A Norwegian Taboo - we are all alike | Sanna Sarromaa | TEDxBergen

[@qystein]

A student with downsyndrome does not go to school to get a "academical" education, but he, and the other students gets a social education. And that is way more important for the rest of the kids life. Seems like the speaker only sees grades and numbers, and not what really matters for other people. Someone with downsyndrome does not need a academic education other than the basics like reading and basic maths etc, but they need to learn social behavior.

[@bhagatchingsubam]

qystein being an outsider, having a different perspective and a set of values is understandable. The speaker apparently doesn't see the other spectrum of benefits to the child and the other pupils in the class. She's unilaterally focused upon her sets of belief system and painting a false picture of political correctness to views not in unison with her own is unfortunate. Encouraging others to follow her path to be rebels doesn't bode well for an egalitarian society.

[@ThSkBj]

I also remember growing up, how some of my teachers raged against this idea that a traditional classroom education would benefit all kids equally. And this was not with respect to handicapped students. We aren't all A4 students. We aren't copy-paste clones of each other. We all have different needs, and we all have our own best approach to learning. Sometimes the means aren't there to accommodate for it, but the solution isn't to shut up everybody who acknowledges that this is a problem.

[@elsagrace3893]

qystein well the social behavior learning wasn’t going so well that day. Learning disabled individuals also have limits on what they can learn in the way of social behavior. They will not be able to make any progress past a certain level of social behavior learning.

[@flybynight2271]

Absolutely true.

[@ludaMerlin69]

That kid's social education becomes a drain on all other's academic education.

[@WolfFireheart]

This is very confusing :s As a dyslectic Norwegian, I had separate Norwegian and English classes away from most of my class most of the time. This class was also handled by someone experienced with teaching someone with dyslectic. It wasn't all the time, but much of the time.

[@osibosi99]

I have been living in Norway for 8 years now and i must say that Norway is much more PC then for example Iceland where i am from. Don't get me wrong, Norway is an amazing place to live and i just love it here She did not say once that the kid "should/would" be moved out of the classroom. She was just asking the question. Everyone that commented on this video saying "SHE IS WRONG, SHE KNOWS NOTHING" is just making her point even clearer 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@JohnSmith-hk1lx]

Well, you do not make it much clearer

[@kk440635NORWAY]

I have difficulty concentrating. I have so-called Nonverbal learning disability, and dyscalculia, not dyslexia. I was diagnosed with an average IQ, the only difference is that it is more difficult to concentrate and that I have to get the tasks in more detail. In our class we had a teacher and an assistant, the assistant assisted more than just me, there were more of us who had needs Sometimes we were in a small room with 3 - 4 other students who needed a little extra guidance, other times I was alone with an assistant in an other room, and sometimes I was with the whole class. I think I was TOO OFTEN with the whole class, it became too difficult for me to concentrate, and I learned LESS from being in a BIG class, I myself wanted MORE facilitation at school I love this speech by Sanna Sarromaa. She makes a good point. I was a very modest and introverted person in elementary school, so I didn't disturb anyone else, but I felt it was disturbing to be with the others. We have recess between lessons, where you can be social, you must not be together with many students and socialize during the lesson In high school, I was allowed to go to a class for people with additional needs, but this was not a class for people with developmental disabilities, not people with Down syndrome. It was an individually arranged class for people who needed a little extra guidance, average people with average IQ, some had dyslexia, some had non-verbal learning difficulties (like me), some had dyscalculia. Here a program was set up with adapted teaching according to the pupils' needs for adaptation, I didn't need adaptation for reading and writing, but someone else did. They saw individuals, divided us into different groups, we were given books according to the level at which we could perform. I received ordinary Norwegian and English tuition, as these subjects were not challenging for me Mathematics was a very big problem. So here I needed a lot of extra help. But the subjects I actually did well, I did well precisely because I was in a special class at a regular school. I am 32 years old now. Steady job, live alone, very independent and manage without help from the public in daily life. And I don't think I would have developed like this if I had been in one classroom for 13 years with many other students, who did not have special needs. Thank you Sanna for your speech at the TED X conference. You're my role model. You do not discriminate, you have a creative and reflective way of looking at people

[@rufa]

Conformity in Norway is in class with North Korea and the Jante law is strong in Norway. Norwegian like their grandiose self view.

[@MSPintail]

I fully agree with her concerns in that instance. There needs to be room to find alternative solutions for pupils with special needs. She didn't deserve all the negative attention she got. Her attitude towards Norwegians and Norwegian society however is clouded with bitterness. She's more than happy to advocate indivual care on a case by case basis for some people, but is more than happy to brush every Norwegian under the same comb to suit her narrative which is a bit ironic. Special interest groups and commercial "news" media outlets hardly represents the opinion of most people in Norway. As she said herself, they represents whatever gets them those juicy clicks.

[@tis_ace]

Agree with both paragraphs but lets also consider that she is a person too and the way that event unfolded for her, being bitter would be human. Also i can understand both sides of the argument on education but all that bring forward is that the current system in inept and it can be better.

[@tangbein]

Precisely. It was specifically after her comment on children with special needs that she became the provocateur she is today.

[@kk440635NORWAY]

I have difficulty concentrating. I have so-called Nonverbal learning disability, and dyscalculia, not dyslexia. I was diagnosed with an average IQ, the only difference is that it is more difficult to concentrate and that I have to get the tasks in more detail. In our class we had a teacher and an assistant, the assistant assisted more than just me, there were more of us who had needs Sometimes we were in a small room with 3 - 4 other students who needed a little extra guidance, other times I was alone with an assistant in an other room, and sometimes I was with the whole class. I think I was TOO OFTEN with the whole class, it became too difficult for me to concentrate, and I learned LESS from being in a BIG class, I myself wanted MORE facilitation at school I love this speech by Sanna Sarromaa. She makes a good point. I was a very modest and introverted person in elementary school, so I didn't disturb anyone else, but I felt it was disturbing to be with the others. We have recess between lessons, where you can be social, you must not be together with many students and socialize during the lesson In high school, I was allowed to go to a class for people with additional needs, but this was not a class for people with developmental disabilities, not people with Down syndrome. It was an individually arranged class for people who needed a little extra guidance, average people with average IQ, some had dyslexia, some had non-verbal learning difficulties (like me), some had dyscalculia. Here a program was set up with adapted teaching according to the pupils' needs for adaptation, I didn't need adaptation for reading and writing, but someone else did. They saw individuals, divided us into different groups, we were given books according to the level at which we could perform. I received ordinary Norwegian and English tuition, as these subjects were not challenging for me Mathematics was a very big problem. So here I needed a lot of extra help. But the subjects I actually did well, I did well precisely because I was in a special class at a regular school. I am 32 years old now. Steady job, live alone, very independent and manage without help from the public in daily life. And I don't think I would have developed like this if I had been in one classroom for 13 years with many other students, who did not have special needs. Thank you Sanna for your speech at the TED X conference. You're my role model. You do not discriminate, you have a creative and reflective way of looking at people

[@kk440635NORWAY]

I have difficulty concentrating. I have so-called Nonverbal learning disability, and dyscalculia, not dyslexia. I was diagnosed with an average IQ, the only difference is that it is more difficult to concentrate and that I have to get the tasks in more detail. In our class we had a teacher and an assistant, the assistant assisted more than just me, there were more of us who had needs Sometimes we were in a small room with 3 - 4 other students who needed a little extra guidance, other times I was alone with an assistant in an other room, and sometimes I was with the whole class. I think I was TOO OFTEN with the whole class, it became too difficult for me to concentrate, and I learned LESS from being in a BIG class, I myself wanted MORE facilitation at school I love this speech by Sanna Sarromaa. She makes a good point. I was a very modest and introverted person in elementary school, so I didn't disturb anyone else, but I felt it was disturbing to be with the others. We have recess between lessons, where you can be social, you must not be together with many students and socialize during the lesson In high school, I was allowed to go to a class for people with additional needs, but this was not a class for people with developmental disabilities, not people with Down syndrome. It was an individually arranged class for people who needed a little extra guidance, average people with average IQ, some had dyslexia, some had non-verbal learning difficulties (like me), some had dyscalculia. Here a program was set up with adapted teaching according to the pupils' needs for adaptation, I didn't need adaptation for reading and writing, but someone else did. They saw individuals, divided us into different groups, we were given books according to the level at which we could perform. I received ordinary Norwegian and English tuition, as these subjects were not challenging for me Mathematics was a very big problem. So here I needed a lot of extra help. But the subjects I actually did well, I did well precisely because I was in a special class at a regular school. I am 32 years old now. Steady job, live alone, very independent and manage without help from the public in daily life. And I don't think I would have developed like this if I had been in one classroom for 13 years with many other students, who did not have special needs. Thank you Sanna for your speech at the TED X conference. You're my role model. You do not discriminate, you have a creative and reflective way of looking at people

[@lovemarsh8037]

In Norway ppl with problems/sickness/learning problems and other "unnormal ppl" will get special treament/help like those 2 assistant the kid had. We do have schools for handicaps i am very sure, at least kindergardens. We make agreement with the kid and his/her parents about how to make the schoollife good for the kid. He could have been homeschooled but then he would learn how to sosilate.

[@jf9198]

Just as it would be unfair to put a neurotypical child in a special needs school for their education, it’s unfair to put a child with significant learning needs in a mainstream school. So I agree with you and my child is autistic.

[@xenobius_638]

This is why it's important to remember that equality isn't always right. Equity is the true key to the 'equal' society that people want. Treating everyone the same is no use because the outcome is different. Treat them with equity - give everyone what they need to be the same, dependant on their individual needs. Children with special needs do have those needs that need to be catered for - in an environment dedicated to this, it both helps to nurture and improve the quality of education for those needed children, and also for those without needs, removing a potential distraction from their learning. It's no fault of their own that needed children are the way they are, but they aren't the same - they have specific needs - and these should be catered for on a more exclusive basis, to be more advantageous to every child's education.

[@chameleon28]

I come from and live in a country that treats those with disabilities as “unmentionables” It’s is so bad that those with mild learning difficulties are not allowed to be included in “normal” schools; this leads to anyone who has any sort of illness or difference being ostracized socially. I think Norway’s inclusion of children with disabilities in normal classes is more important than not including them for the sake of the possibility that their learning may be slightly effected. Rather have these children be seen as human and raise the empathy levels of future generations that not include him on the slight possibility he may perform better academicall , I think including him and teaching the other children that he is still a person and still as important as them is a good thing. He has assistants and as long as it doesn’t effect either his learning or the learning of the other children to the point that they are performing below average for their age group I don’t see his inclusion as a problem.

[@jdish7485]

There seems to be more hate than love in the country if you "do not follow the rules".

[@kk440635NORWAY]

Alot of people gets triggerd of everything in this country :-(

[@ObserverZero]

A lot of words for "I'm bitter about leaving my political career"...

[@jcdentent7835]

She is my teacher lol

[@HeathenRides]

You feel as an outsider in Norway as a finn, that is Ludacris, we have the same culture same architecture and we are both pretty much like the nature around us, which is pretty much the same, my family is from finnskogen and my grandfathers father was part Suomi spoke a little strange and stuff, and have Suomi relatives which i believe feels comfortable all over the north

[@dutawe]

Verket skole is wayyyh different. We have 3 groups in every subjects. Under average, average and above average. Also we have ROT classrooms for handicapped and people with special needs. (What verked does is acually illegal)

[@dutawe]

Verket*

[@SVC-hz6dq]

Knowing how Norwegians deal with their social welfare system, jails, etc., not surprisingly Norway is being regarded as the model that better approaches 'utopia', which entails an ideal seemless social integration that also happens to be radically equalitarian. I nonetheless ignore if the situation described here is only an episodic case in which kids are all mixed together in the same classroom regardless of their intellectual potential or capabilities, or if instead is common practice. In any case, I would agree with Mrs. Sarromaa that this does not bring any good to either the boy with down-syndrome - who evidently will be unable to catch up with his peers - or the rest of the classroom. Clearly, for whoever that sits nearby the kid the only benefit obtained will be of learning how to cope with 'noise'...

[@qystein]

You learn to socialise with others in school. This is whats important for the kid with downsyndrome. He will not get a "normal job", but he will live in the society with the rest of us.

[@tomasimpresarijus9426]

@@qystein It's not that your arguments are incorrect, but as far as I'm concerned her point was that there has to be some room for discussion on hard topics. I think as a liberal she holds some particular values which according to her view should lead society to better future. One of the main virtue for liberal is to have free mind and not to be afraid to get ones point across, which she did. But some Norwegians in this case reacted to it hysterically and ad hominem, which is a big no no in free and modern society. Otherwise how do think a progress of nation should develop?

[@MrChuxel]

Boring

[@erik6554]

saarooma er ei dum ku

[@flybynight2271]

Absolutely appalling.

[@JohnSmith-hk1lx]

yes, she is appalling

[@whatsaygirl1507]

You've got it all wrong. I'm norwegian.