Dyno testing custom velocity stacks on 20v 4age Engine spec in this video: Blacktop 20v 4age Mild inlet port and chamber tidy up. Link ecu Modified 2-1 section / front pipe Rest 100% stock
Пікірлер: 138
@negativeindustrial3 жыл бұрын
That looks like a solid 150hp with a beautiful curve. Nice work, man.
@kelvinpoon9969 Жыл бұрын
what i know 4ag have 145hp
@Red1996Bull10 ай бұрын
@@kelvinpoon9969 depends on the revision
@jdoe95183 жыл бұрын
The point of most interest is Toyota knew what they were doing. It's hard work making gains on something that's good out of the box
@Rifaatmoses3 жыл бұрын
Really love the content and the fact that you reply to most of the comments 🤗
@ossiebalboa56173 жыл бұрын
My favourite dyno tuning channel by far. Thanks for all your efforts. Here is an idea, water injection!
@TheNight-Rider3 жыл бұрын
Really interesting. Keep the 20v content coming plz =)
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
What else would you like to see? pretty limited what i can do with the car in vid as is my daily hack. But maybe able to do a quick follow up vid testing the exhaust parts, on a guys car that has pon cam's. he lost quite a bit of midrange, I think the pipe should gain it back
@TheNight-Rider3 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age The way you usually test and research mods to find the optimum combination is really good. As you say, I'd also be interested in seeing a blacktop with Pon cams, header, exhaust and intake trumpets after a good tune to see what power it makes and how the torque curve looks. Ultimately it'd be super cool to see the blacktop brought up to the same state of tune as your 16v and then compare the two on a more equal basis. But since I'm not a financial backer I totally understand if that's not feasible haha.
@quadeye863 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age would love to see this!
@SidewaysGts3 жыл бұрын
Finally some 20v! Having a 20v myself, I cant wait to see where this goes.
@davidcakers68183 жыл бұрын
Great video, can't wait to see what's next
@user-zl1jv2zv6r2 жыл бұрын
it's a pity that we live in different countries, you are damn cool! it would be nice to work with you. there is a huge job behind each video, I bow to you for it! many people do not share their experience, because of the money and time spent, all that is interesting to them is the monetization of their work. you share your work for free. with great respect, greetings from Russia
@Garage4age2 жыл бұрын
Thanks!
@rleo0153 жыл бұрын
Great content as always man. Keep up the good work!
@shahengovindpershad85993 жыл бұрын
Awesome 20v content please keep it coming!!!!!
@rollyae823 жыл бұрын
The amount of research and work you have done is commendable! I love cars yet have had new ones for sooo long, yet was just given a AE82 in immaculate condition. yet where to get a blacktop 4age motor for it without paying 3 times the car value lol... so alas it has a perfectly running 4AC ... maybe better to keep the car completely stock and immaculate.. we shall see..
@seanhutton71553 жыл бұрын
Bro you should make up some velocity stacks exactly like your design that fits in the oem box,the only other option on the market atm is the very short ones from sq engineering,(which they never have in stock) and I personally do not like the idea of these myself as length is the key like the dyno proves. I always thought of like a billet / metal copy of original rubber ones with a bit of an extention and better bell mouth would be the way to go. If you do decide to make some i would definitely put my name down for a set.
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Thinking about making some to sell. just got a couple of issues need to figure out. first one being cost, as the materials and amount to time required to make them isn't cheap. next need to see if can making them in a single piece. As they are are at a length, where the engine harmonics will make them "ring" and vibrate themselves to bits. hence the factory ones being made from rubbery plastic. and one of the reasons i put the silicone joiner on the test items. Yeah those short straight ones are horrible, better off with factory ones
@seanhutton71553 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age, Thanks for the reply, i always wondered why Toyota used that rubber/plastic one,s always thought it was for sound and cost reasons but never thought about engine harmonics. very interesting. I have subscribed ,will keep an eye out for your content ,cheers
@damiann85303 жыл бұрын
Interesting gains, from just intake and exhaust mods, what was the final length of the new trumpets?
@JesseSpec3 жыл бұрын
Awsome video mate! I’ll be making a similar video on my Dynapack dyno next week. Its incredible what can be done with minor mods. I’ll be using the GT86 BRZ platform to compare some similar mods
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Thanks. sounds interesting, will check it out
@davidalbaramada71603 жыл бұрын
Love this channel. Regards from Spain
@TRDKhanbrothers3 жыл бұрын
Niiice bro, loving this channel as always
@kawaiirunnersdriftclub3 жыл бұрын
Awesome! I wish I could have a dyno at home xD
@maikelgarcia843 жыл бұрын
Good work thanks for the content
@MotoresAspirados3 жыл бұрын
All motor is Life :}
@Doogleraia3 жыл бұрын
So it seems to have great effect from less exhaust restrictions and generally a decent improvement from airspeed over air-volume. Wonder if headers with less low-radius bends would do the same for restriction-reduction as less bends in rear-sections tend to. Great video as always
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
There is probably a little bit in the headers if play with the lengths. the pipe sizes are pretty much right diameter wise on the factory ones. unlike a lot of the aftermarket ones which increase the primary size.
@Doogleraia3 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age might be able to use the venturi effect (or bernoulli principle) to get faster port evacuation rather than just doing straight up-sizing the diameter like so many aftermarket solutions do. Basically an inversion of the trumpets of the intake-side
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
@@Doogleraia Yeah thats kinda the idea behind the pipes i built in previous video. hence why it doesnt work so well when put a little exhaust after them. I added a downsized section out of the port on my latest headers for my 16v engines. But i need to get the good engine back in to find out if its too small or can go even smaller before going any further with it. I know for sure i cant just step up pipe sizes from where im at without loosing a stack of bottom end.
@Doogleraia3 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age could possibly do it if you do a port split into two pipes from the oval section, then merge them into one larger pipe THEN the venturi effect part over to the big merging chamber for all the pipes.. but so much work to get the lengths right and basically would require an engine dyno to figure out what lengths are needed for it to work. Possible "simple" solution for more low end, might be to do one of the exhausts with those chambers behind where the pipe exits into a larger area (the name for it escapes me at the moment), or use long X-pipe sections prior to the big chamber to get the venturi effect akin to how carbs pull out fuel, just sucking a vacuum in the other pipe alternating between them.. so there is effectively suction as the valve opens. So many things that could be tested, but have seen it before that folks do x-pipes on the header-pipes in rally cars to "skirt the rules". Never knew if it really worked or not, but I guess it's in the same uncertainty-category as with roller-barrel throttle ITB's vs traditional butterfly valve ITB's
@geraldbuys98532 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age We found some power (4-5kw) in the headers. Can't remember the sizes (this was 10 years ago). And another 5kw in a mild cam upgrade, still with stock timing and VVT. I did nowhere near the level of development you've done though.
@DG-ox6bg3 жыл бұрын
Do you tune the car between each run? Or this a straight power run from mods alone?
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
AFR tuned if needed. I usually do a quick pull without the dyno logging the power, before the runs you see in video. to check and fix afr if required and to stabilize the temps
@JeredN1nja3 ай бұрын
Some people in Barbados turn the stock trumpets upside down
@jezz4khd7853 жыл бұрын
It's all about getting as much air in and out.
@thomascaseyhart41033 жыл бұрын
Awsume content u should get a 3sge altezza and see what na ganse u can get with it as well love the 4age stuff to keep it coming
@jamest.50012 жыл бұрын
I would build a spacer for the plenum, 1" to 2" or so, then make some short trumpets, large diameter as possible, but short, maybe 1.5" long, maybe make a larger inlet for the plenum, 4"+ or just leave the plenum off, short runners supposed to give more top end power, longer, more low eng TQ, maybe put a tiny nitrous kit on it, just enough for charge cooling, inject it in the top of the trumpets, maybe as small as a 20hp shot, but depends on what you are looking for, maybe long runners with a arching elbow to a trumpet, with a opening or butterfly in the elbow, with trumpet, and a means of opening the runner at the elbow , for a short runner when a Dyno determined rpm is reached, if the short runner makes more power, but I think cutting the head, and cams would show more gains,
@Garage4age2 жыл бұрын
Have modified the plenum. may make a video of it at some stage. Shorter runners will make less power almost everywhere
@Skirk84 Жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age What was the total length of the new trumpets once you cut them down 20mm? Are they bigger diameter than the stock rubber ones? should I cut the rubber ones a bit shorter?
@Garage4age Жыл бұрын
@@Skirk84 the silver section tapers out a bit. so yeh are a bit bigger diameter. they are longer than stock. cant remember the actual length though. dont cut the factory ones down. you could maybe cut and extend them though
@anomamos90953 жыл бұрын
Pork and Ferrari have been at this for years and so have the big Bike makers Pork has tuned for the pulse effect and Ferrari have used twin runner lengths with a butterfly system and the bikes usually go for the top end as most bike engines don't have much torque down low to bother with
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Yeah nothing new here. Seems to be lost in the aftermarket car world to a point though. Lots of short runner stuff out there. In saying that, fitment is usually a pretty big issue. Is a bit of a challenge to make something cost effective, that fits, doesn't vibrate itself to bits and also works
@anomamos90953 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age . For your next tests you should look at the ram air effect. I know that this will be difficult on a stationary dyno. You would probably need to rig up three or four good leaf blowers on a switch to come on at the rpm equivalent of road speed. You would also need to do a poormans wind tunnel test to find where the best pressure point on the vehicle is to place the scoop.
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
@@anomamos9095 when i researched it awhile back. there is very little pressure to be had, unless going really fast. from memory at 100kph it was under 0.1psi. which is what i almost created with my dyno fan here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fKikiaykobVsn5Y
@anomamos90953 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age interesting attempt 👍 Aerodynamics don’t start to be effective until a vehicle exceeds about sixty kilometres per hour and unless you’re going over 120 a rear wing is mostly just decorative. I don’t know how good your dyno fans are at creating boost pressure but I’m sure they aren’t as good as actual driving above 60kph. Try making that cone fit in beside the radiator and fit a boost gauge before the throttle and go for a spin and see what you get at the various legal speeds?
@marceloho19842 жыл бұрын
Just like the V8 from GM for the Corvette.
@abubakrhartley9593 жыл бұрын
sounds so good
@silversups882 жыл бұрын
Please, Please testing more on the 20V bt ......
@renz10133 жыл бұрын
I've always wondered what these type of intake are called
@natelsx2 жыл бұрын
Great content.
@jeremygyles34923 жыл бұрын
Can't believe you didn't do a run with the trumpets bolted on upside down. Purely for the noise of course.
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
haha. It did have a pretty aggressive bark to it with the new trumpets at high rpm. mic didnt really pick it up so well though
@MJBOGAN2 жыл бұрын
The real gains come from moving your butterfly and playing with the total length of the system. Trumpet design is about 3 percent at best either way.
@decmac36983 ай бұрын
Want to put trumpets.inside my silvertop 20v airbox any recommendations
@TotoGeenen3 жыл бұрын
Did you adjust anything in the map? Or did you make these gains with just the physical mod?
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Just fixed the afr. no other changes
@TotoGeenen3 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age I see. Thank you!
@dilsher123 жыл бұрын
Wish you did some 13b rotary testing as well
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
I would like to also, but don't have that much money haha.
@dilsher123 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age I know I heard rotaries are expensive down under , still relatively cheap here in North America , can pick up a 6 port N/A block for under $500-1000 .
@tiitsaul90363 жыл бұрын
Interesting. Small gains added up makes a big difference. Did any of these mods require re tune?
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
its running an alpha n tune, so any changes usually require a tidy up. pretty much the % power increase, is how much % more fuel it needed
@misterlith3 жыл бұрын
Awesome work man. Is this all stock ECU?
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Has aftermarket ecu. All my recent vids have a mod list in the description. May get away with these changes on stock ecu since it has some compensation with the map sensor. but would probably be far from ideal afr wise
@misterlith3 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age Ahh I'm a dummy. I could swear I'd checked recently for that. Cheers
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
@@misterlith Haha all good, someone would ask for engine spec in pretty much every vid. so started putting in description. the older vids dont have it. esp not my good engine, because secret haha
@1magnit3 жыл бұрын
I've never understood WHY people dyno a car with the bonnet open when you drive it with the bonnet closed. How about doing a test showing the differences when you've got an aftermarket pod filter then again when you've got a proper factory airbox? That's bonnet open vs bonnet closed.
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Yes, in some cases. but here want to see where the gains/losses are coming from, without the iat's screwing up the results. for example, if i had of shut the bonnet and the iat's skyrocketed up with the open trumpets, it would have made less power than with the airbox on. but then we wouldn't know the airbox is actually a restriction.
@1magnit3 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age Yes but that's the whole point isn't it?
@1magnit3 жыл бұрын
A dyno is supposed to duplicate road conditions but when testing with the bonnet open to get cold air, it doesn't work the same.
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
I think you are missing the point. Everyone knows hot air makes less power. I'm not testing that here. I'm testing the intake itself. Changing the air temperature as well would be bad science as since would be changing more than one thing at a time.
@1magnit3 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age I know what you're saying but it's a new car to the dyno. Don't you think the very first test should be bonnet open vs bonnet closed to give a good baseline. Then repeat with factory airbox vs cone filter or other filter that doesn't get cold air like stock.
@jeffhurckes1902 жыл бұрын
Is that torque value correct? 400Nm is like 300 Ft Lbs. That's a hell of a lot for an N/A 4 cylinder.
@Garage4age2 жыл бұрын
Its torque at the wheels
@superkonek78083 жыл бұрын
it just need COLD AIR for maximum HP's gain..... your each airbox setup...is the same place.. the best gains, it has to direct COLD AIR
@javonyearwood68853 жыл бұрын
Next time turn them up instead of down works better that way n put air temp sensors closer to intake stack better reading for stock computer
@TakosawaRacing2 жыл бұрын
I'm just focusing my question on the airbox and plenum. Does the airbox rob-off some power potential? Will removing the airbox alone give more power potential? (All others parts still factory)
@Garage4age2 жыл бұрын
Have a look at this vid. is a follow up of this one kzbin.info/www/bejne/m3mYiWilp7RlZ7M removing the lot will make more power. But likely will loose all that power with bonnet shut due to hot air
@zpe12002 жыл бұрын
I did the same with my bz touring but no numbers but my foot was telling me about 5hp extra from running no airbox.
@hojnikb3 жыл бұрын
Dumb question; would a velocity stack help with a 2 stroke carbed engine? I know doing resonated exhaust proper porting gives you the biggest gains, but what about on the intake side like velocity stacks?
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Cant say i've done anything on 2 strokes. but dont see why not. If using reflected wave tuning. the pipe would be half the length as a 4 stroke. since intake event taking place twice in the time of the 4 strokes 1 event.
@danielprado11193 жыл бұрын
Video plis velocity stack 100mm . Excelent work
@MrP3can3 жыл бұрын
do we have some real torque readings, that matters a lot as well than power at wheels...
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Its a 1.6L, it doesn't make any. but end of the day its just a calculation from power and rpm. if makes more power at specific rpm its also making more torque. Peak torque would be about 155nm @ 5200rpm. to get back to actual engine torque need to add the driveline loss, call it 10% and would be 170nm. The torque curve is correct in the graphs btw,
@TheSol1152 жыл бұрын
🚀🚀🚀
@anonimus46393 жыл бұрын
I think your oem airbox too small for this engine.When you open it,you gain power,but on the street open airbox dont work,because hot engine bay air.If you can,make one carton paper,or so airbox (3-4x volume the oem one) above the engine(just for the dyno) and bend the trumpet in this way.Make a intake from front ventillator to airbox,and done.(system like the sportbikes.) In the past,ve make a fiberglass or carbon airbox for sportbikes under gas tank,use all place we can,expand the volume of airbox to 2-2,5X from oem..gain 10-15 mid hp,and 8-10 top on the 150-160hp 1 liter engine.try it
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Hey. Yeah i was planning on getting another factory box and modifying it. So has more volume and better and bigger feed into it.
@BoogalooShrymp2 жыл бұрын
On a stock blacktop with stock ecu, are there any gains to be had from an adjustable exhaust cam pulley with advancing it's timing?
@Garage4age2 жыл бұрын
Haven't tried it myself. but not likely, if so will be very minimal.
@mattk94383 жыл бұрын
Please can u do an anti reversion chamber in the header to see if there are any benefits?
@Dane337813 жыл бұрын
Or AR cones
@Kj16V2 жыл бұрын
Oof, I always have to pause to convert from kW into Ungabunga units.
@Yulla_mx53 жыл бұрын
I’m colorblind I can’t tell what had the most power gains combo 😂
@kelvinpoon9969 Жыл бұрын
u means got intake box will more powers?
@Yenbeats2 ай бұрын
It seems the stock trumpets vs no trumpets didn’t make much of a difference . wonder why they exist lol
@Garage4age2 ай бұрын
I didn't run it with the trumpets removed. only the intake tube removed and the plenum lid removed. would lose a decent amount of power removing trumpets
@gavinivers89413 жыл бұрын
There is someone on here doing similar work but he tried with straight trumpets ( no 90 deg bend ) Would that make a difference?
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
depends how sharp the bend is. if its sharp will start to loose power, long radius wont really lose anything over straight pipe. I used the longest radius i could fit in the airbox, as dont intend to run them open at all. I cant say if im at the point they are too sharp or not. as have only tested the extremes, sharp cast 90 vs long radius. these are somewhere inbetween. much better than factory though. anything straight that fits in airbox is too short.
@beernakedchokes27483 жыл бұрын
Would you share your redesigned front pipe dimensions so I can fabricate my own?
@asimjavedhv96423 жыл бұрын
I need 4Age 20v twin cam blacktop engine complete with company auto transmission gear and complete wiring any link website or anyone have
@nmchannel7153 жыл бұрын
Nice
@ryanjess51113 жыл бұрын
This makes me nervous... I've just bought some el cheapo 70mm trumpets for a laugh (MRP or SQ Eng 100mm are the end goal with a proper airbox) but I'm now starting to wonder just how much they'll change the power delivery and torque... Especially mid range.
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Yeah you will likely find you are better off with the stock ones than 70's. Even the 100's are too short, but maybe a little better than stock due to being a better shape and getting close to their length.
@ryanjess51113 жыл бұрын
Well, fitted them today, mid is a little flat but not by much, it feels a lot more lively up top although that could just be placebo. Sounds great! 🤣
@2dcutout2 жыл бұрын
@@ryanjess5111 I've got the opposite, I've got 100mm SQ ones with a Pipercross filter and it feels a bit dead up top, I'm about to swap back to the stock intake to compare but I swear it used to pull through the rev range faster and feel better up top.
@Dane337813 жыл бұрын
I respect what you're doing but why go through all this for such tiny amounts of power? Have you ever thought about an LS V8? If you won't have an LS why not try a k series Honda or a gm ecotec. If you payed for shipping and promised to modify the hell out of it I would send you an aluminum 5.3 or ecotec combination for free. I like what you're doing and would enjoy supporting your efforts. I just became the proud owner of a 4 axis CNC and I am all about trying crazy combinations. Let me know how I can help.
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Same stuff applys. Remember Its only a 1.6L. If look at the changes as a percentage, then apply that to the bigger engines. On a 6L LS It would be 22kw or 30hp from just changing a couple of bits of pipe, still using factory exhaust and airbox. I know I would probably have a wider audience if used a LS or K series. but kinda the same reason i don't. everyone does them. Thanks for the kind offer though.
@ryanjess51113 жыл бұрын
Not everyone wants nor likes V8s. Why would anyone go through the hell of trying to LS and RWD swap a Corolla?
@Dane337813 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age Thanks for the reply. I understand all that and I see where you're coming from. Just the same though, if there's anything I can machine for you that doesn't exist currently I would love to be able to help. I wish there were more people like you modifying LS engines. There's way too much follow the leader in this camp.
@Dane337813 жыл бұрын
@@ryanjess5111 One man's hell is another's good time. Not all LS V8s are rwd and not all corollas are fwd.
@ajboehmer96083 жыл бұрын
What's going on the 4afe 16v makes that much horsepower and more torque stock.
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
you realize its kw at wheels? Highest rating on 4afe i could find is 85kw or 114hp at the engine. on the unrestricted run this made 112kw or 150hp at wheels, if add 10% drive line loss thats 123kw or 165hp at engine
@tiitsaul90363 жыл бұрын
Is it your car? How does 12kw gain feel like on the street?
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Yeah my daily junker. I haven't driven it on the road with exhaust off.. but with the airbox and exhaust back on, it definitely feels stronger and less asthmatic from 5k onwards. I really wanted those gains from 4k onwards, but yeah little exhaust spoiling the fun
@jacksonbermingham21683 жыл бұрын
to be had the exhaust ruined this test .. i think original custom leanght trumpets need to be retested because it could have been.. hitting the exhaust restriction earlier showing that drop off
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Trimmed 20mm would still be best. esp if running the stock airbox which is what they were designed to do. They didn't drop any bottom end over the full length and peak power was a little higher. the total length of the -20mm lines up with the length my 16v engines like. -40mm was def too short
@zac23843 жыл бұрын
why is there a dip just before 6000 rpm?
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
In which graph?
@zac23843 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age idk I was tired when I commented that, maybe the graph at 3:30?
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
@@zac2384 You will find mr toyota spent a bit of time on the intake system to get a nice smooth power curve.(then screwed it up with a crappy ecu controlling it haha) as can been seen in the first graph with the stock intake system. when start messing with lengths of things and in this case taking the factory airbox off, will quite often end up with little peaks and dips here and there. can seen a good example of it when take the factory intake tube off in the 2nd run. a little bump appears. it is likely the little resonator tube on the intake tube used to smooth this out
@zac23843 жыл бұрын
@@Garage4age appreciate the answer
@jacksonbermingham21683 жыл бұрын
maybe your first lenght was good but exhaust helld it back
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
Yeah definitely isn't helping. but going by what my 16v's like, the original was a little long and kinda showed up with the same trend when to long on them. the no exhaust run was done with 40mm cut down. It should have been a touch better on the 20mm cut down. bit bigger bellmouths would help a little too. but mr aliexpress sent the wrong ones
@dylananderson74733 жыл бұрын
Whats the rev limit? Put it up i say
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
8300rpm ish. engine not up to any more. would need upgraded rod bolts at least and probably valve springs.
@ricepony333 жыл бұрын
Ever consider doing a progressive nitrous system, 30 shot that starts at 10 and goes up?
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
We all know the results already!
@lasi853 жыл бұрын
My 20V dyno tested! kzbin.info/www/bejne/bauZm4moprKfaKs
@Garage4age3 жыл бұрын
nice ae86!
@Josh-ce9sv3 жыл бұрын
I'd like to see the results if you made a set of dual stack like many motorcycles are doing now- kzbin.info/www/bejne/g2PMdKyJhsSDbtU