Are RTK Drones worth it?

[@itsjared]

Great as always Rami. I really appreciate your work here. But my question is, IF you’re going to be setting control and checks anyway why spend an additional $6k? Can you run a comparison between the data sets USING the GCPs in the processing?

[@RamiTamimi]

The idea is you would save on time. You don't need as many GCP's when using an RTK Drone. I could test corrected data sets and see if there is a big difference or not, that could be a good video idea!

[@anthonypsantos]

@@RamiTamimi Rami you should take a look at the metta technologies ppk kit for the phantom 4. It uses a reach m2 as the rover the kit is $299.99 and with a m2 $499 it’s significantly cheaper.

[@MattnUska]

I was going to ask for the same thing. We are looking at getting into drone work. We are considering just getting the non RTK phantom to start out and then later getting a Matrice or renting one as needed. We mostly do mortgage as builts but occasionally do bigger jobs. I’m trying to figure out if it’s worth the expense or would be better to rent.

[@anthonypsantos]

@@MattnUska look used I scored a phantom 4 pro v2 for $800 Canadian and added a rtk kit from metta technology’s above. Rtk is well worth it just as rami mentioned above

[@MeMyself_andAI]

Because the RTK enabled drone can get accuracy down to a centimeter level, and reliably measure the verticality of surrounding topography as well. In my field of work we use it to measure quantities of, and grade dirt.

[@ايهم-غ7ي]

Assalam alykom eng rami I'm really enjoying ur channel absolutely grate videos and I'm learning allot i would like to thank u for ur grate work ....best of luck to u ,,,ayhm alawaid a Syrian 🇸🇾🇸🇦 surveyr working in ksa and also civil engineering student best regards to u my friend

[@jlest3036]

Great video. I’d definitely go with the rtk version but it should be noted that most people doing any mapping work will need some sort of gps device. If your budget is limited, the P4P and Emild RS2 will be overall more useful and within the price of the rtk drone itself.

[@pablosandoval3011]

You failed to mention the PPK functionality. I will always recommend PPK over RTK. Too many issues with network connectivity, internet reliability. There is so many things that can affect your results. That’s why I will always recommend PPK. If you cant live without RTK, learn how to use PPK as backup at least. Great video though, you made that project look way to easy😊

[@meudrone4k369]

Chique drone phantom 4, melhor designer até hoje, perfeito aeronave👍🏻👏🏻👏🏻🤩

[@HenloduToit]

Very nice comparison, I'm actually stoked that the errors wasn't more between the 2 surveys. Would Have been great if your test area was bigger with more elevation changes. I did the same comparison a few years ago (in a much larger area) and found when calibrating on 1 known point (benchmark) I got workable results but when working on a local calibration (most mines work on their own local calibration) then I don't get workable results. I mostly worked with PPK & the syncing afterwards was a nightmare & took a lot of time. So today, a few years later, I'm doing mapping full-time & only use GCP'S, lots of them, that way I know I will not be catched with my pants down when doing work for clients because I have plenty GCP's to fall back on, especially for repeatable work that must overlay. :-)

[@RamiTamimi]

Yea it would be nice to have a bigger test ground. Maybe soon I can find a good location to test out these drones. Great work, keep it up!

[@blimolhm2790]

To me, at the current price, it's kind of like having a fridge with a TV built into it. Sure, you can save time when grabbing another beer, but if the fridge breaks, you've probably got neither a fridge or a TV anymore. This is the same with a drone that has RTK. At the moment, if you're not a billion dollar company, you're probably better off keeping an RTK rover about 6 feet off the ground to zap the ground targets.

[@allanjimenez6063]

Good’day Rami we have phantom 4 RTK but we have a Problem to connect it.

[@monaakkila9891]

Great job Rami👍👍

[@RamiTamimi]

Thank you 😁

[@importjunky3106]

Rami, I use the P4PRTK for PPK mapping missions (propeller). One of the checks that platform is looking for is that the drone is in the air for at least 10 minutes to tighten up the gps positioning. I’m curious if you were to make that adjustment what your results would be

[@EVOlutionHTC4g]

Rami, do you think that for a Phantom 4 RTK is good enough for two to three missions in a week, rather than going for the Matrice 30 RTK?

[@albacsafra3631]

can you tell me what laptop you use and its specs please. Thank you.

[@mihirangammm]

Your Software PIX 4d Pix 4d has lot of limitation

[@deanmartin6222]

Hi, beginner here. we recently bought p4rtk with 1 D-RTK 2 mobile station. Is it possible to use the D-RTK 2 mobile station to make ground control points like what you did?

[@allanjarrettbasi78]

I think it's possible.

[@richgibson8131]

To make GCP's you need a stand alone or network GPS system or a Total Station. You need a known position(s) to establish other known positions, ie. GCP's. You need to be able to tell the RTK base station where it is as well by setting up on a known point. The coordinates need to be entered into the flight controller in decimal degree format and something that is quite hard to find documented, you need to add the height of your base antenna to the ground elevation of your known point that you are set up on

[@nathanksimpson]

Right now (at least where I live, the Mavic 2 enterprise and an RTK kit total is about 3800$. No mechanical shutter, but RTK for less than half of the phantom, so my question is how much does a mechanical shutter make a difference when RTK mapping?

[@SUMMERSETMARINE]

the mechanical shutter is just for lens distortion. It's easier for the software to generate an accurate model when the images are crispy and distortion free.

[@TheBuenoWorldDrone]

Thanks for info. like it. ^^ Take care & seeU. 늘 행복하세요.^^

[@baddogastro]

Can I mark the check points with D RTK 2 Mobile Station?

[@cristipetrache7638]

Rami, you have a new subscriber! :) I am thinking this over and over again for 4 months now and dont know what to do. Here, in my country, the RTK is too expencive but is a dream for me. I barelly managed to raise the money for P4P v2 but haven't bought it yet because i didnt knew if i can use it for topography. Corret me if i'm wrong but all i need is the normal drone, ground control points wich i determine with a normal gnss rtk and a computer soft to create the model and georeference it with GCP coords? Thank you!!!

[@RamiTamimi]

Yea for the phantom 4 pro you need plenty of GCPs but it could still be used for mapping.

[@cristipetrache7638]

@@RamiTamimi Thank you for replying. The mapping resulted after post processing could have 1inch(3-4cm) accuracy?

[@jamespong6588]

How do you connect to an rtk server I own one and never figured it out

[@RamiTamimi]

Watch this video - kzbin.info/www/bejne/p3rdn5uurLqXqdk

[@ajmassey2144]

Hi Rami. How would you rate the Mavic Pro 2 vs the Phantom 4. I have a Mavic Pro 2 now and would like to use it for mapping and photography. Would you recommend staying with the MP2 or upgrading to the Phantom 4? Thanks

[@luisdavidescobedovelasquez2528]

Stay, just fly slower

[@zoeqp]

I watched the whole thing and still dont understand 🥴

[@brucelindsey1141]

Curious what you were using for the RTK corrections, ie base station, subscription service?

[@whitesnake329]

Love this , awesome and some of my engineering degree students at JLR (Jaguar Land Rover( could benefit from that site you mentioned. I will check it out! The obvious point is if you had adjusted the GCP's in the Agisoft Metashape, after all that's what its for, how would the results compare then ? I doubt for most people that accuracy would have been good enough to justify the extra dosh (as we say in UK, especially on peaky blinders , where I am from lol). On UK e bay you can get a Phantom 4 pro for about £500 ( 650 of your US dollar) So another video please , with the adjustments in Agisoft or a comparison with PIX4D , moving the GP's as suggested.

[@RamiTamimi]

Of course, more software based videos coming soon.

[@chrisalexander2478]

Now, we all know RTK is great. The RTK drone is always going to beat the socks off of the non-RTK without GCP corrections. However, the question I have is this. What happens to your data from the non RTK phantom when you use the GCPs for correction and have some check points in there to gauge the accuracy potential? How does that stack up against the RTK phantom outputs then? How do both of them stack up when both actually use the GCPs for correction and have some check points in there to gauge the results? I know folks want the fly it and forget it aspect of the RTK drone but even with that if you want to gauge your accuracy you have to go out and establish check points. Can you get comparable data from the non-RTK drone with the investment of some more ground time laying down GCPs and CPs with the base and rover?

[@vaf1282]

RTK однозначно нестоит покупать, за эти деньги лучше взять 2 teodrone.

[@wengueycheaw3882]

Few comments on the video. 1) the comparison is not even apple to Apple as turning the rtk off on the p4rtk is NOT the same as a P4P as the p4p is only L1 GNSS and the p4rtk is L1/L2. We are talking about at least 5 times better at 95% confidence interval. 2) I read a lot of comments on using the M30 for survey work. I don't think it was built for it. a) rolling shutter camera probably means errors especially when flying fast. b) don't think the camera system has a built in offset from the gnss to the payload like it does on the p4rtk and m300

[@ThingEngineer]

Awesome video, great question answered clearly! Now to disassemble my P4P, cut the UART line from the existing GNSS and feed in one from an F9P module from Ardusimple. Will it work, stay tuned. I won’t be able to use the built-in RTK menu but feeding corrections over a 900 MHz telemetry radio it’s only a few more grams of weight. All for about $500.

[@RamiTamimi]

Thank you. I honestly have no idea if getting into the brains of the drone to install RTK is worth it or not. Maybe if you're good with electronics and know what you're doing lol

[@trollenz]

@@RamiTamimi there are some kits out there that add PPK possibilities, so no RTK during missions but possibility to inject corrected data in the images in post... Prices vary between USD 1000-2000 (not including consumer P4P) but it could be worth it. Plus : no need to feed live corrections, just record raw data from a base and post process everything at the office.

[@tuliosoto4546]

Following

[@kelvinlau9623]

How bout using my mavic 2 enterprise advanced with add on RTK module? Can it get the job done with great accuracy ?

[@IrishPhotoArchive1952]

Imperial measures are so silly

[@prokremelskidezolati1426]

So, according to a "Doctor of Philosophy in Geodetic Engineering...with over 8 years of experience in the Land Development Industry" the 0,015m/0,024m = 0,03/0,06ft? Wooooooooooow, congrats! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@antekatavic2758]

Could you please tell us what was the difference in accuracy when you used/corrected both datasets with all 6 GCP? Since you already need to use them anyway, I wonder if difference is something that would justify the 4k additional cost to drone. In my opinion and some tests I did, rtk is worth it only when you want less field work (GCP) , or you can't put GCP points everywhere you want due to terrain configuration. Again i didn't do much testing and am curious to know if you are able to put GCP like you did on this job are there any differences in errors to initial GCP positions. Also I would much more enjoy your work if you measured those 6 GCP with a total station as a closed and corrected polygon. All that being said, I love what you are doing on this channel and thank you for that.

[@RamiTamimi]

Once you correct the GCPs it will be the same. Maybe some areas will have 0.1 feet difference, but overall it'll be the same.

[@jimmyhumuhumunukunukuapua]

Hello Rami, thank you for the video you made. It is reallt helpfull. But i am a bit confused since i thought that you can't fly in rtk mode without the base station on the ground, connected to the drone. I thought this is how the rtk gets it's positioning and corrections. Can you shed some light on how you did it without the base station on the ground? I want to point out the fact that i'm living in europe. Thank you!

[@trentvestite94]

My guess is he's probably getting correction data from a nearby CORS station.

[@ammadahmad3549]

Can we use local cordinate system in a drone photometry???And if we do not have GNSS THEN HOW WILL WE SET CONTROL POINTS?

[@pandadrone413]

Dude ur so knowledgeable and make everything so easy not over explaining things bless 🙏🏾

[@EAGLE_FPV1]

People are paying 6k for a rtk system which is also not up to the morden standard and on the other hand I thinking to buy or not buy a rtk setup for 800 since two weeks.

[@RellekEarth]

I just want to do a point of interest video with the RTK. Is that something I can do? From what I have seen, it does not, but maybe I missed something.

[@dp70737]

Vertical accuracy of the raw Rtk data was 0.024m = 2.4 cm = 0.94” = 0.0787’ And what would have been the errors of the geo referenced data with and without rtk. If the error after the geo reference is bad then you can’t get any more accurate, without that info its still hard to make the call of is it worth the price for any actual surveying using control points…?

[@kumarswamymath586]

Hi am want buy drone for survey work I have foif dgps which is the best option for me I am a beginner

[@datcameraguy827]

Good job. Can it still get us accurate mapping for 5,000 Acres of land size?

[@Sarfraz_CHK]

Thanks Rami! Appreciate your work

[@ArjayMartin]

If it knows what the error is. why doesn't it just connect it?

[@aerialethos]

Hi Rami - really enjoying your content and learning quite a bit. Did you use a base station with this test or were you using the network for corrections? I am on the verge of purchasing either a base station/rover or an RTK drone (to run off of the network). However I am being told RTK off of the network is not very accurate? Many thanks!

[@landivarscott]

I would like to know the answer to that question as well. It think it is very relevant to the video conclusion. @RamiTamimi

[@sergethomas8853]

Did you use your base station? When I use the RTK with and Emlid RS2 casting through Emlid caster, I get really good data. When I use the FDOT base that is several miles away, I get good but not as good data. By all means, people should still use GCPs when using the P4 RTK. I also have the M+ and adapter for the regular P4P. I have never tested it. You have to do PPK which is superior to RTK but more workflow. The P4 RTK also can log and you can do PPK which is better than RTK. Again, more work, but worth it if real accurate data are needed. Yet, I still use GCPs.

[@RamiTamimi]

I used MDOT Cors in this example, but I get pretty much the same thing when I use a local base station. PPK give you more control over your data. RTK is doing the corrections upon data collection and PPK does the correction afterwards. ALWAYS USE GCPS, EVEN IF ITS JUST A FEW OF THEM!

[@trollenz]

Nice test !... It could be cool also to adjust both surveys with GCPs and compare deviations between both... Edit : I've seen you've thought about it in an answer to another comment. Cool !

[@AZObns]

Elo Sir , M3E drone can get accuracy like this?

[@zwiftfrance]

Not sure to understand well. Do you get a signal from a network when using rtk ?

[@trollenz]

I think you can either use a ntrip stream or set up your local base station

[@jerseyshoredroneservices225]

The dilemma used to be whether to buy the p4p or p4rtk. The new dilemma is what to buy now that DJI seems to be ending the Phantom line altogether...😞

[@sjm7290]

I know, and it's strange. Why are they ending the Phantom line?

[@arturovelasquez1158]

That is not realistic, you can Rtk all GCPS before you use the phantom 4 pro and still get excellent results.....

[@RamiTamimi]

Yes you can. You should do this with the RTK too, but it's impressive how accurate the RTK is even without the GCPs

[@bibbop2078]

Do you need a mobile station to use the RTK drone?

[@dahaproject3498]

I can get

[@scottcraig2569]

I have an RTK Phantom Pro. I bought it for surveying and the dealer told me to turn off the RTK. 😡 I can't wait to fly with it on. Which desktop software are you using to process your flights?

[@Zim_mining]

Can you assist me in getting a P4 pro

[@stargazer7644]

What was the drone using for the base? Cors?

[@BG_Lidar]

Really insightful! Once again a great video, Rami!

[@RamiTamimi]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@nncuav7563]

Thank you) 1. a Ph4 RTK GPS - it is multysystem (+Galileo, Beidou), multichannel (+L2) and more channel system 2. A DJI say, that in RTK and Pro different optic (may be marketing, who knows:) 3. What will real different RTK on RTK mode and Pro from reference marker. No to mach - some millimeters if you have a many reference marker (not a contorl - reference!). 4. RTK a good stable fly (it use a more accuracy GNSS signal) and very frendly hard and software complex

[@rolandkarlsson7072]

Now, the drone is taking images that are stitched together. This stitching gives you information. In principle you could fly around without and GPS and still map the area, and then get relative points. So, I am not sure what your errors means. Is the stitching information increasing the accuracy? You said that, in principle, with some extra work, you could get higher accuracy with the normal GPS, How accurate? And how much work?

[@mikejohnson001995]

Hi Rami, i wanted to ask this. Do you need a pilot's license and a flying permit each time to carry out a drone survey over there in America? Do you also need insurance for your drone? I am a surveyor from Greece and here doing this job is somewhat time consuming as far as bureaucracy is concerned. It is easier to use a drone while being a youtuber for doing amateur videos than using it for professional work.

[@Mnarbona88]

Nothing new here, its obvious that RTK wil give you a much bether absolute accuracy than an autonomous GPS, its known that absolute accuracy for autonomous gps is around 3m. It will a lot more interesting if you compare the relative accuracy, checking the distaces between the points.

[@PeeHooo]

Does the RTK position help if you want to do same fight path(with more accuracy than normal) multiple times? And in different timeframe eg. month between flights?

[@kevinkasp]

Great video and great videos in general. But please don't play music in the background while you are speaking. It's distracting and makes it a little tougher to hear everything you say. Notice in Hollywood movies despite spending millions for the music tracks, they don't ever play music when the characters are talking.

[@MiguelAngelBriones]

Hello Rami, very informative your video, thank you for sharing. Just will like to ask you something. I have the Phantom 4 Pro Plus, so my intention is to use it for topography. So I bought separately the remote control , the one you can use your phone as the monitor, and zinc it with drone. And then I was thinking on using Dronedeploy to do the job. So I like to know your thoughts on this as you have the experience doing this studies. Thank you for taking the time, and hope to hear from you.

[@arthurrousseaux2800]

Hi Rami. French surveyor here ! Ive just discover your channel and took a look at this rtk or not video. I feel like you encourage people not to use GCPs because rtk is here. But on large project you would always have this banana effect, so since you always need GCPs i dont find the cost worth it. I'm using M210 rtk, what if find great with rtk, its when its windy ! And the p4pro rtk dont have the raw, which is a stop for me !

[@alexanderbruchhaus5984]

How does the uav position itself along the flighttrack? With RTK enabled i get it. When RTK is off, does the uav uses some kind of an IMU or visible inertial system to position itself?☺️

[@kkonto202]

really good video but what do you think about making theese ground points the gaps and not chk points? there will be a big difference between drone measurements on orthophotomaps and gnss measurements of for e.g. curbs (in both missions)? can u make this comparison please? when you measure a curb with gnss rover and drone with rtk and without it? and I have an idea… can we make postprocessing of gps position of the photos from phantom4pro? something like when you make a static gnss measurements using dgnss and then you need to make postprocessing data. [sorry for my weak English]

[@infinityxpeed]

whats software you used?🙏

[@juanbetancourt480]

I definitely go with PPK, GCP's are the solution for large areas.

[@ArjayMartin]

What about then calibrating to GCP/Checkpoints?

[@The-charlatans-killer]

What about AUTEL Evo 2 rtk? it's chipper then P4 RTK..

[@weygheoncaldeen]

Is it possible to add the DJI M2EA RTK Module to Phantom 4 V2?

[@daviddavis5986]

Greetings Rami. Could I add a RTK to a Mavic Pro?

[@bnoll712]

So are you using the Base Station that comes with the Drone for your RTK flight??

[@hudsonchalmers6504]

What about relative accuracy, take Elev Diff between points

[@Ironfist76]

Thanks Rami.

[@limelightmuskoka]

Irrelevant now that we have the two RTK pucks on the DJI M30. One puck systems don't compare to the Matrice systems. We are talking a 20 percent difference in price between a RTK Phantom and M30. They should discontinue it.

[@RamiTamimi]

If DJI keeps manufacturing them then maybe they will. I can't wait to get my hands on a M30 to try it out!

[@grigoryaneric]

Do you need a base station with the RTK drone?? Or can you just connect to the CORS network??

[@MeMyself_andAI]

You can do either or.

[@BenedictOsei-Mensa]

Good work

[@EdgardsGranados]

Hi Rami. I have a question: How Can you assure the fix GNSS correction in a RTK flight? I mean, when we are taking GCPs with the GNSS receivers sometimes we have communcation problems... How RTK drone assure or guarantees fix mode during the mission?

[@nncuav7563]

hello at RTK app panel you can see a level of signal, app show you "RTK signal lost", and at meny you can see XYZ error

[@geotek6748]

does data collected in standard p4 pro corrected along with GPS?

[@pradeeppanwar7279]

Hi Sir, Thx!

[@AliFX]

Awesome video man good work!!

[@RamiTamimi]

Thank you Alioosh!

[@BigBoiBalu]

thank you

[@tszabon]

@Rami, thanks for a great video but I still have one important question: how long it takes to process RTK vs non RTK images, is there any noticeable difference?

[@OkNopo]

Huge dif indeed

[@eprohoda]

God morning. bro. Omg- useful vlog. ))

[@RamiTamimi]

Morning!

[@joaopauloabdalla7233]

AWESOME!!! ALSO, I'M NOT ALONE! kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk I did some validation tests with my P4 Multispectral RTK + DRTK2 here in Brazil, and no-one could believe in the accuracies I'm getting from it (older surveyors who didn't update themselves), and also, with some tricks, you can improve the accuracy of mixed raw data from multiple drone flights, in other words, you can mix raw data from more conventional/cheaper drones, like Mavic 2 Pro, align and then correct it with the raw data from the P4M RTK / P4RTK.

[@GerardoDiaz_01]

Almost good. Just use metric system.

[@Harryalexys]

Thanks for your videos, what do you think about Air 2s for aerial mapping? Regards from Ecuador!

[@RamiTamimi]

It would be very similar to Phantom 4 Pro.

[@stevenm6489]

Wow that is super impressive awesome video 👍🏻

[@khalidkhalido6984]

ممكن اسالك بعض الأسئلة ادا تفضلت

[@brahimcnts]

GREAT WORK BROTHER ... BRAHIM FROM ALGERIA

[@CreateHubTips]

What base station were you using?

[@mbbayati]

P4pro with a ppk module

[@oscarulate2592]

great video, what software does you use for the process? for the model? Thank you

[@jerseyshoredroneservices225]

Pix4D

[@lendelljay7093]

Thank you Rami!

[@hudsonchalmers6504]

Did you have the base?

[@manzurolaman494]

Nice....clear explaination...

[@aniruddhadas1232]

Please make a comparison video between lidar based Drone survey and photogrammetry based drone survey.

[@RamiTamimi]

Great video idea! Coming soon..

[@aniruddhadas1232]

@@RamiTamimi Please check the elevation difference after creation of point clouds from both methods.

[@uavvidography2760]

Just a word to the wise, it’s usually a safety feature to turn controller on first ( before the drone)

[@OpInsanity15]

Love the great work!

[@RamiTamimi]

Much appreciated!

[@sw20matt]

Thank you for the video but I wonder what the point of this is? Given that just about every credible source says that are taking not be dependent on solely for mapping in ground control points are still needed. How do these two drones differ when it comes to making Ortho mosaics and 3D models that may need stockpile measurements or other measurements? Once you add ground control points in how much different is the end result?

[@RamiTamimi]

It has to do with the number of GCPs and the dependability of the GNSS receiver. P4 Pro needs more than double the GCPs to make the data accurate, and the RAW data is unusable for high accuracy mapping. Now if you're doing stockpile reports, then mapping isn't a concern and a P4 Pro would be just fine, no need for the RTK.