The Real Reason Anime Discourse Has Gotten Bad

[@SamFromItalia]

You drew me in by having that Demon Loli as the thumbnail only for this to be a short documentary on how the Social media landscape has changed how sides of a debate interact with each other for the worse, fair enough man 😭

[@laorlex]

Shes from Re:Zero if you haven't watched it already

[@JesusLiberton-f9y]

I wonder why he used that thumbnail, the people in his discord unironically think like that towards loli characters

[@fnfgammer2014]

​@@JesusLiberton-f9y did Asa do another A/B thumbnails testing? I remember the thumbnail being Momo from Dandadan.

[@xpurescimx]

capella isnt a loli tho like i have nothing against loli but she is just petite lol

[@JesusLiberton-f9y]

​@@xpurescimxI dont mean this disrespectfully but capella is definitely a loli. Lolis can be adults I often see people saying characters like Tatsumaki from OPM isn't a loli when the author himself says she is.

[@ShreN_]

As someone who hasn't engaged with these sorts of sociology/psychology based topics before, I actually found this video easy to follow and it matches what I've seen over time. At some point I realised that arguing with people is 99% not worth it because most people don't actually want a discussion, they just want their opinions to be heard and/or validated - as some kind of parasocial interaction.

[@danielantony1882]

Yeah, it does seem like it most of the time. It’s like no one cares, lol.

[@AnimalAce]

I was gonna type "Your Wrong" for an ironic thing. But I didn't feel like arguing.

[@ShreN_]

@@AnimalAce 😂 now I kinda wish you did to see if I would've taken the bait

[@AnimalAce]

@@ShreN_ lol!

[@Stryfe52]

@@AnimalAceYou’re* btw. No offense, but is it really that hard to just use the proper word

[@IanNBF]

Not every conversation needs to be a debate, not every debate needs to become an argument, & not every argument needs to be "won".

[@mrcaos999]

This too. I think this is a mistake this Chanel also makes. Who cares if many MHA fans not get his critic. And no just because people disagree with him they are not wrong. It's the way how you do it that matters. Hence to get back to his JJK example. If you say "female character are objectively bad written in the show" you have disqualified yourself from any discussion, sorry. Most of the topics spoken about in this video are highly subjective matters.

[@vsimp2956]

On one hand, that's fair, on the other hand, doesn't it just kinda get your goat when people say completely untrue things with full blown confidence?

[@MilesNuggetBiggestFan]

Arguing is fun though

[@Lordmaster135]

BUT I LIKE WINNING.I LIVE TO PROVE THAT I AM CORRECT AND YOU ARE WRONG IN YOUR BELIEFS

[@crimsonzone8984]

​@@vsimp2956goat?

[@living_legacy_7]

8:43 adding to this, some people are not aware they are engaging in a fallacy cause thats the most prevalent type of argument they have been engaging with, since ever, especially in the anime community where there is a lot of kids. arguing for the sake of arguing is just the "norm" to some of them so they replicate this behaviour which will only perpetuate these kinds of discussions because their social circles approve it. its crazy out there

[@franciszekkapuscinski]

Asaratha rage baiting me by hating Shaula's design😭

[@julio.dealmeidabranconeto5831]

... Is there something good about her design? XD

[@danielantony1882]

Shaula? I thought that was… huh? All I’m seeing is Capella. Are you good, little homie?

[@gumi_twylit2605]

shaula? in the thumbnail? tf?

[@zeo4481]

​@@danielantony1882 You may have seen a different thumbnail. KZbin has a new function to compare thumbnails between different people and pick a winning thumbnail

[@danielantony1882]

@@zeo4481 You’re 100% gaslighting me, ’cause all I can see is Capella.

[@MohamIsMe]

So, in conclusion, humans shall establish more physical contact with grass

[@MC-ku4zz]

I got baited by Capella but I don't regret it

[@Korixon.]

lol. I just saw cappella and though, is this video about re zero. Then I read the titles and it looked like it could be interesting, as I’ve seen so many stupid arguments

[@vsimp2956]

10:36 isn't this just completely objectively wrong though? When Momo fight's Nobara for the first time the entire point she's trying to make is that Mai has struggled because of how mysoginistic the Jujutsu society is. It is also pretty much stated by Mai that if Maki didn't rebell against the clan both of them would have ended up as servants, which Mai found prefferable than being force to be a sorcerer and fight, which also supports the idea that, at the very least, the Zenin clan is mysoginistic in that sense and has some version of traditional gender roles. And neither of those moments were subtle whatsoever, I'm pretty sure some people disliked them because of how extremely on the nose and unsubtlely they were handled... And they still flew over some people's heads. I guess manga readers get too caught up in the hype shit to remember what happened in the story before then.

[@AsarathaHSYT]

sure, that's a fair counter argument to the original poster i was talking about. like i said, if you're going to disagree you should disagree with things they actually said, which you did!

[@vsimp2956]

Yeah I get it, I watched the whole video after, it just kinda got my goat to see that particular example since it was so easily disproved. But it was a good video overall! Nice analysis of the whole situation, good on you for bringing up proper sources too 🙏

[@allin3ss]

I remember that dnd tweet. Had no idea people reacted so negatively to it 😭

[@Its_LMP]

Another well made analysis from my man Asa

[@BocchiTheBox]

Yeah I do think the problem with discourse is the platforms themselves and less so the person you are arguing with. If social media algorithm worked to push peoples interests at the top, discourse would exist still but a lot more minimum and more so for people who are both interested in that same topic. Now it's all about engagement. It's not about what interest you, it's about what keeps you on their platform for longer. So it puts people who don't like a certain thing in a spot where they see more of that thing, they go on a tirade on how much they hate that thing, and since they engaged with that post the algorithm views that as engagement and thinks you want to see more of it and starts shoving more of that thing down your throat. This is something we knew about the algorithm a long time ago with how the dislike button doesn't work in favor of the user. Order goes like this. > Person who hates (this thing) > Person see's a post about (that thing) > Person calls it mid/trash/disgusting to rage-bait some people and then move on with their day forgetting the comment was ever made at all. > Algorithm see's that little bit of engagement and pushes more (of that thing) on that person > Now the person who hates (this thing) is seeing too much (the thing) that the person never wanted to see in the first place involving them in arguments they never wanted to have in the first place. > Now you have this person becoming a bad guy to this group of people who liked (that thing) and those group of people also look like the bad guys to this person who hated (that thing) Replace the stuff in parenthesis with literally any topic.

[@Ariaankun]

(Off the topic ik) but ig the community here is the right one to rate my this observation about Subarus philosophical and perception shift and what rezero ultimately tries to say with its characters. Do you think I had the essence of what re zero is trying to convey? Subaru initially had a perspective that he needs to be like his father, becuz everybody sees him as son of natsuki, he had a perspective that he needs to live up to everybodys expectations to become happy, he was always trying to act like his father, the inauthentic behaviour led him to never get any friends, **"He thought true happiness is when u live up everybody's expectations and make everyone happy and notice u as the hero**", and that perspective of him turned very overwhelming that he gave up in his real world, Upon reaching the new world with his suffering and all he started gaining a new perspective. He learnt that there are people who loves ur innerselves and loves you whatever u do they don't force their ideals on you, they love the way u are, such as his parents he failed to understand their true feelings, his parents loved him the way he is and appreciated what he wants They just wanted him to be happy,. As they give u this unmaterialistic love in exchange u do same for them. Love them as they are, cuz everyone is a victim of self image. "Upon his suffering,he learnt a new perspective" why did i mentioned that? becuz as his suffering became more intense he started opening up ( not fully becuz of the curse but he still did) which he didn't done in his previous world which made people misunderstood him and as he started expressing his feelings in the world of re zero due to that much suffering, and to 'his' surprise, he learnt that people actually care for him and are eager to help him, they love him when even he is vulnerable, becuz he unintentionally did same for them once :) He also learnt self acceptance and self confidence and learnt how not to wait for this materialistic world to valdify his worth instead he have himself and his true loved ones to say how grateful are they to have him and that's how he started to learn about the unmaterialistic and unconditional true love gradually, and his perspective changes. Through re zero we learn how there is a lackness of love in the world and a little love can indeed change many things, just open up and make others open up and accept people the way they are apart from this materialistic world ❤❤

[@DrKarmo]

The takeaway from this is that most fandoms are hogwash except the ones I'm part of

[@KingLAO2964]

Now I shall be seated for this

[@Stryfe52]

I completely forgot this was a Re Zero channel for a second. Good video dude, this helped me realize how I engage in this kind of behavior myself without even realizing it. Too often do I go into arguments assuming that the other person is wrong because of X or Y, and not actually engaging with what it is that they’re saying. I go into arguments wanting to win instead of trying to learn or understand. Anyways, when is the next Chainsaw Man video?

[@Stryfe52]

This actually pushed me over the edge to subscribe for once. No clue why I wasn’t subscribed already I like your content a decent bit

[@gaelheartt]

Holy fuck supertf mentioned 3:48

[@10100rsn]

Sometimes people are just having a bad day, and sometimes their stars are bad... sometimes both. 🙃

[@caper7635]

So what you're basically saying is people should never argue and only be suck-ups that accept everything another person says? Wow you are insane. Likes please :)

[@3dsmaster537]

"How dare you disagree with my favorite youtuber?! You're wrong!!" yappity yap yap🗣🗣

[@TheDestineyAngel]

Chat, is this comment a straw man? When the KZbinr say people should never argue and only be suck ups that accept everything another person says? KZbinr said some things about confirmation and disconfirmation bias; as well as ghost fighting. Also KZbinr likes to read papers since he quoted a few articles and books about selective thinking. It was a weird flex. Alas the KZbinr failed to realize that the vast majority of people don’t research or defend claims with objective points due to illiteracy and skill issue. So no that’s not what the KZbinr said, but the world be better off if illiterate people were more humble.

[@SuperRandoms.]

Rly good vid man clicked for Capella and got smth actually smart

[@barthol9776]

Here comes KZbin content creator Mr. AsarathaHS telling us to not discuss our hobbies on twitter, gee thanks. Good video

[@fan4every1lol89]

Well that was quite insightful

[@NoneAvailable303]

amazing video

[@Sappysappster]

Twitter is pretty much a breeding ground for everything you said in the video lol I'm so glad I left that website man it's just the worst

[@colinhourihan1274]

Idk how these types of videos don’t get more views. Easy to notice the amount of work you put in. Love the content man 👍

[@syan2240]

Damn, didn'r expect this to be so informative

[@SumRndmPenguin]

Good video. I like to think I've avoided participating in stupid discourse since an argument I had a few years ago broke up my discord friend group but it’s really hard to avoid the traps when you're just scrolling for funnies. Also nice thumbnail bait lol.

[@twelfthknight]

I once saw an... argument(?) In a YT reply section on a video talking about a fighting game introducing custom colour schemes for its characters. The comment that started this long chain was something along the lines of "I bet [woke/left] twitter user(s) will hate this" and then like dozens of replies basically restating the same thing again while laughing at this unserious alleged person. No where in this conversation chain, or entire reply section for that matter, expressed any particular criticism politically motivated or otherwise -- but everyone there was seemingly certain this person was out there and knew exactly what they thought and felt on that subject. The part about "punching ghosts" just reminded me of that. You don't even need a person there to be uncharitably antagonistic, just the flavour of such a person existing. A mutual conceptualization is enough now, apparently.

[@CineflickProductions]

It’s time to RAGE The BAIT

[@haomakk]

love your content, dude

[@RaiginAnimator]

Definetly accidently did this. I mean more so gamifying arguments I feel like I try to hard to be right in arguments only till after several exhausting arguments did I realise no amount of “logic” makes people change their minds Even if and that’s a big if someone is genuinely saying something out of touch or not really well thought out it isn’t really my job to tell them how that opinion makes them an awful person nor is it anyone’s. At best I’m just arguing semantics with people with both of us needing to be objectively right and wasting our time. And at worst was screaming at people for disagreeing with me.

[@kyperactive]

Would.

[@Greda-x5j]

This is super correct and there's no self awareness at all, someone just posted a reaction video to this vid, and he is literally called out by this video entirely, what you describe fits him to a t and he doesn't even realize the irony.

[@AsarathaHSYT]

who is this in relation to? 😭

[@StepBaum]

As someone who never had twitter in his life, this is new to me. And holy shit incomprehensibly stupid, people back then in school acted this way. And I suppose not only kids are on twitter. Good video, great flow of narration Asa

[@mahkicarter]

Another great video!!!!!

[@deretti347]

I already knew that, I recomend the book "Infocracy" by Byung-Chul Han I was expecting to be about Lolis because of the thumbnail lol but good video anyway

[@lilg3271]

My man asa cooking a quality meal once more! I especially liked the strawman and ghost hunting segments, since I feel like I see that sort of thing a lot.

[@tayojones9460]

Social media sucks. It really goes without saying

[@4sha42]

Good AsarathaHS Chapter today

[@notimportant0000]

It's really strange to me for people to see videos like this, kind of broadly talking about the toxicity of fandom and just come away with "Twitter sucks lmao". Like yes twitter sucks, but these kind of arguments happen everywhere online. Reddit, youtube comments, instagram, tiktok. Anywhere you're able to write text to another person publicly.

[@ricko3363]

Thank you for the peak video

[@chadgrimwell8380]

There is rage baiting and there's Rezero Lust thumbnail baiting 😂

[@veturwinter]

I like your voice :)

[@TheDestineyAngel]

So the thumbnail was a lie.

[@AsarathaHSYT]

The thumbnail is the most generic one possible. Popular anime character, text that tells the videos promise when coupled with the title, and a red arrow. Genuinely cookie cutter. I don't know why people think it's such devious click bait

[@Blinkehyo]

⁠@@AsarathaHSYTI think the video was good, but I do fear that the people clicking on it are looking for that particular discussion on RZ, and when it isn’t mentioned quickly, they’ll dislike it. I think the audience you’re drawing in with this thumbnail are those who want to know the about this discourse, whereas your audience will like it regardless

[@AsarathaHSYT]

its a 95% like to dislike ratio, so i don't think its that big of an issue. it's just strange because i've done this thumbnail style countless times and only this time is when people call into question the thumbnail. nobody was wondering where makeine was in my aniwave video 😭

[@TheDestineyAngel]

@@AsarathaHSYT sorry for the late reply. If I look at the thumbnail independently, I could make the assumption that the video would articulate why “[someone’s] wrong for liking [Capella]”. The video title and video essay aside, I’d say that the thumbnail is a clickbait since Capella recently received a significant amount of screen time in the latest episode of ReZero. Hence, a lot of content creators have given various reactions that generally agree with the claim “you’re wrong for liking this”. However, the video essay wasn’t about Capella specifically but a broad critique of fandoms. I wasn’t criticizing the design or deviousness of the thumbnail, I practically agreed with you- “Anime Discourse Has gotten Bad” due to a couple of reasons you mention in your lengthy video essay. After watching your video essay, I’m sure we can agree that whether I either like or dislike Capella is totally up to me as a viewer and opinionated individual with predilections, instead of conforming to the opinions of others based on how many likes it was assigned. Your video brings awareness to an issue that plagues fandoms: the trappings of confirmation or disconfirmation bias instead of independent thinking. In conclusion “you’re wrong for liking this” is a groundless claim because a) the video essay wasn’t about Capella or whatever the arrow is pointing at & b) my interpretation of the video essay is to overcome toxic fandom by being aware of why it has gotten bad. Alright it’s time for me to get back to some RZ audiobook

[@memop6679]

Algorithm boost

[@ak-t7d6f]

0:03 Lum mentioned

[@lemonmk2786]

I forgot this was an anime video.

[@ancientkatana1077]

9:45 damn I immediately sided with him, I need to actually research before forming an opinion, thank you for this video this was kinda helpful.😅

[@Chaospirex]

Thank u for this yummy video 🎉

[@alex_zetsu]

I just can't concentrate on what you're saying since the Oshi No Ko clips keep taking more of my attention than the audio.

[@Whatstheteaj]

I don't participate in online discourse usually, but I juss dealt with this with a friend an hour ago, perfect timing 🤣

[@anzl16]

i like to believe most of these ppl who argue aggressively fell short when they have to face a person in real life

[@TXCSymbiont]

I clicked because of my Waifu on the thumbnail but i haven‘t seen her in the video

[@RavenL1337]

Clickbait thumbnail+title will make people think you actually will take part in the "implied" topic, not the worst clickbait mind you :3 it's easy way this happens actually, this type of phenomena happened for quite some time, it's just anime itself has grown so huge it stops being a niche medium, so ofc it will attract attention and discussions of all sorts will happen, including the negative way of handling discourse, and that will make people feel like **anime discourse gone bad** , maybe you should make a video on how discourse is affected by the popularity of any topic, niche vs popular :3 so your video was not too much of a surprise, it's just the way discourse is working , the new info on explaining way did anime discourse become so bad is quite interesting :3

[@trashaimgamer7822]

Rage baiters fuel grifters and grifters fuel rage baiters. Best for any sane person to stay out of the rage-bait/grifter economy. It's utter brain rott.

[@mrcaos999]

I think its totally okay to argue and discuss. But no one is objective. Also people that make youtube videos aren't. Hence its totally okay to critizise a certain scene in episode 1 of Dan da Dan. But no one is wrong for disagreeing. At the end of the day its subjective just like the scenes in Goblin Slayer that is way worse in that regard.

[@Ariaankun]

Let me also tell u some solutions that i discovered for such wicked things. 1st Make people aware they are being victims and others too of this wicked things, and causing a lackness of love in the world, If u love and try to make them feel that u understand what they mean but there might be a better opinion they will sure listen u and tell them to not being a victim of this silly human emotion. Second. Make them listen and then u express why u are drawn to it and why u think its the better one share ur perspective to them as humans, if one human finds it beautiful i believe the other human will do it too its just change of perspectives and expressing why u love it.

[@espurrseyes42]

Because anime "fans" in 2024 turned into the weebs of the 2000s: Taking Japanese cartoons way too seriously and treating fictional characters like real people, doing harm in reality over them. Calm down, son, it's just a drawing.

[@acousticco]

Another W

[@hannahmetzger4880]

At 7:04, what' that anime?

[@pyneaple541]

Go, Go, Loser Ranger! (Also referred to as Ranger Reject)

[@hannahmetzger4880]

@pyneaple541 Thank you! 😁. I'll have to look that up.

[@KGarcia619]

8:25 Sonic Colors, Nice👍

[@MohamIsMe]

And Sonic Unleashed at the start.

[@wuba5456]

09:35 WOO

[@themelancholyofgay3543]

a little off topic, your twitter is set to Japanese?

[@AsarathaHSYT]

yea

[@natalimoina]

yt so poor it won't even let me comment properly

[@czms922]

They're becoming a parasite

[@ReidAstrea]

Real ones know ts a reupload

[@adxo]

maybe we should invent a proper word for 'Gotcha'

[@Kinochai]

Why is gotcha not a proper word? Aside from it not sounding fancy

[@ProjektTaku]

@@Kinochai because I guess its born from a colloquialism of "got you" (not that I think it can't be a proper word).

[@crimsonzone8984]

The memes.

[@convergeman7825]

I always just assumed this stuff was only restricted to the Genshin/Gacha fandoms, since I'd literally never seen internet discourse get this bad before that game came out back in 2019. Based on this video though it sounds like this kind of brainrot has been bubbling everywhere, and now I realise I might have just been sheltered since I never really use Twitter. Now that I've seen more of it, I noticed Twitter discourse especially tends to be very "all or nothing". Any topic seems to bring out the absolute worst people and most braindead takes on both sides of an argument, and it seems like this Twitter style of discourse is starting to leak into other places now. Recently there was that incident bought up briefly during a Trash Taste episode where a single act of racism was met with extreme takes like "omg based racism" on one side and stuff like "omg all people of the same ethnic group and nationality as this person must also be racist, ignorant and backwards" on the other side, with very little understanding or acknowledgement of any sort of nuance. It really puts into perspective what internet discourse today has devolved to even outside of anime and video games.

[@notimportant0000]

This goes back at least as far as the early 2000s in fandom culture, but it probably goes back even farther with message boards and interent forums. People have always acted this way ik fandom spaces online, it's very strange.

[@su1400]

❤

[@Looker0]

Why am i watching this

[@barthol9776]

Did you finish?

[@Stryfe52]

I finished

[@tyler1673]

Don't have to watch the video to blame it on the normies

[@barthol9776]

BASED AND FIGHTING GHOST PILLED

[@eddy9615]

Ok

[@fnfgammer2014]

Ok

[@wahrt]

Ok

[@idreadFell365]

I can’t help be fascinated by that chimera like aspect of her

[@DanielSnyder-m2c]

Just give us more re zero videos

[@barthol9776]

Watch the Rezero Globe one and the Magic system one if you're thirsty

[@bandarsalh1338]

One of the things I dislike the most is when a fandom tries so hard to shield their favourite anime from any criticism Re zero is the biggest example. They'll ignore the glaring flaws of the writing and adaptation, and start comparing power levels to shonen anime and when you criticise the anime they'll tell you that it's not for you because you're a "shonen fan who only likes fight scenes"

[@fnfgammer2014]

Sorry, but only manga readers can complain about re:zero anime. 😔

[@Pyrilewski]

​@@fnfgammer2014As if the manga is the source. Here's ur gold.

[@mvddoxeatsbugs]

big rezero fan here and i agree to an extent. i had a pretty shitty time reading arc 7-8 and every time i tried to see other people’s opinions on why they didn’t like it just to put my finger on what was so off about it, there was always so many people trying to bend over backwards to justify tappei’s lackluster writing choices there. arcs 7-8 are fine but are comparatively weaker compared to the rest of the story. does this change the fact that rezero is my favorite piece of fiction i’ve ever had the pleasure of experiencing? no, not at all.

[@canoshizrocks]

I don't criticize things I don't like because my opinion isn't important. I stop watching it and move on to the next thing.

[@DemiCape]

from my experience, re zero fans are opposite and does not compare power levels, plus there are certain things that works because of the perspective you are looking from.

[@isekaitruckkun]

its a main character syndrome apocalypse we are always presented with stories in media, where the main charactar witch is framed as you. has a purpose and fights for it,and is always right for fighting for that "purpose".we admire that. people don't have purpose witch is great enough so they create one. whether it be an argument. a fight for whatever they believe etc. A person whos got something serious going on in his life will never think about doing this.But teenagers,broke men and introverts do. The keyboard heroes.

[@titania396]

+++

[@nonofyourbeeswax9228]

Garbage take lmao

[@slippyy4252]

Bait used to be believable...

[@barthol9776]

No checkmark no NOTHING, just baiting for the sake of it

[@RaiginAnimator]

Reason #2400005 on why I don’t use Twitter