My Thoughts on Forced National Service and James Cleverly

Belly down in a muddy Dutch forest, The third-year medical student is taking part in the Dienjaar (service-year), a new programme that lets young Dutch sign up for a year-long trial in the armed forces rather than the regular four-year enlistment term. The programme is a success, drawing three applicants for each spot, and the government plans to scale it up from 625 to 1,000 trainees next year. James Cleverly has defended the Conservative Party's proposal of mandatory national service for 18-year-olds, claiming: "We force people do to things all the time."
The Home Secretary was challenged on the BBC's Sunday With Laura Kuenssberg programme over whether the Tories' election pledge clashes with the party's "liberal values" and belief in "personal choice".
Cleverly responded that we "force people to do things all the time", referring to changes in 2013 requiring 16-to-18-year-olds to stay in further education or training.
"We force teenagers to be educated. No one argues with that, I think we all agree it is an investment in them. This is about maintaining that investment in young people, in the future of our society, in bringing people together, in pushing people sometimes out of their comfort zone and perhaps pump-priming a lifelong habit of volunteering, which is good for the individual and good for society."
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[@TimoDyer]

The military doesn't want this. The youth need proper jobs with real money, not volunteer work.

[@Ooze-cl5tx]

you ask "do they think we are stupid". No, they look at the election results from 2010 to 2019 and tell you "we KNOW you are stupid"

[@jackdubz4247]

True. Fooled each and every time. We NEED to introduce austerity. We CAN'T have a Prime Minister who can't eat a bacon sandwich properly. We MUST respect the will of the handful of people who voted to self-inflict economic sanctions upon the country. We HAVE to get Brexit done.

[@Ooze-cl5tx]

@@jackdubz4247 "We CAN'T have a Prime Minister who can't eat a bacon sandwich properly." Instead you choose a PM who knew how to "handle" a pigs head. I wonder if the public would simply have wanted to see something else done to that sandwich. 🤮🤣

[@AllShortsPolitics]

So true 😬

[@bettyswallocks6411]

You can fool all of the people some of the time, some of the people all of the time, but you can’t fool all (or a decisive majority) of the people all of the time. Thankfully.

[@justsayen2024]

That'll get the 18 year olds and their families to out to vote.

[@paulholdstock4751]

Totally agree. This government are in need of urgent medical attention.

[@AllShortsPolitics]

You're not wrong xx

[@zak-a-roo264]

When "Daddy State" does such a terrible job raising UK kids ,didn't save for their college, blames them for being a burden and tells them to go into the military , that's what this sounds like.

[@freedomfighter8614]

It won't happen, Sunak's LA plane ticket is dated 5th July one way.

[@stevemcgowen]

To show how inadequate the military in the Uk is, the RAF had to borrow a plane for the recent Normandy commemorative event because they had only 1 aircraft available. With the budget of the UK military it probably isn't possible to increase the ranks through conscription or increasing reserves.

[@ncammann]

Exactly. Where are the trainers and supervisors? Where is the money? is this costed? £2.5B, is a drop in the ocean for what this proposal would cost. Where are these people going to be housed? Or transported to where they are supposed to go? And then the jobs/lack of taxable income from them doing "voluntary" work. Totally not thought through.

[@stevemcgowen]

@@ncammann It cost the Czech Republic- a tiny country of 10.5 million people $2billion USD to increase the active and civilian reserve forces over the past 2 years.

[@chrisdunn3817]

Point one. There is not a sane military officer or strategist who would want or agree to conscripts in their service. Two. That means the purpose of this program is to replace organised paid labour with cheap labour. Remember YTS and Communiyy Programme?

[@AllShortsPolitics]

YTS = SLAVE LABOUR 🤦‍♂️

[@RobertSmith-pm2jk]

I wonder if all the children of the Upper classes would be forced to do there national service.or would there parents just pay I fine.

[@patrickporter1864]

Their would be exemptions for attending universities. I bet. I would say that you would ha a lot of new doctorate students.

[@vanCaldenborgh]

Well well... Conservatives minding about "social cohesion".

[@oneoflokis]

They should rather invest in some youth clubs, and Sure Start!

[@jimbrown5552]

Thanks again for sharing

[@qeitkas594]

Old generations strangle the young ones. They will not accept this. They will leave and who has a problem then?

[@AllShortsPolitics]

Like that phrase it's true

[@cathalduffy1618]

Labour should bring out a new attack add , saying dads army first preference given to Tories.

[@peterdollins3610]

Make a new comedy service of endless errors.

[@iana6713]

"Who do you think you are kidding, Rishi Sunak...?!"

[@justsayen2024]

"Compulsory volunteers" is an oxymoron on its face. If it's not compulsory and they won't be arrested, will it be a misdemeanor and will there be a fine attached to it? The two days out of the month is not for military (according to the home secretary) purposes. OK but will be forced labor?

[@AllShortsPolitics]

That it is 🤦‍♂️

[@justsayen2024]

@@AllShortsPolitics those potholes won't fix themselves gentlemen.

[@andreaslamers9535]

the argument was that this would mix up the young people, end of private schools for rich would do the same, I don't think that the children from Suniak or Johnson would lay in the same dirt like from unemployed from Manchester

[@jimbrown5552]

Glad I live in Ireland

[@AllShortsPolitics]

I bet xx

[@R0swell5104]

Totally agree with you and your very apt description of it being forced patriotism. Conscription is a totally archaic idea which I thought had long gone not only in the UK but other European countries as well. This ludicrous idea is a last ditch desperate attempt to appeal to whom I wonder? Worse still you will have cohorts of angry and disgruntled young people who do not want to be there and have more of their future prospects ripped away from them. If the tories are allowed to enact this, the next group to be forced to work for the state will be those on benefits, then the disabled and so on. Welcome to the UK fascist state.

[@david-pb4bi]

Apparently they are doing the national service in Rwanda , they have already booked the flights and accommodation. It’s a win-win because they can house the asylum seekers in their parent’s spare bedrooms.

[@AllShortsPolitics]

The Tory Way😬🤔

[@frankreynolds4547]

It's a great and noble notion but the Tories are about as genuine as a Paula Vennells witness statement 😌

[@AllShortsPolitics]

An her self pity

[@glenwooded8523]

Thanks

[@AllShortsPolitics]

Much appreciated xx 🤠

[@larsbjrnson3101]

This is something I actually think is not such a bad idea. I did my 15 months service in our airforce and it's like our transition to adulthood. Get new skills, meet new friends and a sense of pride too. Wouldn't be without all the great memories.

[@AllShortsPolitics]

It meant something back then but unfortunately we don't have the same structures or a military that could support it. 🤔

[@larsbjrnson3101]

@@AllShortsPolitics No it's a strange and bad timing for this. I just don't know anyone who didn't enjoy the experience here. Didn't you have abandoned airfields etc in UK?

[@larsbjrnson3101]

Even our future Queen is doing her service now.

[@rookie_]

The military don't need or want this. Would take resources away and I suspect prove ineffective since time would be so limited, only twelve weekends for a year. It's been my experience (Pirbright in the mid 90's) that not everyone is suitable. Reminds me of the YTS, which mostly provided cheap (slave) workers for the benefit of business owners.

[@AllShortsPolitics]

Exactly 🤔

[@Leon-lt5gv]

They were moaning about russia doing this only months ago ' its consripting & forced control ' can you see any priveledge kids doing this ' i doubt that very much '

[@AllShortsPolitics]

It will just alienate and devide

[@Leon-lt5gv]

@@AllShortsPolitics your not wrong 👌

[@frankmaxwell5193]

It's a cunning plan, sign up the immigrants then thell them they are being posted overseas 😂😂😂

[@bettyswallocks6411]

I’m watching this a week late, listening , in part, to the thunderstorm you have in the background, along with the one we have going on here in Vienna. It’s quite confusing!

[@mrpocock]

Serfdom by any other name.

[@IK-wc4od]

Nation service is as likely a tory government. And also, every policy they've ever promoted was lied about and nothing was done. In fact, in most cases they did the opposite

[@robh8814]

Congrats on the 15K Subs. Growing slowly just like the economy of the UK🤣

[@gobnait7855]

This channel, slowly but surely. The UK economy... Maybe in the opposite direction and not so slowly?

[@colinbrigham8253]

At 76 I know the services turn out conservatives any way when Trump puts American boots on the ground the conservatives will follow.ow his lead

[@madmonk3356]

I'm sorry but national service is not going to work for everyone, not everyone can do what's required to be in the military, trust me I know the young folk that went through basic training at the same time as me I would say about 60% didn't complete it and to be honest 10% of the ones that did make it where complete psychopaths. The equipment we were trained on was old and when we changed from the SLR to the SA80 it was a shambles as the SA80 when it rained just didn't work and rusted up very quickly. The state of some ex army personnel that's left to rot and are never trained on how to adjust to civilian life. PDST is rife and with the state of the mental health services they have no chance.

[@AllShortsPolitics]

A friend of mine went in, Terry was the sweetest guy but came out arrogant

[@iana6713]

My father is ex-Forces, and back when he joined up, some of his instructors were former National Servicemen who stayed on to make a career of it. All of them said that conscription was a waste of time, saddling the Army with people they didn't need, and they'd rather train willing volunteers any day of the week.

[@patrickporter1864]

Is it an 83 iq in the British army as well.

[@HoratioChinn]

No parents / grand parents and only a small number of great grandparents would have done national service. I doubt any of these would have liked to do it so can't see them wanting their childred / grand childred doing it either, disrupting their education. Countries with NS have been doing it for decades so its ingrained into their culture, unlike the UK where we are proud of out professional armed services

[@stevemcgowen]

Didn't Brits used to take gap years? When I was 17 I heard abut the gap year and took a 18 month gap year before university after reading about how many Brits took a year before university to travel or volunteer in some developing nation.

[@stevec8496]

is there an app for that??. that's the only way the kiddies will do anything

[@uweinhamburg]

Nothing absolutely wrong with a National Service! You get a free school system, and you inherit a working social system - why not contribute something yourselves? Nothing absolutely wrong with a National Service! But then the question must be under which conditions? How is it organized? What are the benefits? How is it integrated in other social programs? You inherit a working social system - why not contribute something yourselves? Do young Brits really inherit something worth fighting for? @Allshorts clearly escaped for the warmer and more friendly France, so why should you stay and serve in a National Service??

[@shrunkensimon]

And children wanted to be in school? They had no say in the matter. Don't pretend it's for their own benefit, education is about producing a workforce not enlightened human beings.

[@gennadius2638]

A lot of Europe is talking about national service in view of the actions by the Russian federation

[@chrismurphy6070]

The Tories got Into power with the help of this Russian regime last election

[@oneoflokis]

​@@chrismurphy6070💯

[@jackdubz4247]

A Russian Federation emboldened by the actions of the British public. If only we had the sense to show a united front and not split from the rest of Europe.

[@jeannettecarpenter3784]

I am not opposed to a year of National Public Service, served by men and women when they complete their secondary education. You choose what and where, I'm not sure if you have something similar to the US Forest Service for reforestation, farming, the NHS, the Military could be an option.

[@faithpearlgenied-a5517]

You did national service I presume? Because strangely the people most for it are the people who never did it and who won't have to do it now. Odd that, isn't it? How about just not forcing people to do things they don't want to do? I bet when you left education you CHOSE what you did with your life after that. Stop trying to control others ffs.

[@oneoflokis]

​@@faithpearlgenied-a5517💯 Can't see it being popular with the youth!

[@jeannettecarpenter3784]

@@faithpearlgenied-a5517 No, it's not an option here in the US. I wish it had been. I would have been far better off doing a year before going to directly into college. That kind of a year gives you time to discover a love for something you might never have considered or that really don't want to do. This should be a PAID not a volunteer service. I've known people who went through four, six, eight years of education and then go I really don't like this, but there are so in debt they can't get out. The other thing about a National Service for everyone is the connections you make. Among the myriad reasons the US Economy during the 1950's is one that is overlooked - the connections men who served made with men from different economic backgrounds who would assist each other in work prospects.

[@jackdubz4247]

@@jeannettecarpenter3784 It's not going to be paid. That's the point. The Conservative party wants the optics of punishing the young. Nothing else. This whole scheme is entirely performative.

[@jeannettecarpenter3784]

@@jackdubz4247 That was an error in my understanding of the scheme. I thought they would actually be paid. If they paid they might have something since youth unemployment is problem.

[@charlesbruggmann7909]

Actually, 12 months ‘national service’ (military or otherwise) may not be a bad idea. Young Etonians, Carthusians, Harrovians sharing a barrack room with kids from Hownslow, Huddersfield or Halifax would do wonders for social cohesion. Warning: such a policy would require lots of planning and will turn out to be very expensive.

[@marcor6769]

Er, no. Anyone with a degree, and you can bet deferments will happen till after uni degrees are completed, they tend to be shunted off to officer-schools. Folks from privileged backgrounds can afford uni, can afford to get deferments. So, no, no class mixtures.

[@thomasmyers4089]

It might help to put the immigrants off, they won't want

[@Anonymos321]

Conscription is a good thing. Children get soldiers and after conscription they are grown ups.

[@nicbobags8241]

You want to pay for it then?!

[@faithpearlgenied-a5517]

What a load of shite.

[@DerekConnor-w5d]

Probably the stupidest comment ever on You Tube

[@simonwood1402]

Nutshell Service 🥜🪖 it's a totally 💩 idea! 💡 😄