Annulments: What's True? What's False?

[@tracyalbino-daggett4032]

I wish someone had explained this to me as a teenager in the 80s. I was already upset with the divorce, as a child I felt the annulment made me illegitimate or invisible. It caused decades of pain. I am finally free of that but the scars remain

[@stanfluellen2689]

Fr. Scott. This helped me understand annulments in a clearer way than any one I have seen so far. Thank you very much for this information. Blessings on you.

[@sylviavoz201]

Hi Fr. Scott, I have had my annulment for 5 years now and your talk is bringing a tear to my eye as I feel affirmed in where I now stand. Thank you

[@kelemae]

I started my annulment beginning of covid.. I'm still waiting, it's 5 years later with many complications on all sides of the party. It's not easy Father Scott and suffering without the Eucharist....there's just no words...

[@MWroses]

Can I ask why you can't receive the Eucharist? Are you in an invalid marriage?

[@JohnParks-zc1pn]

You could always do what Jackie Kennedy's mother did. In the early 1940s, she was married to a philandering drunk, Jack Bouiver. She consulted her priest, but he told her there was no way she could get divorced. She would just have to put up with it. She divorced her husband and married Hugh Auchincloss, and under the rules in effect at that time, she was excommunicated. She joined the Episcopal Church, who were happy to give her Communion. At that time, she was not part of the Kennedy family. Fast forward to the early 1960s. Her daughter, Lee, divorced, wanted to marry a Polish divorced man. By then, Lee was JFK's sister-in-law. Well, we cannot offend the family of the first Catholic President of the United States, can we? Especially not one as rich as the Kennedys. So Pope John XIII granted an annulment. After Vatican II, the process became available to the common people, but only those willing to pay the high fees and put up with the rigamarole. Pope Francis has suggested that fees not be charged, but he has not prohibited them.

[@lmr-xt7hw]

You can have the sacraments. You need to resolve to live chaste and regret that you have offended God by re-marrying (before getting an annulment).

[@JohnParks-zc1pn]

@@lmr-xt7hw yes, because on Judgment Day, Jesus is going to be so impressed with that fancy piece of paper.

[@ElizabethDMadison]

@@JohnParks-zc1pn The English Reformation started with King Henry VIII's adulterous desire to divorce one wife and marry another. Episcopalian "Holy Communion" is not the Real Presence of Jesus and is not a real sacrament. Also, Catholics cannot participate in that without committing the sin of schism. We are called to be holy.

[@ralphauer150]

The Catholic Church, (with the dispensation of the Bishop) allows a person who has been remarried in the eyes of the law. To live together, as, non sexual partners. To go to confession and communion, without getting an annulment. This is a fact. But remember no sexual relationship. Living like brother & sister. In some cases with age works well.

[@tina-g8p]

Yes. If you are an older couple , it it can work well. Live as room mates.

[@harryallenpearce89]

2:44 What do we do then? Pray for Reconciliation of the Marriage. Pray for conversion of the soul. The Church is losing its way, when it no longer prays for marriages.

[@daviddsouza735]

The church can encourage reconciliation only as much the couple want to.

[@AdaraBalabusta]

Amen!

[@harryallenpearce89]

@@daviddsouza735 Is that marriage? If they “want to”? I guess the vow is, “so long as we feel like it”. Marriage is a Sacrament. When God created man in His image, He didn’t just create Adam, God created a marriage. The biggest W the devil can get is to destroy the image of God.

[@ModernLady]

Pray for my annulment. It’s the only barrier that stands in the way of me becoming Catholic.

[@melaniedaniels228]

I will pray for you. I too am waiting on my annulment. Although I was just baptized and confirmed into the Catholic church, I just can't take communion until the annulment is finalized because I'm remarried. Waiting on an annulment shouldn't deter you from becoming Catholic. Prayers to you 🙏

[@ModernLady]

@@melaniedaniels228 Thank you! I’m also remarried. Baptised in a Lutheran church which they accept so I can only wait for my first communion, which I can’t take.. But I still feel like a Catholic in my heart and I know my first marriage was not put together by God. Just got my interview date, so maybe it won’t take forever 🤞🤞

[@melaniedaniels228]

@@ModernLady that's awesome! I hope it goes great for you! Can I ask how long the process has been for you up to this point? Mine is still in the beginning stages, the paperwork just needs a final lookover before it goes to the Diocese. I know it depends from place to place but I'm curious to find out from others how long their process is. I've heard everything from a few months to 2 years! 😭

[@ModernLady]

@@melaniedaniels228 I’ll have my interview in 3 weeks! Got the date yesterday about a month after I sent in the paperwork. I hope it won’t take forever and that they will see it’s a clear case. I was an atheist and not really capable of loving anyone after abuse. They say it can take up to 18 months or longer. But I’m yearning for the Eucharist!

[@melaniedaniels228]

@@ModernLady that's great and best of luck to you! I too am really trying to get the process going --my parish priest still has the papers on his desk :( Keep us posted! I'm curious to hear how the interview process goes!

[@Miriam-um1nh]

Thank you for this explanation. I will reach out to my priest to look for an annulment. I go to church and I can't receive communion because I am in a new union and it makes me sad. I want to live a full catholic life again one day.

[@reginakriebel9592]

Father, thank you so much for delivering such clarity in your words and in the issues the face a lot of marriages God bless

[@phillipmanriquez9651]

Hi Father Scott, I'm going through the annulment process right now its been going on for three years. I"m 64 we have been divorced for 10 years now but our relationship died in 2006. Our two sons are grown men now. We have one gran daughter. Our only interaction is with our childeren and gran child. I'am stressing out over this process. If my annulment is denyed then I will be punished to live the rest of my life alone or make a gut wrenching decsision and find out what I need to do to leave Catholic faith altogerther.

[@elwow72]

After all, a group of humans are making the annulment decision. My friend’s annulment was denied bc they didn’t apologize for a real estate transaction mistake.

[@BPzeropoint]

My wife of 20 years wants to convert to Catholicism. Why do I need to have an annulment from my ex wife who was not catholic and we were not married in a church? Also, my wife and I were also not married in the church. Thanks for your help.

[@leecheckley7166]

Thank you Fr Scott

[@Rendasd]

What about 2 people who married very young (18 and 22), their parents played a role in strongly suggesting they get married after just 4 months of dating, the parents in-fact speed up the process for buying the rings and suggesting to set up an early date for a wedding, they then get married by a Judge inside of a house, and over time things get tough, one works full time barely making ends meet because they were young and didn't have well established income, the other is in school, another 4 months pass and one of them commits adultery, they separate and wait for the divorce to finalize, then after just over a year the process is finished and they go about their departed ways. 1. Both of these people thought divorce was an option to get out of marriage. 2. Both of these people thought this was a good idea at the time, but were they mature and old enough to truly understand what they were agreeing to? 3. One of these peoples parents literally bought the engagement ring and wedding bands for each the Groom and Bride. 4. Both knew what they were doing, but had no idea of the significance or permanence of their actions. 5. Lastly, the marriage was completed by a judge in a home, not in a church or by a priest. Are these considered reasonable for an annulment?

[@williamavitt8264]

These are all grounds for an annulment

[@maureengauthier6553]

Father, After our divorce happened in September of 2018, he got remarried. I don't remember if it was before or after the Tribunal, that he petitioned, made it's decision known. Here is where this scenario starts...the Tribunal upheld the validity of our Marriage and I am seeking some direction on where I can find support for wives who find themselves in this kind of situation described below: I find myself lost. In some of the research that I've been doing, I discovered the fact that he is spiritually, emotionally, mentally, and psychologically abusive which did not become apparent until a few years into our marriage, that included 28 years and 5 children. Is it still possible to petition the Tribunal with new grounds without starting the whole process over? Where can I go from here?

[@FrScottVanDerveer]

Please do reach out to your Tribunal and talk with someone on the staff about your concerns.

[@AdaraBalabusta]

You have an incredible opportunity, Maureen, to display chaste holiness.

[@maureengauthier6553]

After the civil divorce in 2018, I did not feel the urge to marry anyone else and in 2021, I found myself having to move into an Assisted Living Home because of complications with my Multiple Sclerosis where I will continue to reside.

[@jodavey]

What happened to “What you hold true on earth. I’ll hold true in heaven”?

[@ginakendrick2581]

Our Lord was kind to me, as my priest helped me get an annulment during a very tumultuous time, and then I got remarried outside the Catholic Church, and did not know that was bad, and the Lord was kind enough to give me the grace and my husband now the grace to get the annulmentand to be married in the Catholic Church my question is I was told recently that I never should’ve been intimate with my second has been even though I was married in the Catholic Church and got this annulment. Is that true?

[@PatriciaCooksey-wr8hd]

Some people will take “forever” literally. The vow is “until death do us part”.

[@lmr-xt7hw]

I was divorced and married a divorced (protestant). After I obtained an annulment from my first marriage and we wanted to marry, no one could find my husband’s first wife’s death certificate. My mother in law knew she had died of cancer but we could find no proof. We now live chaste as brother and sister, sleeping in separate bedroom and accept will of God. It is so wonderful to be able to receive the sacraments again and worth the sacrifice.

[@MWroses]

I don't understand. You had an annulment and your husband's first wife died. Both seem like legitimate reasons that your current marriage is valid. Is there something missing? Are you assuming the annulment is incorrect? And what does the death certificate have to do with it? Sorry for asking. I just feel like it's important in case others in similar situations see your comment, so they understand what happened

[@lmr-xt7hw]

@@MWroses sorry for not being clear. My husband had been married and divorced over 40 years ago - they had no children and my husband moved 800 miles away for his job. His first wife remarried, had a daughter and also moved away but apparently died of cancer about 20 years ago according to my late mother in law who was friends with her parents. She was usually a very reliable source of information especially since she knew the parents very well. And I had no reason to doubt her words. In order to remarry both partners either have to have to prove that they are no longer married (either widowed or have an annulment of their first marriage). Even though my father in law is an expert in family history and tracing marriage and death certificates he could not find her death certificate. She was an only child and she her parents are now deceased. I applied and received an annulment which If I had known this, I would not have done - I should’ve checked beforehand. I grew very desperate when my priest said that we could live as brother and sister, which we are doing now.

[@katiedid8192]

A death certificate should be able to be obtained from public records if she lived or died in the US. Praying for you and your husband.

[@fsa5826]

Saw Fr Rippergar's video there he says first annulment then divorce I am puzzled now.

[@bcgarrels]

What if you were non-catholic when you married civilly, and then your spouse divorces you against your wishes. After the divorce, you get confirmed in the Catholic Church. Do you still need an annulment for the civil marriage to get sacramentally married in the Catholic Church?

[@AdaraBalabusta]

Yes, the first marriage is presumed to be valid. This issue should have been taken care of when the person received into the Church.

[@Jesusandbible]

If the only time you allow Catholics to have a divorce, is if you declare it to be a non sacramental marriage, why does one have to apply for an annulment, if the marriage has already been declared non sacramental in the divorce? Where is such a double paperwork scenario in the teachings of Jesus? And why make exceptions for filthy lucre by allowing divorces for keeping inheritance?

[@geoffjs]

Before the process can commence, it is necessary for the divorce to have been granted. The annulment process is to investigate whether a sacramental marriage ever existed

[@Jesusandbible]

You mean a secular divorce? As Jesus said the only reason to divorce is "fornication" what list of reasons is there for Catholic divorce? And how can it possibly be justified? It is making a mockery of the death of John Fisher. @@geoffjs

[@budokarate6212]

Father. I just applied for an annulment. There happens to be a fee. It is stated on the forms downloaded from the NY Archdiocese. $650 plus $700 more if they feel a psychological exam needs to be included in the investigation.

[@johnt9563]

I wish all archdiocese thought like Fr Scott. I'm Going thru an annulment right now. and it's focusing not on the unholiness of the 25-yr marriage (in 1986 btw) and what happened during it (narcissistic abuse, lies, evil, etc); but rather on my state of mind at time 0 !!! (that's the canon law citation) --- absurd! This is an unholy phariseic practice. It hurts people, not helps. In fact, for this very reason alone, I'm looking into converting to Eastern orthodoxy (already went to 2 Divine Liturgies) since their view and support of marriage (and sin and confession and a lot more) is much healthier. During my annulment interview, I strongly felt there was a high degree of vicarious enjoyment in her detailed questions of my "courtships" before marriage (I was loyal in it) etc--right, a few months' spin---a "courtship'? Flawed assumption. I arguably wasn't even truly Catholic at the altar (time 0), or even truly Christian! The annulment process is unholy. It never existed in the early church as I can tell. BTW--if I don't get an annulment (and even if I do), I am converting most likely. I can't be part of a church doing what Jesus himself criticized the pharisees for...over and over again....adhering slavishly to the law instead of love. In an annulment, there is no mercy; there is no love; there is no understanding (priests never marry!); and there is no forgiveness. And to me, that spells UNHOLY.

[@Lisa-jp4uj]

As a lifelong Catholic i take issue with this. Ill send this to the Archdiocese.

[@miked9788]

In most divorces there is a guilty party and an innocent spouse. Divorce is a mortal sin so the one who petitioned for divorce cannot receive Holy Communion until he confesses his sins and makes repetitions for his sin.

[@CarolineOwens-s1h]

@@miked9788where does it say divorce is a mortal sin in the catechism? It doesn’t

[@robinBrownmanfromHtown]

Where else? Thanks for the reply.

[@tina-g8p]

Can you receive communion if you had a annulment but you did not get married in the catholic church for second marriage ?

[@MaureenClennan]

What if you weren't married in church?

[@ModernLady]

If you are Catholic and didn’t get married in the Catholic Church it’s a problem of form and not a sacrament. Very easy to get annulment.

[@ModernLady]

@@JesusMaryILoveYou I know if sounds weird, but yes you do. Because marriage is a something instituted by God, and the Church can’t just assume you didn’t actually mean what you promised when you got married. Even when you marry outside a church you still promise to be married for life after all. They still have to investigate rather than assume. But the case would probably less complicated than a Christian ceremony. (If the marriage wasn’t consummated and you can prove that, it would be an easy case)

[@meghanmccarthy7414]

Can someone help me? What if you are not Catholic. But you married Catholic. Then they divorced you? Now you are looking to convert to Catholicism and one day hope to marry a strong Catholic and raise a strong catholic family. Is that option out of the question for me?

[@melaniedaniels228]

This is pretty much my story except I was remarried civilly to a non-Catholic and I was not Catholic at the time either. I recently converted which was not an issue. Just waiting on the annulment right now. You can still convert and be fully Catholic, but you would need an annulment from your first marriage before re-marrying in the church. Honestly, I would start the process now if I were you and just be done with it. Prayers and best wishes to you! 🙏

[@MWroses]

@@melaniedaniels228 how did your process turn out? If your annulment was decreed, on what grounds? I'm just asking because I know people going through something similar. It's really frustrating, I'm sure, if converting after the first marriage failed. Because now you know what a real Catholic marriage entails.

[@melaniedaniels228]

@@MWroses Believe it or not I'm still waiting! I believe we're in the home stretch though. They were giving all parties involved 30 more days to submit any final information or "closing arguments" and then I'm guessing I'll hear the final word. Please pray for me, I see no reason that it wouldn't be found invalid but I'm still nervous...

[@southernlady1109]

The Catechism of The Catholic Church states: 1629 For this reason (or for other reasons that render the marriage null and void) the Church, after an examination of the situation by the competent ecclesiastical tribunal, can declare the nullity of a marriage, i.e., that the marriage never existed. 132 In this case the contracting parties are free to marry, provided the natural obligations of a previous union are discharged.

[@bernyandayani7468]

What if after 10years the husband finally confessed that he is gay or bisexual, will there be an annulment sacramentally ??

[@greggrimer1428]

Yes, that marriage would be null. Because he lied by omission about a critical thing his fiance should have been told.

[@AdaraBalabusta]

If he was gay or bisexual at the time of the marriage and did not tell his fiancée, grounds would exist for a Declaration of Nullity.

[@MWroses]

@@greggrimer1428 I know someone who's wife had a male friend at the time of marriage. She did not tell her husband that she and the male friend had a brief intimate relationship in the past, before she married her husband. She remained friends with the other guy. A few years into marriage (no children.... waiting for finances to grow), she left her husband for her male friend. She came back later when the affair ended. Wonder if their marriage is null.

[@CarolineOwens-s1h]

Is alcohol addiction before marriage grounds for anullment

[@robinBrownmanfromHtown]

How do we start the annulment process? My wife hasn't seen her ex since the 1980's.

[@catherinedegiovanni4864]

Start at church from where you were married.where else

[@sharelletemaat938]

Father, can you say "sacrilege?" How about death, judgment, heaven, hell? How about many/most tribunals issue Affirmative decisions in almost every case. Judges can always find grounds as they search what spouses write. How about children feel like bastards even if the uncaring judges say they are considered legitimate. What is your opinion of same sex marriage?

[@glennhartwick7528]

My Fiance' is Catholic and I'm non- Catholic and she wants us to be married in her Church, I have only been married once and I divorced my wife in 1998 because she fornicated on me and when I got out of the military she threw out my clothes and abandoned me. I was told I needed an Annulment before I could marry my Catholic wife in her church. I am a Non-Demoninational Christian so I don't know why I need this? Please point me in the right direction! Yours In Christ

[@ModernLady]

The Catholic Church automatically thinks that your marriage was valid. You need to prove it wasn’t. But it will take 12-18 months.

[@AdaraBalabusta]

It is assumed that your first marriage was valid at the time that it occurred, even if it later failed. If that is true, it is "until death do us part." The Tribunal will examine the conditions that were in force when the marriage occurred and make a determination.

[@glennhartwick7528]

@@AdaraBalabusta well, I've been married to my Catholic wife for almost 1 year now!

[@MWroses]

@@glennhartwick7528 on what grounds was your annullment granted? I'm just asking in case others in similar situations see your comment

[@MWroses]

Cheating and fornication are not the same thing. Fornication is sex before marriage. Adultery is an affair after marriage. Just clarifying for others

[@bcfriardoyle7697]

Really good talk ty

[@iNdUsTrIaLrOcKeR4U]

Legality in the human sector has no bearing in the Sacrament of HIS giving of HIS Life, in Holy Matrimony.

[@dcaldwell7706]

Great information!

[@richardwalker1405]

Thank you ❤❤❤❤

[@TaraJoBean29]

Why would a Catholic go through the heartbreak of divorce without knowing for sure if the Church would declare the marriage null? What a nightmare if they found AFTER a legal divorce that the marriage is still sacramental. I have a hard time understanding how this process isn't backwards for Catholics.

[@yobrown7418]

Thank you. ❤️

[@alexsealey1865]

Please actually teach what the Church teaches.

[@iNdUsTrIaLrOcKeR4U]

The demons have swallowed Fr. VanDerveer whole, unholy. The Sacrament of Marriage is only Symbolic of the human soul being wed to HIM Eternal if the heart has gained ENOUGH to matter in HIM.

[@elwow72]

After all this…God has a plan. If he planned for people to get divorced than a man-made law shouldn’t stop a person from an annulment.

[@philipbuckley759]

annulments are not Biblical reasons, for divorce and remarriage...

[@iamnotyou5499]

Much here is incorrect. Canon law states that the divorced but not annulled state is in and of itself mortal sin. If you divorce first you are in mortal sin until you get the annulment. The idea that the civil marriage has primacy and you don’t need an annulment until you wish to remarry is the opposite of what canon law says. With all due respect Father, show me where your version of this exists in either canon law or the catechism. You can’t because neither of those sources say what you are saying. In fact they say exactly the opposite.

[@patriciabrower5527]

The Catholic Church will not hear a case for an annulment without a legal divorce in place.

[@sammig.8286]

What if my husband divorces me, but I did not desire the divorce? Am I in mortal sin of I don't seek an annulment?

[@PP-ep1sn]

"Divorced but not annulled state is in and of itself mortal sin" - NOT NECESSARILY ! CANNON LAW SAYS DIVORCE IS A GRAVE MATTER, A GRAVE SIN BUT DOES NOT ALWAYS CONSTITUTE A MORTAL SIN THEREBY ONE MAY RECEIVE HOLY COMMUNION AS LONG AS THE PERSON IS IN THE STATE OF GRACE NOT SIN. SO IS LYING, FORNICATION, MISSING MASS ON SUNDAYS ALL ARE MORTAL SINS BUT YOU SEE THOSE SAME PEOPLE GO UP THE COMMUNION RAIL LIKE THEY'RE RECEIVING A HANDOUT WITHOUT GOING TO THE SACRAMENT OF PENANCE FIRST. SO CONDEMNING A DIVORCED PERSON IS OUT OF LINE FOR YOU. SO YOU KNOW THAT THEREBY BEEN SAINTS WHO ARE DIVORCEES???? LOOK IT UP!!! AND THEY LOVE PRE-VATICAN II WHEN SOCIETY WERE STILL PIOUS!!!

[@PP-ep1sn]

".... did not need an annulment unless you remarry" - AGAIN, NOT WHAT HE SAID, ON THE CONTRARY, HE SAID GET AN ANNULMENT IMMEDIATELY AND FAST FROM RECEIVING HOLY COMMUNION UNTIL THE ANNULMENT PROCESS.

[@PP-ep1sn]

ALSO, HE'S NOT GIVING "PRIMACY" TO CIVIL DIVORCE OVER ANNULMENT, IT IS THE CURRENT PRECEPT - YOU GOTTA DIVORCE CIVILLY FIRST BEFORE GETTING A DECLARATION OF NULLITY AS THE CHURCH STILL RECOGNIZES A CIVIL MARRIAGE UNDER NATURAL LAW. ON THE CONTRARY, HE ACTUALLY INSISTS ON GETTING A DECLARATION OF NULLITY IMMEDIATELY AFTER. MAYBE YOU SHOULD DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH.

[@catholicfemininity2126]

I see; so this is what I pick up.... 1. If you divorce and try remarrying again without an anullment you are basically in the sin of 'adultery' because you are trying to be with someone who isn't your spouse because you didn't have an anullment. 2. If you already are married to someone but are divorced and haven't gotten an anullment yet, you're not allowed to receive Jesus in Communion until you do or go to confession and truly repent and you can't have sex with them because then it will be adultery.

[@JohnParks-zc1pn]

The main thing to understand is that in the 1980s Pope John Paul II publicly questioned the high number of annulments in the United States. If the Pope does not understand the process, I am not required to understand it either. An annulment is a “Catholic divorce.” Prior to the Second Vatican Council, annulments were not common. Then, in the early 1960s, John F. Kennedy’s divorced sister-in-law, Lee Radziwill, wanted to marry a divorced Polish man. Well, now, we cannot offend the first Catholic president of the United States, can we? Especially not one from a family as rich as the Kennedys. So, Pope John XXIII granted her an “annulment.” After Vatican 2, the process became available to common people, at least those who are willing to pay the fees and put up with the rigamarole.

[@alexsealey1865]

You are contradicting yourself.

[@alexsealey1865]

You are contradictory

[@locksy2785]

Is any of what this man is saying biblical? He hasnt quoted/listed even one scripture to support what he's saying......or have I somehow missed this🤔

[@iNdUsTrIaLrOcKeR4U]

Yes, no mortal sin can undo a Sacrament of HIS Life in CHRIST.

[@kpn5000]

The definition of annulment is that the marriage was never valid. Otherwise, it’s not an annulment and the marriage is valid. Also, how dare this priest suggest that Mother Church could sanction an “unholy marriage”. That’s not possible. Gay priest man here needs to make up his mind about whether holy matrimony is a true sacrament or not. Finally, divorced catholics cannot remarry without an annulment. If they try, they’re merely public adulterers and receive Eucharist unto their own damnation.

[@dilkycorteling2586]

Ok fr. Here a senario. Man and woman have a relationship and living to gether or not, have a child either aborted or given for adoption . The relatio ship is not successful. They seperste. Then they find another person and get married i yhe church and all is good. So why the hypocrisy. These are all catholics and i know a lot of them .

[@richardjohnston9628]

Ours got denied so not a big fan right now

[@JohnDc]

Pay the money. Annulment approved.

[@toddkerestes594]

@johnDc I was kinda thinking the same thing...so 2 people take weeks if not months of premarital classes to make sure they really want to do this, then stand in front of hundreds of witnesses and make vows to each other and God, recorded and registration as a marriage....then some time later get a legal divorce on paper and then say they were never REALLY married? Let's call it what it is...divorce. Also, if one really believes this, then how can any marriage ever be valid? If later on all you have to do is say it was never valid. JESUS calls divorce and remarrige adultry.

[@alexsealey1865]

You are not teaching what the Church teaches.

[@ginnyr8946]

What is he teaching incorrectly? No annulment, no remarriage, pretty clear cut-

[@alexsealey1865]

@@ginnyr8946 Right when he days "however" he begins to contradict himself. He's wrong. Listen again. Guys like this are why we are having an Annulment crisis is the Church

[@alexischristopher2015]

No fee. Wow. My husband paid thousands. Glad that was changed. My mass got my wedding was $1800. And my grandmothers funeral mass was $600. So all these things are also expensive.

[@JohnParks-zc1pn]

At least Pope Francis recognized the scandal of charging high fees for what is essentially a "Catholic divorce."

[@maricarmenestrada2292]

You didnt paid for the mass you paid for the electricity ,for the secretaries,for the salaries for everyone who works in the that church ,for the decoration and even the food for the priest!!! Come on !!! You paid a saloon ,food and wine after that more expensive and nobody said nothing

[@KA-bv7zg]

Marriage too unholy to endure someone understands Holy Matrimony.

[@iNdUsTrIaLrOcKeR4U]

No sin, mortal or other, can undo HIS Sacrament. i smell a drift in HIS Truth in Fr. VanDerveer. Most of HIS priests have lost course in HIM.

[@randall287]

The flaw was believing the man made laws of Catholicism.

[@jamesmonahan9408]

If outside the RCC, then you are following man made laws.

[@ginnyr8946]

​@James Monahan yep, Protestants love changing the rules to suit themselves-

[@jamesfitzpatrick9869]

It's all fake they are fake they are no ,ore holy lol than the drunk poor guy next door so prove me wrong I dare you after all you have twisted the really truth for 3000 yrs havnt you ?

[@AnnulmentProof]

The church does not teach that you must have a civil divorce first.

[@ginnyr8946]

I was told to file for civil divorce first.

[@AnnulmentProof]

@@ginnyr8946 the enemies of marriage who work in the church will say that. Before the baptized, God comes before the state regarding the marriage contract which is why the annulment is supposed to be first. If there is any civil involvements, it's only by permission of the bishop because "what God has joined, let no man put asunder."

[@iamnotyou5499]

John is correct. What canon law says is different than what most dioceses in the USA do. Canon law is clear that the sacramental marriage is primary and must be dissolved first.

[@patriciabrower5527]

@@AnnulmentProof The Church will not hear your case for an annulment without a legal divorce.

[@AnnulmentProof]

@@patriciabrower5527 The church teaches that all matrimonial causes belong to ecclesiastical judges, therefore any divorce must first be approved by the bishop. There is nothing in church law requiring a civil divorce before an annulment, it's just a modern bishop's rule. If you insist, the tribunal will do the annulment without a civil divorce first, they just don't advertise it.

[@AnnulmentProof]

Anyone who files for divorce in the United States is publicly guilty of grave sin because there are always legal alternatives.

[@ginnyr8946]

The world is filled with sinners, no one is perfect-some far worse than others, it is a spectrum and only God can judge or condemn-

[@AnnulmentProof]

@@ginnyr8946 public guilt is not always the same as private guilt.

[@Kelgoran]

I thought that the Catholic Church allows for a civil divorce in the case of abuse, but just doesn't consider the marriage over. You can't remarry, but you don't have to live with your abuser anymore.

[@ginnyr8946]

@Kelgoran yes, more than one priest told me No one needs or even should stay in an abusive marriage whether physical or emotional-

[@AnnulmentProof]

@@Kelgoran canons 1151-55 says the bishop can hold a separation trial, but the civil judge cannot, bc "let no MAN put asunder."

[@mkf628]

Thank you!