40k Ruins One Page Rules ?

[@davidhalstead402]

2 things to point out regarding OnePageRules that weren't mentioned here. 1. They are working on making big steps to expand out including community and lore building. They have released basic lore for all the armies and are working on both setting and faction books. They also did their first convention recently so I wouldn't be surprised if they have a much larger presence by the time 11th edition rolls around 2. They released the ability to create your own balanced armies using their Army Forge Studio. You can give any in game ability to a unit and rename them for flavour and set the stats and it works out and balances the points for you to keep balance. A number of stl creators have partnered up with OPR to make compatible armies with their own rules and I'm sure plenty more will be doing the same. The future for OPR looks very bright

[@SimplyWarhammer]

That's a great idea to be able to add your own abilities to a random model and it work out a points value for it 😁 that for me is a reason to play this 👍

[@jmppodcast]

The army forge studio having mini creators creating their own armies is a game changer. OPR really needs to push this because once more people see that cool aspect of the game they will be more inclined to try it out.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I might have to do a video to cover this tbh 😁

[@veteransofgalacticwars7376]

Army Forge Studio is such a massive positive, it can't be explained! It's pretty unheard of for a studio to say "Here... here's the tools and the framework we use to build army lists. Have fun!"

[@skybyred13]

Just getting into wargaming, and people's obsession with lore is so strange to me. Why not just imagine and creat your own stories for your army, especially when putting so much effort to build them? I don't understand why people need someone else to tell them the history and backstory of their toys

[@gilesparkes2922]

I think OPR (GDF) is just more fun, more intuitive and for anyone who hates winning by 'gotcha's', 'Hero-Hammer' and 'net' lists. However it's hard to not miss some of the faction specific rules that give models a bit of flavour. 40k has made improvements, mostly by being more like OPR, but the promise that 10th's 'Index' would bring faction balance seems to have been empty marketing. It's also just a co-incidence that a lot of 'ugly' models seem strong right? GW sticking to their slow codex releases, turn structure and lack of proof reading and play testing has hobbled 10th for me (so far).

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer the quality of release has been disappointing compared to what was promised. So many mistakes, big imbalance and as you say being a for profit company they will improve rules for things they want to sell !

[@SirFluffy100]

How do I add more thumbs!? Just went to a OPR "tournament" and it was alot more of a chill hangout then the tense cranky 40k next door. We even got a brand new player, playing a friends army to host another tournament in the following months. The rules are approachable. The models are innviting. The people are friendly

[@carnivalbill]

Way more fun. I don’t think I’d ever play 40k again.

[@legatus_newt]

I have much more fun with OPR. The people who want to play OPR over 40k are the ones who want the flexibility in army creation, shorter games and potentially to house rule / narrative style gameplay. OPR to me feels more like a system for creating wargaming experiences similar to how D&D is a system for table top role playing experiences ( on top of their "first party setting" )

[@DoomBringerDANTE]

Whats wrong with Hero-Hammer?

[@cadiastands8]

Until GW adopts alternating activations, I just can’t enjoy 40K or AoS as much as I used to. “I go you go” (IGYG) is just too slow and antiquated for me. Until then, OPR wins it for me. Also, the ability to customize units/armies with the unit creator tool is really fun, as you can splash in models from other systems that you love and create thematic rules for them in your army! 👍

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I actually wondered whether this edition would be the one 40k moved to alternating activations. Especially as they minimised auras and we play off datasheets. But it's a massive change and I think they are scared to do it so we keep the alpha strike ! In terms of making up rules and playing with them there's no issue doing homebrew in 40k. I've made my daughter rules for her My Little Pony army 😅

[@archangel2709]

Me and my dad actually would play 40k without command points (we both hate them) and with alternating activations. It actually works really well the few games we played using that style were super close. I'd recommend trying it out!

[@Brickerbrack]

@@SimplyWarhammer OPR's Army Forge allows for Community Books - fanmade armies - and on their GDF Forge, there's actually a list for Friendship Ponies! 😜

[@hobbycathartic]

My main gaming group prefers to play OPR, Grimdark Future. It's just a clean and concise system. Games don't take hours to complete. We almost never have rules conflicts. The majority of factions feel balanced and the rules and points are constantly tweaked. Alternating activations keep the pace going and everyone active during the turn. The "you go, I go" system of 40k is just terrible. Most other games that we play, especially skirmish based games are alternating activation and combat just feels more dynamic. If you have the models for it, just try Grimdark Future. The base rules are free and the full rules add a nice layer of complexity without bloat.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

You have nicely described all the reasons to try grimdark over 40k 😁 I was hoping they'd bring alternating activations into 40k this edition, it's in every other game! The alpha strike really annoys me as a game feature 🙈

[@Stinderdaad]

For me I MUCH prefer the alternating turns of OPR, but like others have stated I really miss my characters being unique and have fun abilities. I also don't like that in OPR most models have the same amount of movement but it hasn't really been an issue so far in any games since my table isn't that big.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer I agree and would like alternating activations in 40k would help with the alpha strike problem ! If anything 40k datasheets now have too many special abilities, everything has something and even the same model in different factions has different special abilities 😅

[@guillermopacho7947]

@@SimplyWarhammer why do you think the alpha strike is a problem?

[@JimH.]

Herein lies the core issue of GW: They are a miniatures company that wants you to play a game, but they openly admit their priority is selling models and not the game. This leads to a myriad of problems. 1) Not enough resources allocated to every department. Clearly balance testing was not a thing; anyone who doubts this can look at the graph presented here. Technical know-how wasn't a thing either as is clearly shown by their repeated failures with the app. Marketing, normally a strength, has even started to fail with the blatantly obvious fudging of the "Battle for Whateverthehellitscalled planet" event results, leading to what will in all likelyhood be a "draw" and they will end up showing off both factions. When you have this right on the heels of the LoV disaster, it doesn't instill confidence in your company. 2) Intentionally buffing units in order to hit sales goals then nerfing the piss out of them in order to force players to buy the new, overpowered hotness. There are many examples, but rather than force people to read all of them, I'll simply say "Aggressors" and "Outriders" and leave it at that. 3) Selling you expensive models that allow for 'x' and 'y' customizations then suddenly making said customizations game-illegal. Nothing says "fun and enjoyable" like having your purchased, cleaned, assembled, painted and played with models suddenly be useless. All so you can rebuy them to assemble "legal" ones. Chaos lightning claw and/or combi-weapon terminators, we feel your pain. 4) Terrible army design. Gone are the days when 1 or 2 people (Andy Chambers, Jervis Johnson) wrote effectively every codex. Now you have several authors, each of whom seem to have zero communication with the others. This leads to situations where we have Eldar, an army that has never not been broken on release (forgive the double negative) and Death Guard at opposite spectrums. One army forces you to try hard to lose and the other dares you to try and win. The top 5-6 armies are roughly 20% (in wins) above the bottom 5-6. Even SM, the army that the perpetually offended criers on the internet said would be "beyond broken" because of OoM aren't winning 1/2 their games. It's time for GW to admit that while they have the best miniatures anywhere, they can't write rules to save their lives and either a) dip into those £500m quarterly profits and hire people for full time balance or b) admit they don't know how to do it and subcontract the rules.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Good points, and carrying on with what you say at the end, how about release the rules as beta rules, fully release them as beta to avoid leaks and openly say everything or nothing may change. Get the community using the new rules and have a system to collect feedback. Maybe pay or incentivise play testers and just don't worry about trying to keep things secret

[@JimH.]

@@SimplyWarhammer Well they have to do something. But as we all know, GW is far too concerned with squeezing every last dime out of their customer base and protecting their precious IP. If they just decided to make 5% less money and invest it in building a better game, they'd make more money in the long run.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

They probably feel they have done enough with what they've done in 10th. I just hope rules remain free, that will be a massive thing for them to do. Until there is some new leadership and direction I doubt GW will change their ways too much, it is a profit game for them after all

[@ThePastryGeek]

With the advent of 3D printing GW no longer has all the best models. There are several fantastic designers able to sell their sculpts as STL files instead of producing them in plastic.

[@Nobleshield]

It's ridiculous that the design team is like 5 guys at most, and those 5 guys seem to each be writing stuff on their own with little or no communication. Then you add stuff like the models being designed first, seemingly without any feedback from the designers, and the designers being told "Here add rules for this, it releases in 3 months" so they have to shoehorn things into the game because the model designers are off in their own world rather than making what a faction may need or reworking an old kit to bring it up to date.

[@grenfire5811]

You mentioned it briefly but the reason I much prefer OnePageRules is because of the alternating turns. Keeps the games more involved.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer I agree, not sure how it'd go in 40k, I would like it but would be a totally different game and I think people would leave the game. It would solve the alpha strike problem defo !

[@midnightrider1100]

I did not hear you mention alternating activations. ThT may be the biggest difference and the best pro in favor of OPR.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer, most other game systems have alternating actions and I thought it might have been the time for 40k with 'playing from datasheets' being so important. Buy guess its too big a jump for the community.... even though it'd solve the biggest problem in the game - The alpha strike

[@ColCaffran]

@@SimplyWarhammer I thought they would go for alternating activations, or alternating phases when they changed to 8th considering how much of an overhaul that was going to be.

[@Duppyman695]

A great video detailing the pro's and con's of both games and I totally agree when the codex release happens and rules for 40K become monetarised again, both OPR and Wahapedia are back in business.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Thanks and agree 😁 Its a shame the rules can't stay free and then people can buy versions as with the printed cards... erratas before the cards are delivered is ridiculous ... obviously rules should be digital

[@larrysmith703]

One page rules doesn't have to go head to head with 40k they are two different sets of rolls. I will not ever go back to 40k or GW's rules. I'm not saying that they are bad or good but they are not my cup of tea anymore. So I will stay with one page rules at this time. All those who play and want to have a good time can decide for themselves where they want to fall to the right or to the left. It's up to them. I wish them the best. Good gaming. Good times, good friends

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I agree, there doesn't need to be any direct competition as they are complimentary if anything, it creates a nice video idea though haha I'm interested how many people that play OPR also play 40k ..

[@Ironfrenzy217]

The complexity of secondaries in 9th and 10th make me lean towards OPR. Kill team is fun though!

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I'm still yet to play kill team, I like the idea of a skirmish game but no one to play with atm. The secondaries in 10th which are randomly drawn do make for an interesting and tactical game, you can't just go in with a set plan or just kill things

[@Ironfrenzy217]

@@SimplyWarhammer call me old fashioned but I like the idea of just do objective and kill. 9th and 10th require mobility and a constant shifting of priorities. I don't do multi tasking well. On top of that, Necrons and Votann don't really have mobility to do that so well.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

The game is what we play it, only tournaments focus and the more complicated way to score points, friendlies can do what you want. I regularly just play objective scoring when I play my son, hold 1 / hold more. The perhaps kill and kill more gets some points. We can play 40k simply 😃

[@alankennedy5759]

Grimdark Future!!! More balanced, more fun in less time.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Can't argue its more fun and faster 😁

[@nedlanduzuln9867]

I got hooked on OPR about 6 months ago, and don't see myself coming back to 40k for the foreseeable future. As a player, I just don't feel respected by GW. OPR bring back simple fun to the table.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

And thats the main thing, having fun. In the end a large corporate like GW doesn't care about us individual players even though 40k people feel its a community game it isn't !

[@xironbeastx8677]

I prefer the 40k lore over opr lore, but as a long time 40k player who converted entirely to opr and took his entire player group with him and now we all even 3d print our own stuff, Ima straight up say GW has burned every bridge with me, and 10th edition could be the greatest 40k experience ever made and I will refuse to play it, I don't trust them one bit to not price gouge and screw everything up. I will now do everything in my power to actively avoid giving them money, I will buy video games either on sale or second hand, I will buy the novels I enjoy second hand, I will use alternative companies now for paint, and I will actively attempt to steer newer customers away from them because they are totally toxic to the hobby space 🤷 thats my opinion.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

fair enough, they have certainly done enough over the years to bring many people to the same conclusion. I'm stuck with an addiction and far to invested now to escape their grasp lol 🙈

[@John_on_the_mountain]

Ive thought of playing regular 40k rules except each phase takes turns. For example, both players share Turn 1. movement phase, both players take turn moving units. Shooting phase, take turns shooting, and so on. Speed things up while keeping the depth

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer I've played 40k with alternating activations but because of unit abilities and auras it doesn't really fit so ended up activating 2 or 3 units a time (tried both). I wonder how a movement phase each would turn out 😅

[@stopmotiongarage220]

First off, a good video for quick comparisons. Others have pointed out how OPR has really worked hard to expand and be accessible. Personally, i think if GW wanted to take out OPR they kind of shot themselves in the foot with all of the space marine models they just sent to legands all at once. Now few people will feel like they can play major parts of what they used for first born, but they can be run them just fine as OPR Battle Bros or the Battle Bro subfactions that OPR has rules for. I know that's what i am left with for the few space marine models I've managed to collect so far.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Thanks very much 😊😁 and I agree the big 'cull' of the model range is a shame, people are attached to their collections so it's only a negative thing ! OPR will be there to nop up 😁 Doesn't get enough PR though

[@Diana2112Gaming]

The lack of being able to make Imperial Soup in 9th and 10th is why I'll be sticking with OPR. Being able to field Kriegers with my Space Wolves and Dark Angels in this tense allies of convenience kind of formation is just *fun* for me, ya know?

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer, some factions allow allies but they are pretty strict on it. You should be able to play what you want and just lose faction buffs. Of course while not an official option you can just do that anyway in friendly games 😁

[@Diana2112Gaming]

@@SimplyWarhammer aye, and in friendly games that's one thing. But for daily driving, OPR is just more end-user friendly, more competition friendly, and more combined forces friendly. Basically my thought process is as long as you're not trying to combine Imperium with Chaos or Imperium with Xenos, you should be mostly good (obviously there's a little more nuance than that). But saying you can't combine Space Wolves with ANY faction is stupid. I'm gonna shut up before I get on my old woman "GERROFFMYLAWN/BACK IN MY DAY/UP HILL. BOTH WAYS. AND WE LIKED IT." Soapbox.🤣

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Haha its a good soapbox though as you are right haha !

[@Diana2112Gaming]

@@SimplyWarhammer it's the kids these days with that newfangled rock music I tell ya! (Kidding, I actually dig my kid's music, she's into Iron Maiden)

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Haha

[@PynkPwny]

So as someone who is scouring the internet trying to decide what to play as I like Warhammer and Sigmar Lore the game itself isn't very interesting to me and is way too complex for a new player. I found OPR and honestly, it's cheaper for me someone who doesn't even have a 3D printer to spend the money on an average 200-300 dollar printer and support the smaller company that allows you to make models, customize armies and give them monthly support for a game that has massive potential and who listens to their player base. I'll also say that I really think the most fun part of the hobby will also be painting the models. Just 2 cents from someone who really likes Warhammer, but can't justify the high cost of entry... I've also watched some matches and the YGIG method of play is so boring... it's no fun if you can literally walk off during the other players' turn for the most part because the interactions are so one-sided and boring.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer agree with this, GW are pricing Warhammer out even though the majority of models are lovely. Also alternating activations is much better but just don't see it coming to 40k !

[@BrentWalker999]

As an adult with other stuff to do than play Warhammer, I love opr. The fane is fast, fun and easy to learn bit enough leat to be run after a ton of games.

[@BrentWalker999]

And I simply can't stand 3 to 4 hour games. I got stuff to do

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yes certainly opr is the faster format. It is a little strange how we've just accepted many hours games as normal 😆

[@SimplyWarhammer]

@BrentWalker999 I guess that's why Skirmish games exist too, it's a commitment to playing for hours including admin, setup and tidy away with 40k

[@BrentWalker999]

@@SimplyWarhammer I love skirmish games. Playing a lot of deadzone atm

[@SimplyWarhammer]

My son and I like Star Wars Legion as an alternative and don't really get my Skirmish in. We need something like that just for the time !

[@EyeXombie]

I can't wait for Ravaged Star. I think their rules are going to be some of the best.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

It does look good and with the backing it should get some traction so you have people to play!

[@artificieraustin4855]

Here a year later. Really wish 10th edition didnt take one step forward and 4 steps back. Swapping to OPR for good now

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I'm enjoying 10th but the constant rule changes makes it hard, not to mention the paywall for all factions with a codex, we should have access to all the rules !

[@armundojones]

By the end of 9th my group was bouncing between 3rd Edition 40k and OPR. When 10th came out one of the lads and I gave it a go and it was ok. But as OPR brings a bit more details on it's lore and how it diverges from it's predecessor the group is getting more excited. One of the gents has a craftworld eldar army but after looking at the background he thinks the Dark Elf Pirates are more interesting than the High Elf Fleets and while they are evil it's less gratuitous... so strong chance I'll be helping him print more minis for that army.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I've not played anything before 8th unless you count Horus Heresy which is based on 7th, whats 3rd Ed like then ? My shame is there's no one local that wants to play OPR more 😔

[@brunofrance4776]

I think the optional rules in the full OPR rulebooks are often overlooked. They can add that additional depth the players enjoy from 40k

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer I agree with you, I need to understand them more and give things more of a go 👍

[@DanielVisOneCade]

One of the things I can't sell people on enough is that OPR systems are so effective for participation games. If you are an established hobbyists is likely you own multiple forces, terrain and own a space to play or have access to one (that isn't a games workshop store) but you forever trying to find someone who can invest the same amount of time/money or learn the rules and arny specifics of say 40k. Well that's not a issue if your playing OPR you can just setup something up hand you mate A SINGLE PAGE (sure msybe double sided) and go you playing X everything you need to know is on the sheet let's play. My 11-year-old and 9-year-old recently played OPR with me they both had a 5 man "A-TEAM" style commando squad made up of Infinity the Game miniatures and some counts as Catachans from Reptilian Overlords. I ran a zombie horde as GM and they just had to extract a V.I.P from the centre of the table. Great game went perfectly everyone had fun and they never learnt the core rules just wasn't needed because the army list told them what they need each time IF relevant.

[@DanielVisOneCade]

BTW I played my obligatory game of 10th edition immediately I found even though the army builder was free and I could look things up effectively they still have NESTED RULES not accessible without opening another PDF or having the core rules book at hand. Plus shortly they will pay wall the army builder anyway just a total waste of time when you have multiple other systems offering near peer quality for no cost. 😅

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer the decision to pay wall the army builder is a rubbish one, it creates a barrier to the game and I won't be paying it. Also knowing the rules will start being charged for as a player that has lots of different armies fills me and my wallet with dread lol ! I also think there are too many special rules, as each unit has something, and even the same unit in different factions has different rules !

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I mean you can play 40k more simply and the rules aren't that complex if as a GM you help guide the flow, especially when it comes to what dice to roll and what numbers to look for. I play games with my 7yr old daughter and its super simple and fun and slightly more complex games (still stripped down though) with my 11yr old son. Mainly the thing is to keep a game short and the complexity and mission play really lengthens the game

[@DanielVisOneCade]

Most definitely 40k can be striped back and we all know a Red shirt is at this very moment somewhere doing a intro game because it's there job. But the various OPR systems just don't need to be striped back the have pretty effectively put their systems (core rules) in that sweet spot of been easy to learn, hard to master. Then ofcourse all the optional extra rules are what then add additional complexity or replayability for those who like more crunch, missions, campaign play etc. GW hit it's golden age in the late 90's early 00's with the Armageddon worldwide campaign etc. They still had dedicated rules team, the releases were frequent but not oppressive and most importantly some of the original games developers from the citadel team we're still at the helm. Once it changed to basically the bean counting MBA graduates running the show we have today it just went down hill and now the basically have jumped off the cliff.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I only joined the hobby at the start of 2020 I'm a newbie and have the current way of being baked in now. OPR is defo easier to pickup, even with the intention to make 40k 10th simple for new players . When I was trying it out I played with my son just to test that theory out and seemed easy to get going 😊

[@CaptainCean]

2:30 that didnt aged well

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Haha I know 🙈 I'm planning a follow up based on where we are now....

[@GT-ft1iz]

Learning about OPR has been good. I recently found out that I didn't have the full rull book for Grimdark Future. There are 3 sets of rules. Basic, Core, and Full. I have been a Patreon supporter for some time and just now realized that the link to Drive thru RPG is for the full book once you are a member. *hangs head in shame*. I really love the mission of OPR. Its our minis, and GW can piss off. Legends my ass..

[@SimplyWarhammer]

The patreon offering is really good if you are wanting to support them, there's lots of stuff available and I like the minis you can print too 😁

[@kaceeiacovone7840]

The biggest games in my local meta are old world, grimdark future and konflict 47. Around 300 to 400 players in our area.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Nice! That's a great community 😁 jealous lol

[@boneman-calciumenjoyer8290]

Oh yeah I know what you mean with availability. Except the game was AoS for me, never could find a group around where I live which played it. Everyone either plays 40k or WHFB (which I can't do anymore since I sold all my fantasy armies). OPR works for my group and thats all that matters for me. All in all interesting video, got my grey matter working.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Thanks very much 😊😁 yer the key thing is finding a game system a group wants to play together and then you are golden 😁

[@terrain4print]

We are definitely playing Warhammer 40k, but with OPR ruleset. Trying to shoehorn in all strange factions like admech, necrons, sisters, knights etc into a completely new universe feels very artificial. Free rules are nice but our main reason for playing OPR is it doesn't take all day. We can play a 6-man free-for-all 1500p (each) in 3 hours. Playing that in 40k would take all day.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer I think warhmmer really needs ways of playing for friendlies that are the cards that are also used for tournaments, games are super long! We can make up missions and I do with my son but we shouldn't have to create a part of the game GW should just have

[@timdefreitas1470]

Just have a look at the comments below for reasons other than balance as to why people play OPR. I tried a few games of 10th this week and there were just so many rules to remember and read. It feels like work to me.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

It's defo got a steeper learning curve and the pricing model for the rules is rubbish ! But I enjoy it and don't have a group that opr or I would play more !

[@yagsipcc287]

I honestly just enjoy OPR more than 40K I do like Horus Hersey as well, so OPR and HH are my go to games, Hell I use my HH armies in OPR and I have made some HDF for OPR that also work as Milita in HH :-) (Valor Korps from The Makers Cult as you showed them off in the video as well ha) as far as how the games run I enjoy the system better can have a super simple barebones game or add several rules make it more complex more goals in game etc... in 40k you pretty much have to do everything all the time, also as time goes on more and more books get added and are required (something that does get annoying even in HH) Also I enjoy mixing models from different creators and all also I mostly print things off these days tbh I rather it not only for the price but the amount of options be it bits to mix and match stuff together or just different models :-)

[@yagsipcc287]

Also I find OPR more balanced and they do updates alot (less now as they have been doing smaller updates as they mostly address issues and actually listen to feedback ha

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Ha that's funny you've already got those Krieg models 😄 It was a point I was going to make in the video actually that proxying isn't as well established in 40k as 3d printing now is. Mostly people print copies that could be originals but having stand in models that aren't kitbashed, especially a lot of them is very unusual. The rule of cool does apply and proxies that are great models are normally allowed. I would just suggest for people to ask a TO before a tournament if its OK 👍

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer 10th balance is in the bin atm and it didn't need to be if they'd but more effort in or engaged the community more

[@thecasualwargamer5195]

I've played a few games of GDF and i have really enjoyed it. GDF has a cool Rogue Trader era vibe to it which I like. However, it is the lack of any complexity which means I would stick to 40K. As you say, the potential player base for 40K games is much bigger and I know I can get games of it when I want. Still up for a game of GDF or AoF if the opportunity presents itself.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Thats cool, play whatever you fancy, thats the way 😁

[@benmorin1284]

I'd like to see if 40k player's opinion have changed since the launch of the paywall, I meant 10th edition, a few months later.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

yer its a good point, I think this needs an update as 10th goes on !

[@michaelslack7359]

I’ve got a full time job but can’t justify gw rules and codex books given how many games I get in so am trying to move my friends over to one page rules. Also excited by activations not turns

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer alternating activations is a big draw and I think something that will never come to 40k... but there's hope..

[@strohslights4996]

10th ed increased our player base for OPR GDF. Personal experience is all the people who where playing factions that were dropped have moved to OPR rather than loose their $40k, 40k army.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

You mean those with models going to legends so you can't play them have moved to keep playing them ? makes sense

[@strohslights4996]

@@SimplyWarhammer Exactly, they can use the armies they love that in some cases took years building.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I cry when I think of all my collection that is now legends 😢

[@braininajar853]

Hows those 10th edition data cards working for you?

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I actually like playing from the datacards tbh. You can group your units and leaders together and everything you need is pretty neat. Obvs you can manage the same with printing the pdfs and cutting them out, even though they don't nicely just print as you'd hope. 😁

[@thetabletopskirmisher]

Nothing's stopping folks from using OPR rules and 40K lore together.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yes definitely, the hobby is our own after all 😁

[@anymajordude87]

Thats what I do. I use my old GW models with OPR. The lore of 40k, the models I already own. but faster more fun games.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I wonder if that's a video on its own, which is more 'fun'... but then it's a theological discussion on what fun means lol 😁😅

[@thetabletopskirmisher]

@@SimplyWarhammer make the video! 😁

[@ClauseNight]

"All the rules are free and digital" and "free army builder" for now yes but that only lasts until the codexes drop then you MUST pay for it. OPR seems cool but it is "too" watered down. Factions have no differences besides mainly some weapons. Armies all feel the same.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer the free stuff isn't lasting long with GW, but you can get rules and free army building through BattleScribe 😁 As you say it is one of the other benefits of 40k, armies do feel very different to play

[@bladerdj3503]

The price difference will always make OPR viable I think. You can technically use proxies for 40k too but I often heard of purists who insist using the real models etc.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

That can be the case but I mostly fi d the rule of cool wins out and if it looks good and isn't obviously modelling for advantage then people are chill... full printed armies is unusual in 40k though, there is a stigma

[@MartynStanleyAuthor]

I keep meaning to give OPR a go, but I don't think my models translate well. I don't know anyone who plays and I don't have someone to try it with. I could try and get the kids to - they've tried 40k but they weren't impressed. I could ask at the hobby club I visit if anyone plays - but actually? I don't think anyone does.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

That is always a challenge with games, finding people to play with! My local scene isn't very busy!

[@kallesvensson253]

OPR ftw don't have time or money for GWs rules set. And what I mean with is both game length and time to keep up with there endlessly greedy release schedule.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

it is a never ending uphill slog to keep up to date 🙈 but I love it lol

[@kallesvensson253]

@@SimplyWarhammer alot of ppl still love it it seams :)

[@SimplyWarhammer]

lol indeed 😁 we are addicted to the plastic crack !

[@kallesvensson253]

@@SimplyWarhammer me to but not their paper :)

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Haha good point 😁

[@kevinh.9939]

Grimdark Future is simply a better game, and that's on top of being free. I love the 40k lore, but that's not enough to keep me around when GW is already starting in on the same old BS they always get up to.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

It is a well loved game by those that play which is ace 👍

[@dave4deputyZX]

Alternate activation, thats the most important difference IMO

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer I think they are a great idea and would solve the problem of the alpha strike

[@simonmorley4816]

I intend to give OPR a go I'm not totally happy with GW's approach to 10th and it seems deeply unbalanced (as mentioned in the video) I happen to already own a lot of the more unbalanced stuff and am taking advantage while I can, partially in the hopes that it will be seen by the GW balance team how they have skewed the meta

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer make hay while the sub shines 😅 It'll take a while I think for balance to return, there may be a new update soon though 🤞

[@Jeff-ne1lh]

About the so called “updates’ most people play 40k with the rules as written unless they are in or practicing for a tournament unless there is a rule that is completely broken….no one stands around waiting for GWs next rule revision…it’s stupid to.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Agreed, you have to play with what you have or the way a TO might rule on something 👍

[@michaelstanet7453]

40K is widely more popular, and their are lots of people that just want to play 40K. There is nothing inherently wrong with people likening 40K, and people should play what they want to to play. However I do want to say that for many (most?) people who want to play 40k it is because the like the models, lore, not eager to learn a new system (even one that is more streamlined and intuitive) and existing community of players 40k provides. If this is what you value, OPR may not have much to offer you. On the other hand I don't know a lot of people who say they want to play 40k because they really like the rules, feel that GW does a good job with balance, avoiding power creep/bloat, /balance, or values play testing over "churn it out, sell it and maybe fix later". Furthermore not a lot of 40k players will say GW makes all units/factions relevant, or that the game is designed in a way to make it easy to get to the table a play a whole battle that does not 4+ hours. There are also not many people who chose 40K because they think GW is consumer friendly. OPR rules are not written wholly are mostly in service of selling miniatures, and GW rules are. If rules, balance, ease of play, factions getting mostly equal attention, and consumer friendly practices are your primary concern, then OPR has much more to offer to you then GW.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I think what some of this boils down to is that 40k players are 'locked' into the game system by being so invested with their model collection and money / time spent so far. That will always be a blocker to switching, the biggest blocker to running multiple systems is time. I like playing Horus Heresy and Star Wars Legion but both suffer from time as most my time goes into 40k! Thanks for the comment though, cheers

[@michaelstanet7453]

@@SimplyWarhammer Yes I agree, almost everyone wishes that we had more time and resources to devote to the hobby. Some gamers are very hard up on one or both. The games we choose to play are a combination of preferences and circumstances. Some people who play 40k/AOS actually like and choose those systems, but it does not seem to be a majority. This is hardly scientific, but a few months ago I went looking for KZbin videos of 40k/AOS content creators, where they expressed very positive opinion of rules, mechanics and game play experience (especially in comparison to other similar games). I believe I only found one video like this. This creator is active in tournament/competitive AOS and spoke about really enjoying the complexities of list building, sub-faction choices, and hero/command options that AOS provides that other more streamlined games do not. So after an hour or two of searching I found one person who enthusiastically choose the game based on rules/mechanics/gameplay, and this was for a very specific aspect of the game that only a tiny fraction of players participate in (high level completive). By comparison you can easily find multiple videos of creators expressing preference for One Page Rules specifically for rules/mechanics/gameplay often going into detail of the ways they find it better than 40k/AOS. It just seems like 40k in particular is widely popular (in terms of people choosing to play it) and yet many of these players feel very lukewarm about the game system itself. Of the people who don't have issues with the game system, I wonder how many have never player anything else and therefore have nothing to compare it against.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I would say the 40k youtube community largely responds more to negative, controversial or in some way sensational video making so something saying positive things about the game won't get anywhere 🙈 lol I wonder whether the majority of 40k hobbyists are actually collectors first that try and get a few games in second, the competitive scene is a smaller subset but one that seems to be noisiest in social media and one that GW focuses more effort on!

[@anymajordude87]

The irony here is that competitive 40k is not balanced and the games would be more about skill than money and time spent with a different rule set.@@SimplyWarhammer

[@anymajordude87]

I would add that I agree with not wanting to learn a "new" rule system is a deterrent. (true for me for sure) but what I found was that One Page Rules is the same d6 system so familiar to players of 40K. the units and rules are similar enough to reduce the learning curve, just leaving out some of the parts that take up extra time. I would encourage the reluctant player not wanting to "learn new rules" to review Grimdark Future rules during their opponents turn in their next game of 40K. They may be surprised to discover how easy it is to parse. By the end of that game of 40k they will likely have had time to learn the "new" system and build an army in the free app that matches the force they have on the table. Next game could be three games played with the same army in the same amount of time.

[@golvic1436]

Until GW stops their insane price gouging OPR will always win against 40k by default.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

And something that's not necessarily affecting me in the UK but the unfair pricing in other countries...

[@DeusMachina71]

I started playing GW games in 1986, a couple of years back I dropped all current and new GW gamss from my play shelf over dissatisfaction with 40k 9th ed and detesting AoS (I started with WFB 3rd edition and then a little later Space Marine, Titan Legion and finally Rogue Trader) The bad, poorly written, unbalanced convoluted rules spread, the over priced games and models, the product hamster wheel all converged to make me kick them to the curb in favor of games like OPR and Kow. I'll never buy into another game thats 1- not miniatures agnostic, 2- has an elitist boutique attitude and lastly is owned by a major Corperation that puts its quarterly profits over its player base and the health of the game. I'm not looking back and while I may pick up a GW rule book if it interests me I'm just seriously not interested in their over sized and over priced models anymore particularly considering my 3d printers work at fraction of the price and the model quality is amazing and everything in my fantasy collection is kept at a sensible 28mm and not heroic 34mm as GW has headed lately, I hate their scale these days. bye bye GW I don't need you.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

You are not alone and tbh we are in a glorious time for tabletop gaming, especially with how great 3d printers are now 😁

[@xiuyoalli]

This video get old and false so fast , with the new prices and rules gatekeeping for 10tj

[@SimplyWarhammer]

It did didn't it 🙈 I'm planning a follow up. The paying for rules is so annoying, and considering how good it was having them free for a short time. They should as minimum make all rules available for a subscription

[@kwinland]

Love the background of 40k, but the OPR rules WIN, hands down.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I think thats the same for a lot of OPR fans 👍 I can see why too

For OPR not "everything is free". Part of the rules are locked behind a subscription.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer there is an extended ruleset behind patreon, but then you get additional stuff as well.

[@cameronward9443]

I go you go is a design choice by GW... it's not antiquated. I find it so funny how people has this take. Wargaming has been around for like 200 years and in that time plenty of games have been I Go You Go and others have been Alternating activations. They both have their pro's and cons. Why do I say this? Well the reason why GW will always be a full round per side is because how all their special abilities, command points, stratagems characters etc etc etc work. This is also the reason why One Page Rules needs to just be their own thing and not proxy rules for 40k or AOS... because frankly it's sucks to play 40k factions in OPR. The flavor of the factions is completely missing. So hot take takeaway... you're ALLOWED to play more than one wargame you know... it's not a decision to make. There are plenty of fun wargames with slightly different rules and things like Initiative for activations etc etc... Keep Warhammer warhammer and OPR as OPR. Go play Bolt Action, or Legion or Warmachine or whatever. Go have fun

[@SimplyWarhammer]

My suggestion on alternating activations is more a thought of where 40k might go, I agree it's IGYG by design and does work. To be honest the alpha strike isn't a thing any more in 40k 10th as it was in previous editions 👍

[@masterwilliam8704]

Well...inhale deep breath. Here we go OPR will one day rival GW in fan base OPR is still growing and is expanding the lore. GW has always suffered from power creep and always will. Why GW puts out rules is beyond me. They will just turn around and put out an army that breaks the rules completely and wonder why their shit is broken. They don't care about balance, just buy our crap so we can make the next better so you can buy our crap again. OH you like that faction well we don't so we will half ass it and ignore it for years. Same ol crap from GW. GW doesn't care about its community just its IP and money, money, money. So please quit pissing your money away on GW. OPR is, and always will be a superior option to GW. I switched I few years back. Got a resin and fdm printer for less then the cost of 1 GW army...don't get me started on the cost of GW. Found a new hobby in 3d printing and saved so much, that I got more armies and terrain then I can keep up with. Please save yourself and switch over to OPR. It's OK you can bring your non printed GW models with you we don't mind, even the ones GW left behind.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Thanks for this. It is strange as GW say they are a miniature company and we always see practices relating to sales of new stuff, as you say they get the best rules. And yet they do write rules and make a big thing of metawatch and balance. They update rules and points to try and keep things level. It's like 2 parts of the same company tugging at different ends of the same rope 😆 I don't think 3d printing is exclusive to none gw games though. Its so common now that people print replicas or even just cool proxies. The tournament I went to this weekend the winning Tyranids army was a 3D print Iron Hive army from Makers Cult and looked fantastic. I think it'll be good for everyone in OPR genuinely grows to compete with 40k, but it is the chicken and the egg scenario as people won't jump until its more popular 🙈 Thanks for watching 👍

[@blackmagick77]

OPR is killing OPR. It used to be simple and fun but now they're taking away anything that makes the armies unique, nerfing everything into wet noodles (except prime marines of course) and just making very dumb changes right rules.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Oh really ! I might need to look into this, seems like an interesting video on itself! Cheers 😊

[@davidcashin1894]

Probably an apples v oranges discussion. Is OPR really aimed at taking over the Sci Fi tournament community?

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I don't believe they are. Their target audience, at least for Grimdark Future is the 40k crowd though, but I think their goal is to make something accessible and fun. OPR players will often try and convert 40k players which becomes their trait, however I think that's often only to get more people to play as the OPR community just isn't that big. It's a nice angle for a video though 😊

[@kevinfogle7929]

I recently bought the rules for OPR's Grimdark warfleet, which would be their version of Battlefleet Gothic. Very nice rules.

[@raptorimperium5757]

Do you still believe in this vid or have your thoughts changed? I believe new things came out and such but i could be wrong

[@SimplyWarhammer]

tbh I think I need a follow up video to this now 10th has been out a while, established and the codices are coming out :-D

[@raptorimperium5757]

@@SimplyWarhammer one thought I have to put in is that one page rules is so much more accommodating to people like me who has an entire army of old tactical marines I do not want to pay exorbitant prices so my army is "viable" I already paid and painted my army and I do not want to pay again. My necron friend also is sick of GW as the necrons to him are so bad this edition, im not sure about other players but this is just my little game corner we're in and I thought you might like some thoughts from casual players

[@051biohaz]

Games workshop pricing model means I will never play it

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Are you interested in 3d printing?

[@Zibit21]

Nope. GW just can't stop being GW. After an initial tokens of good will they went back to their usual ways. 40k will (apparently) always be less agile than OPR. And the 10th is still not simple enough to ease the introduction for new players.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer I'm really disappointed we are just back buying books again rather than free rules or a subscription to get ALL the rules ! The amount of time I want to check opponent abilities it'll become impossible as codices are rolled out !

[@shocker1209081]

Imo 10th edition oversimplified too many of the wrong things and heavily limits customization. Most of the rules I've seen people praise are features flat out copied from OPR. Like fluid army building and universal special rules. Getting rid of those phase specific rules that varied by army and the 500 stratagems was a good idea. Calling every single weapon in the Vanguard veterans box an "heirloom weapon" so there's no functional difference between a chainsword and a thunder hammer was a bad idea. I liked chapter and successor rules, I don't like being forced to use power level under a different name. I'm actually more than a little insulted by that. Did they think the problems power level had would go away by calling it points? Did they think I wouldn't notice that it's an identical system with larger numbers? Did they think I just didn't give power level a chance and FORCING me to use it was the solution? No. No I'll have none of that, and I'll have none of their $50 hardcover codices that'll be OP for a week before the errata comes down, only to be replaced by the next.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Loads of good points to respond to there 😁👍 The USRs as a concept came from 40k 7th edition as it was in vogue with the release of new Horus Heresy rules, I don't know where that came from in concept of course.. i'm not that knowledgeable of gaming history. I also like faction flavour and don't like power level, its too simple and we've lost interesting customisation. In particularly you can't take a vanilla squad to save money, you always have to take the best bit of you are wasting points. I think they went the power level way to keep it easy and simple for the start of the edition. Its also lots of effort to figure out wargear prices and I bet they didn't want it. I think it'll be back though. And we'll get faction flavour with codex releases 🤞 fingers crossed Thanks for the comment 😁

[@shocker1209081]

@@SimplyWarhammer Ahh, I started in 8th. Wasn't aware that USRs were something OPR brought back. Still, it's a good idea and I'm happy they went back to it. I definitely hope you're right about the special rules and customization returning. Either way I know OPR has me covered. ^-^

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I started in 8th too at the start of 2020, I only know about 7th because I got swept along by the hype of the Horus Heresy 2.0 release lol 🙈 and that game is based on 7th... I obvs don't know what will happen I just really hope they bring back the flavour and avoid literally everything having a special rule, which seems too much... especially when the same model but in different factions has different special rules lol

[@joriankell1983]

Universal special rules existed before OPR. It's just a recycled idea because that's how GW fakes rules improvements: reimplementing old ideas that actually worked.

[@joriankell1983]

​@@SimplyWarhammerUSR existed back as far as 4th edition

[@Jharlax]

Besides the anti capitalistic touch great Video.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Haha thanks 😅

[@hectorfr]

Gran video como siempre,gracias amigo

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Un placer, gracias por ver 😁

[@thedousehousewatercolorexp5745]

10th is garbage. Like 9th. OPR or Kill Team 2.0 for me

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I really like 9th and 10th tbh but each to their own, OPR is also lots of fun and i'm surprised it just not bigger than it is

[@redgreen09]

well me like do both and 1oth edds free stuff make lot easer then that me like a lot NON GW minis yes got tunes the ho hum guys and my NON GW minis will not go past my GW ones and in fucher will see new minis tell then i just work with what got

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Have you played one page rules games before and liked them ? 😁

[@redgreen09]

@@SimplyWarhammer no not yet got print it up and cavices some to do it to

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Lol almost then 😅

[@stockade-5897]

Well.. as a 40k player i must say that the lore is very poorly integrated on most armies these days, my club only view Warhammer though the prism of competitive scene and the whole index/errata/commentary with no patch note or warning is annoying. Thanks for that vid, I'll try OPR when i can:)

[@SimplyWarhammer]

You are right 40k really has gone very much down the competitive route and lore isn't really part of it. Of course in friendlies people can bring that back and doesn't have to be competitive only, it's a shame if your club only has 1 view. I think Horus Heresy keeps the lore and narrative feel more but it is just marines on marines generally!

[@stockade-5897]

@@SimplyWarhammer i wouldn't complain if that mean less disparities in the rules, precise wording and a better structure in general, but it isn't the case really :x (i may be a bit partial as a Votann player)

[@SimplyWarhammer]

🙈 the Votann got really screwed the Is edition! A kneejerk reaction to the 9th edition feedback that went too far 😬

[@GrumblingGrognard]

lol 10th edition will NEVER be balanced.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

You are probably right 🤣😅

[@cortofredudu]

The only problem I see with your video is that it didn't grow old ... The begging of 10th codex release and the Warhammer+ subscription needed for a more usable Army builder is making this sadly outdate. Thanks to GW giving content creator an endless job

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yes indeed, the Great start of 10th hasn't aged well ! I did warn of that in the video but it is commentary at a point in time, and at the time of the release 40k was free. Now as always you can get your results for free from dodgy means, and the index pdfs still work with only a few mods. I think I'm going to dona follow up vid on this soon 😁

[@cortofredudu]

@@SimplyWarhammer some french creator said we have to start a codex strike and only play with the free resources. (So basically download keep all the indexes) Sure it's a very french approach on an problem but imagine what message players could send to games workshop by boycotting the codexes

[@SimplyWarhammer]

There have been a few attempts to boycott GW for different reasons but never really made a change. Defo have your say with your wallet

[@scythebergon418]

Last I heard online codex will still be free, books will be a collector aspect now

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Oh really! Now that would be amazing 😀 where did you get the info from? It's a great idea if that's what they do 😁

[@xiaojunzi]

I go you go is just bad game design. No other explanation needed.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer I wonder if 40k will ever move to alternating, I imagine it's too big a shift but we'll see 🤷‍♂️

[@xiaojunzi]

@@SimplyWarhammer yeah, I’m skeptical as well. 40ish years is a lot of “tradition” to overcome!

[@ericfrank4991]

I used to play a ton of 40k back during 4th - 6th ed. Got out of the hobby due to having kids. Now I’m getting back into the hobby and even though I love 40k lore, I’ve found myself moving into the OPR range. Plus 3D printing whole armies sound awesome. I’m sold on it and supporting it now.

[@BrooksVlad]

Don’t see how but hey

[@SimplyWarhammer]

It was a video of its time. When 10th Ed was just out, all the rules and app were free and we didn't know how bad balance was lol

[@xiuyoalli]

This video got old really fast, 10th is more expensive , unbalanced and awful than anything else. And this shit of one good codex , one bad codex is really disappointed

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Haha it did !! There was a short window at the start of 10th were things (except balance) were rosey... now balance is tonnes better the paying for rules is back 🙁 as someone who spends the time to learn as many armies as possible it's expensive ! And it's sometimes just so I have the rules on the app to look at rules while playing against an opponent. I won't say for wh+ but would if it came with rules included...

[@RussellWilliams736]

OPR the game is superior to 40k.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Which 1 feature do you think makes it superior or is it all areas added together that make it? 🙂

[@hendrikmoons8218]

The one page rule system is for introduction to the main game. The 'real' game is way to complex/intricate for this. This one page rules set is horible for tournaments.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer I don't think there's any point having a tournament scene around OPR. Do you or have you played much Grimdark Futures ?

[@hendrikmoons8218]

@@SimplyWarhammer Allas not recently. , I've been in and out of the hobby the last 3 years. Before that, from the mid 1990ies I did joined a lot of tournaments. Mainly warhammer fanasy, but also 40k. One page rules are not my thing, like chess. I'm certain chess learns you things, but in the end I like the freedome that comes with building your own army to an agreed amounr of points and then just playing a campaign. At the moment I'm getting back into 40k with Harelquins and Plague marines, Mortarion's finest. For AOS, the enrire Death faction.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Cool. Well I like chess myself haha Interesting 40k army choices. Harlequins is my 10th edition army but they aren't a faction any more 😔 and Death Guard are another fav of my son and I but they are one of the weakest in 10th atm 🙄

[@Grimshak81]

What a Nonsens. OPR is a much better balanced game. Besides: there is more than the basic rules, there’s the “full rulebook” that has stratagems, supression and much more mission types. I just think you don’t know OPR good enough.

[@hendrikmoons8218]

@@Grimshak81 OPR is for short low points and/or introduction games. For anything else it is way to limiting. For instance terain, visibility of units, multi stored buildings. Hard cover versus softcover, what constitudes a cover safe, what is an armor safe modifier, what is an invulnerable safe(ward safe). How flyers diferentiate from hovercrafts. Witch units can give suport fire. How and when to panic test and to regroup. No, OPR cannot and will not cover the indept of a proper 2k army on each side game. Also OPR is not good at balancing at all. It copy pastes the rules for every unit/army all over the place so there is ZERO diference between a marine scout, a Tau fire warior and a guardsmen. If that were the intend, then why have so many different armies? If your goal is to introduce your younger nephew to the game with 500 points on each side, straight from the starter box on your mom's kitchen table, go ahead we hava all been there, me included. On the other hand, if you are aiming at a 2k points game in preparation for a tournament or a multi game/week campaign, well OPR is too simplistic. Too narow minded, not tactical/strategic enough. OPR leaves too many blind spots and to erata that, well, it will be many pages after that. And after 10 games, haven't you played all the games that system has to offer? Just by moving 3D terain pieces and adding a new bunker instead of a hill, you completely changed the game. And thereby, made it a new challange, not a /repeat of last three battle, lets see who roles best now. Also, having most of the rules in the main book means that YOU and everybody else knows 90% of the full game minus race specific odeties. You get way less weird rules interviening with the codex and visa versa. Let alone the tons of erata's.

[@GeoffreyofCastille]

I've played 40k off and on since the beginning of 2nd ed, and end of 9th really pushed me away from the game and over to OPR. I love the lore of 40k, but I honestly got tired of both chasing the pricepoint dragon of rules (not even talking about minis, just the NECESSARY books to play the standard game) as well as the overall mindset of the majority of the 40k player base (at least in my area - 95% super competitive players who will actively scoff at playing a narrative game rather than one testing their newest netlist for the next ITC tourney). Ironically when I do feel like playing 40k, I really enjoy playing 2nd and 3rd ed games.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I've not played anything earlier than 8th ed unless you count Horus Heresy but definitely 9th and 10th are very tournament focused and with the amount of youtube content also the same it really drives play that way. I think it should be fun 1st unless you are at a tournament so its about a group of people more than the game system OPR or 40k... still OPR pulls in more fun oriented play which is nice, I just don't have a group near me that play

[@buryitdeep]

They are not even comparable. Like Advanced Squad Leader VS Risk.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

In reality they aren't necessarily comparable but GDF is the 40k equivalent in the OPR world and is trying to be everything 40k isn't in terms of game play. Not competitive of course

[@buryitdeep]

@@SimplyWarhammer Agreed

[@40kalltheway6]

Never wanted to play one page rules and don't know anyone in my gaming group that does either !

[@SimplyWarhammer]

I guess thats a big challenge, if there's no one around to play why would you get into it !

[@mwu2712]

I have been dicked over by GW too many times. I dont care if the new edition plays great and can cure my diabetes, i wont be playing in GW sphere again. OPR lets me play with my old stuff and not worry about GWs unethical schemes.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

😅 haha this made me laugh 😃 It has made me sad seeing so much of the range (which I have) being put to legends or removed

[@zenex1741]

Being a Thousand Sons player, I'm not a fan of 10th edition at all. The complexity got stripped back way too far on them, and now SOT our most impactful infantry aren't nearly as good as they were.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

Yer as a psychic heavy faction in both game (previously) and lore (more importantly) is a big blow to have the phase removed ! Strange when you have 2 of the most powerful psykers in the game after the emperor in Magnus and Ahriman, and their abilities are reduced to a shooting attack lol

[@zenex1741]

@@SimplyWarhammer Gone from having like 27 magical powers, to having 5 and some slightly spicy shooting.

[@SimplyWarhammer]

sad times. but most armies have had to adjust somewhere, just some more that others