3 clues to spot a NICE narcissist in conversation

[@meadowdevor]

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[@Sweetpea1128]

I had a female boss who was majorly complimentary, gave gifts to me freely, gave me opportunities and included me extensively. I was her favorite UNTIL she asked me to do something against policy as well as illegal (nurses). When I refused and reported her, the tables turned and I was her enemy. She tried to destroy me, but I just kept telling the truth. One of my superiors was doing the investigation and found where this boss had forged my name. That plus the records that were kept in the system normally, literally set me free. Beware grooming being disguised and friendliness and favor.

[@danieltenebrion9413]

Such a good thing to point out, and I love that you named it grooming, as that is the kind of behavior it was. People don't commonly realize that grooming happens even in adulthood and that we should be very careful about those that try to develop secret personal bonds with us or shower us with praise and gifts. I have had my own indirect trauma with this kind of thing happening to an ex partner.

[@Supercalafragulistic30]

Why report her?

[@sylviekins]

@@Supercalafragulistic30because these are legal requirements in medicine in relation to administration of medications. If not reported, someone could be fired, charged with an illegal offence, end up in prison and/or have their registration cancelled and not be able to work again.

[@tradslnd9872]

@@Supercalafragulistic30 I agree, if you say she was a "great" person, reporting her is extreme, sometimes people are just desperate and not bad per say. I would've warned her and you blame her for changing towards you when you incriminated her, sounds very simple minded

[@greenxxghostie]

@@Supercalafragulistic30 One thing people might not realize, is that very much of the time, if YOU don't report the misconduct, and are found to have known about it, YOU can be thrown under the bus. Just how it is. When someone you work with/for is using you, esp in a way that is unlawful, against policy etc you have to watch out for yourself. Sounds to me like the person absolutely deserved to be reported.

[@Anabobana83]

I had a friend at work who told me that in his previous team he bought one of those microwaveable heat pillows for his colleague who always had bad period pain, but he refused to actually give it to her. Instead he insisted that every time she needed it she had to ask him for it and allow him to microwave it for her. Clearly it was so he could constantly feel needed and appreciate and like the hero rescuing her from her pain. Never mind how uncomfortable it would have made her to tell him every time that she had her period and could she please use the pillow. If he genuinely cared about her and her pain he would have given it to her as a gift to use at her discretion.

[@helenahandkart1857]

Whoah, majorly creepy!

[@elisabethkarner1434]

Hope she ended up buying her own pillow...

[@antheredhen]

That's beyond creepy.. It's discusting actually.. Bet he has some stalking and window peeping in his life. That's like a true crime beginning..

[@nmariejenkins2041]

I would have taken it to HR. Gross! And if nothing was done, it would be a cold day before I ever let this person know I was in pain. Sad but you have to be 2 steps ahead of these ppl.

[@Tristitia.]

Why was she telling him about it in the first place?

[@gluckskeks2593]

They talk like candy while their eyes stay cold. You cannot feel their help. They are robots. You cannot feel them. The energy in the room stays cold while they are smiling, talking and acting kind. You may say thank you to them, but underneath your skin, you don't want them to help you. There is something not in line, however you cannot get it. That's scary and confusing at the same time. You'll feel small around them, smaller than usual. That's a big red flag.

[@andrew1717xx]

I have family like this. 😅

[@violetviolent7980]

Wow, that's an excellent analysis in addition highly poetic.

[@MicheleMaBelle67]

@@gluckskeks2593 Yes to all that! You nailed it!

[@SongofaBeach2012]

ALWAYS trust how someone makes you FEEL. Your own intuition and brain's ability to read body language will rarely steer you wrong. Trust your gut!

[@clairewillow6475]

And they make the creepy eye contact

[@AD-hh6dd]

Finally someone who addresses the manipulative nice person. I couldn’t understand why I was so miserable in my marriage because he was such a “nice guy”. But I was always feeling resentful and angry and felt gaslighted and couldn’t figure out why. Once I left the relationship the nice guy act disappeared and he tried to strangle me to death and had ever since been blatantly malicious. But not for others to see of course. He’s so insecure he needs everyone’s approval. But once he realized he couldn’t get mine he punished me for it. I see him as a coward. And one of the most despicable people I know. He is not genuinely nice.

[@JS-dv9ji]

Ok first off, I am SO sorry that happened to you 💜 What a terrible man. I've experienced the same thing, minus the strangulation. Thank you for sharing your experience. These types of men shouldn't be underestimated, especially when we leave. Even if they break up with us, they get angry and play the victim when the physical separation makes it real.

[@AD-hh6dd]

@@JS-dv9jithank you for that. Also I’m really sorry you went through something similar. He really is a horrible person. The level of entitlement he has is demonstrated by his continual effort to punish me 3 years later despite being in a relationship the last 2 years. The worst part is he actually believes he’s a nice guy and feels justified in his treatment of me. He justifies it by dehumanizing me which is how he is able to treat me in very inhumane ways without it weighing on his conscience.

[@aleciahansen7859]

I work with someone who “helps” everyone (without being asked) then complains that people always want their help and their time. They always offer to help me with things I don’t need help with and I also would never ask them based on their resentment and complaints when someone does need them.

[@tabascofaith]

This is my family member. They insert themselves, uninvited, as savior, into some poor souls life. Sets out to fix them, then bitterly complains that they're exhausted by how messed up their protege is and harshly judges their lack of progress.

[@miketexas4549]

This is most teachers I know. Voluntarily stay after school to work and do work on weekends without getting compensated, but complain about "the long hard hours."

[@JustMe-vs1kj]

This is my mother. Offers help, or even let you ask her, then when she is overwhelmed or even doesnt feel appreciated enough she throws it in your face.... learned not to ask, but either hint on needing help or just telling her its her choice. And she is the one doing it and she needs to stop if she wants... It helps... but honestly its tiring to think for others

[@JustMe-vs1kj]

​@@miketexas4549thats part of the job, but they do need to demand money for it tho. But a teacher not doing work outside of class hours is a bad teacher

[@Watchoutforsnakez]

I have a friend who ALWAYS wants to be the one to pass information on to others. She refuses to have them call me.she HAS to be the contact. She’s obsessed with being the person that hooks you up with her “guy” or the “deal”. She will tell you about her real estate agent and force you to take the number and then follows up to make sure you called them. If you don’t she will question you. I have almost nothing to do with her anymore. This lady is hundo P on calling it.

[@williamloree905]

My mother was a sweet narcissist- but wait till her friend left and she would just gossip about them. I told her friend but she didn’t believe me; she got mad at me. After my mother died I found out she had been talking behind my back for years. My mother was a great actress.

[@johedges5946]

My mother, before I HAD to go "no contact" for my own well-being would relish divulging ALL of her friends most private secrets to ME. I have no interest whatsoever!! Not my business!! It was horrifying. Obviously, I knew that she was in turn telling her millions of friends all of my business. ( I have had many mental health issues)

[@Foxie770]

Sounds like my mother and MIL

[@kaze_cat]

Hmmm, maybe you should not have involved yourself. Triangulation is a narcissistic trait as well.

[@NinjaMaxHaven13]

My mom is the same way. Sweet to my face, talk smack behind my back. She did that to other people too. It was annoying

[@lisabeaumont]

You know, I had this realisation recently about my auntie, whom I’ve always adored and thought the world of. She’s always been wonderful to me but I reflected on this: she’s always wonderful to EVERYONE to their face, yet she gossips about them, including my mum, my sister, my dad, her brother and sister-in-law, her in-laws, and even her best friend - I know things about her best friend that I really shouldn’t - her adult children’s friends, etc. The only people she’s never gossiped about to me are her husband and children. And I now realise that the very strong likelihood is that the same sorts of things she’s sharing with me about others is what she’s sharing with others about me. And that’s a big shock to the system.

[@Angelica-bw7iq]

These people are tricky! One thing I’ve experienced with a nice narcissist (and I might be wrong) is that in a way they try and adopt your persona. Careful what you share with them because they will find a way to throw it back in your face and or if they admire what you said or how you think they will literally take your words. They will suck you dry! Stay safe out there and thank you for this video 🤍

[@TrishHermit]

Had a friend who did this. Stole all my ideas (artist/crafters), but could not actually do what I had in mind, so it didn't bother me too badly. But that alone was what made me realize she was doing this.

[@ac1646]

@@TrishHermit That is quite hilarious. 😂😂

[@TrishHermit]

@@ac1646, It was pretty funny. 🤣

[@Angelica-bw7iq]

@@TrishHermit yes! That’s exactly how I found out too. You’re correct you can’t steal my ideas for art but taking my vocabulary word for word as if they were her thoughts was so odd.. bunch of weirdos out there

[@ac1646]

@@TrishHermit I don't have quite the same story (sadly) but just one of vanity (both the person in question and my own). As a graphic designer of quite a few years experience, and at the time working 'in-house' for a major bank, I had a job title of 'Desktop Publishing Executive'. 🤷🤷Meeting up with my then-husband's sister and boyfriend , my SIL mentioned to her boyfriend that I was in the same line of business as his sister and mentioned my job title. "Oh no, sorry but my sister _is_ a *graphic designer* and not a desktop publishing person." "Oh brilliant. Where does your sister work?" "Well she has created some painting stencils and has sold them to an interior designer, but he's ripped them off and now he is doing his own." That was the sum of her work. I'd worked for 13 years in design studios by then. 🙄🙄😏😏

[@wendybond2848]

They can undermine you by consistently trying to educate you or advise you. In fact they are trying to reinforce that you are inadequate or less than them.

[@someone3187]

This is a tricky one. Especially if it's about weight loss. I managed to lose some, then I wanted to help other female friends to succeed as well. Let's say, it's best not to say anything, or they might start to think just like you do.

[@Terquoiz24]

​​@@someone3187 ​ Oh, being super-interested in something & wanting to share a bit too much, or not reading the room well is a different kind of social problem. 😅 I grew up under the shadow of what @wendybond2848 refers to. This type of narcissist can seem very sweet & nice... so helpful... so generous... so magnanimous! They present as sooooo very sweet & innocent... almost to the point that it gets side-eye out of the gate. Sooner than later, this person is demonstrating a very know-it-all, chronic, constant, need to be considered the expert in all things. They can't be in a conversation where someone else knows more about a subject than they do. They will either one-up the knowledgable person, or change the subject to a topic they can use to take control of the conversation. If this can't be done due to the context/circumstance (like a structured meeting or class), they get restless. If they feel like the person addressing the group is talking above their intelligence/comprehension level - they get VERY uncomfortable... squirmy... maybe looking for an exit... but that would require a dramatic reason to leave early... Then if watching closely, you will see her make the decision. It's like a light switch flips on as she puts on a pleased, agreeable mask that tells anyone looking how thoroughly & perfectly she understands everything being said. She could tell you SO MUCH MORE about this subject if given the opportunity. Then, at first opportunity, you will come across her parroting EXACTLY what that other person was saying. She won't present it as something interesting learned from so-&-so, but more as if SHE was the expert who taught the presenter in the first place. At first opportunity, They will in some way, trip into a position of leadership & be in charge somehow (committee leader, club officer/president, teacher, etc). Even though they can't & don't want to fulfill the actual RESPONSIBILITIES >>> & end up in over their heads because they don't actually have the ability, experience, or willingness to LEARN the actual knowledge involved. Nor can they bring themselves to delegate... (I can never tell if that is part of a martyrdom complex, or if it's because *to them* delegating would require admitting someone knew better, or could do it better.)🙄 "I never really WANTED to be in charge! How do I always get FORCED into these positions!" You raised your hand & convinced them to pick you, that's how! 😂 This type must "feel" in control - showing you, telling you... leading/guiding you to see how THEIR good taste & intelligence is the only good source of opinion. No matter your opinion she will suggest something different would be better. If you show her your project, she will ALWAYS point out how you could/should have done it that would have been so much better. A child can't even share what they've done, or tell about what they're learning without needing to take it over, correct it (*unecessarily) or expand on it & make it HER moment. It's awful. Nothing is ever done as well as she could/would have done it.... yet she produces little to nothing. When she does make/do something, you better never make "constructive criticism" or talk to her like she does anyone else. This type chooses to surround themselves with people they perceive as less smart, less talented, or less charismatic as themselves..... people they see as lesser than them. Those who they can "take under their wing", who should feel PRIVILEGED by the attention & care being so benificially bestowed upon them. As soon as a beloved friend or family member proves to have any amount 😅of sense, brains, real talent in an area that this type perceives as competition , or DARES to question this types integrity/intentions, or actual rightness, knowledge, talent, etc... then the friend or family member is suddenly downgraded in esteem & no one should like or respect them now. It's as if a file is opened to begin a campaign to diminish that person, to all in the vicinity of their relationship. The person foolish enough to question an incorrect "fact", or point out an obvious contradiction, etc; is suddenly shunned with icy silence, or demonized for a dozen dramatically magnified traits that have always been clearly present, but were never problematic before... The "reasons" presented are never quite worthy of this sudden change of heart... & are often outright hypocritical (but don't you DARE point that out. It's simply untrue, and you are delusional for thinking that it is true.)

[@gins8781]

I am familiar with Reverse Savior Complex. A family member who swoops in to help when you are on unsteady ground, not giving you a moment to think, insisting that you let them help. When you acquiesce, the devaluation of you begins. This happened to me after a traumatic situation. Their sense of entitlement to criticize and dissect me didn’t end for 16 years. I finally spoke up about how distorted their thinking is about my experience, and how hurtful some of their words and actions have been. Now I am treated with cool reserve and left out of activities we used to share. I was not rude or forceful when I stood up for myself. But it seems that I crushed their ego by telling the truth. I think I instinctively knew this would happen and I avoided speaking up for many years. I love this person, and I am truly grateful for their help; but it came at the cost of having my dignity assaulted repeatedly.

[@garimaheath]

That was my sister when I was hospitalized for a heart bypass…. She came in within 3 hours, helpful, took over everything for my kids - driving them to and from school, packing lunches etc. But then, as I am 2 days out of the hospital - she completely loses it and screams she will be on the first flight ✈️ out of my house if my son doesn’t get his COVID 2nd shot ( she forced him to get the first one as well). He was weeping when he ‘agreed’ to get it - just so she wouldn’t leave his mom while I was very weak after a major surgery. She is a psycho narcissist.

[@gins8781]

@@garimaheath Overstepping my authority over my own child was the last straw for me too.

[@marrop2760]

Same happened to me..after a very traumatic time..yet I was very supportive and non-critical/non-disparaging when they went through tough times..they were so insulting/degrading/mean I stayed away from them for a looooonnnggg time.. & keep it simple when I do interact.. I did speak up for myself...I couldn't believe how abusive they were towards me when I never said a peep when they went through their own situations. they are both narcissists..

[@lulumoon6942]

Have family like this. Don't regret setting your boundaries, likely has saved you greater hurt. 🙏🕊️

[@SunshineCatwoman]

@@garimaheath That poor kid. I hope he doesn't get the associated health problems from it.

[@jacquelineglitter4328]

When I was a single parent my mother would buy things for my kids. Later, if I disagreed with her about something she'd say remember I helped you with the birthday gift. So really it wasn't a gift but a controll tactic.

[@ActuallyDoubleGuitars]

Yep my Mam and sister do that.

[@JustMe-vs1kj]

My mom does this but not financial but physical..... she Will say shes babysitting (even if i didnt ask her to, she offerd or my son asked to play with her) and i need to be more grateful. Or how she is doing so much and i dont appreciate it. She Will even pull my dads name into it even when he is not even around (live with my dad, with my son, dad never says these things to me, mom lives somewhere else) Or shell say "thats not my responsibility, its your child" even when she didnt hand him over to me but is still doing things with him in the house... when she feels like shes done and doesnt want to properly hand him over or taken care of him and i ask why she didnt bathe him or feed him... (only happened a few times but still)

[@TheMazinoz]

Yes, they act nice and approachable, all the while backstabbing and laying land mines in your path.

[@marrop2760]

had a co-worker like that..eventually I found out she was on anti-psychotics..

[@laurie9993]

They are secretly jealous of you

[@unitedstatesofsmlya3374]

When you know it’s not coming from deep down but you act likely as them so you don’t end up looking like creepy

[@the.toxic.phoenix]

"they tie their emotional wellbeing to your acceptance". Bingo

[@thehappyhound770]

Wow!!! So glad I stumbled on this! I have a friend who will “insist” on helping me and then makes the task twice as complicated for me so that I can assist her in helping. It’s just easier to do it myself or not do it at all. Seriously.

[@BriJo91]

Ok nice...another one to lookout for...I'm so tired of human manipulation when they can just be authentic to cultivate a pure symbiotic bond..why is that not enough for humans

[@Littlemouse884]

There's alot of information about narcissists in romantic relationships but not so many with friendships

[@detjaggillar8081]

I agree with You. Narcissism is to found in every relation even between friends as much as in families, workplaces etc. A tight snd long friendship of mine (18 years) ended for about 1 1/2 year ago when I understand (finally) that it was not healthy at all 😒 She flip out to me multiple times and all things was to like "a Great schoolexample" from a litterature of NPD's behavior 😳 I was first thinking that she was fealing angry or sad/hurt of something I had done to hear - but it wasn't. She escalate with her lies, downtripping me for anything I did in my life. Nothing I did, do or say was "good" she critises "whole me" 😮 I tried to talk to her about her behavior but it only get worse. Then one day I told her: If You don't change Your behavior to me or don't even like me cause You are NOT near even to be normal or deadcent/polite too me: I stop our so called friendship. I'm NOT gonna be Your garbage-bag for Your frustration cause thats not what I earn. She behave good for a couple or two times we where talking but then she got nadty and evil again. I didn't say anything at that moment but when after that call I blocked her everywhere: my mobile, meil and social media. She never try (what I know!) try to contact me after that! I ment she COULD if she want might be written a letter or card. But none has came to me as far as I know 😅 It was a HUGE relief when I stopped our friendship. It has been going on the last 2-3 years (of 18 years totally) and she got only worse and worse to me.

[@Littlemouse884]

@detjaggillar8081 sorry you went through all of that. It must feel like huge relief and weight off your shoulders to finally cut loose and move on from her

[@laurar9748]

One of my mottos. Nice…means nothing.

[@gingerr9004]

Yeah. Everyone’s nice at first.

[@gobigirl1]

@@laurar9748 There's a world of difference between nice and kind! Kind means everything, nice is empty.

[@a.s.3267]

Excellent point! ​@@gobigirl1

[@dfinite1111]

Absolutely! That is what I taught my kids. I told them to be nice to people, but to never read someone else’s niceness as meaning anything about them!

[@stephenelkington4971]

I once took a course in creative writing. The course teacher 'When you are writing NEVER use the word 'nice'. It doesn't mean anything !'

[@JamieWhitaker-l7b]

“But They’re So Nice” book sheds a light on this issue.

[@exquisitebiscuit]

I have a nice narcissist at work who has a savior/martyr complex. He's helpful, and in many ways, he's a rock of support, but his constant lane jumping is really annoying, and I have to constantly be vigilant and push him back into his own lane. He's like a noxious weed. The funny thing is that when he takes over, I make him responsible for the project, and I walk away, and his desire to continue diminishes greatly.

[@lulumoon6942]

Ninja Social Skills! Well done you! 👍

[@lindahandley5267]

Reverse psychology!😉

[@janelleanderson6744]

That's smart.

[@NSEasternShoreChemist]

I knew someone like this. He's dead now. If he offered help to anyone and that person didn't accept it, he would start guilt-tripping. I also get the hunch that this kind of person can enjoy parenting younger kids, but doesn't like it when the children get older and want to gain independence. (This is something I _totally_ didn't experience...)

[@yinyangphoenix]

Same.

[@koolbeans8292]

When the children get older is when they stop the physical abuse, and it becomes full on emotional abuse that never goes away!

[@jonathanclayton9107]

💯

[@jonathanclayton9107]

Or if you don't accept they will guilt u anyway

[@marilynbrown5274]

Narcissists often do not want children. They don't want any attention taken off of them.

[@Leah-i1e]

I think some of those nice narcissists would try to rope you into a relationship much too early. There'd be some sort of pressure and manipulation.

[@hummingbirdofgumption3263]

Clue 1 -Spot on. I had a friend who always wanted to do stuff for me and give me stuff without my asking. At first I thought it was sweet, if a bit much. Then I realized she always followed up by asking me favors that were more significant than what she gave me. So she'd get me a scarf that I didn't ask for at the Dollar Store -$1. Then she'd follow it up with, "Oh, I have meet the ladies at my church, can you watch my daughter the next hour." Of course, her daughter would be there. I learned to just avoid her because she while she wouldn't get mad if I refused, she'd go into a self-mortifying diatribe about how bad she was for even asking, I'd feel guilty and relent. Then she'd perk up ask if that never happened and run off to her church Ugh.

[@Jammer-fb2co]

My sister tried to “help” by suggesting I seek mental health care because she was concerned I had our mother’s mental illness. She made sure to tell me she was not mentally ill because her health coach said she was fine. She made sure to tell me that it was just concern on her part for my mental state. What lead up to this? I called her out for sabotaging the sale of our dad’s house because she wanted to give it away to a former family member instead of an equal split between us all.

[@abowling5759]

Yep, you can see right through them!

[@Xianne027]

That is so sick! Yes, I know that game too. Your sister's not the only one with that trump card in her deck! Telling someone else that they need therapy is the cheapest game in the narcissist book.

[@helenahandkart1857]

Oh yeah, I've got one of these, too. Also tried inveigling our elderly mum into putting a third of her will 'towards my niece' to go on the mortgage on niece's accomodation that narc sister herself actually owns... narc sis who has since evicted her daughter... fortunately, mum wasn't so dumb as she thought. she's.... 'entertaining', to say the least.

[@ElizabethTaylor-g1z]

Oh! I had this card played verbally on me. I was told by the charmless ex whilst we were working together (That's a whole vicious situation in itself...) one day that I needed to see a psychiatrist, only he'd choose the psychiatrist for me! Needless to say, he didn't follow through with his foul threats. ​@@Xianne027

[@ninawilliams7701]

Wow!! I got blindsided by one of these at my sons wedding. Didn’t recognize it. Thank you!!!

[@Mattheus217]

Wow, I have experienced the conditioning to get you to want nothing and need nothing because the other person needs are more important than yours and maybe they’ll let you have some scraps here and there if they deem you worthy

[@lindahandley5267]

Well I hope ditched them!

[@MicheleMaBelle67]

Oh my! You are describing my sister. This is both crushing me and enlightening me. 😳

[@lisahowes2701]

Mine too xx

[@Godisinitwithyou]

This sounds like my friend now gone for year older sister but I think all his siblings were all narcissists and they work as unit .

[@justlookalittledeeper9953]

Expressing pity for me: The dumbest ones in my family did this, even when things were going good, and I would never share or complain when times were tough, so they were always missing the mark. I knew it was just another putdown. They talked to me like a child, saying, "you poor thing" like it was my name. Give to get: a sibling once held out her hand with a gift, a small purple rock, the size of a smartie. I said, hey thanks because it was interesting and cool and I like crystals and rocks, and she pulled her hand away, saying "you don't really want this, do you" in a sulky, childish tone. I knew right away that she wanted me to fawn over it. Flattery: we worked for the same company in different departments. She would give me this "compliment" only at work, using the exact same words every time, exaggerating. It started to feel weird. I would tell her she looked nice in return and her face would light up, and she would gush: Oh thank you!! as if she was drugging on it. I'm only four minutes into this video, but I know these types inside and out, and their toxic parent-to-child and child-to-parent (never adult-to-adult) approach. The ooey-gooey goodness is a con. The goal is gaining power and control over you.

[@gloriadonahue7241]

Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you! This topic needs to be talked about more often.

[@julia912d5]

My narc mom was si threatened by someone who genuinely complented me, about a gift I had that she was jealous of me, and worked hard ti gaskight me into thinking, I didn't have that gift. For instance, I was a good artist, had a beautiful singing voice, was very charming and funny, had a sense if style that people seemed to appreciate snd emulate, uncluding her. Anything that I had that made me unique, and different then her. Then sged find a way to say, "You know they said you looked nice, they were really laughing at you". Then shed get this demonic look in her eyes and face as she savored my shock and humiliation. Im not brsgging, but they make you feel you deserve to be sbused fir daring to do anything that outshines them, or threatens their ability to dominate, control and destroy you. They are EVIL.

[@privateprivate8366]

I have a narcissistic boss. He likes to confuse me, with acting as if he’s very supportive, when he’s actually very suppressive. This is to ensure my gratefulness, while he suppresses my future contributions to the organization, because he’s easily threatened.

[@GloryGal]

University president??

[@privateprivate8366]

@@GloryGal 🤔

[@wintermatherne2524]

I know one just like that. Jealous. They’re maddeningly annoying.

[@privateprivate8366]

@@wintermatherne2524 annoying also because I think he knows I know this and his feeling is, “You can’t do anything about it.” He’s right, I can’t. If I came out and said he’s trying to undermine me, he’d say I was ungrateful and didn’t know what I was talking about. Meanwhile, he’s been not only shifting work, to a newer employee, who was hired to “help” me, while I have done just about nothing, for 2 years, unless I get crumbs. He wanted to hire someone to “help” me, years ago. But, various people kept quitting, being fired, etc. Now, this boss is absolutely relieved. He knows he can’t be the contributor I’ve been, because he has no skills worth looking at, but is content that he’s found someone who can do my job. It’s a form of quiet firing. Narcissists become “smart” sometimes, out of fear. Other than that, they’re quite stupid and he’s demonstrated that in other ways. He even lied to his new boss, saying I and another employee are actually very busy and his new boss said, “Yeah, that is NOT what I’m seeing!” It’s like you haven’t to bring in your own work. So, I was assigned a nicer, more public project and, of course, my boss is upset and whining to whomever he can, that I shouldn’t be working on it. It was so obvious. Well, I don’t take this personally, entirely. Because he’s also doing it to another employee he knows could whoop his ass without half trying.

[@tittat9351]

I suspect this about my boss as well but ive only been there for 3 weeks so time will tell if he is one

[@daynapeterson9033]

Are they the super syrupy sweet people who just ooze honey from their veins, yet they've been married 4 times? You're left asking yourself, how could somebody divorce someone so sweet? BIG RED FLAG!

[@justlookalittledeeper9953]

Yep, ooey-gooey saccharine. A definite red flag.

[@npkrn6764]

😂😂😂 right!!! 💯

[@gobigirl1]

​@@npkrn6764 Or not married 4 times-- married just once, long-term, to a wealthy, self-sacrificing adult child of narcissists who believes they deserve nothing but crumbs

[@LostintheTangle]

Do you know my sister? The one I've gone no contact with? 😮😂

[@laurie9993]

My sister was married/divorced 4x--but ditched all good men. A premier Narc w significant Bitch traits. Kids are her supply/flying monkeys; she gives them $$$ to keep

[@pawdaw]

I worked with a malignant narcissist for almost 17 years. Early on, I learned that the 'nice' personality was a mask - the 'nice' personality would try to create connection and empathy, but it was really a tactic to collect information that she would use against you later on. Thus, the 'nice' personality became a signal that I should not engage, and if others were around, that I should choose my words very carefully.

[@jenniferalves6808]

An acquaintance from a small town where we both used to live contacted me on social media after over two decades of having moved on from this place, she was full of flattery and talked about those "good old times" we never actually had together. It felt sticky right from the start, and I kept getting this impression of the movie Single White Female, but I gave her a chance, and shared benign updates about life since that small town, including the experience I had where I stepped on a rattlesnake and got bit. This woman continued to imply that her and I were just so close, and she was just like me, that we had some kind of bond because she had heard a rattlesnake while on a hike on vacation. She contacts me again one day, wanting to know all about my personal life and I told her straight up I don't share that info with people who aren't in my inner circle and the woman actually tried to convince me that she had a dream one night and stepped on a rattlesnake the next morning. The manipulation is this: we're so close, you can trust me, look at how much we have in common. All our communications have been in writing, and I was FLOORED that she actually thought she was going to get away with such an obvious lie, I called her out on it, she told me she was going to pray for me to find "love, compassion and clarity", it made me laugh so hard. Honest people don't like being lied to, narcissists don't like being told the truth, and it's really sad that a human can live an entire life blatantly lying to people and no one has been kind and brave enough to tell them that they aren't fooling everyone they think they are. I feel sorry for this lady I hardly knew, and grateful for the experiences that educated me so well than I can spot a person with NPD pretty quickly. Sticky and dark, and a life wasted in the delusions of their own false narrative to avoid facing the unseen/unresolved trauma. I've seen this a lot in "spiritual communities" and in many people who present themselves as "light workers" and "healers" (lie workers and stealers!).

[@antheredhen]

My mother inlaw is so good at this. So good that one of her ex daughter inlaws always visits her to do things for her and to vent.. She divorced her son but still shops for him, picks him up at the airport, helps him all the time.. My mother inlaw tells her to stand up to him and stop.. Then mommy dearest tells her son (name change) "Well get Belinda to pick you up at the airport or buy your groceries." This daughter inlaw buys all mommy's niceness when she's actually stirring the pot encouraging him to use her like a door mat. She's the poster for sweetness as she lies, manipulates, and steals from people..

[@cominghometoyeshua]

Triangulation

[@lindahandley5267]

@@cominghometoyeshua At its finest! I would hope I wouldn't be dumb enough to let someone do me that way!

[@ginarenee1625]

This sounds familiar. My MIL did the same. Triangulating me and her son. . And he did the same thing to everyone.

[@ghostsheet777]

​@@lindahandley5267sadly we are all dumb enough to be fooled but the good part of that is so is the narc

[@juliewilson1867]

I had an administrator who would say things and when I walked away, I would realize she just put me down.

[@hazelmarieb9934]

My dad practically defines number 3. Always trying to "help" and telling me not to do things without his help and when I do it he's like "how did you manage that by yourself?" And I just give him the classic Elle Woods response. "What, like it's hard?"

[@em945]

Hazel. I love this. Thank you!

[@carefulcarpenter]

Life is very complex and context is essential. Details often lose a narcissist's attention.

[@lulumoon6942]

Was raised this way and thought it was normal while not knowing how repellant it was. Grateful to have finally figured it out, even if i cringe over past behaviors! Sibling continues to do this, with OFFERS of help without boundaries their Dopamine Scooby Snack I have to start clear of! 🙏🕊️

[@Joy.1111]

So many people want to “help” me. This is so true! I feel like it’s off.. replaying it… don’t sit right.

[@jenniethegoldendeavor3311]

Fast tracking entanglement! Yes! This has happened with every narcissistic person I’ve been involved with. Either through sex or prying me open to secure their place with me. 😤

[@antheredhen]

This is my husband's whole family him included.. Niceness and gifting are how they get supply... I feel the same as you've said before. When people are nice to me I feel I owe them something probably because there's narcasism in my family and 33 years of his family.

[@eps4560]

I know a couple who are so simple. They're standard phrase at the end of any "visit" is always to offer "let me know if there is anything I can do to help" or "let me know if you need anything" But absolutely do not mean it or want you to take them up on this offer whatsoever. The energy they ooze is "don't bother or complicate my life" If you test it out and do ask for a bit of help, there are strings and consequesnces that are not worth it. Any public help they offer, like opening a door for someone, returning an item someone dropped, or assisting someone struggling to walk or stand etc is only a display for these two to tell themselves that THEY are good people. Very simple and the laziest way to make themselves feel good with zero or minimal effort. They are zero drama, non abusive, but their kids avoid them. Now they are old and lonely wanting people to visit and help them do daily tasks. Superficial conversations, no deeper connections and conditioning their kids that "you're on your own in this world" ended up backfiring on them later in life. Now they want deeper engagement with others. Nope.

[@lulumoon6942]

Family vibes! 😮

[@gretchenisasquirrel]

Spot on descriptions, TY!

[@didiallen8678]

Interesting how they work as a narcissistic team.

[@persianbelle]

None of what you said is any evidence that they are narcissists. None. You are a very judgemental shallow individual if this is all your evidence. Good grief!

[@antheredhen]

Ya, definitely sounds familiar to me!!

[@christinah.8504]

very very few people are kind and generous without strings attached. They should be people that are your family. Others, you should be suspect of. Always.

[@Tristitia.]

@@christinah.8504💯

[@stephenelkington4971]

'Families' - they're the very worst !

[@ChariotOfFaith]

A very good salesman can use the same manipulation tactics as well, flattery to get you to like them so you buy from them.

[@llamasugar5478]

Yep. It’s one thing that brings out “rudeness” in me. Of course, as the victim of several narcissists in my youth, rudeness just means “speaking my mind and asserting myself.”

[@RoryStarks]

I was struggling with a credit card reader one time, and my ex offered to help... sorta. From that point on, before I could barely get my card out of my wallet, she would snatch it out of my hands and say "You're doing it wrong, it's upside-down, you have it backwards!!" or something similar. This would usually result in her saying "you always fuck everything up!" or some other wildly explosive remark in order to start an argument.

[@kittykat6876]

my ex always acted like he just wanted to help everyone but if you look behind the facade, he only did it because it helped him, he always acts like everyone is taking advantage of him while he is mirroring himself and taking advantage of others and then in the end he asks himself why everyone is leaving him even though he only wanted to help them lol

[@lilamiranda33]

This feels somewhat like co-dependency. Giving to get something back or to feel indispensable. They need external validation to feel valued. I think narcissism and codependency get blurred sometimes. I think narcissism is very dangerous because it involves more of a manipulative, self-serving agenda. I think it’s really to siphon things off of people for self serving purposes. Co-dependence likely stems from needing connection and wanting to be a part of something like a friendship or partnership. It can involve manipulation too, but I think it comes from a different place than a DSM personality disorder. It’s blurry, for sure.

[@TruthInspector]

the first one involves pride....the second... emotional need. two different motivations, and I would say without a doubt the first one is self-serving and Evil.

[@dddamaged7501]

Them being the hero or saviour, you feel obligated to return the favour.

[@dlwilliamson5644]

I am angry with myself for not picking up on the "nice".

[@WhirledPublishing]

Nice is everywhere - and their crocodile tears - the quiver in their voice that captivates our compassion and empathy - their very private sob stories that are shared so freely without even a hint of any true emotion. Then I see those that go overboard to " help " someone in need because disabled people are easy targets for those looking for an emotional punching bag ... Thank you for your comment.

[@WhirledPublishing]

@@heatherburrill ​Decades of looking for the " best " in monsters - until I finally realized that I was repeatedly destroyed by them - 13 years ago - I continue to fail to realize I'm not in Kansas anymore - I'm not in the 1800's anymore ... What is wrong with me? The clues are everywhere.

[@zalix512]

Serial Killers use the same technique.

[@WhirledPublishing]

@@zalix512 yes - you're right - I've known some serial killers - they're highly skilled at deception - one is a PhD female who's been killing people for over 40 years - she gets high on it - and brags about it - she worked for the AMA for years and was trained by oncologists in how to poison terminal cancer patients - the other four are males that fail to qualify as " men " ... I've reported them to law enforcement ... They're still free to murder ... Child rapists are everywhere too - the statistic is one in every square mile in the usa ... a few minutes from children ... 24 / 7

[@MaryDunford]

Forgive yourself. They spend a lifetime learning to trick people who aren't taught to be skeptical in the first place. You're learning now. Many don't. That puts you ahead of the curve. Cheers.

[@PS109VanBurenHigh]

An instructive and spot-on lecture that’s extremely helpful (to grasp) for both men and women.

[@meadowdevor]

I’m glad you found it helpful!

[@ricknico2577]

For me as a Scandinavian this sounded like mingling at any American party🤔

[@joannepinnow6929]

Good lord, you must have met my former boss! :) You just described and explained her thoroughly.

[@ligiamontani]

I'd love to know more about this. It's been so hard to explain and help my girlfriend see how she's been entrapped in this cycle. There's not much out there about the nice narcissist there's an element of self sacrifice and people have a hard time expressing boundaries to not hurt the narcissists that clearly keeps over stepping in the name of thoughtfulness and kindness but it feels smothering and like you can't say no. I appreciate your work. Thank you for sharing your experiences and research

[@user-gr7jo9qb3l]

i learned not to talk about my projects/goals w casual "friends." Goals attract frien-emies looking to take you down just so they can rejoice in your failure

[@marinaariza7344]

I have -had-a friend who ALWAYS offered herself to help but NEVER did it once you asked. Unless everybody could see it. She makes sure to be noticeable and makes a big fuss, in case there is no chance to brag about it she disappears never to be seen until she needs something from you. I don't talk to her anymore but sometimes she still shows up despite my distance. Not anymore phoney.

[@Sab_MJsMama]

I've needed help and have taken it from more than one narcissist. I'm not at all above needing help, no one is. I need to establish more boundaries if and when I do need the help.🤷‍♀🤷‍♀

[@WhirledPublishing]

@7:40 Nice narcissists offer their help * tethered to our sense of human decency that requires us to be considerate of their feelings as they maneuver their niceness to exalt their own status * power * and control over the lives of others.

[@tittat9351]

Great take. I know a guy like that, I ignore him now

[@reesedaniel5835]

The Bible says that satan comes disguised as an angel of light, and so do many of his servants.

[@lulumoon6942]

AMEN 🙏🕊️

[@AlanDeMoss]

I was just thinking about how prevalent this specific type of narcissism is within the Southern Baptist Convention. It's very near the archetype of the flying monkey, vulnerable disorder and likely the only type of illness learned in a community setting.

[@NightMystique13]

Mythology has nothing to do with this.

[@reesedaniel5835]

@@NightMystique13 I agree. There was no mention of mythology👍

[@jesusisgod4992]

The 3 stages of being around a narcissist: 1. They are so nice. (But looking back, they were way too good to be true.) 2. Your life turns into a nightmare. And if you haven't run by then... 3. Your life turns into a horror movie.

[@dale3404]

My MIL displayed some signs of narcissism but not all, so I wasn’t sure. I once had a friend who was a younger version of my MIL, and I had to distance myself from her. This explains it all. Thank you for validating me.

[@IzabelaWaniek-i1x]

Spot on. Thank you for brilliant observations and advice 😊

[@helenamarhounova1120]

Thank you , just happened to me few days ago with someone, cut them off, you just confirm i was correct, thank you for this video

[@janedoe5229]

I am a very good oil painter. I show my work to anyone who comes over (I have it hung on all my walls). Most people say, "Wow, that's really good", and then they are bored and they change the subject. If someone goes overboard with the flattery, I am automatically suspicious.

[@blanchemckenna5926]

Very interesting. New to me information. A new skill set I need to learn.

[@Angela-ul9si]

I am so happy to have found your channel. I really enjoy the videos that focus on how we can help ourselves instead of just bashing the narcissistic folks. I know it’s easy to do this when we’ve been put through the ringer for many many years by these nasty and manipulative folks but I have now stopped caring about my husband and all of his wants and needs when he has never taken mine into any sorts of consideration and I’m now setting my own personal boundaries concerning him and on my own healing journey of sorts with the help of folks like you. You are such a smart young lady and you are absolutely wonderful for helping everyone like you do with your videos you make for us all to learn a thing or two from. Thank you/ Miigwech lil sister. 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼😊🥰🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼

[@lorenagrey2511]

False humility is a red flag.

[@alcudiababe1]

I had to think about some of your explanations. It was quite the mind boggler 😂

[@bostonbutterfly4473]

I’m very sick and disabled, on deck for a spinal fusion. For the first time ever my (Malignant Narcissist) father finally said to me how sorry he was that I’m so sick, how he just wished with everything in him that I was not in so much pain… then this was quickly followed by… so that I’d be able to ride in the car and help him pick out glasses that look the best on him. Silly me thinking for a second there he actually cared. These ppl are Pure evil.

[@someone3187]

@Bostonbutterfly - Hi there, just to understand. Why is it a bad thing for you to help him picking out glasses that suit him best? Maybe he likes your sense of taste, so, why not help him with that? Doesn't he also help you in other things? Why is helping each other considered a bad thing?

[@lisabeaumont]

@@someone3187I agree: I don’t see him saying that as selfish or evil at all. Stating that you’d like someone’s help can mean you value their contribution in your life. Context and tone are key.

[@Teakai8]

​@@someone3187 because he wants her well for his own benefit, not for hers.

[@hshfyugaewfjkKS]

I'm so sorry. And at a time you probably really need his help, he mqkes it about him. Typical.

[@hshfyugaewfjkKS]

​@Teakai8 I don't get how the above 2 commenter's didn't see that. 😳 but maybe for us wh9 have grown up with them it's blatant to us.

[@jomckinnon1042]

sh*t!!!! I just found myself. thanks though; now I know where to put in the work.

[@Anchorgirl100]

What do you mean by you found yourself?

[@LiliVanilli248]

@@Anchorgirl100 Presumably as a nice narcissist?

[@sonicspring6448]

@jomckinnon1042 I think I get what you're saying, because I recognised several tendencies in myself to do the same nice narcissist she talked about! It wasn't a new realisation but it certainly threw them into sharp outlines and helped to feel how they affect other people.

[@WhirledPublishing]

A couple weeks ago, a woman in her early 60's came to me to brag that her mother and daughter had died one month apart - if I were to describe her voice, I'd say if Marge Simpson had an evil twin, that voice would be what I heard from this woman - no sorrow at all in her voice - no sound of her missing their love ... nothing ... After a few days of observing her evil, you can imagine what I began to wonder about those suspicious deaths.

[@julia912d5]

That is so typical of a serial killer. They like to relive what they did by telling stories about what happened, while savouring your reaction to their story. Your emotion are their narc supply. If she had ever seen the lightbulb go off in your eyes, that you saw through her, that you suddenly realized that she murdered them. She would have murdered you to. That is a very dangerous personality to screw with. I'd call the police and report her anonymously.

[@WhirledPublishing]

Thank you, Julia, I reported another woman to local law enforcement, and to another state where she had been murdering and I reported her to the FBI ... not one of them took my report seriously. I'll tell you how I know this other older woman is a serial killer - across multiple states: The first few times she was bragging about being a serial killer, I was confused - because I couldn't understand what she was saying: She bragged that she was an expert in end-of-life care ... which made no sense because she had never worked at a hospital, never worked at a hospice, never worked at a senior care facility, never worked as a caregiver, etc. She was a professor - who was then hired by the American Medical Association to facilitate their Continuing Education programs - which are usually at hotel conference rooms - these conferences are nationwide - in large cities - and sometimes in Canada - and probably other nearby locations like the Caribbean, etc. I have attended some of these educational conferences - so I know what goes on there - lots of doctors, bragging about raping their patients - that's what goes on at the conferences - and they give tips to one another on how to cheat on insurance and on income taxes, etc. The doctors are bragging about their new Lexus, their most recent vacation, the university that their teen was just accepted to, etc. - not one conversation about how to better care for their patients. The old woman then bragged to me that she had participated in many deaths - again - how was I supposed to make sense of that? I didn't know she was a psychopath - so I couldn't make sense of her comments. On and on her bragging went - as I began noticing other clues to her evil - that also made no sense - it was a long series of several indicators before my brain finally caught on - and then yes, she was repeatedly attempting to murder me - leaving oranges for me - which looked very odd - I'm pretty sure she had injected the oranges with poisons - then she left a gallon of water for me next to my front door - fortunately, I had already realized she was a serial killer - so I wasn't going to eat the oranges or drink the water - I began having heart problems - but I didn't realize she had poisoned me - she was my neighbor - on and on the weirdness went - finally I packed and left - she tried to stalk me and found my new neighbors, etc. She figured I'd be dead from all her poisons - but she was wrong - that was several years ago - and my heart recovered. Sorry for the long story but I learned that psychopaths get a bio-chemical high on feeling they have power over life and death. The old lady also murdered our neighbor and then bragged that she was so glad that he was dead - with a bizarre heightened tone of euphoria in her voice. I've reported three males who are serial killers - but law enforcement does nothing.

[@maureengordon6496]

?

[@AA-fz3lj]

This is so hard to explain but this example is so good

[@nategrey86]

your lighting is so professional looking and you look great!

[@aimeesuplift]

My mother who is definitely not a hands on mum has gone around telling everyone saying shes going to look after me after major surgery, making herself sound so alturistic when she is anything but. I cant imagine her doing anything but visit me for a couple of hours as staying over would be enormously out of character for her But she has an image to uphold. Though it may not sound logical my gut is saying no no no i dont want her 'looking after me'..i 'd rather hire a carer. Its so stressful tbh.

[@zoetjez]

My mom both wanted to make herself the victim, but also me.

[@alanreed647]

to bad life is so confusing sometimes, are there any authentic people out there? just a few genuine and simple friends would be nice.

[@nicolebowman5727]

And also proclaiming their superiority by being loudly "unvain" and my concern for my appearance is "inauthentic" and "something i should look at"

[@yomisma9114]

🙋🏻‍♀️my mother in law. Since I draw a boundary she is not even thinking of me. She sent a present to us for my daughter in law. Nothing for me. I can see her meaning and intention from afar. 😅

[@freeshrugs63]

I walk away from a lot of conversation knowing much more detail about the person. We may have talked several times at length or even worked together. I know their grandkids' names, how many times their sister has been married. And I'll realize they don't even know my kids' names. Am I just good at asking questions (yes) or is everybody a narcissist? Probably not, but people love to talk about themselves and love to get compliments.

[@darinsmith2458]

I am going to have to sit and chew on this for awhile.. Nice and Narcissist does not seam to go together..

[@marrop2760]

that's right.. when my ex & I split he mentioned "I wasn't like Phoebe Buffet" anymore!" (Horror of Horrors! - I was a TV character to him from "Friends")!!

[@darinsmith2458]

@@marrop2760 for me them not being nice is the red flag..

[@naznow]

@darinsmith2458 it’s when the apparent ‘niceness’ is highly disingenuous. It’s manipulation. It’s a form of narcissism.

[@darinsmith2458]

@@naznow That makes sense..

[@universalsoldier2293]

You just described Midwest Nice.

[@angelnative9267]

Get the book Dangerous Personaltys by Joe Navero. Wish I had it beforehand but it helped me after the narc.

[@yumacosta326]

This IS my mother-in-law. My husband is her golden child so I also feel like she’s doing this to me specifically to bully me passive-aggressively. It took me about 15 years to figure it out but she’s already done a lot of damage to my self worth as a mother and wife. I no longer give a crap what she thinks and I feel free even though she’s not out of my life.

[@10percentrugs]

Best lecture so far.

[@gigicolada]

This is my mother. I won’t go no contact permanently even though I know my life would be better, but she’s so nice and so sad. Knowing who she is helps though. I’m still left spiraling often.

[@DelphineTheWorstBladeEver]

I'm so sorry Gigi. I hope you heal, with or without her in your life. Please protect yourself.

[@gigicolada]

@@DelphineTheWorstBladeEver thank you! Same to you 🫂

[@carefulcarpenter]

How we feel most often tell us about ourselves. Narcissism is on a scale.

[@mizuplasm37]

Watch the film ‘Greener Grass’ - hilarious and captures this dynamic perfectly

[@AC-dwg]

Some people who say nice things to people, actually want them to hear those nice things - I know now that it could have some hidden agenda, but some of us, lost people and early on and learned to appreciate them while having them here...

[@LilacAmberg]

Not the boss, your underling, the one you are supposed to take care of (and do all their work, because they are so cute! absolutely amazing and always ready to help ;). Try telling them kindly anything and you find yourself labeled passive aggressive.

[@ConstantGardener-q9q]

I have been so frustrated with “nice” leaders who get ahead without doing the work. If you are direct and competent (without being “nice”) if you are a female leader you are a “b*tch” and get clobbered. If you are a male leader you are “assertive and clear.” I often don’t see male bosses feeling the need to be “nice” … just adding the gender component to this equation

[@gingerr9004]

Oh I absolutely agree with that. And that’s in social settings too, not just work. Women are constantly being told to smile and to calm down-when literally all I was doing was speaking my opinion. Trust me, when I’m upset-there will be no doubt lol

[@ckala217]

​@@gingerr9004😂

[@ckala217]

Yes!!!

[@janefreeman995]

I once worked for a woman who is both full of overtures but can easily lower the boom. She tried to pay me with an overused blackberry and another time an old broken camera. ... bc she "found" a new camera on a cruise ship. Im sorry but if I found a camera on a cruise ship, I'd turn it into lost and found. When i pressed her about it, she said the ship was disembarking and no one would come looking for it. It was worth several hundred dollars i know i would. Anyway, i stopped working for her. Many of her neighbors, sister, old friends stopped talking to her. Shes constantly manipulating and creating flying monkeys.

[@lanipowell7287]

I really learn a lot from your video. The volume was so low on this one that I couldn't make out much of what you were saying, even with my laptop speaker all the way up.

[@Beth_82]

The volume is fine, maybe it's your laptop

[@sam12587]

It’s fine on my iPhone.

[@davidestabrook5367]

I'm sorry you were having sound problems with this video. Sometimes KZbin videos play the video, but don't play the sound. Closing down KZbin then starting it up fixes it. I hope it's not a hardware problem, as I have my phone's volume level set to about 25%, and I can hear this one fine. I'd recommend playing some downloaded music or movie, and going into your laptops audio settings. As you might have your browsers audio slider set too low. Good luck with finding and fixing the problem.

[@user-uv6qe2tg7s]

Good Lord, there are some damaged people in these comments. The walking wounded. Yikes. I was one. WAS. I like Ms DeVor and especially so because she is opening explaining regarding her bias. Healthily, she is trying to be balanced acknowledging (the impact/effect of) her own damage and wounds (that she alludes to). Being Careful and Discerning regarding "Flattery" received or received... and relating it to narcissistic manipulation was very insightful. Thank you.

[@Cassie-pt7mt]

My Golden Child older sister is fawn and fight. I know the fawning is always a manipulation.

[@tracyvalentini9627]

This is my mother ! She’s exhausting!

[@gamingbypix]

TMI/TW/CW: 🔥🔥🤸‍♀️🔥🔥 I have asd and I was isolated+tortured+abused throughout childhood and on and off through teens, so I had to learn socialization skills much later and with much more difficulty. I used to think that compliments are a good way to make small talk 😂 now I do them once in a while and never anything "too big" unless it's like a performer and they were TRYING to be glamourous for example. It really rubbed people the wrong way even though my intentions were to attempt to socialize and make friends. THIS MAKES SENSE WHY 😂 But also this reminds me of like half of my step moms personality except difference is that she didn't mean them a lot of the time and it was always to get validation or to manipulate someone either on the spot or over a period of time! But it takes being around/observing her more to even realize it! Her and my bio dad were phenomenal actors 💀

[@camadams9149]

Im really not seeing the issue here if their help produces results. If their help is counter productive or they don't follow through... that's a problem. Otherwise, if they are generating genuine value for me, thanks. You are definitely someone I want in my life

[@wendybutler1681]

Long story but eldest siater and i hadn't lived in the same state since I was five. I am disabled. Only child, 36 yo son, died unexpectedly. Then my building sold and rent became too much for me (even with Section 8 help) and we're in the middle of a housing crisis. She moved to my area (because her son was transferred here) and hopped around rentals but decided to buy a house for us. It was to be OUR HOUSE. I was to feel this was my house as much as hers. I finally relented because it was that or living in my Jeep. I figured we were both sampne and rational human beings so what could go wrong? First I got screamed at for living like a disabled person disabled about 36 yrs at that point). It's been downhill from there. I am on a waiting list for senior housing. It will put me in the position of not being able to afford basics (like there's anything I haven't already given up) and barely scraping by each month and playing catch up on power bills all the time but I will be able to use a stove and oven without being told how much it stinks. How the scent of a pot of chicken veggie soup can offend her nose is the question of the century. Tired of getting screamed at for nothing because somebody else made her mad. At first I thought it was dementia then she did it in front of her son. I had the chance then to ask her son if she'd always been like this. Yup, was his firm and deliberate answer. Now he's taken his family back to the midwest and she does not communicate with him at all. Just his 2 daughters. Er dil's mother had basically told her exactly what she thought in very broken English (which sister deserved because she's the problem) and it was a campaign of hate since then. I found out real quick that they're very lovely people as is their daughter. They were not willing to kowtow to her "unique sensibilities". I have to be willing or I'm homeless. She's told me to pack up and go so many times because she's spitting mad at someone else. Nothing turned out as promised. Even had to battle that a fresh breeze from an open window could have enough smog to put me in the hospital with my compromised lungs. After 6 yrs she's finally looking up the AQI before opening the house up. The only reason I haven't checked out is my dog and the hope that I'll be out of here soon. Get myself and my confidence back. She is a nice narcissist. The nice has strings attached. When she approaches me I never know if it's to ask if I know where she put something or ream me out for something. I read people very well but she even communicates poorly with her body language! Cannot converse. Turns into a one-way lecture and she'll find a way to say you're wrong. Not a creative bone in her body and tries to squelch mine. I made covid ornaments for our special neighbors and she had an absolute fit. She thought they were kitch-y which was the whole point! They turned out perfectly! I did not give them to neighbors but to her son. His neighbors saw them and went nuts! He handed them out and kept one. About 7" in diameter and it comes out every Christmas since. When nephew got such a kick she decided they weren't so bad and mine has hung on our mantle 365 since then. Her silly little sister with the dumb projects who never has anything to say worth listening to. Makes her jealous when the neighbors talk to me whether she's part of the conversation or elsewhere. She's shown her treatment of me in front of a couple of them. One has seemingly backed away from a blossoming friendship. The other has said I can vent safely to her. I am so not the person my sister thought or thinks I am despite what she sees. I am starving for intelligent conversation.

[@wendybutler1681]

She thought my health would vastly improve under her roof. Nope. Turned annoying asthma into chronic. Cannot cook or eat what/when I want or am able. Miss huge salads actually yelled at me for eating so many raw veggies. I had a great, clean diet when I moved in. I now exist on microwave entrees, pickles, jerky and chocolate. The last three need no refrigeration so I can keep them in my room. I have severe fibromyalgia and it greatly affects my digestive muscles and appetite. My windows of opportunity for eating can be rare at times so I make do as best as I can. I cannot WAIT to have my own kitchen again! Not a frozen entree in sight! Trying to explain any of this to sis is dangerous. Tho when she said the family OCD hadn't affected her and after picking up my jaw I explained to her, with examples, of how her OCD ruled her life she was quite receptive. Before moving in together my insight tended to blow her away at times. Now she discounts everything I say even tho I correctly diagnose most of our repair issues before the tech gets here. I have a good mind but she refuses to be comfy with me knowing more than she does about anything. I followed Dad around house and farm when all my sisters were out of the house. I held the flashlight and handed him tools. Turns out her ex hubby wouldn't let her help him do any of their remodeling projects. She'd never bought a tube of caulk before. I'd been divorced so long I had to fix my own house. So who does she think my extremely capable son learned it all from? She knows exactly how brilliant he was. He certainly didn't get it from his father. Oh, dear heavens! Sorry for the life story. Thanks for listening to me vent. It saves my sanity.

[@thevibrancyreboot3835]

My SO exemplifies clue 3, the savior type.

[@bebahojt]

Everything is transactional.

[@consciouscitizen6211]

Thank you for making this complex abuse so clear. Suffered 14 years under this dark cloud!

[@HelloDarling73]

The paradox of the "nice guy"

[@Ytdeletesallmycomments]

The nice ones are the monsters

[@abowling5759]

Very USEFUL information!…