We Interviewed A Former Elite North Korean Spy | Stay Curious #36

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Chul-eun Lee is a former high-ranking North Korean government official who defected to South Korea in 2016. He swam 6km from North to South Korea and started a new life. We asked him about his journey, his former job with the North Korean government, and the differences he sees between North and South Korea.
Special thanks to Chul-eun Lee for taking the time to share his story with the world.
If you're fluent in Korean and English and want to help him with English subtitles, feel free to reach out to him here: [e-mail]
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[@AsianBoss]

If you consider yourself a true fan of Asian Boss, become a member of our community to join the cause: asianboss.io

[@yukonofficialmusic]

@AsianBoss we need an update of where Chul-eun Lee is nowdays!

[@Rinfiner]

He managed to talk for almost 40 minutes without saying anything unnecessary or boring. Every sentence was packed with information and the interviewer asked the right questions. Great Job from both.

[@WilbertLek]

Except for that BS about the buybull. Other cults are banned as well, of course. And NO! that OF COURSE doesn't make it an "atuist cuntry" because they are brainwashed to "worship" their own "supreme being". The only difference is, this one actually exists....

[@gmoney6075]

@@WilbertLekthe bible? im confused as to why youve chosen to miss spell these words. are you mocking him?

[@Outlawjankooo]

lmfao

[@araminrain]

He was concerned he couldn't speak very well. He spoke beautifully. Amazing story

[@pixeldust2898]

@@gmoney6075 Wilbert Lek is being a bigot and a troll trying to mock people of faith. It sounds like the people worshiping in the Christian church were executed or enslaved for their faith. Same attitude of hate and intolerance on display, Wilbert Lek is just being too small-minded to realize it.

[@shoyuramenoff]

"I don't think I spoke well". The entire time I was thinking that he was extremely good at story-telling and conveying his ideas.

[@gubeym]

seriously. i havent watched a full youtube video in a very long time. usually i skip around. i looked down at the 30 minute mark and thought i was only 5 minutes in. absolutely amazing story teller.

[@avatar5811]

They are not defectors. They are surivors

[@Mondscheinelfe]

@@gubeym same

[@ToveriJuri]

I thought I'd watch a little bit of the beginning and maybe skim along, but I was captivated by the storytelling and watched the whole thing without a stop.

[@Stef25042]

exactly

[@sarahraza7935]

I was really impressed with how easily he saw through South Korea's nationalism. He never idolizes anything, but rather objectively assesses his surroundings. He's really open-minded and I enjoyed hearing his story

[@carolday3381]

I like how you point out he objectively assesses, which if you think of it, thats what spy’s do. That’s what intelligence officers have to do. He cuts through and just see’s it.

[@pyrrosdimas5798]

Wonder how many deaths he has on his hands

[@oliver24x]

@@pyrrosdimas5798 You wouldn't have done anything else in his position.

[@bob40179]

yeah - that mindset helped him see through the north korea propaganda

[@elenabob4953]

@@oliver24x I would, but I guess that's my family and there is a reason why a part was deported in Siberia by communist's.

[@iangates1578]

This guy is clearly a man who has reached another level of wisdom. He's seen (and participated) in the worst aspects of his home country, abandoned hearth and home, rejected his old ways, started from nothing in a new country, and can speak honestly and frankly about the shortcomings and strengths of both countries (without making any false equivalence). Bravo!

[@mryellow9655]

Unlike you

[@ano.official]

@@mryellow9655 awesome response! You really got him there! Wow!

[@johnnyohness]

@@mryellow9655 Looks like we've uncovered another Trump voter. "Unlike You? Where do you get off with that? I agree with Gates 100%

[@mryellow9655]

@@johnnyohness go cry

[@aaaaaaaard9586]

He is a SS officer equivalent in NK. He describes crimes againts humanity he parted like fun stories in his job. No remorse, no regret. I heard tons of NK dectors saying how they hate the organization he worked in.

[@nurilha]

i wanted to listen to this in the background whilst doing work, then I realised I don't understand Korean.

[@Jesper007]

xDD

[@shanecallaghan3200]

😂🤣

[@Desimere]

haha, same

[@christotaku]

😂😂😂

[@Ruteger100]

love that your used "whilst".

[@ivansidorov6391]

This guy is something. You don't need to know the language to see how well-spoken he is. He cognizes the world and reflects each problem in its perspective. He is a dreamer. Even South Korea will become small for him. No wonder he defected.

[@JimFortin]

TRUTH

[@MJ-qb5ph]

Yeah … he comes across as a classic adventurer and dreamer or seeker … I agree … grafting in South Korea will disappoint him … I like the guy’s style. Cudos to him

[@dannnmerkle7930]

I have no idea what he is saying and relying on subtitles but the way he speaks and his inflection are captivating for some reason. I found myself turning it up to hear better even tho i am just reading it lol.

[@rafqueraf]

Looks like he has more social skills than the StarCraft players from South Korea

[@Andybwc]

I agree with your observation, he will probably emigrate to Japan or China next.

[@jumbeaux1]

He's eloquent and his story was very clearly communicated. What he said about not underestimating North Korea is probably the truth that people are not comfortable with. It's a mindset thing.

[@krollpeter]

The West has done extensive analysis. In the first two weeks of a war situation, North Korea could do a lot of damage to South Korea, in particular the Seoul area. After that it would stop pretty quick, and they would be forced into a defence situation. After 4 - 6 weeks the US had converted the entire North Korea to farmland and rocks, without using any atomic bombs. I can hear in him the same sentiments that many East Germans have/had.

[@muhammadzariff7075]

@@krollpeter When nothing is certain, anything is possible.

[@krollpeter]

@IAm Nana No need to think the other countries were any better when they developed their atomic bombs. The US for example exposed hundreds of soldiers in different locations to tests. They let them view the explosion from near, as an example. Of course they claimed at that time it was not known how dangerous the radiation is. That however is BS. No excuse for these inhumane experiments and incidents. It seems when it comes to national interests, governments thinking is like: A sacrifice but we have to do it for the greater good.

[@krollpeter]

@@김지섭-n5l posts like this should be auto-removed. You can not state someone is lying without saying why you think this.

[@BearingMySeoul]

I don't think any knowledgeable person is in doubt that North Korea can do a lot of damage/win a battle or two BUT they don't have enough resources or allies to win an actual war. Having lived in South Korea several years, I never truly worried about NK attacking because they know good and well, they day they attack is the day they die. As long as the rich stay rich like this guy talked about, they're not going to be interested in dying.

[@selahmaiah]

I love how pragmatic he is. And how he just states facts without resorting to bias. Didn't even notice the time running. He would make a great analyst. Sure hope he gets to start his own channel soon.

[@flytink1]

He should become a diplomat for South Korea since he could facilitate a better relationship with North Korea.

[@dennisddt1146]

@@flytink1 I don't think North Korea would like to talk with him in any way that is well mannered.

[@flytink1]

@@dennisddt1146 lol well he can pretend he’s a double agent and tell N. Korea he defected so they could have a man on the inside. Then he can feed N. Korea just enough intel to be convincing so they trust him as an agent. But not enough to give away truly important state secrets. Even if N. Korea was mad he defected, his intel is too valuable to pass up! At least they’d cooperate with him. In fact, if I’m North Korea, I’d send over a spy who supposedly “defected”. The defector would have an interesting, harrowing story and then try to work his way into a gov’t position in South Korea. Lmao I’m not siding with N. Korea but if they’re smart, that’s what they should do. If I’m South Korea, if I find out there’s a spy for North Korea working in South Korea’s CIA or NSA, I’d turn them into a double agent. They could serve as a back channel and they can plant false intel to mislead N.Korea. You could say, “what’s the point in all this?” The point is to gather intel on North Korea and to have another back channel or point of communication. Nobody’s going to learn anything worth knowing about North Korea while sitting at a conference table at the DMZ! If you poke a hole in a dam, you create a leak. The dam loses a little water but if your main goal is to break down the dam wall, it’s a small win! The only way you can defeat your enemy is by learning everything you can about them. Aside from their nuclear weapons program, the most valuable intel to gather would be on their infrastructure, GDP, trade relations, etc. North Korea’s only hope of survival is opening their borders to trade. But I guess if their country as a whole becomes stronger, the Kim family regime becomes weaker. That’s probably why they keep N. Korea so isolated. But N. Korea has a wealth of natural resources, so realistically, because their economy is so underdeveloped and they have an agrarian society, this is their most valuable commodity.

[@kanggoo57]

@@flytink1 yeah i doubt the north would take kindly to a defector being a diplomat.

[@tatiairwinn]

And he still could be a spy? Maybe because he’s such a great analyst, he was sent to SK as a spy with a cover as a defector

[@altouna]

I like how his tall friend just goes along with the “you go first” plan to get past the mines

[@parkpatt]

I didn't really understand that part. Does having long legs make it easier to avoid mines somehow? Or did they just get lucky?

[@Azrazel_qwp]

@@parkpatt if his friend steps on a mine, only his friend dies, because his legs are further away from them

[@parkpatt]

@@Azrazel_qwp wow. Thanks for explaining. What a heroic thing to do.

[@parkpatt]

@@Jay-pm9gh how horrible and strange. Can you share the link to the article?

[@kk-kz9im]

@@Jay-pm9gh istnt it that the dude just escaped the same year? he is not necessarily mr Lee's friend

[@brettwilson5389]

"I'm a simple man" Recognizes tidal cycles, alludes security, knows how.... tendons work in relation to an electric fence, or how they cramp in an eight mile swim.

[@chaosghostring9682]

probably because its in-line with his previous work that he knows that knowledge and base on experience. they have different education system there after all

[@brettwilson5389]

@@chaosghostring9682 True, but my point is while he says "simple" as almost derogatory towards himself. It is an incredible strength lacking in most adults today.

[@uttaransaha1941]

Simple doesnt have to mean a retard ... And the things he knows must have something to do with the fact that he was planning to leave North Korea , isnt it ??

[@chaosghostring9682]

@@brettwilson5389 simple means different from where you, me, him and others came from. being simple depends on your experience and background, simple for you might be eating a bucket of chicken but for some simple can only be eating a fried egg. simple knowledge for you might be how to file taxes, but most dont know that. it depends on perspective as relation to background and experience :)

[@MonumentToSin]

Yeah... he clearly had at least a passing knowledge of how torture works *sweat drop*

[@MissesWitch]

He SWAM FOR 8 HOURS ?! To defect to South Korea?! This guy is EPIC!

[@tanie3543]

@@김지섭-n5l okay big guy

[@equux4498]

@@김지섭-n5l why is that? Could you please elaborate?

[@musicbkim]

There are North Korean and Chinese government commitioned (as well as voluntary Patriotic Chinese) people (spies/hackers) stationed in China whose job is to go on line and try to sway the public opinions towards their regime. They are obviously using psudonames and North Korean ones commonly pretend to be a South Korean. They usually say things on comment sections to change the opinions of the people towards more positive image of North Korea. So one needs to be decerning as to which comment could be made by such people when faced with crazy or questionable comments.

[@yeti6601]

ikrrrrrr

[@stanleyho8009]

I mean 8 hours does sound unrealistic. Can someone really swim 8 hours long? Probably with tides, I would be tired in less than 30 minutes. It could be true but I have my doubts

[@janec4]

I appreciate the guest's candor and he was so authentic about the good and bad in N. Korea. It's sad that employers discriminated him in S. Korea based off the fact that he was from N. Korea instead of looking at the perspective of a defector that was brave enough to escape for a better life. Great interview.

[@dawngilbert2761]

I thought the same thing. What a waste of talent and experience. I look forward to him realizing his dream of his own English-based KZbin channel.

[@MaryLoveJane]

There is a lot of prejudice and fear towards North Koreans in South Korea, partly because they don’t trust that they’re not spies. They are also assumed to be unintelligent because education is extremely lacking for most North Koreans, and even if they’re “lucky” enough to be educated, it’s full of propaganda and lies. It’s unfortunate that they’re stigmatized for something that want no part of.

[@athomenotavailable]

North Koreans are stigmatized in South Korea. Most work poorly paid unstable jobs or sell their bodies, typically only the really goodlooking ones become highly paid live streamers

[@moirapettifr7127]

Maybe he could apply for a job with the US Dept of State as a consultant. His knowledge would be from a true insider's.

[@hansmueller4438]

Swimming 8 hours to freedom, now that is truely badass.

[@sidvicious4760]

@Kirk Wolfe Well said though

[@kidaria1333]

@Kirk Wolfe They keep going because the system like this is implemented and a new change could risk bloody civil war and lots of refugees the other asian countries do not want. Also north korea totaly missed the the point where they could modernise at least a bit. The constant comparison with germany is nonesense because germany before the division reached a certain level of industrial development and so did some other eastern european countries like poland, Czech, hungary and others which are do overall good these days again. The eastern european countries who didn't reached that level suffer till today from communism days. There are certain steps in devleopment which have to be done in certain time frames and if you do not you never will able to keep up. One of these steps was the industrial revolution in 19th century and the next big one is now the digital revolution. Also majority of the world is going down and not up. It always goes in cycles of 70-100 years. Usually at that time there had been wars and cards new mixed and new growing after because everything had been destroyed. Thanks to nuclear weapons no direct wars anymore between the super powers and because of that it is not exploding but imploding, and governemnts do war against their own puplic in cooperation with big companies. Yet because it is so clever intelligent portraied majority doesn''t realise it. We are in the beginner phase of the biggest economy crash ever happend and the biggest experiment of humankind considering scoiety transformation and technology development. In retro-perspectiv Trump wasn't such a desaster as he is portraied, because he tried to prevent that, but had come too late into power and had no idea how political power is gained and used inside the institutions (and has no manners). He is not part of the real deep state ochestraiting all this, which is why he had be removed. It was pure luck he won the first election because establishment was sure they would win.

[@greenbrickbox3392]

@Alexander Samuseu Stanislav Kurilov decided to leave the USSR because he was an oceanographer who kept getting excluded from overseas projects due to the authorities restricting him from a visa due to his Chemical Warfare instructor military experience/family who emigrated/dad who was a POW in WW2. He jumped off a USSR cruise ship with a snorkeling mask and fins off the coast of Siargo Island, Phillipines but due to storm conditions and strong currents he was out at sea for 3 nights, 2 days clinging to a local fishing boat when a Filipino fisherman found him.

[@sheilacabrera3986]

@Kirk Wolfe Wow, you sound like you're ready to join the 1984, not so Great Reset team of totalitarians. Please allow me to clue you in on a tiny detail you got wrong; the globalists who it sounds like you're primed to worship want 100% of the world vaccinated so that millions of people are eliminated & they're left with just enough "human capital" as they call us to do their bidding; you need to wake up before you're no longer free to spout such foolishness.

[@RS-ti7bz]

@@sheilacabrera3986 Got vaccinated- doing just fine 😀

[@justinnagac5558]

Stories like Lee Chul-eun's are one of the reasons why Asian Boss should never stop from existing. Thank you Asian Boss for another quality content. Love all the way from the Philippines!

[@rmbii4765]

Indeed.

[@billiehaley2816]

also Love from Washington State in the U.S.A.

[@Kakashi19-69]

onga pre kaya makikiangkas ako sa kasikatan ng 2k likes ng comment mo. His life in NK and escape could be a good movie / autobiography documentary. South Korea film makers needs to see this very thrilling spy like setting. This interviewer is very good the interactions, conversation and questions are on point. Very informative. 31:00 para sainyo to fellow peenoise 🇵🇭 na mga adik at sinasamba ang kpop / kdrama. Hanapin nyo mga testimonies ng ating ibang kababayan o kahit ibang foreigners na nanirahan sa South Korea ng makita niyo gaano kababa tingin nila satin lalo na sa mga ofw dun na mga minimum wage / workforce / domestic helpers. Tingin nila satin mga tools, modern slaves kasi kahit anong trabaho kahit gaano kadumi at kababa gagawin natin kasi wala eh alang alang sa pamilya sa pinas na kesyo mababa dito sa South Korea eh mataas naman kikitain kumpara sa Pinas kaya tanggapin nalang mga pang aalipusta ng koreano. Fight me triggered dudongs come comment

[@hunterflowerson4460]

Yeah this was the most genuine and fair interview I’ve ever seen with a defector. Great stuff and I hope to see more, I hope this guy ends up being able to make that KZbin channel, I’d definitely be a watcher

[@NZOMV]

This is the most insightful interview I've watched from a defector. The fact that he is very self aware of himself, the world and incredibly honest makes me trust his experiences and opinions so much more. Great vid!

[@unechka]

not so honest. when asked about the reason to leave he first talks for 5 minutes about the fact he didn't like rulers calling average people 'garbage' and only after that for a second mentions a real reason - problems with his superior. and i also had a feeling all this interview is of course not the way to tell people about north korea but to get some personal benefits i.e. media coverage.

[@eddiewalker7252]

His biggest culture shock was the move from elitist to peasant!

[@----xo2bm]

i dont trust him at all

[@ProGamerMann]

@@unechka also said he took off his cloths and everything and took off his backpack but when he arrived he said he was in uniform with his ID and knife...

[@joeanonymous1834]

This comment is directed towards all the saps, fools and useful idiots commenting on how enlightened and insightful this guy is, and that suggest that the whole business of the cold war, and the remaining two Koreas, is just some giant unfortunate misunderstanding; that there are good and bad things to be said about both the ROK and the DPRK, and that maybe what we really need is just more "understanding" of North Korea. Let me begin with a little story: Years ago, before I was married, and while working abroad, I had a Chinese girlfriend that was from Dandong (city across the Yalu River from the DPRK, on the Yellow Sea/Wan Hai). She came from a true believing family of CCP members and was an ardent defender of the PRC, although she also lived abroad and was really no communist. She told me of how, during the DPRK famine of the 1990s, ordinary North Koreans would come across the river and appear on the doorsteps of ordinary Chinese in her town, simply wanting something to eat. Eventually, most of these North Koreans would be rounded up by the Chinese police. They would be held in police compounds in Dandong until DPRK police could come across the bridge and collect them. The DPRK police came in a truck. They lined up the handcuffed and starving North Koreans, ran steel shackles through their noses, like oxen, connected them all with a light chain; attached the chain to the truck, and towed them, shuffling, back over the bridge to a DPRK police or military compound where someone walked around with a pistol and shot each one of them in the head. This guy in an ex-DPRK secret policeman. He is a participant in the murder and torture of innocent people--even if his only role was as that of an "investigator"--although he related how his family used to be "stationed" at a DPRK gulag, which he then went on to describe like some sort of kibbutz surrounded by barbed wire and armed guards. His experience of the DPRK was that of the ruling elite, in which he held membership by position of birth. The only reason that he was able to defect as he did was the opportunity afforded him as such. And he was received as a defector in the ROK, and not prosecuted, for the obvious reasons of international politics. He now has to live in South Korean society. That is much more easily done if one is not a pariah. It is for this reason that he soft pedals the horrors of the DPRK as much as he is able, tries to suggest various false equivalencies, and suggests a sort of pan-Korean reconciliation on the basis of the dismissal of a non-existent misunderstanding. Not only is everything he says and does entirely self-serving, I wouldn't be surprised to eventually learn that he is actually still a DPRK agent, although I am aware of no particular evidence of that. Anyone that would like to know more about what this man really did for a living in the DPRK would do well to read The Aquariums of Pyongyang, by Kang Chol-Hwan. And, Asian Boss, maybe you could do an interview with Kang Chol-Hwan. Better yet, maybe you could get Kang and this guy together for a joint interview. They could reminisce about Yodok Prison Camp. Given that you "don't want to vilify North Korea," that ought to be very sweet and poignant.

[@noniboo1521]

This man's story is so amazing . Here he was living an elite life but could see the cruelty of the treatment of the poor and working class. I'm so happy he escaped and appreciate how well he told his story it could be a Netflix movie indeed.

[@m.3257]

No apologies and no remorse from his side. His organization executes and kills innocent people.

[@tyronejones4245]

He was such an elite spy that he's convinced us that he's not a spy anymore.

[@faroukabad]

was, or is?

[@rawdrywall8212]

@@faroukabad bum bum bum buuuuuummmm

[@suronbru9568]

He sounds like a spy in contrast to other defectors like anomi park

[@IamThat00]

@@suronbru9568 I am not saying that it's impossible, but I am not sure if that's the case. He said bad things about North Korean government (like there is less freedom) and he exposed things that they said, like the fact that NK elite government call lower class citizens "trash".

[@pokoloko3618]

I was worried going through the comments that I was the only one who got that vibe.

[@EvolvingLark]

I teared up when he said 6 km. Not because it was such a feat to swim that far, which it really is, but because 6 km feels so close. It's unbelievable how different things could be in only 6 km.

[@jewellui]

If you go to the DMZ you can even see the NKs just working and their houses, it’s a strange feeling how close by they are yet they are living in the past almost.

[@osmomosis9216]

@@jewellui Or a - dystopian society.

[@No1x3N]

@ Well, he said that the south korean thermal cameras lost them because of their body temperature going down, so they were close

[@sakura613]

@ Yes he did. 17:47

[@tonertonki]

What boggles me is how can they swim for those many hours and don't get hypothermia? and granting he said they have no pants

[@oskirules]

This simple interview is better than any Hollywood movie.

[@conniead5206]

Sad that our movies are generally well below an interview. Network paparazzi here wouldn’t have done a good interview either.

[@lb42]

Why don't you contact Yeonmi Park? Or maybe you've done it already 😊

[@ziedzaafrani8612]

No , just no

[@avef]

They'll still get scarjo to play him

[@billybowbob2071]

It sure went by fast! Hard to believe it was 40 minutes, seemed more like 10 minutes! Great interview

[@Suzanne0219]

This is the best interview I’ve watched from North Korea defector so far... the details of how he get escaped and swim across the sea just so stunned... hope that he never gets anymore discrimination in SK, or if he gets, hope that he’s able to understand and ignores that and just having faith in whatever he does..

[@Hdidbi_3049]

He’s very ballsy giving his honest opinion on flaws in South Korea, I’ve sometimes seen comments of individuals of which their national pride heavily clouded their rational thinking, especially towards non-south Koreans. respect!

[@MargaritaMagdalena]

South Korea is racist and xenophobic asf.

[@MargaritaMagdalena]

75% of South Koreans aged 19-34 want to leave the country. Even as a native it's hard to belong there.

[@vivix3795]

Yeah, it was super refreshing to watch something that isn't just a mindless, psychotic nightmare-fantasy of the DPRK. Seems like 99% of everything out there is either non-DPRK people making stuff up, or defectors who are also making stuff up to chase clout (understandable, tbh). So, this was a welcome change of pace.

[@wongkengmun1103]

He is honest smart n have a very balanced view on things we need more ppl like him

[@vasudevrameshbabu3427]

The interviewer was genuine while listening, that encouraged the defector to be eloquent at his best. Also he was a good listener, kudos to Asian boss and journalists should learn from them.

[@eafesaf6934]

Yes I agree, interesting questions, nice pacing and satisfying conversation

[@rizalmaulana7443]

Totally Super Agree

[@praveenp]

The guy was an educated, trained, committed intelligence officer. No wonder he speaks intelligently, no wonder he is an observant. As he said, stereo types in peoples mind, make it hard to realise.

[@AjarnSpencer]

stories like Lee Chul Euns raise attention in the eyes of fake news investigators like me, and this fake news is easy to debunk. juyst google 'Lee Chul Eun escapes North Korea, and not a single fox, cnn, aljazeera, rt, or bbc, or even korean news article pops up.. just 'asian boss' who is living from youtube earnings, and willing to get his disco dancing boyfriend to pretend to be an ex north korean spy. No North Korean of this name escaped in 2016 or any other year. Lee Chul Eun, is a famous S Korean MMA fighter and also an olympic shooter name, which is where Asian Boss probably made his mistake with this fake news. Google says "Your search - Chul-eun Lee escapes north korea - did not match any news results." So don't you think that proves the event never happened? as swimming to freedom would be jumped on by all major news agencies of the world, if true. But Asian Boss is a fabricator of Fake News, cares more about his youtube earnings than how much he influences his viewers.

[@s.f.2480]

@@AjarnSpencer How could you search his name if he is using an alias?

[@koool56]

@@AjarnSpencer He is using an alias, he's real name is not public.

[@GTMarmot]

Intelligence officers (of any nation) are absolute cnuts, not the erudite, sophisticated and genteel people you imply.

[@kvothedo]

@@AjarnSpencer Lol you didn't even watch the video fully and you don't know that the name is an alias. Mr. "fake news investigator" LMAO

[@AtinyKitty]

19:43 is one of those moments where you're like 'Wow. I bet so many others have tried to escape but WERE 10 minutes late, and those ten minutes cost them their lives.' Such a great interview, so interesting.

[@noface2593]

Watching him talk about his views and experiences, I can see that he is a person of intellect, the one that observes and understands well.

[@yeti6601]

yea

[@ozidanni]

This really jumped out to me too. This guy really pays attention well

[@ifbbpro05]

ofc he observes bruh. He is a SPY

[@joyariffic4217]

Exactly what i got from him

[@frogieZ]

Agreed. I guess that was the perks from who he was back then in North Korea. He is very observant & good at deducing the current situation.

[@ignesiastan1150]

Wow the mental fortitude on this guy. Really enjoyed the post-defecting conversation and his ambitions to improve the world's understanding of North Korea.

[@Zhengrui0]

I'm sure, depsite his modesty, he has physical fortitude as well - he must be a catch! Asian Boss: we need a new entry in the dating series!

[@solmoman]

he's a spy, you dimwit

[@Zhengrui0]

@@solmoman there is nothing more dimwitted than name-calling, I hope someday you can find a positive outlet for your energy, and maybe even some worthwhile contribution to the world beyond yourself

[@CaterpillarFriend]

This did not feel 40 minutes long. Words cannot express how enlightening it was from start to finish. Thank you so much for working on this!

[@kyzcent3061]

I didn't even what that this is a 40 minute long video, until I saw your comment.

[@karkkimarkkinat2109]

I would've happily listened to this for 2 hrs.

[@WLF0X]

Yeyeye np

[@RrRr-wj4xv]

i also watched with much higher speed tho hahah

[@khalidmohammedabbas3866]

@@kyzcent3061 ikr

[@Love2Run]

He strikes me as a man who cares more about truth and honesty than crafting a narrative to please or avoid offending certain group of people. Very refreshing, and I really hope he's able to make a positive impact throughout his life in South Korea or whereever he may end up in future.

[@SoloDolo01]

his story didn’t really add up. he somewhat still seemed a bit brainwashed by nk propaganda. definitely got spy vibes. his escape way to easy.

[@ALilUnhumane]

@@SoloDolo01 wow you are dense

[@SoloDolo01]

@@ALilUnhumane sorry you're gullible

[@janpierzchala2004]

And he is a son of...North Korea! This is sensational.

[@15kbeforesubsmay37]

"A single spy inside is scarier than hundreds of enemies outside"

[@tanvirkabir4960]

That sentence is like a double edged sword.

[@m4dyquex579]

Among Us in a nutshell

[@solmoman]

... said the spy. This dude is a spy, reading from a script

[@Zhengrui0]

@@solmoman ...writes the guy who really must be so much smarter than everyone else to be able to dismiss everything he's shared and just go on "well, he was a spy, so he is a spy, so he is just reading a script".

[@SirBojo4]

@@solmoman Prove it.

[@LiveWell6]

This is world class content. This is the sort of stuff that news media should be doing.

[@celenebates3266]

💯

[@winstond4445]

the MSM dominated by american news corporation won't tell you of their deep collusion. The american government supports the kim dictatorship while still having military bases posted in the south. It's their best interest to keep the conflict going.

[@Dr.Nantiwa]

@@winstond4445 true because a conflict with someone outside unites the home. If there is no one on the outside, the home divides starting inner conflicts. Conflict is just human nature.

[@insertprofessionalhandlehere]

“I’m a simple man- I miss my mom. A lot.” 😭

His certainty that his family will be OK is part of what makes him an obvious NK plant.

[@its3ritney3itch]

I’m so happy I clicked on this video. I’ve never learn so much about anything in this short amount of time. It’s crazy to think that they swam for 4 hours. My hands start hurting after 40 minutes of being in water. He is honestly so inspiring and his friend. He really grabbed my attention and had me completely focused on every single word for 40 minutes. Definitely watching this again later. Favorite story so far.

[@m.3257]

Are you aware that he and his organisation took part in crimes against humanity where innocent people get executed or put into concentration camps? No apologies, no remorse.

[@tatiairwinn]

I was working with a south korean organization that help NK defectors for few months, the org. called PSCORE… tbh his story of escaping is one of the fastest one, which makes me kinda doubting him. I know for normal people it’s really hard to swim for that long, but i’ve heard stories that are worse than his. Because others have to go through either china or russia before reaching SK, others even have frostbite while escaping, and once they escape it’s also hard to keep contact with family etc… that’s why it’s kinda hard for me to trust him.

[@naritruwireve1381]

@@tatiairwinn do you think his fast escape might be because he was in the top 10% and was able to access or ask around for more information on the fastest route compared to the everyday north korean? That's what I'm guessing at least

[@tatiairwinn]

@@naritruwireve1381 probably. Maybe because of luck as well. However, that is not the only thing that makes him seems fishy.

[@heni63]

But this wouldn't make him look fishy, of he just is smart and looks for the fastest way? ​@@tatiairwinn

[@BlackByte24]

Huge respect to the escape. I can understand the argument "not everything is bad in North Korea". My parents were born and raised in East Germany (GDR) and they always say that there were many good things back then that they miss now. But they would never wish for the GDR back. I hope that the two Koreas will unite someday and become a similar success story as Germany!

[@TheYoutubeUser69]

korean unifications is very unlikely and i think unlike in germany no one in SK really wants it.

[@sangeuncho8374]

Germany was not a success story. Say what you want about the historical tensions in place, but from a purely numerical point of view Germany is doing much worse than before it combined. West Germany was killing it a few decades ago, it's definitely a world power but doesn't hold foot against what it was in the 70s and 80s. Also, Majority of South Koreans are against it. We do not like our current president and while good relations with NK are supported, merging is both unrealistic and unfavoured.

[@eugenedebbs2189]

@@sangeuncho8374 why is President Moon hated? He is a top shelf diplomat who significantly reduced tensions with NK.

[@snakearekat2634]

@@eugenedebbs2189 I think it has something to do with Housing

[@zetaepsilon1909]

@@eugenedebbs2189 Because he is a North Korean sympathist, so he overlooked the attrocities Kim Jong-Un committed

[@arthurthegreat216]

What a lion this guy is! He's intelligent, cool-headed, articulate, and he has a lot to tell us. I really hope he gets to share his story and knowledge with the world. Kudos to the interviewer too! He's a great listener and he asks all the right questions.

[@Strokwor]

He's a also a lion in terms of participating through his work in prosecuting, torturing and murdering innocent people. It's like saying a Gestapo policeman that left Nazi Germany to live in Argenetina is a well spoken lion.

[@SonOfGod0600]

@@Strokwor It's entirely different. Because North Koreans have no idea of the world outside. No idea of democracy or real freedom. No idea of what is even right or not. They don't believe in God, so they don't care about self righteousness. You have no idea how it is. He had no other choice or chance to live differently. It's all he knew.

[@azk9218]

@@Strokwor not exactly true, but I wish he was asked more about this stuff. However, I believe that if he would be responsible for murdering and torturing, then he wouldn't be released in the first place. Not everyone in the secret police does such things.

[@auroraheshiki6260]

Luckily he decided to flee because he had to do cruel things to poor people, and that talks a lot about him

[@budgetking2591]

@@Strokwor Fix your way of thinking please, its broken.

[@EricJacobusOfficial]

Fascinating. Thanks for the quality journalism. You're outdoing the msm with this stuff big time.

[@averageguy1261]

Not just MSM, but all the news organizations.

[@김지섭-n5l]

Everything he said is lying. i know coz im from korea

[@fikrisuhaimi7546]

Hey Eric, didnt expect to see you here. Love your work in God of War and Tekken videos

[@jennawhitecloud5680]

@@김지섭-n5l sometimes you need to be from outside your culture to see things you can’t see from inside. Everyone has blind spots

[@bruh7130]

@@김지섭-n5l I know there are some things we dont want to accept that hurts our national pride, but we have to admit there is still some form of hostility and discrimination in korean news and society, im saying this as a korean

[@westnilesnipes]

This was one of the most insightful and fascinating interviews I've ever seen. Well done.

[@amitjodha]

A smart, well-educated North Korean, he definitely has some interesting perspectives on us. Hearing him out is important.

[@mongoloid25]

Yes exactly , i was looking for a comment like this one , i 100% agree

[@elenabob4953]

You realize the he was Secret Police and that he probably defected as a spy for NK, right?

[@amitjodha]

@@elenabob4953 And you too must realize that I'm just interested in his opinion on outer world, and I'm not nominating him for world president.

[@junlee7237]

@@elenabob4953 he said the south korean went through several months of interrogation. I dont think it would be likely that this 40 minute interview would provide enough information to undermine the months of interrogation they went through

[@Kankanadaimari]

The interview was very well executed. His story was so intense that I didn't realise that I was reading subtitles. Hope people like him get to make the impact they want.

[@briannaplaysmore2405]

Same, I forgot about the subtitles, until I read your comment

[@julien23lastchristmas2]

Vous êtes nord Coréenne aussi ?

[@zenokarlsbach4292]

@@julien23lastchristmas2 "Of course". They're the mirror of society.

[@LS__14]

wow. he’s a great storyteller. Even coming from someone who doesn’t speak korean and reading subtitles. i can imagine his escape so clearly. you can tell he is quite an intelligent man.

[@hunterflowerson4460]

Yeah his empathy and intellect and self awareness are impressive, those kinds of people are rare in the world itself, let alone an even more propagandized nation

[@sprinkles_091]

he pulled me in with his story, i was so interested. im thankful to know the struggles he and his friend went through, hopefully it doesnt always have to be like this...it reminds me to never take my life for granted..i hope they are doing well mentally.

[@zainebhidoussi1498]

amen

[@appleraika]

A true elite. I love how honest and transparent he is, talking about both countries, without any bias. And looking at the knowledge he has, he is definitely an intelligent figure. Its quite unfortunate that his talents and intelligence are wasted, but hope he will get the freedom and success he earned for. This is a very interesting interview. I could go on listen to his experiences and life story. Hope one day he could meet his mom.

[@tamasmuszbek]

It is fortunate though that there is no demand for his surveillence skills in South Korea. I don't think his intelligence is wasted, he just hasn't yet figured out what he wants to do with his life.

[@Krystalmyth]

He would have made an excellent police officer. Perhaps thats why the discrimination happens. Fear of a North Koren elite showing up their cops. But isn't it supposed to be about service to the people of Korea? This is a disservice, to waste these talents. South Korea should have been proud that he would choose to have swam 8 hours in freezing water to wear their uniform... a shame. But he's quite young still. Who knows what the future will bring?

[@tamasmuszbek]

@@Krystalmyth He was doing surveillence on people. Spying on what they do in their personal lives, whether they go to church, what their opinion is about the system. I don't mean to speak against this guy, he's great, but in South Korea there is no equivalent institution conducting such surveillence (as far as I know of), and that's certainly not what police officers do. At best he could be an investigator journalist.

[@kmb5707]

@@tamasmuszbek I'm sure it takes lot of skills to be an intelligent service officer and do your job for years, especially in North Korea. South Korea can definitely use this asset but they are just discriminating and wasting his value. I reckon he could be some sectors of CIA if he had proper language knowledge.

[@nickson211]

he's truely intelligent. no wonder he got in to Samsung

[@mentallyuntouchable2918]

He swam for 8 hours to escape north korea? Get this man in the olympics asap

[@heleenblbas8669]

@@김지섭-n5l how do you know? Are you north korean?

[@p41s3r]

@김시접 you understand you made the interviewee’s point right? Wish you had more brain to realize what you’ve done.

[@김지섭-n5l]

@@heleenblbas8669 Yes im

[@heleenblbas8669]

@@김지섭-n5l So which parts of the interview did he lie about if you can explain it since you made a pretty different comment from everyone else?

[@Qtips7]

I don't think we can accuse him of lying, nor should we welcome every sentences as undeniable truth. There might be events that were twisted or expressed in a certain way to hide uglier things, there might be parts of the escape that were perceived by him in a given way based on how traumatic and nerve racking of an experience it was, there might even be parts that he can't remember well and romancized a bit. Did he really swim 8 hours in cold water? We can't know for sure how long it took, he definitely didn't start a timer when he left guys.. I mean c'mon. What we do know for sure is that he is insanely brave for risking his life to run away from his comfortable lifestyle to chase the unknown. May it be 100% true, 95% or hell even 50% true, this was a fascinating interview.

[@AshAhms]

Mr Lee is very self critical and impartial in his speech. I hope he comes to be a frequent feature in upcoming programs, if not a guest reporter on Asian Boss. Kudos on this episode guys, very thought provoking!

[@rosievriesinga5904]

I hope so too!

[@aliah9426]

I would love to see him as a guest reporter on Asian Boss..🧡👏👏✌

[@lindashen9700]

I'm about to shed tears when the North Korean man said how he missed soybean paste soup made by his mother, hope he can meet mother in near soon. also hope he can live well in South Korean. This is a quite impressive real talk.

[@jackbarry8847]

Somehow I couldn't take my eyes off the subtitles for 40mins. Best piece of journalism I've seen in decades.

[@aaronkuehn3229]

I knowww

[@JimFortin]

AGREED

[@bucurdragos7771]

Excellent journalist , really skilled.

[@erins.5420]

I had to slow down the speed of the video to be able to keep up with reading it all. It went so fast in some parts!! I wasn’t going to miss what was being said! I was hooked within seconds.

[@amartinez5326]

Seriously. Excellent interviewer, and concise interviewee.

[@MrBOuellette]

His interpretation of media is spot on! Accountability and humility are enormously under developed and under appreciated aspects. *also, does anyone know if he made a youtube channel?

[@InIMoeK]

I thought the same thing! Also the point that he made that people actually do not know what the value of freedom is.. "Take a look in North Korea!"

[@joeanonymous1834]

This comment is directed towards all the saps, fools and useful idiots commenting on how enlightened and insightful this guy is, and that suggest that the whole business of the cold war, and the remaining two Koreas, is just some giant unfortunate misunderstanding; that there are good and bad things to be said about both the ROK and the DPRK, and that maybe what we really need is just more "understanding" of North Korea. Let me begin with a little story: Years ago, before I was married, and while working abroad, I had a Chinese girlfriend that was from Dandong (city across the Yalu River from the DPRK, on the Yellow Sea/Wan Hai). She came from a true believing family of CCP members and was an ardent defender of the PRC, although she also lived abroad and was really no communist. She told me of how, during the DPRK famine of the 1990s, ordinary North Koreans would come across the river and appear on the doorsteps of ordinary Chinese in her town, simply wanting something to eat. Eventually, most of these North Koreans would be rounded up by the Chinese police. They would be held in police compounds in Dandong until DPRK police could come across the bridge and collect them. The DPRK police came in a truck. They lined up the handcuffed and starving North Koreans, ran steel shackles through their noses, like oxen, connected them all with a light chain; attached the chain to the truck, and towed them, shuffling, back over the bridge to a DPRK police or military compound where someone walked around with a pistol and shot each one of them in the head. This guy in an ex-DPRK secret policeman. He is a participant in the murder and torture of innocent people--even if his only role was as that of an "investigator"--although he related how his family used to be "stationed" at a DPRK gulag, which he then went on to describe like some sort of kibbutz surrounded by barbed wire and armed guards. His experience of the DPRK was that of the ruling elite, in which he held membership by position of birth. The only reason that he was able to defect as he did was the opportunity afforded him as such. And he was received as a defector in the ROK, and not prosecuted, for the obvious reasons of international politics. He now has to live in South Korean society. That is much more easily done if one is not a pariah. It is for this reason that he soft pedals the horrors of the DPRK as much as he is able, tries to suggest various false equivalencies, and suggests a sort of pan-Korean reconciliation on the basis of the dismissal of a non-existent misunderstanding. Not only is everything he says and does entirely self-serving, I wouldn't be surprised to eventually learn that he is actually still a DPRK agent, although I am aware of no particular evidence of that. Anyone that would like to know more about what this man really did for a living in the DPRK would do well to read The Aquariums of Pyongyang, by Kang Chol-Hwan. And, Asian Boss, maybe you could do an interview with Kang Chol-Hwan. Better yet, maybe you could get Kang and this guy together for a joint interview. They could reminisce about Yodok Prison Camp. Given that you "don't want to vilify North Korea," that ought to be very sweet and poignant.

[@joeanonymous1834]

@@thisisyol I'm not clear on your point. You're German? What does this have to do with the subject at hand?

[@thisisyol]

@@joeanonymous1834 After thinking about it for a bit and being german obviously: "Everything is relative".

[@joeanonymous1834]

@@thisisyol I'm still confused. By the way, were you around during the Third Reich? You're not guilty by blood.

[@heret1c385]

"Punishment depends on the severity of a crime" "He overtook a car with a 216 numberplate, so he got executed"

[@sormin3456]

Seeing as that got interpreted as disrespect to their supreme leader, that's only natural

[@thingsmac]

Rofl..... ha ha. Sad but true

[@boxerpop82]

Bro he was so calm and casual about I had to rewind to make sure I heard that right.

[@heret1c385]

​@@sormin3456 Of course, but from a western point of view this is just silly.

[@sweiland75]

@@heret1c385 The United States differs.

[@MaeF1y603]

This is one of the best interviews I've seen in a long time. The man doing the interviewing asked some really great questions, and it was interesting to hear from a privileged class defector. The fact that he was able to get air time about his experience without being expected to recount his most traumatizing experiences was refreshing. I know it's important for those stories to get told too, but I worry about their PTSD getting worse after the stress of an interview like that. Getting re-traumatized is awful.

[@VitaKet]

Isn't telling your story part of healing PTSD though...

[@capitaldidi]

@@VitaKet not always. Sometimes, until you find a productive way to talk and break down the trauma, you just relive it every time you talk.

[@DaCheesecake951]

this is the first youtube video where i watched an entire 40mins of video without doing other stuff. great stuff

[@Icecandy1882]

Me too! I was so drawn to the interview.

[@rupalisuryavanshi2027]

Me too.Otherwise I sometimes scroll through comments section while watching.

[@wubsthecat]

same here, it was such an informative and well executed interview!

[@dickidsrip5262]

yes exacly

[@mmyeyint6126]

☝🏻

[@madeinbusanjkjm]

I wonder what happened to his friend that defected with him and if he's doing okay. But I really hope Mr Lee will be able to get his dream of having a youtube channel some day and that somebody will help him with the English subtitles. I can tell he has so much more to share.

[@haozzy]

I wonder how many of these defectors are actually legit and if their credibility are being verified at all. Lots of western media outlets would jump at the chance to capitalise on this and for all we know they could literally just be south koreans that can speak with a northern accent.

[@FillorianHofnarr]

@@haozzy North Koreans are still looked down upon in South Korea.I don't think anyone would fake being North Korean.

[@AshleySialovesTimTam]

he does have a youtube channel if you scroll up to the pinned comments

[@soyou4217]

his friend is doing well. married and have a job. they came out on TV together once. and they both tried to take the credit for escaping the NK in a funny way.

[@soyou4217]

@@haozzy South korean goverment has a dept dedicated to this kind of matters and they were able to successfully screen all spies out so far. there are some korean Chinese that try to come to South Korea to receive money from South Korean gov. b/c the gov gives you money to settle for a yr and provide housing for a yr. and pays college education for you if you are legit defector. (yeah, once you come to South korea, you receive all these but N korean dont know about this. they were educated that South korean gov will shred them into pieces and take your eyes out) Sout korean gov literally has a list of all population of N Korea, they asked you things like who were your classmates? what are their names? how many kid does your neighbor have. etc.

[@outresru7751]

wow, I never watched an interview fully. He kept us engaged with his story and wow! he is so open minded, that is what humans lack the most, to accept both right and wrong things about something. Be doesn't want to bring a bad name to S/N Korea, he is just telling the facts it's just the people who have a backward mindset think that whatever he says he is one sided. Really enjoyed this interview, like really really. Loved this interview thanks for sharing such amazing insights asain boss!n

[@robopecha]

just think of all the other great interviews out there that you have not fully watched yet! so much to discover!

[@outresru7751]

@@robopecha yeah,I'd love to do that, I maybe sometimes I just don't find the time or such nice interviews, but this interview was truly insightful :)

[@supersaiyan4530]

same, when i first looked at the video duration i was pretty off to watch but when i was watching i was so engaged i didn't feel bored at all, surprised when it ended.

[@sagan08]

True, first interview on this channel I didn't even pause....felt like this dude's mindset will bring him places.

[@tcr333]

me to on the edge of my seat

[@dash1046]

This man is so open minded. So broad minded. Always willing to put things backed by logic, facts and intelligence. And needless to say, extremely fearless.

[@porkchophotandspicy]

He's so deep. You definitely described him as an intelligent man. One of the best interviews I've watched. I hope he is okay right now.

[@ХристоР]

He is intelligent because he is a North Korean agent sent to demoralize South Korean society. You don't send average joes for sophisticated agit-prop jobs. Mostly a good actor, but a keen mind as well.

[@alyaspark1234]

@@ХристоР 16:12 Bad acting - it is sign - elementary signs of deception - nose puffing. he is lying - or suddenly his nose is itching in that part of his story

[@ghostbravo7127]

@@ХристоР He isn't an actor, he just says it like it is.

[@camilledumas]

@@alyaspark1234 Suuuure. Because you guys are more intelligent and skilled than the Korean NIS and you also have access to so much more information 🙄🙄🙄

[@venti9925]

@@camilledumas I mean. Neither do you. He contradicted himself when telling the story about his escape and when he first introduced himself. So these comments aren't just for fun.

[@Meeshi-]

MASS MEDIA ACCOUNTABILITY! This king is out here speaking facts about how the media will rip someone to shreds and desert them, even if the story was completely wrong or the person was falsely accused.

[@jackychong7134]

Exactly! he was able to dissect the issue with the south korean media and even compare to his country!

[@shaunkollamparampil1710]

Dude got out of dictator regime and was investigator security officer of course he would have a good perception skills I like this dude Sadly his mother and his family might get killed or executed

[@jo-han]

Yep he mentions exactly what is wrong with media around the world :)

[@jojobad1796]

Maybe he just thinks rationally but not emphatetic. He probably sent a lot of people in prison camps or to get executed during his 20s just because they wanted to freely criticise the government he worked for or follow a religion

[@breanajohnson7311]

@@jojobad1796 that was his job. unless we watched different interviews Im sure you picked up on the fact that they will "weed out" any dissidents or those who aren't doing their job. It was probably his life or theirs. He even mentioned that they report each other so yeah definitely didn't have a say in the matter since he was always being watched

[@yaka169]

"I'd like to eat soybean paste soup made by my mom". Damn, this hit hard

[@RubelliteIsHere]

She’s probably brought to a camp though

[@Kakashi19-69]

@@RubelliteIsHere most likely publicly executed to serve as examples for other north koreans trying to defect. Its just a matter of choice whether to continue living in the "perfect" north korea jong un empire or try to see some change at the south side of their fence. I bet if his father was still alive he will stay there. Looks like he and his father are very close. If i were him i'd probably wait until my mom dies then i'll go

[@piratz1995]

@@Kakashi19-69 He will be 50 years old then. Maybe he will die when swimming to South Korea. If I was him I will say goodbye then go

[@u.v.s.5583]

No, it doesn't hit that hard. It is like me sort of wishing to taste that soviet ice cream again. It was pretty damn nice, I swear. This shouldn't hit hard. Any mother who isn't shot by the regime after such a high standing son has escaped the country is to be seen as extremely high ranking person. (Edit: she hasn't even been declassified, as far as I can understand from this interview, which is MUCH stronger fact). She embodies the elite of NK, the very people who make that country so dreaded by all.

[@whatthefuckiswrongwithyou]

@@RubelliteIsHere FeelsBadMan

[@elenatsvetkova9113]

Wow, I am truly impressed with Chul-eun Lee's eloquence and ability to communicate his experiences as a former elite North Korean spy. It's clear that he speaks with honesty and an open mind, making it easy to engage with his story. I was so captivated by his interview that I didn't even notice how much time had passed! I would love to see him start a KZbin channel in the future, so we can learn more about his unique perspective and experiences. Thank you for sharing this incredible interview with us!

[@valoxsen6003]

Man, all North Korean defectors' journeys to freedom are incredible. Some had to go the long way through China and Thailand to reach South Korea, some charged across the minefields of the DMZ to try to reach the South Korean side, and some took the coastal route and swam for hours to get there. I wish all of them prosperous lives in their new homes.

[@PrograError]

BTW due to COVID it's now way harder for any defectors to escape, even through the historically easy route up through china and indo-china (thailand, laos, cambodia and so on)

[@thylatrash7668]

I feel like I could listen to lee cheul-eun speak about his experiences for at least 3-4 more hours, he has so much insight to share and speaks very intelligently. i really liked how much he focused on painting a nuanced picture of everything because it's just not all black and white. you could really feel his sincere desire to communicate the actual situation in north korea to the world. because i don't speak korean, i am especially grateful for asian boss making interviews like that and allowing me to learn. i think understanding is the first step towards global peace and lee chul-eun helped that today by sharing his incredible story with the world. i hope he is well and has a good, long and happy future ahead, i will definitely keep him in my heart ❤🙏🏼

[@avantegarde7797]

Chul-eun Lee said, near the end of the interview, that he felt he did not speak very well. I disagree exceedingly; he spoke beautifully and eloquently. I learned so much from this amazing young man, and I hope and pray that he gets his KZbin Channel up and running. He has so much to give and teach to the world. Thank you so very much to you at "ASAIN BOSS" for bringing him and his story to us !

[@plasmichoneytrip]

That statement was also unbelievable to me when I was really amazed the whole time he was telling his story. I was using my imagination when he was describing his escape and learned about North Korea based from his perspective. He is a very smart and insightful man.

[@ElizabethRae]

I'm glad he survived and is willing to share his story. Wishing him the best of luck and health. Hopefully everything continues to work out for him.

[@elanw4973]

Wow, this is one the most interesting interviews that I've watched. It was amazing to hear these nuanced and realistic perspectives, and perhaps this is the beauty of KZbin. One can learn so much through this platform if properly used. Thank you Asian Boss!

[@AltEffFour]

This was amazing. The fact that this didn't even feel like an interview just goes to show how unbiased the editing was, the great questions, and Asian Boss' willingness to let this man's truth be told to the world. I'm walking away from this just that much more knowledgeable. Absolutelty fantastic from start to finish.

[@yuckfou514]

I like the way he talks though. It sounds like he's bragging but it shows that he really finds it distasteful that his people are being treated like disposable objects.

[@mrahzzz]

This interview feels really bittersweet. I can't imagine coming from a place in a society that feels hopeless and in some ways oppressive, but as an elite in a surely interesting job, putting your life on the line, to come to a society and be initially treated like a criminal, then have to work your way up from jobs that are below what you previously worked. To leave your family behind, and maybe have some of the hope for the future that you were looking for, but to also meet different kinds of oppression and different kinds of social issues... wow. I know we have vastly different experiences, but there are a lot of things he's saying about people being too judgemental or too nationalistic that are very easy to relate to - I think those are very human experiences and frustrations. I'm super impressed by his spirit, because he's been through it... This turned into an interesting perspective and conversation regarding media. I really love his unique perspective on it (he's saying things I agree with, but with a perspective grounded in his experience in North Korea - it's interesting and sad to hear him say how alike South Korea (and I'd add, the US) is in that way). It must be frustrating to live in a democratic society where we all have the opportunity to access so much information and to educate ourselves, and still witness irresponsible behavior surrounding media, and general close-mindedness. Let's do better with our media! Agreed - thanks to him for sharing his story- I also felt he spoke eloquently.

[@chrisdavie8163]

I don't blame people becoming nationalistic whilst religion is pretty much dead to the younger generations. It's either that or following an extreme green ideology or becoming part of the woke brigade. He's spot on that the media should be put on some sort of trial when they've done wrong. The editor should actually come out and apologise publicly on camera. It just depends what they've done wrong though since the editor/writer may be seen to be wrong because of another political point of view that disagrees with them politically. It's bizarre in 2022 that the South Koreans wouldn't allow a North Korean in the police force. In Britain he would have had been on the racial quotas of being first in line to be employed, whether or not that is fair in society when we live in society based on succeeding solely on merit, not who you are, nor where you come from.

[@mrahzzz]

@@chrisdavie8163 You and I probably have very different understandings of humans and politics and society based on the way you've shared your perspective, so I don't find myself really agreeing with all you've said as you've said it, but thanks for sharing your perspective anyway. I do agree with the idea that there are lots of different social issues we all face as we work our way towards truly just, and more generally egalitarian societies. :)

[@mrahzzz]

@@chrisdavie8163 You and I probably have very different understandings of humans and politics and society based on the way you've shared your perspective, so I don't find myself really agreeing with all you've said as you've said it, but thanks for sharing your perspective anyway. I do agree with the idea that there are lots of different social issues we all face as we work our way towards truly just, and more generally egalitarian societies. :)

[@analyticalmindset]

i totally got the same take away as you about global media. For him to see the same similarities in western media to his N Korean media says alot

[@stompingpeak2043]

@@mrahzzz some societies are basically at their apex for rights and everything else. People living in a free country like America will act outraged over petty social issues or whatever. Then people living in an oppressed country like Iran or something will act outraged over wars and stuff. The point is every country will act like their problems are a huge deal since that's human nature. If we take a step back and look at some of the issues in America you'll see that they aren't really a huge deal at all. Then some other issues like debt or obesity are massive factors that get overlooked. This happens because media has to run with the trendy topics. What gets more views between "national debt crisis imminent" or "black man was spit on by white cop"? Its almost like the national media is purposefully skewed away from the real truth. Then the outside world is very skewed by our own views or overlooked in its entirety.

[@Mikehaelohim]

Just after going into the comments after the video, did I notice it was 40 min long. This interview was incredible. It felt like a 10 min video, while being packed to the brim with information. I could definetly listen to more of his stories any day.

[@Quenead]

The good thing about him is he's frank. He doesn't sugarcoat things beyond his control. He doesn't care if he hurts the ego of North or South.

[@rosievriesinga5904]

Indeed!

[@rooster555555]

Probably why he had to leave nk

[@amalbraj2943]

He's well informed and doesn't sugar coat things when he said what all ge doesn't like about S.Korean. it's really interesting to hear his perspective.. kudos to Asian boss for making such a good, unbiased video. Hope other journalist, especially the news media around the world could learn from them ❤️

[@descoiatorul]

He's sugarcoating NK while criticizing SK, quite suspicious for a so-called defector. He's just a spy posing as a defector.

[@bog4240]

@@descoiatorul You need to consider that he was part of the elite, which may provide him slight bias to the "better" side of North Korean society. In general, of course, even though south korea is 100% better than North Korea, it does have its flaws, and as an elite living in North Korea, there will be decent parts of life. I live in third world, near a gated community where the ultra rich live. Honestly? With money and power, living in a third world isn't that bad, the world is your playground. Just think about it, a country where minimum wage is $200 a month, where a lot of people barely scrape by day to day, and there are lots of people roaming the roads riding cars which cost 50k usd(normal car for relatively affluent people) to ones that cost 750k usd(yes, supercars exist in third worlds, and that number is a result of luxury taxes). With that amount of wealth, there's a lot of fun and enjoyable things to do, even in underdeveloped countries. The rich do not play in slums, for wherever a large population exists, the top still exists, and they will have their toys.

[@rzt430]

@@descoiatorul if he lays it all out negatively on north korea, people will think the opposite, they will say he's just someone hired by SK to pose as an NK spy as propaganda material. it's a lose-lose situation. so it's actually the best option for him to kinda lay things out towards the middle of the spectrum instead of straight on trashing on NK to make it more believable. you shouldn't make silly conclusions since none of us really know the truth, it's more harmful than otherwise, you're not smarter than everyone else.

[@timlewis2522]

@@descoiatorul he possibly has family.he doesn't want murdered too

[@hisokamlml3281]

That was so interesting, and I'm still shocked that he swam 8 hours...the power of desperation, hope and his will to live is unbelievable

[@enkiimuto1041]

The human body is simultaneously a very fragile and yet very strong thing.

[@SauravTiru]

@@enkiimuto1041 damn facts

[@cheldivision]

Great interview! I hope he’s doing well.

[@TheFlamingPike]

I feel like every defector's story would be worthy of a novel or movie. What they have to go through is insane.

[@drstrange6563]

Agree especially in order to live by yeonmi park(north korea defector)

[@myra8695]

@@drstrange6563 Yeonmi makes up a large portion of her stories tho. There have been many inconsistencies pointed out by many journalists. Sure, she's been through hell i assume but she needs to exaggerate it to make a living and bring in more attention and views

[@TrinhNguyen-sh4fj]

@@drstrange6563 No way! She is the worse one who lies through her teeth just for money and attention.

[@TrinhNguyen-sh4fj]

@@myra8695 Exactly! Many in South Korea know how fake she is. She lies just for money and attention.

[@drstrange6563]

Why did you watch her video, if you watch her video you will know what humanity was. Also some of his video are more humanity than hatred just like you who loves hatred and heartless.

[@missus_o_22]

This interview is full of substance. Worth watching. I can only imagine how scary that escape was. I love how the interviewer asked necessary questions and how Mr. Lee answered everything brilliantly with full honesty and conviction. Hope that all is well for him, now.

[@brittfussell7566]

This is probably one of the best interviews I've ever watched. I wasn't bored once and it was very well made. Amazing work :)

[@user-ix5wf2mn7d]

Same This is the first time I watched a 40 minute long interview without skipping

[@meem524]

ikr? At first, I was like 40 minutes is too long. And then the video ended before i even realised it

[@user-ix5wf2mn7d]

@@meem524 same😀

[@pierrenilsson6189]

Probably because the interviewer did not focus on himself, which is quite common in the western world. Look at a talkshow host interview someone. The talkshow shares the name of the interviewer/host and the guest get a minute or two to talk but most of the talking is done by the interviewer.

[@rayanaviegas6640]

This is an unbelievable interview. I never spent 40 minutes so focused in a video, now I really want to improve my knowledge about North and South war, differences and so on. Thanks, Asian Boss for sharing this video! And I hope somebody help this guy to start his channel, he has SO MUCH to share and this host lead this talk easily. It was a high level content🔥

[@theresarayaflores5136]

One of the most interesting interviews I’ve watched. It really struck me when he started to explain the problem with media, especially when it comes to destroying someone’s life due to media because it is very true, whether it’s in SK or any other country. You can tell he’s very observant. Hope he can start off his KZbin channel. I’ll definitely subscribe to listen more on his stories.

[@CasualGuy60]

Same, I want an updated interview with extreme details he wanted to share about N.Korea

[@leogrey8509]

You get the ignorant majority... And the concerned minority hellbent on principles...

[@shorgoth]

I'd like to see a more in-depth interview with him about the lives of North Korean officials and their general perceptions/mentality. He is clearly intelligent and has some keen observations to share.

[@teshn1229]

@@robme3660 He openly mentioned a number of negative or horrible things about North Korea.

[@chonjacki]

@@thijs2906 I don't think you know what the term plant actually meant in this context. Settle down.

[@alahiri2002]

@@chonjacki They definitely did not. Regardless, everything else in the comment was valid. What they were describing is known as confirmation bias.

[@casbee9610]

@@robme3660 as a German who lived through reunification of a similarly separated country I dont think you know what you're talking about. He obviously did ignore some atrocities but that doesnt make his other observations less true.

[@casbee9610]

@@robme3660 he didnt say it was.

[@kimtaeri13]

Chul Eun Lee's stories would make an interesting series imo

[@InDstructR]

He has haha. Just waiting on him to put subtitles in his videos. Then I'll be able to understand the series he's made.

[@kimtaeri13]

@@InDstructR just subscribed to his channel...luckily I'm fluent in Korean

[@serahmatsu6906]

I love when someone decides to go totally honest! I knew this was going to be a great interview as soon as he talked about the public sentiment. Great job 👏

[@dracassan6129]

Woa, I never think I would watch the whole 40-minute interview about North Korean like this, it's so real and amazing, I wasn't bored at all. I'm so impressed with the way he talked about South Korea, he doesn't praise and totally honest about how he felt and things are not like the way he imagined. Thank Asian Boss for sharing us this valuable info during this pandemic.

[@aikomellendez3598]

This is the only 40-minute interview I watched my whole life. It's totally worth the time! I was disappointed how the government didn't find ways to help him get a good job. As he said, it was stopped due to political concerns but I still hoped the government recognized his sacrifices.

[@kireikiku]

If you are curious, I believe he is referring to the withdrawal of funds from the North Korean Defector Comradery, (their job is to assist in finding NK defectors proper training and employment.) It's hard to find any English media reporting on this but from my understanding from some articles it has greatly impacted defectors as of recently. The SK gov't reasoning is apparently fewer defectors coming into the country but those metrics could totally be skewed by the pandemic.

[@sl-je5fg]

I didn’t even notice it was 40 min I thought it was something like 20

[@uelrington9270]

I am Korean born Australian , cut the long story short , Korean Government cannot reveal where he works , where he is living because of his safety !!

[@BazzBrother]

PBS frontline has excellent 50 minute interviews.

[@Leftyotism]

Maybe the government can help a civil group to do that, so it's not directly engaged D:

[@nikimj1]

This is one of the best interviews I've ever seen. Engaging questions, great pace, neutrality and entertainment. QUALITY I TELL YOU

[@iLoveChopin]

Considering he worked in intelligence in North Korea, I find it difficult to believe that his mother and relatives are still safe (not executed/punished) following his escape.

[@texasvet2729]

This guy is surprisingly brilliant. Really interesting to hear his perspective

[@mygirldarby]

I'm not at all surprised that he's intelligent. You can't be a very good spy if you're dumb.

[@stanleyho8009]

@@mygirldarby you can still be a spy if you’re dumb, doesn’t mean you’re a good one then. I mean North Korea can’t just appoint anyone as a spy so it makes sense the children of the former spies become spies. Doesn’t mean they are automatically smart, but they are taught in a way which makes them still a valuable spy.

[@gooacnt707]

I agree, but I think there’s something more to him. It seems like he speaks from his own perspective at times maybe, like as if he was an outsider to both North Korea and South Korea. A type of person who’s an outsider of any society and has his own moral compas and thinks differently than most. People like that are very rare, they don’t think in terms of confines of their environment. Most people don’t realise their environment shapes how they are and think. So he’s criticism and positivity I find very objective. Tho I don’t doubt he had to cover up some things etc because he’s got fam and frns back north, and doesn’t want to get abducted if he says too much bad stuff etc but I find much of what he says reasonable and logical

[@jasminesarita7019]

Iuuuiiu

[@Donovanodo]

@@gooacnt707 As a Korean who served a military duty (so I'm kinda aware of the stuff), I think the reason he covered up some facts is mostly bc he cares about his family safety(mostly mom, I guess), since they might excute his mom or imprison her into the political outlaw camps if there's any link found between them after his defect. In many cases, defects don't get abducted, but rather their families get executed for punishment

[@konanoobiemaster]

this is a super-proud man who doesnt want to forget where he came from and there's nothing wrong with that.

[@darkjak224]

It's probably shitty going from a high position with a lot of responsibility to working at a normal factory

[@devvv4616]

he has pride cos he had high status back home

[@patrickbarnes9874]

No, it's never wrong for an African, Asian, or Arab to be a proud man who doesn't want to forget where he came from. But if you try being a white super proud man who doesn't want to forget where he came from, you'll find yourself in a ton of trouble as a Nazi white supremacist.

[@darkjak224]

@@patrickbarnes9874 Dude... Race has nothing to do with it. Literally.

[@sakshibachhav9506]

This got me hooked from start to the end wow

[@divijdevsingh216]

Indian check 🇮🇳

[@arjun5458]

@@divijdevsingh216 check.

[@ggondaeblues]

철은씨와 같은 생각을 하는 사람들도 많을 거란 생각이 들어요. 소신있게 이런 용기를 낸 것에 정말 감사하다고 생각합니다. 상대를 제대로 알아야 우리도 대처를 할 수 있는 건데... 듣기 싫은 말을 들으려 하지 않는 사람들이 많은 것도 사실이에요

[@Navyuncle]

I can't read a word of this. But, I agree completely.

[@gnolan4281]

He's an intelligent, educated and dynamic guy who understands that there is no need to be afraid to say what he really thinks.

[@standardtuning4guitars423]

yeah he talks well. But saying people should watch north korean news to learn stuff? They dont have independent media in north korea. He said north korean news will talk about no food in the south etc. False news.

[@gnolan4281]

@@standardtuning4guitars423 Of course, you're dead bang on. But remember, Dennis Rodman never did come to his senses.

[@hadiyazid]

the part when he was explaining how to detect electric current is fascinating

[@echung168]

Right? I made a mental note if I ever come near an electric fence and had to escape with my life on the line. If I ever come into this situation (hopefully not), I hope I can recall this information.

[@michaellim4165]

Yes, always use the back of your hand to touch electricity.

[@kmit9191]

@@michaellim4165 Also for checking heat, as you need your palm more than the back side

[@ladyalezzagemoto9171]

plus how to get away from cramps

[@crystal8537]

Yes I didnt even know that until now!!!!

[@gemmadepaz652]

I like how frank he is when he openly comment on his observations. Particularly in the entertainment industry. We have the same observation. Entertainment industry is a really thorny world.

[@aquila519]

This became my favorite interview from a North Korean defector. So interesting to hear his story and his wisdom. Love that he showed no bias, just simply observed and stated what he's seen.

[@gandharzero]

Chul-eun lee is actually a badass and his story sounds like from an survival movie. Scouting prior to escape / breaking a possible electrified fence, clearing a minefield, crawl in mud for 200 meters to avoid being shot, swim for 4 hours and giving his friend a foot massage while he himself has issues being afloat.

[@tubblebub]

Right? I can see the movie starting with him getting up and getting ready like a normal happy person, and then you start seeing things to indicate he's in N Korea, like the portraits on the wall, his uniform, etc. But it still shows him happily going to work and doing his job until something jacked up happens in the street and we start to see the cracks in the veneer. It could be such a great movie!

[@roblangada4516]

@@tubblebub I like the slow reveal its set in North Korea idea a lot

[@manu144x]

It makes total sense since he was what we'd consider a well educated man, and not any education, probably a military oriented one, considering where he worked at, any person like him would probably approach an escape the same way, scouting first, elaborating a strategy, preparing, etc.

[@xckk5849]

A foot massage is the least you can do when you use your "friend" as a minefield blind walking cane.

[@thecipher8495]

@@xckk5849 haven't watched but wtf?! dummy test? jeez this guy is extreme for escaping

[@prieten49]

That was an interesting interview. He "had it all" and yet still left N. Korea. That speaks volumes.

[@ifstatementifstatement2704]

He had it all but he was intelligent enough to recognise it was not really freedom. Really brave and smart man. One of the best interviews I've ever seen. I wish him all the best.

[@leandradozier968]

He also sent many people to their deaths. He’s not a hero, at least not in my eyes. No one wins in stories like these.

[@ifstatementifstatement2704]

@@leandradozier968 Yes but at least he had the courage to change his life. He was born and grew up in these circumstances, and escaped them after seeing that life could be different. He could not have escaped North Korea the moment he was born or while he was being trained as a spy. The way he escaped was short of a miracle and he could have died easily in the attempt. So he could not have changed his life before then. He did not enjoy sending people to their deaths nor did he want to talk down to others below his class. He had empathy for people, hence why he saw that this life in North Korea was not good and he got the courage to escape. I leave it up to God to judge him for what he has done.

[@catmerchant8699]

@@leandradozier968 Do you think he still would have done it if he wasn't forced to? He had no choice.

[@leandradozier968]

@@catmerchant8699 he had a choice to do the right thing. But he didn’t have the courage to do the right thing

[@puddingding]

his observations of the South Korean people are very insightful.

[@brianlam9429]

An outsider's view is often more accurate.

[@TheMasterhomaster]

Propaganda exists everywhere. In the west they’re called commercials or advertisements.

[@brianlam9429]

@@TheMasterhomaster False equivalencies are false. Crime exists everywhere! So everywhere must be equally bad. Or ads are "propaganda". The definition is "information, especially of a biased or misleading nature, used to promote or publicize a particular political cause or point of view." I wouldn't say it is "everywhere". Call a spade a spade.

[@rdpaik]

Insightful and valuable yes. But we also need to remember, it's just one man's view. My observation of SK people is that for every SK person who's nationalistic ("my country is great"), I met a SK person who's self-deprecating ("my country is still weak compared to China or Japan").

[@Sam-sg4wv]

The part when he described the 8 hour escape hit me in a different way. The fact that he escaped knowing that he could get killed instantly, or his own mother meeting that same fate would have been scary, and very hard to decide if he was doing the right thing. I hope he lives his life to the fullest from now on, he really does deserve it.

[@rebeccaclark2614]

There is a follow up interview with him!

[@cerealkillo2813]

I love him..... considering the fact that he doesn't shy away from real issues and that he tells you his opinions with little to no bias(maybe there are but not much)....

[@snoproian]

I mapped the journey that he and his friend swam on google Earth and my god… its insane. Seriously look it up.

[@rishabgupta1772]

Can you please share a link?

[@putridspit]

@@rishabgupta1772 you can do it yourself, just go to google map and put the location he mention.

[@jamieyoho2310]

I wanna help this guy write a book in English. For real. Not joking.

[@jqa16]

Sameeee he swam around 16km his estimates were far off.

[@angelicascaglia1611]

@Meghan but where did he start from? Which part of the province

[@SS-kz7td]

"I think what you're saying about the media, resonates with a lot of people around the world". Me sitting on the other side of the world, "Yep"

[@dejaysam]

It would never get boring while having a conversation with this person. I was captured by his way of thinking and portraying his views regarding the two different society. Simply amazing!

[@angieyaaa]

"No one can predict the result of a war. You should never underestimate nor over estimate your enemy." Damn true. It also applies to your inner self war.

[@MeepMeep88]

k mr. fortune cookie.

[@quietkid52]

That was some wise talks

[@Kakashi19-69]

Art of war is shaking

[@level1selamat155]

This guy is very intelligent for his age

[@Johann.863]

@@level1selamat155 intelligence doesnt come over age my friend

[@GentleFD25]

I was really surprised when he said he didn't think he was able to convey his message that well at the end. You're a great speaker, I was glued to the screen for the entire interview! Thank you for sharing your story; your open-mindedness is inspiring.

[@rdpaik]

In his mind, he was only sharing a small portion of his "entire" story. That's probably why.

[@thatboi5542]

The story of him defecting is incredible, if it was made into a film I would watch it.

[@lomuss5]

@ He mentioned he scouted the water 2 days prior to defecting to see the tides. Did you even watch the video or are you just dumb

[@alyaspark1234]

@ 16:12 elementary signs of deception - nose puffing. he is lying : suddenly his nose is itching.

[@thisorthat7746]

@@alyaspark1234 stop it, lmao. or someone might report you for spam.