@blueeyesmew]

I enjoy this level (my fave tails level too), and I think you've captured part of why. If you keep moving you can lock onto more things at once and also get out of harm's way before the dynamite packs explode.

[@isenokami7810]

Generally a good play philosophy anyway. Even if they’re objectively the slowest play style, the mechs are still capable of good speed, and like the other two styles, they feel best when you’re at that top speed pushing through everything. The mechs are much slower to turn than the other characters, but that’s only a real issue in the infamous Tails vs Eggman 2 fight. In the actual stages it barely if ever comes up.

[@Snakesrcool2003account]

i think this is the first time ive seen someone kill one of those artificial chaos as a mech without getting hit like i think that is the true achievement in this game

[@spindash64]

Should have been a steam achievement: “Imperfect Chaos”

[@zechariahcaraballo8765]

one strategy I know is instead of just skipping the rooms out right, target everything, tnt included, so when u get to the end u can safely destroy everything for some extra score

[@collinn9404]

The Raid Shadow Legends ad is the milestone we've all been waiting for

[@zoomzike]

YEAHHHHH

[@BigLadStudios]

I do think it can be a rather unforgiving and miserable time for first time players, and your point against the dynamite pack still stands but I think part of the challenge of this level is hitting the dynamite packs. Not only can the level be played in a way where you are mindful of shooting, but I can be a test of your movement skills and knowledge on how to get longer chains for better scores. I'll usually blast them when I'm past them or just get by as fast as I can, they aren't the be all and end all. Stuff like the hatch infront of the switch, I usually destroy em once I'm leaving the room. It's knowing when to shoot and after playing SA2 all these years, I'm quite fond of the level. It's certainly no Cosmic Wall, but I think there is something going on deeper that can make it fun. However, I don't think I've ever seen the fat bombs that GUN Beetle drops near the start and the secret Chao Route is embarrassing. A major mark against the stage since you should be able to get back to the stage no question and it could have easily been circumvented by having a switch under the 1-Up or something.

[@SpeedDeDe]

Eternal Engine is the definition of A G O N Y

[@Boooo]

honestly I never thought the exploding tubes or dynamite were supposed to not be shot, seeing them explode was satisfying to me and I didn't think of them as that much of a threat

[@CybeastID]

Lost Chao has a room which definitely helps sink that lesson in.

[@Boooo]

@@CybeastID fair but I dont think I went there on first plauthrough

[@johnwhitten2441]

This level was so difficult growing up that I learned all the tricks, traps, and flaws, and now I A rank the mission basically everytime

[@dip.918]

Glad to have you back! You and PatMac are the two creators that instantly make my day better when you upload, and these stupidly in-depth level analysis are awesome.

[@ambleeins_door]

Lemme guess the raid ad made your day slightly worse

[@dip.918]

@@ambleeins_door Actually, no. In fact, seeing a small creator I like getting paid for making good content made me even happier.

[@ambleeins_door]

@@dip.918 i think its just the fact raid isnt a good game, id love to see zoom support good games and not a game that puts more money into sponsors then itself!

[@AkameGaKillfan777]

​@@ambleeins_door Any game that preys on people and anyone who shills for them deserve the backlash they get.

[@JonnesusButArchive]

The fact that the video length matches the in-game level time displayed at the end is such a cool touch

[@ImanFate]

ngl eternal engine doesn't tell me to stop shooting. I like that i could die due to my recklessness. puts me on edge even more while trying to rack up points

[@YourContractHasExpired]

I dropped the game a few times because of this level as a child and the only reason I managed to beat it was because I asked a friend to clear this level for me, who was infinitely better than I am at this game. Honestly, that was such a high raise of required skillcap just to go through, and it being very long doesn't help either

[@GUNUFofficial]

Eternal Engine is a sick name for a train movie or book. I'm thinking of snowpiercer, aren't I

[@Pslamist]

Okay honestly, best Raid sponsorship transition I've ever seen. Very nice.

[@trgabrielgf]

I actually discovered that the real challenge of this level is about WHEN you fire off, rather than IF you fire off. If you target everything in a room and immediately fire off, it's gonna become pretty hard to cross, obviously. But if you target everything in a room while running to end of it, you can avoid all of the hazards and get HUGE point multipliers, which I think is fun. That factor doesn't make this level a favourite of mine, I actually still consider it the worst one in the game, but I've at least in found a way to enjoy it more in that way.

[@sergeizinovijev99]

You can actually kill the grounded artificial chaos with the mech's melee punch attack thing even if their head(?) isn't poking out. It's pretty easy to do but I don't think it's mentioned anywhere.

[@manjackson2772]

"Easy" is a strong word. You have to spam your homing shots at them to force them to keep their heads down as you approach, otherwise you get stabbed. And that's basically mandatory for Cannon's Core mission 2.

[@AkameGaKillfan777]

​@@manjackson2772 No you don't, just hold the lock-on until you get in front of them. For Cannon's Core, hold it until you get behind them.

[@MetaKaios]

@@manjackson2772 …And what could be easier than just mashing the B button while walking forwards? 🤨

[@luigi3276]

Honestly, I like the dynamite mechanic. The way I see it, you can either not shoot the dynamite and play it safe, or you can chain the dynamite with other enemies to rack up more points, but you’re at risk of dying.

[@JoshuaEisenbart]

I think the most frustrating thing about those dynamite packs isn't that you aren't supposed to shoot them. Making players choose their shots carefully is perfectly fine as far as I'm concerned. The problem is that shooting them is all but unavoidable since they are plastered on every available surface in rooms filled with enemies, even getting directly between you and them, and that the suction on the broken hatches is way too strong. It's not unrealistically strong, in fact it is weaker it would be IRL, but some of the rooms become entirely impassable if you blow up two or three hatches, especially with the mech's clunky movements, because the suction becomes inescapable if you get within a few feet of it. You can't even run past them because you have to run directly away from the hatches to avoid getting sucked into them. The devs should've toned down the suction so that it only became an instant kill if you stepped into the hole itself. Yeah, you could have the mech get pulled a little bit it if you got too close, but do NOT make that pull radius larger than the distance between the hatches in the walls and floor, which would make a hallway LITTERALLY IMPASSABLE if you blew them all up on accident.

[@Commander6444]

While it's not exactly Eternal Engine's biggest problem, I do think the level suffers a lot from a lack of atmosphere compared to the other space stages in the game. Eternal Engine doesn't have the cold isolation of Lost Colony, the futuristic thrills of Crazy Gadget, or the playful absurdity of Mad Space. If there were a stage that needed its gameplay to pick up the slack, it would be this one. _But alas._ Music still slaps, though.

[@kuklama0706]

Perhaps they were looking at Xen from HL1 which forces the player to unlearn everything he learned throughout the game and be careful instead?

[@KingdomHeartsBrawler]

I'm going to have to respectfully disagree. I like how challenging the level is and how it turns the Shooting rules on their head. Instead of just blindly shooting, you have to really think about what you're doing. It keeps you on your toes while serving as a nice contrast to all the blowing through enemy forces Robotnik's doing in Cosmic Wall.

[@CybeastID]

UNFORTUNATELY, if you pick up the Laser Blaster.

[@Vidiocity92]

"How did you know it's a bad level?" "Because you just TOLD me, ZoomZike!"

[@blackbloom8552]

I feel like the inconsistency of dinamite packs could have been solved by just having dinamite chain react with each other if they are close enough so that you could visibly understand that blowing up one pack in a room or bridge is going to blow up the whole thing.

[@obsidianknife427]

Congrats on the sponsorship, keep up the great work! :)

[@ambleeins_door]

Don't encourage more raid ads

[@alcatrazvongola]

I forgot how much PTSD this stage bought me as a kid. I replayed it so many times.

[@spritvio639]

This is my favorite mech stage.

[@BunstoppableForce]

Your level clear time always being the same as the video length is such a 10/10 A+ detail

[@brendantjeerdsma492]

Weirdly enough, this was the stage where it finally clicked how I wanted to play Mech Stages: focusing on combos and high score. This was the stage where I finally felt satisfied and enjoyed SA2. Yes none of the Sonic levels, but Tails's Final Level. I even spent like an hour or 2 restarting the level every time I died. Also I see the Dynamite yhat you're not supposed shoot, I saw as high risk, high reward. You'll extend your combo and get more points, while increasing you chance of dying.

[@sayronmix]

I love your SA2 level design analysis, pointing out both what you like and don't like about it! Hoping to see even more videos on it soon, it's my absolute favorite Sonic game (though I also have a lot of fond feelings for SA1).

[@Elwood7X]

5:32 I was waiting for someone to talk about this room specifically, talk about a jumpscare.

[@spindash64]

Yeah, EE makes it clear to those who weren’t aware that Tails was actually a later addition to the game than Eggman. While I understand the Mech Gameplay isn’t for everyone, Eggman’s levels tend to play into their strengths much more, focusing on giving you a massive number of targets to lock into at once, and generally keeping the cheap shots to a minimum

[@linkkicksu]

The strategy for artificial chaos isn't to wait and counterattack, it's to keep firing to prevent it from attacking while you get close and do that melee attack thing to instant kill it.

[@AkameGaKillfan777]

Or just keep the lock-on until you get close

[@justcallmexen]

So... the last parts of the stage is taking the ideas straight out of E-102's Hot Shelter finale.

[@MrMexx2]

Your clear time for the leve is the same as the video's length, that's a good touch.

[@anthonycoolasheck2724]

chao singing while raging needs to be a channel mainstay

[@solidifiedwatergatherer]

The dynamite packs are a risk vs reward mechanic, you can shoot them to add to your combos and risk potential death or play it safe or miss out on points. You aren't necessarily meant to just ignore them. This games level design is based around getting A ranks so "There's no reason to shoot them outside of score" isn't exactly a good point in my opinion because it goes against going for A ranks

[@solidifiedwatergatherer]

Also the chaos room it's incredibly unlikely you'll even get into it first run considering you need an upgrade you get in Eternal engine to even get the mystic melody, it's just super nit picky and barely a problem

[@zoomzike]

I come at these from the perspective of a first-time player and how the game teaches them and expends upon mechanics. Every person I've watched play this game in-person and on blind playthroughs does not care too much about getting A Ranks and are simply trying to clear the stage to progress the story. For these majority of players, there is little incentive for them to shoot, and they're better off not shooting anything so that they don't get hurt. The Chaos room is a Mystic Melody path so you'll see it on your second go-around, but it's meant to show how the devs didn't design this level with consistency in mind for their main mechanic, the dynamite packs.

[@solidifiedwatergatherer]

@@zoomzike That is 100% fair! Though I feel you could have made the mystic melody thing a bit more clear. And you do make fair points in the enemies in this stage being pretty annoying to deal with.

[@Asakedia]

this video was so enjoyable I was ready for a 2h sit-through. just made myself very comfortable at the 11 minute mark to see it end quickly xD great job, I rarely love videos this much!

[@Kurayamiblack]

I really appreciate that the level was beaten with 12min-14sec on the clear time and the video length also happens to be 12min-14sec

[@themissingbits6375]

“Eternal Engine is fine, you just suck at it” - The Missing Bits

[@Jojothejman]

ngl, weapons bed just makes me feel like I'm doing chores. There's TOO much shit to shoot at. I appreciated Eternal engine alot more than other mech levels because you get to choose for extra challenge in exchange for extra points, making the level harder only when you're going for the A rank. Hell, with proper timing you can even avoid stuff while still destroying it, which feels rewarding.

[@MechanistGamma]

The funny thing about that opening narration is that Eternal Engine is the level that made me quit playing Sonic Adventure 2 permanently when I was younger. I had to wait until I got control improvement mods for the PC version lol - my GameCube version of SA2 lies incomplete still.

[@lamenwatch1877]

11:01 You didn't do anything fancy, yet this piece of editing is brilliant!

[@darknight1220]

Idk I always enjoyed eternal engine as a tails level, i think it added challenge and strategy to trying to farm points, stay safe, and move fast all at once but i get where youre coming from

[@Guardian-of-Light137]

I'd love to see you cover eggman's lost colony level or whatever it's called. Where you have to blast enemies to turn on the lights.

[@JasLamArr91]

I tolerated this stage. The one thing that made it bearable was the music.

[@TrueStopwatch]

It's such a shame that this level ended up being so frustrating, because it does have some fun moments, and some interesting ideas that were just executed sloppily and inconsistently. Honestly, it almost feels rushed - like it was one of the last levels in development and they had to quickly wrap it up and slap everything together before the game shipped.

[@anjoliebarrios8906]

the omochao that gets sucked into space over and over again... my beloved

[@pubcle]

I don't mind the mech sections nearly as much as I hated the gem searches which I found earnestly boring every time, but I did forget about this being annoying.

[@Neogears1312]

I think you’re misunderstanding the point of the dynamite. It’s not “don’t shoot stuff” it’s adding a risk vs reward. They offer huge combo opportunities for your score at the cost of risking it all from making it too hard for you.

[@zoomzike]

First time players don't prioritize score when playing through this level, they're just trying to clear it. If you look at blind playthroughs of this game they often don't really care much about getting a bunch of combos like veteran players do.

[@Neogears1312]

@@zoomzike true. But as a kid, I just ignored them. Once you try getting A ranks you start realizing how useful it is. It’s definitely frustrating, though I think the enemy placement is usually the problem with eternal engine more than anything.

[@adambriton5394]

Oh god I'd forgot what a stupid level this was but it's all coming back

[@pikminman13]

the definition of "i can tolerate anything if the music is good"

[@chelleshocked8666]

I LOVE the music in this level. I just wish playing this stage wasn't so painful 😅

[@hijster479]

I'd still argue this is Tails' best stage. Pretty much everything it does "wrong" from the camera to the enemy placements, and even the fact that it's hard to get back to the main route from the lost chao is an issue in other stages, other stages with less interesting gimmicks. Weapons Bed for example has most of these issues, and the only real gimmick is that the stage is full of sitting ducks so you can easily rack up score. Not saying this to knock Weapons bed, Tails' stages generally have better gunplay while Eggman's have better platforming. So giving Tails a stage that throws a wrench into the lock-on loop makes a lot of sense and works well in a vacuum. The real issue is the difficulty spike. Most of us played the hero story first, and Tails really only has 4 stages, so the difficulty curve is broken. Again this is a problem with the game on the whole, Security Hall is in a similar boat. It's Rouges next to last stage, but it's placed before Shadows second, and after you've had several stages to warm up to Eggman. Most people already find Security Hall frustrating, imagine if it was the third hunting stage you ever played? It's certainly not as good as Cosmic Wall but I still think it barely falls into the better half of mech stages.

[@BobPeterson628]

I think this mech level is amazing. All throughout the game, you could just cheese the mech levels by firing nonstop, since there is no limit on shooting. So this final Tails level tests the player by punishing you for blindly shooting. So you need to be more cautious and cerebral in your approach to the level, in the way that Tails himself would. There are surprises and subversion around every turn, and you learn to distrust any pack of dynamite as unpredictable. You need to go slower or maneuver the level with less shooting, since each shot could spell danger. And all the while, the level remains cinematic, such as the camera angle at the top of the pulley, or the final showdown with the titular eternal engine (adding in-level narrative weight to the context of the stage).

[@Sneavile]

I think you understate how important score is to the overall enjoyment of the mech levels. Most of the rooms you talk about CAN be walked through without shooting, but the whole point of most of the obstacles in the stage is the risk/reward of getting a larger combo bonus by shooting more dynamite packs, while making the stage more dangerous in the process. I do agree that some enemy placements are pretty questionable though, and the standing artificial chaos aren't very fun to fight.

[@GetThatGlitchBandit]

I weirdly hate this level but found it fun to A rank for some reason. There has been countless times that I fallen through those holes because I was rushing through trying to get the big combos, but honestly the most memorable part of the whole stage for me is watching that one Omochao get constantly sucked into space and respawning. That definitely amused little kid me.

[@DataDigi151]

I do get the issues with Eternal Engine for newer/lower skilled players but I always loved Eternal Engine. It’s my favorite mech stage with my favorite mech character. Being able to target everything in a room, run by while holding the lock-on, then firing once you’re in a safe distance feels fast and rewards you with those usually missed out points for the A rank. I even love trying to challenge myself by shooting the bombs near that one grapple with death below it or near the switch in that one small room. I never understood why Eggman’s levels are more loved (other than he was the original mech character). I loathe Weapons Bed and Cosmic Wall for being those levels that desire really high scores for A ranks as well as being slow and frustrating. I mean, Cosmic Wall is 8 minutes long! It over-stays its welcome for a good third of the level.

[@faedragonlucy]

I'm still an avid fan of this level now that I'm good at playing it, but I do appreciate that you brought up the fact that the enemy-filled, winding path section was much more enjoyable than the dynamite packs sections. I genuinely don't mind a difficult level that straddles the line between fun and tedious, and Eternal Engine COULD have been just that with a few tweaks. I feel as though this level's theme and gameplay represents Miles's kinder, method-driven mindset quite well, forcing the player to balance the risks and make your way to the goal with surgical precision. Juxtapose this to Robotnik's version where his cruel, results-driven mindset is at play as he obliterates everything in sight as he forces his way through to his goal.

[@faedragonlucy]

Also, fun fact: The Artificial Chaos can be "easily" dealt with with the mech's "melee" attack, as it ignores the deflection property of the enemy. Another fun fact? There's a gust of wind in the pit right before the goal ring (like the gusts that save you in Pumpkin Hill), just in case you fall. I only just recently discovered this and I've been playing SA2B since I was five.

[@Lazyboy0337]

I love this level, yet also totally agree with the flaws, I never considered the "hidden chao path in normal objective" point, but that is a serious blunder.

[@solidifiedwatergatherer]

You need the upgrade you get in Eternal Engine to access the mystic melody so it isn't exactly a serious blunder unless you go out of your way to specifically pick that path by exiting eternal engine, picking Hidden Base, going to get the mystic melody and then coming back to Eternal Engine just to pick that path

[@thejonbrownshow8470]

5:32 ... I low key thought for a second sonic adventure 2 is having a chaos themed suicide bomber enemy for a second 😅

[@TehGamingMasta]

You don't have to wait for artificial chaos to reveal itself, if you walk up to it and use the close range attack it kills it instantly. Not exactly the most well communicated strategy or the smoothest one but hey, it works

[@TehGamingMasta]

also, I personally always shoot the dynamite because it provides more lock on targets to increase my score, lol

[@notcorrect]

I think what you are supposed to do is target everything in the room and let go when you are just about to leave the room. I mostly like this level because you have to be precise with your shots while Eggman's level wants you to rack up the high scores. I also like the need to wait for artificial chaos to attack before shooting it.

[@HOTD108_]

If the upcoming Sonic Frontiers DLC doesn't add this stage as a cyberspace level then what's the point?

[@CrazyCyranYT]

I have a tip for defeating the Artificial Chaos. Keep shooting until you find a weak point and go closer to it as shooting will possibly evade its attacks

[@beaniedude16]

I’m not even joking with you, this stage almost made me go into insanity

[@mackthisarrowhearth295]

I think if they made it not instant death, most would have been resolved, and other interesting uses, like actually using dynamite to destroy enemies as combo score or whatever

[@Oath_Of_The_Ancients]

getting an a rank on eternal engine mission 5 is actually the worst experience in sa2

[@alescano3504]

I had flashbacks of getting all the A ranks in this stage. Painful memory

[@PhantomAarantula]

I've never been so happy to see someone do a Raid: Shadow Legends ad read before now. Happy for you, ZoomZike.

[@captaincrete3433]

Honestly, the dynamite is a fun risk reward scenario. You can either, not shoot the dynamite and lose out on points but have a safe path or you could take the points in exchange for harder platformimg. I like the rooms too because once you memorize the optimal aim order you can rack up MASSIVE score

[@BahGawdHass]

When I finally got all Five A ranks in Eternal Engine, I swore to never play that stage again. Happy to say I've kept my word years later.

[@CeruleanHee-ho]

You know, I actually find it quite interesting how the video's length ended up being equal to the amount of time he took to finish the stage itself in the video.

[@cc_5576]

"Eternal Engine is Actually Sick, You're Just Bad" All jokes aside I never realized how many people hated this level. I got an A rank first try I thought it was super easy for a late game level. (Not trying to flex, I sucked at every other Tails level. Eternal Engine was just the first A rank I got)

[@TophDaGreat]

Yea but the OST slaps at least

[@mushroomdude123]

I remember the first time I saw the artificial chaos, I was so scared that I had to get my older sister to help.

[@tikkelbikkel]

Love how he cleared the level in 12 minutes and 14 seconds, and that also being the length of the video. Lovely little detail, surely I'm not the only one who noticed

[@whybother5741]

Eternal engine is eternally enraging everyone everywhere, ZoomZike in particular.

[@catcraze8673]

The entire level feels like walking on eggshells. Honestly though the music carries the level hard.

[@captainhydrodus4616]

I had a fun glitch happen in the tails section with the airlocks where i mansged to fumble my way back in only to be rewarded with a game over for just tapping the death zone without fully flying out

[@doctorchaos4436]

Lowkey, this kinda gives me a new appreciation for Eternal Engine. That's not to say it's without jank. It's sort of like that video he did on Radical Highway. This is Tails' final level. What is it that it's repeatedly punishing you for? Reckless aggression. Compare that with something like Cosmic Wall, a level that pretty much encourages you to blast everything like a madman. But Tails isn't Eggman. This level wants you to be careful with your shots and if you play it like an ordinary shooting level, you'll make things much harder on yourself. The path to the Lost Chao is a perfect example of that. You have the Artificial Chaos, the dynamite, the hatches and an UNLOCKED door. There's no need to attack them (and what's more, since Lost Chao missions are graded strictly on your time, engaging them would be completely pointless.) The nearly ever-present dynamite is a constant reminder that you can't blast away all willy-nilly, until you get to the end. To bring up Cosmic Wall again, since both levels lock their characters in place at certain moments, when it happens there, it's to let Eggman blast away at everything in sight while zipping around like a roller coaster, but in Eternal Engine, it's to keep Tails locked on his target.

[@BPBludgeon]

The only thing I can say in favour of this level is the stark contrast between Tails' and Eggman's final levels. Tails has everything against him, from the terrain to the hordes of enemies. The ARK is unfamiliar to him, it's incredibly claustrophobic and he's out of control when in low gravity. Despite that, he persists to the end. Eggman however is completely in his element. He can control himself in low-gravity, he has plenty of space to move about and he has advantage over the robots and Artificial Chaos.