A Disturbing Comic About Loneliness

[@Dantalliumsolarium]

Oh this was fascinating, makes me want to read the other stories because the concepts sound really interesting. This also is a good example of like, the main character does not mean they are always in the right. Love your work!

[@RatatTalks]

The full trilogy are fun reads and pretty short if you can look past some of George’s more visceral and sometimes just gross writing

[@KevinPendragon]

This vid popped up in my recommendations and I clicked eager to hear someone else talk about this dark and disturbing story. Imagine my shock when I heard my name get mentioned! This was excellent analysis. You picked up on things that I completely missed. Meathouse Man is a tough read because of the graphic content but also because you can just *feel* how personal it is. It's like reading someone's journal. Anyway, thanks for the shout out. Off to binge the rest of your vids

[@RatatTalks]

This comment has made my day, I’ve been a fan of your videos for the longest time. Appreciate the kind words!

[@Bloodycupcake54]

lust is desire with the absence of love

[@RatatTalks]

So true

[@Ephenger]

Very compelling analysis really well done

[@RatatTalks]

Thanks Lego Riddler!

[@InkyIsScared]

Out for a day and so few views?? Criminal! A great analysis, I think I'm going to go look for the short story myself now. Just describing the character and the plot in this summary gave me absolute flashbacks to men I have had encounters with that were clearly trapped in the same spiral. I think the commentary and themes are very much more relevant today than they might've been at the time of publication. Great thematic connections to be made between internet anonymity/depersonalization and incel culture. As a side note, I wonder if there's any deliberate parallel to be drawn between him viewing corpses (and people) as meat and being able to manipulate them better. Seeing them not as ex-people with moral and ethical implications and lives of their own makes him subconsciously better at exploiting them. I would have to read more of the short stories and the full comment to flesh that thought out I think.

[@RatatTalks]

I think that’s an interesting bit of speculation as to how being more morally dubious makes someone a better manipulator, and is supported as the other two corpse handler PoVs in the other two stories are also kind of terrible people.

[@kathylennerds750]

My god. Many thoughts about this, I'll say. Firstly, I stuggle to sympathize with this sort of character because of how dangerous individuals like that are irl. It is very interesting that this, I imagine, older story is so applicable to today's situation for many boys and men online, especially. The idea as well you mentioned, that Crager doesnt actually *want* real connection with another person but just someone to validate his existence and reflect himself back to him, I think is very real. Like yeah, it's sad but a self-dug grave imo. Additionally, and this might be mostly my own POV but the hard focus on finding connection through romantic love instead of literally anything else is probably the saddest part to me about this story and pointing towards the problem mentioned above as well. He has so many opportunities to find connection with people around him that wouldnt be dictated by sex but thats probably what makes it unappealing to him. Super interesting video anyways bc I had never heard of this story before!

[@RatatTalks]

Yeah I think it is hard to feel sympathy for this kind of person because it is so largely self-inflicted as you say, but it’s worth noting that Trager was a teenager when he was inducted into this way of thinking by his older male coworkers. He’s effectively groomed to be a bad guy, and whilst it’s on him that he never progresses, it’s the fault of his role models that he developed these thoughts to begin with. The sexual focus is an issue with a lot of masculine relationships as a whole, not just between men and women but between men and men, as men with this mindset tend to view each other as competition. Trager and Don argue a lot over women, and Trager and his coworkers at the start all ridicule each other for not being as masculine as they ‘should’ be. Very interesting how well this story has aged, I appreciate the insight into your perspective.

[@kathylennerds750]

⁠@@RatatTalksTotally! As usual, patriarchy and capitalism ruin everyone, including those that are benefiting from it. Story ends perfectly in that way, with him on top of the world but with his life completely devoid of meaning and feeling :0

[@wyssmaster]

​@@kathylennerds750"This is a story about how a young man objectifies women and refuses to see them as anything but sex objects" "Ah, yes, classic capitalism" You have no idea what you're talking about

[@Arc_Soma2639]

I love this kind of niche things fortunate enough having found your channel, keep going, hope you explode in popularity soon.

[@RatatTalks]

Thank you!

[@nont18411]

Seems like Trager was a model of Tyrion Lannister and Littlefinger, considering how empty, cynical and hedonistic all of them are. And the reason I also include Tyrion is because if we look into the details, he wasn’t a good person in the first place (GRRM is so good at writing villains that he made us still root for House Lannister. The only two characters from this family who are actually good people are Myrcella and Tommen and that’s simply because they weren’t raised closely by Cersei to end up as a psychopath like Joffrey). When Tywin ordered his soldiers to gang-r*pe Tyrion’s first wife, Tysha (whom Tyrion also r*ped), Tyrion barely took any issue with it because Tywin and Jaime lied to him that Tysha is a sex worker. It was when Jaime revealed that Tysha was actually a normal girl who genuinely loved Tyrion that made Tyrion furious and killed Tywin. Tyrion didn’t care if a sex worker gets sexually assaulted because he never respects them as a human being. That’s why after Tysha left him, he then found a replacement in Shae and deluding himself that she actually loved him and wasn’t with him for money (and once Shae betrayed him after getting paid by Cersei, he murdered her in cold blood and never thinks about her again). He never really considers an act of sexually assaulting someone to be morally wrong, only about what type of people who got it. In my opinion, Meathouse Man can also be considered as the “Evil 500 Days of Summer”.

[@RatatTalks]

For sure that connection is there, George loves to reuse archetypes and plotlines so the parallels are super apparent. Kevin Pendragons video on Littlefinger discusses this connection at length so I recommend it. Evil 500 days of summer made me giggle, that movie was already kind of evil.

[@nont18411]

@@RatatTalks Call me weird but the more I dive deeper into Tyrion and Jaime’s character, the more I dislike them. Because their delusions about thinking themselves as good people are much more insidious than those of Cersei, who never thinks she’s a good person. Plus her delusions are much more fun to read.

[@RatatTalks]

I loooooove Cersei chapters she’s so messy and chaotic

[@reynaashes]

SOOO EXCITED TO WATCH !! A video before my birthday this weekend,, lucky me

[@RatatTalks]

Happy birthday!!

[@KogKog-wengine]

happy birthday 🎂

[@bilis2866]

Tyrion also follows this archetype, he's not full meathouse man ending yet like petyr but is going there

[@RatatTalks]

Yeah he even has the ‘I’ve fucked a corpse’ line, and the dynamic with Penny is very similar to the second part of this story.

[@KatieMadsen-pe6im]

I do believe the 'male loneliness epidemic' is real, but it can be hard to feel sympathy when a lot of men seem to want women to be objects they can control rather than a genuine connection. It is a real issue though, where men especially are becoming so lonely that their loneliness turns to anger, and so comes forth the incel. Rejection shouldn't be your driving force to blame women for your loneliness. Tragers infatuation with the Meathouse girls reminds me of porn addicts, who disregard a real connection with a person because they have this ideal person easily accessible on a screen, and when they do finally meet someone, they're disappointed. Porn can fulfill many desires (apart from real connection), whereas a potential partner might express their dislike for certain sexual acts or kinks, or like Laurel be less attractive or experienced. Trager, from watching this video, seems like he will only ever be happy if a person lives up to a Meathouse girls expectations. Laurel might of been everything he wanted if he had never had that first Meathouse interaction, but now his expectations will always be impossible to live up to as a real woman. I do feel really bad for him, because constantly chasing connections to no success is so painful. But it REALLY seems like he feels that women should be fulfilling his loneliness, and that this is their JOB, rather than 'I care about this persons interests, beliefs, dreams'. When does he express what he can do for them to support them? Maybe going off topic but I think a really great film that easily shows the difference between incel-like behaviour and a man accepting rejection is Megamind. With Megamind accepting rejection and of course being upset, but Titan instead uses it as his driving force as a villain. Great videooo! Hype for F&H!

[@maplestick2369]

@KatieMadsen-pe6im the megamind connection is so real actually. learning to take rejection as an opportunity to grow is difficult but sooo worth it. ur conment is so real and i totally agree. it sucks that they think that way and it really does just make life harder for everyone involved

[@RatatTalks]

Amazing comment and I couldn’t agree more, especially with the megamind comparisons. Goated movie.

[@SetariM]

You're falling into the same pit though. Men should not be seen purely as providers and a wallet. "When does he express what he can do for them to support them?"

[@katiemadsen5325]

​@@SetariM I definitely did not mean it like that. All I meant was, if you are only concerned with what a woman can provide for you, shouldn't you be able to provide something back? Relationships shouldn't be about things like sex in exchange for money or anything like that though. I obviously don't agree with a relationship being an exchange, it should be a partnership.

[@maplestick2369]

@SetariM oh, i saw that comment more of a general question rather than a financial one. like "what has he done to support them emotionally, physically, etc." yk? like how lovers are meant to help each other. though i do think it's good to reiterate the fact that men should never just be there for financial gain.

[@giornogiovannax4124]

well this was interesting and thrilling. very good video

[@minami1824]

Peak incel story writing

[@RatatTalks]

GRRM incel arc

[@nont18411]

@@RatatTalks And he never escape that

[@maplestick2369]

guess who hasn't read this story but will still write their thoughts on the video? 🎉 okay, but seriously, this is an interesting story about patriarchy. as we're all well aware, patriarchy affects everyone, not just women (though us who are born female tend to get the shorter end of the stick). this is a major way in which this plays out. there is such an emphasis on power with men. they have to dominate what they do, get a good job, be the best at their field, impress other men and compete with them. so on and so forth. but that's what leads to such resounding spikes of loneliness. power is the antithesis of connection. it inherently rejects all attempts at humanization out of fear of losing its higher status. in this story, trager (god i hope im spelling that right) has placed himself above all the women in his life. he views himself as more because he thinks of them as objects for his pleasure. that is a power dynamic that he imposes onto them. but, it's not just him. virtually all other men think the same way, his friends encourage him to keep trying to find love. they compete and they force each other to negate any humanity the women in the story could have. male relationships here are also rather surface level. men keep each other in check, forcing notions of masculinity on children when they're young, as seen by the trip to the "meathouse" when the mc is just a teenager. thing is, society is a two way street. it affects us and we affect it back. our relationships with each other dictate the relationships our children will have. its that inherent interconnectedness that i think characters like this miss. they're so lost in the sorrows pushed onto them they forget they can push back. instead, they keep the cycle alive through a reinforcement of societal norms, even at the cost of themselves and those around them. overall, it's a good look at patriarchy and the ways it destroys people at every level of its hierarchy. can't wait for the next video! i have a lot of fun engaging with the topics of discussion you bring up :D

[@RatatTalks]

Amazing comment, I think I agree with everything in it so no comment. Consider starting your own video essay channel with takes like this hehe

[@maplestick2369]

@@RatatTalks don't tempt me

[@moon-fq1cf]

Amazing video, keep em coming! ☺️

[@RatatTalks]

Thank you!

[@emielregis1540]

I like the idea of Necromants in Space as low society class

[@SetariM]

This entire video sounds like a lonely guy talking to AI nowadays lol. Also, I'm the guy.

[@RatatTalks]

Computer. Generate gf.

[@ReiSilver]

As someone who was afab is really depressing. Of course you want men to feel loved, you love men, but you can't form a relationship with someone who doesn't see you as fully human. Like what can you do? Your words and thoughts mean nothing compared to the masturbatory fantasy he thinks he is owed. I guess my main advice if you are feeling like this is to get a hobby like that guy from the 4chan thread who started raising shrimp and it turned his life around. Having interests that you can share with people and enjoy with them really helps to connect. This guy had no hobbies, it seems like he went out to connect with people and brought nothing but loneliness with him, so he was only able to connect over shared loneliness.

[@kathrineici9811]

Bojack Horseman vibes

[@RatatTalks]

Very much so

[@goodtaste2185]

I think I am a meat house man 🤔

[@RatatTalks]

At least you’re self aware

[@Blue-pi5mo]

Hallo

[@RatatTalks]

Hi!