A very blursed Cree Start in Civ 6

[@PotatoMcWhiskey]

In this series we'll talk about some difficult topics, but I promise you that I try to treat these topics with respect, and tell the stories in a way that will hopefully help you better understand that Native American issues can't be generalized very easily.

[@brandicunningham7243]

Thank you Potato for approaching this with an open mind. Looking forward to this series and possible future series with descriptions of said Civ's :)!

[@PotatoMcWhiskey]

Hey, this isn't a place for you to post your opinion about First Nations issues, its about listening to the stories from fellow audience members. I deleted a few comments, anyone who wants to drop a hot take on Indigenous people positive or negative below this comment must accept that they will be banned. Do it somewhere else, not under the pinned comment thread.

[@thebigchief6870]

Also, the reason you are being trolled recently is related to #1 secret that hasn't been globally accepted, yet: your thoughts/words/emotions literally dictate what happens next in your life.

[@thebigchief6870]

Love your videos. You have definitely changed your demeanor over the years, and it has only enhanced the quality of all you create on this platform. Thank you 💯

[@Melrose781]

I think this is a great initiative that you're taking Potato. I also think this could open up opportunities to discuss other cultures featured in Civ 6. For example, I'm doing research with Indigenous peoples of the Peruvian Andes, many of which have strong Incan roots. It would be cool to hear some stories and challenges from their perspective if you were to do another Pachacuti run in the future.

[@grimm42]

"I need a galley to clear this barb camp" - Refuses to build a galley and instead does holy site prayers

[@PotatoMcWhiskey]

GIGACHAD

[@zope6362]

“Dear Lord, please send down a galley, Love, Potato”

[@jeroenritmeester73]

@@zope6362 He'll also send down a guy name Noah to build it

[@MunchthatCrunch]

"did I play greedy??"

[@gbpz321]

I think the idea of sharing cultural experiences based on the Civ you're playing is a cool idea. Love your content potato!

[@Frydrykmastkiller]

Okay I'm sorry, I hold PotatoMcWhiskey in high regards. But seeing Potato lose Civ games feels so rare and I honestly enjoy watching the rage and struggle

[@iservHim]

Makes him feel more human and us feel more understood! I’m with you, haha

[@DamagedDingo]

I find it helpful to see him struggle more as that’s where I learn the most. And.. you know.. it’s funny too.

[@BonjourGuysBasement]

As a Navajo that lives out in the sticks. The only station without much static is KTNN, this plays mostly tribal pow-wow music and classic country or bluegrass. I enjoy playing Native tribes because the civ music reminds me of chilling back at home.

[@ShockedLogic]

PMW - "I will play cree and settle these nice cities" Sweden and Phoenicia - "No" PMW - "Fine I'll try again" Every barbarian camp - "Also no"

[@ashvinvaidyanathan7239]

This has got to be because of a new update right? Sweden has been extremely aggressive imo.

[@kassandraofodyssey6475]

@@ashvinvaidyanathan7239 For me Sweden hasn't at all. Although that might just be because I swallowed her empire whole as Norway because her cities kept rebelling.

[@cloudw3]

Lighthouse actually work on lake tiles and you can see the yield changes at ~34:05. The description is wrong.

[@Legendendear]

Good to know

[@jamivirtanen474]

Lake tiles are regarded as freshwater providing coast tiles, you cant build huey on coast but you can build any other water wonder on both

[@derekmenebroeker4993]

Honestly, I hate hate HATE how barbarian camps are able to spawn quadriremes (a Classical Era unit) right from the start. That was probably the main source of your barbarian woes; the fact that you couldn't clear out that barb camp because of a unit that had no business being able to exist at the stage of the game where no player or AI (even on Deity) would be able to research Shipbuilding even if they bee-lined toward it.

[@obliviousbonobo2770]

The same kinda crazy starts have been happening to me and my friend too! The game starts off good, all of a sudden an army of musketmen invade and raze my civilizations lands in the fucking classical age or something like that. That being said tho, I always want to play Civ 6 after watching you, good content, keep it up!

[@szurketaltos2693]

Ah, Babylon.

[@ajcarroll1542]

You’ve probably heard this already but for the Cree, they’re First Nations, since their territory was mostly in Canada, but American Indians didn’t exactly love that term since their groups didn’t resemble nations as much as the First Nations people did. Also (obviously not trying to be condescending not everyone has taken literal courses on this) remember that not all Indigenous groups were tribes! many were bands, clans, and nations. With such a wide spread of cultures it’s easy to over-generalize so I get it tho :) TLDR Cree were First Nations and American Indian History is cool but very complicated

[@jacobprouty9210]

I would assume the main differences are the size of the groups and the complexity of their social structures

[@jonathandorsey]

It also gets complicated based on geographical area, and whether the people in question where more nomadic or agricultural in their food staples, and how much warfare they engaged in with their neighbors. Historically, there are fairly extensive trade networks pre-European colonialism, where Central and South American trade goods made it to the Great Plains area (chocolate lovers rejoice).

[@twilor9515]

@@NotAverageAfro Semantics, primarily, but many communities had clans, which would be like large family structures. In some, the clan would determine social roles (hunting, leadership, etc). Sometimes the clan was more akin to a nation in itself, functioning as a political unit. Band usually applies to a collective group of people, could be synonymous to a community.

[@vatsilvsgi8606]

Fun factoid: the Cherokee have most of those definitions/ names. The Eastern (which I belong to!) and Keetowah are bands, the Oklahoma Cherokee are a Nation - and we are all members of the Cherokee tribe. And we have 7 clans within our tribe (I'm Anigilohi, the Long Hair clan). I think the distinction is usually as tribe specific as everything else. And yes, it's complicated! Because studying pre-Columbian america is essentially studying all of Europe or Asia, each tribe/nation have unique histories specific to ourselves, just like any other continent. German history isn't swedish history, and Cherokee history isn't Cree history.

[@Schlarb237]

I lost it when Potato said, “They’re actually gonna make me settle a snow city!” Idk why lol

[@OsKarMike1306]

Samuel Champlain showing up in New France be like

[@docbrown7087]

I lost it when he said, "I will punch you out of the air."

[@Deathscythe39]

This game is the devs revenge for your last civ6 promo vid trolling them with 1 turn victory 🤣

[@sethc.1366]

I think what happened with the flood of barbarians was a Galley spotted your capital at 10:18 ish. Then it went and narced on you to the other barb camps.

[@jakedlind]

"Was I greedy? I don't think I was greedy. I think this was a fairly standard opener." - Potato (paraphrased). That made me laugh. I think the issue is that your standard opener is greedy, haha.

[@aidanwright3037]

Love that harbor placement. Having your harbor in a lake is invaluable.

[@Dracoape]

I'm not Native myself, but my childhood best friend is, and his family was always excellent to me, it was like a second home. It's kind of excellent to give an opportunity for folks to share their own stories.

[@erreve1120]

this is great! I have First Nations friends and family and people really do not know a lot of what they deal with now and in the past

[@danwatt5789]

Congratulations on having the strength to play this save. I would have quit before seeing Edinburgh, long before ;)

[@restouler]

As an Indigenous person living in Canada, the "Native Conquest" military card always brings up some negative feels. But sums up the history fairly well in it's description.

[@TheCheeseman1983]

Makes you wonder just how many civilizations have existed across the world that have just been completely deleted from history by conquering armies. It always makes me sad when I hear about invaders destroying the art and suppressing the religion/culture of the people they conquer.

[@restouler]

@@TheCheeseman1983 Then take ownership of the artifacts found, not returning to the original peoples.

[@TheCheeseman1983]

@@restouler Yep, and keep them locked up in the storage rooms of museums where nobody can see them.

[@lucasblauw4394]

I my experience, getting relgion and a good amount of faith is the single best start if your start position is horrible. If your able to bye a lot of settlers in a medieval golden age you can pretty much always save your game.

[@Deamon93IT]

Awesome to see you use the civ to spread an important message, although the game start definitely tried its best to derail the plans

[@PapaPondy]

Does anyone else watch McWhisky, get excited to start a new game, then quit on turn 50?

[@TheBake1986]

I quit on turn 50 in most games, either from realising I’m boxed in or anxiety at not settling an optimum placement 😞

[@eduardo3652]

What difficulty setting do you choose?

[@MrTrellheim]

I think I remember "someone" saying that playing with barbarians made the games easier because the they mainly made things hard for the AI. It's obvious whatever god rules game AIs heard that "someone" and decided punishment was in line.

[@cm8139]

City state AI being in the way has been a PLAGUE on my games, feeling your pain in this one!

[@LazyVanny]

Why do I imagine in each game you play of CIV, that after the leaders for the game drank from the Fountain of Youth, they dragged you and a few other people from the future to help them win.

[@aplguy99]

You used to always build scout slinger in almost every game. In your last couple series you don't build that early slinger. It might be where you are feeling like every game something happens to you. It probably stems from your admission that you have been playing without barbs lately and your early game meta shifted away from earlier defense to early greedy builders and settlers.

[@PotatoMcWhiskey]

I'm just greedy

[@LUCAdupaLUNI]

@@PotatoMcWhiskey I was shouting at my screen "build units build units!" while you were doing holy site prayers 😭

[@shinydavidhowell]

Funny you mention that meta difference! My casual multiplayer group is going to be trialling barbs-off next game after our current one saw one team get a barb-heavy start they resented enough that they quit the game even though one of their two - playing as the Cree, as it happens! - had some excellent yields going. (The other, as English Eleanor, was badly constrained by barbs on one side and my teammate's Scythia on another. The game is in progress still.) It's a different game, and especially with many of our group preferring a much less war-heavy meta than multiplayer usually provides in both public games and high-level competition, the lack of need for barb defense could produce some fascinating game scripts. I don't know if I'll prefer it but I'm excited to find out 👍

[@LUCAdupaLUNI]

@@shinydavidhowell it's a weird one because you can get anywhere between no barbs and being flooded like in potato's game but I find in my experience with multiplayer not having barbs can kinda break the balance of the game where some players can turtle far too easily if they spawn with no other civilisations neighbouring them

[@shinydavidhowell]

@@LUCAdupaLUNI Yeah barbs add an RNG element but spawn location is already a big one (even with BBG, which we've used ever since our first team game was cursed with a Mali tundra start!) and barbs naturally fill gaps more given the outpost spawn mechanic?

[@ZaWyvern]

Hey there. I'm Cree and thought I'd throw my two cents in. I've played Civ since I had it on my Amiga 500. I carried on playing all versions basically for decades now. When I got my 486 I played Civ 2 religiously and would often change the civ name to Cree. Those were the days when you could pop in a music CD and Civ would play it for you. I did "share" my copy of Civ with fellow enthusiasts through popular software sharing programs of the day. But being a young genius, i just shared the folder directly so I'm sure my saved games went with it. Which makes me wonder if that maybe pushed Cree forward into the public Civ space. I did the same bonehead maneuver with my Master of Orion 2 copy and that for sure got copied out as when I bought a DOSBox version from GOG it had all my old planet names, like my name, random towns I lived in when I was younger that no one has heard of, etc. Anyway, glad I could see them included directly in later versions of the game.

[@Kasserole1]

That is really interesting.

[@atocanboi409]

settling on Plains Wheat tiles is one of the most heartbreaking things to do in Civ6, but sometimes you must do what must be done

[@Traha]

One disappointment ive had with Civ 6 is the lack of leader or pantheon/religious idea that focused on natural wonders. I know that technically the appeal ones can apply to it in a way but nothing that directly added bonuses or enhanced them makes me a little sad cause in 5 i loved playing natural wonder obsessed Isabella and only "winning" when i had every natural wonder in my borders no matter how awkward or warmongery it was.

[@emylily8266]

it was an absolute blast playing wide Isabela, getting free settlers from finding a wonder first was so good.

[@тито-к9в]

something interesting about this specific example of Indigenous “representation” is that many Néhiyaw (Cree) nations actually protested the inclusion of Pîhtokahanapiwiyin (Poundmaker) in the game, as they weren’t consulted about anything. and before people say “well it’s not like they consulted with Scythians to include Tomyris,” this is specifically an issue because Indigenous peoples, wherever they are, never get the chance to represent themselves, it’s always what the hegemonic colonizer culture decides to show (often completely misunderstanding something at best, intentionally justifying genocides of past and present at worst).

[@mirandabee2323]

Commenting for algae rhythm reasons.

[@тито-к9в]

@Miranda Bee currently vibing to the algae rhythm 🌱💃

[@The_13th_Hussar]

So why didn't they like the choice of Poundmaker?

[@grimmturd]

Love that you're playing my favorite civ to play in this game.

[@nether0146]

Love the content 🥔 ive been really enjoying your recent civ videos keep up the good work

[@lancecurley658]

Would love to see a part 2 of this series. I unfortunately didn’t get to share my experience and the experiences of my ancestors/family.

[@tylerm9515]

I'm a huge fan of Sukitract's Oceans mod to make oceans more diverse and make stronger shoreline metas

[@stnavellino]

Hey man, just started watching your channel. Seemed like pretty fun gameplay, but the fact that you're spreading stories and culture and that sorta stuff of the nation you're playing is awesome! Civ 5 enjoyer, might swap to Civ 6 now...

[@Ramblingman420]

Dude, those barbs were relentless!

[@vendettarules1]

I hate when the give Barbarians ships before you can even think about building any!

[@vohwl9810]

Yo I love your content Potato and this video feels like every deity game I’ve ever played before lol. Love how you ended it and interested to see what you bring next

[@Rob-od2ei]

Archery, Archery, Archery, ARCHERY, oh ya and ARCHERY in the beginning can't be overstated LOL This coming from a US Army Field Artillery Man.... Love your playthroughs.

[@DrLongWang]

My headcannon is that the snow elephants are the last remaining mammoths.

[@jsievers]

I like playing as The Cree and this video was entertaining for me :). I hope you play more Cree in the future!

[@DammitDani]

Hears the sword of damocles and immediately thinks Tomb Raider Anyways love that there will be a native American discussion of some sort in future vids.

[@Nathanael_Forlorn]

36:30 yes! Finally a ~ 6 city game! No eww, but hooray! :D No wait for part two, where an entire civ is added into the 'imperium'... :D

[@Nathanael_Forlorn]

38:00 Nvm. Already with the shitty Island cities. :D Oh well. Though the land is really not very well set up for tall. Still better than wide. :)

[@justdna4385]

Snow hill for a silly snow canal seems better than settling on the grass next to the snow.

[@christopherwhite8984]

I'm glad I'm not the only one to get trolled by the AI whilst trying to settle a city

[@alexcebollero]

Even more painful is if he made the unique improvement initially, he would of had the golden age.

[@johnvohrer]

I swear these are exactly how my games turn out 81% of the time, It just doesn't want to see you win 🥶💀

[@Stone19298]

You've mentioned this on an older video but I am going to bring the theory up again. The AI knows where you put map tacs and stands in the way to screw with you lol

[@HarleyMaebry]

Of course Potato would go for the Government Plaza option that yields a better Harbor. All Harbors, all day!

[@0_Body]

The AI is waking up and choosing violence against Potato

[@OffMetaProfessor]

if you get the hero Maui early with Cree it's disgusting how many bonuses you can get with the Mekewap building...

[@anakondase]

Yeeah, that's how ALL of my games start.

[@shinydavidhowell]

I love this approach to a Cree series but I also have to admit as soon as the thumbnail came up on my notifications showing the start location, a George Michael earworm entered my head and it's not left 😂 This is an S-tier start location if you've "gotta have faith..."

[@zimoch84]

I really enjoyed this one. Struggling with barbs and getting out of this. Cool

[@wxcvbndu51]

The lighthouse actually gives you food on coast AND lake tiles, not just coast, you can see the lake tiles getting the +1 food when it gets built in your capital. The tooltip is poorly worded

[@PotatoMcWhiskey]

I keep forgetting this

[@reval1989]

Finally Potato starts to get my starts

[@rtvnartavian09]

This concept is absolutely needed too understand each other and grow from our social bubbles great joob

[@MonLudfi]

Yeaay PotatoMcWhiskey never give up to play from previous defeat...

[@chrism7395]

I'm pretty sure that Civ6 has some start location RNG stuff going on under the hood. I've lost count of the number of times I've won a game to find the next couple of games start in bullsh*t locations or circumstances - i.e. Mansa starting on snow, sandwiched between 2 aggressive civs within 20ish hexes (I got a surprise war on me before I'd even build a 2nd warrior! ) or endless hordes of barb camps

[@Krishnath.Dragon]

I think Lake Petra would be useful for your empire, just a thought for the future.

[@marshallscot]

Gotta build some sweet canals using those lakes and connect the oceans.

[@S4B3R117]

Jeeeeeez those barbs are brutal, this always happens to me too lmao

[@jl3039]

I know domination games are boring, but it is what I struggle with executing the most. Would love a modern "How to Domination" series with any Civ. Possibly not a hardcore domination Civ though.

[@pandaprrr995]

Feed the World is always the best option. I can't believe you have to think about it

[@seankurzman4551]

I think the snow city is a perfect place for a mid-late game Amundsen-Scott Research Station

[@prim16]

1:27 What In Tarnation Cree 2 What In Tarnation Cree 1 Cree Game Turn 1 POtential Religion Cree The ACTUAL God Start Cree POSSIBLY INTERESTING CREE... Interesting Cree Start 3 Interesting Cree Start 2 Interesting Cree Start 7 outta 10 Cree 6 outta 10 Cree God, I love your save naming convention

I would love to see you going for a religion win. Love the content!

[@dr.paulwilliam7447]

You really need a 3 archer start on this kind of evil barb maps…

[@matthewhannigan1916]

The pope likes to dona little bit of trolling

[@lennartgoebel]

I watch this video on second screen at work and it's almost sad to hear the disappointment in the potato's voice increasing , but its a great and entertaining video, tho.

[@chadwolfe3395]

Potato about to turn the late game churn into the late game learn

[@Dartanis]

This game has been equal parts painful and entertaining to watch. I have agreed with every decision you made this game, at the time you made them. And its as if the game was listening to what you said and went: "Yes but you see no, screw you." I dont know what you have done to upset RNGeesus, but I recommend a sacrifice of some sort as a form of appeasement.

[@Unimportant]

Funnily enough I played a game as Egypt where I blocked the Cree on untenable land filled with barbarians that devastated their game.

[@eyebrowsGreg]

Hello sire. Is there any chance you could do some sort of video on canals? They make it seem so straightforward but I've had so many times where I have a perfect plan to utilize canal's to enhance trade but end up unable to build them for reasons unknown to me.

[@ichifish]

Your persistence emboldens me! I would have given up at the fourth barb camp. I have a question for you: I've never (ever) had an AI accept my delegation when I meet them. It always takes some kind effort on my part. What are you doing differently?

[@PotatoMcWhiskey]

You do it on the first turn. You need to be playing on standard speed

[@ichifish]

@@PotatoMcWhiskey Ah, must be the standard speed. I always play online speed. Thanks.

[@kurowasanabe]

Man, I've also been getting blasted with barbarians lately. I'm glad I'm not the only one.

[@notlilyspears]

Lighthouse adds food to lakes too, even though it says coast

[@zackwilliams2170]

Question: How did purchasing one tile (at 19:32) actually allow you to purchase a second one simultaneously?

[@eazycome555]

The tea is only just okay

[@Mathmachine]

Blursed starts best starts.

[@vacinden]

Finally a game that goes like mine :P Because I was wondering in previous games if you were playing without barbs.....

[@LAZERAK47V2]

The barb spam has been a problem ever since Clans update. Some code monkey screwed up the spawning algorithm, and now camps will spam units, even if they don't scout your city. They never fixed it after abandoning the game in favour of shoving launcher updates down our throats. This also applies to Droughts, which can chain-trigger off each other. I once spent 30 turns with my capital under constant Droughts because one would trigger while another was in effect. Edit: Due to anti-player bias in the Barbarian coding, even if they scout an AI city, if they discover your borders, they'll send everything your way, even if you aren't their original target. It's why bribing, inciting and using Recruit Partizans is COMPLETELY worthless as player. You're just spawning more headaches for yourself. I once tried to incite a barb camp against an AI, they just came to my borders and started pillaging. Maori did the same to me and they spawned a new unit every single turn and never stopped rushing my cities.

[@benmorgan7331]

Nice work pulling that one through spuddy, controversial opinion incoming, monumentality but focus builders early since you have the growth coming through you will need improved tiles to work, the bonuses of doing so will be continuous throughout the rest of the game

[@bosskingbeast]

Violence is always the answer potato

[@bluebird5687]

Yay another video! Potato 🥔

[@tbush6657]

An interesting fact about "Indiginous Americans" (don't know if that's an official term, I just made it up) is that most of them, especially the traditional ones, prefer to be called Indians. When the European first came here, they mistakenly called the natives 'Indians' but the natives didn't know anything about actual 'India' or the English language for that matter. So from the Native American perspective, "The white man showed up and in their language, we are called Indians." Now today some of them don't like the term, but most of the devisiveness comes from either avoiding confusion with referring to people from India or American indigenous people, and white guilt thinking calling them Indians is somehow derogatory. But for the more traditional tribes, they see it as "We have always been called Indians, it's just our identity, it doesn't matter if there is a country on the otherside of the world, we didn't know they exist until centuries after we adopted the name for English identity."

[@PotatoMcWhiskey]

You really can't generalise like this, because there are so many Nations who all have different stances on this.

[@lpsoldin3162]

As a Blackfoot I still use the Indian name. I even am diagnosed with a degree of "Rubber Indian Man Syndrome", and looking up information about the hereditary trait is only harder now because they wanted to change the name time and again. The only reason I would ever argue to move away from the term Indian is because Native Americans are not from India. It's not an offensive term, it's just inaccurate.

[@SImrobert2001]

That is nowhere near correct for 100% of the time. ITs a wide variety of people with different opinions. At no time is there a consensus.

[@peterlines5008]

These barbs made me so mad and I wasn't even playing. Like if Firaxis could only fix one thing my first choice would be deity barbs.

[@aesemon5392]

If you are going for rat cities wouldn't the initial spot for Antahkakoop (3rd city) one tile to the west have been better to allow squishing a city against the mountains? @ 38:16

[@PotatoMcWhiskey]

Nah, that city sucks and theres likely islands to settle

[@aesemon5392]

@@PotatoMcWhiskey ah OK, how do you feel about us plebs commenting as we go? Really like your exploration of other cultures through civ and those who come from them, fantastic format. Have been pushing my way through the difficulty levels via your videos many thanks.

[@PotatoMcWhiskey]

@@aesemon5392 I like it, sometimes you guys come up with good ideas

[@aesemon5392]

@@PotatoMcWhiskey cheers, haven't managed your live streams recently so my bits are low making me a low quality watcher these days. Love it all keep it up, top creator.

[@refrii_ra]

this is going TOO WELL next sec: why all my recent games going like this !

[@hashira9166]

History major from NA well-versed in First Nations histories (the best I can be at least). If you need anything information/approach-wise to share the Cree experiences, I'd be happy to help!

[@Johnisawsome1]

Cree has best music in the game.

[@AbundantlyLimbed]

I wanted you to reload the turn 1 auto save so badly by turn 45 tbh

[@atherrien95]

We almost heard him murder a rabbit

[@joelzhl]

It's payback for what you did to that English settler.

[@lEGOBOT2565]

the Cree would be "First Nation", for US natives, the term "Indian" or "American Indian" is used by the US government, while "Native American" is the more acceptable term, though both Indian and Native American are preferred, depending on which tribes you ask

[@owenyoshida9202]

In Canada, Indigenous is the best term to use, and I think it is ok in America as well.

[@PotatoMcWhiskey]

Yup, its hard to generalize this which I why I gave a battery of words instead of one.

[@marshallscot]

In the US we use Indians, American Indians, Amerindians, or Native Americans, although I think use of indigenous and First Nations are growing in popularity since that's what the Canadians use. Generally Native American seems to be the most politically correct and widely used term today but some tribes still prefer use of the word Indian. The Federal government officially still uses Indian, see Bureau of Indian Affairs, which handles relations with the various Indian Nations and Alaska Natives.

[@lpsoldin3162]

As a Blackfoot I still use the term Indian and I find it more offensive that people want to control what language I use to protect me from offending myself.

[@BonBonB]

...this is me every game... on King.

[@randomyoutuber5563]

I swear the AI knows what you pin and purposefully positions to prevent you from getting it at all costs. If they can't stop you, then they do their best to at least delay the process. It happens to me all the time and it's so dumb. I stopped pinning and they don't block me as much after I stopped using the pins to say where I want to go. I've debated pinning spots that aren't where I am planning to see if they block that spot which could open up my real locations

[@actualturtle2421]

Ah man I don't think you've done a religious victory since I've been watching. I've always liked them. Religious combat is fun.

[@rickb6694]

This is why I always click the no barbarians option lol...

[@cyberbaibai赛伯伯]

Yes, new series